Spoiler: I feel like Sister Barnes killing him was an ironic twist. Him using the fake resurrections to trick all those women, then finally he triggered a real resurrection that ended up being his downfall.
I interpreted that whole sequence being a dream sequence, Barnes included. Barnes never resurrected, it wasn’t that she didn’t die either( (I mean while Reed was cutting the contraceptive implant from her arm we know he full on pulled and cut a vein, no she was definitely dead) it was all just a hallucination before death like Barnes said it happens. The film cuts to Barnes hitting Reed literally a second before Reed was going to stab Paxton in the throat. I think he did do it, and everything after that was just a hallucination. It ties back to the conversation they literally just had earlier: prayer doesn’t help the person, but it makes you feel good. Prayer did not save Paxton, did not give her any divine help, but it let her die at peace with herself, and with her faith. She could imagine that Barnes did resurrect to help her, that she does escape the house the same way Barnes suggested earlier in the film (through the window), that she does arrive in an all white place like Barnes said, and that she does fly away like a butterfly.
@@camelliasinensis219 I am always surprised how many people think that Barnes survived miraculously. I guess it is a proof that a lot of people want dearly belief that there is a happy end. Like living after death.
@@camelliasinensis219I dobt rwmember did we see her get a vein pulled and cut? That doesn't kill someone, especially if you apply pressure, its arteries that make soneone bleed out quickly.
I adore what they did with Paxton. I love when there's a character who is underestimated by everyone around them and then shows them up. I also love it when even the audience is led to underestimate them. It is kinda giving Drew Barrymore in Scream but like extended
I love that both girls weren't dumb, just conditioned to be submissive. On multiple occasions towards the first half of the movie, you see the girls think critically about the situation they are in and intuite that they aren't safe. However, they actively act against their own interests because they are people pleasers who are conditioned to trust older men as leaders and protectors. I really enjoyed that both girls were well-read and sceptical of Mr. Reed's arguments, rather than being portrayed as sheltered to the point of stupidity. I feel that it really highlighted how every mistake or missed opportunity was due to how these girls were trained to solve problems. Paxton had the opportunity to stab Mr. Reed before Barnes said magic underwear, but she is obedient and moral. Barnes picked up the letter opener for self-defense, but chose to give the weapon to Paxton despite being more innocent and helpless. If these girls had been trained on self defense or safety, they likely would have survived. But because of the church's teachings, they were never going to make the decisions required to have escaped early. I think a less nuanced version of this movie would have seen the girls lose faith in exchange for survival, which would have undermined the core of the movie being a critique of hierarchical controlling religious dogma, not faith itself.
@@Juliabulia4404I mean, they did try to escape pretty early imo, but it was already too late. I think your comment made something click for me. after watching the movie I left the cinema wishing Paxton would not have said “what?” before Reed said “magic underwear”. I felt it undermined it a bit, like she was confused instead of emboldened. but now I think it does make sense with her character and her upbringing that she would be hesitant to harm another, even in self defense.
As amazing as Hugh Grant was, I think the two actresses who played Sister Barnes and Sister Paxton, Sophie Thatcher and Chloe East deserves the same amount of praise as Grant. Thatcher and East delivered standout performances in due to their ability to bring authenticity and depth to their roles as Mormon missionaries. I think their personal connections to Mormonism were key, both actresses were raised in the faith, which helped them portray the complexities of their characters convincingly. Thatcher, for example, grew up in a family with deep ties to the LDS Church, which she used to shape her character's inner conflict and skepticism. East, on the other hand, leaned on her familiarity with friends who had served as missionaries to add realism and vulnerability to her performance. It helps that the filmmakers decided to avoided stereotypes instead presenting a nuanced exploration of modern Mormonism through their excellent chemistry. I think they are both fantastic 👍
Sophie and Chloe are both excellent here also. Their dynamic immediately draws us to them & we don’t want to see anything awful happen to them. Learning they were both former Mormons kinda blew my mind a bit, but it really lends well to their performances
Both women were excelling Regarding the choice to avoid Mormon stereotypes, it also helps make the girls faith more applicable to other branches of religion. While it does exist, Mormonism isn’t big outside the USA (despite missionary efforts). If their faith was too specifically Mormon, it’s less applicable to, for example, Catholics. They needed to be Mormon for the conceit of two young missionaries knocking on a strangers door. Beyond that, they really only needed to be people of faith.
@@ginao6810 i agree with the lack of stereotypes making it more applicable to other faiths. I dont think ive ever even met a mormon but the discussions about faith felt so familiar to me as a former catholic.
I think that was one to the biggest laughs I had in that movie was the Jar Jar joke. And then the impression came out & I’m going “I don’t think I want to hear this” and laughing my ass off
I really loved this movie as someone raised in the church no longer practicing. It really hit home how many unsafe situations I'd put myself in and was told "God would protect me no matter what" when he certainly didn't always. Hugh Grant was so awesome also, and creepy AF. Such a thought-provoking experience.
I left the church but my mom is still deep in the trenches and she really does think god will fix everything. I desperately need to leave the usa for healthcare reasons and she’s just like “god will make it ok” What’s annoying is it’s all worked out for her so far so I can’t even say she’s wrong
@@AmandaTheJedi An exMo with a channel who had been on a mission said that his "My wife is baking a pie" lie would have worked on her AND said that the Mormon Church REALLY pushes the idea that God will protect the missionaries. She said that someone she knew was told to go into an area where there was a full blown political riot going on by their superior and was only saved from probably being killed because the police blocked him from going into the area, In other words she said the Mormon Church does not care about the safety of their missionaries at all.
@Variocom I don't think it particularly takes sides between religion and non-religion, because it does also point out the predatory practices and amount of harm caused and enabled by either members OF a church or just certain churches as a whole. What it does is take the side of these girls, though. These girls who have done nothing wrong, these girls who were only trying to spread knowledge of the path that helped *them* , these girls who, regardless of your feelings on religion, don't deserve what they're going through. It takes *their* side imo, not the churches.
"freed from his romcom typecast" This is what I've been fearing for a while now. He's got too much Willem Dafoe creepy energy now he can use, and he's spent so long being charming I've been fearing his descent into horror... With antici.......pation.
I grew up Mormon only leaving when I turned 18 and moved away and I absolutely loved this movie. I felt like this was the best depiction of Mormons I’ve ever seen in a movie. I also hope that Sister Paxton survived in the end.
I like to think she does! I feel the ending is that she did indeed live, but was it faith or just luck that got her through. Was it a higher power or just a hollow series of events that got her out. The butterfly landing on her hand at the end when she said that’s what she’d hope to be reincarnated as I believe lends to that, trying to make you think if it was meant to be or not through God
@@michikip45 You do realize the butterfly was probably hinting that she was hallucinating as it "glitched" away, right? Also, if you did not notice, the camera briefly zoomed in on her cell phone showing it has no signal, another hint she's probably hallucinating as she's slowly dying
@ I preferred to believe it flew off, and that phone signal might still be shit right by the house in the middle of the woods (as one who’s lived that way, there’s def dead spots) because I truly prefer to see the ending more positively and that one of the girls made it. If you believe she’s dying though that’s also valid! It’s a ending left for interpretation so it’s not that I didn’t “realize” Mr know it all, I just picked the more positive conclusion :3
@@michikip45 I think it's intentionally left open, given the nature of the film anyway. We're left to "believe" which ending we choose, so maybe you're not wrong. It's just those shots we're intentional. I personally believe she escaped, but died shortly after and the butterfly hallucination was hinting at that. I've seen videos and comments who believe she didn't leave the basement. It's all up to us to choose the ending
@@mcpherson1222 some people class everything anxiety-inducing as horror, and in this case, yeah, definitely horror. This feels more real than Jason vorhees coming at you with a machete.
See, he ACTUALLY compared Anakin to Jesus, but then pointed out how ridiculous it would be for Jar Jar to become a religious figure as one of Anakin's disciples
I watched a former Mormon missionary react to this movie and she said while on her mission she would have definitely walked into this situation similarly to the main characters.
Apparently a number of Church Elders have come out criticizing how unrealistic the movie was regarding mission work, while lots of members (especially women who did missionary work when young) came out and said they had experienced _exactly_ these types of situations (that is, encountering a creep but not having the social tools to escape).
@@paulsillanpaa8268sounds like the movies message was right in more ways than one then…. Women are more agreeable and more likely to just go along with nonsense. He’s a man sure but it was two of them so they felt safer for some reason and felt they’d be in danger if they refused. The men would have smelled the bull and questioned immediately when the wife didn’t show up and him claiming the door would lock.
@@paulsillanpaa8268 Makes sense that the elders would deny any uncomfortable strange situations are ever encountered to not scare off their flock from doing them. I mean they are part of a belief system that both preach “forgive and forget” and the act of shunning any family member who leaves the church. Same with the Catholic Church denying any wrongdoing ever of any priest with little boys despite the torrent of victims.
Really loved this one! I feel similarly to you about where the "true ending" doesn't really matter. It's mostly about belief or disbelief and what it means for you. I really enjoyed ex-Mormon Alyssa Grenfell's video on the film, and she gives more insight about the Mormon community! Edit: About your closing statement: Thank you! I feel like people coming out of this like, "Wow makes you think of how ridiculous and stupid religion is," when the movie's thesis seems to be more about interrogation about what you believe and why, as well as the institutions which promote control over faith.
I also heavily recommend Cinema Therapy Reviews channel on the movie! They give a perspective from active members of the Mormon faith and it's really cool to see their take as well
What’s more interesting is that the film actually fails, and relies HEAVILY on the preconceived ideas of the audience themselves. There is absolutely no way the dead body could have been moved and dropped in a hole with a covered trapped door and another woman take her place without the two women seeing, hearing, or noticing. Literally couldn’t have been done given how the trapped women’s bodies are so unhealthy, meaning they really wouldn’t have had the strength to do it alone let alone without making noise in a room with crazy echo ability. The women are shown to be far to observant to have literally missed such a body swap right over their shoulders. A woman just died…. The fact some woman faked death and then was able to sneak up behind them without making noise is ridiculous on so many levels that entire built up event undermines the entire film😂😂😂 It’s almost like they were pushing the more natural angle of him promoting some kind of ancient demon or evil or something. That would have been the natural progress if we’re being honest. He focuses too heavily on positive religions and never actually goes further into the negative cults and religions. Claiming simple “control” was a waste. Then again the film was walking an extremely fine line by focusing on Mormonism as it’s example religion. The ending truly doesn’t matter because every character is dumb. They are overly indulgent in their own arrogance.
@@vikkidonn Yes, and what bothered me most was this: if reed comes in right after the prophet (the lady who replaced the corpse and loses her finger) and never leaves during his simulation speech, who puts prophet in her cage and locks the bike lock? How does she even get there if the entrance s through the floor and they are all in the same room and mormon girl does not see it. I mean, maybe she locked her cage herself but how could she lock the bike lock after enetering and if she did not lock it, then who did?
@@mingiinimene3335 and WHY are they on the other side of that occultic room??? Almost as if he hints he DID dabble in paganism and the darker belief systems and then just stopped….??? What was that room for if not just another layer of the scam??? Were ALL those women the living member of a two man missionary group??? Were they ALL so inconsistent that they looked past his red flags???? Seemed more like an insult to religious women than the actual religion of Mormonism. He was scary until he wasn’t. Just like both women were interesting and intelligent until they weren’t. And I laughed out loud when that woman popped up from the dead to kill him. Was that also just a joke fake out? Or was THAT an ACTUAL miracle. She was bleeding out too fast and too long to have that much kick in her. Smdh….
When watching this I really felt like religion was a pretext. I felt so reminded of the moments where I had to polite myself out of a room with man. He could have been saying anything, it was more that sudden realization they had of his capacity of violence.
"You could not have paid me enough to go down that whole, but I;m sure glad she did so I can see whats down there!" - Exactly how I feel while watching your videos
Can we all just take a moment and express our gratitude? It took so many years to redefine religious horror in the contemporary world, but this is SO IT!
I am a Christian and I had no intention of watching it, but you have convinced me, so now I am watching it. Thanks, Amanda. I like questioning institutions and I have a relationship with God, but I dislike institutions. Also, I like when things defy my beliefs and I like coming out firmer in my beliefs after it. I think we need to be smart about our faith and relationship with God, recognizing institutions will always be flawed because they're made by people and doctrine needs to be challenged. I love horror too, especially psychological. Thanks, love the channel.
I was raised Catholic but now I define myself as spiritual, because I believe in God but I don't agree with the practices of the church and related institutions. So I definitely understand your view on this!
I loved this movie - I'm a Muslim but I'm also a Unitarian. So when he was on his little "all religions are the same" rant I was like "yes? And?" 😂. I find doubt and questioning is an essential part of faith. If our beliefs can't stand questions from outsiders without falling apart is actually that strong?
Exactly this!!!!! I was raised Catholic, attended Mormon church for years, and consider myself Christian but don't believe in any one institution because churches are run by people and not God. I think the strongest faith is one you build yourself, and for me it's like the thing she said about prayer. I may not believe prayer actually makes things better, but I 100% believe keeping someone in your thoughts is a good thing to do and a reminder that we will all go through troubles but should know that we aren't alone cause others are thinking about us.
I’m glad you feel that way about prayer even though you’re an atheist. It’s weird to me when atheists get bent out of shape about people saying they’ll pray for them or seeing people refer to God or prayer on social media. Like if it’s not personally harming them why not let people take comfort in it?
@@monicarenee7949as a disabled person, who is also atheist, it really comes down to how frequently people inconvenience you with their prayer. Prayer on a personal level is fine, you want to pray for me, go ahead and do so on your own time, but the amount of people who stop you to loudly announce that they want to pray for you, pressure you into a public scene of them praying over you and get outright offended if you refuse so it just makes it easier to comply and then pat themselves on the back for doing a good deed is tedious, feels very disingenuous and condescending and culminates in making the disabled feel alienated being in public spaces since we never know when a stranger is going to tell us they pity our existence and wish to pray us away. That prayer isn’t going to get me better, we have prayer groups for my condition the members decrease following self unaliving announcements more than I got better ones. And still I’ve wasted sometimes upwards of 15 minutes of my life on other people’s prayers over me because I know it’s rude to say no, and I’m in the Bible Belt so I will face verbal condemnation on my character if I do say no, and many Christian have a problem taking no for an answer and being prayed over is better than an attempted exorcism. Prayer isn’t the problem, it’s how it’s done, the tone at which it’s often conveyed, and the implied threat if you don’t accept it.
@@monicarenee7949also, people often use prayer as an excuse to not do anything substantial, they pat themselves on the back for praying as if that was all that could be done. It is frequently used as an excuse to offer nothing of yourself than words.
@@monicarenee7949 well (in the case of saying you will pray for someone) it's also weird to think everyone you come into contact with believes in God or will find value in you praying for them. Without a belief in God, prayer is essentially a non-action. It's doing nothing to tangibly help the situation, other than thinking about someone else with sympathy. I at least don't think that's actually helpful in any way (I feel the same way about 'keeping someone in your thoughts'). That doesn't even take into account the fact that religion is WIDELY known to be a polarizing topic, so assuming someone has identical beliefs to yours and will find comfort in prayer the same way you've found comfort in it is odd to me. In my experience a lot of Christians expect people to accommodate their belief in God, but seem unwilling to empathize with the fact that some people _genuinely_ do not believe in a God, and thus find no personal value in receiving religious actions like prayer that entirely depend on that belief. It's not hurting anyone, but is it really helping anyone, other than the person doing the praying (aka the person who is supposed to be _offering_ help)? When you're trying to support someone, I think having an awareness of the fact that the person your speaking to might _not_ find comfort in the same things you do is better. Actually _asking_ what you can do to help (or admitting your sorry if you genuinely can't) shows more awareness of the situation and _their_ needs than of your own. _You_ may need to pray to find comfort in the situation, and that's fine. But not everyone is you, and doing something tangible if you can will probably help a greater number of people, because it doesn't require a pre-existing belief (or a deference to that belief) to feel like something is actually being done lol. Not every non-religious person feels this way obviously. For some people the effort and good intentions are enough. But for me intentions don't amount to much, and while it doesn't offend me if people tell me they'll pray for me, it also amounts to basically nothing in my eyes. I've also had people who were fully capable of actually tangibly helping me who simply said they would pray for me and kicked their feet up. Lot's of people use prayer as a way to evade actual tangible responsibility, when ironically that doesn't even align with their belief system (Jesus certainly didn't spend all his time _just_ praying). That's not even getting into situations where people use offers of prayer as a way to condescend or alienate the person they're speaking to e.g. prayers for things the person praying sees as a problem but the recipient does not, like a disability, sexual orientation, etc.
@@monicarenee7949 It’s because saying “I’ll pray for you” to a stranger, is basically saying, “You are inferior because you don’t believe what I do, and you must believe what I believe or you will have a pitiful existence.” You aren’t actually going to pray for them. So why say it? No atheist gets upset if someone they know says that they prayed for them, because they actually did pray for them.
I can't believe Mr. Reed said, "when Sister Barnes and Sister Paxton came to a set of two open doors, they entered the door on their left" to see if they would follow the instructions or not!
Seems like the most unrealistic thing about this is that the Elder 1. Wouldn't have come alone and 2. Absolutely wouldn't have known where their appointments were. You call your district leader once a day at night to check in, but you don't tell him what your schedule is the next day. And it's not like you're living together, so you really wouldn't be missed until 9 when you're supposed to check in.
Ex-mormon atheist Alyssa Grenfell has a super interesting video on this film. She interprets Mr. Reed as standing in for religion itself, with the different faces it presents at different levels of initiation.
The way I gasped when Amanda showed that Barnes was killed like I'm sure they all did in the theater. I wouldn't know I will not be seeing this cause I'm a chicken. Thanks for calling me out Amanda 🙏lol
I had high expectations going into this movie after seeing the trailer and I have to say it really lived up to that. I thought the film was excellent and had me gripped the whole way through. I was devastated when he slit Barnes’ throat! It was genuinely shocking! It was actually probably even better than I expected as I thought it would just be a fun horror movie but I loved the message and how it made you think. I’m not religious but I love the bit at the end when Paxton talks about prayer and how it’s just nice to think of others. And I choose to believe she got out in the end because that’s what I want to be true, which is interesting compared with how that’s the opposite of my feeling towards religion. Although I will agree with you that I expected more levels to the house. The trailer had me imaging the house as one big escape room which would have been cool. But great movie and performances overall by everyone involved. 🖤
This was an absolute blast, which I found fascinating for some personal reasons. I'm a 3rd generation atheist, but also grew up in the Bible belt. So I've never had a faith, was raised by faith, but it was always all around me. And this has given me quite the fascination for the topic. This movie engaged with SO MUCH of my own internal debates and observations, even some very specific points. As a teenager, I was of course kind of a petulant dick about by atheism. This was also the 90s, so it wasn't nearly as common a position, but was rising. But over the years I got over the "angry atheist" stuff, and one of my biggest points of relating was from comic books! I've had numerous talks where I speak about how I learned a lot of how to be a good person from reading about Peter Parker, Steve Rogers, and all these other characters. And how from that, I could understand a person reading about Jesus or Buddha or whoever and finding this framework for themselves. And Grant playing the Dawkins/Hitchens school atheist by way of Jigsaw was immaculate because he IS making good points on the surface, but also overplaying his hand routinely. And neither of the girls are some kind of brainrotted idiot, they just have their own perspective on things. Sister Barnes seems the least invested in divinity, but also seems like someone that wants community and so plays along on the surface even though she will make decisions counter to the community's ideals if she feels it appropriate. Sister Paxton seems less rebellious, but her love of comics even early on shows a depth. She's not just this one thing. Could work on being judgy of pornstars, but the fact she even HAS that anecdote feels like a hint at her multiple facets. And there's also something to the early scene with the teenage girls who pants Sister Paxton to help set this tone of how the outside world treats them sometimes which in turn reinforces why they stay in their community.
The biggest mystery to me with this movie, is why did Sister Paxton never put her glasses back on? What happened to them? Where did they go? How was she getting through all this while visually impaired?
He was! I think my favourite scenes of everyone were before the story crosses the Belief door, maybe even the most in the living room. Everyone was great but Chloe East impressed me most of all. She delivered her lines so perfectly for her character, and I think it's the hardest one to play convincingly out of the lot.
It’s interesting to think that they are not fighting back until it’s too late because they still need enough proof, they are questioning whether they are mistaking the signs and not ready to fully commit to their belief that he is a murderous psychopath who won’t let them get out. I think it adds to the movie’s point about faith and the influences of society and others on our decisions and the choices we make. Similarly, the fact that she stabs him right as his says the code word can also be a nod to how easily she is conditioned to follow instructions. Perhaps it was his plan all along? The two sisters made that agreement speaking fairly loudly in the basement before they knew he could hear them down there, so what if he heard it and used it on purpose to show that she was so susceptible to influence that she was ready to kill at the code word no matter who’s mouth it came from?
Never take to heart someone telling you that you’re reading too much into things. Yes, interpretations can be wildly off base, and different from authorial intent, but that just tells you more about the person doing the interpreting. If someone tells you it’s just not that deep, it tells you a whole lot more about them than it does about the work in question. If they instead present their own interpretation that counters yours with textual evidence then their opinion is worth taking into account.
I've seen so many people say the anti-religion arguments were shallow and already well known. But I think it depends on how much time you spent debating or researching religion. In my country, no one really cares about religion that much and my mom and my sister left the cinema discussing points that were totally new to them and they never thought about before. I think Mr. Reeds points were good enough to start questioning the goal of all religion and I think Barnes attempts to challenge him with her own arguments were weak and fell short. Mr. Reed was definitely the villain, but pretty much all he said was objectively true. While the only pro-religious argument I found 'convincing' was Paxtons take on prayers and that was more about faith and humanity than religion, really. Anyway, I loved everyones performances and how Hugh managed to be both charming and terrifying. I loved the humor in it too
Member of the “Watch Amanda review scary movies I’m interest in so I don’t scare myself” club here: I am very glad I didn’t try to watch this one on my own bc those prophets are gonna be a big ass NO from me. From the trailers I would have never expected them and I would have been traumatized 😂😂 I kept seeing ads and was like “oo maybe this is one I could handle” LOL SHE WAS SO WRONG
seriously! I’m a scaredy cat so I kept googling how scary the movie was before I went to see it. everywhere it said “no gore, no jumps cares”, so I thought I was safe, but that was a damned lie! I mean they had multiple throats gushing blood and a guy literally rooting through an arm and pinching a vein! just remembering it makes me nauseous (but I did enjoy it tbh)
Yes I also do the same! I can take thrillers and psychological horror but I can’t take gore and jump scares. My favorite scary movie is The Ring but it didn’t have any jump scares. Movies like this, I wish I could see because they’re so interesting. But I’ll settle for hearing about them on UA-cam
The one thing I thought of after watching it was there was a third option at the beginning, not making a choice at all. If the front door was on a timer, there was also technically the option of just waiting for the door to unlock. He wasn't (at the time) doing anything to physically make them choose.
I wondered that as well but when he answered the door for Topher, he has to lift up the light switch or thermostat to reset a timer. I think it locks after a certain time and only unlocks when you reset it with the wall switch thingy. I could totally be wrong though. 🤷
@@theupwardspiral1580 Just makes me think of something like Cabin in the Woods. If they didn't play with anything in the basement, nothing would have happened, they had to "choose" to transgress.
@@Kurogane72 I think stepping over the threshold was that. Again this is just how I see it and could totally be wrong. I think once they had gone in when the wife wasn't there was acting in faith. If they'd have said okay well no thanks we will come back they'd have been fine. Once they stepped in, I think he was never gonna let em go.
@@Kurogane72 something is stuck in my head though. If one of them has studied the model of the house, would they have been able to get out? Like when they first went in to the study...during the monopoly scenes. Could they have escaped?
It's considered anti-mormon because the elders say that even looking at anything that can make you question is apostasy. Basically don't try to think for yourself.
5:52 im a fiber artist, that's not crochet that's cross stitch! you can especially see the little X's on the "I". the background does look oddly ridged though, not like a typical cross stitch canvas. could be a white pannel of single crochet with the letters and design cross stitched on top, but I cant exactly tell without a higher quality image. maybe we're both right!
lol as a crochet-er it looked more cross stitch to me, like the kind that is from cheap kits with more plastic than fabric so it’s nice and stiff for beginners. But I do not think any part of it was crochet (at least not a form I recognize). Glad I wasn’t the only one catching that during the video!
Nice to see another crafter catch this. It's 100% just a cross stitch, I think the fabric probably looks "oddly ridged" because it's really low count aida fabric so you can really see the holes, I've only really seen it in kits for kid to be used with dk yarn and a plastic needle. The only way I can possibly see it being cross stitch on top of croceht fabric is if they'd used the smallest hook and thread to create the fabric but even then I don't think there's enough texture, it's too smooth to be crochet.
I do think that what we saw happening actually happend, she saw a miracle and escaped, and then although the butterfly wasn't real she believing that it was even for a second was enough to make her move forward
The first 40 minutes were the best for me. The whole chain of events leading to the question by Mr Reed "Do you believe when I open this door I'll find my wife when every incident today has pointed to contrary?" and the segment where he compared multiple religions was exactly what I was hoping. tbh I was hoping for the movie to continue this path and see an the intellectual debate between Belief vs Disbelief. Does anybody know more movies where I can expect this? I saw 'The Man from Earth' couple of years ago (which also touches upon the same concept of an 'original source' of a religion) and have been looking for such movies since
I'm a happy ending lover so I'm going with the first option 😂 I've seen Hugh Grant as a villain a few times but this is a role I have never seen him. And Chloe East has become another Scream Queen in my book!!
I'm so bad with horror movies (because I lucid dream) that sometimes even the recaps give me nightmares. I love horror movie lore though so appreciate Amanda breaking down the movies for us (also found flix is great too). If you watch both channels videos of the same movie its cool seeing their different takes and what they pick up on.
10:29 I can kind of understand that perspective when the two girls are Mormon (which is a sect of Christianity) vs. if they had made them two Jewish or Muslim girls. But I also agree with the fact that he's a villain, so you can't take his words at face value too. Love your videos! ❤
it would have to be a totally different movie if the main characters were jewish, because judaism doesn't actively encourage new converts and therefore doesn't have a tradition of evangelism/mission work. in fact, in my experience jewish people generally love having the kind of "question everything" conversations the hugh grant character is looking for lol - debate isn't taboo the way it is in some christian denominations which valorize total faith and devotion. i can't really speak to the muslim perspective and whether the movie would have worked in that case, just wanted to point out that there are logistical and thematic reasons why christians in general and mormons in specific made good protagonists for this particular film, beyond just "everybody wants to shit on christians."
It's such a fascinating character study. This movie balanced a great line between "faith as an unexplainable ideology" and "faith as an institution" by condemning the latter (i.e.: the ultimate truth being control). A clever move I think the movie pulls off well is the "parlor trickery" of it all. The first half of the film has this mysterious tension building towards a supernatural horror tone (e.g.: is Hugh Grant the devil? Or is he God testing their faith?). But once the movie introduces the "prophet" it snuffed out any suspicions of a greater force at play and it becomes a thriller- two girls are trapped in a lunatics "religion bad" escape room experiment. A good comparison is novel The Magus (John Fowles, 1965) where the protagonist finds himself at the whims of a great magician... or is he just a masterful trickster? This, combined with Sister Barnes' dying words to fight back with intellect calls forth the idea of critically analyzing the world around us. The movie spends its first half building the image of a seemingly powerful man but then carefully dismantles and exposes itself for what it was: A test of faith, but from a higher power.
God and all the criticisims of how religion controls women: first through the polygomy question and how that's used to justify controlling women and then by LITERALLY showing women caged and worshipping him- going so far as to kill themselves (poisoned blueberry pies) to prove his point.
I disagree with you in that this was a terrible film railroaded by the dismissal of the religious element almost all together. “The prophet” being introduced didn’t actually prove it to be trickery. Because of not only the filming but also the sudden lack of awareness of the women it comes across as being some of the MOST supernatural elements. Even the idea of the woman actually dying and her body being swapped was ridiculous straw grasping by the women and actually showed how little their beliefs in the supernatural are. As that theory was put forward it was NEVER actually addressed how those two women were in that room and didn’t hear, see, feel, or notice anything…… the women in the cages were so extremely frail that even a second one entering made no sense. How and from where did she come from?? Was she loose the entire time??? Where was she hiding that they didn’t notice her? How did she move a dead body without noise while also being extremely frail herself? How did she even open the trap door and drop a body in without making a sound? How did neither woman notice such happenings when they were shown actively moving around the space while Hugh grant was walking in and out dealing with the front door? How did the woman recover the trap door AND put herself into position before they saw her in motion? How has this seemingly happened several times over but she didn’t put her head in the correct placement? Where exactly did he walk her to once he ushered her from that room? How does the audience accept the intelligence of the women to notice all these things but somehow accept they were so oblivious to the dead body that they somehow CHOSE to not have any actual survival skills????? That scene took me out the movie as it made the ENTIRE thing a joke. The fact that he even had some occultic chamber deeper in the ground that directly led to the caged women suggests it wasn’t just for show and that he actually dabbles in witch craft to some extent. But….. “control” is the one religion…. Sure
@@vikkidonn You know that just because something in a film might be ludicrous, it doesn’t make it supernatural. The girl’s unawareness of the body switch is what the more forgiving would call a suspension of disbelief, and the more vigilant, what it actually is, a plot contrivance. No different than: - How in most movie’s characters don’t hear an approaching helicopter until it’s right above them. - How stalker killers seem to be omnipresent and always manage to appear everywhere that characters are (including the backseat of locked cars). - How zombies in the woods make no sounds (even walking) until they’ve jump scared a person. - Or how EVERYONE in the FAST/FURIOUS movies survives total car wrecks and that EVERYONE who dies somehow survives. None of it supernatural.
@ I’m not saying it automatically makes it supernatural simply because it should technically speaking. I’m saying it because of the movie and what it’s attempting to do. They promoted the film as supernatural in concept then tried a gotcha that fails in the cannon of the film itself. What I said stands. Not based on suspension of disbelief but because the film wants you to simultaneously view the characters as hyper intelligent and observant while also having you believe they’d be that unaware of their surroundings that the biggest plot device would go unnoticed… entirely unnoticed? While they were actively walking around that area looking at that body multiple times…. And standing in the center listening to things taking place in the study/sanctuary area. But they don’t hear a slow decrepit woman walking around? Yeah that’s the fault of the film. They would have had an easier time just making it supernatural and leaning into that more. That’s my point
When she had the line pointing out that boiling down the choice of belief vs disbelief erases all the other parts of the human experience in the middle I literally said "ok Donnie" out loud in the theater 😂 someone remembered the Lifeline Exercise
The butterfly story comes from an ancient Chinese philosopher Zhuangzi, who wrote the Taoist allegory, The Butterfly's Dream, where a man dreams of being a butterfly, and upon awakening, he isn't sure if he is actually a man who dreamt of being a butterfly, or a butterfly dreaming of being a man. It's interesting in relation to the themes of this movie because it focuses on the difficult in determining what is reality and what is illusion, and what one's identity really means.
Best review and examination of this movie I’ve seen! I went through a handful of channels looking to help wrap up my thoughts on the ending and this one was just 👌. Subscribed 👍
I haven't seen this film, but from your summary I pretty much agree with your closing statement. It's not a film against religion in general, but rather a film against blind followership; saying that true belief should come from genuine thought and convinction, not from being a sheep. Otherwise, you let others dictate what you do rather than your own self.
I grew up in a Catholic household and began questioning the institutions when I was a tween before finally straying away from religion altogether. Quite frankly, I don’t know what I believe. The like to think agnostic because I like the idea of a loving God and Heaven but not like in scriptures. I can appreciate this movie a bit for those like me.
It’s really cool to see how much of the ending people were putting up to interpretation. I thought of everything as literally happening right up until the butterfly lands on Sister Paxton’s hand. So cool to see how others view movies like this one.
I heard a former Mormon mention that while on mission knocking on doors you are so desperate to speak to people (and not get a door slammed in your face) that you'll go along with just about anything. So, it seems that thats probably the main reason why the sisters just waltz into Reed's home. This same former Mormon mentioned herself and others being put into a lot of sketch/dangerous situations while on mission as well (mostly because the Mormon church doesn't do a whole lot to deter bad things from happening. There's a lot of "leave it in God's hands" going on). Oh! And she also mentioned how they are taught to be VERY perceptive of their surroundings, especially inside a possible converts home (not for safety but more for getting to know the person they're talking with), so the fact that Paxton is pretty perceptive to things is something that is taught by the church. One little gripe I had was with the birth control implant because they really didn't do their research on that one. I've had the arm implant off and on for 10 years now and one: it doesn't leave a scar like that and two: it's not metal. The implant is essentially hard plastic and when its inserted it is punched into and under the skin so it leaves a small round scar. Even when it's removed (and a new one is possibly reinserted) they make the smallest possible incision that doesn't go long ways like shown in the film. When they focused on the scar in the film I thought BC for a second but dismissed it because the scar didn't match at all.
For anyone who wants an (ex) Mormon's perspective on the film, please check out Alyssa Grenfell's review! It's super enlightening and she delves more into specific religious aspects, beliefs, symbolism, etc.
Ms. Jedi, you're one of he only reviewers I've ever seen who can actually get me hyped for a film, even ones I might not have been thinking about seeing. Love it.
I havent seen this movie yet but dang, as someone who’s really in to religious studies and their similarities I feel like this is very up my alley!! Always love a good horror mixed with religion, usually it’s Catholic or Christian things, so the Mormon missionaries is a very cool change already
Made it to 1:58 and I have to stop already because I NEED to see this movie before I watch this. I'll be back eventually. Gonna watch a different one from Amanda for now.
Re: the ending. I don't think enough time has passed for it to be already morning when she escaped. It seemed like they arrived there before dusk and following the story, it doesn't seem like they were there for more than even 8 hours
As an ex mormon I actually found it hard to listen to my mormon friends and family bash this film without even having seen it. I understand the distrust many of them have towards films like these but I don't really see it as anti-mormon. It's not pro-mormon either but it clearly is only approaching every topic how real mormons and outsiders do, it feels like an honest exploration. I actually quite like how even in the end when after belief has been so highly debated prayer still takes place and is seen as a good thing, if anything the story has a positive message for belief, just a negative one against blind following, a problem in a lot of churches, not just the LDS church
To be fair, as a former LDS missionary myself, the facts that Sister Paxton doesn't have any baptisms and her scriptures aren't as marked up are just a sign to me that she's fairly new to the mission. Sister Barnes is probably closer to the end of it. Missionaries are required to have over an hour of dedicated scripture study every day, so basically everyone's scriptures are marked up by the end of it. But it's very common to start the mission with a fresh new set of scriptures, so they get marked up slowly over time.
Me and my mom went to see this I was a little worried about it only because we are both church goers her more than I and I was worried she would find it sacrilegious. But we both came out loving it I didn’t think it was ever fully against one side it wanted you to make up your own mind and I do feel like anyone can have a different experience. We now are trying to get my nana to watch it
I get this movie’s message so much. Personal religion isn’t easy to share with others, and many people do seem to just believe what they’re told. However, that also applies to almost everything, not just religion.
6:06 As a note, this is because the “Mormon Healthcode”, (where they don’t drink alcohol, smoke, or drink coffee), it doesn’t say no caffeine. But some older generations see Caffeine as a sort of drug, and only take it if they need to. It became a little bit of a cultural thing. Reinforced by things like Church-school campuses not serving any caffeine. But since then, it’s been shown as not part of the Healthcode, culturally. BYU now serves caffeine. More and more people see it as fine, and not letter of the law. And others are careful about it, but not white and black. But I get that it was probably a test.
As a practicing Catholic, I agree with Amanda, I love seeing movies that are well done, and question religion and faith because I dont believe in blindly following a religion anyways Anyways, a great watch as always👍
Ngl. I do like watching your reviews cause watching horror with cptsd is super difficult sometimes and you're a fantastic resource for me to find out if theres anything triggering I should either avoid the movie for it being just a bit to much or if I could probably handle it so long as I keep in mind that the triggering things are there and mentally prep myself for it.
Also no matter what. If I step inside even my best friends house and he tells me he has metal ALL UP IN HIS WALLS out of nowhere, there is no force strong enough to stop me from bolting out of that house immediately because theres just no other reason to have metal ALL UP IN YOUR WALLS OF YOUR LIVING SPACE unless youre into some serial killer nonsense.
I took the ending as that she lived. her seeing the butterfly was her choosing to still believe in religion. Also them making it disappear was the film making a statement that it isn’t real.
I actually really enjoyed this movie. I’m not a religious person so hearing the characters’ in-depth discussions was fascinating to me. I also had a good theater experience with it; there were only three of us there and we ended up discussing it as we left together, mainly theorizing on the ending. It was great!
Loved it, it was so much fun. I was lucky enough to watch it on a whim without any prior knowledge (not even the trailer) and enjoyed every minutes. I have pretty much the same read on the movie as you did, so no notes on that. (can't believe the movie made me hope the priest would save the day, really fell for that one)
I can't believe that Sister Barnes would've been alive to attack him again, so I think that Sister Paxton likely died when he stabbed her. The whole butterfly scene is beautiful but gives "The Giver" sled scene vibes, and I interpret both scenes as the characters being dead. Edit: I think this is also why/how Sister Paxton initially returns to the dungeon room after first "escaping" him instead of ending up somewhere else (new). She has to return to that familiar place in her brain before she can imagine a way out.
Yes, it’s even possible that she never went up the stairs or even not down to the second level of the basement. What if he stabbed her even earlier on and she imagined all of the rest? Like how sure she was from that point on in her analysis and interpretation seems curious.
I saw the trailer but, as people were saying - did not look into it ay further. And it did not disappoint. I really like the ambiguity of it all, and like you said, people can take from this movie what they want. I saw it as an entertaining discussion of religion as a while, with some horror tossed in. Way funnier than I was expecting, great performances all around.
Cross stitch. It's a cross stitch. I know, the crochet crowd is very annoying about this, but still. That is "bless this mess" depicted using counted cross stitch embroidery. Not a single crochet hook to be found.
@@madbyinstinct To clarify, no offense meant toward @AmandaTheJedi. I get that fiber arts can be easily confused. I'm sorry that my comment was so abrupt and, on reread, totally rude. Not as an excuse, but as an explanation: As a long-time crochet nerd often surrounded by knitters I just have that knee-jerk reaction to people misidentifying crafts. Respect for the under dog fiber crafts! Cross stitch is also cool!
There is an old movie with Hugh Grant as an asshole called “An Awfully Big Adventure”. I’ve always preferred Hugh Grant as an antagonist. As a note, if anyone watches the movie - I usually see summaries describe it as “comedy” or “coming of age”. Both are inaccurate descriptions. The main character is a young teenage girl who is figuring out how to be a human being in a wrecked London after WWII. It’s a good movie and there are funny moments, but it is NOT a comedy and it’s more about how tragedy/trauma stunts and/or traps people, rather than a vaguely triumphant movie about someone learning how to be an adult.
I really enjoyed this movie as someone that was raised in a very similar religion. Ever since I saw the trailer with them preaching I was invested bc the fear of someone doing something to you while you are in the ministry is sooo real. I will say, as a side note, that this movie was pretty rough at points as someone with a low tolerance for gore, though. I'm happy that I watched it but i was very close to fainting lmao.
"And then, generations later, we got Anakin Skywalker, amen."
Quite a sigma level quote
Are you Mormon? you seem well versed
The chosen one by immaculate conception ❤lmao
Did you have a cup of coffee today?
@@AmandaTheJedi pray to Anakin for some snow day this year lol
Spoiler: I feel like Sister Barnes killing him was an ironic twist. Him using the fake resurrections to trick all those women, then finally he triggered a real resurrection that ended up being his downfall.
I interpreted that whole sequence being a dream sequence, Barnes included. Barnes never resurrected, it wasn’t that she didn’t die either( (I mean while Reed was cutting the contraceptive implant from her arm we know he full on pulled and cut a vein, no she was definitely dead) it was all just a hallucination before death like Barnes said it happens. The film cuts to Barnes hitting Reed literally a second before Reed was going to stab Paxton in the throat. I think he did do it, and everything after that was just a hallucination. It ties back to the conversation they literally just had earlier: prayer doesn’t help the person, but it makes you feel good. Prayer did not save Paxton, did not give her any divine help, but it let her die at peace with herself, and with her faith. She could imagine that Barnes did resurrect to help her, that she does escape the house the same way Barnes suggested earlier in the film (through the window), that she does arrive in an all white place like Barnes said, and that she does fly away like a butterfly.
@@camelliasinensis219 I am always surprised how many people think that Barnes survived miraculously. I guess it is a proof that a lot of people want dearly belief that there is a happy end. Like living after death.
I was going to say, that's if you believe Paxton escaped.
@@camelliasinensis219I dobt rwmember did we see her get a vein pulled and cut? That doesn't kill someone, especially if you apply pressure, its arteries that make soneone bleed out quickly.
@@camelliasinensis219 im in love with you
this movie answers the age old question: “what if jigsaw was a reddit atheist”
idk why the word atheist is being thrown around so much with this movie.
lol Dead Meat made that joke in their podcast on it. Makes me chuckle every time
Nothing scarier than having 2 Mormons in your house is a joke I saw in the comments. Nah 2 redditors is far worse
Good god you ain't wrong.
What if jigsaw was a manosphere pick-up artist?
I adore what they did with Paxton. I love when there's a character who is underestimated by everyone around them and then shows them up. I also love it when even the audience is led to underestimate them. It is kinda giving Drew Barrymore in Scream but like extended
I love that both girls weren't dumb, just conditioned to be submissive. On multiple occasions towards the first half of the movie, you see the girls think critically about the situation they are in and intuite that they aren't safe. However, they actively act against their own interests because they are people pleasers who are conditioned to trust older men as leaders and protectors. I really enjoyed that both girls were well-read and sceptical of Mr. Reed's arguments, rather than being portrayed as sheltered to the point of stupidity. I feel that it really highlighted how every mistake or missed opportunity was due to how these girls were trained to solve problems. Paxton had the opportunity to stab Mr. Reed before Barnes said magic underwear, but she is obedient and moral. Barnes picked up the letter opener for self-defense, but chose to give the weapon to Paxton despite being more innocent and helpless. If these girls had been trained on self defense or safety, they likely would have survived. But because of the church's teachings, they were never going to make the decisions required to have escaped early. I think a less nuanced version of this movie would have seen the girls lose faith in exchange for survival, which would have undermined the core of the movie being a critique of hierarchical controlling religious dogma, not faith itself.
I literally smiled when she began putting it all together, despite what had just happened in the scene 😅, but I loved how they did that
@@Juliabulia4404I mean, they did try to escape pretty early imo, but it was already too late.
I think your comment made something click for me. after watching the movie I left the cinema wishing Paxton would not have said “what?” before Reed said “magic underwear”. I felt it undermined it a bit, like she was confused instead of emboldened. but now I think it does make sense with her character and her upbringing that she would be hesitant to harm another, even in self defense.
As amazing as Hugh Grant was, I think the two actresses who played Sister Barnes and Sister Paxton, Sophie Thatcher and Chloe East deserves the same amount of praise as Grant. Thatcher and East delivered standout performances in due to their ability to bring authenticity and depth to their roles as Mormon missionaries. I think their personal connections to Mormonism were key, both actresses were raised in the faith, which helped them portray the complexities of their characters convincingly. Thatcher, for example, grew up in a family with deep ties to the LDS Church, which she used to shape her character's inner conflict and skepticism. East, on the other hand, leaned on her familiarity with friends who had served as missionaries to add realism and vulnerability to her performance. It helps that the filmmakers decided to avoided stereotypes instead presenting a nuanced exploration of modern Mormonism through their excellent chemistry. I think they are both fantastic 👍
That's some cool info, thanks for sharing!
Sophie and Chloe are both excellent here also. Their dynamic immediately draws us to them & we don’t want to see anything awful happen to them. Learning they were both former Mormons kinda blew my mind a bit, but it really lends well to their performances
Both women were excelling
Regarding the choice to avoid Mormon stereotypes, it also helps make the girls faith more applicable to other branches of religion.
While it does exist, Mormonism isn’t big outside the USA (despite missionary efforts). If their faith was too specifically Mormon, it’s less applicable to, for example, Catholics.
They needed to be Mormon for the conceit of two young missionaries knocking on a strangers door. Beyond that, they really only needed to be people of faith.
@@ginao6810 i agree with the lack of stereotypes making it more applicable to other faiths. I dont think ive ever even met a mormon but the discussions about faith felt so familiar to me as a former catholic.
Bold of him to assume that Amanda the JEDI doesn't already see Jar Jar as an allpowefull god
Darth Jar Jar
I think that was one to the biggest laughs I had in that movie was the Jar Jar joke. And then the impression came out & I’m going “I don’t think I want to hear this” and laughing my ass off
I really loved this movie as someone raised in the church no longer practicing. It really hit home how many unsafe situations I'd put myself in and was told "God would protect me no matter what" when he certainly didn't always. Hugh Grant was so awesome also, and creepy AF. Such a thought-provoking experience.
Definitely should have touched on the confidence in their belief making them think they'd be safe because God is with them
I left the church but my mom is still deep in the trenches and she really does think god will fix everything. I desperately need to leave the usa for healthcare reasons and she’s just like “god will make it ok”
What’s annoying is it’s all worked out for her so far so I can’t even say she’s wrong
@@AmandaTheJedi An exMo with a channel who had been on a mission said that his "My wife is baking a pie" lie would have worked on her AND said that the Mormon Church REALLY pushes the idea that God will protect the missionaries. She said that someone she knew was told to go into an area where there was a full blown political riot going on by their superior and was only saved from probably being killed because the police blocked him from going into the area, In other words she said the Mormon Church does not care about the safety of their missionaries at all.
Yeah idk how people can see this as an anti-religion movie. It definitely takes the side of the church in the last 10 min.
@Variocom I don't think it particularly takes sides between religion and non-religion, because it does also point out the predatory practices and amount of harm caused and enabled by either members OF a church or just certain churches as a whole. What it does is take the side of these girls, though. These girls who have done nothing wrong, these girls who were only trying to spread knowledge of the path that helped *them* , these girls who, regardless of your feelings on religion, don't deserve what they're going through. It takes *their* side imo, not the churches.
"freed from his romcom typecast"
This is what I've been fearing for a while now. He's got too much Willem Dafoe creepy energy now he can use, and he's spent so long being charming I've been fearing his descent into horror... With antici.......pation.
I grew up Mormon only leaving when I turned 18 and moved away and I absolutely loved this movie. I felt like this was the best depiction of Mormons I’ve ever seen in a movie. I also hope that Sister Paxton survived in the end.
I like to think she does! I feel the ending is that she did indeed live, but was it faith or just luck that got her through. Was it a higher power or just a hollow series of events that got her out. The butterfly landing on her hand at the end when she said that’s what she’d hope to be reincarnated as I believe lends to that, trying to make you think if it was meant to be or not through God
@@michikip45 You do realize the butterfly was probably hinting that she was hallucinating as it "glitched" away, right? Also, if you did not notice, the camera briefly zoomed in on her cell phone showing it has no signal, another hint she's probably hallucinating as she's slowly dying
@ I preferred to believe it flew off, and that phone signal might still be shit right by the house in the middle of the woods (as one who’s lived that way, there’s def dead spots) because I truly prefer to see the ending more positively and that one of the girls made it.
If you believe she’s dying though that’s also valid! It’s a ending left for interpretation so it’s not that I didn’t “realize” Mr know it all, I just picked the more positive conclusion :3
@ I mean.. even Amanda said she chooses to believe that, as OP so I guess either none of us realized that or you know, different interpretations 👌🏻
@@michikip45 I think it's intentionally left open, given the nature of the film anyway. We're left to "believe" which ending we choose, so maybe you're not wrong. It's just those shots we're intentional. I personally believe she escaped, but died shortly after and the butterfly hallucination was hinting at that. I've seen videos and comments who believe she didn't leave the basement. It's all up to us to choose the ending
Do I watch horror movies? No
Will I ever watch horror movies? No
Do I watch every video? Yes
Living vicariously through this channel
I wouldn’t necessarily call this a horror, but rather a psychological thriller.
If you don't like horror for gore or jumpscares, this one doesn't have those (maybe one or two lol). It's just more psychologically suspenseful
@@mcpherson1222oh big difference.. yall so annoying
@@mcpherson1222 some people class everything anxiety-inducing as horror, and in this case, yeah, definitely horror. This feels more real than Jason vorhees coming at you with a machete.
When will you wear wigs!
I did not know that Topher was short for Christopher. It's beautiful to see people utilizing all of the name.
Just saw a letterboxd review saying _Hugh Grant really compared ja ja binks to jesus_ 5 minutes ago
See, he ACTUALLY compared Anakin to Jesus, but then pointed out how ridiculous it would be for Jar Jar to become a religious figure as one of Anakin's disciples
@AmandaTheJedi I will forward that message for you
I watched a former Mormon missionary react to this movie and she said while on her mission she would have definitely walked into this situation similarly to the main characters.
Apparently a number of Church Elders have come out criticizing how unrealistic the movie was regarding mission work, while lots of members (especially women who did missionary work when young) came out and said they had experienced _exactly_ these types of situations (that is, encountering a creep but not having the social tools to escape).
@@paulsillanpaa8268sounds like the movies message was right in more ways than one then…. Women are more agreeable and more likely to just go along with nonsense. He’s a man sure but it was two of them so they felt safer for some reason and felt they’d be in danger if they refused.
The men would have smelled the bull and questioned immediately when the wife didn’t show up and him claiming the door would lock.
@@paulsillanpaa8268 Makes sense that the elders would deny any uncomfortable strange situations are ever encountered to not scare off their flock from doing them. I mean they are part of a belief system that both preach “forgive and forget” and the act of shunning any family member who leaves the church.
Same with the Catholic Church denying any wrongdoing ever of any priest with little boys despite the torrent of victims.
Alyssa Grenfell?
@gwynethdolen3275 I think so
“With great power comes great responsibility”
“Spider Man”
“… Voltaire”
💀 that was hilarious
Dont forget:
"The only way out is through."
Frost?
Swamp thing
it's also not true. voltaire never said that.
it was, but it's not a confirmed voltaire quote, which I think is even funnier
The reversal with Swamp-Thing at the was pretty fun too!
Really loved this one!
I feel similarly to you about where the "true ending" doesn't really matter. It's mostly about belief or disbelief and what it means for you.
I really enjoyed ex-Mormon Alyssa Grenfell's video on the film, and she gives more insight about the Mormon community!
Edit: About your closing statement: Thank you! I feel like people coming out of this like, "Wow makes you think of how ridiculous and stupid religion is," when the movie's thesis seems to be more about interrogation about what you believe and why, as well as the institutions which promote control over faith.
Yes my friend just sent her video my way! I knew there'd be a lot of great ex-mo videos on it
I also heavily recommend Cinema Therapy Reviews channel on the movie! They give a perspective from active members of the Mormon faith and it's really cool to see their take as well
What’s more interesting is that the film actually fails, and relies HEAVILY on the preconceived ideas of the audience themselves. There is absolutely no way the dead body could have been moved and dropped in a hole with a covered trapped door and another woman take her place without the two women seeing, hearing, or noticing. Literally couldn’t have been done given how the trapped women’s bodies are so unhealthy, meaning they really wouldn’t have had the strength to do it alone let alone without making noise in a room with crazy echo ability.
The women are shown to be far to observant to have literally missed such a body swap right over their shoulders. A woman just died…. The fact some woman faked death and then was able to sneak up behind them without making noise is ridiculous on so many levels that entire built up event undermines the entire film😂😂😂
It’s almost like they were pushing the more natural angle of him promoting some kind of ancient demon or evil or something. That would have been the natural progress if we’re being honest. He focuses too heavily on positive religions and never actually goes further into the negative cults and religions. Claiming simple “control” was a waste.
Then again the film was walking an extremely fine line by focusing on Mormonism as it’s example religion.
The ending truly doesn’t matter because every character is dumb. They are overly indulgent in their own arrogance.
@@vikkidonn Yes, and what bothered me most was this: if reed comes in right after the prophet (the lady who replaced the corpse and loses her finger) and never leaves during his simulation speech, who puts prophet in her cage and locks the bike lock? How does she even get there if the entrance s through the floor and they are all in the same room and mormon girl does not see it. I mean, maybe she locked her cage herself but how could she lock the bike lock after enetering and if she did not lock it, then who did?
@@mingiinimene3335 and WHY are they on the other side of that occultic room??? Almost as if he hints he DID dabble in paganism and the darker belief systems and then just stopped….??? What was that room for if not just another layer of the scam??? Were ALL those women the living member of a two man missionary group??? Were they ALL so inconsistent that they looked past his red flags???? Seemed more like an insult to religious women than the actual religion of Mormonism.
He was scary until he wasn’t. Just like both women were interesting and intelligent until they weren’t. And I laughed out loud when that woman popped up from the dead to kill him. Was that also just a joke fake out? Or was THAT an ACTUAL miracle. She was bleeding out too fast and too long to have that much kick in her. Smdh….
When watching this I really felt like religion was a pretext. I felt so reminded of the moments where I had to polite myself out of a room with man. He could have been saying anything, it was more that sudden realization they had of his capacity of violence.
Polite yourself is so real. Men are problematic
"You could not have paid me enough to go down that whole, but I;m sure glad she did so I can see whats down there!" - Exactly how I feel while watching your videos
Oh man, I would LOVE to see a Yellowjackets vid from Amanda - anyone else?!
Yesssss
Yes!
yes please!!!!!!
13:17 "Look, I'm not saying I'd survive an abduction. But if I die it's because I tried to murder them first!" Truth.
I loved how Hugh used his rom-com goofy faces in this movie. That was super creepy.
Can we all just take a moment and express our gratitude? It took so many years to redefine religious horror in the contemporary world, but this is SO IT!
I am a Christian and I had no intention of watching it, but you have convinced me, so now I am watching it. Thanks, Amanda. I like questioning institutions and I have a relationship with God, but I dislike institutions. Also, I like when things defy my beliefs and I like coming out firmer in my beliefs after it. I think we need to be smart about our faith and relationship with God, recognizing institutions will always be flawed because they're made by people and doctrine needs to be challenged. I love horror too, especially psychological. Thanks, love the channel.
I was raised Catholic but now I define myself as spiritual, because I believe in God but I don't agree with the practices of the church and related institutions. So I definitely understand your view on this!
I loved this movie - I'm a Muslim but I'm also a Unitarian. So when he was on his little "all religions are the same" rant I was like "yes? And?" 😂. I find doubt and questioning is an essential part of faith. If our beliefs can't stand questions from outsiders without falling apart is actually that strong?
Exactly this!!!!! I was raised Catholic, attended Mormon church for years, and consider myself Christian but don't believe in any one institution because churches are run by people and not God. I think the strongest faith is one you build yourself, and for me it's like the thing she said about prayer. I may not believe prayer actually makes things better, but I 100% believe keeping someone in your thoughts is a good thing to do and a reminder that we will all go through troubles but should know that we aren't alone cause others are thinking about us.
So true!
My views exactly
As an atheist I loved the movie. Especially loved what she said about prayer. That it's a way of people to keep you in their thoughts
I’m glad you feel that way about prayer even though you’re an atheist. It’s weird to me when atheists get bent out of shape about people saying they’ll pray for them or seeing people refer to God or prayer on social media. Like if it’s not personally harming them why not let people take comfort in it?
@@monicarenee7949as a disabled person, who is also atheist, it really comes down to how frequently people inconvenience you with their prayer. Prayer on a personal level is fine, you want to pray for me, go ahead and do so on your own time, but the amount of people who stop you to loudly announce that they want to pray for you, pressure you into a public scene of them praying over you and get outright offended if you refuse so it just makes it easier to comply and then pat themselves on the back for doing a good deed is tedious, feels very disingenuous and condescending and culminates in making the disabled feel alienated being in public spaces since we never know when a stranger is going to tell us they pity our existence and wish to pray us away. That prayer isn’t going to get me better, we have prayer groups for my condition the members decrease following self unaliving announcements more than I got better ones. And still I’ve wasted sometimes upwards of 15 minutes of my life on other people’s prayers over me because I know it’s rude to say no, and I’m in the Bible Belt so I will face verbal condemnation on my character if I do say no, and many Christian have a problem taking no for an answer and being prayed over is better than an attempted exorcism. Prayer isn’t the problem, it’s how it’s done, the tone at which it’s often conveyed, and the implied threat if you don’t accept it.
@@monicarenee7949also, people often use prayer as an excuse to not do anything substantial, they pat themselves on the back for praying as if that was all that could be done. It is frequently used as an excuse to offer nothing of yourself than words.
@@monicarenee7949 well (in the case of saying you will pray for someone) it's also weird to think everyone you come into contact with believes in God or will find value in you praying for them. Without a belief in God, prayer is essentially a non-action. It's doing nothing to tangibly help the situation, other than thinking about someone else with sympathy. I at least don't think that's actually helpful in any way (I feel the same way about 'keeping someone in your thoughts'). That doesn't even take into account the fact that religion is WIDELY known to be a polarizing topic, so assuming someone has identical beliefs to yours and will find comfort in prayer the same way you've found comfort in it is odd to me. In my experience a lot of Christians expect people to accommodate their belief in God, but seem unwilling to empathize with the fact that some people _genuinely_ do not believe in a God, and thus find no personal value in receiving religious actions like prayer that entirely depend on that belief. It's not hurting anyone, but is it really helping anyone, other than the person doing the praying (aka the person who is supposed to be _offering_ help)?
When you're trying to support someone, I think having an awareness of the fact that the person your speaking to might _not_ find comfort in the same things you do is better. Actually _asking_ what you can do to help (or admitting your sorry if you genuinely can't) shows more awareness of the situation and _their_ needs than of your own. _You_ may need to pray to find comfort in the situation, and that's fine. But not everyone is you, and doing something tangible if you can will probably help a greater number of people, because it doesn't require a pre-existing belief (or a deference to that belief) to feel like something is actually being done lol.
Not every non-religious person feels this way obviously. For some people the effort and good intentions are enough. But for me intentions don't amount to much, and while it doesn't offend me if people tell me they'll pray for me, it also amounts to basically nothing in my eyes. I've also had people who were fully capable of actually tangibly helping me who simply said they would pray for me and kicked their feet up. Lot's of people use prayer as a way to evade actual tangible responsibility, when ironically that doesn't even align with their belief system (Jesus certainly didn't spend all his time _just_ praying). That's not even getting into situations where people use offers of prayer as a way to condescend or alienate the person they're speaking to e.g. prayers for things the person praying sees as a problem but the recipient does not, like a disability, sexual orientation, etc.
@@monicarenee7949
It’s because saying “I’ll pray for you” to a stranger, is basically saying, “You are inferior because you don’t believe what I do, and you must believe what I believe or you will have a pitiful existence.” You aren’t actually going to pray for them. So why say it? No atheist gets upset if someone they know says that they prayed for them, because they actually did pray for them.
I can't believe Mr. Reed said, "when Sister Barnes and Sister Paxton came to a set of two open doors, they entered the door on their left" to see if they would follow the instructions or not!
Was that a Stanley Parable reference?
The broom closet ending is my favourite!
@@dread46 As your friend, I find that concerning.
Seems like the most unrealistic thing about this is that the Elder
1. Wouldn't have come alone and
2. Absolutely wouldn't have known where their appointments were. You call your district leader once a day at night to check in, but you don't tell him what your schedule is the next day. And it's not like you're living together, so you really wouldn't be missed until 9 when you're supposed to check in.
Ex-mormon atheist Alyssa Grenfell has a super interesting video on this film. She interprets Mr. Reed as standing in for religion itself, with the different faces it presents at different levels of initiation.
The way I gasped when Amanda showed that Barnes was killed like I'm sure they all did in the theater. I wouldn't know I will not be seeing this cause I'm a chicken. Thanks for calling me out Amanda 🙏lol
She was still twitching so I knew she was still alive, a bit.
I had high expectations going into this movie after seeing the trailer and I have to say it really lived up to that. I thought the film was excellent and had me gripped the whole way through. I was devastated when he slit Barnes’ throat! It was genuinely shocking! It was actually probably even better than I expected as I thought it would just be a fun horror movie but I loved the message and how it made you think. I’m not religious but I love the bit at the end when Paxton talks about prayer and how it’s just nice to think of others. And I choose to believe she got out in the end because that’s what I want to be true, which is interesting compared with how that’s the opposite of my feeling towards religion. Although I will agree with you that I expected more levels to the house. The trailer had me imaging the house as one big escape room which would have been cool. But great movie and performances overall by everyone involved. 🖤
This was an absolute blast, which I found fascinating for some personal reasons. I'm a 3rd generation atheist, but also grew up in the Bible belt. So I've never had a faith, was raised by faith, but it was always all around me. And this has given me quite the fascination for the topic. This movie engaged with SO MUCH of my own internal debates and observations, even some very specific points.
As a teenager, I was of course kind of a petulant dick about by atheism. This was also the 90s, so it wasn't nearly as common a position, but was rising. But over the years I got over the "angry atheist" stuff, and one of my biggest points of relating was from comic books! I've had numerous talks where I speak about how I learned a lot of how to be a good person from reading about Peter Parker, Steve Rogers, and all these other characters. And how from that, I could understand a person reading about Jesus or Buddha or whoever and finding this framework for themselves.
And Grant playing the Dawkins/Hitchens school atheist by way of Jigsaw was immaculate because he IS making good points on the surface, but also overplaying his hand routinely. And neither of the girls are some kind of brainrotted idiot, they just have their own perspective on things. Sister Barnes seems the least invested in divinity, but also seems like someone that wants community and so plays along on the surface even though she will make decisions counter to the community's ideals if she feels it appropriate. Sister Paxton seems less rebellious, but her love of comics even early on shows a depth. She's not just this one thing. Could work on being judgy of pornstars, but the fact she even HAS that anecdote feels like a hint at her multiple facets.
And there's also something to the early scene with the teenage girls who pants Sister Paxton to help set this tone of how the outside world treats them sometimes which in turn reinforces why they stay in their community.
I've only just finished heretic about an hour ago, thought man i wish amanda had a video on it and bam! Like magic!
The biggest mystery to me with this movie, is why did Sister Paxton never put her glasses back on? What happened to them? Where did they go? How was she getting through all this while visually impaired?
Can chock it up to adrenaline.
My head canon is that they’re fake and she just wears them to look more grown up 😂
@christalcavanaugh
I also figured they were a fashion choice more than a medical necessity.
when I first saw the trailers for this, I didn't know if I could buy Hugh Grant in this role, but his performance was incredible!
He was! I think my favourite scenes of everyone were before the story crosses the Belief door, maybe even the most in the living room. Everyone was great but Chloe East impressed me most of all. She delivered her lines so perfectly for her character, and I think it's the hardest one to play convincingly out of the lot.
It’s interesting to think that they are not fighting back until it’s too late because they still need enough proof, they are questioning whether they are mistaking the signs and not ready to fully commit to their belief that he is a murderous psychopath who won’t let them get out. I think it adds to the movie’s point about faith and the influences of society and others on our decisions and the choices we make.
Similarly, the fact that she stabs him right as his says the code word can also be a nod to how easily she is conditioned to follow instructions. Perhaps it was his plan all along? The two sisters made that agreement speaking fairly loudly in the basement before they knew he could hear them down there, so what if he heard it and used it on purpose to show that she was so susceptible to influence that she was ready to kill at the code word no matter who’s mouth it came from?
You're giving way tooo much credit to the writers. It was plain old horror movie ending
Never take to heart someone telling you that you’re reading too much into things. Yes, interpretations can be wildly off base, and different from authorial intent, but that just tells you more about the person doing the interpreting. If someone tells you it’s just not that deep, it tells you a whole lot more about them than it does about the work in question. If they instead present their own interpretation that counters yours with textual evidence then their opinion is worth taking into account.
It's interesting to think that he may've been willing to self-destruct in order to test Paxton.
I've seen so many people say the anti-religion arguments were shallow and already well known. But I think it depends on how much time you spent debating or researching religion. In my country, no one really cares about religion that much and my mom and my sister left the cinema discussing points that were totally new to them and they never thought about before. I think Mr. Reeds points were good enough to start questioning the goal of all religion and I think Barnes attempts to challenge him with her own arguments were weak and fell short. Mr. Reed was definitely the villain, but pretty much all he said was objectively true. While the only pro-religious argument I found 'convincing' was Paxtons take on prayers and that was more about faith and humanity than religion, really. Anyway, I loved everyones performances and how Hugh managed to be both charming and terrifying. I loved the humor in it too
so you don’t have politicians claiming they were appointed by god? oh how nice it must be
Omg which country???
Omg which country???
Member of the “Watch Amanda review scary movies I’m interest in so I don’t scare myself” club here: I am very glad I didn’t try to watch this one on my own bc those prophets are gonna be a big ass NO from me. From the trailers I would have never expected them and I would have been traumatized 😂😂 I kept seeing ads and was like “oo maybe this is one I could handle” LOL SHE WAS SO WRONG
seriously! I’m a scaredy cat so I kept googling how scary the movie was before I went to see it. everywhere it said “no gore, no jumps cares”, so I thought I was safe, but that was a damned lie! I mean they had multiple throats gushing blood and a guy literally rooting through an arm and pinching a vein! just remembering it makes me nauseous (but I did enjoy it tbh)
Yes I also do the same! I can take thrillers and psychological horror but I can’t take gore and jump scares. My favorite scary movie is The Ring but it didn’t have any jump scares. Movies like this, I wish I could see because they’re so interesting. But I’ll settle for hearing about them on UA-cam
The one thing I thought of after watching it was there was a third option at the beginning, not making a choice at all. If the front door was on a timer, there was also technically the option of just waiting for the door to unlock. He wasn't (at the time) doing anything to physically make them choose.
I wondered that as well but when he answered the door for Topher, he has to lift up the light switch or thermostat to reset a timer. I think it locks after a certain time and only unlocks when you reset it with the wall switch thingy. I could totally be wrong though. 🤷
@@theupwardspiral1580 Just makes me think of something like Cabin in the Woods. If they didn't play with anything in the basement, nothing would have happened, they had to "choose" to transgress.
@@Kurogane72 I think stepping over the threshold was that. Again this is just how I see it and could totally be wrong. I think once they had gone in when the wife wasn't there was acting in faith. If they'd have said okay well no thanks we will come back they'd have been fine. Once they stepped in, I think he was never gonna let em go.
@@theupwardspiral1580 that's a fair assumption.
@@Kurogane72 something is stuck in my head though. If one of them has studied the model of the house, would they have been able to get out? Like when they first went in to the study...during the monopoly scenes. Could they have escaped?
It's considered anti-mormon because the elders say that even looking at anything that can make you question is apostasy. Basically don't try to think for yourself.
"Spider-Man."
".... Voltaire."
That got a hearty chuckle out of me when i was watching the movie.
5:52 im a fiber artist, that's not crochet that's cross stitch! you can especially see the little X's on the "I". the background does look oddly ridged though, not like a typical cross stitch canvas. could be a white pannel of single crochet with the letters and design cross stitched on top, but I cant exactly tell without a higher quality image. maybe we're both right!
lol as a crochet-er it looked more cross stitch to me, like the kind that is from cheap kits with more plastic than fabric so it’s nice and stiff for beginners. But I do not think any part of it was crochet (at least not a form I recognize). Glad I wasn’t the only one catching that during the video!
Nice to see another crafter catch this. It's 100% just a cross stitch, I think the fabric probably looks "oddly ridged" because it's really low count aida fabric so you can really see the holes, I've only really seen it in kits for kid to be used with dk yarn and a plastic needle.
The only way I can possibly see it being cross stitch on top of croceht fabric is if they'd used the smallest hook and thread to create the fabric but even then I don't think there's enough texture, it's too smooth to be crochet.
i love that this video came up in the “important” section of my notifications
The true irony is that he thinks people don't already worship Jar Jar as a Sith.
Jar Jar is the key to all this.
I’ve never been this early 🫨 love your work!
I do think that what we saw happening actually happend, she saw a miracle and escaped, and then although the butterfly wasn't real she believing that it was even for a second was enough to make her move forward
Amanda not knowing that Topher is short for ‘Christopher’ is everything 😅😅😅😅😅
I had no idea either
I've just learned this today 😮
The first 40 minutes were the best for me. The whole chain of events leading to the question by Mr Reed "Do you believe when I open this door I'll find my wife when every incident today has pointed to contrary?" and the segment where he compared multiple religions was exactly what I was hoping. tbh I was hoping for the movie to continue this path and see an the intellectual debate between Belief vs Disbelief. Does anybody know more movies where I can expect this? I saw 'The Man from Earth' couple of years ago (which also touches upon the same concept of an 'original source' of a religion) and have been looking for such movies since
I'm a happy ending lover so I'm going with the first option 😂
I've seen Hugh Grant as a villain a few times but this is a role I have never seen him. And Chloe East has become another Scream Queen in my book!!
“That musical by the South Park guys was making fun of us.”
I really loved this movie. I liked it wasn’t a traditional religious horror movie
People who think this movie is "too wordy" have no patience. This movie is a masterpiece.
Anyone who thinks it’s even a movie, much less a master piece, is severely limited in their cognitive function
I appreciate the “cute actors are now horror villains” trope going around. I’m still waiting on a Tom Hanks horror villain.
Nah, Tom Hanks is too far down the old cranky but deep down charming hero of a bygone era path at this point
the polar express is right there
I'm so bad with horror movies (because I lucid dream) that sometimes even the recaps give me nightmares. I love horror movie lore though so appreciate Amanda breaking down the movies for us (also found flix is great too). If you watch both channels videos of the same movie its cool seeing their different takes and what they pick up on.
10:29 I can kind of understand that perspective when the two girls are Mormon (which is a sect of Christianity) vs. if they had made them two Jewish or Muslim girls. But I also agree with the fact that he's a villain, so you can't take his words at face value too. Love your videos! ❤
it would have to be a totally different movie if the main characters were jewish, because judaism doesn't actively encourage new converts and therefore doesn't have a tradition of evangelism/mission work. in fact, in my experience jewish people generally love having the kind of "question everything" conversations the hugh grant character is looking for lol - debate isn't taboo the way it is in some christian denominations which valorize total faith and devotion. i can't really speak to the muslim perspective and whether the movie would have worked in that case, just wanted to point out that there are logistical and thematic reasons why christians in general and mormons in specific made good protagonists for this particular film, beyond just "everybody wants to shit on christians."
YES! I was waiting for you to cover this one! Yippee!
Hugh Grant really is thriving as a charming villain juat based on seeing the Dungeons and Dragons movie.
Yes! Been waiting for you to do this. I can’t wait to watch this.
Edit: I also really liked Alyssa Grenfell’s break down of this
It's such a fascinating character study. This movie balanced a great line between "faith as an unexplainable ideology" and "faith as an institution" by condemning the latter (i.e.: the ultimate truth being control).
A clever move I think the movie pulls off well is the "parlor trickery" of it all. The first half of the film has this mysterious tension building towards a supernatural horror tone (e.g.: is Hugh Grant the devil? Or is he God testing their faith?). But once the movie introduces the "prophet" it snuffed out any suspicions of a greater force at play and it becomes a thriller- two girls are trapped in a lunatics "religion bad" escape room experiment.
A good comparison is novel The Magus (John Fowles, 1965) where the protagonist finds himself at the whims of a great magician... or is he just a masterful trickster? This, combined with Sister Barnes' dying words to fight back with intellect calls forth the idea of critically analyzing the world around us. The movie spends its first half building the image of a seemingly powerful man but then carefully dismantles and exposes itself for what it was:
A test of faith, but from a higher power.
God and all the criticisims of how religion controls women: first through the polygomy question and how that's used to justify controlling women and then by LITERALLY showing women caged and worshipping him- going so far as to kill themselves (poisoned blueberry pies) to prove his point.
I disagree with you in that this was a terrible film railroaded by the dismissal of the religious element almost all together.
“The prophet” being introduced didn’t actually prove it to be trickery. Because of not only the filming but also the sudden lack of awareness of the women it comes across as being some of the MOST supernatural elements. Even the idea of the woman actually dying and her body being swapped was ridiculous straw grasping by the women and actually showed how little their beliefs in the supernatural are. As that theory was put forward it was NEVER actually addressed how those two women were in that room and didn’t hear, see, feel, or notice anything…… the women in the cages were so extremely frail that even a second one entering made no sense. How and from where did she come from?? Was she loose the entire time??? Where was she hiding that they didn’t notice her? How did she move a dead body without noise while also being extremely frail herself? How did she even open the trap door and drop a body in without making a sound? How did neither woman notice such happenings when they were shown actively moving around the space while Hugh grant was walking in and out dealing with the front door?
How did the woman recover the trap door AND put herself into position before they saw her in motion? How has this seemingly happened several times over but she didn’t put her head in the correct placement? Where exactly did he walk her to once he ushered her from that room?
How does the audience accept the intelligence of the women to notice all these things but somehow accept they were so oblivious to the dead body that they somehow CHOSE to not have any actual survival skills????? That scene took me out the movie as it made the ENTIRE thing a joke.
The fact that he even had some occultic chamber deeper in the ground that directly led to the caged women suggests it wasn’t just for show and that he actually dabbles in witch craft to some extent. But….. “control” is the one religion…. Sure
@@vikkidonn You know that just because something in a film might be ludicrous, it doesn’t make it supernatural. The girl’s unawareness of the body switch is what the more forgiving would call a suspension of disbelief, and the more vigilant, what it actually is, a plot contrivance.
No different than:
- How in most movie’s characters don’t hear an approaching helicopter until it’s right above them.
- How stalker killers seem to be omnipresent and always manage to appear everywhere that characters are (including the backseat of locked cars).
- How zombies in the woods make no sounds (even walking) until they’ve jump scared a person.
- Or how EVERYONE in the FAST/FURIOUS movies survives total car wrecks and that EVERYONE who dies somehow survives.
None of it supernatural.
@ I’m not saying it automatically makes it supernatural simply because it should technically speaking. I’m saying it because of the movie and what it’s attempting to do. They promoted the film as supernatural in concept then tried a gotcha that fails in the cannon of the film itself. What I said stands. Not based on suspension of disbelief but because the film wants you to simultaneously view the characters as hyper intelligent and observant while also having you believe they’d be that unaware of their surroundings that the biggest plot device would go unnoticed… entirely unnoticed? While they were actively walking around that area looking at that body multiple times…. And standing in the center listening to things taking place in the study/sanctuary area. But they don’t hear a slow decrepit woman walking around?
Yeah that’s the fault of the film. They would have had an easier time just making it supernatural and leaning into that more. That’s my point
@@vikkidonnwhen the body was switched they were up the stairs screaming and trying to get matches.
When she had the line pointing out that boiling down the choice of belief vs disbelief erases all the other parts of the human experience in the middle I literally said "ok Donnie" out loud in the theater 😂 someone remembered the Lifeline Exercise
The butterfly story comes from an ancient Chinese philosopher Zhuangzi, who wrote the Taoist allegory, The Butterfly's Dream, where a man dreams of being a butterfly, and upon awakening, he isn't sure if he is actually a man who dreamt of being a butterfly, or a butterfly dreaming of being a man. It's interesting in relation to the themes of this movie because it focuses on the difficult in determining what is reality and what is illusion, and what one's identity really means.
Have watched this a hundred times already !! So good, thank you Amanda!
I've only watched it five times.
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Best review and examination of this movie I’ve seen! I went through a handful of channels looking to help wrap up my thoughts on the ending and this one was just 👌. Subscribed 👍
I haven't seen this film, but from your summary I pretty much agree with your closing statement. It's not a film against religion in general, but rather a film against blind followership; saying that true belief should come from genuine thought and convinction, not from being a sheep. Otherwise, you let others dictate what you do rather than your own self.
I grew up in a Catholic household and began questioning the institutions when I was a tween before finally straying away from religion altogether. Quite frankly, I don’t know what I believe. The like to think agnostic because I like the idea of a loving God and Heaven but not like in scriptures. I can appreciate this movie a bit for those like me.
It’s really cool to see how much of the ending people were putting up to interpretation. I thought of everything as literally happening right up until the butterfly lands on Sister Paxton’s hand. So cool to see how others view movies like this one.
I heard a former Mormon mention that while on mission knocking on doors you are so desperate to speak to people (and not get a door slammed in your face) that you'll go along with just about anything. So, it seems that thats probably the main reason why the sisters just waltz into Reed's home. This same former Mormon mentioned herself and others being put into a lot of sketch/dangerous situations while on mission as well (mostly because the Mormon church doesn't do a whole lot to deter bad things from happening. There's a lot of "leave it in God's hands" going on). Oh! And she also mentioned how they are taught to be VERY perceptive of their surroundings, especially inside a possible converts home (not for safety but more for getting to know the person they're talking with), so the fact that Paxton is pretty perceptive to things is something that is taught by the church.
One little gripe I had was with the birth control implant because they really didn't do their research on that one. I've had the arm implant off and on for 10 years now and one: it doesn't leave a scar like that and two: it's not metal. The implant is essentially hard plastic and when its inserted it is punched into and under the skin so it leaves a small round scar. Even when it's removed (and a new one is possibly reinserted) they make the smallest possible incision that doesn't go long ways like shown in the film. When they focused on the scar in the film I thought BC for a second but dismissed it because the scar didn't match at all.
Saw this with my sister a couple of weeks ago and absolutely loved it tbh. Fantastic performances and a well made script.
For anyone who wants an (ex) Mormon's perspective on the film, please check out Alyssa Grenfell's review! It's super enlightening and she delves more into specific religious aspects, beliefs, symbolism, etc.
I’m surprised you were able to avoid seeing a trailer for this movie before you saw it. I felt like I couldn’t escape them
I saw it in September at a film festival
Ms. Jedi, you're one of he only reviewers I've ever seen who can actually get me hyped for a film, even ones I might not have been thinking about seeing. Love it.
I havent seen this movie yet but dang, as someone who’s really in to religious studies and their similarities I feel like this is very up my alley!! Always love a good horror mixed with religion, usually it’s Catholic or Christian things, so the Mormon missionaries is a very cool change already
Made it to 1:58 and I have to stop already because I NEED to see this movie before I watch this. I'll be back eventually. Gonna watch a different one from Amanda for now.
I'm wearing the Hell is a Teenage Girl shirt as I watch this 😂.
I loved this movie. It didn't disappoint
Re: the ending.
I don't think enough time has passed for it to be already morning when she escaped. It seemed like they arrived there before dusk and following the story, it doesn't seem like they were there for more than even 8 hours
I think this detail is a strong argument in favour of the idea it was all a hallucination
I went to see Heretic with my dad (loved it) and the ticket guy looked at what we were seeing and went “you’re taking HER to see Heretic?”
As an ex mormon I actually found it hard to listen to my mormon friends and family bash this film without even having seen it. I understand the distrust many of them have towards films like these but I don't really see it as anti-mormon. It's not pro-mormon either but it clearly is only approaching every topic how real mormons and outsiders do, it feels like an honest exploration. I actually quite like how even in the end when after belief has been so highly debated prayer still takes place and is seen as a good thing, if anything the story has a positive message for belief, just a negative one against blind following, a problem in a lot of churches, not just the LDS church
To be fair, as a former LDS missionary myself, the facts that Sister Paxton doesn't have any baptisms and her scriptures aren't as marked up are just a sign to me that she's fairly new to the mission. Sister Barnes is probably closer to the end of it. Missionaries are required to have over an hour of dedicated scripture study every day, so basically everyone's scriptures are marked up by the end of it. But it's very common to start the mission with a fresh new set of scriptures, so they get marked up slowly over time.
Me and my mom went to see this I was a little worried about it only because we are both church goers her more than I and I was worried she would find it sacrilegious. But we both came out loving it I didn’t think it was ever fully against one side it wanted you to make up your own mind and I do feel like anyone can have a different experience. We now are trying to get my nana to watch it
I cannot believe how much I loved this movie. Everyone did wonderfully.
I love this movie. I thought they all did an amazing job. I didn't expect it to be a deep introspective movie. It left me thinking about it for days.
I get this movie’s message so much. Personal religion isn’t easy to share with others, and many people do seem to just believe what they’re told. However, that also applies to almost everything, not just religion.
6:06 As a note, this is because the “Mormon Healthcode”, (where they don’t drink alcohol, smoke, or drink coffee), it doesn’t say no caffeine.
But some older generations see Caffeine as a sort of drug, and only take it if they need to. It became a little bit of a cultural thing. Reinforced by things like Church-school campuses not serving any caffeine.
But since then, it’s been shown as not part of the Healthcode, culturally. BYU now serves caffeine.
More and more people see it as fine, and not letter of the law. And others are careful about it, but not white and black.
But I get that it was probably a test.
As a practicing Catholic, I agree with Amanda, I love seeing movies that are well done, and question religion and faith because I dont believe in blindly following a religion anyways
Anyways, a great watch as always👍
Ngl. I do like watching your reviews cause watching horror with cptsd is super difficult sometimes and you're a fantastic resource for me to find out if theres anything triggering I should either avoid the movie for it being just a bit to much or if I could probably handle it so long as I keep in mind that the triggering things are there and mentally prep myself for it.
Also no matter what. If I step inside even my best friends house and he tells me he has metal ALL UP IN HIS WALLS out of nowhere, there is no force strong enough to stop me from bolting out of that house immediately because theres just no other reason to have metal ALL UP IN YOUR WALLS OF YOUR LIVING SPACE unless youre into some serial killer nonsense.
Your shirt ❤
This topic 🥰
What a great Saturday 😊
I hope everyone is well 🖤❤️
bless you
I watched this movie, and I didn't realize that was topher as the elder until you said it lol
I loved this movie. There are flaws yes but the acting was spectacular and the vibe was so good. Great music and beautifully shot.
I took the ending as that she lived. her seeing the butterfly was her choosing to still believe in religion. Also them making it disappear was the film making a statement that it isn’t real.
I actually really enjoyed this movie. I’m not a religious person so hearing the characters’ in-depth discussions was fascinating to me. I also had a good theater experience with it; there were only three of us there and we ended up discussing it as we left together, mainly theorizing on the ending. It was great!
Loved it, it was so much fun. I was lucky enough to watch it on a whim without any prior knowledge (not even the trailer) and enjoyed every minutes.
I have pretty much the same read on the movie as you did, so no notes on that.
(can't believe the movie made me hope the priest would save the day, really fell for that one)
26:29 Mr reed is the ice king from adventure time: just building up his collection of women, not thinking about what happens afterwards.
I can't believe that Sister Barnes would've been alive to attack him again, so I think that Sister Paxton likely died when he stabbed her. The whole butterfly scene is beautiful but gives "The Giver" sled scene vibes, and I interpret both scenes as the characters being dead. Edit: I think this is also why/how Sister Paxton initially returns to the dungeon room after first "escaping" him instead of ending up somewhere else (new). She has to return to that familiar place in her brain before she can imagine a way out.
Yes, it’s even possible that she never went up the stairs or even not down to the second level of the basement. What if he stabbed her even earlier on and she imagined all of the rest? Like how sure she was from that point on in her analysis and interpretation seems curious.
I saw the trailer but, as people were saying - did not look into it ay further. And it did not disappoint.
I really like the ambiguity of it all, and like you said, people can take from this movie what they want. I saw it as an entertaining discussion of religion as a while, with some horror tossed in. Way funnier than I was expecting, great performances all around.
Cross stitch. It's a cross stitch.
I know, the crochet crowd is very annoying about this, but still. That is "bless this mess" depicted using counted cross stitch embroidery. Not a single crochet hook to be found.
Thanks for saying what i was thinking 😅
Amém! I do both, but I understand when people can't identify which is what. I'm a little surprised because it usually happens with knitting 😂
@@madbyinstinct To clarify, no offense meant toward @AmandaTheJedi. I get that fiber arts can be easily confused. I'm sorry that my comment was so abrupt and, on reread, totally rude.
Not as an excuse, but as an explanation: As a long-time crochet nerd often surrounded by knitters I just have that knee-jerk reaction to people misidentifying crafts. Respect for the under dog fiber crafts! Cross stitch is also cool!
Glad to see I’m not the only one who has a tradition of watching creepy movies at Christmas time.
I love Amanda's Jennifer's Body movie Megan Fox shirt.
Holy Axl Rose…smart, insightful, attractive & Canadian…can’t hit subscribe fast enough!
There is an old movie with Hugh Grant as an asshole called “An Awfully Big Adventure”. I’ve always preferred Hugh Grant as an antagonist. As a note, if anyone watches the movie - I usually see summaries describe it as “comedy” or “coming of age”. Both are inaccurate descriptions. The main character is a young teenage girl who is figuring out how to be a human being in a wrecked London after WWII. It’s a good movie and there are funny moments, but it is NOT a comedy and it’s more about how tragedy/trauma stunts and/or traps people, rather than a vaguely triumphant movie about someone learning how to be an adult.
I’m an Exmormon, and saw it with a group of other exmos in Utah. It was so good!
You have the candle! I'm such a sucker for a24 merch
I really enjoyed this movie as someone that was raised in a very similar religion. Ever since I saw the trailer with them preaching I was invested bc the fear of someone doing something to you while you are in the ministry is sooo real.
I will say, as a side note, that this movie was pretty rough at points as someone with a low tolerance for gore, though. I'm happy that I watched it but i was very close to fainting lmao.
Hell yes!!! I grew up Mormon and have been waiting for a review!