North America's Next Subway Leaps Forward | Ontario Line
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- Опубліковано 4 лип 2024
- Since nearly the beginning of my UA-cam channel, the idea of a new Downtown Toronto subway line has been incredibly important. And now, thanks to some big news, it appears that things are finally set in stone. Let's talk about it!
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Ever wondered why your city's transit just doesn't seem quite up to snuff? RMTransit is here to answer that, and help you open your eyes to all of the different public transportation systems around the world!
Reece Martin (the RM in RMTransit) is an urbanist and public transport critic residing in Toronto, Canada, with the goal of helping the world become more connected through metros, trams, buses, high-speed trains, and all other transport modes.
It’s quite exciting, but… sad it will probably take a decade or more to open. Human lifespans are too short when you’re a transit enthusiast. 😔
That's a good thing in China actually. They can finish large parts of a project in MONTHS. That's what I am jealous of.
The two things that take the most time are A) Bureaucracy, politics, and funding; and B) Tunnels. If we just started approving a new elevated or at
grade project every couple of years, in time they would start opening all the time. This would probably be more GTA scale then Toronto scale. Build GO-ALRT automated metros to connect the region.
It doesn't have to take decades but unfortunately North America isn't known for its quick and efficient infrastructure builds.
@@pepperpillow Considering how long the Hamilton and Hurontario LRT have taken, I’m not sure at grade or elevated would happen all that quickly…
we've got the transit intrastructure we have today because those before us decided it was a good investment .. even if it takes years to complete, it will be a huge positive when it's done :)
Always love the dancing in the intros!
No
Yeah!! Reese gets funky!
@@da_revo5747 doch
You know its going to be good news when
@@RMTransit 💃🕺
I found it interesting that you said this new subway should help Toronto transition from a “cars” to mass transit. When I lived in Toronto from the 1950’s until 1972 it never even crossed my mind to purchase a car. I could go anywhere, any time of day or night and there was always a streetcar or subway to take me there. In fact, my shift at CP Rail ended at 12 midnight and it was a piece of cake getting back home. It wasn’t until moving out of Toronto that I was forced to buy a car so I could get around.
It's been a while since I've been to Toronto, but all I can say is it definitely needs a new subway line in its downtown area.
Yep! Super excited!
Why?
Or 3.
@@Jay-vr9ir Because a large part of the city isn't served by the subway, so a lot of the journeys are not feasible with the highest capacity public transport.
After hearing talks of a relief line for decades, it's so satisfying to see progress moving so quickly at this stage. Hopefully that trend continues!
The satisfaction is deep indeed!
Hate to burst your bubble, but this is a political announcement for Tory's reelection bid next month. Nothing has been signed, they are just announcing the firms they are going to try to negotiate with first. If you want to get excited, wait until after the election is over, and the contracts are signed.
A completion in 2031 is too damn late they should at least speed it up to 2027 realistically
Hitachi will also have a (new) Canadian connection. It is currently in the process of acquiring the ground transportation division of Thales, which includes the Toronto-based Urban Rail Signalling group. This group has done signalling/automated train control projects all over the world.
Will be interested to see if they are involved!
Isn’t Thales the company behind the Ottawa Otrain signalling problems?
To be fair to people who originally didn't think it would be built, all the previous versions didn't.
Thats true, but all previous versions did not progress nearly as much!
@@RMTransit ...for a person so excited by transit, you seem to have a very selective memory. The shepherd east LRT not only had contracts signed, but shovels in the ground, when they cancelled it.
@@power_mac Agreed. Also, the city had gotten pretty close to this far with the DRL, and if funded (and there were clearly funds) & plans untouched, would be much farther along right now with an actual subway that would've opened by the end of the decade.
There were actually some big issues with the Copenhagen Metro trains when they were brand new. In 2003, many trains were delayed, doors falling apart from the train, they suddenly started to drive backwards and the security wasn't safe. Luckily everything has been fixed, but yeah, that's Hitachi Rail's first metro project
Fortunately it seems like things have gone better since
When the trains were originally delivered, they were made by the Italian company AnsaldoBreda - the same company that caused the IC4 fiasco, the FYRA fiasco, and the fiasco with streetcars for Gothenburg.
They really weren't good at building trains in general. The company was bought up by the Japanese company Hitachi (changing name to Hitachi Rail Italy), and since then the quality has gone up significantly.
The AnsaldoBreda plant is also supposedly at fault for the issues with the 80x series trains in the UK. There were some high-profile issues with cracking struts a while ago
AnsaldoBreda was also partially responsible for our lousy Type 8 light rail vehicles in the Boston area. They are terribly unreliable (even from when they were new), and they derailed frequently until the wheel and rail profiles were reground (and even so, they still occasionally derail). AnsaldoBreda is now Hitachi Rail Italy -- I wonder if that will finally fix their problems, or if they will corrupt the rest of Hitachi?
@@andrewreynolds4949 That was the Japan Plant which produced the shells (UK) and kits (Italy) - My understanding is it was a poor choice of Alloy, along with data about track quality supplied by Network Rail not matching reality so forces experienced were far higher then what the spec called for. With great pressure to reduce weight being part of the spec, any overengineering just in case wasn't going to happen.
I've seen allegations that Italian sets were beating the Newton Aycliffe sets for quality.
I'm excited to see Hitachi break into the Canadian market - their "tiny and cute" automated trains are my dream vehicle for my as-yet imaginary Halifax Metro.
The Ontario line looks very nifty; I'm impressed by how much it will open up the city while at the same time having so many connections to the existing system.
If it’s taking Eglington over 12 years and counting for an LRT, I can only imagine which century this new line will be open to the public
It hasn't taken 12 years - part of the issue was the way things were phased
Metrolink has already established a downtown corridor requiring only authorized agencies subject to permit approval for any nearby construction to ensure their plans are unaffected as well as their delivery routes in order to get queen street/stn going. I know this, as I am working on capacity enhancement improvements for reduced headways requiring additional traction power cables to run in new underground duct banks in the area for the TTC. Its happening faster than you may perceive it to be.
Hopefully they’ll complete this on time given it’s been contracted to Hitachi
Reece, whenever you get to announce something for your hometown of Toronto, I always get so excited for you. You do such an excellent job documenting systems all over the planet - and your videos on our systems here in Australia are probably the best that exist, you even get the pronunciation correct 99% of the time which is unheard of for a foreigner - so when you get to announce something world class and and awesome for your own city, well, I'm just so damn happy for you. Congrats on your new Ontario Line - hopefully your provincial government gets you involved in some way like how TfL lets Geoff Marshall in for sneak peaks. Have you thought about maybe emailing the relevant organisations to see if you can get on a PR list or something similar? Once again, very happy for you, and thanks for detailing Australia's public transport construction boom so excellently.
Video idea: Railway Nationalization explained. There are currently unprecedented challenges facing freight and passenger rail in the US right now. Would love to hear your take on the concept, and also how it works around the world and might work in North America
European railways have been moving away from the nationalized model in recent years. There have been issues pointed out with a sort of "closed-mindedness" in many of the nationalized operators, where they optimize things for their internal uses and where they are most likely to find local political support. This has led to poor compatibility between rail systems, and makes international travel difficult in all but a few trunk routes. Issues with the half-nationalized British system have meant that projects are way too susceptible to changing political dynamics.
Considering passenger rail currently is nationalized in most of North America...
The US freight system has mostly done fairly well in recent decades, and since it's run by private companies rather than a government with some amount of transparency obligations, it's far more common to hear about the bad stuff than the good stuff. Unfortunately that's how the news works here, one accident gets a lot more attention than a signal modernization or local track doubling project. There are a lot of issues right now but they're not unfixable, if the people involved aren't stubborn, greedy, or negligent idiots. That's not something that would go away if government took over the rail industry (in fact I think it would exacerbate it). There is some historical record for drastic changes in management system making things worse, for example the formation of BR in 1948. Because of rapidly shifting political tides rather than building a system that could recover from WW2 and sustain resilient traffic, first new steam locomotives were built then scrapped at a huge loss of design life (and thus cost-efficiency), but were replaced by diesels with insufficient technology development behind them (thus constant breakdowns and other issues). The huge waste of resources this created led to political pressure which meant the rail network was stripped to the bone. Yes BR eventually recovered, but the huge change is what caused those problems of that magnitude in the first place.
Interesting idea
Great to see the return of Dancing Reece!
You know its a good day when!
High speed train(300km/hrs+) between Toronto, Ottawa and Montreal is needed! Where do I submit my vote?
Video on the Honolulu issues would be great!
This is brilliant, exactly the right direction to be headed, Good to see Toronto being Canada center point for most things really ramping this up and allowing trips to be made car free, which has many positives. Good to see all these Canadian cities really making the right steps forward in creating good transit and an attempt at limiting car dependence, and making it more appealing to ditch the cars. Good video.
02:20 California HSR made a huge mistake when they decide to begin with the nearly flat central valley section. Now the opening date of the Pacheco Pass Tunnels would be that for any useful services.
In China, the good practice is to alway work on the longest bridges and tunnels first. Such sections usually get special environmental review under the name of "key, controlling construction", so that they can break ground several years earlier.
I don’t think China is allowed to be an example of good HSR, considering the failures in ridership
@@srpacific On an engineering perspective they are a success. Ridership is not their goal.
It is sad to say this is not Chinese territory to do business. China could build the whole line in 3-4 years like the new line in Moscow even in winter -35 C.
@@srpacific I thought anyone who follows this channel would understand the principle of building out transit infrastructure ahead of development, rather than waiting until the people are already there. We do it backwards in north america, letting massive populations build up with bad transit and only giving it to them when the demand is a dam waiting to burst.
Great video and summary, I really apprecaite the extra info on rolling stock and comparing to other cities, thanks for putting this all together!
Thanks for watching!
As far as I know, Keolis and Transdev are two independent companies
You're right, and this is a major mistake. And while both are French they are huge competitors.
@@jaspboynl8094 sorry, made the entire video last night so I guess my brain short circuited!
I love the new dancing intro...it's a nice touch 😀
Great stuff Reece 👍
It does sound exciting. Call it looks like some exceptional rolling stock could get produced. Also breaking the project up and for separate contracts may inspire a little competition to try to perform better than the other contractors on the project hopefully producing a better result
Big fan of your videos, keep it up! I've noticed that you haven't really mentioned the Sydney Metro in any depth in any of your videos, I think it is quite an interesting project, including its 3 sections under construction already and I'd love to hear your analysis of the project and where Sydney is headed next. Love your content, keep it up!
I'm so excited!!!!! I'll probably be in my 30s when this is done and maybe not in Toronto but this is amazing.
Its great for everyone when any city builds more transit!
Yay! 🙌 Also, dancing Reese in the intro! 😍
Been waiting for this video since your tweets :D
Thanks for watching!
I look forward to riding this in 2050 when it opens
I unironically love the clip of you dancing over the intro
People where right at the time to be skeptical given how often these announcements don't go anywhere, a perfect example being the Pink Line in Montreal recently, but as you pointed out it was handled differently so it didn't have the issues a lot of other programs have. Hopefully projects like this and the REM will see the Pink Line or Red Line revisited with at or above ground portions to bring costs down enough to justify reviving one of those projects.
Happy for Toronto with the Ontario Line, and also glad that our Singapore MRT Operator SMRT is part of the team, helping out with Maintenance, Operations and Rehabilitation.
They aren’t, they competed but were not in the winning team
@@RMTransit Oh, sorry, my bad... but just in case you didn't know, SMRT, via its international subsidiary, has also won several contracts overseas, but also won bids as a consultant to several projects worldwide too.
For example, recently they were appointed as the shadow operator for the Grand Paris Express, a consultant to review the operation scenarios for the Brisbane Cross River rail in Australia and an Independent Safety Audit consultant for the Mauritius Metro LRT system Phases 2B, 2C and 3
Perhaps SMRT may be an emerging player to rival the likes of Hong Kong's MTR Corporation.
Can’t wait for this line to get started. Just moved to the distillery district in Toronto and really excited to see the growth of portlands area and the whole cork town district. I’m lucky I get to live in an area of Toronto that had such well thought out massive construction plans. Makes me not mind the traffic and noise looool
As a Torontonian who doesn't own a car and never wants to, I'm thrilled about this. I never thought I would see a new subway in the city in my lifetime, but it now seems quite likely!
It feels good to know that Downtown Toronto is finally getting another Rapid Transit line and hopefully opens within a decade (I hope). The 2020's will definitely a major transit renaissance for Toronto with so many projects under construction.
2020s will be pretty hellish as the population grows. This line doesn’t open until 2031 by current estimates
The Ontario Line ends at Exhibition Place. There will be bus connections with 29 Dufferin and 63 Ossington, though the 47 Lansdowne bus could be extended via Jameson Avenue and Lake Shore Blvd. into Exhibition Place.
There could be another connection using the streetcar tracks from Dundas West Station along Dundas Street West, if they could install streetcar tracks along Dufferin Street south of Dundas Street West to connection with the Exhibition Station. This streetcar route could run "express" along Dufferin Street into Exhibition Place, leaving the 29 Dufferin bus to provide local service.
A very interesting idea!
Will that be enough though? The Dufferin 29 bus is so busy I feel we need a subway for the length of it. Even where the current subway runs close to Dufferin (near Yorkdale mall), you'd think that'd relieve the pressure somewhat, but it doesn't - it's still a super busy route.
@@n.b.3521 I've seen a plan with a future Ontario Line extension making a hard turn north at Exhibition and up Dufferin.
@@paul1224ford That would be great if it happens!
Mostly listening to a RMTransit video, hearing the word REM, lifting my head from what I was doing to watch the screen and who's on it... me :)
Great video but, as usual, no word on the operator (O&M part). On this project Transdev And Hitachi will operate this metro line during 30 years. Everybody probably know Hitachi but Transdev is the world leader of public transport operators managing all modes of public transport in the world (bus, trains, metros, bicycles, taxis, ferries, etc.).
I don't even live in Canada, but I am excited because you are excited lol
Ahhh this is super exciting news! There is just so much transit awesome stuff that is going to be happening within the next ~10 years.
When its finished its really cool that anyone living in midtown can access Up Express, Kitchener GO, Eglinton west station, Eglinton station and science centre station, to go downtown.
Good to see the dance is back
Such joy 🤩
Yes!!!
That intro dance!
Its so exciting!
Bro was vibing in the intro 😎
Nice Easter egg pointing to your next video! 😀
Haha glad you caught that
You know it's a good day when Dancing Reece is back!!!
Good news, thanks for video. I think the line as appears on video would be completed (if at all) in something like 15 years.
Are you planning to make a video on the athens metro like at all? There is a new expansion of it coming soon (2028 is soon in greece), and there are all kinds of transit services in athens. There is also the Thessaloniki metro, which is still under construction but planned to work by 2023, and it will be a light metro as well.
Reece loved the Happy Dance!
The idea to split the project into 3 sub-projects is actually a very good idea
It is going be awesome
I really love the Hitachi driverless metros, I'm looking forward to seeing which design they use, and how the interiors will be laid out.
While a great channel and video in general, that dance in the beginning had me punching the thumbs-up.
"Finally, another way across Don Valley!"
"Oh no its Scarborough! Quick, back across!"
Copenhagen Metro did not rely on longer trainsets, instead they relied on more frequent arrivals/departures. On all 4 metro lines you can expect to wait a maximum of 4 minutes during rush hour, and 3-6 minutes outside rush hour and during the weekends. Friday and Saturday night (after 01:00) trains arrive with a 7-15 minutes interval and a 20 minutes interval after midnight on weekdays (Sunday through Thursday)
Issuing of contracts is a great sign for a project actually getting built
Rapid transit powered by overhead wire is not unheard of in the United States. The Cleveland RTA Red Line does it along all of its trackage, and the MBTA Blue Line (Boston and near-shore points northeast) does it from Maverick Square Station or Airport Station in East Boston and all points northeast (the third rail from the old East Boston Tunnel extends to Airport Station and the overhead wire from outside/northeast extends into Maverick Square Station, so trains have overlapping options in case something is wrong with one of them).
I think you should do a update video about the Finch LRT as it's not gotten a lot of coverage and the last video you did about it was nearly two years ago and it's coming out within one.
I have clips of it in a few recent videos!
Oh I am always so excited about new subway lines. I am also so excited about the planned U5 in Hamburg and the S-Bahn and U-Bahn extension plans there. Probably the city with the most significant extensions planned in the German speaking countries and only an hour away from me :)
Well U5 and U2 extension in Vienna is also a very signifcant project, as far as German speaking countries go. At least comparable to Hamburg.
@@mancubwwa yes, comparable to the U5. But adding the S21 extension to Kaltenkirchen, the S32 to Osdorfer Born, the U4 extension to Horner Geest and the planned U4 Elbe river crossing I think Hamburg takes the lead
Edit: forgot the S4, probably the most significant project after the U5, which will free up capacity in the notoriously crowded main station and the new planned central S-Bahn tunnel to free up additional capacity for main line trains in the main station and on the rail line to Altona. All these projects will completely transform the city's transit network, especially the S-Bahn
There's a lot of S-Bahn expansion planned for cologne, though not so much stadtbahn, mostly because that already covers most of the city
Don't forget the 2nd main S-bahn line (2. Stammstrecke) extension in Munich
Oooohhh, I was unaware of a new line U5 for Hamburg... I'll have to look it up!
Hitachi Italy driverless metros that will be on the Ontario line are really good trains! With this contract, the world coolest driverless train technology will also be available in Toronto after they proved the reliability in Copenhagen, Rome, Milan, Taipei and soon also Honlulu and the Greek city of Thessaloniki will be added to the roster of cities served by this wonderful driverless train technology
though it seems the project in honolulu has had its share of problems, such as the axles being too small for the tracks
Milan is about to inaugurate another line with the same technology. In the same region of Lombardy the city of Brescia also has a Hitachi driverless line, that also sports impressive stations.
@@tonywalters7298 I think it was an infrastructure issue
To be fair, the ones used for M1 and M2 are older 1st gen models while M3 and M4 are newer 5th gen models.
Currently if you 2022, only eight 5th gen models are running on M1 and M2 line.
Personally I prefer the 1st gen models, the electric motor sounds better than the newer 5th gen model, but I do like Hitachi Italy kept the classic design mixed with modern features.
I don't know 1st gen models were only used in Denmark, seems like other countries and cities use 5th gen models.
I wonder what Ontario Line decided to use overhead wire instead of a third rail?
The downtown relief line is sorely needed and while I'm glad it will make commuting in/out of the core easier, I still have concerns about Metrolinx seeing through its integration with outlying areas of the City of Toronto, specifically in Etobicoke and Scarborough.
The recent news about Metrolinx not having a real end date on when the Eglinton LRT will be "officially" done was disappointing (I can't say it's a surprise lol), as well as its ballooning budget. Many of these areas esp in the city's extreme NW and NE rely on buses only, and sometimes only one route that requires multiple bus transfers just to access the subway or an LRT. Until the promised transit conveniences extend to the whole city -- not just the core and its nearby neighbourhoods -- it will always look like an on-going, incomplete project.
I'm still hopeful about transit in the city, but I also remember the promises about Toronto amalgamation in the 90's re: transit improving for everyone that have yet to be delivered. The city was let down by successive gov'ts at all levels over the years. The Ontario Line is a start. Let's hope they intend to build on it for the future.
Hopefully Hitachi can wave their Magic Wand and make their part of the project a reality.
Best comment 😂😂😂
Very exciting news! The Ontario Line will probably be finished before HART at this rate.
Oh my I hope not!
By the time HART is finished the ocean would have risen to turn it from an elevated line to a sea-level line.
0:41 I see those moves Reese!
I wonder why Toronto doesn't make condo developer pay for the subway stations??? Real estate above subway stations are prime and sell at a premium price.... In Asia . Not only developer has to pay for the station they have to pay on top of it. It also drive tons of ridership in to the system. Win win win. It's a no brainer
Small world indeed. Keolis also runs the buses in my mid sized town in Sweden
Wish York region would be able to have this great of transit :(
It's all well and good (transit expansion) but reliability and affordability are still issues that the TTC still struggles with. Those issues should also be given priority if the city wants to move away from cars as the main transportation in the city.
3:10 hitachi trains are everywhere in italy and the high speed train frecciarossa is built by hitachi
Reece, a little off topic. I agree with line 4 Sheppard subway should be extended westward from Yonge Sheppard subway station to Sheppard West station on the York Spadina line. Higher priority than line 6 Finch West LRT going east to Finch station. Glad that Ontario line has a contract for building it.
They don't have one for Line 4 sadly.
@@RMTransit I know eh? If the late Rob Ford the former mayor of Toronto hadn't cancelled transit city back then then the Finch West LRT would extend eastward to Finch subway station on the Yonge subway line.
Excited for this to be finished. Will expand the connections around the city. Next we need more frequent and faster intercity train service.
So excited about Hitachi winning the bid! Will be great to see more Japanese rolling stock - especially electrically powered vehicles from Japan. Where will they be manufactured?
Go Toronto! 👍👏😊♥️
can you talk about the upcoming hovercraft service between toronto and niagara falls
Its pretty borderline as transit but maybe!
@@RMTransit It will never make it.
Will the Ontario Line go partially under King? If so, will it go near the Distillery? To get to and from the Distillery and the train system is a hassle, and the King streetcars are closed quite often
It will, with Corktown and Mosspark stations
Love the dancing
My parents had a Hatichi TV back in the 1970s and it was reasonably good, so I think that Toronto is good hands with their new subway cars.
Good news! When the ontario line finally get built i will have graduated and left toronto tho
You know the video is going to be good when we get the dancing Reece intro.
was kinda hoping for tr’s on the ontario line but i’m sure these new trains will be cool
How about a video about the Ontario Line crossing of the Don Valley? That must a big project on its own.
Awesome news! Ontario Line Two?
Lots of grading going on on the north side of GO's Lakeshore East line west of Danforth station for the past while. So yeah, the Ontario Line construction has pretty much been going on for a while now already.
They've also been expropriating businesses already. They seem to be really serious about this one.
More than rome's metro C sets, which are an older design, i'd look at something more similar to the more modern trains which will be used on Lima Metro line 2, which look like a driverless version of the Leonardo trains built for Milan metro
Request for a mississauga lrt and richmond hill extension video please. Also will there be suicide barriers on the ontario line? Also, would be interesting to know if you think the university line should go to wonderland and complete a full circle in Richmond hill
Let's goooo!!
Hey!! Just out of curiosity, where do you get the transit maps you put on your wall behind you?
On an unrelated note, looks like the Atlanta streetcar extension may be happening
Nixe Video
I don’t think is gonna be bigger than the Montreal REM because they announced they’re gonna confirmed the expansion of the REM in the east side of Montreal after the provincial election in Quebec
The East End expansion isn't confirmed but overall REM is a very different project
@@RMTransit it’s not confirmed yet because we’re still in election in Quebec but me trust they are gonna do it that’s 100% sure
4:20 rome has three metro lines and line c is so good that line a and b seems to be of an other place (they're bad!)
Transit projects should be funded publically- we don't leave private companies to build roads, coz they'd suck at building and maintaining usesful services with profit as their primary motive. Transit IS NOT a competitive market, you don't get competition on a railway, therefore the free market cannot be applied to it in a reasonable way- privatization of our railways in the UK has been disasterous- services are less well connected, more expensive and see less investment, many lines were removed entirely. A good rail system needs to be funded by taxes.
It is funded by the public through tax dollars, as with basically every other transit project built everywhere construction companies compete to build and operate for a period of time - that ensures they don't build a bad project because they would be responsible for operating it!
@@RMTransit Now you know why most places have crappy infrastructure like the entirety of NA. At least from a Swiss perspective. Never want to go back to NA.
It would be great to have a video on Mexico City's metro system! It's often overlooked, especially considering it moves literally MILLIONS of passengers daily!
I actually previously had one, but I have taken it down so that I can remake it. It’s definitely an interesting system.
Interesting. Will any of the new route be bored out with TBMs? The BIG machines...
Much of it I would guess!
Is the new subway going to built to standard gauge or is going to use the quaint and unique Toronto gauge?
Would it not have made sense to have the western portion of the new line run back up to Bloor St.?
why did you removed the sao paulo video? a lot has changed in terms of next projects for lines in sao paulo metro system, might make for a good video :)
first time im 5 mins to a video!
Welcome!
The Rome Line C cars are the same dimensions as the Milan ones, although the trains are six car not four car
How is it going in Toronto? Are transport planners excited or against all those transit expansions?
Why would they be against it!