Right when you went to start talking about the engine protector, I was fully prepared to be a pedant in the comments section lol. A couple snippets from me are all I have though. 1: The hot oil detector and engine protector both work by causing the governor to sense low oil pressure, which as you said makes it shut down. The hot oil detector is a thermostatic valve, (like a thermostat in a car or truck) which opens at, I believe, 215 degrees Fahrenheit. When it opens it dumps the oil in the governor's sensing line causing the low oil shutdown to pop. The actual valve for that is located in the main lube manifold going into the front of the engine. 2: You mentioned a sort of "limp mode" and actually even those old locomotives have something similar. When you look right above air compressor and towards the front of the locomotive you can see a water manifold. That manifold has three temperature switches in it (a normal SD40-2 would have four). The switches are labeled TA, TB, TC, and ETS. (A tunnel won't have a switch in the TC spot since they only have two fans.) That ETS (engine temperature switch) picks up at, again *I think,* 205 degrees. When that switch closes a bunch of electrical stuff happens and it "derates" in a sense. It basically changes your throttle notches to 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 5, 6. (in 7 & 8 it knocks you down 2 notches) the speed reduction reduces the risk of cavitation in the water pumps, and the excitation system reduces the load on the engine as well. Not anywhere near what modern electronic controls are capable of, but still a neat little "limp mode" even on those old engines. So yeah, that's the pedant in me satisfied lol. Great video and definitely earned a like from me! Also, I'm sure you remember me from last week and I did check and according to the source I looked at, our 5413 retains the number it had when it ran on the D&RGW, and the 5412 used to be the D&RGW 5391.
Well hell! That's awesome detail. The BNSF sent us darned white hats to the mechanical schools, but didn't cover any electrical side. I always wished I learned more. I just thought those temp switches were just for controlling the rad fans - I'll admit, when I saw all of them back there on 5401, I was confused seeing as it has fewer fans. That makes a ton of sense! Thanks for teaching me something today. :)
@Hyce777 No problem at all! I'm a locomotive tech by trade and the railroad I work for has a roster that's over half SD40-2's. And even the stuff that isn't is mostly of similar vintage (GP35, GP40, SD40) I also have a literal electrical manual for the SD40-2 that I was given as part of my apprenticeship. Edit: I've also had days where I was bored at work and would get out prints and spend time going through them to find out what makes things happen. (Yes I have heard I'm strange) I have a couple of sequences wrote out on my phone for reference.
@@CDROM-lq9iz There’s nothing strange about knowing your job, especially when you get sent on a road trip to get the mainline cleared and traffic moving again. I’ve had to go out on the road and change a CLS (coolant level sensor) on a C-44 AC without losing too much coolant, and it was still running when we got there, stopped on the main line, nowhere near a water source to refill the cooling system. The bad sensor wasn’t allowing the unit to load, and the remaining consist didn’t have the power to continue on the uphill grade without it. I put on a rain suit, some leather gloves, some thick neoprene oil changing gloves over those, a face shield, and taped all of the seems on that stuff closed with duct tape. I was able to get the sensor changed and only lost about 4-5 inches of water in the sight glass. Got er loading and on her way in about 30 minutes time, main line clear and open to more traffic. Have a good day sir!
@ralfie8801 Thanks and I'm sure you had a hell of a time getting out of that getup lol. I don't think I've done anything quite that sketchy but I have had to manually put motor cutouts in on an SD40 that was blocking a yard track and an inbound was waiting on the main for them to clear up. I've also fixed a couple loading issues with a hammer to the side of a contactor. I'm sure stuff like that would make plenty of people freak out lol.
@@CDROM-lq9iz Yeah, I put all that on because I didn’t feel like getting scalded with 210 degree water. It was a mess, but it all worked out in the end. Had to travel 25 miles to get to it.
Hey Hyce....5401 was a good unit, Mars light and all. Operated her back in the late 70's out of Denver. She is an old lady now, and shows it. When she was new she was proud to be a leader amongst the GP30's, GP40's, and SD-9's, SD-40's, and SD45's in the stable. These were, as you know, used primarily on the coal trains to Phippsburg, and beyond...to Craig. They had a very eloquent style. Will always be my favorite locomotive type...(they could really haul...at the lower speeds), and the dynamics were easy to control. Mitch Pittenger (Road Foreman) was a buddy (god rest his soul), and we had some great times railroading together. Thank you for the look back into the past !!!
645 c.i. per cylinder comes out to 169.1 L!!!! I understand that that's not super surprising to most train nerds, but to me, somebody who is just learning about how diesels work, that is utterly astounding! Great work, Hyce! Love the content.
I really really want to see more "Nerding out" with Hyce on an EMD locomotive. It may not be Steam, but the BNSF story juices can start to flow and experiences as the camera films Hyce show and talk EMD locomotives with this SD40-2T.
9:29 if you look most modern locomotive adopted the tunnel motor style cooling and intake system . Take a deep dive also on the sd45x elephant ears was another attempt to do the same thing
The Colorado railroad museum is on the list to visit some day. I've always thought the tunnel motors were a great series and such a simple way to approach the problem.
I loved our SP tunnels. We had 45t-2s and regular 40t-2s. Crews would often brag about how good "9500" and "9400" were at pulling. Sadly the tunnels are all but gone, with the last one "4071" breifly going into the deadline before being returned for a short time as a new customer needed a dedicated engine. She found her way into a few more road trains as she came in on her 92 day and the customer realized a big 6 axle was too much power for them only to finally end up leased to a grain elevator after one of their workhorses went down. Its unclear if 4071 will ever return to our roster or will remain at the elevator the rest of her days.
Id just like to say Mark, im happy to see how much you’ve grown your channel over these 2 years. Ive been here since u started the original RO play throughs. Cheers to you, keep on rollin man.
Hyce: Do you want to see me go into nerdy details of locomotives in video form? Everyone here: But that's why we're here, so obviously yes! Also everyone: With the Hyce special touch of teaching train tech, who would want to miss out!
Former EMD mechanic here, once we got a call from a customer saying the engine shut down and wouldn't start back up. And they said it wouldn't stop beeping for hours and just couldnt figure it out. We went out there to a geep and turns out the only problem was the governor button was out. Pushed it back in and problem solved 😂 topped off the water and the oil to make sure and checked its vitals. Everything was all good!
My dad was one of the lead design and manufacturing engineers for Motive Power out of Boise, Idaho up until just before they went bankrupt from poor account management. I can’t wait to show him your channel. He will tell anyone who will listen that “working on choo-choos” was the best job of his 45-year career.
Yeah, this is an excellent opportunity to do a full, in-detail workover of the locomotive. As a side note, I really enjoyed that you admitted you were incorrect and offered corrections. Shows your humility. Nicely done Hyce.
Very cool video! The SD40T-2 has to be my favorite EMD locomotive of all time. My grandfather worked for the SP and worked with these all the time, despite there being no tunnels on the SP route through Arizona, although they did work Donner Pass and throughout the Sierra Nevadas. Said they were fantastic at what they did. After the merger, he also got to work on former Grande ones and on the former DRGW lines, including Moffat Tunnel!
I guess this design also helps in hot climate of Arizona? The cooler the air you blow through the radiators, the more efficient they are. Blowing hot desert air through isn't great, but it's better than hot desert air that's been pre-heated by everything that it passed before it got to the radiators. I'm not sure what the difference in manufacturing price, running costs and maintenance costs are, but as these changes were not made standard for the model I suppose there has to be a drawback somewhere.
You know, I was just asking myself last week if you had covered the museum's tunnel motor. Lo and behold I get this in my recommended! Beautiful explanation of the functionalities! Our railroad has 3 tunnels, two of them still retaining the original Rio Grande livery! 5391 (now 5412) and 5413! As a side note, sanding these things are a pain, especially if there are two of them back-to-back :L I just love trying to reach for the sand hoses that have been set up for regular 6-axles and the occasional 4-axles when these long bois come in. Stretch Armstrong mode activated. And don't get me started on those long hood suicide steps .-.
Was about to comment about how the SP developed the tunnel motors, but it looks like you beat me to it. 😁 That said, Moffat tunnel is no longer the second longest in the US, it's the third. Flathead Tunnel in Montana, built in the late 60's, is second longest at 7 miles. It was built to reroute the GN Hi-Line when Libby Dam flooded the original route.
@@realcanadian67 they wouldn't need a long bridge. They'd need a very steep grade to get above the dam from Libby, and then a lot of track along the shore of the new lake (which flooded an entire valley, lengthwise). A new route to the south and the 7 mile tunnel was apparently easier and less steep.
the dam and the realignment were done by the US Army Corps of Engineers, fun fact. those guys are no joke, they can build anything, and to pretty good standards
We have a pair of these in my home terminal in Fond Du Lac Wisconsin for CN. We use them as shover power, and I always wondered why they have a huge open space in the back. Thanks for finally answering that for me!
The Ringneck and Western railroad out here in South Dakota has a tunnel motor running on their line. It looks a little silly being there no tunnels, but it's a cool piece of railroading history.
you are literally one of my fave people to watch talk about things, not for the topic (although interesting), but for the way you structure the video, the method, the context, the sass and the wit. you truly are an intellectual pleasure x
I love watching your videos and as a helper in a maintenance shop the standard SD40-2 is 68ft 10in, where the SD40T-2 is 70ft 8in the Locomotive is slightly longer to accommodate for the rear tunnel radiator
I remember seeing these as a young kid (in SP livery) and noticing they looked different. It wasn't until a couple of years ago I learned what they were. This video does a great job of showing the equipment that makes it a tunnel motor.
A tunnel story. My dad fired for the B&O out of Baltimore, West End. The route west, the Old Main Line, winds it's way up a river valley, cresting the grade at a place called Mount Airy, Md. The line summits through a mile-long tunnel under the town. Not that steep, but for a train, gradient is relative. The trick to firing through a tunnel is to have the boiler full, and the fire-box as hot as possible with plenty of coal. Before entering the tunnel the feed-water is shut-off, and no more coal added to the fire. With luck the train will be over the hump before water and coal must be added. Often the water in the sight-glass would drop out of sight. The story The engine wasn't steaming well. Not only did it require almost constant feed-water, it was burning more coal than it should, and was filling the tunnel with exhaust. Then they stalled. My dad looked over at the engineer. The engineer was on the verge of passing-out. My dad suggested to the brakeman to get down and pull the pin, they had to get out of there. He went over to the engineer, shaking him and yelling, "Give the brakeman some slack, we're cutting-off and getting out of here." Tunnels and fuel-burning engines are fundamentally incompatible. If tunnels had desires, it would be to kill humans. I am sure that Hyce has a copy of "Rails that Climb." The Moffat trains faced snow-shed hells.
That's a really dangerous situation to be in ! ( sounds like in the llate 1930s or 1940s ) If you were headed Uphill, water would normally flow to back/cab end of boiler, causing sight glass to read high compared to a level loco... if water is below the sight glass and you are on an UP grade, then the front of boiler is running dry, and the water right over firebox top plate is thin too, which can lead to boiler explosion if you have much of a fire going. But, at that moment, their immediate problem was a stalled engine and being 3 minutes from suffocating in a tunnel !! About their only option was to set the air brakes on train, disconnect, and use what little steam was left in boiler to get the locomotive + crew moving toward fresh air. This would have left a mess for the rail line... (hopefully no other train scheduled on that track soon) Rail boss would have needed to send another loco+crew to attach to the train from bottom end, release the brakes and take cars back downhill to siding or rail yard... possibly split into smaller load, then send again in pieces. Sounds like it may have blocked rail traffic most of the day, but I'm glad nobody died.
Fun fact: Air brakes in semi trucks were inspired by the same braking system in locomotives because of how successful it was, and was adopted. After 1974 or 1975, the spring brake chamber is the required type of air brakes to be used in semi trucks because of the safety issue that arose when trucks that lost air pressure meant that there were no brakes and no brakes means it's gonna be a VERY bade time. The spring brakes are the safety mechanism in place to prevent that from happening, BUT you'd need air pressure to essentially "unlock" the brakes to allow the truck to move as well as air pressure to stop the truck.
I love these videos, this is stuff I would have never been interested in since I'm more of a continental european electric loco guy but your presentatnion manages to make this stuff incredibly interesting.
I preferred the SW1500s and MP15s for switching. The brakes are not that great on the Geeps and SD40s, especially if they have the independents turned down for remotes.
GE units for the most part have better traction motors and stronger tractive effort. EMD units however normally load quicker,both DC & AC,which gives them road switching advantage. One of the only GE units suitable for switching are the ES44AC's,the throttle response is impressive. I completely agree about the SW1500's,minus the flexicoil trucks,and MP15DC's/AC's which were awesome switchers. The GP40-2's & SD40-2's were the last great units built by EMD without any major flaws. It's debatable nowadays on what's been reliable. I will personally note down that the modern GE units have incredible dynamic braking when it comes down to serious tonnage.
I lived in Tolland, CO for 13 years, which is right next to the Moffat Tunnel. I instantly recognized some of your video footage. I've seen so many trains going through there it's unreal, and I've probably seen that locomotive going through the valley too (lol). The locomotives going through put out so much diesel exhaust that they usually stop when they find out from other trains in passing that there are stowaways on the train cars. They'd stop the trains and call the local sheriff's office (me) to come out and remove them. Not so fun when it's -40 F outside. The Moffat Tunnel has a giant locomotive engine along side the tunnel entrance, which forces air in the opposite direction the train is traveling. This keeps the area around the locomotive from being consumed by the train's exhaust, and keeps the engineer and conductor from getting suffocated by the exhaust. When the tunnel fan engine fires up, it is so loud the sound fills up the entire valley to the east with the siren-like sound of the fan and engine.
I just rode the Amtrak California Zephyr through the Moffatt tunnel last week on my way home to California. 10 minutes for the 6 miles and no moving between cars through the tunnel. I didn't notice any particular diesel fumes either. The section between Denver and Glenwood Springs or Grand Junction is a great trip for the exceptional scenery.
You know, seeing you next to the loco Hyce, reminds me of how huge the US equipment is! Our stuff only go as high as the nose of your locos. That's one reason I want to visit the US, just to enjoy the size of the trains!
"You do not want crank-case overpressure... That's how you send pistons to space." Watch out, Hyce! Jebediah Kerman will be looking into piston-launched rocket technology next!
I was actually learning about Grande 2nd gens like this just before this came out! Keep up the great work helping common civilians learn about this great industry!
Would love to see 360 on 5401 I have always loved the tunnel motors and would enjoy seeing more. Thank you hyce for what you do and being an amazing person that shares their passion with the world around them
If you can find the book,,very rare, titled the "Mack Railroad" the Gilsonite Route. It describes special built Baldwin locies articulated in the middle to make the sharp curves up Baxter Pass in Mack Colorado to Bonanza Utah to haul Gilsonite back to Colorado. When it shut down both Locies disappeared. One was found some 20 years alter in Honduras. From what I understand it is still there, on a side track covered with Jungle groth. Only two of the exotic engines were made.
Mark, YES please continue the tour with a 360 video on the CRRM’s newest acquisition 5401! I know very little about diesel choo choos so this latest video furthered my understanding of them. Love that the original paint scheme survives. What a gigantic locomotive for sure. The huge cold air intake was ultra OMG, almost like a screened in porch. I was thinking a few lounge chairs and could provide a nice shady area during the hot summer months 😂. Opening up the compartments and pointing out important components and what they do was not only fun to see but such great learning moments as you discussed the details. And as you say, Mark, it’s so all about the details! Congratulations to the fab CRRM on their latest rolling stock collection acquisition. And most importantly many thanks Professor for yet another excellent learning video and as always cheers to you!
This locomotive went by my house all the time as a kid on 62nd and carr street. My grandfather was a switchman for rio grande for decades and i used to go down to the yard to hang out back in the 80s and 90s and watch him kick cars over the hump. He retired after union Pacific came in. I actually picketed with him back in the early 90s. I miss seeing these rio grande locos going by. Every now and then youll see and old dilapidated switcher go by in arvada. I can tell without even going outside, by the wheezing chugging sound of those old emd diesels.
Was noticing 5401 in the background during the cow catcher video. Saw a DRGW diesel behind you and thought 3011 until I saw the standard EMD cab then the road # and was like oh new acquisition,neat. Second the idea of a 5401 3011 double loco 360.
It’s nice to actually see the details of how the changes were made to the tunnel motors beyond that the air intakes were enlarged and placed in a low position.
Was just thinking about tunnel engines used by SP, and bam! up pops your video! Thanks for taking the time to show us exactly how the “T” engine concept worked. Great video!
Southern Pacific bought a lot of them because of several steep grades the railroad had to deal with: Donner Pass, Tehachapi Pass and Beaumont Hill specifically. The cooler running of these "tunnel motors" was how SP ran some pretty heavy trains over these passes.
"It's only been out of service for close to fifteen years, its fine! It looks pretty solid, it looks better than [ *really mumbles* ] some of the power I've seen coming on the railroad. [ */really mumbles* ] Can't be that hard, right?" Best line of the whole vid!
The first SP engine I built fir my HO trains was a tunnle motor. It was a blank shell and a chasis. I the motor and lights in it ( no DCC at the time). It was also the first time I painted a shell. I painted in the bloody nose scheme. The speed Southern Pacific decals came out perfect. Of all the models I've had, that is the one I was most proud of.
I’ve always heard that the point of the tunnel motors wasn’t really to keep cool inside the tunnel, because pretty much all air in the tunnel gets hot after a little bit. But rather it was to cool down faster when it was outside the tunnel, so that it’s ready for the next tunnel.
Moffat Tunnel is why we said D&RGW is the mainline THROUGH the Rockies-not around! Also hope you had time to talk to volunteers in the roundhouse, they're great people. Museum's a handful of minutes from my hometown, and I've been there many times.
I love this video because I've always understood how a tunnel motor operates, but I've never known how it's all put together to actually do the cooling. And yes, please do a Loco 360 on it!
The tunnel motor is a classic. SP, D&RGW and Cotton Belt ordered this model. There's another one known as SD45T-2 only ordered by Southern Pacific and Cotton Belt. #5401 is one of two preserved SD40T-2s, the other one being #5371 at Utah State Railway Museum. Im glad they saved some SD40T-2s and an SD45T-2 for preservation.
Love the Video Hyce, Tunnel motors are my 2nd most favorite modern unit. We had a bunch here in Southern Oregon after the DRGW/SP merger. I lived next to the old SP Siskiyou line in Roseburg, Oregon. Loved seeing them running all the time and then when CORP took over and went Red/Grey livery and got 3 of them. I now model this line in HO from 04-06ish
What's up, I work on the moffat sub today. I can tell you with 100% certainty that we all wish our distributed power were tunnel motors. They choke themselves out in the tunnel district all the time with the high air intake
Here in Vermont, we have one of Southern Pacific's SD40T-2s still running. NECR 3317, built as SP 8256 in April of 1980 is still used almost daily across the NECR system. sadly NECR Repainted it to the standard boring orange and black G&W scheme, but it sure is fun seeing such a unique engine here in the far northeast. I am hoping for it to stay for a long time, however it sounds like NECR will be receving GE -9 power sometime this winter and either selling or scrapping a lot of the classic EMD fleet including former a DMIR SD9 (NECR 1750)
You know darn well that we'll watch a Locomotive 360 of literally everything, even those railmotors, a hand-cart, heck, a tool dolly you left across the tracks in the shop. (Save that film for 1st April.)
I live out east but the tunnel motors are special to me anyway. The Ohio Central System operated a trio that used to make frequent appearances on their coal trains before those were discontinued in 2020, though since G&W took over only 4027 is still on the Ohio Central roster that I'm aware of, 4025 and 4026 have unfortunately since been repainted and relocated to other G&W lines. RJ Corman also operates a number of SD40T-2s on their various lines.
I am impressed that the U.S. is developing new trains. On the other hand, Croatia still uses EMD GT22HW-2 (which is similar to the SD40) and G26 from 1973.
@bluescrew3124 in bigger cities like Zagreb, Osijek, Slavonski Brod, Sisak, Rijeka, but it's hard to see them. Most of times trains are broken down or not in use. Trains here are not really used. It's cheaper and a lot faster to use truck to deliver something. If you want to use train to travel 300km you need around 8h
You can see in those GE engines going by as you're talking about more modern locomotives, an aspect of the tunnel motor lives on today: the air intakes are down low now. They don't have the bulkheads, but they did lower the air intakes from the high position that the early EMD engines had.
If you want to see 2 SD40T-2 and a couple of gp38s still running in their Grande paint, might be worth a trip out east to chase the Wheeling and Lake Erie. They still run a lot of sd40s and even high hood gp40s (with ALCO trucks of course).
Wow Hyce ! Thank you so much for this clip. Im building a 1/11 scale version of this locomotive and your video helps me A LOT ! Thank you so much for a close look into the rear of a Tunnel Motor. Btw a 360 video would be super nice ! Cheeers from Germany
Growing up in Colorado Springs in the 1980s and early 90s I remember seeing these tunnel engines moving through town - including once on the Rock Island branch extending east of town.
Very informative and well explained. I really like your enthusiasm and gestures as you teach your viewers the fine points of the great subjects! All in all, your interest makes us interested😊. Good work, my friend and many thanks❤
If i remember, a D&RGW tunnel motor like this one was loaned to BC Rail up here in Canada for a bit in the very early 2000’s, still unpatched and in D&RGW colors but owned by UP
Fun fact: Prior to initial tunnel motor development, SP had initially tried to combat the tunnel overheating / de-rating problem by experimenting with a "tunnel curtain". This is circa 1969. Essentially, a large curtain of heavy canvas cloth, draped and "sealed" off the tunnel's opening, which was rigged to a mechanism that would vertically roll up the curtain when approaching trains would trigger trackside relays. The scheme worked so-so, but SP scrapped the idea when a failure in the system saw an SD push its way through the curtain, as well as the cost of retrofitting tunnels. The tests were performed on the west portal of Tunnel #7 on the Cascade Sub. It was after this series of experiments that SP finally laid down the gauntlet to EMD engineers and said, essentially, "you need to build us a modified SD40 that can adapt and live in our long tunnels." Curiously, today, the UP has a lot of the similar problems on that sub with de-rating or shut downs. Everything old is new again.
They also considered electrification of the entire Roseville Subdivision because of how frequently the early SD40s and SD45s would stall at the Big Hole. Now that would've been interesting.
The Moffat tunnel is awesome. Spent a lot of time in that area as a child, along south boulder creek. Would visit the tunnel area to see the doors and trains going in and out. Winter had ice skating on Lake Pactolus where the trains from California used to stop to pick up ice for the trip east.
The SD40-2T were designed in conjunction with EMD and Southern Pacific. Rio Grande just benefitted from the design. They were originally designed for the Donner Pass out here in California. They were not designed specifically for the tunnels but rather the lengthy Snow Sheds and very long tunnels on that route. But the history of the "Tunnel Motor" really begins with the AC series locomotives built in Sacramento California. They were known as the Cab Forwards. The only remaining example currently resides in The California State Railroad Museum in Sacramento. Basically the Cab Forward solves the same problem, only it keeps the crew alive.
Of all random places, we ended up with 10 refitted SD40T-3's here in Western Pennsylvania, on the Bessemer and Lake Erie railroad, hauling iron ore from Lake Erie to Pittsburgh to feet steel mills. It's kind of interesting that we ended up with tunnel motors on a railroad with no tunnels.
Id love to see a video about diesel locomotives that use pod systems with 2-3 individual removable gensets instead of the standard single engine. At my job I manufacture large 16~ liter diesel gensets in sets of 3 for switcher locomotives. Mostly rail yard and shunting work but they're very fun
Oh yes, one of my favorite locomotives. Not that many around anymore, but a few places like the NYS&W still have some in service (in a magnificent paint scheme as well)
i worked the southern pacific diesel pit at sparks nevada in the early 70s. crews were changed and we went out to the yard to go through and inspect the locos. i cant tell you how many times sd 45s coming off the mountain { donner pass } were out or low on coolant, and i had to fill them. the railroad experimented with some 'elephant ear' shrouding to come up with the design.. then came the sd 45 Tunnel motor! wow they were great. but my favorite was the sd 45x e.g. sp 9500 though. enjoy the videos ty
I heard about the "elephant ears" after I posted this from a friend. Wacky design, but I get the thought behind it. Must've been an interesting place to work! I bet you've got some good stories. Cheers!
@Hyce777 the sp's gp40x's also had elephant ears when new. Cp rail even experimented with them on sd40-2s in Canada over kicking horse pass. On the sp, the elephant ear designs very successful and cheap to modify on existing power. There was one problem that kept them from system wide implementation and pressured emd to develop this new cooling system, train crews banging thier heads on the elephant ears walking back on the motors for servicing or walking between locomotives while running. It also made basic maintenance on the radiator Intakes a pain
I noticed that the Tunnel Motor has the extended dynamic range blister instead of the normal version. That would make an excellent addition to your video here
BNSF has 7.9 mike Cascade Tunnel in Washington and 7 mile Flathead Tunnel in Montana. Moffat Tunnel comes in 3rd. Canadian Pacific has the 9 mile Mt McDonald tunnel.
I don’t know if your “Blerb” mentioned this, but the SP also ran tunnel motors because of the long tunnels and snow sheds over the Sierra Mountains via Donner Pass. I would like to see a “360” on the tunnel motor, as well as the pair of F9’s the museum has.
Very interesting video, thanxs. This diesel is exactly where all diesels (maybe outside of shunting) belong. In a museum! And even shunting could be done with battery powered solutions. Burning prehistoric remains for locomotion (in its literal sense) is so 20th century 😉.
I'm curious about two aspects of the tunnel motors: #1 - it appears the air intakes at the front remained up high. This is the generator & traction motor cooling plus the combustion air intake. I'm really surprised they didn't need to move that down too. #2 - Did they add a second discharge to cool the engine compartment?
Your video just popped up on my feed....watched, liked and subscribed! Any mountain railroading, is GREAT railroading! I'm huge fan of the Milwaukee Road, with a soft spot for the Rio Grande! Greetings from a Swede in Glasgow, Scotland! 🤜🏻🤛🏻🍻
![Milwaukee Road A Railroad At Work 1946 Film [4K]](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/4D_pXV9tJtY/mqdefault.jpg)
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Right when you went to start talking about the engine protector, I was fully prepared to be a pedant in the comments section lol. A couple snippets from me are all I have though.
1: The hot oil detector and engine protector both work by causing the governor to sense low oil pressure, which as you said makes it shut down. The hot oil detector is a thermostatic valve, (like a thermostat in a car or truck) which opens at, I believe, 215 degrees Fahrenheit. When it opens it dumps the oil in the governor's sensing line causing the low oil shutdown to pop. The actual valve for that is located in the main lube manifold going into the front of the engine.
2: You mentioned a sort of "limp mode" and actually even those old locomotives have something similar. When you look right above air compressor and towards the front of the locomotive you can see a water manifold. That manifold has three temperature switches in it (a normal SD40-2 would have four). The switches are labeled TA, TB, TC, and ETS. (A tunnel won't have a switch in the TC spot since they only have two fans.) That ETS (engine temperature switch) picks up at, again *I think,* 205 degrees. When that switch closes a bunch of electrical stuff happens and it "derates" in a sense. It basically changes your throttle notches to 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 5, 6. (in 7 & 8 it knocks you down 2 notches) the speed reduction reduces the risk of cavitation in the water pumps, and the excitation system reduces the load on the engine as well. Not anywhere near what modern electronic controls are capable of, but still a neat little "limp mode" even on those old engines.
So yeah, that's the pedant in me satisfied lol. Great video and definitely earned a like from me!
Also, I'm sure you remember me from last week and I did check and according to the source I looked at, our 5413 retains the number it had when it ran on the D&RGW, and the 5412 used to be the D&RGW 5391.
Well hell! That's awesome detail. The BNSF sent us darned white hats to the mechanical schools, but didn't cover any electrical side. I always wished I learned more. I just thought those temp switches were just for controlling the rad fans - I'll admit, when I saw all of them back there on 5401, I was confused seeing as it has fewer fans. That makes a ton of sense! Thanks for teaching me something today. :)
@Hyce777 No problem at all! I'm a locomotive tech by trade and the railroad I work for has a roster that's over half SD40-2's. And even the stuff that isn't is mostly of similar vintage (GP35, GP40, SD40)
I also have a literal electrical manual for the SD40-2 that I was given as part of my apprenticeship.
Edit: I've also had days where I was bored at work and would get out prints and spend time going through them to find out what makes things happen. (Yes I have heard I'm strange) I have a couple of sequences wrote out on my phone for reference.
@@CDROM-lq9iz
There’s nothing strange about knowing your job, especially when you get sent on a road trip to get the mainline cleared and traffic moving again.
I’ve had to go out on the road and change a CLS (coolant level sensor) on a C-44 AC without losing too much coolant, and it was still running when we got there, stopped on the main line, nowhere near a water source to refill the cooling system. The bad sensor wasn’t allowing the unit to load, and the remaining consist didn’t have the power to continue on the uphill grade without it. I put on a rain suit, some leather gloves, some thick neoprene oil changing gloves over those, a face shield, and taped all of the seems on that stuff closed with duct tape. I was able to get the sensor changed and only lost about 4-5 inches of water in the sight glass. Got er loading and on her way in about 30 minutes time, main line clear and open to more traffic.
Have a good day sir!
@ralfie8801 Thanks and I'm sure you had a hell of a time getting out of that getup lol. I don't think I've done anything quite that sketchy but I have had to manually put motor cutouts in on an SD40 that was blocking a yard track and an inbound was waiting on the main for them to clear up.
I've also fixed a couple loading issues with a hammer to the side of a contactor.
I'm sure stuff like that would make plenty of people freak out lol.
@@CDROM-lq9iz
Yeah, I put all that on because I didn’t feel like getting scalded with 210 degree water. It was a mess, but it all worked out in the end. Had to travel 25 miles to get to it.
I was hoping to see a piston going to space in the clip that played after the discussion of crank case overpressure
Me to
Lol yes me toooooooo😂
i fully expected it
Who DIDN'T expect to see that?
Same
Hey Hyce....5401 was a good unit, Mars light and all. Operated her back in the late 70's out of Denver. She is an old lady now, and shows it. When she was new she was proud to be a leader amongst the GP30's, GP40's, and SD-9's, SD-40's, and SD45's in the stable. These were, as you know, used primarily on the coal trains to Phippsburg, and beyond...to Craig. They had a very eloquent style. Will always be my favorite locomotive type...(they could really haul...at the lower speeds), and the dynamics were easy to control. Mitch Pittenger (Road Foreman) was a buddy (god rest his soul), and we had some great times railroading together. Thank you for the look back into the past !!!
Cheers my friend! I bet you've got some great stories from your time on the railroad.
I’m a Rio Grande guy. I put in 43 years. Hate to say that I finished with the up. I remember when those units came online. They were beautiful.
The Rio Grande thanks you for your contribution to our railroad
"You, breathing your own fumes in an enclosed space, you would shut down too" a porta potty in mid July came to mind.
645 c.i. per cylinder comes out to 169.1 L!!!!
I understand that that's not super surprising to most train nerds, but to me, somebody who is just learning about how diesels work, that is utterly astounding!
Great work, Hyce! Love the content.
I really really want to see more "Nerding out" with Hyce on an EMD locomotive.
It may not be Steam, but the BNSF story juices can start to flow and experiences as the camera films Hyce show and talk EMD locomotives with this SD40-2T.
Would love to see both 5401 and 3011 featured in a loco 360
3011 is unfortunately missing a ton of functional things. It got parted out prior to being donated.
@@Hyce777 Thats a shame, perhaps swap out 3011 for one of the Geese?
9:29 if you look most modern locomotive adopted the tunnel motor style cooling and intake system .
Take a deep dive also on the sd45x elephant ears was another attempt to do the same thing
@@Hyce777Anyway we could get a 360 of the tiny little gas switcher? Peewee I think you guys dubbed it.
@@Hyce777I just want to see what's behythe door on the engineers side just behind the cab.... In detail... So yeah! A 360 would be killer!!!
The Colorado railroad museum is on the list to visit some day. I've always thought the tunnel motors were a great series and such a simple way to approach the problem.
I loved our SP tunnels. We had 45t-2s and regular 40t-2s. Crews would often brag about how good "9500" and "9400" were at pulling. Sadly the tunnels are all but gone, with the last one "4071" breifly going into the deadline before being returned for a short time as a new customer needed a dedicated engine. She found her way into a few more road trains as she came in on her 92 day and the customer realized a big 6 axle was too much power for them only to finally end up leased to a grain elevator after one of their workhorses went down. Its unclear if 4071 will ever return to our roster or will remain at the elevator the rest of her days.
Nearly all went to Brasil and worked meter gauge with ALL and some rebuilt for FCA as BB40t-2....
it’s cool to see old engines like this
Id just like to say Mark, im happy to see how much you’ve grown your channel over these 2 years. Ive been here since u started the original RO play throughs. Cheers to you, keep on rollin man.
Cheers mate!
Hyce: Do you want to see me go into nerdy details of locomotives in video form?
Everyone here: But that's why we're here, so obviously yes!
Also everyone: With the Hyce special touch of teaching train tech, who would want to miss out!
Former EMD mechanic here, once we got a call from a customer saying the engine shut down and wouldn't start back up. And they said it wouldn't stop beeping for hours and just couldnt figure it out. We went out there to a geep and turns out the only problem was the governor button was out. Pushed it back in and problem solved 😂 topped off the water and the oil to make sure and checked its vitals. Everything was all good!
My dad was one of the lead design and manufacturing engineers for Motive Power out of Boise, Idaho up until just before they went bankrupt from poor account management. I can’t wait to show him your channel. He will tell anyone who will listen that “working on choo-choos” was the best job of his 45-year career.
Yeah, this is an excellent opportunity to do a full, in-detail workover of the locomotive.
As a side note, I really enjoyed that you admitted you were incorrect and offered corrections. Shows your humility.
Nicely done Hyce.
Very cool video! The SD40T-2 has to be my favorite EMD locomotive of all time. My grandfather worked for the SP and worked with these all the time, despite there being no tunnels on the SP route through Arizona, although they did work Donner Pass and throughout the Sierra Nevadas. Said they were fantastic at what they did. After the merger, he also got to work on former Grande ones and on the former DRGW lines, including Moffat Tunnel!
I guess this design also helps in hot climate of Arizona? The cooler the air you blow through the radiators, the more efficient they are. Blowing hot desert air through isn't great, but it's better than hot desert air that's been pre-heated by everything that it passed before it got to the radiators.
I'm not sure what the difference in manufacturing price, running costs and maintenance costs are, but as these changes were not made standard for the model I suppose there has to be a drawback somewhere.
You know, I was just asking myself last week if you had covered the museum's tunnel motor. Lo and behold I get this in my recommended! Beautiful explanation of the functionalities!
Our railroad has 3 tunnels, two of them still retaining the original Rio Grande livery! 5391 (now 5412) and 5413!
As a side note, sanding these things are a pain, especially if there are two of them back-to-back :L
I just love trying to reach for the sand hoses that have been set up for regular 6-axles and the occasional 4-axles when these long bois come in. Stretch Armstrong mode activated. And don't get me started on those long hood suicide steps .-.
When you said send a "piston to space" I was a little disappointed when that next video clip, wasn't an example of that happening.
Was about to comment about how the SP developed the tunnel motors, but it looks like you beat me to it. 😁 That said, Moffat tunnel is no longer the second longest in the US, it's the third. Flathead Tunnel in Montana, built in the late 60's, is second longest at 7 miles. It was built to reroute the GN Hi-Line when Libby Dam flooded the original route.
Why didn't they just build a really long bridge? 🤔
Oh cool! So we're extra extra wrong. Lol!
@@realcanadian67 they wouldn't need a long bridge. They'd need a very steep grade to get above the dam from Libby, and then a lot of track along the shore of the new lake (which flooded an entire valley, lengthwise). A new route to the south and the 7 mile tunnel was apparently easier and less steep.
the dam and the realignment were done by the US Army Corps of Engineers, fun fact. those guys are no joke, they can build anything, and to pretty good standards
@@BandanRRChannel rack and pinion?!?!? It was right Infront of them!!!! Smh...
We have a pair of these in my home terminal in Fond Du Lac Wisconsin for CN. We use them as shover power, and I always wondered why they have a huge open space in the back. Thanks for finally answering that for me!
You're hilarious, that's how you send pistons to space. Awesomely put.
I would love to see a Loco 360 on this locomotive!
The Ringneck and Western railroad out here in South Dakota has a tunnel motor running on their line. It looks a little silly being there no tunnels, but it's a cool piece of railroading history.
you are literally one of my fave people to watch talk about things, not for the topic (although interesting), but for the way you structure the video, the method, the context, the sass and the wit. you truly are an intellectual pleasure x
A 360 would be cool and I think maybe a 346 step by step once in a while would be cool to
I love watching your videos and as a helper in a maintenance shop the standard SD40-2 is 68ft 10in, where the SD40T-2 is 70ft 8in the Locomotive is slightly longer to accommodate for the rear tunnel radiator
I remember seeing these as a young kid (in SP livery) and noticing they looked different. It wasn't until a couple of years ago I learned what they were. This video does a great job of showing the equipment that makes it a tunnel motor.
A tunnel story.
My dad fired for the B&O out of Baltimore, West End. The route west, the Old Main Line, winds it's way up a river valley, cresting the grade at a place called Mount Airy, Md. The line summits through a mile-long tunnel under the town. Not that steep, but for a train, gradient is relative.
The trick to firing through a tunnel is to have the boiler full, and the fire-box as hot as possible with plenty of coal. Before entering the tunnel the feed-water is shut-off, and no more coal added to the fire. With luck the train will be over the hump before water and coal must be added.
Often the water in the sight-glass would drop out of sight.
The story
The engine wasn't steaming well. Not only did it require almost constant feed-water, it was burning more coal than it should, and was filling the tunnel with exhaust.
Then they stalled.
My dad looked over at the engineer. The engineer was on the verge of passing-out. My dad suggested to the brakeman to get down and pull the pin, they had to get out of there.
He went over to the engineer, shaking him and yelling, "Give the brakeman some slack, we're cutting-off and getting out of here."
Tunnels and fuel-burning engines are fundamentally incompatible.
If tunnels had desires, it would be to kill humans.
I am sure that Hyce has a copy of "Rails that Climb."
The Moffat trains faced snow-shed hells.
That's a really dangerous situation to be in !
( sounds like in the llate 1930s or 1940s )
If you were headed Uphill, water would normally flow to back/cab end of boiler, causing sight glass to read high compared to a level loco... if water is below the sight glass and you are on an UP grade, then the front of boiler is running dry, and the water right over firebox top plate is thin too, which can lead to boiler explosion if you have much of a fire going.
But, at that moment, their immediate problem was a stalled engine and being 3 minutes from suffocating in a tunnel !!
About their only option was to set the air brakes on train, disconnect, and use what little steam was left in boiler to get the locomotive + crew moving toward fresh air.
This would have left a mess for the rail line... (hopefully no other train scheduled on that track soon)
Rail boss would have needed to send another loco+crew to attach to the train from bottom end, release the brakes and take cars back downhill to siding or rail yard... possibly split into smaller load, then send again in pieces.
Sounds like it may have blocked rail traffic most of the day, but I'm glad nobody died.
Loved the way the motor and turbo sounded together as the ran down the line. Love the SD 40-2T 😊
Would love to see a 360 video of it. The sd-40 and dash 2s are amazing locos and so much fun to operate
Fun fact: Air brakes in semi trucks were inspired by the same braking system in locomotives because of how successful it was, and was adopted. After 1974 or 1975, the spring brake chamber is the required type of air brakes to be used in semi trucks because of the safety issue that arose when trucks that lost air pressure meant that there were no brakes and no brakes means it's gonna be a VERY bade time.
The spring brakes are the safety mechanism in place to prevent that from happening, BUT you'd need air pressure to essentially "unlock" the brakes to allow the truck to move as well as air pressure to stop the truck.
I love these videos, this is stuff I would have never been interested in since I'm more of a continental european electric loco guy but your presentatnion manages to make this stuff incredibly interesting.
Those SD40s may be old and outdated but there are very few locomotives that I prefer when it comes to flat switching.
They load way quicker than anything GE ever made, that's for sure, lol.
I preferred the SW1500s and MP15s for switching. The brakes are not that great on the Geeps and SD40s, especially if they have the independents turned down for remotes.
@@rjohnson1690we don't use remote locomotives, we have an engineer due to our yard design. All of our older locos have been sold or scrapped :(
@@Hyce777lol switch with any GE is pain, at least the new ACs (when we get them) are quite quick once they start to load.
GE units for the most part have better traction motors and stronger tractive effort. EMD units however normally load quicker,both DC & AC,which gives them road switching advantage. One of the only GE units suitable for switching are the ES44AC's,the throttle response is impressive. I completely agree about the SW1500's,minus the flexicoil trucks,and MP15DC's/AC's which were awesome switchers. The GP40-2's & SD40-2's were the last great units built by EMD without any major flaws. It's debatable nowadays on what's been reliable. I will personally note down that the modern GE units have incredible dynamic braking when it comes down to serious tonnage.
I lived in Tolland, CO for 13 years, which is right next to the Moffat Tunnel. I instantly recognized some of your video footage. I've seen so many trains going through there it's unreal, and I've probably seen that locomotive going through the valley too (lol). The locomotives going through put out so much diesel exhaust that they usually stop when they find out from other trains in passing that there are stowaways on the train cars. They'd stop the trains and call the local sheriff's office (me) to come out and remove them. Not so fun when it's -40 F outside. The Moffat Tunnel has a giant locomotive engine along side the tunnel entrance, which forces air in the opposite direction the train is traveling. This keeps the area around the locomotive from being consumed by the train's exhaust, and keeps the engineer and conductor from getting suffocated by the exhaust. When the tunnel fan engine fires up, it is so loud the sound fills up the entire valley to the east with the siren-like sound of the fan and engine.
I just rode the Amtrak California Zephyr through the Moffatt tunnel last week on my way home to California. 10 minutes for the 6 miles and no moving between cars through the tunnel. I didn't notice any particular diesel fumes either.
The section between Denver and Glenwood Springs or Grand Junction is a great trip for the exceptional scenery.
You know, seeing you next to the loco Hyce, reminds me of how huge the US equipment is! Our stuff only go as high as the nose of your locos. That's one reason I want to visit the US, just to enjoy the size of the trains!
Just found your channel I really enjoy the videos. I was a locomotive engineer for Conrail and then CSX. Best most fun job I ever had.
"You do not want crank-case overpressure... That's how you send pistons to space."
Watch out, Hyce! Jebediah Kerman will be looking into piston-launched rocket technology next!
I was actually learning about Grande 2nd gens like this just before this came out! Keep up the great work helping common civilians learn about this great industry!
Love seeing people talk about the things they are passionate about, no matter the topic.
As someone who remembers 1980, hearing you say "1980 is not that old" was a balm to my soul :)
Would love to see 360 on 5401 I have always loved the tunnel motors and would enjoy seeing more. Thank you hyce for what you do and being an amazing person that shares their passion with the world around them
If you can find the book,,very rare, titled the "Mack Railroad" the Gilsonite Route. It describes special built Baldwin locies articulated in the middle to make the sharp curves up Baxter Pass in Mack Colorado to Bonanza Utah to haul Gilsonite back to Colorado. When it shut down both Locies disappeared. One was found some 20 years alter in Honduras. From what I understand it is still there, on a side track covered with Jungle groth. Only two of the exotic engines were made.
Mark, YES please continue the tour with a 360
video on the CRRM’s newest acquisition 5401! I know very little about diesel choo choos so this latest video furthered my understanding of them. Love that the original paint scheme survives. What a gigantic locomotive for sure. The huge cold air intake was ultra OMG, almost like a screened in porch. I was thinking a few lounge chairs and could provide a nice shady area during the hot summer months 😂. Opening up the compartments and pointing out important components and what they do was not only fun to see but such great learning moments as you discussed the details. And as you say, Mark, it’s so all about the details! Congratulations to the fab CRRM on their latest rolling stock collection acquisition. And most importantly many thanks Professor for yet another excellent learning video and as always cheers to you!
This locomotive went by my house all the time as a kid on 62nd and carr street. My grandfather was a switchman for rio grande for decades and i used to go down to the yard to hang out back in the 80s and 90s and watch him kick cars over the hump. He retired after union Pacific came in. I actually picketed with him back in the early 90s. I miss seeing these rio grande locos going by. Every now and then youll see and old dilapidated switcher go by in arvada. I can tell without even going outside, by the wheezing chugging sound of those old emd diesels.
Can't wait for them to offer Hyce the job of project management for restoring that loco and him to just shut down and have flashbacks.
Was noticing 5401 in the background during the cow catcher video. Saw a DRGW diesel behind you and thought 3011 until I saw the standard EMD cab then the road # and was like oh new acquisition,neat.
Second the idea of a 5401 3011 double loco 360.
It’s nice to actually see the details of how the changes were made to the tunnel motors beyond that the air intakes were enlarged and placed in a low position.
As much as i appreciate the videos you do on locomotives, i most definitely appreciate the honesty you have when it comes to mistakes! Very cool!
Was just thinking about tunnel engines used by SP, and bam! up pops your video! Thanks for taking the time to show us exactly how the “T” engine concept worked.
Great video!
Southern Pacific bought a lot of them because of several steep grades the railroad had to deal with: Donner Pass, Tehachapi Pass and Beaumont Hill specifically. The cooler running of these "tunnel motors" was how SP ran some pretty heavy trains over these passes.
Great video. The production value reminded me of those "All About Trains" VHS and DVDs from my childhood
I’m willing to wager Baby Hyce had those videos too……
"It's only been out of service for close to fifteen years, its fine! It looks pretty solid, it looks better than [ *really mumbles* ] some of the power I've seen coming on the railroad. [ */really mumbles* ] Can't be that hard, right?" Best line of the whole vid!
The first SP engine I built fir my HO trains was a tunnle motor. It was a blank shell and a chasis. I the motor and lights in it ( no DCC at the time). It was also the first time I painted a shell. I painted in the bloody nose scheme. The speed Southern Pacific decals came out perfect.
Of all the models I've had, that is the one I was most proud of.
I’ve always heard that the point of the tunnel motors wasn’t really to keep cool inside the tunnel, because pretty much all air in the tunnel gets hot after a little bit. But rather it was to cool down faster when it was outside the tunnel, so that it’s ready for the next tunnel.
Moffat Tunnel is why we said D&RGW is the mainline THROUGH the Rockies-not around!
Also hope you had time to talk to volunteers in the roundhouse, they're great people. Museum's a handful of minutes from my hometown, and I've been there many times.
I love this video because I've always understood how a tunnel motor operates, but I've never known how it's all put together to actually do the cooling. And yes, please do a Loco 360 on it!
The tunnel motor is a classic. SP, D&RGW and Cotton Belt ordered this model. There's another one known as SD45T-2 only ordered by Southern Pacific and Cotton Belt. #5401 is one of two preserved SD40T-2s, the other one being #5371 at Utah State Railway Museum. Im glad they saved some SD40T-2s and an SD45T-2 for preservation.
Love the Video Hyce, Tunnel motors are my 2nd most favorite modern unit. We had a bunch here in Southern Oregon after the DRGW/SP merger. I lived next to the old SP Siskiyou line in Roseburg, Oregon. Loved seeing them running all the time and then when CORP took over and went Red/Grey livery and got 3 of them. I now model this line in HO from 04-06ish
That was one really cool video about a very unique diesel locomotive. The SD40T-2 is the most unique diesel locomotive I've ever heard of.
Far away shots alongside the close shots to maintain perspective is awesome, thank you!
Love the new camera angle. I always wondered what the POV of Hyce's coworkers were XD
What's up, I work on the moffat sub today. I can tell you with 100% certainty that we all wish our distributed power were tunnel motors. They choke themselves out in the tunnel district all the time with the high air intake
Here in Vermont, we have one of Southern Pacific's SD40T-2s still running. NECR 3317, built as SP 8256 in April of 1980 is still used almost daily across the NECR system. sadly NECR Repainted it to the standard boring orange and black G&W scheme, but it sure is fun seeing such a unique engine here in the far northeast. I am hoping for it to stay for a long time, however it sounds like NECR will be receving GE -9 power sometime this winter and either selling or scrapping a lot of the classic EMD fleet including former a DMIR SD9 (NECR 1750)
You know darn well that we'll watch a Locomotive 360 of literally everything, even those railmotors, a hand-cart, heck, a tool dolly you left across the tracks in the shop. (Save that film for 1st April.)
I live out east but the tunnel motors are special to me anyway. The Ohio Central System operated a trio that used to make frequent appearances on their coal trains before those were discontinued in 2020, though since G&W took over only 4027 is still on the Ohio Central roster that I'm aware of, 4025 and 4026 have unfortunately since been repainted and relocated to other G&W lines.
RJ Corman also operates a number of SD40T-2s on their various lines.
I am impressed that the U.S. is developing new trains. On the other hand, Croatia still uses EMD GT22HW-2 (which is similar to the SD40) and G26 from 1973.
Where’s the best place to see trains in Croatia?
@bluescrew3124 in bigger cities like Zagreb, Osijek, Slavonski Brod, Sisak, Rijeka, but it's hard to see them. Most of times trains are broken down or not in use. Trains here are not really used. It's cheaper and a lot faster to use truck to deliver something. If you want to use train to travel 300km you need around 8h
@@mrmura4 years ago I took a train from Zadar to Zagreb and it took 12 hours…..
Your videos are awesome. I love the content. 👍🏼
A HUge Big hanx for an AWESOME explanatory doccu info about the big iron we ALL LOVE..love and respect from denmark
You can see in those GE engines going by as you're talking about more modern locomotives, an aspect of the tunnel motor lives on today: the air intakes are down low now. They don't have the bulkheads, but they did lower the air intakes from the high position that the early EMD engines had.
If you want to see 2 SD40T-2 and a couple of gp38s still running in their Grande paint, might be worth a trip out east to chase the Wheeling and Lake Erie. They still run a lot of sd40s and even high hood gp40s (with ALCO trucks of course).
Wow Hyce ! Thank you so much for this clip. Im building a 1/11 scale version of this locomotive and your video helps me A LOT ! Thank you so much for a close look into the rear of a Tunnel Motor. Btw a 360 video would be super nice !
Cheeers from Germany
Growing up in Colorado Springs in the 1980s and early 90s I remember seeing these tunnel engines moving through town - including once on the Rock Island branch extending east of town.
I just worked on ex SP SD40T-2 CORP 4075 yesterday
Very informative and well explained. I really like your enthusiasm and gestures as you teach your viewers the fine points of the great subjects! All in all, your interest makes us interested😊. Good work, my friend and many thanks❤
Atlas shrugged had a good chapter about diesels and tunnels and mayhem of sorts. Great book centered around a railroad company
I went to a Navy School for 16-645 Engines back in early 1980's. My first ship had those engines also. One of many diesel engine schools that I took.
If i remember, a D&RGW tunnel motor like this one was loaned to BC Rail up here in Canada for a bit in the very early 2000’s,
still unpatched and in D&RGW colors but owned by UP
Fun fact:
Prior to initial tunnel motor development, SP had initially tried to combat the tunnel overheating / de-rating problem by experimenting with a "tunnel curtain". This is circa 1969. Essentially, a large curtain of heavy canvas cloth, draped and "sealed" off the tunnel's opening, which was rigged to a mechanism that would vertically roll up the curtain when approaching trains would trigger trackside relays. The scheme worked so-so, but SP scrapped the idea when a failure in the system saw an SD push its way through the curtain, as well as the cost of retrofitting tunnels. The tests were performed on the west portal of Tunnel #7 on the Cascade Sub. It was after this series of experiments that SP finally laid down the gauntlet to EMD engineers and said, essentially, "you need to build us a modified SD40 that can adapt and live in our long tunnels."
Curiously, today, the UP has a lot of the similar problems on that sub with de-rating or shut downs. Everything old is new again.
They also considered electrification of the entire Roseville Subdivision because of how frequently the early SD40s and SD45s would stall at the Big Hole. Now that would've been interesting.
@@mikehawk2003 That's cool, I'd never heard that before. Indeed, that would've been an interesting scenario.
The Moffat tunnel is awesome. Spent a lot of time in that area as a child, along south boulder creek. Would visit the tunnel area to see the doors and trains going in and out. Winter had ice skating on Lake Pactolus where the trains from California used to stop to pick up ice for the trip east.
The SD40-2T were designed in conjunction with EMD and Southern Pacific. Rio Grande just benefitted from the design. They were originally designed for the Donner Pass out here in California. They were not designed specifically for the tunnels but rather the lengthy Snow Sheds and very long tunnels on that route. But the history of the "Tunnel Motor" really begins with the AC series locomotives built in Sacramento California. They were known as the Cab Forwards. The only remaining example currently resides in The California State Railroad Museum in Sacramento. Basically the Cab Forward solves the same problem, only it keeps the crew alive.
Of all random places, we ended up with 10 refitted SD40T-3's here in Western Pennsylvania, on the Bessemer and Lake Erie railroad, hauling iron ore from Lake Erie to Pittsburgh to feet steel mills. It's kind of interesting that we ended up with tunnel motors on a railroad with no tunnels.
Id love to see a video about diesel locomotives that use pod systems with 2-3 individual removable gensets instead of the standard single engine. At my job I manufacture large 16~ liter diesel gensets in sets of 3 for switcher locomotives. Mostly rail yard and shunting work but they're very fun
Would love to see 5401 in a Loco 360 piece. And considering it’s recent retirement, run again. (As Jeremy Clarkson would say “how hard could it be??”)
Oh yes, one of my favorite locomotives. Not that many around anymore, but a few places like the NYS&W still have some in service (in a magnificent paint scheme as well)
Donner Pass was why Southern Pacific went to the tunnel motors. There are a few running in different parts of the US and some in Canada.
i worked the southern pacific diesel pit at sparks nevada in the early 70s. crews were changed and we went out to the yard to go through and inspect the locos. i cant tell you how many times sd 45s coming off the mountain { donner pass } were out or low on coolant, and i had to fill them. the railroad experimented with some 'elephant ear' shrouding to come up with the design.. then came the sd 45 Tunnel motor! wow they were great. but my favorite was the sd 45x e.g. sp 9500 though. enjoy the videos ty
I heard about the "elephant ears" after I posted this from a friend. Wacky design, but I get the thought behind it. Must've been an interesting place to work! I bet you've got some good stories. Cheers!
@Hyce777 the sp's gp40x's also had elephant ears when new. Cp rail even experimented with them on sd40-2s in Canada over kicking horse pass. On the sp, the elephant ear designs very successful and cheap to modify on existing power. There was one problem that kept them from system wide implementation and pressured emd to develop this new cooling system, train crews banging thier heads on the elephant ears walking back on the motors for servicing or walking between locomotives while running. It also made basic maintenance on the radiator Intakes a pain
Once again, I really enjoy this level of nerdy detail that I could never find in books when I was growing up. More nerdy detail videos!
Another great, interesting, and informative vid, Hyce. Keep 'em coming and I keep watching. I really enjoy your channel .. thanks.
Thanks Hyce, YES on the loco 360, the Tunnel motors were my favorite back in the 80’s.
I noticed that the Tunnel Motor has the extended dynamic range blister instead of the normal version. That would make an excellent addition to your video here
BNSF has 7.9 mike Cascade Tunnel in Washington and 7 mile Flathead Tunnel in Montana. Moffat Tunnel comes in 3rd. Canadian Pacific has the 9 mile Mt McDonald tunnel.
Here at the Trona Railway thats all we have is ex SP and UP SD40T-2'S and SD40-2'S. The old kodachrome is still pulling cars around.
This is some of the most fascinating content imo. Nerds love to see how stuff works!
One of my former locos was a GP15-1, the baby tunnels. I've really liked the cooling system
I don’t know if your “Blerb” mentioned this, but the SP also ran tunnel motors because of the long tunnels and snow sheds over the Sierra Mountains via Donner Pass. I would like to see a “360” on the tunnel motor, as well as the pair of F9’s the museum has.
Very interesting video, thanxs. This diesel is exactly where all diesels (maybe outside of shunting) belong. In a museum! And even shunting could be done with battery powered solutions. Burning prehistoric remains for locomotion (in its literal sense) is so 20th century 😉.
You guys are a crack up.... Great info and love the delivery of the video..... 🤙
I'm curious about two aspects of the tunnel motors:
#1 - it appears the air intakes at the front remained up high. This is the generator & traction motor cooling plus the combustion air intake. I'm really surprised they didn't need to move that down too.
#2 - Did they add a second discharge to cool the engine compartment?
Your video just popped up on my feed....watched, liked and subscribed!
Any mountain railroading, is GREAT railroading!
I'm huge fan of the Milwaukee Road, with a soft spot for the Rio Grande!
Greetings from a Swede in Glasgow, Scotland! 🤜🏻🤛🏻🍻