'Fated': The Old Swedish Lines
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- Опубліковано 3 лис 2020
- A look at what the Old Swedish lines in Grimfrost's short movie 'Fated' mean. Watch 'Fated' here: • Age of Vikings: Fated,...
Jackson Crawford, Ph.D.: Sharing real expertise in Norse language and myth with people hungry to learn, free of both ivory tower elitism and the agendas of self-appointed gurus. Visit jacksonwcrawford.com/ (includes bio and linked list of all videos).
Jackson Crawford’s Patreon page: / norsebysw
Visit Grimfrost at www.grimfrost.com?aff=183
Latest FAQs: vimeo.com/375149287 (updated Nov. 2019).
Jackson Crawford’s translation of Hávamál, with complete Old Norse text: www.hackettpublishing.com/the... or www.amazon.com/Wanderers-Hava...
Jackson Crawford’s translation of The Poetic Edda: www.hackettpublishing.com/the... or www.amazon.com/Poetic-Edda-St...
Audiobook: www.audible.com/pd/The-Poetic...
Jackson Crawford’s translation of The Saga of the Volsungs: www.hackettpublishing.com/the... or www.amazon.com/Saga-Volsungs-...
Audiobook: www.audible.com/pd/The-Saga-o...
Music © I See Hawks in L.A., courtesy of the artist. Visit www.iseehawks.com/
Logos by Elizabeth Porter (snowbringer at gmail).
Old East Norse and Old Swedish get so little attention and I’m so happy to see those languages get a spotlight! I already knew a little about OEN grammar, but this taught me a lot!
*An attempted comparison with modern Swedish*
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Mír þóttis séa blóð... - Jag tyckte mig se blod...
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Þír þóttis séa blóð? - Du tyckte dig se blod?
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Þat auðnar illt… - Det bådar illa... [The word "auðnar" is directly related to the Swedish word "öde" (destiny), but that word doesn't appear in the verb form ("ödnar") today.]
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Mantu eftir þeiri orrustu er eistun mír huggus? - Minns du det där slaget då mina testiklar höggs? [The most etymologically related word to "orrustu" I can think of in Swedish would be "ödem", but that means something badly swollen and isn't used in this way.]
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Þar vissi jak þat at jak sá mitt blóð, en jak barðis fram. - Där visste jag att jag såg mitt blod, men jag stred fram. [As far as I can tell there is no modern Swedish equivalent of "barðis". Correct me if I'm wrong.]
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Far fram ok far inn í. - Far fram och far in i. [It doesn't really make sense here to say "in i" (into) in modern Swedish. More likely you say "igenom" (through). Also "far" (go), even though it works grammatically, would in modern Swedish more likely be "ta sig" (get oneself).]
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Ver besti maðr þú fár varit. - Var bäste mannen du får vara. ["Får" (get to) should be "kan" (can) in modern Swedish, since it's not a question of whether the character is allowed to be the best, but rather whether he can.]
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Jak em aldregi besti maðr, jak em æ inn versti. - Jag är aldrig bäste mannen, jag är alltid en värsting.
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Þetta kommer til at vera inn sísti kostrinn. - Detta kommer till att vara en sista möjlighet. [The words "till" (to) and "att" (to) are both unnecessary and confusing in this sentence today, but wouldn't be wrong to include anyway. I can't think of a modern Swedish version of "kostrinn", because the closet word today would be "kostnad" (cost) and that doesn't work here.]
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Vír tapum tíma. - Vi tappar timmar.
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Jak veit hverr er þu ert. - Jag vet vem du är.
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Jak á skip. Þú vill fá eitt? - Jag har skepp. Vill du få ett?
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Ok menn. Þat auðnar at vír herjum saman. - Och män. Det bådar att vi härjar samman. [It would be more common today to use "tillsammans" (together) instead of "samman" (together). "Härjar samman" (ravage together) could easily be interpreted as fighting on the opposite sides.]
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En hverr herjar lengri? - Men vem härjar längre?
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Þess þurfum vír. Ok þat átt þú. - Det behöver vi. Och det bör du. [I have problems finding a modern Swedish equivalent to "þurfum". For the word "átt" however, there is the related old Swedish word "äga" (ought), but in modern Swedish you never hear anyone use "äga" in this context. Now "äga" isn't to owe or ought, but only to own.]
Mycket intressant! Very interesting!
Bra jobbat! 👊🏻
Quite interesting, here's some Icelandic comparison:
Mantu eftir þeiri orrustu er eistun mír huggus -
Manstu eftir þeirri orrustu er eistun mér hjuggust.
Þat auðnar illt -
það auðnar illt.
En hverr herjar lengri.
En hver herjar lengri.
Þess þurfum vír. Ok þat átt þú -
Þess þurfum vér. Og það átt þú.
Ok menn. Þat auðnar at vír herjum saman -
Og menn. Það auðnar að vér herjum saman.
Jak veit hverr er þu ert -
(J)Ég veit hver er þú ert.
Fantastiskt jobb! Tack så mycket! För någon som lär sig svenska, det var otroligt hjälpsam för mig att få förstå språket bättre
My friend shot Fated. Happy to see you being involved in this!
For a moment there I thought your friend was homicidal.
@@willandersen3695 Hah, how come?
it was a play on words ... An actual shooting of one named Fated with a bolt or arrow hence the allusion to Homicidal
fun fact, the sentence "Þat auðnar illt" would be directly translated in modern Swedish as "Det anar illt" which goes to show how similar SOME Swedish words still are.
Men ’anar’ används väl inte opersonligt? ’Du anar’, men jag har aldrig hört ’det anar’ i vardaglig svenska - det låter som en poetisk konstruktion.
Däremot om det är ett ödnar*, från öde, hänger meningen ihop, men det verbet finns inte idag, eller har inte överlevt.
Och illa, istället för illt.
@@katarinawikholm5873 Sånt där beror mycket från dialekt till dialekt. Här uppe i norra Sverige finns det inget problem med meningen "det anar illt" eller liknande
This was way easier to understamd than the west norse comversations i have heard on your channel, as a swede
Normally people would say Captions suffice But not The Crawford
"coucougnettes masculines" I've never heard this phrase before in French or English, not the language I was expecting to learn from this video
I am a middle-aged native English and fluent French speaker, and the term was new to me also.
Does it mean what I think it means?
@@noahh.4484 yes haha
Given your explanation of "auðnar" and what it's probably cognate to, I'm disappointed that they chose to subtitle as "That's a bad sign", rather than "That's a bad omen."
I note that they have the Norns with spindles and thread, not carving sticks. Oh well...
This was actually pretty interesting, when I combined reading with your pronunciation I could understand some sentences. But then again I'm a Swedish from birth and the last 14 years I've lived in Norway, with some close Danish friends.
You had the 13th warrior experience then hahaha
Awesome series I'm so grateful to all involved with this project! I've read your Havamal and now I'm saving to get the Poetic Edda, I can't wait! Thank you so much Jackson I wish you the best mate!
Really fascinating, thanks for the breakdown. I’ve not heard of this project, but I’m going to look for it now
Beautiful! Very interesting.
I could actually read those text boxes and understand them, it's crasy how similar old Icelandic is written to modern Icelandic
Very interesting. Thank you.
Hey Dr. Crawford, can you tell us about Laufey the goddess in Norse mythology?
Interesting that with the help of the English subtitle I could understand a lot in whole sentences. Without, practically impossible. Pronunciation / emphasis often sounded like Finnish-Swedish.
One can wonder when the focus tone became high, and the boundary tone was low. So the language is perceived to go up and down like a roller coaster, especially in Norwegian. But not at all in Danish.
I have often wondered why Danish developed stød, and Swedish/Norwegian developed pitch accent.
Where and when can we watch fated?
ua-cam.com/video/_yqbowUiH-s/v-deo.html
Wouldn't "þvínæst" work perfectly well as the equivalent of "almost", so like: "þeiri orrustu er eistun mér þvínæst huggusk"
"Þú vill fá eitt?" sounds odd to me. Did they not use word order to distinguish questions from statements? And if so, when did that change?
In modern Swedish, you can ask questions both in statement-like order and question-like order. You could say "Du vill få ett?" is about just as valid as "Vill du få ett?", however the latter one is more common.
Now I just need someone to explain to me why my ancestors thought big foreheads and beady eyes were attractive enough to procreate with. This is common in the gene pool in Sweden
What font is he using? It looks good lol
Yes, i went and rewatched LOL
2:53 Funny that the eu becomes an ö, because the word audnar (I dont have that letter on my keyboard), im pretty sure means anar today. "Det anar illa". Although we wouldnt say a sentence iek that nowadays. Maybe some dialects i donno.
Maybe "det bådar illa"
Old Swedish= Best Norse language
I’m curious whether Swedish or Danish speakers can understand the dialog.
@Yes Sir! Thanks! I would understand “vind auga” but only because I have studied German and Old English recreationally. Ironic that German uses a variant of the Latin word for window.
@Yes Sir! Interesting example of language contact. I understand that the presence of certain German words in Scandanavian languages may be the result of Hanseatic League influence. The Bergen “r” pronunciation is more like that of Danish or German than that of other Norwegian dialects.
No we cannot. However I bet an Icelander could.
Being a native Swede, I would say we understand parts of it easily and and the rest not at all. Personally I'd say we get 50% of the meaning of the dialogue. Which could be dangerous...
@@Regnmakare Probably easier for Swedes than Danes because of all the phonetic changes in Danish.
I think i preffer east norse. Might be because I am swedish tho
Great video generally but I'm concerned to see again that many anglo-saxon scholars repeatedly miss to include the retention of the Proto-Germanic voiced labio-velar approximant /w/ in Old Swedish. In contrast to West Norse it was retained in Old Swedish (and East Norse more broadly) in initial sounds as well as after consonants. This retention was preserved in swedish dialects well into the 18th, 19th and 20th century (in rural dialects in Skåne, Halland, Västergötland and south of Bohuslän). It is still preserved in the Dalecarlian languages as Elfdalian and Våmhusmål in Dalarna, Sweden, to this day.
/Daniel, Swedish historical dialect scholar
Exactly, and in northern Jutland it is also retained in the present-day middle-aged and older generations of speakers.
@@troelspeterroland6998 Yes!
This is very interessting. Is there a significant difference between old swedish and runic swedish? Could you be so kind and suggest a source or book/s for learning these languages? I would very much like to learn and even try and read old runestones in Sweden some day in the future. I would appreciate it a great deal for any tips on a solid start so I might begin in the right direction when studying for this.
Grimfrost?
Methought!!!! vestige
Far fram ok far inn í.
interesting to see European languages dividing and integrating.
Is there any evidence that the Norse used throat singing or polyphonic chants? In the video "Fated" and many other viking inspired shows/music there is a lot of Tuvan/Mongolian throat singing and polyphonic chanting but I have not heard of any evidence that points to the vikings singing or chanting like this. Skalds were very important to Norse culture so surely there would be evidence if this was the case but it seems to me that people are taking artistic liberties and clouding our understanding of the oral tradition/musical methods of the Norse. If you could shine any light on this topic is would be greatly appreciated.
Not sure about the Norse, but I believe the Sami people do and did use throat singing.
@@SarionFetecuse You raise some interesting points.. Is there any Christian source mentioning the pagan practice? If not it seems like just an easy way to explain why it was wiped from the archeological/anthropological record which gives us very little basis to believe it happened
@@Celticelery
Sami people type of singing is called Jojk and somebody practicing it is someone that Jojkar, think it reminds a little in sounds a bit of Native Americans in the North of North America.
No, there is no evidence that the Norse historically did this, and there is no continuity across Central Asia of a throat singing tradition. Saami will *sometimes* do this whilst joiking (traditional singing style that lacks lyrics), but there is no evidence the practice made it into Norse or even Suomi usage. As far as we know the only people to indigenously develop and use overtone singing are the Mongolian peoples, Tibetan peoples, the Chukchi, some Turkic peoples like the Bashkirs, people living in the mountains of countries bordering Tibet, the Ainu (although their form is extinct), Sardinians, Inuit peoples, and some Xhosa people.
@@SarionFetecuse This is very wrong, throat singing is done in no Indo-European culture natively except Sardinians. The Romans never documented anything that would approach this, and even Tacitus (who very much aped the Germanic tribes) thought they had very little in the way of 'culture'. Throat singing in Central Asia has two loci of origin in Tibet and in Mongolia, and does not appear any further west than the Caspian sea historically or otherwise. Similarly the Greeks never noted it among the Scythians or Sarmatians.
though 'ok' is a probable translation, it should be noted that many Swedish runestones denote 'och' as 'åg', whereof 'g' is a general g-k-ish consonant (can specify runestones should anyone be interested)
I thought Younger Futhark didn't distinguish K and G, and that "ok" is consistently spelt "auk" during that time
@@wenqiweiabcd if you take a look at U 1034, Tensta, Uppland, Sweden, you'll notice the 'auk' spelling utilising å, u and g, whereof the traditional g-rune is a general consonant. The older k-rune is rarely expressly used post 900 ad, whereof in Sweden you pretty much only find it further north.
There are also instances of 'och' being spelled 'u[g/k]'
Dear doctor, can you explain the Old Norse word GYÐINGR for Jew, and how present were Jews in the Norse world?
Gydinger = modern Jyder = people from Jutland
"Reasonably interesting"
Like I wouldn't be interested anyways