The Donner Party: American Cannibals
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- Опубліковано 2 жов 2024
- The Donner party's journey for prosperity turns into a nightmare as they get stranded in an icy hell with no way out, resorting to murder and cannibalism. A cautionary tale for those following the trail for westward expansion.
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Simon is the last guy you would want in a 'Donner Party' because he'd be the one guy saying "you know, cannibalism really isn't that bad for you" and everyone else would be like "Simon, we've only been lost for 30 minutes!".
😂😂😂😂
"Apparently it's fine as long as you don't eat the brains"
Simon: Yes, but I've been out of cocaine for an hour!
@@douglasdonaldson2510Simon didn't run out of cocaine. His stash got ruined by WD-40 in a public restroom, allegedly. He said he began carrying around his own clean mirror, to prevent the magical marching powder from becoming all goopy with WD-40 ... Again, allegedly. 😉
I for one am on team Simon just remember necessity does not absolve you of legal guilt so shhhh.
@@mikewazouski1717 is cannibalism illegal? I just thought it was frowned upon
The man carrying the children in a one-man relay because he refused to leave any behind - just, wow.
Legend
Now that's commitment to principles. That man is a machine.
Now *THAT* is a true LEGEND… and he managed to save them all. Beautiful.
That’s why I love this story classic hero’s and villains
BuT hE sTole LAnD!!!!!
John stark carrying all 7 children to safety has to be one of the most amazing parts of this rescue story
Back from the war, no less!
War vets seem to have something like muscle memory when i comes to survival.
John Stark, what a badass. Carrying all those kids slowly to safety. That man deserves his own statue.
Knowing California it would have beem vandalized because he was a "colonizer"
Honestly 🙏
As someone who lives an hour from where they got stranded it never ceases to amaze me how much technology changes our lives in a century. Less than 100 years after the Donner Party got stuck there the Lake Tahoe/Donner Pass area became perhaps the single most famous winter sports location on earth. Less than a hundred years from a place being entirely inhospitable to human life to being a place that millions of people flock to every year specifically to enjoy the very thing that killed those settlers.
Damn.... that's a sobering thought. Thank you for that perspective.
I just drove pass Donner pass during that nasty hurricane in February and told my husband that “if something happened, eat me and not the dog.” He was not amused. 😀
@@Du-Masses are you kidding me??? I had to drive from Grass Valley to South Lake and back that same day! Small world it is
@@paulhammer4941 yess! We made it to Reno but got stuck on the way back to Sac and ended up in Carson city for an extra night. It was quite beautiful but the by far the craziest driving conditions of my life. 😀
Right! my family just visited Donner Pass after sledding in Truckee. I just kept thinking of how easy it was for us to get there.
I was disappointed that you didn’t mention John Stark in your final list of the heroes of this tale. He saved seven children at great personal cost, and deserves to be remembered more.
I’ve been on Donner Pass in winter, doing cold weather training for a National Guard unit. It was not easy with relatively modern, Korean War era, cold weather gear and plenty of supplies.
👀
Yesterday i watched a video on the Donner party and wondered “i wonder if Simon has made a video on the topic?” And today he has delivered 😂 the timing is weirdly perfect 🤣
He may have done a video on one of his other channels, but I could be wrong.
@@pollypocket3508 I would be really surprised if he hasn’t😂
FYI, having read several first-hand accounts from surviving members, the reason why the native men quickly left is not just because of their cultural disgust with cannibalism but because several members of the party thought that killing and eating indigenous people wasn't as bad as doing it to white people.
Honestly the park should have been named after the Native tribe the rescuers were from, cause they were the real heroes. It was the white people's laziness that lead them to leave late and get into this mess, and then Natives did help but the white ppl were just racist and only wanted to steal Native land. They should have named it after the Natives, or the guy who hauled those seven children (cause he was the only white guy that did anything genuinely heroic). Having a cannibalism statue that represents racism and being lazy/tardy + colonising sacred Native lands is just honestly disgusting. They should take it down fr
Another video stated that some of the donner party told the indians to escape in the middle of the night before they became the prey.
Is this the same area where the monster the Wendigo came from?
It very clearly states in this video that a member of the party warned them.
@@whitedragoness23nope. The Wendigo is an eastern and northern tribe myth. The skinwalker however originates in the Midwest/southwest.
0:30 - Chapter 1 - The journey began
2:25 - Chapter 2 - At a crossroads
2:20 - Chapter 3 - The hasting cutoff
3:25 - Chapter 4 - Banishment
4:00 - Chapter 5 - Preparing for the pass
5:00 - Chapter 6 - Donner pass
5:40 - Chapter 7 - The winter camp
6:50 - Chapter 8 - The forlorn hope
8:05 - Chapter 9 - The 1st rescue attempt
9:35 - Chapter 10 - The 2nd rescue attempt
11:25 - Chapter 11 - The 3rd rescue attempt
12:45 - Chapter 12 - The salvage party
- Chapter 13 -
- Chapter 14 -
- Chapter 15 -
John Stark was a real hero to those 7 kids. He should be remembered for what he did ❤
PBS, the American public TV network, featured this story on an episode of their program "American Experience". It's meticulous and well done. Definitely worth watching, but incredibly bleak and haunting as you'd expect. It took me a few days to shake the morose feeling it gave me.
Can confirm this is an AWESOME episode of American Experience. It used to be up on youtube, with about 5 minutes taken out of the middle for copyright reasons, but I don't know if it still is. Worth watching if you get the chance!
The guy that did a one-man relay to rescue the rest of the children? Legend!!
Maybe it’s just me, but I think it’s a bit creepy to have a recreational park where so many people died.. just doesn’t feel right.
As always, an excellent video. Definitely sad, but well researched and presented. Well done Simon and team.
It’s not just you! Holocaust/ war crime memorials are good and necessary to ensure we never forgot and allow the future to repeat such atrocities but something just rubs me wrong about commemorating a site where people were forced to eat their own children and parents.
Reminds me of my city that built and named a park after the settlement that was effectively stolen from my ancestors 2 generations ago because they tried to build town too close to a local university. We're sorry we burned down your newly built school, threatened your families, and gave you pennies on the dollar in exchange for generational wealth. But, here's a park to make you feel better about it lol.
Truckee is a huge summer and winter destination. Donner Lake is right there (named after you know who), and the memorial is practically lakeside. I've been to the memorial - it's not so much about the doom of the event but more about how they prevailed. I recall they didn't really even go into the cannibalism part. It also talks a lot about what they brought over, their attire, the natives, etc.
Well there’s so many recreational parks and reserves all over the country were natives and slaves were tortured/killed, it’s just not talked about
oh ho ho avoid the PNW of the US then. I know of 2 parks pretty close to each other where 1 commemorates a battle where settlers slaughtered Native Americans and the other commemorates an ambush where Native Americans slaughtered settlers. when i started digging into the agreed upon history of the Native American tribes of the PNW I was aghast to discover much of the tribes in the dense woodlands had a strong slave culture and continuously warred with each other over slaves. the Chichimeca tribes of central America are the next closest native tribes that conducted themselves in this way. it's not common.
Being born and raised in Reno/Sparks Nevada, The Donner Party is like the first scary story everyone is told....and sometimes when the first of autumns winds blow, the first flakes of snow fall, faintly the cries of hunger echo again reverberating off those granite walls, are then replaced by manic laughter ghostly sounds of bone crushed by an axes fall, apparitions of shadows at blizzards apex, phantom blood runs to the waters edge, residual smells of fires flare, try this meat as only the hungry dare?
Well, the comments seemed to deteriorate at record speed today.
Thank you for a well researched and presented video. You and your team always treat these topics with respect. Place hand on back and firmly pat.
Seconded with great enthusiasm 🎉
Simon! I think covering The New Mexico State Penitentiary Riot would be a great fit for this channel.
I live about an hour from there, always crazy when driving the pass to know a trip that once was a threat to your very life now we do blasting music in climate controlled comfort in little more than an hour or so along roads kept mostly passable year round.
Though, let me tell you this year was something else, lot of people moving after seeing just how dangerous a year of heavy snowfall can be. For me, views of Tahoe and the peace of living so isolated makes it all worth it
Thank you Simon - no other version of this story that I've heard says so much about the children, kessenberg or the natives.
If you want more info on the children, Keseberg, & the natives, as well as a bunch of other characters associated with the Donner party, in many cases using diary entries of party members & letters written afterwards by surviving children in the party, PBS's "American Experience" show covered the Donner party in a superlative episode that a couple of other comments here have mentioned. It's a tough watch, but totally worth it.
"It would be better that we all die, than resort to such evil. " said no one at the camp
Nyom nyom
@@lulujanuary i-💀
@@lulujanuary bork bork nyom nyoms
Some of them must have, because there was more than one person that just died and got eaten, but they didn't eat others
This should have been a real deep dive, like you do on Casual Criminalist. Over an hour please!
Donner Memorial Park is beautiful and has a lovely campground. You can get an idea of how deep the snow was by walking among the leftover tree stumps…about 12ish feet high.
The base of the monument is the height of the snow during that winter.
One hell of an ordeal for all involved - it's a foresight into what space exploration will be for future generations, full with opportunities and tragedies.
Also, the excellently named John Stark is definitely a hero and a legend for the deed that he did - much respect.
Looks like meat's back on the menu boys!
... Man flesh.
That line always confuses me. Does mordor have restaurants or food places with 'menus'. Weird thing for an orc to understand 😂
Donner kebab?
I went to Elitha Donner Elementary School, named after one of the surviving children who lived in the area after. Her grave is actually in a very small, old cemetery on the outskirts of town as well. Our shcool mascot was the Dolphin. I'm not sure if it was chosen for any particular reason or not. We obviously were taught about the Donner Party tragedy at a fairly young age since one of the members was our school's namesake and California history was taught in 4th grade when I was a kid anyway. They didn't go into gruesome details but they did recognize the deaths and cannibalism. Sometimes teaching the harsh facts of history in a concise and respectful manner is better than ignoring its existance to protect fragile minds. It was uncomfortable and eerie but not where near traumatic nor as learning about the Haulocaust only around four or five years later.
Similarly I learned about the Donner Party in 4th grade as part of Californian history, but part of that lesson was watching a documentary that did go into gruesome details. If I’m remembering correctly, they were reading out journal entries of the Donner party members, but the details were going through the details of how they sliced the flesh (naming specific body parts) and roasted it.
Fellow Elitha Donner alum! Lol I was actually just going to comment pretty much exactly what you said.
I’m going to go out on a limb and guess that your mascot was a dolphin because of alliteration. Donner Dolphins has a decent ring to it 🤷♀️
I agree that hard facts need to be learned. Even though and especially because they’re hard to hear. When tragedies make an impact, then they’re less likely to happen again.
You should of spent a little more time in English.
disgusting that a school is named after this animals
James Reed left family behind in Illinois, I am a direct descendent of those people. It’s always been interesting family history. When I was little I looked a lot like Patty. She spent the rest of her days not too far from where I live now. 😊
Going from a Brain Blaze video straight to Into the Shadows is always so jarring
Your hardships matter, but we are all pretty damned lucky to be watching a video about the donner party rather than living through it, or even just living at that time.
The past truly was the worst.
The good old days.
Those poor people probably didnt even have a dash of Tobasco sayce to help the long pig go down a little easier.😢
It's true. Even the well traveled Oregon Trail was dangerous enough
A litany of f-ups, idiocy, hubris and failure, but John Stark, what a legend!
These were clearly much sturdier people than exist now. To think of a 6 month, 1400 mile trip on foot today is incomprehensible. There is currently 600 inches (18 meters) of snow on Donner Pass. Yikes.
Sturdy or stoopid? Would you go 1400 miles through possible hostile territory with wild animals and the elements and everything else for the sake of discovery? Nah.
@@godwarrior3403discovery? No. New life? Yes
I’ll never look at a Donner kebab in the same way again…
They say that human meat taste like pork
.
.
.
Now you'll never see again gyros the same way as well 😜
You pinched my comment from me,ya bugger.👍
You say that now, but a few pints later it'll be another story
Its donair but lol anyways
@@terryarmbruster9719 don't get smart Terr Bear
Amazing story. It would be great to see the Andes plane crash story too. Acts of human survival are so inspiring
I saw the film based on that... great idea
Just want to add that John Stark is a hero and a name that should be known the world over.
Nando Parrado & Roberto Canessa, the rugby players who managed to walk out of the Andes and save their remaining friends, went on to be *absolute legends* far beyond their infamous ordeal. (Example: Dr. Canessa continued his medical studies and went on to specialize in heart surgery for newborns.) And the survivors all remain friends to this day. It's an amazing story all around. ❤
I had some trouble understanding some of what you said in this one and had to rewind on 4 or 5 occasions. Usually don't have that problem.
Weird, glad it wasn't just me! It wasn't his accent, that's easily understood, and I don't think it was the audio. More like he slurred a few words or something? Either way, same thing happened to me! 🤷🏻♀
In his defense, some of our local pronunciations are odd, and he got them wrong (as to be expected from a non-local)
@@jacquelynsmith2351 A few times it was normal words, like numbers and stuff. It's no big deal, just had to go back and listen a few times, lol but yeah never had to do that before with one of his videos. Could be a combination of things like him being tired or just needing another clearer take.
@@LadyBeyondTheWall My guess this was his 17th recording of the day.
A+ video!
Excellent story telling, writing, images, and topic.
I literally live an hour from Donner pass. I've heard these horrific stories my whole life. So tragic and so sad
Greetings, fellow Sierran.
Make a video on the South American football stuck on the Andes mountains after their plane crashed.
I struggle to feel sorry for people who make terrible decisions. I feel bad for the kids because they were just dragged along. But the adults set off a month late then went way off course because some guy told them to. Maybe don't go out into the wilderness then be surprised when it snows in winter.
They were fools deserving of pity - strung along by a snide trickster of a frontiersman.
It wasn't their fault, they had no idea the route was devised by a charlatan.
it was certainly a series of bad decisions, but fate can be just as cruel even if you do everything right.
You're right. They were given warnings not to trust the new pass by others who had already been, and they chose to believe what they wanted about the "shortcut" because it sounded good.
I see where you're coming from, but we've all gotten lost and taken wrong turns in life (literally and metaphorically), but I like to think we don't deserve to be stuck in the wilderness and forced to either eat or be eaten by our family and friends.
I'd hope that if My friends and I were in a situation and I died. I would hope that If they had to eat me to survive. They would. I mean better me than one of my smaller friends. Ain't no one surviving off them for long.
Right? I've told my family and friends that if, for whatever reason, we're ever in the situation where cannibalism is the only option besides dying.. I'm fine with them eating me. 🤷🏻♀
"The Indifferent stars above" by Daniel James Brown is a great book about the Donner Party. This video is a great abbreviated version of the story!
0:25 stick 2 the trail
*me* iguana on a stick
Yes..."iguana" meat.
Great videos simon!
You should check research on "the groet trek." How the boers crossed South Africa. Was very similar to the west march in the USA. Except they were being persecuted by the British after the brittish capture of The Capes, and Natal.
This one of the most difficult stories to follow, this the second video i watched about it and still keep losing track of who's who
The "shortcut" or second trail was harshly derided by other trail guides at that time and others that made it west
Hubris!
Errbody's gangsta till long pig's on the menu.
I live not very far from Donner Pass. Close enough for the pass to be part of our weather reports. It gets ugly up there every winter. But, they got caught in one of the worst winters we've ever seen.
He defended his wife
He was left alone to die
He survived
He came back to rescue his children
In my book that Reed guy is the definition of " alpha male"
Clown
Do not support Cannibalism Bruh... Not cool. The Holy Bible warns against it.
@@JMac-md3vj keep crying in your parents basement ❤️
An alpha would’ve asserted dominance and made them do what he wanted, clearly a Beta, and we love them
@@horribleprogram I’m just trolling bruh
I once did an extreme snowshoeing trip (extreme for me anyways)... it was 13 miles car to car along a 3700ft ridge during a blizzard. The snow was drifted up to 6 ft of powder for the middle 7 miles... I had all modern equipment and a bunch of Gatorade... I survive the excursion with some mild hypothermia, nothing that a 1 hour hot shower couldn't fix. Anyhow, stories like the Donner Party make me wonder how much further I could have pushed myself in order to survive... All I know is, the second I stopped moving I was screwed. I had cramps in my calves, thighs, and hamstrings all at the same time... Eating some pure salt tablets helped. But in my mind, I wonder if I could go 25 or 30 miles in such conditions. The guy who carried those kids out in pairs, that is super human.
When you remember all these people suffered and died like this because one man lied about a short cut
Fun fact about Keseberg that I learned in one of my college classes, though I have not substantiated the claim, though I trust the fact from the professor, he supposedly opened a very short lived restaurant.
Got confused with all the names and multiple paths/groups/ rescue atempts.
I think a map with the different groups, where they went etc. Would have helped.
Not necessarily the ID of the show but hey.
Eat tree bark. Specifically, the part between the hard bark and the wood itself. While not super nutritious that part of a tree has enough to sustain a human being for months so long as one has water to supplement it
You might have to prepare it for human consumption, though. Too much tannins could make tree bark inedible.
@@melissawickersham9912Still better than eating longpig.
@@RHCole At least tree bark doesn’t contain bad prions or other human pathogens.
@@melissawickersham9912 What he said. "Longpig" is human.
Only some trees. Not every bark is edible. Inner bark of pine is the only one in my area. Eating people who are already dead is a better bet. It's literally only a psychological hurdle and if you're down that bad, you can get over it. Just gotta make sure you eat them when they still have fat on them. Otherwise rabbit starvation will be a thing
Once you had to start cutting your own tracks, you should've known to turn back. Better to spend the time near a spring or lake at the base of the mountain for the cold season and survive (maybe not all but definitely more). Plus, you could then take the known route but seems people never like to admit they've made a mistake no matter what century you're in. Human behavior has come a long way but is also very much the same. Will we ever learn that making mistakes AND admitting so is okay?
honestly the survival cannibalism is one of the LEAST horrifying part of this ordeal
One man relay carrying those kids? What a champion.
This incident proves that everything is on the menu when a person is hungry enough.
Our modern sensibilities have a hard time fathoming the direness of this type of survival situation and it boggles the mind that you would be cutting out organs of your family member within seconds of their death, for a chance at making it out.
The levels of trauma are extreme to the levels that would break the vast majority of people. But it also shows the resilience of the Human spirit and gives weight to the adage, "Where there's a will, there's a way".
I had a classmate (for 1st through 12th grade, twelve years in a row!) who later became one of my best friends, his last name was Donner.
The Donner Party was a reoccuring topic of conversation.
And kids today won't even eat a chicken nugget that's not shaped like a dinosaur
If you want a more in-depth telling, "The Indifferent Stars Above" by Daniel James Brown is a well written novel!
My morbid soul loves picnics in the area. Have since I was a child and first heard the stories. The scenery is phenomenal.
Picnics! What do you eat? Not humans I hope.
For anyone interested in a really deep dive into this story, there’s a really magnificent book called The Indifferent Stars Above by Daniel James Brown that I highly recommend. It’s incredibly thorough, uses a lot of source material from people involved, but is entirely gripping, engaging and of course devastating. The book provides genuine understanding of the people who went through this and the layered complexities of the whole event.
So glad to see this covered here; in other instances it’s often shortchanged in pop culture references.
Lewis Keseberg is by far the creepiest member of the party to me. Starting from him reportedly beating his wife & leaving old Hardkoop to die earlier in the expedition, & ending with his insistence on staying on in the camp with the few remaining adults too sick or weak to travel (as well as Tamsin Donner who wanted to stay with her dying husband), apparently in order that he could steal their remaining property (& likely to murder Tamsin for said property), this man's cannibalism was hardly his worst trait. I know there was an initial dislike of Keseberg & his family by the rest of the party due to their immigrant status, but I really feel Keseberg's antisocial behaviour made that dislike worse. If John Stark is our hero in the Donner Saga, James Reed our antihero, & Patrick Breen our reliable narrator, Lewis Keseberg is certainly our villain. I won't say he deserved every bit of the bad treatment he received afterwards, but he did earn some of it!
Agreed! Such a unnerving man
Every time I hear something horrible, I think “Ok, it can’t get any worse..”, I hear something like “…three men will each carry one child and leave the rest to die.” I’m like “N*gga cot dammmmn!!”
Terrible editing this week Simon. It was all so abrupt
If you have any doubts - I lived both in Northern California and Northern Nevada. I've driven over the pass via I-80, and in June I've driven through snow flurries in Truckee.
Go see the pictures of what this winter did in the Sierras this year. It's still not a guarantee to survive a winter there, even in today's technology.
Their elementary school teachers should've made them all play Oregon Trail because most every kid my age learned that only dumb dumbs leave Independence in May.
There's a Donner party reference in red dead redemption 2. a frozen group of cattle near lake Isabella (Isabella was one of the survivors, for that 2nd reference)
The entire region is based on the Sierras. The trees, the weather, Ambarino West down to Tall Trees is all typical Sierra Nevada environment. Reminds me of home..
The worst part of cannibalism?... You get hungry again.
I lived in the area this happened. I was a member of a historical society that would build monuments at historical sites.
I’ve been exactly where they’ve been in the winter.
It’s not uncommon for the temperature to drop to -30 degrees. I’m not surprised they ate each other.
And here I thought it was gonna be a cult, huh
What I took from this video is that John Stark was a fucking badass.
Best. Musical. _EVER!_
Thank you for framing the event well within the context, the trip being made to take land from Indigenous people. The story is worth learning more about, and the context grounds us more properly.
Get off the, woke high horse! Weak people deserve to be concurred or in slaved. It's a human tradition and will always happen
"Of the eighteen who followed the Hastings cutoff, just 48 survived" ....math??
I live next to Truckee (now called Donner) Lake about a mile or so from the state park mentioned and with the near record amount of snow we have been hit by this winter I can very much see how they would be completely stuck. We call it "sierra cement" for a reason lol
Aren't the snow drifts until August fun though? Lol or the glaciers in parking lots and driveways.
The OG yellowjackets
I would try to not be so racist to run off the locals when they come to offer help.
madness was likely a factor in that .
moral of the entire donner party tale: STICK TO THE FUCKING PATH!
The first rule is *never take a shortcut. Ever* I've had instances just in my own life where I tried taking a shortcut and after driving around for hours would end up getting back to where I knew where I was, and either taking the original route no matter how long and looping, or just going home in defeat.
Terrific video Simon, well done 👍
I passed through Donner Pass exactly 10 yearsago
brb, i need a snack before watching this video....
John Stark is a legend
Why am i learning about this now? I started to Google when some Mormons refused to talk about it. the intrigue.
And at nearly the same time 2500 miles north the Franklin Expedition was also resorting to cannibalism in the freezing cold.
When some people say "i was born in the wrong year" this isn't what they think about. Be thankful for the day we live in, that we (in the US) don't have to risk getting hypothermia just to get some land out west. Nowa days you can drive on a few handfuls of highways, or fly to get to the other side of the country. These people had to slowly, bumpily, painfulluly, sickly, deathly travel. And you had to go off of guesses or crappy maps. We have gps and satalite imaging.
This is probably why men don't stop to ask for directions: you cannot trust what people tell you. Shortcut my @$$!
As for what I think I would do in their situation.... I would do whatever was necessary to survive and keep my family alive. Morality and whatnot is all well and good, but baser, animalistic drive is essential under such circumstances.
I need stronger glasses. I clicked thinking it said 'The Donner Party: American Cannabis' and I was about to hear the story of a notorious kebab and reefer party.
Well it did involve kebabs.
My home town is Reno, NV which is pretty much next to Donner Pass and I think it’s so fucking wild that I grew up next to the site of one of Americas most infamous horror stories. What’s really weird is there’s a restaurant there.
Those that killed to survive can be forgiven. We will do a lot out of desperation. I highly doubt that they weren't racked with guilt but desperation won. Those that murdered for gain or something else are just murderers.
I don’t remember this in the Oregon Trail video game.
Constructive criticism-I don't know if you're on a time limit, but it seems like you're talking way too fast.
Brings a whole new meaning to Donner kebab
Of all the horrifying things in this, the one that genuinely jumped out to me was the deal to take 1 kid and leave the rest to die. You’re a grown man and you can only carry one completely malnourished child??? If they each took one and last guy took 7, so 9 total kids, that’s two total trips, one carrying two kids each and one carrying one kid each. Just “eh one kid a piece should do it” like what will the rest of the people say when you’re back? Honestly the cruelest thing outside of possible murder in this story imo
The 'American Dream' certainly has some nightmares attached.
This is a horror we can’t even comprehend. I’ve done some camping and hiking in snow, nothing crazy probably around a foot or so. Even with high grade modern gear and snowshoes breaking trail is miserable. The muscles in your toes and ones you didn’t even know you have burn like the worst workout you’ve ever had. The men and women who went West back then embody the American Spirit.
After first seeing the term, it took me a while to realize 'Donner Kebab' wasn't a darkly humorous reference.
I would like to say KMS but we all know I would eat others 😂 you gotta do what u gotta do when it is life or death, survivors will carry that forever but will live
Natives have seen European-Americans eat each other before its the original story of Thanksgiving.
Simon...the last line of this video makes it sound like you think these people deserved to die in this way for wanting to find a new home. That's gross
What would I do? -- Does anyone have any Grey Poupon?