6:34 I seriously don't think that the triumph 400x is anywhere on the same level as the RE 450, it's basically a city bike dressed up as a scrambler, I think there is a lot of difference between the two, I don't think anyone will be riding the 400x around the actual Himalayas like itchy boots did with the RE 450 😊
Agreed on the Itchy Boots adventurer demographic. But for more everyday use you now have the choice of two Indian-built bikes leveraging the history of their British brand heritage at the same price and with comparable single cylinder engines, power outputs, etc… No doubt, if you were going on an expedition the Enfield would be the one but for some light laning or just commuting it’s an interesting comparison.
I've been doing Ladakh every year for the last 15 on my RE's 500 & 650. Come this season and I for one will be on all the high passes above 5000 meters...on my new Scrambler400x. In the hills the Triumph400 scores over the 452 on account of better and more usable low end torque delivery. The 452 calls for far more gear shifting, isn't as nimble as the 400x and personally I like the Triumphs riding ergos better for long hours in the saddle...better seat too.. And those Looks...so very quintessential English, espl in green trim
Iv watch the research and the development in India that went in to this new bike some real bike experts and the thousands of hours of though that went in to it ,and the hundreds of hours driven through the Indian mountains on rough roads ,it’s a tough all steel no nonsense bike it’s kind of built like a tank not covered in plastic I like it ,it’s worth the money bang for buck ,if you could pick it up ok you can’t go wrong
23:51 when you say "signal on the phone" you do know that you can download the maps on any area you want so that all you need is a GPS signal, which you can get worldwide no matter where, but the battery issues are well known with the royal enfield app and is bad to be honest
Indeed. I was riding in Nepal and there are stretches where we don't get signal. The console kept disconnecting from the phone, forget navigation, I couldn't even control the music.
@@bikes.and.knives This was my experience in Sardinia as well - I think it's a nice idea and probably works well when you're in civilisation. But beyond that you'll still need additional devices.
One thing about Google Maps is that you can highlight a map area, quite large actually, and download all the map data, including points of interest, addresses, Topographic, Satellite imagery, etc. and that should then allow you to drive the tripper as if you had internet connectivity in that area.
I've knocked up 50,000ks in 4 years on my 650 Interceptor without any problems. After test riding this 450 and finding the pick up is as quick as my 650 I'm going to add one of these in the next month or so.
Excellent review. I would buy this bike with the tubeless tyres. Had a small test ride. Just right for the back roads and off road. What if Royal Enfield built a parallel twin using the internals of this new single? 900cc with 80bhp. How much would it cost? How well would it sell at £8,000 - a wild assumption on cost.
What will make or break this Himalayan is the price point they place it at. It will definitely need to be significantly below the price of the KTM 390 adventure if it will have a fighting chance. If it is priced too closely to the KTM, I see people choosing it over the Himalayan. They will get more for their money by doing so. Also, if the maintenance intervals are similar to the old Himalayan, it will be another downfall. Here in the USA the dealership are few and far spread. This makes for some lengthy trips just to get maintenance or serviced if there is a major problem. Finally, Looks like no carry over with accessories for the moto. It would have been awesome if you could have gotten some seat time on the previous Himalayan to better compare the two.
But the 390 Adventure is not really an adventure bike is it? Just a Duke with some minor adventure styling. Same with the Triumph 400X, just a street bike with some minor cosmetic off road styling. I think the Himalayan is a much more capable off road bike and a better choice for adventure riders. It's real competition will be bikes like the CF Moto 450MT.
How did they manage to get the wet weight a full 100 lbs heavier than a DRZ400? It can't be all the larger gas tank, can it? Certainly the DRZ could use upside down forks and fuel injection, and maybe some people want the display, but that can't explain the weight difference. I mean, at 430 lbs wet this bike is heavy for the 400-450 class. It weighs in heavy for a 650. Other than that it looks good.
@@Futuremodi Well 430 lbs is not a bad road bike weight, but it's too much for me to throw around off road, it would be exhausting. Still, a lot better than some of these large adventure bikes, which can run over 500lbs. I don't think they qualify as off road at all. Maybe I'm just getting soft in my old age, but I think a truly off road capable bike needs to be closer to 300 lbs.
Simple answer - all metal and luxury vs. plastic where possible and simplistic. I currently own a Fantic Caballero 500, which is about 50cc less yet about the same HP numbers and 40kg less. But all that means is that pretty much everything is made of plastic, the dash is super small and everything that offers extra comfort is gone. No main stand, simplistic fairings, low fuel capacity, no windscreen etc. and the engine is tuned according to that. I put on crash bars and a luggage rack and notice quiet much when I put on some luggage and gear, since with such a light weight the engine is a sporty short stroke... very revy and lots of fun, but less capable at pulling stuff along and quiet inefficient when it comes to fuel consumption... and oil, lol
I have the Hunter 350 and GT650. Last year I test rode the 411 Himalayan and Scram. After riding my Hunter 350, I found the 411 engine to be a lump, such poor power delivery, unpleasant to my ear mechanical/tractor like engine sounds. It was a no thank you deal. I was looking forward to the new 452, but will go with the CFMOTO MT450. It would not go in our modern/crazy more, more, more world but.........Put the 350cc J motor into an updated frame, loose some kgs, better suspension, brakes........That would have been a great, more "genuine" Himalayan.
Given the places the old Bullet used to get to, an explorer variant of the J motor chassis is a good idea. Semi-knobbly tyres, fork gaiters, single seat and a pannier rack as standard, and you have a budget world tourer.
It's a fair clarification, but though the native navigation on the Tripper is indeed through the proprietary phone app the mapping and everything else behind it was developed in partnership between Royal Enfield and Google, and it's the first time it's been made to work on a circular display apparently. So, I think in that sense it was reasonable to say 'powered by Google' as a shorthand way to explain it.
It’s a really good bike bang for buck the designers have done a really god job on it plenty power now 👍 the only concern iv got is ride by wire I think they should go back to cable reason is if you break down in the middle of no we’re how do you fix it ,cable would be cheaper to produce as well time will tell I suppose
Bro literally spent more than 10 mins talking about old himmy and other brands.... Atleast do some justice to the title of video and talk about the bike... instead of giving a monologue just to increase video length....
You compare it against a 450 against a 310, a 390, and a 400 ... but why not the Honda scrambler? And why does every reviewer leave out maintenance intervals as a comparison? The RE is like stepping back in time to a 70s bike when it comes to maintenance having to do valve adjustments more often which translates into a higher cost ?? Smh !!
You have a major point there! They'll just suggest your getting old and need to get with the times! Its a good bike but I can't be bothered with all the gimmicks, gadgets, bling, bells&whistles either.
the big reliability issue is the efi system same as all new efi bikes you wont fix efi with a hammer lol true reliability = simplicity eg carburetor gravity wont fail fuel pumps do as fuel pump relays sensors ect in saying that i do like this new himalayan i had the old carbed one it was a dog on motor ways for sure
He is comparing the ethos, the specification and it's place in the modern market, he doesn't need to have ridden the 411. It's a step into another market segment compared with the old model for customers not interested in the classic hype and for RE the inevitable step in the world market, the 411 sold badly almost everywhere but the UK and they desperately needed something for more general customer. I've ridden both, the 411 was absolutely nothing, a time warp back to the 56 Bullet I owned once in my youth and the 450 still uninteresting to me, it doesn't bring enough to the table compared with the competition. 50kg lighter and a more refined engine I might have though otherwise.
Don't forget, that's just opinion. We're all different, my cb500x was without a doubt the most boring bike I have ever owned (which means the nx would be the same) and the Himalayan is on pre order to replace it!
You were doing quite well until you said “ I can’t speak for those who loved the original Himalayan because I’ve never actually ridden one”…What are you talking about then…How would you know if it The 450 is like the 410 ..Why talk about the old Himalayan…Go ride a LS 410 and stop winging it..
True, I've never ridden the 410. But the objective comparisons for spec, price, performance, tech and things that I did mention are still valid without that first-hand experience, and I've compared notes with folk who have so hopefully it was clear I wasn't making any claims I couldn't back up. And, in some ways, not having that 'baggage' of projecting my views of the old one onto the new one is a bit of a fresh take, and makes it a more objective review. Thanks!
Just being honest on my thoughts .. Your review was really good and very professional.. You just blew it out of the water for me by saying you hadn’t ridden the original Himalayan..That’s after all your comparisons between the two bikes?..You need to ride both.. Sorry ‘notes’ and what you’ve been ‘told by people’ don’t cut it …Just go ride the LS410..Job done.. Wishing you all the best for the channel and ride safe 👍
@@DickieMintCycles Hopefully I’ll get the chance to do that as I’m really keen to find out how it compares. If that happens I’ll be sure to put a vid up on that as well but it’s a steep learning curve as I’m pretty new to the bikes! Cheers!
@@midlifecrisismotorcyclist You and me both.. I’m on a learning curve as well..Constructive criticism ain’t a bad thing and I learn from it..Here’s a plus..Your presentation and how you come across to your viewers is top notch and like I said ‘very professional’ ..Definitely worth subscribing to 🙂👍
@@DickieMintCycles Thank you, and I take that just as gratefully as I do the constructive criticism - both welcome as always want to do a better job. Now, I need to find someone who can lend me a 410 for a ride. Watch this space!
😉 You say po-tay-to, I say po-tah-to, to-may-to, to-mah-to, etc... I take the point, though. But it's kind of an accent thing, and much as an Indian speaker would pronounce some English place names differently from a native one so it goes the other way round I think. So let's live and let live on that one!
@@midlifecrisismotorcyclist You know what , problem is with English language itself with no fixed pronunciation rules that is why accent problem arises . Himalayan word is derived from Himalaya word from sanskrit which has very fixed pronunciation rules which are very logical . So anyone who knows the sanskrit or hindi language will always pronounce a word correctly. It is simply ignorance and arrogance to mispronounce a word which is so popular since a decade atleast. Many Aussies pronounce it perfectly .
@___SSS___ yes but because there are so many British accents, non of us speak the same in the country. We pronounce words differently because of accents! No rules will change that.
I’ll take ‘almost’ 😂 Fair comment tho and someone else mentioned they’d like to cut straight to riding so I’ll add in a link to that in description with the time stamp. Thanks for sticking with it, tho!
6:34 I seriously don't think that the triumph 400x is anywhere on the same level as the RE 450, it's basically a city bike dressed up as a scrambler, I think there is a lot of difference between the two, I don't think anyone will be riding the 400x around the actual Himalayas like itchy boots did with the RE 450 😊
Agreed on the Itchy Boots adventurer demographic. But for more everyday use you now have the choice of two Indian-built bikes leveraging the history of their British brand heritage at the same price and with comparable single cylinder engines, power outputs, etc… No doubt, if you were going on an expedition the Enfield would be the one but for some light laning or just commuting it’s an interesting comparison.
Zack Courts and Spurgeon Dunbar maybe?
I've been doing Ladakh every year for the last 15 on my RE's 500 & 650.
Come this season and I for one will be on all the high passes above 5000 meters...on my new Scrambler400x. In the hills the Triumph400 scores over the 452 on account of better and more usable low end torque delivery. The 452 calls for far more gear shifting, isn't as nimble as the 400x and personally I like the Triumphs riding ergos better for long hours in the saddle...better seat too..
And those Looks...so very quintessential English, espl in green trim
@@sanjaysharma-jf8fv Wow, that sounds amazing and I can understand your preference for the Triumph based on those factors. Have fun with that!
So did Yammienoob, too bad the bike fell apart.
Iv watch the research and the development in India that went in to this new bike some real bike experts and the thousands of hours of though that went in to it ,and the hundreds of hours driven through the Indian mountains on rough roads ,it’s a tough all steel no nonsense bike it’s kind of built like a tank not covered in plastic I like it ,it’s worth the money bang for buck ,if you could pick it up ok you can’t go wrong
For sure
I think its a lovely small capacity adventure bike and would be wonderful for a weekend away here in Oz.
OI, Oi OI !!!
My thoughts as well. So I bought one. Loving it.
Itchy boots took the new himalayan pre production bike 3000 kms around India without any issues late last year
So did Yammienoob, too bad the bike fell apart.
@@leeinwiswdym by fell apart? Can you explain?
Really excellent review of the Himalayan.
Thank you!
Seems as though with all your comparisons to the old bike you should have taken some time to ride one before going on about it for ten minutes.
🤭🤭
Exactly
Do you really consider the Triumph 400 a premium bike? Get real. Judge bikes by what they are, not your perception of the brand.
23:51 when you say "signal on the phone" you do know that you can download the maps on any area you want so that all you need is a GPS signal, which you can get worldwide no matter where, but the battery issues are well known with the royal enfield app and is bad to be honest
The app refuses to connect to the console if you don't have signal in your phone.
@@bikes.and.knives odd 🤔
Indeed. I was riding in Nepal and there are stretches where we don't get signal. The console kept disconnecting from the phone, forget navigation, I couldn't even control the music.
@@bikes.and.knives This was my experience in Sardinia as well - I think it's a nice idea and probably works well when you're in civilisation. But beyond that you'll still need additional devices.
I wish they kept the Compass, I actually like riding by map, pen and paper
One thing about Google Maps is that you can highlight a map area, quite large actually, and download all the map data, including points of interest, addresses, Topographic, Satellite imagery, etc. and that should then allow you to drive the tripper as if you had internet connectivity in that area.
I've knocked up 50,000ks in 4 years on my 650 Interceptor without any problems. After test riding this 450 and finding the pick up is as quick as my 650 I'm going to add one of these in the next month or so.
A MAN WHO SAY THAT IF YOU RAN OUT OF FUEL AND THEN SAY YOU CAN USE YAK PISS OR SOMETHING LIKE THIS . HE CANNOT BE PAID BY SOME SPONSERS 😊😊😊😊😊😊
Good morning.
The 411: The one and only !
Excellent review. Cheers
Great review, thanks!
Excellent review.
I would buy this bike with the tubeless tyres. Had a small test ride. Just right for the back roads and off road.
What if Royal Enfield built a parallel twin using the internals of this new single? 900cc with 80bhp. How much would it cost? How well would it sell at £8,000 - a wild assumption on cost.
Excellent review, well done 👍
A good thing is the air cleaner is up high under the tank away reform water
As apposed to low air cleaners on other bikes ?
Royal Enfield is Unique ....other bike (triumph and cf) is a generic and econimy bike....Himalayan is a must
What will make or break this Himalayan is the price point they place it at. It will definitely need to be significantly below the price of the KTM 390 adventure if it will have a fighting chance. If it is priced too closely to the KTM, I see people choosing it over the Himalayan. They will get more for their money by doing so. Also, if the maintenance intervals are similar to the old Himalayan, it will be another downfall. Here in the USA the dealership are few and far spread. This makes for some lengthy trips just to get maintenance or serviced if there is a major problem. Finally, Looks like no carry over with accessories for the moto. It would have been awesome if you could have gotten some seat time on the previous Himalayan to better compare the two.
But the 390 Adventure is not really an adventure bike is it? Just a Duke with some minor adventure styling. Same with the Triumph 400X, just a street bike with some minor cosmetic off road styling. I think the Himalayan is a much more capable off road bike and a better choice for adventure riders. It's real competition will be bikes like the CF Moto 450MT.
Great common sense review. thank you.
How much effort dose it take to lift up if you drop it ,is it manageable
Yes, I've tried it and easy as to lift it .
How did they manage to get the wet weight a full 100 lbs heavier than a DRZ400? It can't be all the larger gas tank, can it? Certainly the DRZ could use upside down forks and fuel injection, and maybe some people want the display, but that can't explain the weight difference. I mean, at 430 lbs wet this bike is heavy for the 400-450 class. It weighs in heavy for a 650. Other than that it looks good.
That's just an RE thing I guess. They build motorbikes like tanks. No plastics at all. The weight adds to the stability.
@@Futuremodi Well 430 lbs is not a bad road bike weight, but it's too much for me to throw around off road, it would be exhausting. Still, a lot better than some of these large adventure bikes, which can run over 500lbs. I don't think they qualify as off road at all.
Maybe I'm just getting soft in my old age, but I think a truly off road capable bike needs to be closer to 300 lbs.
I think this bike is more of a road biased adventurer with the occasional off-roading. A tourer to be loaded up with luggage and cans of fuel.
This bike is no means a dirt bike.. its more of a adventure tourer😂
Simple answer - all metal and luxury vs. plastic where possible and simplistic.
I currently own a Fantic Caballero 500, which is about 50cc less yet about the same HP numbers and 40kg less.
But all that means is that pretty much everything is made of plastic, the dash is super small and everything that offers extra comfort is gone.
No main stand, simplistic fairings, low fuel capacity, no windscreen etc. and the engine is tuned according to that.
I put on crash bars and a luggage rack and notice quiet much when I put on some luggage and gear, since with such a light weight the engine is a sporty short stroke... very revy and lots of fun, but less capable at pulling stuff along and quiet inefficient when it comes to fuel consumption... and oil, lol
I have the Hunter 350 and GT650. Last year I test rode the 411 Himalayan and Scram. After riding my Hunter 350, I found the 411 engine to be a lump, such poor power delivery, unpleasant to my ear mechanical/tractor like engine sounds. It was a no thank you deal. I was looking forward to the new 452, but will go with the CFMOTO MT450. It would not go in our modern/crazy more, more, more world but.........Put the 350cc J motor into an updated frame, loose some kgs, better suspension, brakes........That would have been a great, more "genuine" Himalayan.
Given the places the old Bullet used to get to, an explorer variant of the J motor chassis is a good idea. Semi-knobbly tyres, fork gaiters, single seat and a pannier rack as standard, and you have a budget world tourer.
Have you ridden CFMoto 450 MT?
Tft not powered by google, rather by your phone, which need to be screen on throughout.
Easy fix by software update
It's a fair clarification, but though the native navigation on the Tripper is indeed through the proprietary phone app the mapping and everything else behind it was developed in partnership between Royal Enfield and Google, and it's the first time it's been made to work on a circular display apparently. So, I think in that sense it was reasonable to say 'powered by Google' as a shorthand way to explain it.
@@midlifecrisismotorcyclistthis is not tripper thou... it's screen mirroring.
None of those reviews mentioned about google maps integration.
It’s a really good bike bang for buck the designers have done a really god job on it plenty power now 👍 the only concern iv got is ride by wire I think they should go back to cable reason is if you break down in the middle of no we’re how do you fix it ,cable would be cheaper to produce as well time will tell I suppose
I think the CF Moto 450MT will be the biggest competitor for this.
You waxed nostagic about a motorcycle that you've never ridden?
How can you justify your comparison?
Whilst it has some issues I like it. The big let down for me is the Enfield app. It sucks the life out of a phone battery like there is no tomorrow.
Bro literally spent more than 10 mins talking about old himmy and other brands.... Atleast do some justice to the title of video and talk about the bike... instead of giving a monologue just to increase video length....
Stick with it, I get to that … eventually! 😁
@@midlifecrisismotorcyclist well yeah.. what else can be done... from next video plz give time stamp...
@@relaxininspiration Good idea, will maybe add that into the description if folk want to skip the preamble/scene setting. Thanks for the feedback!
You compare it against a 450 against a 310, a 390, and a 400 ... but why not the Honda scrambler? And why does every reviewer leave out maintenance intervals as a comparison? The RE is like stepping back in time to a 70s bike when it comes to maintenance having to do valve adjustments more often which translates into a higher cost ?? Smh !!
Agree with you. I am thinking about buying a Classic 350 but... tappets adjustment every 10.000 km???? Come on...
Itchy Boots went through India not so long ago. Before the New Himalayan was even released.
Make up your mind on the front fender.
You have a major point there! They'll just suggest your getting old and need to get with the times!
Its a good bike but I can't be bothered with all the gimmicks, gadgets, bling, bells&whistles either.
I felt u overdone on talking about the old himalayan.
the big reliability issue is the efi system same as all new efi bikes you wont fix efi with a hammer lol true reliability = simplicity eg carburetor gravity wont fail fuel pumps do as fuel pump relays sensors ect in saying that i do like this new himalayan i had the old carbed one it was a dog on motor ways for sure
This video is gonna increase your subscribers
Its a completely different bike. It’s not an evolution. It just isn’t. This is simply a company using a brand’s equity because it’s there.
Why are there so many videos about the 450 done by people who have no idea about the previous model and just talk promos. We need real reviews.
He is comparing the ethos, the specification and it's place in the modern market, he doesn't need to have ridden the 411. It's a step into another market segment compared with the old model for customers not interested in the classic hype and for RE the inevitable step in the world market, the 411 sold badly almost everywhere but the UK and they desperately needed something for more general customer.
I've ridden both, the 411 was absolutely nothing, a time warp back to the 56 Bullet I owned once in my youth and the 450 still uninteresting to me, it doesn't bring enough to the table compared with the competition. 50kg lighter and a more refined engine I might have though otherwise.
Once the hype is over the price needs to come down. It’s not far off Honda nx500 prices which is a better bike
Don't forget, that's just opinion. We're all different, my cb500x was without a doubt the most boring bike I have ever owned (which means the nx would be the same) and the Himalayan is on pre order to replace it!
No such thing as this bike is better then that...... Or this... Is it better for me? is it for you? test ride it if you like it that's it
It's really a Jeep Wrangler vs Landrover Defender comparison you're trying to pull here
Can it be fixed with hammers ? That's pure gold. Still laughing.
Yes, it’s a proper Himalayan, because RE made it and it says “Himalayan” on the bike😂
You were doing quite well until you said “ I can’t speak for those who loved the original Himalayan because I’ve never actually ridden one”…What are you talking about then…How would you know if it The 450 is like the 410 ..Why talk about the old Himalayan…Go ride a LS 410 and stop winging it..
True, I've never ridden the 410. But the objective comparisons for spec, price, performance, tech and things that I did mention are still valid without that first-hand experience, and I've compared notes with folk who have so hopefully it was clear I wasn't making any claims I couldn't back up. And, in some ways, not having that 'baggage' of projecting my views of the old one onto the new one is a bit of a fresh take, and makes it a more objective review. Thanks!
Just being honest on my thoughts .. Your review was really good and very professional.. You just blew it out of the water for me by saying you hadn’t ridden the original Himalayan..That’s after all your comparisons between the two bikes?..You need to ride both.. Sorry ‘notes’ and what you’ve been ‘told by people’ don’t cut it …Just go ride the LS410..Job done.. Wishing you all the best for the channel and ride safe 👍
@@DickieMintCycles Hopefully I’ll get the chance to do that as I’m really keen to find out how it compares. If that happens I’ll be sure to put a vid up on that as well but it’s a steep learning curve as I’m pretty new to the bikes! Cheers!
@@midlifecrisismotorcyclist You and me both.. I’m on a learning curve as well..Constructive criticism ain’t a bad thing and I learn from it..Here’s a plus..Your presentation and how you come across to your viewers is top notch and like I said ‘very professional’ ..Definitely worth subscribing to 🙂👍
@@DickieMintCycles Thank you, and I take that just as gratefully as I do the constructive criticism - both welcome as always want to do a better job. Now, I need to find someone who can lend me a 410 for a ride. Watch this space!
It's pronounced as Himaalayan not him-lay-in .🙏
Himabrit, Himadontcare
😉 You say po-tay-to, I say po-tah-to, to-may-to, to-mah-to, etc... I take the point, though. But it's kind of an accent thing, and much as an Indian speaker would pronounce some English place names differently from a native one so it goes the other way round I think. So let's live and let live on that one!
@@midlifecrisismotorcyclist You know what , problem is with English language itself with no fixed pronunciation rules that is why accent problem arises . Himalayan word is derived from Himalaya word from sanskrit which has very fixed pronunciation rules which are very logical . So anyone who knows the sanskrit or hindi language will always pronounce a word correctly. It is simply ignorance and arrogance to mispronounce a word which is so popular since a decade atleast. Many Aussies pronounce it perfectly .
@___SSS___ yes but because there are so many British accents, non of us speak the same in the country. We pronounce words differently because of accents! No rules will change that.
What does it matter??
WHO CARES ??
It IS IRRELEVENT.
No one cares.
It is NOT important.
It took 4.48 mins to see you ride & review...almost got bored with the yapping
I’ll take ‘almost’ 😂 Fair comment tho and someone else mentioned they’d like to cut straight to riding so I’ll add in a link to that in description with the time stamp. Thanks for sticking with it, tho!
The new RE Himalayan 450 with tube tire...
What a shame RE !!
Other than that the bike is not cheap but It's priced low
Tubeless tires is available
starring of the videos your bike landed wrong ,your bike must land on back wheels not on front
This was literally the first time I've ever jumped a bike so bear with me on that but I'll take that onboard for next time! Thanks!
Now do one with a decent sized motor
The 411 had original design. This looks like every other Indian brand motorcycle. Bland. Design wise speaking.
Interestingly honda is copying the original design
Agree..blands the word. Lacks personality in trying to be too many things all at once
@@sanjaysharma-jf8fv I actually like that it's trying to be more practical than aesthetic.
An ADV Should be build with that ethos in mind.