WEIRDEST New Locomotive?
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- Опубліковано 20 лип 2024
- Sometimes looks have to sacrificed to pull heavy trains with the highest efficiency and power!
References:
Locomotives: The Modern Diesel & Electric Reference by Greg McDonnell
ET23DCM Locomotives Explained by Chris Guss / Trains.com
Guide to North American Diesel Locomotives by Jeff Wilson
How Diesel & Electric Locomotives Work by Jeff Wilson
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Santa Fe was doing this 50 years ago, taking old covered wagon engines and rebuilding them with freight bodies. Check out the book "CF-7 From Cleburne to Everywhere. " by Cary Poole.Those engines got a new lease on life with ATSF. And then they were peddled off on shortlines all over the world. Even Amtrak owned several CF-7s. Many are still being used today, despite their non compliance with Tier 4 emissions requirements
ATSF is my favorite railroad, I've heard of them before.
The CF7’s looked ugly to some, but they were real miracle workers. I’ve heard crews praise the CF7’s for their flexibility and large windows
@@Coloribus2004 maybe it was the short little nose? The first railroad I worked for had about a dozen CF-7s and a pair of GP-7s. Except for the position of the batteries and the nose shapes, they were almost identical to each other to us crew folk.
@@AaronArroyo-sn4uysame
Those CF7s were built before the Environmental Police Agency really started mandating all these Tier rules. I think they overstepped their power and have caused many things to cost more because of their actions. Besides many older locomotives were grandfathered and allowed to keep running. Just look at the Alcos and MLWs that are still running. Anyway I thought that the EMD that opened the video was a rebuilt with EMD components. Thanks for the info.
As someone whos worked with those rebuilds, theyre nowhere near as powerful as the unrebuilt ones, but they are so quite and smooth. We got her in on a mow train. She didn't stay long but i liked her
They are slippery from what I heard and have had issues in the colder climates.
I live in Erie PA. Wabtech has been more cunning, devious and cut-throat against their employees than even GE was. These workers have built locomotives for decades. They are skilled. But the company wants to move production to Texas and pay wages that are half or less, to laborers who have very little experience. In a short decade or so, watch for some Wabtech locomotives to have issues with quality and build. These will be the ones built by cheap labor.
They want to hire ILLEGALS YES I said ILLEGALS for the job.
Boeing all over again!
Meh ge’s have always been junk so they will be even worse!
Do you mean cheap, Mexican labor ?
se habla espanol
Notice the Red light over the Ditch Lights on the Canadian National Unit. They use the Red light for rear DPU usage. I wished every Railroad would adopt this standard.
It's just one more accessory to maintain. Locomotives used to have marker lamps or sometimes called section lamps. There was a mechanical rod that changed the lenses from red to white and to green. While their usage became unnecessary in the 70s, any Locomotive equipped with such accessory had to maintain it in order to pass inspection. Broken or malfunctioning section lights were a defect and the engine could not pass an inspection while the accessory was defective. This included the bulb behind the lens that were not used! And yet in certain cases, it was cheaper to keep a working light bulb in the socket than it was to remove and cover the fixture altogether, so it stayed. Appliances, fixtures and other accessories that are not required or have been made obsolete, are really more hassle than their worth. And making something a standard requirement would need some safety background to justify its necessity. Red lights vs ditch lights or even a glowing headlight is probably not going to win any favor since both have the same meaning. "Train or engine here, stop before you reach the coupler, thanks!"
The argument about flashing or "wig-wag" ditch lights has been a fundamental debate since the mid-90s when ditch lights themselves became a requirement. But the wig-wags are not required by law. Certain railroads prefer them because they feel it offers an extra level of safety while other railroads remain firm in the stance that its just not necessary at all.
Great video and great information. I enjoy your videos. There is a small group of us that railfan at Amtrak Station in Clemson.. Saturday evening, I was early ahead of the rest of the group when a grandmother showed up with 2 grandsons. They both had tripods and cell phones with scanners on their belts. They asked about you tube train channels. I provid we d yours, and several others including Distant Signal with Danny Harmon. Helped both of them with Grandmother's permission, to set up and subscriptions for all the channels. They were absolutely excited and loved it. I told the grandmother about rail day at Folkston, and she said they will attend in the fall.
Don’t forget 7 Idea Productions my guy.
That's really cool! Thanks for sharing the channel with them.
Looks like an ES44AC and SD40-2 had a baby lol
yes😂
It's a SD23T4
The only difference is that it has a GEVO engine
@@bowlinglegendofleftwich4775so like an ES44AC...
@@RaisedLetter yeah, ES44ACs and ET44ACs use the same engine, except that they used an ET44AC engine for the Tier 4 specifications
I can completely understand Rehab, Rebuild and Reactivate especially when the Cost of New Units is one (1) to two (2) Million plus dollars. Thanks Charlie. 👍🙏
The sd40 lives on. Sd40-2 is one of the best locomotives ever built
01:30 haha, I was the conductor on that 1714 when it went from Spartanburg, SC to Kingsport, TN, probably not long after you took that video. It isn't a really good engine, it loves to drop its load when it goes from its sub-21 MPH to 21+ MPH ?gearing?, which isn't a good idea when it is the only engine pulling a train up the mountain.
I loved this video! You put a lot of work into it and it shows. Those 1713 & 1714 are crazy looking locomotives.
Thank you, sir!
The SD23T4 also have their dynamic brake fan section raised a little, which i assume to accommodate necessary Tier 4 components
Can also confirm that the 23s are supposed to be only in MoW service........ our mto got yelled at for using her as a second engine on the local while waiting for the mow to finish relaying the yard lol
I left out of Tilford one time with 6 U18Bs, all painted orange for mow service “only”, on a revenue train, because they were the only engines left in the yard lol
@@mikeingeorgia1 sounds about right lol, there was a time we were down to two engines to cover all of our locals (7 at that time) and one for switching lol
They have two assigned to road service on the former Pan Am territory. Crew hate them, they are constantly breaking down, load slow, are slippery, and are gutless. For the longest time they were getting sent into the shops every other trip.
Good video. Very informative. That SD23 looks like the result of a one night stand between an EMD and a GE.
T4? Nah, as someone who worked for the railway new GEs are not even close to T1 on a good day. Emissions from locomotives will always be high but way lower than semi trucks
I saw 1713 several months ago when it was pulling one of CSX's geometry trains. It was parked in a nearby yard over the weekend I saw it. But I barely missed it when it left due to having to go do something else.
Interesting design, though the radiator overhang means it's lost its ladder, which may make maintenance a pain.
These rebuilds from CSX are just another in a long line of crazy rebuilds railroads would pump out, and there have been some wild ones over the course of history! You should check out some of the ones Frisco and MKT for example pulled off! Alco RS units rebuilt with GP7/9 long hoods and prime movers, Santa Fe's famous "Beep" locomotive, PA-1s rebuilt with EMD engines, the list goes on! Love them, or hate them, these SD23-T4s are just following in the footsteps of some of the more zany rebuilds of yesteryear!
Illinois Central Paducah-builts with their strange ox-bow intakes. Santa Fe CF-7s where they took a F-unit car body off, and replaced it with a unique freight body. And then some one-of-a-kinds that served as a way for locomotive shops to flex their muscles and show just how much skill they had at building a jalopy of a locomotive. I've been railroading almost 25 years and only just recently learned about the "Beep" haha!
Another flawless documentary from V12 Productions
Great video! Interesting to see how rebuilt that unit!
I love the look of them especially the radiator fins. 1713 has a wonderful Ekyrail E-bell too!
Wonderful and Ekyrail usually aren't paired together
Nice shots Charlie! Glad we were able to see 1713 at Howell in March!
Thanks man!
EMD nose and flared radiators make these stunning. I love these things and wish they’d escape Barr Yard here in Chicagoland more often. Very photogenic.
As far I’m aware, the reason why locomotives use water instead of antifreeze is the engines leak too much. Antifreeze contamination of the oil will ruin its lubrication qualities & turn it into a milkshake.
Water works fine. Antifreeze is expensive and toxic. In cold weather, diesels are kept running to prevent freeze-up.
Water in oil will also destroy engines.
@@Greatdome99 That is interesting. My thought was that water lacks corrosion inhibitors (the primary reason I change my car's antifreeze according to the service manual)?
while they could use the same pink antifreeze as RV drinking water systems, it is probably still too expensive and messy most of the time.
@@user-hb2gh6wh7e - For some reason, I know more about antifreeze than I should. In your car, when you add fresh antifreeze, it reacts with bare metal and forms a protective film to prevent further corrosion. As the miles add up, the pump slowly wears down, constantly exposing “fresh metal” that then reacts with the same corrosion inhibitors. Eventually the system “uses up” those inhibitors and that’s when you need to change the coolant. When carmakers switched to long-life coolants a few years ago, they had to redesign the pumps to reduce cavitation and erosion, some even switched to non-metallic pumps in spite of the high cost of glass-reinforced nylon parts.
@ClockworksOfGL the main reason locomotives do not use antifreeze is because they are running more often than not. And if they are running, the coolant will not ever freeze in normal conditions. That being said, I remember seeing instructions on a locomotive in Alaska to leave it running idle in Run 3 (throttle position) when the outside temperature was below -25C.
I've also been a (trainmaster) of a short line that had to get out of bed at 11pm and go fire up some engines that would freeze otherwise.
There was a *GP* 23T4 at UP's Stockton, CA yard last time I was there. It's used for yard work. It was specifically on the industry switcher job last I've heard.
I saw one of those before it was painted into CSX, it had a grey body with the big radiator and an NS cab/short hood, it had marks for GECX
This was extremely informative and well put together.
Loved the quality of this video and the amount of info packed into it. Thanks. Subscribed.
Awesome video! Really enjoyed the information about the different engines and how they meet tier 4 emissions requirements
Every time I see those giant radiators I always think SD45 or GE U-Boat. Doesn't help that when my dad tells me he saw a U-boat he really saw an SD70ACE or some other modern junk.
U-boats don't have particularly large radiators. And if anybody tells you they've seen a U-boat today, they're almost certainly mistaken. There are almost none still running. Barely even any Dash-7s, which people keep calling "U-boats" but they're a generation later.
@@beeble2003 Most didn't, true, but it is worth noting the U36B and C had larger ones, and I think my dad associates radiator wings with U-boats as a result. Dad and I are both into trains, and we have had a number of Lionel O gauge and Bachmann HO and N U36Bs over the years, so he makes the association, as he is much more casual a railfan, in that he enjoys seeing them, knows some units, but that's about it. To him, every road unit GE has made is a U-boat.
A good friend of mine & other railfans I know caught one of those SD23T4 rebuilds leading a loaded coal train in NE Ohio back in March. Very unusual but I imagine they were testing these to see how they would do. Excellent video!!
My first teir 4 gevo I ever saw was Norfolk southern 3648, definitely something special for me
Finally, a 4-stroke EMD.
Amusingly, the 1010J is just an improved 265H (thanks to Caterpillar) from the SD90 and SD89 models.
@RailsofForney I wonder if cummins will ever produce a 8 cylinder 3/4ton truck engine. It's always been a 6 cylinder
@@freedomfan4272 i8s would be a bad idea due to their length, but a V8 or upscaled VR8 would be a good idea.
@@JohnGeorgeBauerBuis Sounds good to me
"Finally"? EMD have been making four-stroke engines since 2015...
The EMD 710 would meet t4 standards if DEF is used, but the railroads did not want that. As far as I know the 710 can still be bought for marine use.
Then Metra in Chicago might decide that they want a 710 with DEF in something rather than add the 265/1010 to the mix, as they have an all-EMD fleet except for the electrics and the yet to be delivered Stadler MUs.
@@JohnGeorgeBauerBuis CSX got rid of the t4 SD70s they had, well gave them back to Progress Rail, anyways.
Because they sucked irrc
@@bluegrassman3040 They were on a 5 year lease, CSX never owned them, Progress did.
@@alexmarks7275 yes I know that.
As always, fantastic content and information!
Thanks!
There's about 2 or more of those new CSX engines in my area, and I still haven't caught one. 😅I absolutely love the horn and bell on them along with their looks. I just took a trip to the Huntington Shop a few days ago! They've got a lot of SD70s rebuilt since my last visit in 2022. They just built a new hydrogen powered locomotive last month. As Always, another Enjoyable and Informative video! Keep Up the Great Work!
Will do. Thanks!
Again another excellent video. Your in-depth explinations are great and I learned quite a bit this morning watching and listening. Your video quality is secomd to none!👨🎓
Seeing that Winchester and Western unit was a real treat, I live next to one of the lines operated by them!
Just found your channel. WOW, this was a fantastic video ! Love all the different scenes injected into the video !
Thanks!
I remember going down to the steam loco scrap yards in N.J. Nice to see some Diesels being rebuilt.
What a great video! The very smooth images, combined with drone and the bunch of information make this one of the best train channels. My favorite one.
Greetings from Mexico!
Many thanks!
Yeah v12 great video as usual .👍🏻
Your videos are always so helpful! Thank you for the valuable information! 💝🐱
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it!
@@v12productions You just replied to a porn spammer.
So I’ve been in the 1717 and 1719 and they where strictly rebuild for MOW duties ( rail trains, geo trains, dumping ballast etc)
Is CSX planning to put them in local or normal service anytime soon?
@@TealGuy like k said strictly MOW duties. They was the ones who funded the rebuilt
@@tylerrose5232 oh ok
The back of it looks like a hammerhead shark lmao
In the top 2 or 3 Rail Channels overall and the best with regard to Motive Power details and information. Excellent video!
Just found your channel and subscribed immediately.
Great Video!
Thanks!
We’re probably in the future now 😂😂
Very interesting, cool new addition to the CSX's fleet.
the SD23T4's are often seen in Maine on the trains coming in and out of Waterville
Great video and information. However these unit are being rebuilt in Wabtec’s factory in Erie, PA. Not being done by CSX.
I love Your intros! They're awesome!
Thanks!
There It Is!!! That's The Locomotive I've Been Looking For!!!!
Bottom Line is EMD Engines are still Thee Best Engines ever made and also Good Looking Engines period.
Tier 5? Chevron deference ruling says "Hold my beer"
Hi v12 awesome video good information on locomotive is USA thanks for sharing the information I have been watching your videos for same time now from Australian Queensland . Jason.
Very good 👍 show 😎. You Do a very good job 👏🚂 . Thanks: alan.
Just found your channel.
Very informative.
When he said surprise I just had to run and grab my popcorn great video V12
Thanks!
Thank you for this amazing and informative video!!! 🚅
Thanks for watching!
Now this is totally awesome how some of these locomotive's gets rebuilt or replaced totally awesome 😊
I can remember seeing F7 and Fairbanks Morris running through Rondout Lake County Illinois. Biggest train I have seen had 24 SD-40 and 240 Coal cars test run for train control electronics Chicago & Northwestern main line along US 41 near lake Forest Ill in the Mid 70's
I Love Your Videos
has anyone ever done a cost per mile comparison of a turbine vs a piston engine on trains?
Presumably Union Pacific did, and the answer was "terrible".
Great vidio, lots of good info, just got an et44 for my Yard layout 0 gauge and shes a great runner.Thanks for the morning coffee...
Thanks for watching!
Pretty cool looking locomotive. I’d really like to run one! Cool video. Thanks 👍❤️
I have.
@@alexmarks7275 That’s great. Being a retired locomotive engineer I’ve run lots of locomotives but never one of those.
love your vids
Thank you!
1:07 the K1L13 horn and Ekyrail bell remind me of the VIA Rail F40PH rebuilds
I grew up in Tucker Ga I know Exactly where that's at, I'm not there at night without the 2A and a pit bull.😂
what does the pit carry?...besides pearly whites>>>
I seen both of these engines in Charleston wv in April on my trip
looks fantastic.
Seen those Diesel-electric-electric hybrids in Spain? They’re basically Diesel-electric locos with a pantograph ontop so they can run off overhead electric power when desired & run off the Diesel generator when required, or even put power into the lines, say on long descents, etc. Means a lot more versatility at I assume not that much more cost.
Quite a bit more cost, and you end up as lower power in either diesel or electric mode. Neither diesel nor electric locomotives have enough free space in them to accommodate the equipment of the other.
@@beeble2003 You do know that virtually all diesel locos use their diesel engines to generate electricity to run electric motors. ‘Diesel-electric-electrics’ are also known ‘electric Diesels’. BtW there’s no space issue that can’t be resolved by making the locos a couple of metres longer. Go do a search. It really is as simple as sticking a pantograph unit ontop with the added electric switching & wiring. Yes some are a compromise, but there are ones like the Spanish ones that run like both a full power Diesel-electric loco & a full power electric loco, just with a choice of either. Although some have huge banks of batteries as well, that’s really another type that I wasn’t referring to.
@@mickvonbornemann3824 Thanks, I know how diesel-electric locomotives work. The problem is that you seem to think that an electric locomotive is simply an empty box with a pantograph on the top, traction motors at the bottom and wires between the two, so all that's needed is sticking a diesel engine and generator/alternator in the empty space. They're not empty boxes.
@@beeble2003 i know, but it’s not rocket science, do a search on “electric-diesels”, not all are compromises. There are ones that exist that match the full specs of both full powered electric locos & full powered diesel electrics, & they’re only a few metres longer. Go check out the Spanish ones. They really do make more sense on rail systems that are only electrified in urban areas & greater populated regional areas, leaving most of the country regions unnelectrified. Take Australia, where the big trans continental trains all have to change over to diesel locos about 100 to 300km out from capital cities
It is looking great 😃👍🏼
Saw one up one the Ohio river sub in benwood West Virginia on a test run was a great catch
Beautiful beasts
I maybe old fashioned but EMD is still the best, especially when it's smoking and in notch 8; good report Mr Charlie, you always bring good content.
Emd all day
The GEs always catch fires and they don’t last as long as the EMDs because EMD finds replacement parts and easily rebuild their locomotives while GE rushes newer locomotives out the door
“GE” is a strange way to spell “Alstom”
Ironically, GE Transportation made a lot of money rebuilding EMD locomotives for a while, as did MK, which became Wabtec in a somewhat complicated history before buying the GE Transportation division.
@@JohnGeorgeBauerBuis Dash 8 are gone they got cut up like the Dash7 In 2006
@@williamgreeter1855Dash 8s would and should have been considered for rebuilds. Not many left around anymore.
@williamgreeter1855 CSX has a lot more GE's on their roster than EMD.
Just one thing, I was told the first GEVO was 2004. If I’m wrong, I would love to know about the very first GEVO from 2002.
That makes no sense.
Larger radiators mean either one of 2 things.
Either your going to run the engine at a lower temperature or generate more power.
Running the engine at lower temperature means you loose efficiency but decrease NOx.
Higher temps mean you gain efficiency but increase NOx.
Normally .
However, with new engine designs, being able to get a clean burn at lower temperatures...err compute error....Zzziiittt
Naa, bigger radiators means more power!
Please elaborate on the mechanical &/or thermodynamic reasoning for the need for additional cooling radiators on these modern train engines. Is it for EGR coolers & multi-stage high boost "compound turbocharger" heat exchangers? Are the radiators now stacked on top of DOC/DPF & SCR exhaust aftertreatment packages too? If older engines produced over 1000 horsepower more & were able to have adequate cooling with smaller radiator systems, then what necessitated much larger or higher radiators on newer ones with less power? Thanks for your show!
1713 was hanging atound up here in Massachusetts for awhile
What lights are you using in the darker shots?
We have been using one of these sd23t4s as a bowl job in Radnor for about 2 months already. We call it the Frankenstein
Is it any good?
@@Biker_Gremling loads like a road engine. Shit for yard work. We need motors that load quick and put power down but once it loads up it pulls anything we put on it. But there are a lot of faults that keep popping up. It spends alot of time in the pit
Wow that was Locomotives NS and CSX Trains That Was a Fresh Paint?
My 1st thought was thats the one with the inline 6.....and i was right!!
Your students are paying attention! 😁
At Goodwill just bought a lamp similar to yours seen at 1:45 . HANDLAN AT&SF Ours is *blue* glass. Designates *Do not move* ? Base has a well in which to set an oilamp? Did the oil lamp have a clear glass chimney to keep the colored lens from sooting up? Is the slot for wick height adjustment? Or someone cut for an electricord? (I put in an LED lamp.) Thank you.
Railroad locomotive builders are going to Discord and Reddit to find the most cursed images of freak locomotives and spending thousands of dollars making it a reality.
Has anyone heard of a company trying to recoup the power from the water coolant, eg using the steam to run a piston or propeller?
I still love and miss all the emd units!!!! Just wish they can bring them back. Even the sd 45!!!!
04:01 music to my ears. ❤
You gonna have to explain how more cooling capacity reduces emissions. There is no direct connection. I suspect this straight six has a monumentally large turbocharger and its equally humongous intercooler (fitted between the compressor side of the turbo and the engine. . .) which need more coolant to 'densify' inlet air for more power from such a small displacement motor. Some of the reduced emissions also come from improved engine management (engine computer) just like today's autos.
Or you could research it yourself
@@freedomfan4272 Sure, but if somebody's going to make a video about low-emissions diesel locomotives and claim multiple times that bigger radiators reduce emissions, that claim should be explained in the video itself. It's not just some tangential thing -- it's one of the video's main points.
If your interested rn in Rensselaer ny they are converting p42dc 184 to a NPCU
So the single most important change was going to 4 stroke diesels instead of the 2 stroke EMD diesels, yet very little mention was made of this.
@ 7:46... turbochargers... so in the early days of dieselization, there were some turbocharged locomotives... but it seems that back then they were unreliable... so much so that some roads ordered new locomotives WITHOUT turbos because they were ALWAYS a maintenance headache... question... at what point did turbos stop becoming a maintenance headache and start becoming more reliable???????
Love the 1943 union pacific train of all trains ❤
its a locomotive, not a train.
7:12 That's a Tunnel Motor, popularized after the 1970s when it was discovered during Southern Pacific's time running German engines that exhaust tends to want to backwash in tunnels, significantly reducing the integrity of the frame and carbody each time. To prevent this, engines were either factory-direct with these tunnel motors, or were rebuilt to have them.
Basically, the grates hold fresh air for the engine to use so it doesn't cycle its exhaust and ruin the engine
No it isn't. That's a 2000s era GE locomotive. Tunnel motors were SD40s and SD45s. And I don't think any tunnel motors were rebuilds -- the whole thing would need to be re-engineered as, for example, the SD40T has body over the whole length of the frame.
3:35 what happened to the ditch lights 😂
Should be on, but only actually _required_ if going through a grade crossing at more than 20mph. (Or is it 25?)
Looks like a WDG4 without the front cabin.
Looks top heavy
dang thing has a back porch
3:42 E-Bell sound origin (brass bell with same pitch)