It's no longer about having thought provoking and engaging stories, or doing world building that makes sense. To them it's about having a bunch of characters, representing different groups, that each can have a fan base that can relate to them, and they can discuss endlessly who the best character ever is. The plot is just something you need to keep showing the characters and giving them a chance to show how awesome they are. So this season they decided that a scavenger hunt is good enough, because they can visit various planets. That's also why they don't kill off any positive characters, because that would disappoint that character's fans. And I don't think they have any explanation for Kovich, they just wanted to have a mysterious guy on the show.
The worst thing they could have done and did is make the characters relatable. It sounds good on the surface, because why wouldn't we want to relate ourselves to them? Well, these are not 2024 humans. They live 400 years in the future and are highly intelligent, trained and professional officers. They are not mental cases on the verge of a breakdown. They can have many flaws, in which we can see ourselves, but these people are supposed to be role models.
You hit the nail on the head! In their desperate efforts to make characters seem "real and relatable" they just write characters who are pathetically stupid and wouldn't make it a single week working on a starship, because their weak feelings were too hurt to do their duties.
Tilly winning a running race is hilarious. She actually did the same in an earlier episode (S2 or 3) when they were running a race in the Discovery hallway so there is precedence she is amazing at physical endurance regardless of body size. There has never been a single good episode of STD, and this last season isn't providing even a slight hope that is going to change.
I’m offended that they really keep trying to get me to not use logic or believe my eyes. It just feels deliberate. I use to think Tilly was a little good looking. Then she got sting by a thousand bees.
It’s called “sci-fi” you nerds. The “fi” stands for fiction. There is no gravity in the Discovery universe. Only density. And on density there is nothing more powerful than a Tilly.
No way! Tilly: She’s having trouble breathing. So Tilly refers to Ravah as she. Or maybe the queen of endurance got it wrong. I'm calling shenanigans on the whole thing.
The fire did get smaller as the episode moved on The thing that got me was that once they had violated the prime directive, they just go all out and tell them everything, not even trying to keep the violation to a minimum.
ENT was going to have a two parter where Archers crew runs into mirror Kirk, transported into our universe from the Tantulus field. It would have been a really cool two parter.
Two quick comments: first of all, in terms of humanity encountering something greater than itself, Tilly might have a problem with that. Second point: as far as this episode, subverting, the usual, Roddenberry plot, I think the reason for religion to be given a space here, is that by the end of the season, Michael Burnham is going to become God. So the show can’t quite criticize religion too much, since their lead character is about to become God.
A couple issues you didn't talk about: -In the previous episode, there was a warning at the beginning of the episode, right after the first STAR TREK intro and the CBS Production, that there will be strong flashy lights that might affect people that are sensitive, even though there were few strong flashy lights. But for some reason I didn't see the warning being present at the beginning of the episode, and the very first scene of this episode involved nothing but an epileptic's worse nightmare. Did I somehow miss the warning? -The scene with dr. Culbert talking to his ChatGPT grandma is such a lazy ripoff of Tony Stark's holo-therapy scene from CA: Civil War (Culbert even mentions how it's supposed to be therapeutic), that the STD writers didn't even bother finding an actress that looks remotely similar to Wilson Cruz, "abulita" is dressed almost like Tony Stark's mom in that film. -It's been nearly 4 years since Adira was introduced, and the character is now even dumber than before, being incapable of doing even the basics of a Starfleet officer. I guess the writers really think the character will accumulate in the last 4 episodes, about 4 years worth of character development. -Early in the episode they mention that the water in the vial is so pure that it can only be obtained from air, since there are no contaminants in air... except for sand, dust, organic compounds, plant and fungi spores, etc., all of which the alien planet had plenty of... and remember that this episode aired while there's Saharan dust turning the air in Southern Europe into Arrakis or Hollywood Mexico... -The name of the planet, Halem'no, they pronounce it almost like how Wonder Woman says "Kal-el no" in Josstice League
How does Adira’s disheartening plot point prior to their bridge assignment factor in? Data had 2 such moments I can think of off the top of my head. An incident in Season 2 when Data thought he couldn’t be trusted on the bridge and *Picard* had to talk some sense into him; and then again *in TNG’s first movie* (how many years later?) when Data tried to abandon his post and Picard *again* had to talk some sense into him. Please, articulate for me, why this *first* example of Adira showing a lack of confidence is so offensive to your sensibilities of a Starfleet officer or character on the show? Did you have similar problems with Reginald Barclay? Real talk. I’m fascinated by people’s differing views on this show and I am struggling to understand how it is hated. My inspiration (one of them) is Riva, from an early TNG episode. Please do not react as though I’m trolling you. I’m genuinely trying to engage 💙
@@InimicalWit When we're first introduced to Adira, the character is shown to be an officer in the Earth Force and was competent but also resourceful (quickly made a transporter jammer) in what was basically special ops (boarding Discovery), and behaved professionally during that time. Skip 4 years to current S5 and Adira now cannot think anymore under pressure (like during the incident with the drone statue) nor under little pressure (like helping Burnham repair the control panel, even though the tricorder pretty much told them all what to fix). For some unexplained reason, Discovery writers decided to change the character from "competent and skillful" to "rookie that still has much to learn", even though Adira is supposed to have centuries of life experience from the Trill symbiote to learn from.
@@sargon6000 Crap. Lost some original messaging after some writing and some research. Will try to reconstruct: I see you've presented 3 incidents, giving me some homework, because memory isn't what it used to be and I tend to only watch things once, these days. "That Hope is You, Part 2" and "Under the Twin Moons". Question, tho: For those 3 incidents, in how many was someone's life in immediate danger? You suggested "less pressure" above, for the 2nd incident, but that's when the Captain and Saru were actively being fired at. For the 3rd incident, Tilly's life was in danger, but I don't think that was true until a little bit later. I would say Adira's demotivation was more directly (and explicitly) their recent unwitting hand in Discovery getting trapped in time. I think we all agree at actual "fault" for that, but that's not how psychology works. Speaking of psychology, tho, regarding Tal - isn't Adira absent those memories more and more, now that Tal is no longer a part of them? I still have to address the 1st incident, tho, and while I think I can recall enough of the 2nd, I definitely don't of the 1st; and I want to remember the 2nd better moving forward. I like how critical you're being, but I do think maybe you're being overly critical - however, this is just one of the points you brought up, previously (it deserves being mentioned). Honestly, all these things I'm seeing people bring up about (why they hate) the show gets overwhelming to try and think about altogether. I had to pick one, and if I'm being completely honest, I think I picked Adira, because despite being LGBT myself, I don't have a lot of experience with the gender diversity they present for us; so I'm pushing on that a little bit. I do wonder, though, as I mentioned previously: How does your view on Data's own recurring drop in confidence contrast with your view on Adira's? And if you read this far, thank you for giving me what time you did. 💙💙💙
Glad I'm not the only one that saw this was sooo much a Stargate setting. Also having these grinding stone structures move like in Stargate when this is not the way things are in the ST universe, the Denobulan would have used forcefield and holograms to hide the tech.
The 'Trapped in a room and Running out of Air with Torches Burning" situation sounds like something they would give fifth graders to think about during a Starfleet Academy simulation. "First I would cover all the burning flames and use the light from my communicator or tricorder to continue to search for ways out" Good job, Timmy! How can anyone take this seriously. This doesn't even pretend to be science fiction. This is the sort of thing that would happen on an episode of a teen sitcom that you would just be expected to ignore.
honestly..... cybernetic eyes have been used for this since early TNG yeah. heck even TOS had cybernetics for senses to some degree. BUT... this piece of tech is seemingly not cybernetics. It's a scanning device that literally fits on your eye like a contact lens. Honestly.... I think it'd be better if the lens was just the HUD for the device, not the whole device, but even then, what's the control mechanism?
I though exactly the same thing. Why didn't Tilly put out all those torches to save oxygen? Style over substance... I am guessing they wanted the visual prompt of the flames getting lower to show the oxygen being depleted.
yes, and I guess they wrote themselves into that corner by that civilisation not having lightbulbs or leds or any kind of artificial light sources besides fire and their "temples" not having any of that either. I guess they are not supposed to be there, so the Weather tower lighting didnt turn on and they braught those torches there.
Man that version of Jean Luc in you thumbnail probably cruised across the desert landscape of New New Vegas in a monstrously oversized Cadillac with a trunk full of illicit substances and worf dressed up like a schluby parinoid lawyer going all "Fear and Loathing " on Risa. In short, he excavated Hunter S. Thompson's Glasses and Arsenal from Woody Creek. That would make a heck of a season 4 of Picard Worf a Jean Luc's LSD feulled romp through the Stars. LOL
Yes, you've nailed this story's foolishness. Fire allowed to burn in the suffocation room. They/them nonsense (in the context of a sci-fi story set far in the future). Tilly being body-positive doing that marathon. And more. There's nothing wrong, in principle, with these ideas. As we know, though, Discovery very unnaturally forces those "currently modern concepts" into the story. But, that said, I found this episode one of the 'better' ones because it moved along and until the end didn't force us to watch long sappy, weapy PC-indulgent scenes. The writers of this series are so clueless. One day this series will end. Can't happen soon enough.
As a Stargate SG-1 episode it would have made much more sense. Teal'c would have been the perfect participant in the race, Sam Carter and Daniel Jackson would have fixed the control panel and O'Neill could have convinced the local guy to open the door. Or: two of them would have examined one of the broken towers to study the technology, having a hard time to cross the wasteland, but ultimately fixing it. In the meantime the other two would have dealt with the local people, adding another level to the episode. But: here we are with Burnham, who is smarter and better than anyone else.
Well, Tilly winning is no problem, because lets face it, the other people did not even try to win, because they are not as stupid as the daughter and don't want to die.
It is kind of a problem. Even if everyone gave up, the challenge remains the same. There is no way she would have lasted all the way to the tower much less even halfway. She is no longer fat - she is obese. The fact they made Burnham the one to stop and rest for a bit seals the fact they were conscious in trying to make Tilly look capable in physical aspects of missions, but she clearly isn't.
Jessie Gender "Pre-warp makes it sound like a nessesary evolutionary step. I prefer to call it Non-warp."(quoted from memory)😁 How did one denobulan scientist breaking the prime directive manage to install 5 gigantic weather control towers? Did he really do it alone?
I don't understand why Burnham chose to break the prime directive as soon as she really her friend was going to die? And why didn't she transport near but out of sight from Ohvahz and then at least try to reason with him to open the door (which surely she could have located with her retina tricorder anyway) before breaking the PD if she felt she had too? And the broader and ongoing problem is that this is another example of the Michael Burnham show. I think she said in an earlier episode to Rayner that it's important to her that the crew feel involved and engaged, but she doesn't really seem to. This would have been a good away mission for Rayner, for example. Also I didn't understand why the scenes weren't shot in a more barren environment if they struggle with drought so much. That threw me. And what was the point of the whistle-speak thing??
The whole "Find the progenitor tech" arc just shows they have run out of ideas so the only thing they could do was steal an idea from TNG and expand on it. I guess the next arc they will be looking for the Genesis Device.
I catched myself looking several times at my blank wall instead of at the screen, thinking about random stuff, im not joking. It WAS a filler even though there would be so much to explain about the plot.
We need to start writing our own episodes. Nitpicking Nerd has plenty of ideas. Remember what Captain Kirk said: "In every revolution, there is one man with a vision." 🙂
They also make a HUGE point and go wow!!! when they state the fact that they have 3 genders. I am also really tired of the doctor's whining. His character is the worst in the show.
I was also bothered by Tilly winning the race. But then I thought that maybe this planet has a smaller size than Earth or a specific air composition that benefits humans. Just like on our planet, where most marathon champions come from a specific region in East Africa.
So Mickey B's retinal tricorder can find a console terminal under a mutated mushroom covered rock but can't find the vacuum chamber door lock while looking right at it. Hell, MB could have simply looked under the carpet with her non-tricorder eye to find the lock mechanism. No that would be too easy and then MB wouldn't be able to use her special empathy persuasion powers. And who cares if she breaks the Prime Directive? There's like nine goddam people outside the temple. Who would believe these cavemen? They might as well whistle dixie. Ha ha ha, whilstlespeak my arse.
Which scene did you watch where Michael had a chance to scan the room before her presence was known? Please tell me about the part where she couldn’t find it despite a thorough effort and then turned to Ohvahz? She had multiple objectives, at that point, because as far as she knew, if she ignored him and scanned and tried to do it herself, she may have had to physically fight him - because despite his sadness, he was ready to accept the outcome. I know people hate this era, but truly; let’s debate this a bit. That’s what Star Trek is about, among other things 💙
@@InimicalWit Alright let's debate this. "Which scene did you watch where Michael had a chance to scan the room before her presence was known?" I watched no such scene and never claimed I did. Nice Strawman. "Please tell me about the part where she couldn’t find it despite a thorough effort and then turned to Ohvahz?" I never claimed Burnham couldn't find it (the lock mechanism) despite a thorough effort and then turned to Ohvahz. Again, nice Strawman. I stated that Burnham's retinal tricorder could find a console terminal under a mutated mushroom (moss actually, my bad) covered rock but couldn't find the vacuum chamber door lock while looking right at it." Watch the scene again. The lock mechanism is located no more than two feet away from Ohvahz, hidden under a carpet. A cursory search should have spotted it immediately, nevermind a thorough search or a Tricorder search. The chamber's tritanium shell preventing the Discovery from beaming Tilley and Ravah to safety is an accepted if lazy writing conceit but technology that moves a story forward at one point suddenly going missing when it would save the day at the climax is an unforgivable inconsistency and an example of bad writing. "She had multiple objectives." No, she did not, Burnham had one objective and that was to save Tilley's life. She wasn't thinking about the clue, or the Prime Directive or the Progenitors or anything else. " If she ignored him and scanned and tried to do it herself, she may have had to physically fight him." Michael Burnham regularly throws two hundred pound Commandos the length of Discovery's corridors, how much trouble do you think she would have holding off one middle-aged, malnourished priest while she opens a door? Look, I know the writers are trying to create stakes and tension, but if you rewatch te scene, the tension is actually created by Burnham as she handles the situation in a manner that would make her supposed stepbrother Spock ashamed. She beams into the room startling Ohvahz. Rather than attempting to calm him with some of SMG's patented whisper acting, she immediately demands that he open this door as he splutters in confusion. It's no wonder the poor guy asks if she's a god, Burnham gets in his face and boldly states," I AM HERE, LISTEN TO ME! YOU HAVE TO OPEN...THIS DOOR. MY FRIEND IS IN THERE, she doesn't want to die and she doesn't NEED TO DIE! RAVAH DOESN'T NEED TO DIE!!! OHVAHZ! OHVAHZ! WE ARE STANDING INSIDE OF A MACHINE! (she's getting really loud here btw, clearly terrifying the man) THIS IS A PIECE OF TECHNOLOGY!" "Technology?" asks Ohlvahz, clearly a word he has never heard before along with machine. That doesn't stop Mickey from confusing the guy further with even more crazy words and concepts he couldn't possibly fathom. "it was placed here hundreds of years ago by an alien race,...the sacrifices don't bring the rain, okay technology does." Ohvahz quite reasonably rejects this shattering of his worldview and begins to plead with the gods. Burnham literally rolls her eyes in disbelief. Seriously watch this moment, either SMG was directed to make this gesture or made this acting choice of her own volition. Incredible. So she asks Tilley if she can hear the preceding conversation and when Tilley weakly states that they are running out of air, asks her to have a little chat with Ravah to see if she can tell her something that will help her "reach" her father. Now I could be wrong here but I think Spock may have contacted Discovery and asked Rayner for solutions to convey the appropriate contemporary Dinobulan building schematics in order to help her search for the door lock rather than ask her hypoxia ridden colleague for help. Good writing would have found a better, more effective way to create tension than this. The tricorder inconsistency could have been eliminated by getting rid of the tricorder in the first place and by having the Discovery find the console for Burnham but I fear the showrunners liked the tech and thought Burnham and Tilley looked cool with their one blue eye.
I think we agree that the way Ohvahz is portrayed having difficulty accepting the truth is different than his beliefs was well performed. You mentioned 2 Strawman arguments against me, but I believe you misunderstood my point. I absolutely agree with you that even a cursory scan of the room could have revealed the location of the control and that Burnham would have had *no trouble* (None. Zero.) incapacitating Ohvahz if she chose to. However, I also believe Michael did not want to have to physically fight him. She just got done doing that with her own self - and as Spock would prefer, she tried to avoid that. My point was that when she entered, she chose to try to deal with Ohvahz, person to person, instead of ignore and overpower him. Would it have been better writing to reuse the fact that she has no issue scanning through the material that hides the technology? Maybe. Was the transporter issue consistent? I thought it was. With the inner chamber all sealed up, they couldn't beam right in, but once Ohvahz manipulated the device, that problem was solved and they started transporting right in. Would Spock have chosen a different way to do things? I think he may have tried to beam in at least a little more discretely and quietly incapacitated Ohvahz while he scanned the room for the control, rescued Tilly and manufactured some kind of happenstance that could prove to Ohvahz the sacrifice was unnecessary while saving Ravah - a brief speculation says the entire village would have interpreted Ravah as some divine chosen one, at that point. Needs a solution Spock would come up with. Maybe, to preserve the Prime Directive, they'd have to consider kidnapping Ravah and assimilating her into the Federation - maybe then there could be a followup story where she finally goes against all that and returns to her planet. Plot ensues. Getting all up in Ohvahz's face may not have been preferable, but that's how this Captain does things. Even James Bond is disliked by his superiors, but results are results - even when they go worse before they get better. As I see it, Burnham did what she thought was best once she beamed in and saw the state of things. Do other people have different ideas? They better. Thank you, thank you, for responding. I don't think you take me quite seriously or friendly, just yet (and maybe you won't) but I do hope we can debate things like this with love of the franchise rather than hate for any of it. My thinking goes like this: If we critique the show because we love it, it will continue, and it may get better. It we critique the show because we hate it, it will be cancelled and we may not have any more. There's obviously more to discuss, but I don't want to obligate you to any more reading before *deciding* to continue Live Long and Prosper 💙💙💙
@@InimicalWit I actually do appreciate the debate. I don't want to write much more on this episode as I'm reaching obsessive levels of attention here. I took your questions seriously however so I'll just try to correct anything I have written that may not have been clear. Our disagreement concerning Burnham's actions attempting to save Tilley's life is unimportant. However the debate is created by the tricorder issue I already mentioned. Btw, I didn't say the transporter issue was inconsistent, I said it was an accepted if lazy writing conceit. It is a tool used to raise stakes and tension much like the "ticking clock" trope commonly used in Star Trek over its history. I called the tricorder tech inconsistent. You ask "Would it have been better writing to reuse the fact that she has no issue scanning through the material that hides the technology?" No I don't think it would be better because that would have been too easy a solution and would have destroyed the tension. That is why I said," The tricorder inconsistency could have been eliminated by getting rid of the tricorder in the first place." My point is, don't introduce amazing new tech to solve an early obstacle if no reason is given to explain why the same available tech can't solve a similar problem later in the story. This is valid criticism of bad writing. But allow me to say that I don't blame the writers, I blame the showrunners who have both the initial and final say in the script remit. If I seem defensive, you have to understand that criticism of Discovery is often met with accusations of gatekeeping at best and racism, transphophia, sexism, and homophobia at worst. This happens because some critics ARE gatekeepers, some ARE guilty of one or another of that list of offences. And some are are guilty of all of them. Hell, some critics possess those predudices whilst still offering valid criticisms of Nu-Trek. People are complicated. This includes the show's defenders. I have no doubt that there are plenty of Nu-Trek fans who defend this content by attacking a critics' motivation, all the while agreeing with many of those same criticisms. If you enjoy Discovery, that's great. Find happiness wherever you can as long as it doesn't harm anyone. I disagree however with your concluding point and I'll tell you why. You write, "If we critique the show because we love it, it will continue, and it may get better. It we critique the show because we hate it, it will be cancelled and we may not have any more." Criticism will not make these shows get better. They need to die in order for someone else to take over the franchise. I think many of Nu-Trek's biggest defenders, hold a similar belief. If they don't vocally support Secret Hideout's Star Trek, the various series will be cancelled and they won't have Star Trek on television anymore. This includes countering any and all criticism with accusations like the ones I already mentioned. But no amount of criticism, poor IMDB or Rotten Tomatoes ratings will cause these shows to be cancelled. Discovery was cancelled because its ratings were poor and the show was unprofitable. Strange New Worlds could continue to have cartoon crossover and musical episodes galore and turn in the worst episodes of Star Trek ever, but will not be cancelled as long as it makes money. So, I guess what I'm saying is I''d rather have no Trek than bad Trek. Good luck to you IW
Firstly, the prime directive was already broken by the race that built the weather tower. So this whole worry about breaking the prime directive was silly. Secondly, the Discovery crew didn't even have to engage with the villagers to get the clue.
when you said the people working in the forest were using whistlespeak to talk to each other over long distances I thought you were about say they used whistlespeak to talk to the trees. That would be peak STD.
Excellent video as always. One thing: unless they make another Star Trek show that takes place in the 32nd century or later the thing with the ocular tricorders won’t be a thing. Great catch about the fires. I didn’t even think of that. How about the part where the first officer on one occasion refers to Adira as she after previously referring to them as they? For the record, though, I think there’s a bit of distance between the doctor recognizing that there might be something intangible about the human spirit, or a mystical element to life, and a society having a full on religion, where they worship gods. I don’t think those are the same thing and even if they are the same thing, I don’t think it’s silly that they show, you know, sort of both sides of the situation, where some people are spiritual, and they kind of explain why or explore why, and then, at the same time, show that, you know, other people, in this case, the Federation or Starfleet, have gotten away from that or have gone past it. I think both things are part of the human condition, and I am not finding any reason why it would be wrong for them to sort of show both of those aspects of humanity. I don’t think you can say they just did it so as to walk on eggshells around anyone. But, yeah, they goofed up a lot of stuff and I make the observation in my own review of this episode that it’s like they write these episodes and then just go with the first draft. No one goes over them to find the stupid shit that doesn’t make sense. You were right to point out what I missed which is: how did the thieves get to the technology in that alternate future when, up to this point, they’re now missing two of the clues and could not possibly have gotten ahead of Starfleet unless something went wrong between the point where they started time jumping and the end of this episode that they skipped over when they jumper time but even then, like, how? I didn’t even catch that where you did but what’s bad is that the people who are paid to make this show good didn’t catch that. And what about why in the end they’re bothering to go after the thieves? The only reason they interacted with them at all is because they were trying to get to the clues before them and then in some cases get back clues that they got before Starfleet got them, but now that they’re two clues ahead and there’s no way that the two of them could possibly get those next two clues and are essentially out of the race at this point why would they bother to chase them down Like they do at the end of this episode? What is the point of that? Anyway, I’d love it if you checked out my video on this episode.
Hope you're well staying safe, 🤓 I have to push back on the thing about the cloud seeding, future or not if you want to do something there may not always be a transporter, deflector dish, or other magic wand way to do things.
Abrahamitic Religions are oposed to human Sacrifice since the aforementioned Abraham. So offending Religious People would seem a unecessary worry (except for the sort of People who are offended anyway).
I agree about the Prime Directive needing consequences for those giving the orders to break it. The Prime Directive is like a future, cosmic in-scope, highest of contemporary "international laws". In the here and now we must cleave to such current laws when contemplating how the human condition can allow for humanity's future in such an enlightened Federation.
25:00 it's a Octagonal forcefield And i also thought it's BS they can't beam into the chamber because it's made of Tritanium - but ships are made of Tritanium too, and there is no problem?
That's a good point. Starships have transporter emitters, but there are plenty of cases when an invader beams in when the shields are down or when they're transporting onto or out of a ship that has no power.
And they said there were five towers but given the area one covers, that wouldn't suffice to keep the northern hemisphere free from dust, let alone the entire planet. I usually watch Star Trek in English but I checked the episode in my native language and they use the english pronoun "they" as well (which wouldn't make much difference for a female in my language). It's another filler episode in an already shortened season, let alone the last.
There is a they/them in the new Tales of the Empire cartoon featuring Barriss Offee. She and an Inquisitor hunt down and defeat a Jedi, which has a female head on a male body. Barriss suddenly starts referring to the Jedi as “they,” as if there are more than one. Confusing.
The first known written use of "they" as a singular pronoun was over 650 years ago. If you're still confused by something that's made sense for 650 years, that's on you. I hope you can get an education about the English language so that you understand it when it's used correctly.
@@scorptrio8231 The first instance biological sex evolving is 1-2 billion years ago. If you’re still confused about what is between your own legs I hope you can educate yourself. I hope you can obtain an understanding of basic human biology that even infants comprehend at an instinctual level.
In 800+ years these people on the planet had zero social or technical advancements? There were primitive over 800 years ago. They should have some technically by now.
Being limited to a quite small area will set some limitations on their advancement, but primitive isn't exactly the word I'd use. They have a highly ritualistic culture, and they do have some specialists, we also see they make cloth to a fairly advanced level, and also woodworking and pottery, all require sophisticated tools.
One of the better reasons for the prime sugestion is that interference might lead a civilisation to wait for outside help, rather then work things out for themselfs.
The whole "can't break the Prime Directive" thing was nonsense, because it was already broken long ago and the damage done by the towers having put there in the first place, so Michael isn't really doing anything wrong. I'm reminded of the "All the World's a Stage" episode of Prodigy, where the alien culture was long contaminated by a TOS redshirt and a faulty shuttle, and the only "right" thing to do was help them and give them technology and they weren't admonished in any way (and IMO this episode was better than Whistlespeak, despite being half as long and a "kids show").
Tanks for this, i was waiting for your review. The plot of those scientists makes no sense at all as even an Nausicaan can find all those clues or they simply get lost (for example the romulan ship with the dead one gets salvaged by Ferengis after some hundred years or the wild animals on Trill found another nest to breed and so on). They get the moral message only AFTER they found the clue, so whats the point of this scavenger hunt at all? Even the series shows how the smugglers and some evil Breen find it without help. So they could have simply burry one chest with all the information on a random planet, somebody will find it somehow or not. Episode 6 and im still confused why the romulan scientist worked for the federation president and betrayed his homeworld and later the taskforce of scientists hide their findings from the president and betray him also without any consequences. There is so many things wrong with the main plot as always, very annoying.
Let's assume the best and after the message was played back, it took some years before someone discovered that there was more somewhere besides the message, and the group wasn't assembled before the Romulans joined the dominion war, the warming relations and the long standing attitude amongst some romulans that maybe the Federation isn't the enemy they have been taught it is could allow for this, the real issue is cramming this in with the mess created by the JarJar movies and destroying Romulus.
@@vrenak The fact that they joined the war alongside the federation and the klingons hasn't really improved the diplomatic relations, the incident on the moon of Bajor speak for itself. Even if we give that, it makes no sense that the romulan hasn't informed his government about the progress and that they were not looking after him and his ship after he went rogue. But his clue were in a romulan riddle box, the shrine was in romulan too, supposed to be found by romulans. And then he parks his ship somewhere and goes to bed where he dies? Was this some weird suicide? Yes, there could be some twist and some reasons what leads to this situation somehow. But the writers didn't care to explain anything as they haven't thought about it at all. Also, Burnham solved the riddle and she comes from the pre-Kirk age, she shouldn't know anything about the romulans. Again, the whole scavenger hunt makes no sense as everybody could find those clues, even the smugglers with their teenage love affair.
@@FabiusPolis The alliance most certainly improved relations, they literally metion it in an episode. Alas Michael can do no wrong and knows everything is the writers mantra, and it really destroys the show from within. A scavenger hunt could work, but they need to be much more elaborate with the clues.
Season plot summary: we need to find a McGuffin, inside of which is a McGuffin, which when opened, reveals another McGuffin, which is the clue to lead us to five more McGuffins, which when assembled, will be or show us the way to the final McGuffin.
29:20 it makes sense that no one ever tried not to sacrifice a person. Mayans, I guess, never tried not to sacrifice people. Religous laws are above everything else.
I feel like there must be some people that work on this show with some common sense but they/him are afraid to say anything in case the producers give a signal to their HR department to get rid of them/him. Like a little finger across the neck signal.
STD has always been pro religious. Remember the second season episode with the Red Angel taking a church to another planet? It said the inhabitants created the ultimate PC religion, one that says all religions are correct.
Culbert said his grandma believed in all religions at once lol . They are afraid to offend any religion so they say they are all correct even if they contradict each other
@@NitpickingNerd "Believing in all religions" is just a thing people say after they join a cult in Southern California. I unfortunately know this from experience.
@@vrenakThe wrath of the picard will be as harsh as it will be swift. Hence he made season 1 and 2 to punish us. Fortunately we repented so he gave us season 3😂
@@NitpickingNerdAll religions being correct only _appears_ a paradox if one doesn’t understand the purpose of *spiritual kindergarten* aka Religion. There are infinite paths to understanding The Source but you can only walk one path: *Your own.* Religion is like-minded people following a exoteric path/philosophy they have in common trying to understand the esoteric. At their (uncorrupted) core (almost) all Religions teach the same thing: *Love Unconditionally.* _Everything_ else is just a mnemonic to help you remember the story because people apparently need 700,00+ words instead of two for some reason. Sadly false profits have replaced false prophets selling Heaven insurance; the ultimate wisdom of KNOW THYSELF has been replaced with materialism. Atheists are going to a conniption ~2050 when they find out that (almost) every intelligent species has their own religion. So much for the lie that Religion is “man made”. While Roddenberry was an ignorant Humanist he did understand certain spiritual and alien principles. His shift from “anti” religious in TOS to “pro” religious in DS9 shows his growth of understand that our innate divinity is what’s ultimately important, not JUST Science. Religion is one man telling you what you _Should_ do to understand The Source, Spirituality is one man telling you what you _Could_ do to understand the Source. Religion is in the core DNA of Star Trek; STD tapping into that is nothing new.
The fire Is obviously affected by the lowering oxygen levels, the flames would've had a negligible effect on the considerable amount of air in that room, and most importantly: the air was being removed from the room, I repeat, the air was being removed from the room; I felt that needed repeating since it makes that whole critique irrelevant.
@@NitpickingNerd Because, as I explained in more detail, it wouldn't have made any significant difference due to the large amount of air in that room, so her survival time depends entirely on how quickly the chamber depressurises.
@@MadScientist512 it makes no sense that she didn't even try to put out the fire to prolonged her life. if you were suffocating in a room and it had candles you would have put them out even if it's little different and would only buy you a few more seconds
One thing that annoys me, is that every time the Discovery gets fired upon, streams of hot molten metal sparks burst out onto the bridge. What the hell is causing this?
How come it rained at the end when the tower was not permitted to complete its operation? The door was opened before the vacuum, etc. were completed to seed the clouds.
also what would have happened if no one won that race . then they just wouldn't activate the tower and remain rainless ? nothing makes sense in this show
They have a third PHYSICAL gender, not just gender disphoria. This would be like someone born "intersex" here on Earth. When the doctor did a medical scan on Rava, he saw that.
I suppose Culbert referred to her as they as he only arrived later and didn't know the gender of her? I know people who always refer to others as they to be polite, if they don't know whether to call others he or she yet.
The use of ‘they’ makes more sense if you have already referenced Adira directly, or at least point to them while you are saying it. In any case, I find it rude to reference someone in the third person while they are STILL STANDING THERE.
I find it amazing that they're actually trying to keep from offending anyone religious. Usually these type of people don't care, or will do so deliberately (and usually explicitly [and typically only one religion]). So this is more in line with real Star Trek, and a breath of fresh air.
I don’t watch this sh1t but I can only hope the fire nonsense was there in the show just FOR people like nitpicking nerd. The creators of STD probably watch these videos and have a right chuckle. It has to be that. The alternative is not worth thinking about.
As an OLD Queer man... I do not get this they them krappyshite... We in the queer world have had a word that has been around LONG than me, much longer. She, He, Her, Him ... and "SHIM" We have a very long history of TV, TS, non-binary, etc... as Shim. My mum's brother referred to his gay friends (from WW1 era) as Shim. I do not know when it started but it seems to have been Forgetten.
It ("they" as a singular pronoun) started 650 years ago. You should get an education in the language arts, so that you can then understand the English language and not sound so ignorant and stupid.
It is like the writers are only watching cop shows. Other languages on Earth have personal pronouns for the non gendered. It is as if the writers just didn't look up that on a internet search.
0:28 This is a great question. Why name the episode after one particular facet of this culture? And why a facet that (I don’t think) is referenced again before the end? Are the other people here, this channel’s creator and those who watch and comment, content to leave that question as rhetorical or are there any ideas as to what the reason might be? If my experience reading these perspectives and trying to understand them is any indication, you all likely find these details exhausting and don’t want to apply more energy to it - and I get it. Reading all these dismissive remarks, and considering the viewpoints, it’s very taxing - but I’m simply not content to leave it at that, nor can I treat any of you with the same level of contempt that I read in the remarks. I’m describing my perspective. Please believe it is not my intent to attack any of you. I am as bewildered as you are. Trust me. On face, I’m excited the episode has that name and that there’s a culture that has such a language, because it’s such a rare thing on Earth. I loved seeing it brought up in Star Trek. But what about Whistlespeak’s (and its use to grant long distance communication) are of relevance to this particular episode? Let’s share some genuine ideas 💙💙💙 As I suggest with my parenthetical, above, I suspect it’s something to do with the unique properties at overcoming a problem: long distance communication. Perhaps the episode retains that title specifically to help keep the concept in our heads once the episode is over, because the language will be particularly relevant in a later episode?
@@NitpickingNerd 😁😁😁 yeah, you got me. But there is no really good equivalent in german for most gender terms. Gender in german is Geschlecht(Go bad). And Sex in german is Geschlechtsverkehr(Go bad traffic🤣🤣🤣) wich means fucking and not, if you have a penis or not. Penis and Vagina btw. are called Geschlechtsteile(go bad parts).😊😊😊
In the future, people should be more evolved. Using "they / them" is a good general term when not knowing which pronoun the person prefers. I have transitioned to using "they/them" instead of "he" or "she" when I don't know what their preference is.
@@NitpickingNerd No. When you talk to someone you don't usually use pronouns when talking directly to someone. We don't say "Hello she, how are you today?" It's when talking to someone else. Instead of saying "She looks okay to me. Her breathing appears fine," you can say, "They look okay to me. Their breathing appears fine." Once you start using they/them more regularly, it becomes more natural in speech.
What is confusing about a pronoun being both singular and plural in usage? We've been doing it for 650 years and it's only now that 'tards are confused by it.
![Star Trek: Discovery Cast Reveals Who Cried The Most Over Season 5 Being The Last [SXSW]](/img/n.gif)
I am SO glad these synopses confirm I was right in quitting after the first season pilot.
What is frustrating is that crap like this gets 5 seasons yet the spiritual successor to TNG, _The Orville_ had to fight to get 3 seasons.
Ironically enough, season 1 was the better of the seasons, and that's not saying much at all.
@@iamnotanuggetblackhart5103It got worse?!
/Oblg. “Oh my!”
It's no longer about having thought provoking and engaging stories, or doing world building that makes sense. To them it's about having a bunch of characters, representing different groups, that each can have a fan base that can relate to them, and they can discuss endlessly who the best character ever is. The plot is just something you need to keep showing the characters and giving them a chance to show how awesome they are. So this season they decided that a scavenger hunt is good enough, because they can visit various planets. That's also why they don't kill off any positive characters, because that would disappoint that character's fans. And I don't think they have any explanation for Kovich, they just wanted to have a mysterious guy on the show.
That about sums it up. Call-it-in lazy (AI generated?) writing with a schtick.
The worst thing they could have done and did is make the characters relatable. It sounds good on the surface, because why wouldn't we want to relate ourselves to them? Well, these are not 2024 humans. They live 400 years in the future and are highly intelligent, trained and professional officers. They are not mental cases on the verge of a breakdown. They can have many flaws, in which we can see ourselves, but these people are supposed to be role models.
You hit the nail on the head! In their desperate efforts to make characters seem "real and relatable" they just write characters who are pathetically stupid and wouldn't make it a single week working on a starship, because their weak feelings were too hurt to do their duties.
The real reason they used the mirror Enterprise was so they didn't need to build another set, just use that one.
''Tilly could have done this... that...'' You're asking unintelligent people to write intelligent characters. Remember what show this is.
Tilly beats Michael at cardio. LOL.
I am always looking forward to your review more than the actual episode.
Tilly winning a running race is hilarious. She actually did the same in an earlier episode (S2 or 3) when they were running a race in the Discovery hallway so there is precedence she is amazing at physical endurance regardless of body size. There has never been a single good episode of STD, and this last season isn't providing even a slight hope that is going to change.
😂 maybe Tilly could win if everybody ate poison or something.
Tbf she was thinner in the earlier seasons. She let herself go as a Golden Corral spokesperson.
@@JohnS-il1dr Wow, yes, I didn't realise how much thinner she was. Body positivity though!
I’m offended that they really keep trying to get me to not use logic or believe my eyes. It just feels deliberate. I use to think Tilly was a little good looking. Then she got sting by a thousand bees.
It’s called “sci-fi” you nerds. The “fi” stands for fiction. There is no gravity in the Discovery universe. Only density. And on density there is nothing more powerful than a Tilly.
No way!
Tilly: She’s having trouble breathing.
So Tilly refers to Ravah as she.
Or maybe the queen of endurance got it wrong.
I'm calling shenanigans on the whole thing.
The only "they" i registered was Colbert referring to them.
The fire did get smaller as the episode moved on The thing that got me was that once they had violated the prime directive, they just go all out and tell them everything, not even trying to keep the violation to a minimum.
yeah this is a nuance that gets lost on hack writers. You're violating the Prime Directive for a REASON, not because it's fun.
ENT was going to have a two parter where Archers crew runs into mirror Kirk, transported into our universe from the Tantulus field. It would have been a really cool two parter.
Two quick comments: first of all, in terms of humanity encountering something greater than itself, Tilly might have a problem with that. Second point: as far as this episode, subverting, the usual, Roddenberry plot, I think the reason for religion to be given a space here, is that by the end of the season, Michael Burnham is going to become God. So the show can’t quite criticize religion too much, since their lead character is about to become God.
Yeah, Tilly finding something greater than herself might lead to stress eating for her xD
TNG’s “Pen Pals” dealt with the ‘dilemma’ of permitting a species to perish when they could’ve been saved on account of the Prime Suggestion.
Prime Directive, not suggestion
@@jamiethomas18 Did you watch the video?
A couple issues you didn't talk about:
-In the previous episode, there was a warning at the beginning of the episode, right after the first STAR TREK intro and the CBS Production, that there will be strong flashy lights that might affect people that are sensitive, even though there were few strong flashy lights. But for some reason I didn't see the warning being present at the beginning of the episode, and the very first scene of this episode involved nothing but an epileptic's worse nightmare. Did I somehow miss the warning?
-The scene with dr. Culbert talking to his ChatGPT grandma is such a lazy ripoff of Tony Stark's holo-therapy scene from CA: Civil War (Culbert even mentions how it's supposed to be therapeutic), that the STD writers didn't even bother finding an actress that looks remotely similar to Wilson Cruz, "abulita" is dressed almost like Tony Stark's mom in that film.
-It's been nearly 4 years since Adira was introduced, and the character is now even dumber than before, being incapable of doing even the basics of a Starfleet officer. I guess the writers really think the character will accumulate in the last 4 episodes, about 4 years worth of character development.
-Early in the episode they mention that the water in the vial is so pure that it can only be obtained from air, since there are no contaminants in air... except for sand, dust, organic compounds, plant and fungi spores, etc., all of which the alien planet had plenty of... and remember that this episode aired while there's Saharan dust turning the air in Southern Europe into Arrakis or Hollywood Mexico...
-The name of the planet, Halem'no, they pronounce it almost like how Wonder Woman says "Kal-el no" in Josstice League
How does Adira’s disheartening plot point prior to their bridge assignment factor in?
Data had 2 such moments I can think of off the top of my head. An incident in Season 2 when Data thought he couldn’t be trusted on the bridge and *Picard* had to talk some sense into him; and then again *in TNG’s first movie* (how many years later?) when Data tried to abandon his post and Picard *again* had to talk some sense into him.
Please, articulate for me, why this *first* example of Adira showing a lack of confidence is so offensive to your sensibilities of a Starfleet officer or character on the show? Did you have similar problems with Reginald Barclay?
Real talk. I’m fascinated by people’s differing views on this show and I am struggling to understand how it is hated. My inspiration (one of them) is Riva, from an early TNG episode.
Please do not react as though I’m trolling you. I’m genuinely trying to engage 💙
@@InimicalWit When we're first introduced to Adira, the character is shown to be an officer in the Earth Force and was competent but also resourceful (quickly made a transporter jammer) in what was basically special ops (boarding Discovery), and behaved professionally during that time. Skip 4 years to current S5 and Adira now cannot think anymore under pressure (like during the incident with the drone statue) nor under little pressure (like helping Burnham repair the control panel, even though the tricorder pretty much told them all what to fix).
For some unexplained reason, Discovery writers decided to change the character from "competent and skillful" to "rookie that still has much to learn", even though Adira is supposed to have centuries of life experience from the Trill symbiote to learn from.
@@sargon6000 Crap. Lost some original messaging after some writing and some research. Will try to reconstruct:
I see you've presented 3 incidents, giving me some homework, because memory isn't what it used to be and I tend to only watch things once, these days. "That Hope is You, Part 2" and "Under the Twin Moons".
Question, tho: For those 3 incidents, in how many was someone's life in immediate danger? You suggested "less pressure" above, for the 2nd incident, but that's when the Captain and Saru were actively being fired at. For the 3rd incident, Tilly's life was in danger, but I don't think that was true until a little bit later. I would say Adira's demotivation was more directly (and explicitly) their recent unwitting hand in Discovery getting trapped in time. I think we all agree at actual "fault" for that, but that's not how psychology works.
Speaking of psychology, tho, regarding Tal - isn't Adira absent those memories more and more, now that Tal is no longer a part of them?
I still have to address the 1st incident, tho, and while I think I can recall enough of the 2nd, I definitely don't of the 1st; and I want to remember the 2nd better moving forward.
I like how critical you're being, but I do think maybe you're being overly critical - however, this is just one of the points you brought up, previously (it deserves being mentioned).
Honestly, all these things I'm seeing people bring up about (why they hate) the show gets overwhelming to try and think about altogether. I had to pick one, and if I'm being completely honest, I think I picked Adira, because despite being LGBT myself, I don't have a lot of experience with the gender diversity they present for us; so I'm pushing on that a little bit.
I do wonder, though, as I mentioned previously: How does your view on Data's own recurring drop in confidence contrast with your view on Adira's?
And if you read this far, thank you for giving me what time you did. 💙💙💙
Glad I'm not the only one that saw this was sooo much a Stargate setting. Also having these grinding stone structures move like in Stargate when this is not the way things are in the ST universe, the Denobulan would have used forcefield and holograms to hide the tech.
The 'Trapped in a room and Running out of Air with Torches Burning" situation sounds like something they would give fifth graders to think about during a Starfleet Academy simulation. "First I would cover all the burning flames and use the light from my communicator or tricorder to continue to search for ways out" Good job, Timmy! How can anyone take this seriously. This doesn't even pretend to be science fiction. This is the sort of thing that would happen on an episode of a teen sitcom that you would just be expected to ignore.
Geordie: visual tricorder?!
honestly..... cybernetic eyes have been used for this since early TNG yeah. heck even TOS had cybernetics for senses to some degree. BUT... this piece of tech is seemingly not cybernetics. It's a scanning device that literally fits on your eye like a contact lens. Honestly.... I think it'd be better if the lens was just the HUD for the device, not the whole device, but even then, what's the control mechanism?
I though exactly the same thing. Why didn't Tilly put out all those torches to save oxygen? Style over substance... I am guessing they wanted the visual prompt of the flames getting lower to show the oxygen being depleted.
yes, and I guess they wrote themselves into that corner by that civilisation not having lightbulbs or leds or any kind of artificial light sources besides fire and their "temples" not having any of that either. I guess they are not supposed to be there, so the Weather tower lighting didnt turn on and they braught those torches there.
"after he had another man inside of him" kek. great review as per usual! danke!
🤓
Man that version of Jean Luc in you thumbnail probably cruised across the desert landscape of New New Vegas in a monstrously oversized Cadillac with a trunk full of illicit substances and worf dressed up like a schluby parinoid lawyer going all "Fear and Loathing " on Risa. In short, he excavated Hunter S. Thompson's Glasses and Arsenal from Woody Creek. That would make a heck of a season 4 of Picard Worf a Jean Luc's LSD feulled romp through the Stars. LOL
That romulan ale hits different
Yes, you've nailed this story's foolishness. Fire allowed to burn in the suffocation room. They/them nonsense (in the context of a sci-fi story set far in the future). Tilly being body-positive doing that marathon. And more. There's nothing wrong, in principle, with these ideas. As we know, though, Discovery very unnaturally forces those "currently modern concepts" into the story. But, that said, I found this episode one of the 'better' ones because it moved along and until the end didn't force us to watch long sappy, weapy PC-indulgent scenes. The writers of this series are so clueless. One day this series will end. Can't happen soon enough.
Classic TOS style episode!? Yeah, right one of really bad ones lol!
This episode broke me.
Yeah it was pretty boring. Definitely a filler episode in which not really anything happened to add to the season's plot.
This Eps also borrows ideas from other shows like SGA and ST TNG only they were written better.
As a Stargate SG-1 episode it would have made much more sense. Teal'c would have been the perfect participant in the race, Sam Carter and Daniel Jackson would have fixed the control panel and O'Neill could have convinced the local guy to open the door. Or: two of them would have examined one of the broken towers to study the technology, having a hard time to cross the wasteland, but ultimately fixing it. In the meantime the other two would have dealt with the local people, adding another level to the episode. But: here we are with Burnham, who is smarter and better than anyone else.
Well, Tilly winning is no problem, because lets face it, the other people did not even try to win, because they are not as stupid as the daughter and don't want to die.
Excellent point!!!
It is kind of a problem. Even if everyone gave up, the challenge remains the same. There is no way she would have lasted all the way to the tower much less even halfway. She is no longer fat - she is obese. The fact they made Burnham the one to stop and rest for a bit seals the fact they were conscious in trying to make Tilly look capable in physical aspects of missions, but she clearly isn't.
Jessie Gender "Pre-warp makes it sound like a nessesary evolutionary step. I prefer to call it Non-warp."(quoted from memory)😁
How did one denobulan scientist breaking the prime directive manage to install 5 gigantic weather control towers? Did he really do it alone?
Tilly doesn't need air to breath. She's not human. She's a cancerous blob of terrible writing and character design.
I don't understand why Burnham chose to break the prime directive as soon as she really her friend was going to die? And why didn't she transport near but out of sight from Ohvahz and then at least try to reason with him to open the door (which surely she could have located with her retina tricorder anyway) before breaking the PD if she felt she had too? And the broader and ongoing problem is that this is another example of the Michael Burnham show. I think she said in an earlier episode to Rayner that it's important to her that the crew feel involved and engaged, but she doesn't really seem to. This would have been a good away mission for Rayner, for example. Also I didn't understand why the scenes weren't shot in a more barren environment if they struggle with drought so much. That threw me. And what was the point of the whistle-speak thing??
"the Queen of Endurance"
"Ain't No Way"
22:24 22:40 33:14
Is this your queen?😂🤣😂 she looks like if Staypufft marshmallow man joined starfleet.
Please people are people
This weider of star trek , don't talk about religion
This weider of star trek , don't talk about religion
Fire in a Oxygen poor environment would lead to Carbonmonoxyde Poisoning in terribly short Time.
The whole "Find the progenitor tech" arc just shows they have run out of ideas so the only thing they could do was steal an idea from TNG and expand on it. I guess the next arc they will be looking for the Genesis Device.
It was so boring I fell asleep before the end. It felt like filler
I catched myself looking several times at my blank wall instead of at the screen, thinking about random stuff, im not joking. It WAS a filler even though there would be so much to explain about the plot.
So did I 😂
We need to start writing our own episodes. Nitpicking Nerd has plenty of ideas. Remember what Captain Kirk said:
"In every revolution, there is one man with a vision." 🙂
We had no idea how good we had it when we complaining about Ent being the crap new star trek...
Don't worry 5x07 will see Mickey getting busted back down to ensign for braking the prime directive, lots of whisper crying.
Culbert found religion? wasnt he reborn of mycelial mushrooms? what is he worshiping mushrooms now?
They also make a HUGE point and go wow!!! when they state the fact that they have 3 genders. I am also really tired of the doctor's whining. His character is the worst in the show.
Star Trek "missed opportunity" Discovery
"They can go do their missions totally naked now"
Ugh! Thanks for that disturbing visual!
Gah!
🤣😂 it’s Saru isn’t it? You don’t want to see Saru Naked?
You know something? Every creature in reality or fiction, underneath all their clothes … they’re naked.
😏💙
I was also bothered by Tilly winning the race. But then I thought that maybe this planet has a smaller size than Earth or a specific air composition that benefits humans. Just like on our planet, where most marathon champions come from a specific region in East Africa.
If they actually mentioned that then it would be ok
So Mickey B's retinal tricorder can find a console terminal under a mutated mushroom covered rock but can't find the vacuum chamber door lock while looking right at it. Hell, MB could have simply looked under the carpet with her non-tricorder eye to find the lock mechanism. No that would be too easy and then MB wouldn't be able to use her special empathy persuasion powers. And who cares if she breaks the Prime Directive? There's like nine goddam people outside the temple. Who would believe these cavemen? They might as well whistle dixie. Ha ha ha, whilstlespeak my arse.
Which scene did you watch where Michael had a chance to scan the room before her presence was known? Please tell me about the part where she couldn’t find it despite a thorough effort and then turned to Ohvahz? She had multiple objectives, at that point, because as far as she knew, if she ignored him and scanned and tried to do it herself, she may have had to physically fight him - because despite his sadness, he was ready to accept the outcome.
I know people hate this era, but truly; let’s debate this a bit. That’s what Star Trek is about, among other things 💙
@@InimicalWit Alright let's debate this. "Which scene did you watch where Michael had a chance to scan the room before her presence was known?" I watched no such scene and never claimed I did. Nice Strawman. "Please tell me about the part where she couldn’t find it despite a thorough effort and then turned to Ohvahz?" I never claimed Burnham couldn't find it (the lock mechanism) despite a thorough effort and then turned to Ohvahz. Again, nice Strawman. I stated that Burnham's retinal tricorder could find a console terminal under a mutated mushroom (moss actually, my bad) covered rock but couldn't find the vacuum chamber door lock while looking right at it." Watch the scene again. The lock mechanism is located no more than two feet away from Ohvahz, hidden under a carpet. A cursory search should have spotted it immediately, nevermind a thorough search or a Tricorder search. The chamber's tritanium shell preventing the Discovery from beaming Tilley and Ravah to safety is an accepted if lazy writing conceit but technology that moves a story forward at one point suddenly going missing when it would save the day at the climax is an unforgivable inconsistency and an example of bad writing. "She had multiple objectives." No, she did not, Burnham had one objective and that was to save Tilley's life. She wasn't thinking about the clue, or the Prime Directive or the Progenitors or anything else. " If she ignored him and scanned and tried to do it herself, she may have had to physically fight him." Michael Burnham regularly throws two hundred pound Commandos the length of Discovery's corridors, how much trouble do you think she would have holding off one middle-aged, malnourished priest while she opens a door? Look, I know the writers are trying to create stakes and tension, but if you rewatch te scene, the tension is actually created by Burnham as she handles the situation in a manner that would make her supposed stepbrother Spock ashamed. She beams into the room startling Ohvahz. Rather than attempting to calm him with some of SMG's patented whisper acting, she immediately demands that he open this door as he splutters in confusion. It's no wonder the poor guy asks if she's a god, Burnham gets in his face and boldly states," I AM HERE, LISTEN TO ME! YOU HAVE TO OPEN...THIS DOOR. MY FRIEND IS IN THERE, she doesn't want to die and she doesn't NEED TO DIE! RAVAH DOESN'T NEED TO DIE!!! OHVAHZ! OHVAHZ! WE ARE STANDING INSIDE OF A MACHINE! (she's getting really loud here btw, clearly terrifying the man) THIS IS A PIECE OF TECHNOLOGY!" "Technology?" asks Ohlvahz, clearly a word he has never heard before along with machine. That doesn't stop Mickey from confusing the guy further with even more crazy words and concepts he couldn't possibly fathom. "it was placed here hundreds of years ago by an alien race,...the sacrifices don't bring the rain, okay technology does." Ohvahz quite reasonably rejects this shattering of his worldview and begins to plead with the gods. Burnham literally rolls her eyes in disbelief. Seriously watch this moment, either SMG was directed to make this gesture or made this acting choice of her own volition. Incredible. So she asks Tilley if she can hear the preceding conversation and when Tilley weakly states that they are running out of air, asks her to have a little chat with Ravah to see if she can tell her something that will help her "reach" her father. Now I could be wrong here but I think Spock may have contacted Discovery and asked Rayner for solutions to convey the appropriate contemporary Dinobulan building schematics in order to help her search for the door lock rather than ask her hypoxia ridden colleague for help. Good writing would have found a better, more effective way to create tension than this. The tricorder inconsistency could have been eliminated by getting rid of the tricorder in the first place and by having the Discovery find the console for Burnham but I fear the showrunners liked the tech and thought Burnham and Tilley looked cool with their one blue eye.
@@jinks6005 I love it! Brilliant, give me a few minutes, please - I understand your angle much better, now 💙💙💙
I think we agree that the way Ohvahz is portrayed having difficulty accepting the truth is different than his beliefs was well performed.
You mentioned 2 Strawman arguments against me, but I believe you misunderstood my point. I absolutely agree with you that even a cursory scan of the room could have revealed the location of the control and that Burnham would have had *no trouble* (None. Zero.) incapacitating Ohvahz if she chose to. However, I also believe Michael did not want to have to physically fight him. She just got done doing that with her own self - and as Spock would prefer, she tried to avoid that.
My point was that when she entered, she chose to try to deal with Ohvahz, person to person, instead of ignore and overpower him. Would it have been better writing to reuse the fact that she has no issue scanning through the material that hides the technology? Maybe. Was the transporter issue consistent? I thought it was. With the inner chamber all sealed up, they couldn't beam right in, but once Ohvahz manipulated the device, that problem was solved and they started transporting right in.
Would Spock have chosen a different way to do things? I think he may have tried to beam in at least a little more discretely and quietly incapacitated Ohvahz while he scanned the room for the control, rescued Tilly and manufactured some kind of happenstance that could prove to Ohvahz the sacrifice was unnecessary while saving Ravah - a brief speculation says the entire village would have interpreted Ravah as some divine chosen one, at that point. Needs a solution Spock would come up with. Maybe, to preserve the Prime Directive, they'd have to consider kidnapping Ravah and assimilating her into the Federation - maybe then there could be a followup story where she finally goes against all that and returns to her planet. Plot ensues.
Getting all up in Ohvahz's face may not have been preferable, but that's how this Captain does things. Even James Bond is disliked by his superiors, but results are results - even when they go worse before they get better.
As I see it, Burnham did what she thought was best once she beamed in and saw the state of things. Do other people have different ideas? They better.
Thank you, thank you, for responding. I don't think you take me quite seriously or friendly, just yet (and maybe you won't) but I do hope we can debate things like this with love of the franchise rather than hate for any of it. My thinking goes like this:
If we critique the show because we love it, it will continue, and it may get better.
It we critique the show because we hate it, it will be cancelled and we may not have any more.
There's obviously more to discuss, but I don't want to obligate you to any more reading before *deciding* to continue
Live Long and Prosper 💙💙💙
@@InimicalWit I actually do appreciate the debate. I don't want to write much more on this episode as I'm reaching obsessive levels of attention here. I took your questions seriously however so I'll just try to correct anything I have written that may not have been clear. Our disagreement concerning Burnham's actions attempting to save Tilley's life is unimportant. However the debate is created by the tricorder issue I already mentioned. Btw, I didn't say the transporter issue was inconsistent, I said it was an accepted if lazy writing conceit. It is a tool used to raise stakes and tension much like the "ticking clock" trope commonly used in Star Trek over its history. I called the tricorder tech inconsistent. You ask "Would it have been better writing to reuse the fact that she has no issue scanning through the material that hides the technology?" No I don't think it would be better because that would have been too easy a solution and would have destroyed the tension. That is why I said," The tricorder inconsistency could have been eliminated by getting rid of the tricorder in the first place." My point is, don't introduce amazing new tech to solve an early obstacle if no reason is given to explain why the same available tech can't solve a similar problem later in the story. This is valid criticism of bad writing. But allow me to say that I don't blame the writers, I blame the showrunners who have both the initial and final say in the script remit. If I seem defensive, you have to understand that criticism of Discovery is often met with accusations of gatekeeping at best and racism, transphophia, sexism, and homophobia at worst. This happens because some critics ARE gatekeepers, some ARE guilty of one or another of that list of offences. And some are are guilty of all of them. Hell, some critics possess those predudices whilst still offering valid criticisms of Nu-Trek. People are complicated. This includes the show's defenders. I have no doubt that there are plenty of Nu-Trek fans who defend this content by attacking a critics' motivation, all the while agreeing with many of those same criticisms. If you enjoy Discovery, that's great. Find happiness wherever you can as long as it doesn't harm anyone. I disagree however with your concluding point and I'll tell you why.
You write,
"If we critique the show because we love it, it will continue, and it may get better.
It we critique the show because we hate it, it will be cancelled and we may not have any more."
Criticism will not make these shows get better. They need to die in order for someone else to take over the franchise. I think many of Nu-Trek's biggest defenders, hold a similar belief. If they don't vocally support Secret Hideout's Star Trek, the various series will be cancelled and they won't have Star Trek on television anymore. This includes countering any and all criticism with accusations like the ones I already mentioned. But no amount of criticism, poor IMDB or Rotten Tomatoes ratings will cause these shows to be cancelled. Discovery was cancelled because its ratings were poor and the show was unprofitable. Strange New Worlds could continue to have cartoon crossover and musical episodes galore and turn in the worst episodes of Star Trek ever, but will not be cancelled as long as it makes money. So, I guess what I'm saying is I''d rather have no Trek than bad Trek. Good luck to you IW
Firstly, the prime directive was already broken by the race that built the weather tower. So this whole worry about breaking the prime directive was silly. Secondly, the Discovery crew didn't even have to engage with the villagers to get the clue.
Exactly! This episode looks like writers have no idea what Prime Directive is.
when you said the people working in the forest were using whistlespeak to talk to each other over long distances I thought you were about say they used whistlespeak to talk to the trees. That would be peak STD.
Excellent video as always.
One thing: unless they make another Star Trek show that takes place in the 32nd century or later the thing with the ocular tricorders won’t be a thing.
Great catch about the fires. I didn’t even think of that.
How about the part where the first officer on one occasion refers to Adira as she after previously referring to them as they?
For the record, though, I think there’s a bit of distance between the doctor recognizing that there might be something intangible about the human spirit, or a mystical element to life, and a society having a full on religion, where they worship gods. I don’t think those are the same thing and even if they are the same thing, I don’t think it’s silly that they show, you know, sort of both sides of the situation, where some people are spiritual, and they kind of explain why or explore why, and then, at the same time, show that, you know, other people, in this case, the Federation or Starfleet, have gotten away from that or have gone past it. I think both things are part of the human condition, and I am not finding any reason why it would be wrong for them to sort of show both of those aspects of humanity. I don’t think you can say they just did it so as to walk on eggshells around anyone.
But, yeah, they goofed up a lot of stuff and I make the observation in my own review of this episode that it’s like they write these episodes and then just go with the first draft. No one goes over them to find the stupid shit that doesn’t make sense.
You were right to point out what I missed which is: how did the thieves get to the technology in that alternate future when, up to this point, they’re now missing two of the clues and could not possibly have gotten ahead of Starfleet unless something went wrong between the point where they started time jumping and the end of this episode that they skipped over when they jumper time but even then, like, how? I didn’t even catch that where you did but what’s bad is that the people who are paid to make this show good didn’t catch that.
And what about why in the end they’re bothering to go after the thieves? The only reason they interacted with them at all is because they were trying to get to the clues before them and then in some cases get back clues that they got before Starfleet got them, but now that they’re two clues ahead and there’s no way that the two of them could possibly get those next two clues and are essentially out of the race at this point why would they bother to chase them down Like they do at the end of this episode? What is the point of that?
Anyway, I’d love it if you checked out my video on this episode.
Nitpicking Nerd watching Star Trek so I don't have to.
The tricorder in the evolving to other devices being adopted sounds like a Borg origin story.
They had retinal try quarters all along. Jordy waited till 1st contract to get them because he is old school then. Awsome! Science!
It' was a good episode, but i agree with you in everything
Tilly aka baron harkonnen without anti-grav...wins marathon....ok...
Hope you're well staying safe,
🤓 I have to push back on the thing about the cloud seeding, future or not if you want to do something there may not always be a transporter, deflector dish, or other magic wand way to do things.
Abrahamitic Religions are oposed to human Sacrifice since the aforementioned Abraham. So offending Religious People would seem a unecessary worry (except for the sort of People who are offended anyway).
Christianity is based on a human sacrifice.
I agree about the Prime Directive needing consequences for those giving the orders to break it. The Prime Directive is like a future, cosmic in-scope, highest of contemporary "international laws". In the here and now we must cleave to such current laws when contemplating how the human condition can allow for humanity's future in such an enlightened Federation.
25:00 it's a Octagonal forcefield
And i also thought it's BS they can't beam into the chamber because it's made of Tritanium - but ships are made of Tritanium too, and there is no problem?
Maybe cause its solid tritanium
That's a good point. Starships have transporter emitters, but there are plenty of cases when an invader beams in when the shields are down or when they're transporting onto or out of a ship that has no power.
This review had me in stitches 😂😂😂 great job thank you!
And they said there were five towers but given the area one covers, that wouldn't suffice to keep the northern hemisphere free from dust, let alone the entire planet.
I usually watch Star Trek in English but I checked the episode in my native language and they use the english pronoun "they" as well (which wouldn't make much difference for a female in my language). It's another filler episode in an already shortened season, let alone the last.
"... Why he looks like today's Shatner." 🤣
Great line, love your reviews.
At least we can say this is just a possible future. A future that hopefully never happens.
There is a they/them in the new Tales of the Empire cartoon featuring Barriss Offee. She and an Inquisitor hunt down and defeat a Jedi, which has a female head on a male body. Barriss suddenly starts referring to the Jedi as “they,” as if there are more than one. Confusing.
The first known written use of "they" as a singular pronoun was over 650 years ago. If you're still confused by something that's made sense for 650 years, that's on you. I hope you can get an education about the English language so that you understand it when it's used correctly.
@@scorptrio8231 The first instance biological sex evolving is 1-2 billion years ago. If you’re still confused about what is between your own legs I hope you can educate yourself. I hope you can obtain an understanding of basic human biology that even infants comprehend at an instinctual level.
oh god, I didn't even notice the fires... holy shit it's even dumber than I thought.
maybe because it was so fucking boring that I wasn't even paying attention. (that's my excuse at least)
In 800+ years these people on the planet had zero social or technical advancements? There were primitive over 800 years ago. They should have some technically by now.
Not if they're communists
Being limited to a quite small area will set some limitations on their advancement, but primitive isn't exactly the word I'd use. They have a highly ritualistic culture, and they do have some specialists, we also see they make cloth to a fairly advanced level, and also woodworking and pottery, all require sophisticated tools.
@@FerdinandFake😂
Its because they had 3 genders and no classes.
No chance of advancement socially no tech advancement either.
One of the better reasons for the prime sugestion is that interference might lead a civilisation to wait for outside help, rather then work things out for themselfs.
Spirituality is not the same as Religion.
Men ,woman.
The whole "can't break the Prime Directive" thing was nonsense, because it was already broken long ago and the damage done by the towers having put there in the first place, so Michael isn't really doing anything wrong.
I'm reminded of the "All the World's a Stage" episode of Prodigy, where the alien culture was long contaminated by a TOS redshirt and a faulty shuttle, and the only "right" thing to do was help them and give them technology and they weren't admonished in any way (and IMO this episode was better than Whistlespeak, despite being half as long and a "kids show").
This is a total copy of Who Watches the Watchers in s3 TNG
I’m betting in the end the entire season will be a convoluted copy of “The Chase”.
The picard will spite u for this blasphemy.
Dont u dare compare this heresy to anything in tng.
Even sub rosa is better than every episodes in std😂😂
Tanks for this, i was waiting for your review. The plot of those scientists makes no sense at all as even an Nausicaan can find all those clues or they simply get lost (for example the romulan ship with the dead one gets salvaged by Ferengis after some hundred years or the wild animals on Trill found another nest to breed and so on). They get the moral message only AFTER they found the clue, so whats the point of this scavenger hunt at all? Even the series shows how the smugglers and some evil Breen find it without help. So they could have simply burry one chest with all the information on a random planet, somebody will find it somehow or not. Episode 6 and im still confused why the romulan scientist worked for the federation president and betrayed his homeworld and later the taskforce of scientists hide their findings from the president and betray him also without any consequences. There is so many things wrong with the main plot as always, very annoying.
Let's assume the best and after the message was played back, it took some years before someone discovered that there was more somewhere besides the message, and the group wasn't assembled before the Romulans joined the dominion war, the warming relations and the long standing attitude amongst some romulans that maybe the Federation isn't the enemy they have been taught it is could allow for this, the real issue is cramming this in with the mess created by the JarJar movies and destroying Romulus.
@@vrenak The fact that they joined the war alongside the federation and the klingons hasn't really improved the diplomatic relations, the incident on the moon of Bajor speak for itself. Even if we give that, it makes no sense that the romulan hasn't informed his government about the progress and that they were not looking after him and his ship after he went rogue. But his clue were in a romulan riddle box, the shrine was in romulan too, supposed to be found by romulans. And then he parks his ship somewhere and goes to bed where he dies? Was this some weird suicide? Yes, there could be some twist and some reasons what leads to this situation somehow. But the writers didn't care to explain anything as they haven't thought about it at all. Also, Burnham solved the riddle and she comes from the pre-Kirk age, she shouldn't know anything about the romulans. Again, the whole scavenger hunt makes no sense as everybody could find those clues, even the smugglers with their teenage love affair.
@@FabiusPolis The alliance most certainly improved relations, they literally metion it in an episode. Alas Michael can do no wrong and knows everything is the writers mantra, and it really destroys the show from within. A scavenger hunt could work, but they need to be much more elaborate with the clues.
Season plot summary: we need to find a McGuffin, inside of which is a McGuffin, which when opened, reveals another McGuffin, which is the clue to lead us to five more McGuffins, which when assembled, will be or show us the way to the final McGuffin.
Im not watching anymore, I just watch these reviews. PC culture has killed star trek
29:20 it makes sense that no one ever tried not to sacrifice a person. Mayans, I guess, never tried not to sacrifice people. Religous laws are above everything else.
The doctor has gay telepathyt
😂😂😂😂
Gaylepathy.
It's his superpower.
It's something that happens when you die and get resurrected by mushrooms.
ps... Kronenberg... is Picard. He had his gollum have some 'plastic surgery' to look different... ;)
This is supposed to be a red directive super duper urgent mission. There's zero sense of urgency
Couldn't get through it. it's more of the same garbage 🤦🏽♂️In no world is Tilly winning a marathon 😂😂😂
I feel like there must be some people that work on this show with some common sense but they/him are afraid to say anything in case the producers give a signal to their HR department to get rid of them/him. Like a little finger across the neck signal.
Say please people
STD has always been pro religious. Remember the second season episode with the Red Angel taking a church to another planet? It said the inhabitants created the ultimate PC religion, one that says all religions are correct.
Culbert said his grandma believed in all religions at once lol . They are afraid to offend any religion so they say they are all correct even if they contradict each other
@@NitpickingNerd "Believing in all religions" is just a thing people say after they join a cult in Southern California. I unfortunately know this from experience.
@@NitpickingNerd The Picard will not be pleased.
@@vrenakThe wrath of the picard will be as harsh as it will be swift.
Hence he made season 1 and 2 to punish us.
Fortunately we repented so he gave us season 3😂
@@NitpickingNerdAll religions being correct only _appears_ a paradox if one doesn’t understand the purpose of *spiritual kindergarten* aka Religion. There are infinite paths to understanding The Source but you can only walk one path: *Your own.* Religion is like-minded people following a exoteric path/philosophy they have in common trying to understand the esoteric.
At their (uncorrupted) core (almost) all Religions teach the same thing:
*Love Unconditionally.*
_Everything_ else is just a mnemonic to help you remember the story because people apparently need 700,00+ words instead of two for some reason. Sadly false profits have replaced false prophets selling Heaven insurance; the ultimate wisdom of KNOW THYSELF has been replaced with materialism.
Atheists are going to a conniption ~2050 when they find out that (almost) every intelligent species has their own religion. So much for the lie that Religion is “man made”.
While Roddenberry was an ignorant Humanist he did understand certain spiritual and alien principles. His shift from “anti” religious in TOS to “pro” religious in DS9 shows his growth of understand that our innate divinity is what’s ultimately important, not JUST Science.
Religion is one man telling you what you _Should_ do to understand The Source,
Spirituality is one man telling you what you _Could_ do to understand the Source.
Religion is in the core DNA of Star Trek; STD tapping into that is nothing new.
The "non-binary girl?"
When the excuses are exhausted beyond the capacity to hold up the falseness...is that reality real?
The fire Is obviously affected by the lowering oxygen levels, the flames would've had a negligible effect on the considerable amount of air in that room, and most importantly: the air was being removed from the room, I repeat, the air was being removed from the room; I felt that needed repeating since it makes that whole critique irrelevant.
Why didnt tilly put the fire out to survive longer
@@NitpickingNerd Because, as I explained in more detail, it wouldn't have made any significant difference due to the large amount of air in that room, so her survival time depends entirely on how quickly the chamber depressurises.
@@MadScientist512 it makes no sense that she didn't even try to put out the fire to prolonged her life. if you were suffocating in a room and it had candles you would have put them out even if it's little different and would only buy you a few more seconds
One thing that annoys me, is that every time the Discovery gets fired upon, streams of hot molten metal sparks burst out onto the bridge.
What the hell is causing this?
How come it rained at the end when the tower was not permitted to complete its operation? The door was opened before the vacuum, etc. were completed to seed the clouds.
also what would have happened if no one won that race . then they just wouldn't activate the tower and remain rainless ? nothing makes sense in this show
I skipped so much of the episode, I even missed the gender stuff. So once again I didn't miss much.
They have a third PHYSICAL gender, not just gender disphoria. This would be like someone born "intersex" here on Earth. When the doctor did a medical scan on Rava, he saw that.
No. They didnt say they have 3 genders . they said they have 3 gender identities
@@NitpickingNerd I know, I'm just trying to come up with something plausible.
I suppose Culbert referred to her as they as he only arrived later and didn't know the gender of her? I know people who always refer to others as they to be polite, if they don't know whether to call others he or she yet.
The use of ‘they’ makes more sense if you have already referenced Adira directly, or at least point to them while you are saying it.
In any case, I find it rude to reference someone in the third person while they are STILL STANDING THERE.
The only purpose of this episode was they/them
I find it amazing that they're actually trying to keep from offending anyone religious. Usually these type of people don't care, or will do so deliberately (and usually explicitly [and typically only one religion]). So this is more in line with real Star Trek, and a breath of fresh air.
where were the skeletons from past sacrifices in the chamber???
I guess they clean them up later
In ancient religions it was quite common to eat sacrificial meet.
I don’t watch this sh1t but I can only hope the fire nonsense was there in the show just FOR people like nitpicking nerd. The creators of STD probably watch these videos and have a right chuckle. It has to be that. The alternative is not worth thinking about.
Wibble!!!!! XD
The prime directive is so 90's😅😂
As an OLD Queer man... I do not get this they them krappyshite...
We in the queer world have had a word that has been around LONG than me, much longer.
She, He, Her, Him ... and "SHIM"
We have a very long history of TV, TS, non-binary, etc... as Shim. My mum's brother referred to his gay friends (from WW1 era) as Shim.
I do not know when it started but it seems to have been Forgetten.
That would be a lot less confusing
It ("they" as a singular pronoun) started 650 years ago. You should get an education in the language arts, so that you can then understand the English language and not sound so ignorant and stupid.
If you're confused, it's because you're ignorant. Get an education, then you won't be confused.
It is like the writers are only watching cop shows. Other languages on Earth have personal pronouns for the non gendered. It is as if the writers just didn't look up that on a internet search.
On an away mission why would aTilly have her hair slapping her cheeks the whole time. That is annoying as heck.
You sa her
The Episode was boring as hell
My pronouns are haha, heehee, hoho
Why are you people still watching this dumpster fire?
0:28
This is a great question. Why name the episode after one particular facet of this culture? And why a facet that (I don’t think) is referenced again before the end?
Are the other people here, this channel’s creator and those who watch and comment, content to leave that question as rhetorical or are there any ideas as to what the reason might be?
If my experience reading these perspectives and trying to understand them is any indication, you all likely find these details exhausting and don’t want to apply more energy to it - and I get it. Reading all these dismissive remarks, and considering the viewpoints, it’s very taxing - but I’m simply not content to leave it at that, nor can I treat any of you with the same level of contempt that I read in the remarks.
I’m describing my perspective. Please believe it is not my intent to attack any of you. I am as bewildered as you are. Trust me.
On face, I’m excited the episode has that name and that there’s a culture that has such a language, because it’s such a rare thing on Earth. I loved seeing it brought up in Star Trek. But what about Whistlespeak’s (and its use to grant long distance communication) are of relevance to this particular episode?
Let’s share some genuine ideas 💙💙💙
As I suggest with my parenthetical, above, I suspect it’s something to do with the unique properties at overcoming a problem: long distance communication.
Perhaps the episode retains that title specifically to help keep the concept in our heads once the episode is over, because the language will be particularly relevant in a later episode?
Worst episode of the worst series of the worst star trek programme ever made.
How about using zey/zem in place of they/them when referring to one person? 😊
Then it would sound german i guess
@@NitpickingNerd 😁😁😁 yeah, you got me. But there is no really good equivalent in german for most gender terms. Gender in german is Geschlecht(Go bad). And Sex in german is Geschlechtsverkehr(Go bad traffic🤣🤣🤣) wich means fucking and not, if you have a penis or not. Penis and Vagina btw. are called Geschlechtsteile(go bad parts).😊😊😊
I like the Finnish “han”. They don’t have gender specific pronouns, just the one.
Why, now, go back on 650 years of the tradition of using "they" as singular pronoun in the English language?
In the future, people should be more evolved. Using "they / them" is a good general term when not knowing which pronoun the person prefers. I have transitioned to using "they/them" instead of "he" or "she" when I don't know what their preference is.
But wouldnt it be insulting to say this to someone who is a woman or a man as if telling them they look wierd so you cant determine their sex
@@NitpickingNerd No. When you talk to someone you don't usually use pronouns when talking directly to someone. We don't say "Hello she, how are you today?"
It's when talking to someone else. Instead of saying "She looks okay to me. Her breathing appears fine," you can say, "They look okay to me. Their breathing appears fine." Once you start using they/them more regularly, it becomes more natural in speech.
It's confusing because they is also used to refer to 2 or more people
It should be natural by now: we've been using it that way for 650 years.
What is confusing about a pronoun being both singular and plural in usage? We've been doing it for 650 years and it's only now that 'tards are confused by it.
i use it/freaks not they/them