Check Out This High Capacity DIY Lifepo4 Battery Box Kit!
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- Опубліковано 20 лип 2023
- This video is about the Apexium Lifepo4 DIY battery box kit that is sold by Jenny Wu with Docan Technologies. In this video I show how the kit comes and compare it to the boxes I build in my shop and have shown on this channel. If you are interested in purchasing one of these, you can contact her at Jennywu896@gmail.com and she will get you sorted. If you want me to get credit for this contact, just mention my channel and I will get a small commission. The price will be the same either way so just do what makes you feel comfortable. In the next video I will show what it is like to assemble the kit and what I would do a bit different. Thanks for watching.
Thanks again Ray, I am really pleased, that Jenny is being of great assistance to you as well as the Solar Community.
YES - a BOX - PERFECT - LOVE your Wood Boxes - but NEED metal Boxes for this project !!!!!!!
This review is what I absolutely needed.. have been on the fence in pulling the trigger in this kit.. trying to find some one with a review that's legit.. you sir have earned my respect and subscription.. I appreciate all that you are doing!!!!
look forward to continuing and as detailed as possible 🥳
Thanks good job. Watching from South Africa
Good Video Ray! Hope to see you at Summer Camp!
Appreciate the detailed video, hope the leg gets back to 100% real soon.
Nice video ❤
witing for review
Very interesting. I know I would love to be able to build wooden boxes like yours, but I lack the tools, the space, and the skill-knowledge. This solution just might be the ticket to help me get there.
Morning Ray, from Australia.
Heya, a batterie box kit for diy that'ss intresting can't wait to see that vlog
Just got my batteries from Jenny so far so good haven't done a capacity test hoping to do that soon. Only took 40 days to get them from China. I prefer wood boxes because it's cheap, and easy to make. Mine won't be as nice as yours they do the job. I try to use scrap wood if I can find it. Pallets will work if they are in good shape. Sheet of ply isn't all that much. I want to design mine so it's on casters I can double stack it. HF sells casters easily handle the weight. My shed has a concrete floor easy to roll them on.
Nice work Ray. I was wondering when some high quality boxes would appear for DIY. Rules are tightening in Australia regarding battery containers... life gets more difficult
Yes battery box. ⚡🔋👍
This kit is a great idea! It looks like it should be a fairly straightforward build. I would be very much interested in the way this kit will go together, I would also be interested in the cost comparison between building from the wooden box frame and the steel box frame.
Will do!
wel, well, well, look what the cat drag in/ good to see you
Good stuff - look forward to seeing the outcome. You probably will not have the room to add the class t fuse.
I went with the Seplos Mason 280ah 14KW DIY kits. The build is excellent, and the ability to parallel the units is great for monitoring.
They are heavy though.
Looks like your kit is also made by Seplos.
One tip for easy access, build a rack so you can slide the units out for service. Stacking works, but only the top battery is accessable.
Seplos doesn’t make them but they are probably made in the same factory. I don’t think Seplos is a manufacturer in the true sense of the word.
The fuse they include, if it is a proper branded and rated one will likely be fine since the entire fuse holder is inside the metal battery case so if it does blow in a catastrophic way it will still protect the cables and the user. I have been using the fiberglass reinforced 80VDC ANL fuses for my battery system and they seem to have plenty of breaking capacity. I would only recommend that all fuses be housed in a fire retardant holder in case they were to catastrophically fail.
On my system I have the main distribution bars in the system housed inside a steel enclosure with the fuses so even if a fuse decides to explode the enclosure will contain any sparks or small flames that may happen during an overload. I tested a couple of the fuses with one of my 16 cell batteries with the BMS disconnected just to protect it and the fuse blew instantly during both tests. Even with a class-T fuse I would still recommend it to be housed in a fire retardent holder/enclosure just in case. Each battery string also has an enclosed fuse just to protect in case of a possible short across the battery cables or main busbars.
Thanks Ray, this is very interesting. I will contact Jenny as i am considering adding to my system. Is it hot where you are? lol
I look forward to the next part. Individual testing should not be necessary from a trusted source. And the BMS will let you know if one is bad.
👍😎
I am pulling the trigger on this one
👍
My friend wich brand you prefer. Rept or eve cells?
Thanks
I use EVE cells.
How do you connect to the battery after its built?
They sell cables or connectors or you can get them on Amazon.
This is exactly seplos 280Ah battery case and their BMS, with different brand name. :)
Seplos is another seller, not a manufacturer I believe.
Most of these battery box kits have a small design mistake:
The rear battery cells are only supported by a square beam in the middle and with square beams at the top and bottom of the rear walls. The battery cells will expand over time, and it would be better if they had full support of their whole surfaces on the rear wall.
Some people do fill the back with precision cut wood in the gap between the all rear beams on the back wall.
Others put an aluminium back plate between the rear beams and the rear battery cell.
Just a little tip to consider before you start building a battery in this box.
This kit has a solid plate in the back.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Yes, but that's the end cover plate, the rear battery cell is pressed against the three-quarter beam only through the plastic isolator.
You'll see that when you start to assemble the battery.
Watch the video: How to improve the compression in the SEPLOS MASON 280 DIY Kit.
@tiborchren My memory failed me. I thought I had checked this but I am wrong and you are correct. I will be correcting this before assembling the battery. Thanks for your comment and followup.
I see a seplos Mason 280 ( rebadged) kit ray, awesome..
This is actually what my battery stack is made up of.
The BMS will work together with your seplos bms's
Btw communicates perfectly with deye ( Sol-ark/sunsynk)
Great to see you Floris. I think the kit is manufactured by one company and sold by several companies including Seplos and Apex. I'm getting the feeling that the BMS is the same story. The factory makes them and sells them to a dozen different companies including Seplos. If you wanted to buy 5,000 of them from the factory you could have them packaged as the houseofancients BMS. You could have them implement whatever mods you wanted and others might decide they wanted those mods too. It sounds like the Solark/Deye scenario all over again in a different corner of the industry.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff well, all I know is seplos had them first, same for the BMS, and they are cheaper too..
Btw how's your leg doing ?
Got my 4 mason stack communicating perfectly with my sunsynk's, so you shouldn't have any issue getting yours talking to eachother and your Deye's.
Hoping you got you SA running too by now ?
@@houseofancients all the server rack batteries seem to use the same BMS also or at least very close. Haven’t gotten mine up yet because I’ve been focused on so many other things. I’ve caught up on lots of it but the surgery and a couple of other kind of big things have made it tough to keep up with everything, and then there’s the hobbies. 😂
Have you got experience of running a stack of these alongside Spelos V2 BMS do they communicate as a single pack, can I use the same desktop software to manage?
@@edc1569 they are the same BMS..
I only have the seplos boxes, a friend does have both, and he is running them as 1 stack
Sure would be nice to know what a reasonable price for different cells from JennyWu is. I probably can't afford it anyway, but it is nice to know what a DIY battery (and parts) cost so to compare to a battery from a manufacturer. Is that too much of an ask?
What are the air tanks for in the background?
I built a system for filling my own scuba tanks. In those large tanks I store 32% oxygen gas at 300 bar.
Do you know if these can be used with the EG4 18KPV inverters?
Yes, how many will you use?
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff I am building an off grid ranch in lulling Texas and I wanted to have a battery capacity of 120-150kwh 200amp (48v batteries) inverter capacity. Previously I have used equipment from signature solar with the exception of using used solar panels. I really like the EG4 systems and have installed the 18kpv with 21 batteries on a cabin i built but getting them at scale is pretty pricy so I've been looking for ways to cut costs but not lose quality. To get the system I want I'm looking at like $70,000 (big portion of that is batteries). I own an electrical business but I'm only about 2 years into my solar experience. Im really comfortable with installing the EG4 equipment but nervous about building my own batteries from scratch. Do you do any design/consultation work?
@@joshuafisher5299now I understand much better. Yours is a perfect case for these battery boxes and diy. I recommend watching some of my videos. Notably the one about the Midnite Solar battery combiner box but others as well. Your best bet is to contact Jenny Wu at jennywu896@gmail.com let her know I sent you she will take care of you. I know a pretty funny joke about Luling but I’ll save it.
Server rack $1500 minimum. I can build the same 5kWh for $1000. I agree with you.
$1349... Also saw $1299 the other day
And if you make dealer account a better price and 10 year warranty, and parts shipped to you.
I am interested to see assembly of the unit
Btw i hsve ordered 8 cells of 160Ah from Janny Wu and still waiting for delivery
In a day or two. I promise!
Hej Ray , tak for gode videoer . jeg har købt mange batterier Fra Docan power , alle batterierne, har altid været i ok balance. jeg prøver deres Dry kit 280 Ah med box.
som du selv siger, det er Mason, som er producenten. Ifølge salgs billede, tilhørte også de udvendige kabler med, hun/han tabinaler stik, det var så ikke med, der var så en masse skriveri med sælger og til sidst Alibaba, vi blev enige om en godtgørelse. så husk at få et billede med af Dry kit tilbehør i kontrakten. Jeg synes deres nye terminal til slutning ikke er ok ( er meget dyrt tilbehør c. 5, 00 $ pr. stk. ) jeg ønsker terminalerne, er med skuer eller møtrikker. Med venlig Hilsen Henrik
I am looking forward to the DIY box build! You didn’t mention the cost of the DIY metal box.
They put those insulators on the terminals when the batteries box is properly labeled as a battery because if it’s known the package is batteries then it could be checked/inspected in which case the terminals have to be insulated. I learned that from the EV batteries I removed from EVs and sold.
Why are u against active balancer? I don’t even use the balance function of my bms. The cells stay balanced. But if I ever did need to balance them I would want the active balancer because it can balance the cells much faster when needed. Ofcourse don’t leave balance function of the active balancer on all the time masking a problem. I have the cell voltage difference set tight so if there is a problem making the cells unbalanced then the battery shuts off so I can assess the problem.
The BMS can keep the cells balanced unless they are of poor quality. If I needed to fix one I can easily do that manually with a power supply.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff agreed. A passive balancer can work. An active balancer can simply balance much faster if speed is wanted or needed. I don’t like the idea of keeping a passive or active balancer on all the time.
Cost of DIY box? I’m sure everyone else wants to know.
I have permanently attached Neey 4th gen 4amp active balancer to my Seplos Mason. It can be switched on/off via a bluetooth device. For $100, I like it.
Ray, I am ordering the DIY battery box from Jenny. I will pick up in Houston when they arrive. I have a question regarding how close does the voltage need to match with existing 280 ah battery bank before connecting them together. I ordered them from Jenny also so they are the EVE batteries. Is there a way you could give some guidance?
Sure, just watch any of my videos related to top balancing the cells. The voltage that they read when they arrive to you will be meaningless because with the chemistry of lithium iron phosphate, the voltage is virtually the same for the middle, 85% of the state of charge. That is why the only way to properly balance the cells prior to assembling the battery is to do a top balance. This applies to cells of any price or quality.
Ray, I would certainly top balance the new diy box when assembling it. So I would need to re-top balance my existing 280 a/h bank before connecting the two batteries in parallel? I want to make sure I do not have an inrush of current from one bank to the other. I can now see that the correct way to know they are extremely close in charge is to top balance both before connecting together. Just want to be safe with the addition of additional capacity.
Oh no, I misunderstood you. If you just drain a little energy from the new battery and get it down to within .1 volts of the other battery your inrush should be down to a reasonable amperage. I have been surprised at how small the inrush is at that point. The batteries will then work out their own balancing from one to another as you use them. No need to retop balance your existing batteries.
I just reread your question and I had totally misinterpreted what you were asking. sorry
6:56 shows the seplos production version if you look carefully on the lower left corner from your point of view. You can read there EMU whatever and at the end V16, which is the new BMS version from seplos released end of last september, that with the bt onboard and app support. I am pretty sure about that cause I had gotten both versions, the previous and the upgraded one V16.
SEPLOS had been the first with these rack sized kits - eel had done a similiar one like this. The Seplos one had strong sales in the past year also due to the BMS that was able to run canbus communiction with the most popular inverters.
They had started to raise prices in last summer so I did not buy one. IN the beginning the box incl. bms for EVE LF280K was 550€ or 600 $ incl. shipping and customs and vat. Later tney went over 800 $ without cells.
I finally stopped buying Seplos from Seplos cause there is another shop selling Seplos as Minerals on Aliepexpress and usually 5 to 10% cheaper which does not sound like a lot, but Seplos has the most expensive import service from Fedex where I had to pay 60€ on top for customs alone. From 200 to 190 it would have gone up to 260 while the other shop Minerals has a different importer which took just 7€ or 260€ versus 197€. And the Minerals were a lot faster, even though they did not mention that it was a Seplos BMS nor replied when I had asked them.
So I bought them and rejected the SEPLOS import due to the high fees they had never mentioned before.
I don't think Seplos is a manufacturer. The factory that makes their BMS also makes these and others. The boxes are the same situation.
All made in same factory. People need to understand how stuff works in China. Comunist regime. Do it all in one place , no serial numbers engraved, no dates, all come on stickers, and you can order whatever you want and glue it on.
Respectable companies are engraving, names, serial numbers, dates etc. To show that is original. And overall stuff from China is not cheap anymore.
Why nobody in Usa, can start making things again, even lithium cells. I would pay more to support local economy, to have real warranty backing.
Ray, you are young enough to remember the good days of Made in Usa stuff, that lasted long time.
Nice video. Please itemize your battery build.
700$ it cost you in materials to build your box. How much is costing you the cells to have all batt complete. What is the total capacity in kwwh. And how much is the cost per kwh without your labour?
Thank you. Keep doing a good job and show people options. How about the cell warranty and in case of failure can Jenny Wu send a replacement?
Energy independence is the best.
I pay a little under 2800usd for 14Kwh. These cells can be damaged by poorly managing them. That is why Tesla and others require that they monitor them which I have no interest in.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Nobody wants tesla involved. I like off the network stuff.
THAT IS why I use Victron first generation, transformer based, off network stuff, easy to repair and super durable. For batteries, yes 100% non tesla or internet connected ones.
But I strongly suggest for inverters all should stay away from capacitor inverters. Transformer based are super durable, can last a lifetime if held in specs, and parts are not SMD boards.
I buy the server rack batteries cause u can't get a 10 year warranty with DIY. Keep it up brother
Kind of like paying extra for an extended warranty from an overseas or small domestic company. It’s a choice.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff there is a good Us company. Inverters are Us, giant warehouse in Reno , they sell Sok, server rack, 10 year warranty . They are large company, huge investment and large bussiness, hard to belive they will be out of bussiness. And good prices
Thanks for the video Ray and this new option to build DIY batteries. One request. The sound on this video seems pretty low. If you could bring the volume up a little it would be great. Thanks for your work.
The volume is more than high enough, you might just need better speakers or a hearing aid 😂
this is my comment to help the algorithm
In regard to the in-line fuse.
First off a fuse is very crude, it only give overcurrent protection, this means by the time it blows a large amount of current has passed through it, very roughly more than twice its stated rating for an instantaneous operation.
(note the rating is for continuous use)
In other words it is a last resort.
What is it protecting and from where?
The in-line fuse is protecting the batteries only, it is also only going to operate due to a fault and the next protective device down the line. If you have a fuse or circuit breaker at the distribution equipment then your fuse is only protecting the zone of the cables between itself and that point, ie the battery cables.
Any fault in 99.99% of the overall system will be covered by much better circuit breakers.
This leaves you with a "risk assessment" to make, what are the chances of a fault occurring in that 0.01% and what is the potential result?
A fault in that area will most likely make the batteries suspect of stress damage even with the fuse, or you have to wait for the "fault" to blow itself clear.
My personal opinion would lean towards no in-line fuse is necessary as the cables are not in true contact with each other being single cored.
The risk is so small its very unlikely to happen.
Saying that if you want to fit one I would not argue against it but be very careful of the rating, use a fuse just slightly below the continuous rating or don't bother.
For mission critical batteries a battery management system that can isolate individual cells is the only true protection.
Thanks.
Did you get a price for the kit?
Delivered in the US from the Houston warehouse is about 700$ but Jenny knows for sure. Jennywu896@gmail.com. Mention me if you want me to get a credit.
I must have missed it, but what are the specs on this battery?
It will hold 280 AH or 304AH cells so that is 14KWh or 15.1 kWh and the BMS is rated for 200 amps of output though I would always recommend not pushing any BMS at its rated capacity.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff Thank you Ray. - Roy in East Texas.
Nice video and the enclosure looks good. Actually the enclosure looks identical to the one I got from Seplos! The model number is MASON-48230-DIY-Without Cells.
BTW I got the cells from Jenny Wu based on your reviews - worked out really well, thanks for all your videos!
Both companies buy from the same factory.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff its China, one factory make it all, you pick ypur paint, your name, your color. If you do not have enough money for the order, they come black and you glue ypur own sticker, like any other vendor on amazon.
Its fun to watch all batteries on amazon look identical and come with same instructions and box, but with just a different sticker.
This non branding game should be stopped and mass selling online should be blocked, so companies stand behind manufacturing
Hi Ray, Jenny is promoting Ganfeng 280 cells ($80) do you have any experience?
nope
I just got that email from Amy Zheng (Docan). The price sounds good, but shipping makes it cheaper to buy the US-stocked cells.
@@jeremydumoit4487 I will only work with Jenny Wu. I can’t say more.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff I don't blame you. She's great to deal with, from what you've said.
Just confirming, you buy your BMS & Batteries from Jenny Wu of Docan?
I buy my cells from Jennywu896@gmail.com . I buy my seplos bms from Seplos but in the future I will pursue the same BMS under a different label from Jenny. Wu hoo!
So expensive though if it’s the same price of the Seplos. Wish they could stock them in the US so the shipping didn’t kill the cost effectiveness.
These are stocked in the US.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff I do recall Docan saying they had 20 or so of the pre-built batteries in Houston back in April or May. Good to hear they have some of the kits onshore now. Make sure you specify you want the latest BMS version, and bluetooth. With Seplos, at least, I had to specify that I wanted the latest BMS, bluetooth (this is on the screen, actually), connections for heating mats, etc. All of which cost extra.
@@jeremydumoit4487 Andy says there's a new Seplos BMS coming??
@@ppi57 One nice thing about the Seplos BMS is that you can update the firmware. I really don't want to unstack 4 batteries at 250lb each and change out BMS's. :)
@@RayBuildsCoolStuffThat’s awesome they have them stocked here. And sorry you may have mentioned in the video, but do you know the cost shipped to a US zip?
I would love to have one these KIY kits, but frankly, they are priced out of my range. If the price was under $200 I might be more interested, but the cost of the cells, the BMS and the box plus all the wiring I have to do makes them impossible for me.
and then the shipping $$$
How much is the box?
Hpw much all batery ends up costing, after all box, cells, shipping. And I think no warranty .. nobody will warranty a kit
Why do you not like Active Balancers? Seems less wasted energy than Passive😊
The cheap active balancers work well at a high state of charge but can mess with the balance if you leave them connected 24/7. A BMS with an active balancer is the way to go, you'll need 2A+ of balancing current to make a dent in these 280Ah cells. 0.25A or 0.5A of passive balancing isn't gonna do anything.
FWIW I put a Neey in each of my Seplos kit batteries. I can rename them in the app, so I know which battery active balancer I'm connected to. It adds $100 and an hour or two of time to each battery, but no way I'm unstacking, disassembling and top-balancing 5 250lb batteries every couple months...
Looks like a clone of the Seplos kit. I think the two companies are associated somehow. I have five of the Seplos batteries built and connected to my Victron system, and highly recommend them. Not cheap, but built like a tank.
They are indeed built in the same factory, as are the BMSs.
@RayBuildsCoolStuff Ray, I was going to ask if you bought the Seplos BMS direct from Seplos and the Batteries separately from Jenny Wu? Do you have an affiliate program so you can get credit if we make a purchase? Lastly... Can you touch on your current terminal polishing technique and grease?
@@jamesbsa6450 hi James. I don’t do an affiliate link program but if you mention the channel to Jenny I’ll get credit and make a commission. That says how much I trust Jenny. The BMS she has access to is made on the same like as the Seplos. This one is the blue tooth version.
Same a Seplos , same defect of no support at one end for the cells . Same over priced box . These empty boxes shouldn't be more than $200 usd . Hope you heal fast Ray !
The cells are supported at both ends. Thanks for the well wishes!
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff It sure doesn't look like it , it looks like the one end has no compression support except at the top and bottom . Search for Andy's video = How to improve the compression in the SEPLOS MASON 280 DIY Kit. on youtube
@onthelake9554 My memory failed me. I thought I had checked this but I am wrong and you are correct. I will be correcting this before assembling the battery. Thanks for your comment and followup.
@@onthelake9554 I've seen Andy's video on the back, I just don't think it's a big deal. Would a plate be better? Yeah, likely so. As far as the cost of the boxes; keep in mind it comes with the BMS ($200), fuse, busbars, all hardware, etc. Also, the build quality is impressive. These things are bomb-proof. Not your stereotypical Chinesium crap.
@@jeremydumoit4487 Yes it needs a plate on that end , not that hard to add one though . Yes the BMS is 200 , the bussbars and all the extra stuff 100 maybe if that . But the kit last time I checked was 700-800 . Seems like it 2or 300 overpriced for what's there . Just my opinion .
For one complete battery with Apexium case kit and 16 pcs EVE LF280K
battery price: 2400USD
DDP freight cost: 325USD
Subtotal: 2725USD
Add Alibaba trade assurance fee: 68USD
Total: 2793US, and add alibaba transaction fee
Ray, this is no bargain price battery.
200$ per KWh is as cheap as I’ve ever been able to build or find. That is less than 1/4 the price of a Tesla power wall battery.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff if a server rack battery gets to 1000. 1200@ Per 5.2 kw. Then self build its not worth it. It takes lots of tools, time, materials and overall you can spend time with grandkids, doing cool stuff. Its fun to build but not too much savings.
You are saying a 14 kwh cost to build is 3000 $ excluding labour. Better buy rack battery at 1300 per 5.2 kw. And have some warranty, buy buy from well known long term companies like inverters are us.
@@crinabobo7412 if your premade stops working where does that leave you? I build batteries for self sufficiency. Building and maintaining my system is important to my feeling of long term safety.
@@RayBuildsCoolStuff I agree, its good to know and be your own tech guy. I also seen rack ones, that are 100 serviceable and they provide parts shipped for customers if smth fails, its just need to be trusted , old history, large distributor.
Self built its great also. And I appreciate your videos.
Feed me Seymour.
Lol
likes 666. lol Thats messed up.
this is the last comment for this video
I bought 4 Apexium DIY battery kits with the JK Inverter BMS PB2A16S20P. The first one I built had a bad BMS right out of the Box and it looks like Jkung is not going to replace it. 34 days have gone by without a commitment to replace it. This is not good after sales support.
Who was your salesperson?
Jenny Wu. She has help us get 64 EVE LF280K cells and four non-inverter JK BMS and the four DIY cases. everything has gone well until the bad BMS on the first kit that I built. 34 days and no result is not good. She is no longer responding to my emails.
@@stevenfrazier8939 would you like me to ask her about this?
That would be nice. I am at a loss for a solution. We have a $1,734 battery that is unusable without a BMS. Jenny has been very helpful getting all of the equipment. I just wish the after the sale support was better. I have two more big projects in the works, but I am second thinking how I get the equipment.
this is another
No this is .
@@onthelake9554 you are 💯 correct, your comment is the last one
Lol, another advertisement for Jenny Wu.
Looks like.
I would like him to stop saying that in every video. It cuts on credibility. We all know about Jenny woo. But keep saying all time is hard to hear, it turns a good video to look like a china agent. He looks american enough to stop saying Jenny wu so often😅
china goes up.. cash is always the problem!!! even a china high quality product reaches high costs...
I haven’t seen many high quality products from China. Too many greedy, corrupt, tax evading, biz jet flying, tax deductible family vacation taking US corporations.
Everyone should stay far away from Jenny, they want to take your money and not provide warranty replacement for bad batteries. I am honestly very disappointed that i ever came across this channel and his advertisements for Jenny and docan batteries. I will happily share my email correspondence with Jenny for a bad battery. You should avoid this company, because after they have your money, they no longer have any use for you. I have been trying for over a year to get a bad cell replaced.
Yak yak yak nothing got done. No demo ... just yak.
I am still waiting for batteries being reasonably priced instead of the INSANE prices they are now!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Jenny has some 280ah for $80