Thank you for this. On a FB computer build group, a guy was insisting that I run an external DAC in order to avoid noise. I wasn't very convinced my expensive motherboard would have introduced noise to the audio. I have an Aiyima T9 pro, so I decided to do a comparison. I did not find any noise. Thanks to your video here I did an other test to try and notice a difference in sound performance. Yes the DAC in my Aiyima sounded better than my motherboard's DAC. This is a bummer since the mother board has a series of outputs intended to support 7.1. Once again my 2-channel stereo wants aren't playing nice with my surround sound wants. Now I am torn between getting a needed preamp for the 3.5mm variable AUX output of the Aiyima so I can fee the other preamp side of my other Chinese amps. I have been getting multiple amps to support AUX 3.5 to amp then to passive speakers. This is great fun to do speaker comparisons and weens me off the poor powered speaker products made for computers. I can optionally get a lead DAC for the conversion directly from the PC's optical. Depending on the product chosen, this may also require a downstream pre-amp. It never ceases to amaze me how often the audio product market never seems to offer features you want, with good quality and reasonable price. Why can't they all sound like my Sansui 2000. The disease of FOMO is real. I don't recommend exploring unless you are ok with wanting things :)
features and connections was exactly why i choose the dac that i choose... and because it mets my standards but having a remote with switchable channels, headphone and speakers seperated channels, mute, volume control with remote... really looking forward to it
Went from UMC22 Behringer DAC line out to my Magni to power my Edition XS and DT 770 pro 80ohm to a Modi -> Magni and besides the very obvious power jump (1v vs 2v) I did pick up some small differences. What I can say is every sound that comes out now (regardless of headphones) sounds more "interesting". As if every noise whether it is faint or in your face has more overall punch and definition to it. Movies illustrate this well. I went back and forth A-B testing to the UMC22 headphone output on its own (at reasonable volumes so it was not distorting) and I would describe the more complex sounds as "crushed" when listening to the UMC22 alone. Things also have more separation in the sound stage between the 2 and noises transition from side to side a little more decisively when using the Stack. If you want to get the best out of your headphones I would say it's necessary. Also objectively the white noise floor is much lower and I think anyone can appreciate that when listening at higher volumes.
Just received my SA-1 today, I paired it to my SMSL SU-8s....and got blown away. My Focal Elegia, 6xx and even iems like Blessing 2Dusk, 7z Timeless all played on high gain and balanced cables just revealed themselves. I don't think I would have such a high degree of improvement with an upgrade to the Schist Bifrost and my SMSL SH-8s. Can't wait to introduce the SA-1 to a "worthy" dac.
Be interesting to see you compare the sigma delta dacs with a mulitbit like the Mimby. I have one and would say this one changes the conversation between comparing dacs. Great video and keep them coming
Well, I can't say I'm quite clear on exactly what isn't sigma/delta yet. I was under the impressions that both the Mojo and my Deckard use their own discrete designs, but I didn't notice much difference from them to the other typical AK / ESS stuff.
Appreciate your upload and testing of your repertoire of DACs. I own the red Behringer and would like to know if you think it has a phase heavy echo sound compared to the $100 DACS. Thanks much!!!
I got the He400se with the Fiio k5 ess both for 150 bucks. Now i am aiming for the hifiman edition x, for the next upgrade. But gonna wait for a year first and learn more on hifi set ups. Still havent even got my amp yet and already planning for upgrade. Plug the he400se directly to the PC, was barely audible. DAC amps is a MUST.
@WilczukPL its really good, I don't see why I need to buy anything else. Really detailed and clear, way better than the standard Bluetooth headphones I was using before. Most average people won't hear any difference unless you do a major upgrade, so I am sticking with this set up for now. Gonna get a RX 8700xt instead for my PC. The K5 ess also really made music so beautiful on both headphones and active speakers. Its really at another level.
I have one of those Cheap $30 ones and i am using the SPDIF from my MOBO to it and to a pair of Rokit5. And I am hearing pops when i use some of my other usb devices. Do you think a better dac would possibly fix it ? (I know it's hard to know)
I think I can hear a very minor difference between my old Sony PHA-1 and my Apple USB-C adapter, but it might just be a difference in output impedance and channel balance. The Sony sounds slightly smoother and more "laid back." Apple sounds slightly clearer or sharper.
Thanks for sharing and appreciate your straightforward no hype styles! I’d like to start the journey , after reading your hardware reviews, I got a probably ignorant question, I only use iPhone AAC files （as I bought hundreds of songs from iTune） does it make sense to get a dad amp combo , even your favorite Cayin RU6 , would that make a significant upgrade on the sound /Soundstage for lossy files?
I have the Sony NW A55 Walkman, and a pair of 1More Quad Driver IEH, the sound is weak; I don't have a headphone amp yet, guess I need one? Suggestions? I am new to all this, your video is extremely insightful, answered many ?'s I have seen a few of these on amazon, thinking "wtf are these? do I need one? " "How much should I spend?" I have folders full of flac's, and i can convert cd's to flac, I am exploring the whole HI-RES AUDIO / SOUND thing, and any point in ripping CDs to 24/96? or stay 16/144? and so called Hi-Res content can only be purchased correct? too many questions? heh...lol (this is for nice audio on my bike rides) I use Soundcore Liberty Pro 2 and 3 (Ldac) Bluetooth True Wireless ear phones and want to step it up. edit later that day: ok settled on this one.. FiiO BTR5-2021 Receiver Bluetooth5.0 Headphone Amp Hi-Res 384K/32Bit Native DSD256 USB DAC Supports LDAC/aptX HD CVC 8.0 for Phone/PC/Car/Home Audio(Comes with Type-C to Lightning Cable)
Okay, I'll try to answer most of your questions. I'm surprised that the A55 wouldn't be able to push those IEMs. It doesn't put out a ton of power, but typically IEMs don't require much. If you are going to get an amp--do you want it to be portable, or is it just going to live at your desk? Then, I can make some recommendations. Also a budget would be good. A good place to start usually is a Modi/Magni stack (I think the IEMagni is a great starting point). If you need portable, that's a bit of another discussion. I personally don't worry too much about high res, but others have quite different views on that. I stream for convenience, and I use UA-cam music which isn't super high res, but I pay for UA-cam Premium, so it just makes sense. My understanding is cd quality is set at 16 bit, so ripping it at a higher bit rate isn't going to really gain you anything--you can't add information that isn't in the source. Most streaming services are currently offering pretty high res stuff at very affordable prices, Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon, Tidal, Qobuzz--all stream in very high res. If you want to do an experiment, check this test out with your current gear and see if you can pick out the difference (I don't do well on this test): www.npr.org/sections/therecord/2015/06/02/411473508/how-well-can-you-hear-audio-quality
Noticeable yes, big is subjective. I think it’s worth it. You can by a used A3 for $150 if you keep an eye out. Magni from Schiit will be $120 after shipping.
@@towsifshahriarshovo I liked the ifi Hip DAC, but I’d also say if you can stretch your budget to $150, then you can look for a used stack: Schiit, JDS, Liquid Spark.
I only hear differences in DACs when I compare (any sample) against that $10 Prozor. Same form factor you had in the video. For others, specially after level matching, I still can't hear a difference. Will keep trying.
Do DACS matter? do amps,speakers,network switches, routers,cables,power supplies matter? the answer is all of the above if you are interested in sound quality!
DACs DO Matter! R2R DACs are amazing, IMO! In my experience, you have to step up to the $450 to $500 to start to hear bigger differences. And R2R compared to Delta-Sigma chips is pretty noticeable. Bifrost 2 is amazing! Keep trying! I have a Gungnir MB DAC and will NEVER give it up, only upgrade it!
The Bifrost 2 has been on my list for a long time--that's just a big trigger to pull! I actually was able to just get a really good deal on an SU-9, and am testing it now. I'll have a video on it at some point.
@@MrAyritidc, it's stupid to buy an expensive DAC without the knowledge of the DAC itself that still a mystery and no YT succeed in explaining it so far.
DAC chip, the chip implementation, DAC voltage output make a difference. And you can hear it. Headphones - amp - DAC in that order make the most difference in sound. I find the people that make these comments have the lease time with a variety of equipment, and that's ok. But calling something snake oil without personal experience is a bit silly. My Geshelli Enog was a noticeable step up in overall sound quality vs the modi. Letter I got a Geshelli amp which didn't sound good until I updated from the Enog to the JNOG. It was more resolving and had more voltage output. My K11 R2R sounds darker and more tube-ish vs my other DAC. So much so I hate the K11 R2R on my tube amps. But love the Geshelli JNOG on all of my amps. The K11 R2R is fantastic paired with my Rupert Neve headphone amp. The resistor ladder design of the R2R translates to a noticable darker musical , less analytical sound across all my amps. When paired with headphones like the Grado, or Meze 109 is a round off some treble spikes and maintains the character of the headphone. Some amps do the same thing. It's the reason synergies exists. If every headphone amp a DAC sounded the same there would be very little reason for most of them to exist. Again headphones and amps are going to be your largest change, but DAC can be what puts a system over the top and on certain edge cases like really bright or really dark tuned headphones make the difference as to if you like the headphone or not
You can't hear the difference because you are using a source i.e a desktop or smart device which has a inbuilt shitty dac which is nearly impossible to bypass. Use a stand alone device from cowon or sony or cayin nokia 5800 xm and will surely spot the difference between noise and sound.
Chord has got everyone believing that box is filled with unicorn farts.
Chord is the peak of snake oil salesmanship
Thank you for this. On a FB computer build group, a guy was insisting that I run an external DAC in order to avoid noise. I wasn't very convinced my expensive motherboard would have introduced noise to the audio. I have an Aiyima T9 pro, so I decided to do a comparison. I did not find any noise.
Thanks to your video here I did an other test to try and notice a difference in sound performance. Yes the DAC in my Aiyima sounded better than my motherboard's DAC. This is a bummer since the mother board has a series of outputs intended to support 7.1. Once again my 2-channel stereo wants aren't playing nice with my surround sound wants.
Now I am torn between getting a needed preamp for the 3.5mm variable AUX output of the Aiyima so I can fee the other preamp side of my other Chinese amps. I have been getting multiple amps to support AUX 3.5 to amp then to passive speakers. This is great fun to do speaker comparisons and weens me off the poor powered speaker products made for computers.
I can optionally get a lead DAC for the conversion directly from the PC's optical. Depending on the product chosen, this may also require a downstream pre-amp.
It never ceases to amaze me how often the audio product market never seems to offer features you want, with good quality and reasonable price. Why can't they all sound like my Sansui 2000.
The disease of FOMO is real. I don't recommend exploring unless you are ok with wanting things :)
man the most honest content ive been looking for weeks
features and connections was exactly why i choose the dac that i choose... and because it mets my standards but having a remote with switchable channels, headphone and speakers seperated channels, mute, volume control with remote...
really looking forward to it
Went from UMC22 Behringer DAC line out to my Magni to power my Edition XS and DT 770 pro 80ohm to a Modi -> Magni and besides the very obvious power jump (1v vs 2v) I did pick up some small differences. What I can say is every sound that comes out now (regardless of headphones) sounds more "interesting". As if every noise whether it is faint or in your face has more overall punch and definition to it. Movies illustrate this well. I went back and forth A-B testing to the UMC22 headphone output on its own (at reasonable volumes so it was not distorting) and I would describe the more complex sounds as "crushed" when listening to the UMC22 alone. Things also have more separation in the sound stage between the 2 and noises transition from side to side a little more decisively when using the Stack. If you want to get the best out of your headphones I would say it's necessary. Also objectively the white noise floor is much lower and I think anyone can appreciate that when listening at higher volumes.
Always appreciate an honest review!
Some say it’s the DAC chip, some whether delta signs or r2r. I suspect it’s mostly how well it is designed.
Just received my SA-1 today, I paired it to my SMSL SU-8s....and got blown away. My Focal Elegia, 6xx and even iems like Blessing 2Dusk, 7z Timeless all played on high gain and balanced cables just revealed themselves. I don't think I would have such a high degree of improvement with an upgrade to the Schist Bifrost and my SMSL SH-8s. Can't wait to introduce the SA-1 to a "worthy" dac.
Good advice. I think you have the direction right- Headphone first, then amp, and always with your sources in mind...which might be analog.
Be interesting to see you compare the sigma delta dacs with a mulitbit like the Mimby. I have one and would say this one changes the conversation between comparing dacs. Great video and keep them coming
Well, I can't say I'm quite clear on exactly what isn't sigma/delta yet. I was under the impressions that both the Mojo and my Deckard use their own discrete designs, but I didn't notice much difference from them to the other typical AK / ESS stuff.
Appreciate your upload and testing of your repertoire of DACs. I own the red Behringer and would like to know if you think it has a phase heavy echo sound compared to the $100 DACS. Thanks much!!!
I got the He400se with the Fiio k5 ess both for 150 bucks. Now i am aiming for the hifiman edition x, for the next upgrade. But gonna wait for a year first and learn more on hifi set ups. Still havent even got my amp yet and already planning for upgrade.
Plug the he400se directly to the PC, was barely audible. DAC amps is a MUST.
how’s it been?
@WilczukPL its really good, I don't see why I need to buy anything else. Really detailed and clear, way better than the standard Bluetooth headphones I was using before. Most average people won't hear any difference unless you do a major upgrade, so I am sticking with this set up for now. Gonna get a RX 8700xt instead for my PC. The K5 ess also really made music so beautiful on both headphones and active speakers. Its really at another level.
I have one of those Cheap $30 ones and i am using the SPDIF from my MOBO to it and to a pair of Rokit5. And I am hearing pops when i use some of my other usb devices. Do you think a better dac would possibly fix it ? (I know it's hard to know)
Just found about your channel. Enjoying your content. Subscribed. Keep the good work man. Means a lot
Welcome. I appreciate the kind words.
If you get to try a multibit DAC I will be interested in your impression. I never heard any of those and I'm considering that.
I’m sure I’ll get one at some point.
I think I can hear a very minor difference between my old Sony PHA-1 and my Apple USB-C adapter, but it might just be a difference in output impedance and channel balance. The Sony sounds slightly smoother and more "laid back." Apple sounds slightly clearer or sharper.
How does a Playstation 5 dac compare?
Thanks for sharing and appreciate your straightforward no hype styles! I’d like to start the journey , after reading your hardware reviews, I got a probably ignorant question, I only use iPhone AAC files （as I bought hundreds of songs from iTune） does it make sense to get a dad amp combo , even your favorite Cayin RU6 , would that make a significant upgrade on the sound /Soundstage for lossy files?
I have the Sony NW A55 Walkman, and a pair of 1More Quad Driver IEH, the sound is weak; I don't have a headphone amp yet,
guess I need one? Suggestions?
I am new to all this, your video is extremely insightful, answered many ?'s I have seen a few of these on amazon, thinking "wtf are these? do I need one? " "How much should I spend?" I have folders full of flac's, and i can convert cd's to flac, I am exploring the whole HI-RES AUDIO / SOUND thing, and any point in ripping CDs to 24/96? or stay 16/144? and so called Hi-Res content can only be purchased correct?
too many questions? heh...lol (this is for nice audio on my bike rides)
I use Soundcore Liberty Pro 2 and 3 (Ldac) Bluetooth True Wireless ear phones and want to step it up.
edit later that day: ok settled on this one..
FiiO BTR5-2021 Receiver Bluetooth5.0 Headphone Amp Hi-Res 384K/32Bit Native DSD256 USB DAC Supports LDAC/aptX HD CVC 8.0 for Phone/PC/Car/Home Audio(Comes with Type-C to Lightning Cable)
Okay, I'll try to answer most of your questions. I'm surprised that the A55 wouldn't be able to push those IEMs. It doesn't put out a ton of power, but typically IEMs don't require much. If you are going to get an amp--do you want it to be portable, or is it just going to live at your desk? Then, I can make some recommendations. Also a budget would be good. A good place to start usually is a Modi/Magni stack (I think the IEMagni is a great starting point). If you need portable, that's a bit of another discussion. I personally don't worry too much about high res, but others have quite different views on that. I stream for convenience, and I use UA-cam music which isn't super high res, but I pay for UA-cam Premium, so it just makes sense. My understanding is cd quality is set at 16 bit, so ripping it at a higher bit rate isn't going to really gain you anything--you can't add information that isn't in the source. Most streaming services are currently offering pretty high res stuff at very affordable prices, Spotify, Apple Music, Amazon, Tidal, Qobuzz--all stream in very high res. If you want to do an experiment, check this test out with your current gear and see if you can pick out the difference (I don't do well on this test): www.npr.org/sections/therecord/2015/06/02/411473508/how-well-can-you-hear-audio-quality
Is there a big jump up going from a schiit magni 3+ to Asgard 3?
Noticeable yes, big is subjective. I think it’s worth it. You can by a used A3 for $150 if you keep an eye out. Magni from Schiit will be $120 after shipping.
What is the latest dac you have settled on to feed your CTH? Also is your CTH still your go to preferred amp?
I am fortunate enough to have gotten my hands on a Bifrost 2. Deckard is now my preferred amp.
@@MrAyrit Nice hopefully you can put out a review on it. Does the bifrost 2 live up to the hype and would you say its worth its 600 ish price?
@@ForeverYoung007 there’s definitely a question of value, but if you can swing it, the short answer is “yes”
Recently I upgraded from Topping NX4 to Ifi hip dac and It's quite worthed It I can say..
Good to know. I just picked up a Fiio Q1 Mkii for $35. I thought it would be worth testing out for that price.
Which is more necessary for audio dac or amp?? When you have only 100 bugs. Or dac amp combo like e10k..
Not a big fan of the e10k. I’d say amp for sure. Some of it would depend on what headphones you’re using / want to use in the future.
@@MrAyritplease recommend some budget amp
@@towsifshahriarshovo I liked the ifi Hip DAC, but I’d also say if you can stretch your budget to $150, then you can look for a used stack: Schiit, JDS, Liquid Spark.
Have any plans to review Hifiman Ananda??
It’s definitely on my list, but it’s hard to say if/when it will happen
I only hear differences in DACs when I compare (any sample) against that $10 Prozor. Same form factor you had in the video.
For others, specially after level matching, I still can't hear a difference. Will keep trying.
I have the same problem too, the expensive DAC aren't supposed to be worth that much. I don't even know what to consider in buying a DAC.
Everything depends on the resolution of the rest of your system.
Unless the DAC is the bottleneck, which is definitely possible
Have you done a double blind test?
Nah, my wife doesn’t have the interest to help me out with something like that.
From my experience I put things in such order:
1. The very music record
2. Speakers
3. Room
4. DAC
etc
P.S.
I am in love with my Modi 3😍
Amplifier??
From Fulla 2 Dac only to SMSL su-8s was a night and day difference. I don’t know the su8s vs another $200dac is significant
Do DACS matter? do amps,speakers,network switches, routers,cables,power supplies matter? the answer is all of the above if you are interested in sound quality!
DACs DO Matter! R2R DACs are amazing, IMO! In my experience, you have to step up to the $450 to $500 to start to hear bigger differences. And R2R compared to Delta-Sigma chips is pretty noticeable. Bifrost 2 is amazing! Keep trying! I have a Gungnir MB DAC and will NEVER give it up, only upgrade it!
The Bifrost 2 has been on my list for a long time--that's just a big trigger to pull! I actually was able to just get a really good deal on an SU-9, and am testing it now. I'll have a video on it at some point.
What r2r DAC do you suggest in the $450 to $500 range?
@@simpsonbergman2185 A used Bifrost 2 from somewhere like head-fi.org.
@@MrAyrit What were your results on the SU-9? Ive got a ifi zen dac and SH9 amp - thinking of completing the SMSL stack, worth it??
#DACLifesMatter :DDD
snake oil scam
Care to elaborate?
@@MrAyritidc, it's stupid to buy an expensive DAC without the knowledge of the DAC itself that still a mystery and no YT succeed in explaining it so far.
DAC chip, the chip implementation, DAC voltage output make a difference. And you can hear it.
Headphones - amp - DAC in that order make the most difference in sound.
I find the people that make these comments have the lease time with a variety of equipment, and that's ok.
But calling something snake oil without personal experience is a bit silly.
My Geshelli Enog was a noticeable step up in overall sound quality vs the modi.
Letter I got a Geshelli amp which didn't sound good until I updated from the Enog to the JNOG. It was more resolving and had more voltage output.
My K11 R2R sounds darker and more tube-ish vs my other DAC. So much so I hate the K11 R2R on my tube amps. But love the Geshelli JNOG on all of my amps.
The K11 R2R is fantastic paired with my Rupert Neve headphone amp.
The resistor ladder design of the R2R translates to a noticable darker musical , less analytical sound across all my amps. When paired with headphones like the Grado, or Meze 109 is a round off some treble spikes and maintains the character of the headphone.
Some amps do the same thing.
It's the reason synergies exists. If every headphone amp a DAC sounded the same there would be very little reason for most of them to exist.
Again headphones and amps are going to be your largest change, but DAC can be what puts a system over the top and on certain edge cases like really bright or really dark tuned headphones make the difference as to if you like the headphone or not
You can't hear the difference because you are using a source i.e a desktop or smart device which has a inbuilt shitty dac which is nearly impossible to bypass. Use a stand alone device from cowon or sony or cayin nokia 5800 xm and will surely spot the difference between noise and sound.