Also as an airplane owner, you can do alot of maintenance yourself. If you are mechanically inclined you can get your A&P as well. That way you can really get to know your plane.
Agreed! I've got a few videos on the channel highlighting exactly this. Every owner should become involved in maintenance both for the knowledge, and cost savings. I did practically everything possible on my Arrow, Diamond, and Bonanza under the supervision of two great friends who happen to be A&Ps. I'm likely going for my A&P in 2025.
This is very timely, I have started the process in getting my first airplane , my wife wants something much bigger than what I think is required. I really like the fact that you say, get something that does 60% of your mission. This was very helpful, thank you!
@@jarbo007 Congratulations! The fact your wife is even having the conversation is a huge win I'm celebrating with you. The significant other always wants more airplane than you'll need! With that said, if you get a partner in an airplane it cuts your expenses and your wife gets what she wants which I'm told, is the key to happiness and self fulfillment. Another option is to go to your airport and find a "reciprocal partner". They already have a big expensive to operate airplane, you buy a small and affordable to operate airplane, and swap when your mission dictates or when one is down for maintenance. Sharing isn't for everyone but it is a viable option especially in this economy and when you realize the airplane will sit unused 90%+ of the time. There are many ways to slice this cake. No one size fits all. whatever you do, just enjoy the process and feel free to bounce ideas off me here. Someone else will benefit. Disclaimer: I'm not in sales and not a broker. I just do a lot of airplane stuff.
@@OpenSourceGA It is certainly something that I am considering. I am really enjoying your channel sir, and keep the content coming. I know I can sit and talk airplanes all day, and forget where the day has gone. Ironically, I have already gotten the quotes and made up my per hour spreadsheet so I can show the wife all the numbers that go into the expense. If you ever want to talk the day away about airplanes and aviation, please don't hesitate to hit me up.
Really enioyed this video. I've owned two airplanes - one on my own, and the current one in a partnership - and i liked the mix of common wisdom on this topic and some great insight (do things in reverse). Thanks. Looking forward to combing your other vids and getting your takes on other topics!
I’m glad you stumbled into the channel! Tell us what you flew? I’m by no means the most educated presenter, but my experiences in this short time are worth sharing to help the next person along their journey.
@OpenSourceGA I owned a Cherokee 140 in my own that I got my private and instrument tickets in. I've got a few videos on my channel of that airplane. I now own a Cherokee 235 in a partnership. I've got a few videos of that too. I'm a huge fan of instrument flying. But I'm constantly looking for my next airplane. Trying to decide if I build one. Or if I stick to certified. Maybe a twin. A twin comanche is one of my favorite airplanes. Or maybe a Piper Malibu so that I can get into the flight levels with a pressurized cabin. I don't know.
At my core I'm a Piper fan. Spent years as the mentee of Karl Bergey one of the original designers of the PA28. My A&P has a Twin Comanche and it's a great cross country machine and burns almost the same fuel as my Bonanza with its 2 smaller engines. Great thought on going experimental: that's truly the smart and progressive way to go IF you keep something else flying while you build. "If you want to build, build, if you want to fly, fly...if you want to do both, keep access to your 235". Experimentals address the need for modernization and safety improvements through common sense applications of readily available technology that I'd be fined for adding to my 60 yr old airplanes. If I could, I'd get into a RV10, Lancair ES or Sling TSi personally. About to do a deep dive on your channel!
Some good advice. A partnership is also a great option. Sharing the fixed costs can go a long way and help you afford a better airplane. The partner you choose is critically important.
Thanks for stopping by! And agreed on the partnership - I started an equity non-profit flying club (a few more members than a partnership) and it ran great for 5 years until we lost our parking, fuel at the airfield, and had an engine make metal all within the same quarter. Would do it again and they would too - the people are the key. Great team we had.
This is great info! Especially the part about choosing aircraft based on insurance costs rather than trying to get insurance after buying the airplane you want. Also, it’s about time someone mentions that it’s ok to leave your plane outside if that’s all you have access to or can afford. It’s not ideal, but hangar access should not be used as a gate keeping tool to keep people out of aviation.
Thank you good Sir! The hangar availability excuse to ownership really grinds my gears. I’ve had arguments with friends because they shop around for YEARS for the perfect airplane that they’re only going to "keep inside" and miss out on some of the best flying opportunities of their lifetime. There are $45/mo tie downs available near me. If I was in the open, I'd just use the difference in the cost of the hangar on more gas for flying, airplane covers, LPS-2 for monthly lubrication regime, and a regularly timed ceramic coating/wax and be good with it. Oh and good fuel cap and window seals. As poor as you will be while in school I figured you'd endorse this message.
@@OpenSourceGA Looks good- I would have liked a shot of the cargo area, but that's me. my 60% is solo or dual, cross country and/or camping so how much crap it'll haul, and do I have to pack it down tight like in say a Flight Design which seems to have almost no cargo area.. I know what I want to see in an ad- in order, a 3/4 view of the outside, then the panel (1-2 pics), then the interior (1-2 pics), then whatever else. Engine, tires, random cosmetic squawks...
Yea you're not putting much of anything into any of these side by side light trainers - that's just not what they're built for. The baggage area of this airplane is just the shelf behind the seats so think overnight duffel bags for 1 or 2 people. Maybe a small tent and a backpack.
My wife is gonna be mad because this is making me more set on buying an airplane. I want a Luscombe 8, I fly for fun and stress release and nothing fits that bill better than a classic taildragger. low time examples often sell for under 30k, Insurance is probably the biggest initial hurdle because tailwheel, but it will go down significantly once you have the tailwheel hours. I picked the Luscombe specifically because although it’s a classic taildragger most of them are all aluminum so they should be ok stored outside as long as it’s covered, maintained, and flown regularly. That would allow me to park it at the airport five minutes from my house and live the dream to be able to go up for a quick hop basically on a whim when the weather is nice, even before or after work. My one real worry about buying an airplane is that I fund my aviation hobby with overtime and while I’ve made 20k plus in overtime the last couple years which paid for my ppl with lots left over, there is always the possibility that overtime dries up and leaves me hanging after I take on a 10k a year airplane.
Your wife will initially be mad, then love it when your blood pressure is reduced, you leave the house from time to time to give her peace, and she gets to tell her friends that you're out flying your airplane - how cool are you! The Luscombe 8 is the perfect example of an airplane that is all about pure flying - no bells and whistles and your avionics package will fit on your lap (an iPad + a Sentry). It's also gorgeous so your Facebook photos are about to be improved. The great news here is yes, your costs are going to be significantly lower than the not so comparable Cherokee or 172 and your mission will be fulfilled easily. Develop a habit of lubricating the airframe and anything that moves/articulates monthly (I use LPS-2 on my Arrow and Bonanza on the last flying day of every month, the Luscombe Association will probably have better input). By the way, my fuselage cover was $500 but my airplanes are larger, and I went with a more expensive company. You could add wing covers, etc. for the cost of 2 months in a hangar and be happy. My advice is to go out and start that tailwheel training now if you can. That way when you do get insurance quotes, you already have some tailwheel time and that might help the numbers. Another option of course if you own the airplane outright (no loans), and I do not necessarily endorse this, but it is an option: have liability-only coverage and good health insurance/AD&D so you cover the 'other guy's' property that you damage and you hopefully walk away from the airplane albeit uncompensated...your situation and risk tolerance might vary but statistically, this could work well. Again - not a suggestion and I'm not a broker or associated with one. The wife might also have something to say about that. The last bit of well-intentioned rant that I have here is yes, sh*t is in fact, going to happen. Don't sugar coat it, don't let it surprise you either. The job might change, the economy might go flatter, your engine might cough up a rocker 10 hours after overhaul - have all of those things in your mind so WHEN it DOES happen, there's little to no shock and awe, just momentary panic, sadness, and a well-made plan to recover like all good pilots should have. There's nothing you're going to experience flying, buying, and owning an airplane, that thousands of other real pilots and owners haven't yet so, learn from them as you go (which is why I assume you've landed on this channel - nice job). Have a plan. In those cases, you'll be happy to know that finding a partner or two in any airworthy airplane is easy. There will be several local aviators looking to build time and fly your exact mission in a cool airplane like a Luscombe 8 and can buy in for an equity stake, or non-equity position as you desire. I started a non-profit, equity flying club in 2018 so I have some idea of what I'm talking about here. I guarantee you the number of times you'll want to go fly will not be significantly impacted by one or two partners, as much as our 13 members never butted heads over airplane availability - no one flies as much as they think they will. Of course, there's always using the airplane to generate revenue by letting it get used as a tailwheel trainer - you'll find a way! Settle for no excuse.
@ That’s a lot of good advice, it can be hard to find info on the nitty gritty of ownership. Most social media pilots showcase the pretty side. 😝 I did find a nearby school with a Champ and tailwheel instructor, so I should have my endorsement and some hours by the time I find right plane. I’d rather finance than dig 30k into my savings so the bank will require hull insurance, which is fine with such a big investment. I was able to get a hull insurance quote for an Aeronca Chief I considered when I was still a 20 hour student pilot so I know it’s doable. You’re probably also correct that once I bring the plane to a local airport there will likely be pilots willing to buy in if I need to spread costs. There’s so many possibilities, If I get my CFI down the road maybe I could replace overtime with tailwheel flight instruction as my supplementary income source. I’m convinced, now I just have to do the legwork.
@@Durandalski absolutely target becoming a CFI. We need more CFIs whose mission isn't only to build time to go to the airlines. They're doing a disservice to so many students, leaving them high and dry and passing them around at the most inopportune times. Love the path you're on! Please keep us updated. You've inspired me to post a part two to this video. I'm scripting it now. Can't wait for you to send me a video saying "so...I bought an airplane..."
What a load of crap. Unless you have $20k PER YEAR of money you can throw away you cannot afford an airplane. A $400/mo hangar is already $5k even if you never fly an hour. And most people have a loan, another $500 a month or $6k a year. Annual is another $2k if you are lucky. Insurance is $1200 a month for $50k hull damage + liability or $14,400 a year. That alone is $25k and you have not flown ONE HOUR.
Thanks for the counter view! I did say in the beginning of the video that its bad advice and if $10 is your budget...then there's your answer. This video really only applies to the people who really want an airplane - not everyone does and that's fine. Your numbers are far off for the types of airplanes we're flying on my channel. But a $35/month tie down (like I talked about) a loan for a $30,000 airplane, insurance at $1,000/yr, the fact that I have close friends who are A&Ps, I do anything I'm competent and legal to do with or without supervision, means that flying 5 hours a month has me breaking even vs. renting. That's what my whole channel shows. If you can't afford it or if it's not a priority, then it's immediately a non starter and you're absolutely right!
There is a myth you are perpetuating. It's the myth that aviation is not affordable unless you're a trust fund baby. Here's the truth to counter your falsehoods. If you have ever received a quote for $1200 a month for $50k hull I will personally pay you $100 upon receipt of proof UNLESS you have crashed an airplane or dont have a drivers license, medical, or pilots license. Completely false. I pay $1100 per YEAR for $100k hull and an increased personal injury amount for a plane on a grass runway. $100 a month is obtainable for insurance. Tie downs are available here (Oklahoma) for $50/mo or less. And I have a hobby of making note of any planes on barnstormers within an hour drive for less than $30k and they come up quite often. A local bank I work with will loan $30k on a used plane with a small down payment and amortize for 60 months or 72 months. This will end up being about $500/mo. So for under $750/mo you could have a plane to fly. Make friends with mechanics who are also pilots and let them have time for helping with maintenance. Make friends with other pilots and share costs..... Jawanza is doing it right because he didn't believe it when people said "it's too expensive" or "it can't be done". Keep up the awesome vids J!
![Lp. Сердце Вселенной #60 РОЖДЕНИЕ ЛОЛОЛОШКИ [Финал] • Майнкрафт](http://i.ytimg.com/vi/YoR0pAV9FVQ/mqdefault.jpg)
Also as an airplane owner, you can do alot of maintenance yourself. If you are mechanically inclined you can get your A&P as well. That way you can really get to know your plane.
Agreed! I've got a few videos on the channel highlighting exactly this. Every owner should become involved in maintenance both for the knowledge, and cost savings. I did practically everything possible on my Arrow, Diamond, and Bonanza under the supervision of two great friends who happen to be A&Ps. I'm likely going for my A&P in 2025.
This is very timely, I have started the process in getting my first airplane , my wife wants something much bigger than what I think is required. I really like the fact that you say, get something that does 60% of your mission. This was very helpful, thank you!
@@jarbo007 Congratulations! The fact your wife is even having the conversation is a huge win I'm celebrating with you. The significant other always wants more airplane than you'll need! With that said, if you get a partner in an airplane it cuts your expenses and your wife gets what she wants which I'm told, is the key to happiness and self fulfillment. Another option is to go to your airport and find a "reciprocal partner". They already have a big expensive to operate airplane, you buy a small and affordable to operate airplane, and swap when your mission dictates or when one is down for maintenance. Sharing isn't for everyone but it is a viable option especially in this economy and when you realize the airplane will sit unused 90%+ of the time. There are many ways to slice this cake. No one size fits all. whatever you do, just enjoy the process and feel free to bounce ideas off me here. Someone else will benefit. Disclaimer: I'm not in sales and not a broker. I just do a lot of airplane stuff.
@@OpenSourceGA It is certainly something that I am considering. I am really enjoying your channel sir, and keep the content coming. I know I can sit and talk airplanes all day, and forget where the day has gone. Ironically, I have already gotten the quotes and made up my per hour spreadsheet so I can show the wife all the numbers that go into the expense. If you ever want to talk the day away about airplanes and aviation, please don't hesitate to hit me up.
You got it!
New to your channel and this episode was really encouraging to me. After watching this my dream of owning an airplane is possible. Thank you.
Welcome aboard! Glad I could help in whatever little way. The dream is indeed attainable. What’s your ideal airplane/mission?
Really enioyed this video. I've owned two airplanes - one on my own, and the current one in a partnership - and i liked the mix of common wisdom on this topic and some great insight (do things in reverse).
Thanks. Looking forward to combing your other vids and getting your takes on other topics!
I’m glad you stumbled into the channel! Tell us what you flew? I’m by no means the most educated presenter, but my experiences in this short time are worth sharing to help the next person along their journey.
@OpenSourceGA I owned a Cherokee 140 in my own that I got my private and instrument tickets in. I've got a few videos on my channel of that airplane. I now own a Cherokee 235 in a partnership. I've got a few videos of that too.
I'm a huge fan of instrument flying. But I'm constantly looking for my next airplane. Trying to decide if I build one. Or if I stick to certified. Maybe a twin. A twin comanche is one of my favorite airplanes. Or maybe a Piper Malibu so that I can get into the flight levels with a pressurized cabin. I don't know.
At my core I'm a Piper fan. Spent years as the mentee of Karl Bergey one of the original designers of the PA28. My A&P has a Twin Comanche and it's a great cross country machine and burns almost the same fuel as my Bonanza with its 2 smaller engines.
Great thought on going experimental: that's truly the smart and progressive way to go IF you keep something else flying while you build. "If you want to build, build, if you want to fly, fly...if you want to do both, keep access to your 235". Experimentals address the need for modernization and safety improvements through common sense applications of readily available technology that I'd be fined for adding to my 60 yr old airplanes. If I could, I'd get into a RV10, Lancair ES or Sling TSi personally.
About to do a deep dive on your channel!
Some good advice. A partnership is also a great option. Sharing the fixed costs can go a long way and help you afford a better airplane. The partner you choose is critically important.
Thanks for stopping by! And agreed on the partnership - I started an equity non-profit flying club (a few more members than a partnership) and it ran great for 5 years until we lost our parking, fuel at the airfield, and had an engine make metal all within the same quarter. Would do it again and they would too - the people are the key. Great team we had.
Really good as usual. Way to use your b roll to hold attention as you voiceover.
I've always wanted to share the stuff I have never put out there. Love using this platform for it. Thank!
This is great info! Especially the part about choosing aircraft based on insurance costs rather than trying to get insurance after buying the airplane you want. Also, it’s about time someone mentions that it’s ok to leave your plane outside if that’s all you have access to or can afford. It’s not ideal, but hangar access should not be used as a gate keeping tool to keep people out of aviation.
Thank you good Sir! The hangar availability excuse to ownership really grinds my gears. I’ve had arguments with friends because they shop around for YEARS for the perfect airplane that they’re only going to "keep inside" and miss out on some of the best flying opportunities of their lifetime. There are $45/mo tie downs available near me. If I was in the open, I'd just use the difference in the cost of the hangar on more gas for flying, airplane covers, LPS-2 for monthly lubrication regime, and a regularly timed ceramic coating/wax and be good with it. Oh and good fuel cap and window seals. As poor as you will be while in school I figured you'd endorse this message.
Nice video!
Thanks! Appreciate you stopping by! I'll take a minute to watch your content also.
I see the Diamond for sale on Trade-A-Plane this morning...
How'd I do with the photos?
@@OpenSourceGA Looks good- I would have liked a shot of the cargo area, but that's me. my 60% is solo or dual, cross country and/or camping so how much crap it'll haul, and do I have to pack it down tight like in say a Flight Design which seems to have almost no cargo area..
I know what I want to see in an ad- in order, a 3/4 view of the outside, then the panel (1-2 pics), then the interior (1-2 pics), then whatever else. Engine, tires, random cosmetic squawks...
Yea you're not putting much of anything into any of these side by side light trainers - that's just not what they're built for. The baggage area of this airplane is just the shelf behind the seats so think overnight duffel bags for 1 or 2 people. Maybe a small tent and a backpack.
First!
There he is!
The best situation is having a FRIEND with an aircraft. Just like a friend with a boat or a beach house. =)
This is correct and actually great advice 😂
My wife is gonna be mad because this is making me more set on buying an airplane. I want a Luscombe 8, I fly for fun and stress release and nothing fits that bill better than a classic taildragger. low time examples often sell for under 30k, Insurance is probably the biggest initial hurdle because tailwheel, but it will go down significantly once you have the tailwheel hours. I picked the Luscombe specifically because although it’s a classic taildragger most of them are all aluminum so they should be ok stored outside as long as it’s covered, maintained, and flown regularly. That would allow me to park it at the airport five minutes from my house and live the dream to be able to go up for a quick hop basically on a whim when the weather is nice, even before or after work. My one real worry about buying an airplane is that I fund my aviation hobby with overtime and while I’ve made 20k plus in overtime the last couple years which paid for my ppl with lots left over, there is always the possibility that overtime dries up and leaves me hanging after I take on a 10k a year airplane.
Your wife will initially be mad, then love it when your blood pressure is reduced, you leave the house from time to time to give her peace, and she gets to tell her friends that you're out flying your airplane - how cool are you! The Luscombe 8 is the perfect example of an airplane that is all about pure flying - no bells and whistles and your avionics package will fit on your lap (an iPad + a Sentry). It's also gorgeous so your Facebook photos are about to be improved. The great news here is yes, your costs are going to be significantly lower than the not so comparable Cherokee or 172 and your mission will be fulfilled easily. Develop a habit of lubricating the airframe and anything that moves/articulates monthly (I use LPS-2 on my Arrow and Bonanza on the last flying day of every month, the Luscombe Association will probably have better input). By the way, my fuselage cover was $500 but my airplanes are larger, and I went with a more expensive company. You could add wing covers, etc. for the cost of 2 months in a hangar and be happy.
My advice is to go out and start that tailwheel training now if you can. That way when you do get insurance quotes, you already have some tailwheel time and that might help the numbers. Another option of course if you own the airplane outright (no loans), and I do not necessarily endorse this, but it is an option: have liability-only coverage and good health insurance/AD&D so you cover the 'other guy's' property that you damage and you hopefully walk away from the airplane albeit uncompensated...your situation and risk tolerance might vary but statistically, this could work well. Again - not a suggestion and I'm not a broker or associated with one. The wife might also have something to say about that.
The last bit of well-intentioned rant that I have here is yes, sh*t is in fact, going to happen. Don't sugar coat it, don't let it surprise you either. The job might change, the economy might go flatter, your engine might cough up a rocker 10 hours after overhaul - have all of those things in your mind so WHEN it DOES happen, there's little to no shock and awe, just momentary panic, sadness, and a well-made plan to recover like all good pilots should have. There's nothing you're going to experience flying, buying, and owning an airplane, that thousands of other real pilots and owners haven't yet so, learn from them as you go (which is why I assume you've landed on this channel - nice job).
Have a plan.
In those cases, you'll be happy to know that finding a partner or two in any airworthy airplane is easy. There will be several local aviators looking to build time and fly your exact mission in a cool airplane like a Luscombe 8 and can buy in for an equity stake, or non-equity position as you desire. I started a non-profit, equity flying club in 2018 so I have some idea of what I'm talking about here. I guarantee you the number of times you'll want to go fly will not be significantly impacted by one or two partners, as much as our 13 members never butted heads over airplane availability - no one flies as much as they think they will. Of course, there's always using the airplane to generate revenue by letting it get used as a tailwheel trainer - you'll find a way! Settle for no excuse.
@ That’s a lot of good advice, it can be hard to find info on the nitty gritty of ownership. Most social media pilots showcase the pretty side. 😝
I did find a nearby school with a Champ and tailwheel instructor, so I should have my endorsement and some hours by the time I find right plane. I’d rather finance than dig 30k into my savings so the bank will require hull insurance, which is fine with such a big investment. I was able to get a hull insurance quote for an Aeronca Chief I considered when I was still a 20 hour student pilot so I know it’s doable. You’re probably also correct that once I bring the plane to a local airport there will likely be pilots willing to buy in if I need to spread costs. There’s so many possibilities, If I get my CFI down the road maybe I could replace overtime with tailwheel flight instruction as my supplementary income source.
I’m convinced, now I just have to do the legwork.
@@Durandalski absolutely target becoming a CFI. We need more CFIs whose mission isn't only to build time to go to the airlines. They're doing a disservice to so many students, leaving them high and dry and passing them around at the most inopportune times. Love the path you're on! Please keep us updated. You've inspired me to post a part two to this video. I'm scripting it now. Can't wait for you to send me a video saying "so...I bought an airplane..."
Haha feeling personally attacked by that intro.
Called out!! Haha - take that feeling and turn it into something positive. Just let me know how I can help.
What a load of crap. Unless you have $20k PER YEAR of money you can throw away you cannot afford an airplane. A $400/mo hangar is already $5k even if you never fly an hour. And most people have a loan, another $500 a month or $6k a year. Annual is another $2k if you are lucky. Insurance is $1200 a month for $50k hull damage + liability or $14,400 a year. That alone is $25k and you have not flown ONE HOUR.
Thanks for the counter view! I did say in the beginning of the video that its bad advice and if $10 is your budget...then there's your answer. This video really only applies to the people who really want an airplane - not everyone does and that's fine. Your numbers are far off for the types of airplanes we're flying on my channel. But a $35/month tie down (like I talked about) a loan for a $30,000 airplane, insurance at $1,000/yr, the fact that I have close friends who are A&Ps, I do anything I'm competent and legal to do with or without supervision, means that flying 5 hours a month has me breaking even vs. renting. That's what my whole channel shows. If you can't afford it or if it's not a priority, then it's immediately a non starter and you're absolutely right!
There is a myth you are perpetuating. It's the myth that aviation is not affordable unless you're a trust fund baby. Here's the truth to counter your falsehoods. If you have ever received a quote for $1200 a month for $50k hull I will personally pay you $100 upon receipt of proof UNLESS you have crashed an airplane or dont have a drivers license, medical, or pilots license. Completely false. I pay $1100 per YEAR for $100k hull and an increased personal injury amount for a plane on a grass runway. $100 a month is obtainable for insurance. Tie downs are available here (Oklahoma) for $50/mo or less. And I have a hobby of making note of any planes on barnstormers within an hour drive for less than $30k and they come up quite often. A local bank I work with will loan $30k on a used plane with a small down payment and amortize for 60 months or 72 months. This will end up being about $500/mo. So for under $750/mo you could have a plane to fly. Make friends with mechanics who are also pilots and let them have time for helping with maintenance. Make friends with other pilots and share costs..... Jawanza is doing it right because he didn't believe it when people said "it's too expensive" or "it can't be done". Keep up the awesome vids J!