-first the rockers go bad via bearing failure -This causes cam shaft scoring/damage. -That then affects the valve lift duration since the rocker pushes down on the valve stem and in this case causes the valve to burn up from not closing fully. Did I get all that right? Anyways I got a 3.6 pentastar in the shop with a cyl 5 misfire even after a tune up with new coil. Rough idle. Should I skip the injector and just open the valve cover to check the status of the cam/rocker? You said it's rate for cyl 5... does that mean this disaster is never the case for cyl 5 misfire then? I was thinking a cam phaser or even the vvt solenoid might also cause a misfire what do you think is a next good step after the tuneup failed? Thanks
Hey gman I have a 2016 Wrangler Had a tick bank 2. Went in and changed out bad rocker...did the whole bank. Month later got p0302. I've changed everything from pcv coils plugs sensors. Did leak down test on cyl 2 Compression is very low. I dont feel exhaust coming out of tail pipe. But i can hear air releasing out of engine somewhere while doing leak down. Doesnt seem to be coming out of intake ports. No bubbles or air in the radiator either. Have you come across clyinder 2 that may have stuck piston rings or am i grasping at straws? Is my best bet pulling the head off?
Unfortunately, your problem there is gonna be a burnt valve seat. It’s hard to detect, but that’s what it is, always remember a misfire on a PENTASTAR on 2,4,6 is the cylinder head, 1,3,5 it’s usually a coil any other questions feel free to let me know.
My misfire on cylinder 6 is a burnt valve. Pulled plug and Yeap toast. That’s what over 4 years of driving a ticking engine will do to you. Now I’m driving it through the showroom window 😂😂😂😂😂
Hi! Great vid! I have a 2014 durango 3.6 and it had the cel on so I scanned it and said p0301 also rough idke, i replaced all 6 spark plugs cleared the code, idles rough still cel came back but now p0305 and p0300. Any suggestions?? Drives fine under load! Id really appreciate some guidance, i have a rental car company and the car needs to get back on the road on friday :/ thank you so so much for your time and knowledge
@@santiagomercant9206 try the basics first switch the coil to another good cylinder switch the injector afterwards and see if the misfire moves. Let me know.
@@gmanhere.173so i put brand new NGK coils on the 1-3-5 side of the engine (the side that i get codes at) (also plugs) When you start the engine its solid, until it removes the choke and goes into those really low rpms. Then it idles rough like if you had a drag v8 in it. It shakes. No clicks, oil change done 2k miles ago. I got the same cylinder 5 code and now i got one stating idle speed too high or something like that. I haven’t touch the injectors yet. Im willing to keep talking through here but also im down to send you some $ and jump on a call if you prefer or if you dont mind. Scratching my head over this durango right now. Thanks so much for your time
Great info! 2016 Jeep Wrangler Pentastar 94,000 miles. Had to do all rockers/lifters and one cam. Have a misfire cylinder #3 and hoping (like you said) it’s the coil. Should I just change all 3 coils 1,3,5 ?
So there is a tech service bulletin on the 2014-2018 Pentastars for this exact problem. However apparently Mopar/Stellantis wont warranty earlier motors for this. Im going to contact Stellantis about this issue as this is my daily and im not dumping $$$$$ into replacing cylinder heads on this damn thing. Avoid the 3.6L shitter.
2016 Ram 3.6 115,000mi Started seeing a little excess smoke/vapour in exhaust persisting when warm. 2 weeks later, cyl6 misfire; replaced all plugs and coil 6, totally stopped misfire. But now seeing much more white smoke in exhaust. Coolant level not dropping at all. Oil looks clean but level on dipstick is high. Cold start has no smoke in exhaust, only smokes once driving. No codes. Seems to start and run fine. Wondering if it's just injector stuck open and fuel pushing into crank case and burning out through pcv. Or maybe valve seat damage? Booked in to a reputable mechanic in a week from now, and not driving it until fixed. Any input appreciated.
When you do timing chains how do you determine what location to put the camshafts for top dead center. Is top dead center at stage 2 position or stage 1?
The camshafts have holes on them, up 12 o'clock position is tdc, the phaser also has to be positioned with the little dots facing each other for tdc. Hope that helps.
Last week CEL on my 2014 T&C with 134,000 came on. No prior indication of trouble. Did notice idle RPM fluctuations. Dealer said replace Cylinder Head..$3000+. Also had the oil filter housing leak a year ago $900. Purchased Max Care Lifetime Warranty when new. So far $6000 worth of warranty work since 2014. I think there’s a class action lawsuit on this.
No class action on this. The left valve seats always burn due to head casting’s. Yes, oil coolers to this day still leak eventually. The PENTASTAR still ranks as the top v6 available. No one makes a perfect product.
@@gmanhere.173 Bull. GM had the 3000 series V6 motors damn near perfect. Nissan makes their VQ series V6 and they are literally still the best on the market. Pentastar is pretty crap. They should have not put the oil cooler/filter assembly where they did. Its a bad design.
Depending on what model the PENTASTAR is in the most you would have to do is remove the lower metal cover. 5 timing bolt fasteners are located within. Never needed to remove the upper aluminum pan unless doing the oil pump which is another popular thing that goes bad.
@@gmanhere.173 Thanks for the insight. I have a 17 grand cherokee that I'll be replacing both cylinder heads on and Mitchell says to remove upper and lower oil pans to remove timing cover which didn't sound right to me. Either way thanks for the reply 👍
Hi, just seen your vid and I have a 2012 Avenger 3.6l. In the process of removing L head, see there is actual small chucks of aluminum stuck under the edge of #2 cylinder intake valve? Is that anything you have seen before? Just praying it's not piston pieces ugh
@@gmanhere.173 Thank you for responding. First code was p2172 then the #2 cylinder misfire code. Yeah there is chunks of aluminum stuck under intake valve i can see from the top. Also yesterday found that valves rocker are laying down in the oil valley of the head. I'm praying the aluminum pieces stuck between the valve and valve seat is not piston pieces 😮 I'm fairly good with mechanical stuff, but this one got worried lol
@@gmanhere.173 I did find one roller laying in the oil galley of the head, It's like bran new I would quess it fell out of position since there was not tension anymore from the valve being stuck open by the pieces of whatever broke loose in cylinder (piston ring?) I also will check the cam over carefully for sure. Again I thank you for your response and advise one this one!! It's a nice clean car and worth saving, not sure how long it 's going to take and how much $$$ to fix it, I'm kinda of an old guy so I move a bit slower lol I don't understand what could of gone wrong inside the motor, it was well taken care of, no sludge nothing clean inside inside the motor. But things break i guess lol THanks again, and I will update next time I get somemore done.
P0302 misfire code. 2017 Wrangler Sport: changed all plugs, changed fuel injector 2xs, changed coil 2xs, changed cams and rockers, compression tests performed by 2 different mechanics (both passed), leak down test - passed, still have check engine light with same code. Do you think a burnt valve seat is the issue, or could it be an electrical harness issue?
@@ricknoonan9451 bank 1-cylinders 1,3,5-bank 2-cylinder 2,4,6. Valve seats burn because of incorrect coolant jacket casting. Never had an oil consumption problem with a PENTASTAR. I do them all the time.
Hey brother I’ve got a crazy one for you and I’ve worked on shit for thirty years , changed some rockers on a 3.2 in and out job you know that as well as I do but changed these and lost compression on couple cylinders thought ok maybe I fucked up some how did a leak down blowing out of intake tore it down to find nothing guides good no damage so fig take them have machines look at them he cleans valves and seats up to find some carbon in seats he said but did the work put them back on still leaking every where cams out am I missing something because I’ve done a hundred of these no issue
@@russellmckay1655 have the heads checked out or throw a new set on. I just had a pro master with pretty much the same problem. A set of heads took care of it. The cylinder leak down was in conclusive.
Believe it or not the Cylinder Head failure on my 2014 T&C last month just happened again last week! Lifetime Maximum Warranty comes through again. Over $10,000 of warranty work since new.
BUT what causes that issue because my 2018 300 had 58k with a p0306 and it was the bank 2 cylinder 6 does this happen when you use low octane gas like 87 .
-first the rockers go bad via bearing failure
-This causes cam shaft scoring/damage.
-That then affects the valve lift duration since the rocker pushes down on the valve stem and in this case causes the valve to burn up from not closing fully.
Did I get all that right? Anyways I got a 3.6 pentastar in the shop with a cyl 5 misfire even after a tune up with new coil. Rough idle. Should I skip the injector and just open the valve cover to check the status of the cam/rocker? You said it's rate for cyl 5... does that mean this disaster is never the case for cyl 5 misfire then? I was thinking a cam phaser or even the vvt solenoid might also cause a misfire what do you think is a next good step after the tuneup failed? Thanks
Rockers don’t discriminate. Check them all.
You need to open her up and check your valve train, but I’m just a rookie 😂😂😂
Hey gman
I have a 2016 Wrangler
Had a tick bank 2.
Went in and changed out bad rocker...did the whole bank.
Month later got p0302.
I've changed everything from pcv coils plugs sensors.
Did leak down test on cyl 2
Compression is very low. I dont feel exhaust coming out of tail pipe. But i can hear air releasing out of engine somewhere while doing leak down. Doesnt seem to be coming out of intake ports. No bubbles or air in the radiator either.
Have you come across clyinder 2 that may have stuck piston rings or am i grasping at straws?
Is my best bet pulling the head off?
Unfortunately, your problem there is gonna be a burnt valve seat. It’s hard to detect, but that’s what it is, always remember a misfire on a PENTASTAR on 2,4,6 is the cylinder head, 1,3,5 it’s usually a coil any other questions feel free to let me know.
My misfire on cylinder 6 is a burnt valve. Pulled plug and Yeap toast. That’s what over 4 years of driving a ticking engine will do to you. Now I’m driving it through the showroom window 😂😂😂😂😂
Hi! Great vid! I have a 2014 durango 3.6 and it had the cel on so I scanned it and said p0301 also rough idke, i replaced all 6 spark plugs cleared the code, idles rough still cel came back but now p0305 and p0300.
Any suggestions??
Drives fine under load!
Id really appreciate some guidance, i have a rental car company and the car needs to get back on the road on friday :/ thank you so so much for your time and knowledge
@@santiagomercant9206 try the basics first switch the coil to another good cylinder switch the injector afterwards and see if the misfire moves. Let me know.
Thank you so much for the quick reply. I will keep you posted. Ill be home in a few hours and jump right at it
@@santiagomercant9206 not a problem
@@gmanhere.173so i put brand new NGK coils on the 1-3-5 side of the engine (the side that i get codes at) (also plugs)
When you start the engine its solid, until it removes the choke and goes into those really low rpms. Then it idles rough like if you had a drag v8 in it. It shakes.
No clicks, oil change done 2k miles ago. I got the same cylinder 5 code and now i got one stating idle speed too high or something like that.
I haven’t touch the injectors yet.
Im willing to keep talking through here but also im down to send you some $ and jump on a call if you prefer or if you dont mind.
Scratching my head over this durango right now.
Thanks so much for your time
Update: now i just got the cylinder 5 missfire. No other code
Great info! 2016 Jeep Wrangler Pentastar 94,000 miles. Had to do all rockers/lifters and one cam. Have a misfire cylinder #3 and hoping (like you said) it’s the coil. Should I just change all 3 coils 1,3,5 ?
Your call buddy I usually don’t change the coils unless it’s needed.
So there is a tech service bulletin on the 2014-2018 Pentastars for this exact problem. However apparently Mopar/Stellantis wont warranty earlier motors for this. Im going to contact Stellantis about this issue as this is my daily and im not dumping $$$$$ into replacing cylinder heads on this damn thing. Avoid the 3.6L shitter.
2016 Ram 3.6 115,000mi
Started seeing a little excess smoke/vapour in exhaust persisting when warm. 2 weeks later, cyl6 misfire; replaced all plugs and coil 6, totally stopped misfire. But now seeing much more white smoke in exhaust. Coolant level not dropping at all. Oil looks clean but level on dipstick is high. Cold start has no smoke in exhaust, only smokes once driving. No codes. Seems to start and run fine. Wondering if it's just injector stuck open and fuel pushing into crank case and burning out through pcv. Or maybe valve seat damage? Booked in to a reputable mechanic in a week from now, and not driving it until fixed. Any input appreciated.
That’s going to be bank 2 cylinder head. Valve seat is losing its integrity.
Good luck with your reputable mechanic as mine sucks ass
Were is your shop located ?
Dealership. Upstate NY
When you do timing chains how do you determine what location to put the camshafts for top dead center. Is top dead center at stage 2 position or stage 1?
The camshafts have holes on them, up 12 o'clock position is tdc, the phaser also has to be positioned with the little dots facing each other for tdc. Hope that helps.
Last week CEL on my 2014 T&C with 134,000 came on. No prior indication of trouble. Did notice idle RPM fluctuations. Dealer said replace Cylinder Head..$3000+. Also had the oil filter housing leak a year ago $900. Purchased Max Care Lifetime Warranty when new. So far $6000 worth of warranty work since 2014. I think there’s a class action lawsuit on this.
No class action on this. The left valve seats always burn due to head casting’s. Yes, oil coolers to this day still leak eventually. The PENTASTAR still ranks as the top v6 available. No one makes a perfect product.
@@gmanhere.173 Pentastar is a great engine. If you look at comments from engine remanufacturers and owners forums it does have its expensive issues.
@@calbob750 as so does all manufacturers.
@@gmanhere.173 Bull. GM had the 3000 series V6 motors damn near perfect. Nissan makes their VQ series V6 and they are literally still the best on the market. Pentastar is pretty crap. They should have not put the oil cooler/filter assembly where they did. Its a bad design.
@@nissan300ztt I just fix them. I don’t make them.
To pull the timing cover do you have to remove the upper oil pan? Or just the lower?
Depending on what model the PENTASTAR is in the most you would have to do is remove the lower metal cover. 5 timing bolt fasteners are located within. Never needed to remove the upper aluminum pan unless doing the oil pump which is another popular thing that goes bad.
@@gmanhere.173 Thanks for the insight. I have a 17 grand cherokee that I'll be replacing both cylinder heads on and Mitchell says to remove upper and lower oil pans to remove timing cover which didn't sound right to me. Either way thanks for the reply 👍
Hi, just seen your vid and I have a 2012 Avenger 3.6l. In the process of removing L head, see there is actual small chucks of aluminum stuck under the edge of #2 cylinder intake valve? Is that anything you have seen before? Just praying it's not piston pieces ugh
Could be ring lands. Why are you removing the head? Misfire?
@@gmanhere.173 Thank you for responding. First code was p2172 then the #2 cylinder misfire code. Yeah there is chunks of aluminum stuck under intake valve i can see from the top. Also yesterday found that valves rocker are laying down in the oil valley of the head. I'm praying the aluminum pieces stuck between the valve and valve seat is not piston pieces 😮 I'm fairly good with mechanical stuff, but this one got worried lol
@@bryanfuller21 make sure it’s not rocker arm or cam debris. They known for dropping the roller and grinding up the camshaft.
@@gmanhere.173 I did find one roller laying in the oil galley of the head, It's like bran new I would quess it fell out of position since there was not tension anymore from the valve being stuck open by the pieces of whatever broke loose in cylinder (piston ring?) I also will check the cam over carefully for sure. Again I thank you for your response and advise one this one!! It's a nice clean car and worth saving, not sure how long
it 's going to take and how much $$$ to fix it, I'm kinda of an old guy so I move a bit slower lol I don't understand what could of gone wrong inside the motor, it was well taken care of, no sludge nothing clean inside inside the motor. But things break i guess lol THanks again, and I will update next time I get somemore done.
P0302 misfire code. 2017 Wrangler Sport: changed all plugs, changed fuel injector 2xs, changed coil 2xs, changed cams and rockers, compression tests performed by 2 different mechanics (both passed), leak down test - passed, still have check engine light with same code. Do you think a burnt valve seat is the issue, or could it be an electrical harness issue?
Change the head my friend. Almost always 2,4,6 is a head and 1,3,5 is a coil. MOST of the time.
@@gmanhere.173 would a reman head work or "New" head?? What goes bad with the 2,4,6 head??
@@stanghp1 reman or new is fine. Yes, bank 2 head burns the valve seat because of casting problems.
what is the approximate price to do the head replacement?
Warranty time is approximately 9 hours, cash can be in the upscale of double warranty time.
do the valve guide seals go bad a lot on these engines?
@@ricknoonan9451 no.
@@gmanhere.173 it’s rear cylinder passenger side and the plug oil fouls after about 1500 miles
@@ricknoonan9451 bank 1-cylinders 1,3,5-bank 2-cylinder 2,4,6. Valve seats burn because of incorrect coolant jacket casting. Never had an oil consumption problem with a PENTASTAR. I do them all the time.
Hey brother I’ve got a crazy one for you and I’ve worked on shit for thirty years , changed some rockers on a 3.2 in and out job you know that as well as I do but changed these and lost compression on couple cylinders thought ok maybe I fucked up some how did a leak down blowing out of intake tore it down to find nothing guides good no damage so fig take them have machines look at them he cleans valves and seats up to find some carbon in seats he said but did the work put them back on still leaking every where cams out am I missing something because I’ve done a hundred of these no issue
@@russellmckay1655 makes no sense. Double check timing and phaser position , along with rocker arm positioning.
@@gmanhere.173 there’s no phasers or cams bolted on
@@russellmckay1655 have the heads checked out or throw a new set on. I just had a pro master with pretty much the same problem. A set of heads took care of it. The cylinder leak down was in conclusive.
Believe it or not the Cylinder Head failure on my 2014 T&C last month just happened again last week! Lifetime Maximum Warranty comes through again. Over $10,000 of warranty work since new.
Enjoy that max life. They don’t do that anymore. I’ve had plenty of max life vehicles get bought out eventually. It’s inevitable.
BUT what causes that issue because my 2018 300 had 58k with a p0306 and it was the bank 2 cylinder 6 does this happen when you use low octane gas like 87 .
Nothing to do with fuel. Cylinder head casting causing exhaust valve seat burn up. Very common problem with the PENTASTAR.
And how often should I expect this happened
@@wilfredjaime1130 cylinder head replacement? Misfire? Because of the valve seats? Can happen anytime or not.
I think Chrysler said it’s extended warranty of up to 150k
Thanks for the reply 👍appreciated
if you didnt take the engine front cover off would you be able to take cylinder 1 head or riight head off or you Have to take engine cover off.??
There is a dowel. It doesn’t take much more to remove the cover.