Love the way you shorten all your screws! Once the block is made and you are sure it doesn’t warp as it is being worked, great stuff. If you fins after a while it is warping and leaves some screws longer/shorter, make another block, which has holes large enough to fit the whole head of the screw through, obviously not threaded, and screw that to your block you are using right now.
John scoring your G-10 as well as the metal inlays works very well. You should also consider cleaning with alcohol or acetone before you glue to remove any oil residues that will make your glues fail. Additionally using a crisscross hatch pattern works well because the corners lock up with the glue nicely. good luck
Hello there Mr Grimsmo. Fellow Ontario resident here so I feel you on the weather getting cold lol. Just wanted to say great vid. Got a knife in the November batch I am waiting on and a February batch one as well. Just wanted to say great videos and really look forward to getting these knives. Seeing all the effort you put in makes the knives that much more special and helps justify the price lol. Keep up the awesome work brother!
Some people use a ball peen hammer to bend blades, but it leaves dents. You can also use a torch to bend blades. Once they cool they will bend toward the area that was heated. It's most effective with stainless. Practice makes perfect. You are correct about the glue. We use 80 grit sandpaper to rough up the surface. This increases the amount of "mechanical anchors" and produces an epoxy joint that is stronger than the base material. West system has an epoxy that is designed to bond dissimilar materials and metals, it's called "G-Flex".
Hey wanted to let you know use baby powder on the surface plate. Shake it on and take excess of and it will slide smoothly. That's what we do at our shop. Love the videos!
Hi John, And my best to Erik. If possible I would love to see this shop you mention so if you are able to film there . . . Take care and thanks for being so honest in admitting this, because if a blade and or handle can warp with the care you put into them, it tends to indicate that because all knife blades and or handle or scales if you will, are literally ground down to nothing on one edge only it should not come as a surprise for any blade to be warped even if slightly. Through use this may or may not get better or worsen depending on how many paint cant and gate hinges a buyer ‘adjusts’ with a $500 + knife! Very interesting none the less, even if I can’t afford one at the moment. A-N-D-- about time you got some heat in your shop, weigh the cost of not only doing so and the then constant cost against your comfort and or any business partners you show round, and a warm shop could ‘make sales’ you may not even know about, if you see what I mean, it gives an ‘air’, and forgive the unintentional PUN, of a business which is well managed, and one in which you are ‘in control of every aspect? OK so to some this may sound silly but when dad and I were working together we had showed several customers around out ’shop’ only about 4 x 7M tiny compared to yours, but the reason we had to put a very gentle heat in there was to help keep the stored wood in good condition. Everyone that visited always said, Wow, you build everything in this tiny cold shed? So it makes a difference not just to you but could bring in more customers which in turn will make the heating ‘pay its way’. Forgive my sh&t memory I just can’t think of the word I want where, people are ‘made to think’ a ‘place or item’ it nice by the way it looks more than what is ‘said’ to ’sell’ it. Take care mrbluenun
Some of the best guns, Purdy I think they are called start at around 60000 pounds, the barrels are straightened entirely by eye. So don’t feel too bad about your 2-3 thou’ out!
Hey John, Have you thought about making titanium inlays for your knives? You could anodize them the accent color which might flow well since they will be the same surface finish as the rest of the knife. Keep up the awesome work!
A surface gage works a lot better than a magnetic base for what your using it for. They have are ground on the bottom and have more surface space to slide on.
A chemical etch will probably be more effective/faster than the dremel. I would also recommend against superglue. It's fast, and fairly strong, but it is very brittle. A small shock load, and those inlays are gone.
Just a thought that you may well be straightening the unsharpened side of the blade, and unless you can precisely find where the bend starts and stops, your way in probably the ‘historically accurate’ way to straighten anything. My thoughts are whether the blade has a ‘spiral twist’ from end to end and, if this is relatively constant, for instance it may bend on the sharp side in the centre, maybe leaving a little bit more metal on the blade, to be judged by ‘test blade runs’, whether that may stop or help the bends you refer to and the warp you may get on the sharp edge?
I could get you a "last word" dial test indicator which is put out my starrett. Very high quality. I also Could get you a precision ground granite block to mount the indicator from. It's a much better and far more accurate measuring surface.
Cold working often causes internal stresses that warp the material. This is very easily fixed by annealing. for what you're doing, i think process annealing would be best. this will relieve the internal stresses of the blades, which makes them less likely to warp during heat treatment, and straighten them. hope this helps.
Annealing makes a metal more workable and ductile. However I believe the steel he is using is already annealed from factory. Anyways he would need a furnace to do this, and he already mentioned that he does not have one. And if he could have done this, he would've been able to temper and heat treat these blades by himself. A electric furnace is a massive and expensive machine. -Millwright Student 3rd year.
typically well made wood working tools like shop table saws, jointers, planers will have castings with the flatness you or any knife maker would want to gauge flatness. I own a powermatic 66 table saw that is flat as Kansas. checked it with a laser and magnetic gauge, its precision ground. Typically European equipment is even better. Point is if you own any of these types of tools(not those from lowes or sears) you have your flatness tester.
What about surface grinding a piece of stock heat treated as hard as possible then milling a slot in the face the exact thickness of the blade end to tip? Then ll you would need to do is slip each blade into the slot to check for straightness.
spray foam insulation sounds like a bad idea in a shop with a belt grinder (sparks + foam = fire?). you would have to cover it with some non-flammable barrier which kinda defeats the advantages of spray foam. am i wrong?
spamboli Yes, you are wrong. The main reason I recommend it, is that he is in a concrete block building. The pro spray foam will stick to the concrete and there will be no condensation formed on the wall. All other forms will condensate and then mould. All other forms of insulation are fragile and will need an additional covering. With the spray foam, you screw spacers onto the wall first, then he can cover with something like drywall which is cheap and fireproof/
You can get a small (9x12'') surface plate from lee valley tools for about $40CAD, flat to +-0.0001" (1 tenth). Pretty cheap, and a lot better than the chunk of granite countertop. Awesome work, as always.
Still watching the vid, but look up "cosine error" to help get accurate numbers out of your DTI - having it at a 45* angle will diminish the reading considerably.. But a simple 'does it rock' test is likely sufficient :) I doubt your norseman blades would snap like the tor did, there's clearly a huge stress riser right in the area that snapped, not so on the norseman.
What do you know, cosine error shows tons of pics of DTI's, cool! when setting it up I briefly considered the angle it was at. Thanks Rob, I didn't know about that but it makes perfect sense. And yes the Tor broke at the weak point for sure.
I'm not sure you are reading exactly the right thing. I think you are interested in having the gaps on each side of the blade even in the handle, so basically you should be checking the reference planes of the bearings with the sides of the blade (or if you feel confident enough in your machining process, the tip of the knife). Basically the light check is checking most of the length of the blade with an even attention (with a slight prime on the middle), but in your geometry, the bearings have the most influence on the result while being next to the weakest point (the pivot groove), I think they should be the prime references.
considering you used the z axis on the mill to press in the ball bearings, would it be possible to make a jig for the mill where you can attach the blade by the pivot hole then use the touch probe to measure if it is bent, then making a blunt tool that the z axis can use to push against the blade to straighten it and repeat with the touch probe until the blade is straight?
Yeah maaaaayybe, but it sounds like it would take forever and be really tricky to program and set up. Doing it by eyeball was pretty quick. I'm all for automation and appreciate the suggestion, but sometimes quick and dirty works better ;-).
Au contraire my friend. Super glue works best on a perfectly flat surface. Its not the same as paint or wood glue. Clean with meths or alcohol and make sure its smooth and it will work great.
well dont think a dovetail cutter would work so well to small radiuses in that pocket, but you could probably handgrind something for testing purposes. Turn it on the lathe and heat treat the end.. Should work. =)
If you have a milling machine why don't you use that and steed of that marble slab I think the mill would be more true.i don't know maybe you can't anyway nice work
Wikipedia says SPC means "Statistical process control", interesting stuff. On the small scale I'm trying to keep track of stuff like that, not so much for warped blades but for other things so that I can reduce wasted time and materials. It's amazing how much time you can save when you actually step back and analyze what you're doing.
Yep. I did SPC at my last job for 5 years. SPC really has (2) main goals... 1) To get a clear picture of how well a process is working... ie - putting out 'good' parts and 2) Help you determine areas prime for improvement.
Haha, I had to stop watching after 40 seconds because it was too weird. I've never turned on and read the captions before, they're pretty close for some things, but completely off base for others.
why dont you use an hair angle because with your method you will have errors at wrong angles with an hair angle you have only like an hairline touch your blade you you can see it much better
Rockness Hardwell is John's porn name.
HA!
Love the way you shorten all your screws! Once the block is made and you are sure it doesn’t warp as it is being worked, great stuff. If you fins after a while it is warping and leaves some screws longer/shorter, make another block, which has holes large enough to fit the whole head of the screw through, obviously not threaded, and screw that to your block you are using right now.
John scoring your G-10 as well as the metal inlays works very well. You should also consider cleaning with alcohol or acetone before you glue to remove any oil residues that will make your glues fail. Additionally using a crisscross hatch pattern works well because the corners lock up with the glue nicely. good luck
Great vid.Congrats on 122! I had the same thing happen. When I flip the parts over, I put a shim under to reduce chatter for the 'B' side cuts.
Hello there Mr Grimsmo. Fellow Ontario resident here so I feel you on the weather getting cold lol. Just wanted to say great vid. Got a knife in the November batch I am waiting on and a February batch one as well. Just wanted to say great videos and really look forward to getting these knives. Seeing all the effort you put in makes the knives that much more special and helps justify the price lol. Keep up the awesome work brother!
Some people use a ball peen hammer to bend blades, but it leaves dents. You can also use a torch to bend blades. Once they cool they will bend toward the area that was heated. It's most effective with stainless. Practice makes perfect.
You are correct about the glue. We use 80 grit sandpaper to rough up the surface. This increases the amount of "mechanical anchors" and produces an epoxy joint that is stronger than the base material. West system has an epoxy that is designed to bond dissimilar materials and metals, it's called "G-Flex".
Thanks bud! The torch idea is tempting, but I'd hate to ruin the temper on the blade in a certain spot.
Hey wanted to let you know use baby powder on the surface plate. Shake it on and take excess of and it will slide smoothly. That's what we do at our shop. Love the videos!
Hi John,
And my best to Erik. If possible I would love to see this shop you mention so if you are able to film there . . .
Take care and thanks for being so honest in admitting this, because if a blade and or handle can warp with the care you put into them, it tends to indicate that because all knife blades and or handle or scales if you will, are literally ground down to nothing on one edge only it should not come as a surprise for any blade to be warped even if slightly.
Through use this may or may not get better or worsen depending on how many paint cant and gate hinges a buyer ‘adjusts’ with a $500 + knife!
Very interesting none the less, even if I can’t afford one at the moment. A-N-D--
about time you got some heat in your shop, weigh the cost of not only doing so and the then constant cost against your comfort and or any business partners you show round, and a warm shop could ‘make sales’ you may not even know about, if you see what I mean, it gives an ‘air’, and forgive the unintentional PUN, of a business which is well managed, and one in which you are ‘in control of every aspect?
OK so to some this may sound silly but when dad and I were working together we had showed several customers around out ’shop’ only about 4 x 7M tiny compared to yours, but the reason we had to put a very gentle heat in there was to help keep the stored wood in good condition. Everyone that visited always said, Wow, you build everything in this tiny cold shed?
So it makes a difference not just to you but could bring in more customers which in turn will make the heating ‘pay its way’. Forgive my sh&t memory I just can’t think of the word I want where, people are ‘made to think’ a ‘place or item’ it nice by the way it looks more than what is ‘said’ to ’sell’ it.
Take care
mrbluenun
Some of the best guns, Purdy I think they are called start at around 60000 pounds, the barrels are straightened entirely by eye. So don’t feel too bad about your 2-3 thou’ out!
Will be interesting to see video where u list up all changes norseman got from 1st batch to last one-)
Hey John, Have you thought about making titanium inlays for your knives? You could anodize them the accent color which might flow well since they will be the same surface finish as the rest of the knife. Keep up the awesome work!
I've thought about it a lot! I even bought some thin titanium, can't wait to try it.
A surface gage works a lot better than a magnetic base for what your using it for. They have are ground on the bottom and have more surface space to slide on.
A chemical etch will probably be more effective/faster than the dremel. I would also recommend against superglue. It's fast, and fairly strong, but it is very brittle. A small shock load, and those inlays are gone.
Love the videos. Can't wait to get my norseman.
Just a thought that you may well be straightening the unsharpened side of the blade, and unless you can precisely find where the bend starts and stops, your way in probably the ‘historically accurate’ way to straighten anything.
My thoughts are whether the blade has a ‘spiral twist’ from end to end and, if this is relatively constant, for instance it may bend on the sharp side in the centre, maybe leaving a little bit more metal on the blade, to be judged by ‘test blade runs’, whether that may stop or help the bends you refer to and the warp you may get on the sharp edge?
I could get you a "last word" dial test indicator which is put out my starrett. Very high quality. I also Could get you a precision ground granite block to mount the indicator from. It's a much better and far more accurate measuring surface.
Love your new intro!
Cold working often causes internal stresses that warp the material. This is very easily fixed by annealing. for what you're doing, i think process annealing would be best. this will relieve the internal stresses of the blades, which makes them less likely to warp during heat treatment, and straighten them. hope this helps.
Annealing makes a metal more workable and ductile. However I believe the steel he is using is already annealed from factory.
Anyways he would need a furnace to do this, and he already mentioned that he does not have one. And if he could have done this, he would've been able to temper and heat treat these blades by himself.
A electric furnace is a massive and expensive machine.
-Millwright Student 3rd year.
you should get a flex shaft for your dremel ($30.98 at Lowes)
I want that sweet fixed blade that looks like it has a Norseman shaped blade. (Background at 1:37)
It's called a Tor, we made around 20 of them and they didn't sell well, so we're focusing on the Norseman which is selling like hotcakes!
I wish I had $600 to spend on a knife but I have no money to spare because I need a truck for my job in the spring.
typically well made wood working tools like shop table saws, jointers, planers will have castings with the flatness you or any knife maker would want to gauge flatness. I own a powermatic 66 table saw that is flat as Kansas. checked it with a laser and magnetic gauge, its precision ground. Typically European equipment is even better. Point is if you own any of these types of tools(not those from lowes or sears) you have your flatness tester.
Suggestion....move to Florida! :-D. Specially lately, the weather has been crazy everywhere else but here ;-)
What about surface grinding a piece of stock heat treated as hard as possible then milling a slot in the face the exact thickness of the blade end to tip? Then ll you would need to do is slip each blade into the slot to check for straightness.
When you do the insulation work, have a look at the pro spray form insulation- it sticks directly to the wall and prevents any condensation.
spray foam insulation sounds like a bad idea in a shop with a belt grinder (sparks + foam = fire?). you would have to cover it with some non-flammable barrier which kinda defeats the advantages of spray foam. am i wrong?
spamboli
Yes, you are wrong. The main reason I recommend it, is that he is in a concrete block building. The pro spray foam will stick to the concrete and there will be no condensation formed on the wall. All other forms will condensate and then mould. All other forms of insulation are fragile and will need an additional covering. With the spray foam, you screw spacers onto the wall first, then he can cover with something like drywall which is cheap and fireproof/
12345NoNamesLeft thanks, i stand corrected. i just don't want to see john's home burn down.
You can get a small (9x12'') surface plate from lee valley tools for about $40CAD, flat to +-0.0001" (1 tenth). Pretty cheap, and a lot better than the chunk of granite countertop.
Awesome work, as always.
You need a dog head hammer and a straight edge to take out the stress of the blade so it lays flat before he treating!
Still watching the vid, but look up "cosine error" to help get accurate numbers out of your DTI - having it at a 45* angle will diminish the reading considerably.. But a simple 'does it rock' test is likely sufficient :) I doubt your norseman blades would snap like the tor did, there's clearly a huge stress riser right in the area that snapped, not so on the norseman.
What do you know, cosine error shows tons of pics of DTI's, cool! when setting it up I briefly considered the angle it was at. Thanks Rob, I didn't know about that but it makes perfect sense.
And yes the Tor broke at the weak point for sure.
I'm not sure you are reading exactly the right thing. I think you are interested in having the gaps on each side of the blade even in the handle, so basically you should be checking the reference planes of the bearings with the sides of the blade (or if you feel confident enough in your machining process, the tip of the knife). Basically the light check is checking most of the length of the blade with an even attention (with a slight prime on the middle), but in your geometry, the bearings have the most influence on the result while being next to the weakest point (the pivot groove), I think they should be the prime references.
considering you used the z axis on the mill to press in the ball bearings, would it be possible to make a jig for the mill where you can attach the blade by the pivot hole then use the touch probe to measure if it is bent, then making a blunt tool that the z axis can use to push against the blade to straighten it and repeat with the touch probe until the blade is straight?
Yeah maaaaayybe, but it sounds like it would take forever and be really tricky to program and set up. Doing it by eyeball was pretty quick. I'm all for automation and appreciate the suggestion, but sometimes quick and dirty works better ;-).
Au contraire my friend. Super glue works best on a perfectly flat surface. Its not the same as paint or wood glue. Clean with meths or alcohol and make sure its smooth and it will work great.
mill a small negative chamfer on the inside of the inlay pockets so the glue flow out and create a wedge wit the inlay... =)
Sweeeeeeeet idea, I like it. Although I don't have any tools like that, called a dovetail cutter or a back chamfer tool.
well dont think a dovetail cutter would work so well to small radiuses in that pocket, but you could probably handgrind something for testing purposes. Turn it on the lathe and heat treat the end.. Should work. =)
If you have a milling machine why don't you use that and steed of that marble slab I think the mill would be more true.i don't know maybe you can't anyway nice work
Were abouts is that surface grinding shop? I might try to send some stuff there because I cant fix the one at my school lol its beyond broke.
Buffalo.
Instead of useing wd40 use remington Teflon oil it wont bry up as fast and I will slide better
Good work :-)
What is the current total price for a Norseman if pre-ordered?
They start at $525 USD shipped, still 9 spots left!
Are you guys still planning on producing the integral -frame flipper that you showed a 3-d model of awhile back?
Hello I am a Hong Kong people, your knife so beautiful I want to buy your knife, and how you trade?
What screws are you using? They look like Pan heads, and are they 2-56?
Not pan head, low head from knifekits, 4-40.
When your business gets large enough to warrant SPC, look me up. =o)
Wikipedia says SPC means "Statistical process control", interesting stuff. On the small scale I'm trying to keep track of stuff like that, not so much for warped blades but for other things so that I can reduce wasted time and materials. It's amazing how much time you can save when you actually step back and analyze what you're doing.
Yep. I did SPC at my last job for 5 years. SPC really has (2) main goals... 1) To get a clear picture of how well a process is working... ie - putting out 'good' parts and 2) Help you determine areas prime for improvement.
Bladeforums
Have you read the transcript for the video? It's kinda funny to read, not even close to what he is saying.
Haha, I had to stop watching after 40 seconds because it was too weird. I've never turned on and read the captions before, they're pretty close for some things, but completely off base for others.
why dont you use an hair angle because with your method you will have errors at wrong angles with an hair angle you have only like an hairline touch your blade you you can see it much better