Spider-Man Movies & Marxist Themes
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- Опубліковано 1 лип 2024
- In a ploy to find any excuse to gush about Spider-Man for long periods of time, I decided to explore what Marxist themes(if any) can be found in his live-action films. Also: is MCU Spidey a class traitor?
PATREON: / stephan_k
TWITTER: / krosecz
00:00 Introduction
03:50 Spider-Man
05:53 Spider-Man 2
08:46 Spider-Man 3
11:55 The Amazing Spider-Man
15:15 The Amazing Spider-Man 2
22:41 MCU Introduction
25:22 Spider-Man: Homecoming
34:48 Spider-Man: Far From Home
37:08 Wrap-Up (feat. Leftist Brain Spiders) - Розваги
I've seems some of your criticisms, and I just want to state for the record: Socialism is good, actually.
Thank you for your time.
EDIT: Nah, actually I guess I'll do more than make jokes. I'm not interested in the outdated vague threats conservatives have decided Marxism and socialism stand for, I care about the actual material conditions people are forced to live in. It is indisputable that what we have allowed to happen, particularly in America, has created unprecedented wealth inequality. It's a problem that capitalism cannot address because it is in itself the inevitable result of capitalism when we do not restrain it.
The basic tenants of Marxism and socialism require distributing money and power far more equally among people in order to create an equitable society where you don't have to die just because you don't meet some ridiculous standard of productivity. Everybody should have a right to live regardless of how much money they make, and we live in a world where that idea could easily become reality. If you can't get behind that we will never agree.
Capitalism with free, open markets is good. I lived under socialist rule and I wish you got a taste of it too. Then you would sign a different tune.
Most of the problems we have right now in the West can be traced to shitty socialist policies of the government officials that are buying votes of people like you.
@@coolluckyme2007 But that wasn't reeeeaaaal socialism.
@@Armyn13 :) felt pretty real to me. Standing in the breadlines, lines to doctors with shitty outdated knowledge etc.
Funny how much I hear this from people who've never actually LIVED in socialist states. This naive idealism frankly is appalling- try spending some time in Venezuela or China even right now, as if you cant see enough from the history of Russia (and its ongoing state, actually, Putin for another 100+ years lol).
It feels like your forcing a narrative; you want spidey to be a Marxist so you argue from that point. As opposed to Peter just genuinely wanting to be a good person.
No I'm a socialist I just didn't think this was a good video.
And I was looking forward to this coming out as well.
35:48 "Peter, the only working class superhero in the MCU". This quote made me open my mouth to argue and then shut it again. I was going to bring up Steve, but then I realized that Steve may have been working class but he's not used as a working class hero. Kinda wish he was.
Ant-Man was fucked by a big Corporation he worked on while trying to help people, so there's him. And luck for us, Falcon and The Winter Soldier exists now, and Sam is officially one of us, working class heroes.
It's also worth noting that he was working class as a white man in the 40s, which in modern terms would probably make him something closer to middle class, especially when compared to basically every minority of his same time period.
Also he probably got paid a lot more once he became a super soldier
@@pennyforyourthots Hmm, I'm not sure I agree with your statement that Steve Rogers is middle class. As far as I remember then it's pretty much canon in both the MCU and the comic universe that he was a poor Irish immigrant and an orphan. He was very sickly which would make him undesirable or unable to work for a good wage. I think the fact that he also was undesirable by the military is also a mirror to how he was undesirable to society at large. I don't think Peter Parker is anymore working class than Steve Rogers.
His depiction has definitely changed depending on the comic and the time it came out but Cap has always been a fighter of the common people, just like "your friendly neighborhood Spider-Man". I think Steve Rogers is made of the same cloth as Peter Parker but they are used differently in the Marvel Universe (and MCU). Spider-Man is arguable THE working class hero because his whole identity is repeatedly that of a working class, "ordinary" person. How to juggle an ordinary life and being a superhero is a frequent theme of his stories.
Captain America, and Steve Rogers specifically, is used more widely and not specifically that of a working class hero. The themes are broader and more ideologically based, of good versus evil and the ethics of this or that. About war at large and not war in a specific part of a city It's not a better or worse use of a character, but it's different.
The quote: "Peter, the only working class superhero in the MCU", just made me realize that Steve, who arguably has all the puzzle pieces to be a working class hero, is not really used as one. He's used as a hero FOR the working class and not a hero OF the working class, and I think there's a difference.
Cap switches betweem being an empowered vehicle of the state monopoly on legitimate violence and an individualist rogue element depending on if he agrees with the government of the moment, he never seems to act on any kind of class consciousness only personal conscience
24:55 I actually really like this quote dodge. The original was about the burden of power, while this one's about *blame* through *inaction*. It's roughly the same message, but the contrast communicates that he's internalized it in relation to fault, to guilt, because it was only through guilt that he learned that lesson.
Uncle Ben wanted Peter to try and make the right decision in the present, not to dwell on the wrong decisions of the past. Uncle Ben never wanted this for Peter.
He doesn't have an intrepid desire for justice, not yet. He's a kid trying to undo his mistakes.
Yeah, it's a shame that Uncle Ben either doesn't exist or doesn't matter in the MCU tho :/
Kind of a missed opportunity tbh
I really want to see the Vulture come back. Nothing to do with the fact Michael Keaton is amazing.
kind of hard to think of what motivation he'd have as either pro or antagonist
damn the ben shapiro was sooo on point. I gaged.
It was a good impression but mocking the quote doesn't make it wrong.
@@GITAHxgCoo Yeah. The fact that it's wrong makes it wrong. Obviously.
@@creamdeluxe5655 Which part, the one about what's not evil or the one about what is?
@@creamdeluxe5655 but it’s right it ain’t left
@@GITAHxgCoo Sorry, Ben Shapiro is a garbage person who gets off on "destroying" 18 year olds on college campuses, while exercising the power to turn off their microphones and ability to give a rebuttal.
Bumping the jam at 12:01 on repeat. Put it on Spotify NOW
I'd say the thing with Vulture is that he's more of a Walter White than just a straight up rich guy trying to stay rich. He WAS a working class dude pushed to desperation but over time, he got greedy. Ended up taking more than he needed in order to give his family the rich life.
Another very important point is that he became addicted to the power that comes with his work (just like WW).
Your take on Homecoming legit solved a couple of my problems with that movie.
I’m still baffled on why all these adults thought it was a good idea to give a teenager a weapon program complete with drones. Seriously, I think maybe they should talk to Rhodey and pepper aka the actual adults.
Why did you not cover Spiderverse? D:
cuz this is no sense video, bro
This is about LIVE ACTION movies
Would love to see an addendum with the spiderverse if there were enough themes.
A fun thought experiment. And some really fun editing.
Seriously, what's up with the peeps in this comment all of a sudden coming out to try and defend capitalism or shitting on marxism. This video is not about peddling some marxist narrative. It's to explore the character of Spiderman through the lense of Marxism.
Complaining about that is like complaining about people thinking Cats is a bad movie for an average movie fan. Yeah, from some weird critic's perspective it might be an interesting movie, but for the normal person it just ain't. It's almost as if applying different lenses to the reading of a movie enables you to spot different things in the movies and highlight different messages that could be taken away.
For fucking real, the people in this comment section need a fucking chill pill.
@@doomdoot6731 It apparently is promoting marxism according to the pinned comment.
31:50 in Agents of SHIELD, it does show that Damage Control was very necessary, because first responders were being killed by an alien virus unbeknownst to them. So yeah, Toomes did deserve an explanation especially since him and his crew could’ve exposed and be reimbursed since they hired beforehand.
Again, it shows how Tony is bad at communication. Like really bad.
One thing that bugs me in homecoming is that i loved the fact that Peter chose to look out for the little guy, but right after he chooses that he says to Tony "that was a test right". This to me implies that the only reason he said it was because he thought that was what Tony wanted him to say to furthering him becoming an avenger.
I think that he chose that decision because he saw it as the right thing to do. Him asking if it was a test was him not realizing that he was actually making a better decision than Tony. He idolized Tony so much that he assumed that the entire thing was set up for him to make the decision he made
Woah hey there Stephan. This was a very unexpected yet welcome upload!
A lot of people don't seem to understand how an analysis from a specific perspective works. It doesn't even need to be from an ideology you agree with either.
"That's a stretch, blahblahblah"
Well duh, that's the whole point. I highly doubt any of those movies were made with the intention to propagate Marxist ideology considering they're all made by big corporations. It's just fun to try to find elements to pretend that they were just for the heck of it.
A lot of people these days don't seem to understand how fun a little brain teaser like that can be... and that makes me sad. (Although I guess that you could easily figure out that I enjoy those sorts of things just looking at my account name)
100% agreed that Peter should’ve destroyed the EDITH glasses at the end of the film, and unfortunately I fully expect the best movie to completely ignore their existence.
You missed a good one: Doc Oc’s arms are an allegory for the HAND OF THE MARKET 😂
They're not invisible though
Been so looking forward to this going up on UA-cam! I always love your movie analysis videos. It's always a fun time with your flawless editing and humor, and I've recently become a much bigger fan of Spider-man than I used to be, so this was perfect timing. Can't think of much else to say since I agreed with everything lmao. Great job!!!
I just saw your most recent animated short and wondered why I was subscribed to this random channel that I have no memory of.
I still don't remember why I originally subscribed to you, but DAMN, it feels great to find this kind of content randomly.
whens the next PoC review, would love to see another one
My *biggest* problem with MCU Spider-Man so far is that Homecoming has been the only one that actually had a Friendly Neighborhood Spider-Man in it.
They keep setting Peter up with these absolutely MASSIVE things to tackle, when Peter Parker as a character is meant to be going up against the stuff that threatens "The Little Guys".
They're making his movies Marvel movies and not *Spider-Man* Movies and I think that's something we haven't really seen done since like- Spider-Man 2.
*Someone* is a Neil Cicierega fan.
The editing in this video was soo good!! It was really nice to see a new video from you in my subscription box :)
Why did you private the Abridged on Titan series?
This is a great video, and the editing really ties is together. Excellent work.
It's always a pleasant surprise to see a new video from you in my subscriptions, and this one was excellent!
This editing is insane. Can't wait to see what you create next.
Even as a big MCU Spidey fan, I'm surprised with the amount of commentary you had on Homecoming. Great video!
6:56 Okay, that got a good laugh out of me, and some really impressive editing lol.
Why yes, Spider-Man + Marxism DOES interest me. You capture my thoughts on Homecoming and FFH really well in particular; I really really like both of them as movies and stories, but FFH losing the explicit class commentary is a genuinely noteworthy issue I have with it.
I WILL say, in defense of the “Tony giving a teenaged boy a wearable version of the patriot act” plot point, I don’t think Tony was planning to give Peter those specs until he was older. Not that that’s much better...
Such a great, thoughtful analysis, particularly the vulture part
I respect you a lot for making this video, honestly. You probably knew you were gonna alienate a portion of your fanbase by writing this, but still went through with it. Gotta love seeing a great creator sticking to his principles instead of bowing to viewer expectations. Much love
Well shit dude, didn't know you were a comrade, neat!
I do feel like Spier-Man tends to shine as a working-class hero when put next to other heroes from different circumstances, like the panel you showed in the beginning of the video where he asks how much The Fantastic Four pay, being potentially denied a job because he lacks the economic security of (read: belongs to a different class than) the rest of the team.
Also the transitions between each movie were *chef's kiss*
Do you use the term "comrade" unironically? It always feels like larping when people throw the word around, unless you both reside in a country where socialism/communism is actually practiced, which is unlikely given any hard communist country bars access to most if not all platforms of discussion online, and "socialist" nordic countries still lean mostly on free market economics. Anyway, kind of a weird thing to call someone casually.
@@turntechgodhead9395 People who are socialists and communists do it all the time.
What is a "hard communist" country?
11:55 WE NEED A LONGER VERSION
16:37 I genuinely couldn't stop laughing!!! XD
4:20 I read the novelization and I kept going “Well, it’s not like you actually cared about Harry. So that wasn’t much of a sacrifice.”
I don't agree with your takes on Homecoming, but I still loved hearing those different interpretations and enjoyed the video as a whole. Great job!
I don’t think it was intended by the creators for Tony and the Avengers to be seen as a bad example of heroes but they end up being that way anyway. Tony and the Avengers put them selves above the common man and because of that they don’t care whose life is ruined as long as the world is still standing. That whole scene where Tony is chewing out Peter had me tearing my hair out because TONY IS WRONG. He didn’t listen to the threat of the vulture, didn’t do anything to stop Vulture, didn’t prepare Peter to face Vulture, and didn’t send people qualified to handle Vulture to deal with him. And he’s chewing out Peter for taking on a bad situation that would’ve been made worse by Tony’s actions(or lack of action) and then blamed Peter for not doing nothing when he knows doing nothing is the one thing Peter will never do.
@Erik Kemeey oh wow the FBI Those pistols sure will be useful against the mecha bird suit! He sent them to die and also most definitely didn’t inform them of the proper threat.
@5:40
Part of it is a "dont mess with NYC" thing, another is this came out months after 9/11 and you can probably remember how very "USA USA USA" everything got in 2001 - in NYC it was dialed up to over 9000
That Shapiro voice is on point.
are you gonna do a star wars 9 review
I feel like Peter should give the glasses Rhodey or Pepper, or maybe just lock them away in a safe place. I feel like he wouldn’t just break them and throw them away with the risk that someone could fix them. Then again he could always take some of the tech form it to give his suit a *slight* boost.
35:25 yes! I would have liked to keep all those cut scenes in the movie.
I think a wonderful example to reflect your point - " Superior Spider-Man" juxtaposing how Peter Parker just ISNT the kind of personality that thrives in a capitalist society and doesnt have the cruelty and ruthlessness necessary.
“Capitalism bad”
Amazing! A very fun look at the films with this. Destroying the glasses fits so well into that film that I actually forgot he didn't. Shame
The entire first 25 minutes I was like... Get to Spiderman licking Tony Stark's boots! Get to Spiderman licking Tony Stark's boots!
But, 10/10 fresh take on Homecoming. I never really considered the reasons why Spidey gave up the chance to join the Avengers.
My favorite channel uploaded first video in half a year? What a good excuse to blow off work!
I just want to say the ghostly edit of the "Asshole" song whenever Peter is haunted by the ghost of Denis Leary was GOLDEN. Thank you.
Havent watched the video yet but im so glad you uploaded been a fan since your pirates video essay cant wait to watch this all the way through
I actually say TASM2 in theaters and oh boy, Denis Leary of Christmas past was just... *chef kiss*
And itsy bitsy spider [BASS BOOSTED] sure did make me feel a unique sense of existential dread that could only be cured by gremlin Harry
I have no idea why I'm subscribed to you. No clue when I subscribed either. But I'm glad I did.
Same
Dang I was hoping for 'Mr.Sandman, man me a sand'
23:05 oh yeah, I kept seeing that on Tumblr. And I ignored it because it was on Tumblr.
Oo, interesting take. Shame a lot of the comments (at the time of posting this comment) are trying to reach too hard and turn this into a "marxism bad, capitalism good because it works" discussion.
I feel like people need to learn how to be able to view things from a different perspective, and videos like this can open up a whole bunch of people to the idea, by applying the method to something people already like and enjoy. Seriously feel like some people here need to take a very serious chill pill and slow the fuck down and enjoy the content for what it is.
@Some characters aren't allowed Yeah, that's also a valid reading of the movies. And that's exactly the damn point of my comment: people are too focussed about WHAT lense is being applied (although from the intro it makes sense to apply it) and not enough concerned with the fact THAT a lense is applied. Why not just appreciate the fact that this creator took the time out of his schedule (or made a schedule) in order to provide a more unique take than the luke warm "its superhero fun stuff"?
Yeah, spiderman being a guy who punches bad guys is a valid reading, but honestly, it's not a very interesting one. I'd rather watch 100 videos about all different kinds of themes you can extract from the Spiderman Franchise than a single video explaining how it's really just about a guy in a spider costume punching bad guys.
Missed your content
Did you miss the whole part in civil war where Tony hands over his power to the government? That whole divide is the conflict in the movie. Cap’s side is the side that believes that he should wield power that’s unchecked, and cap was from poverty I’m pretty sure considering they were in WWII America which was just recovering from a depression. You’re making some real big and copious amounts of stretches.
He does that a lot when talking about Tony's character. He has this really unfiltered neigh hatred for Tony where there are plenty of videos on this site exemplifying how wrong he is with how he views Tony's character.
@@ZeonZenes I actually LOVE Tony Stark as a character. I think the fact he so blatantly, incredibly flawed makes him very interesting and makes his journey engaging to experience.
you could argue tony want's to give power away, some from guilt , but some becasue he's very close with the institution he's giving it to, he's rich, he knows plenty of people in the pentagon , have you seen any other avenger talking with ross like the way tony fucks around with him? he most likely has contacts in the goverment, in many ways, hes not thta far from the power, not like someone like , lets say, wanda, would be.
Aw yes, more of this please.
"You can't thrive in capitalism and be a good person." Luckily we have an entire entertainment/media complex to distract you from thinking too hard about that.
Even if the entertainment itself is saying “switch to socialism” because just watching will be relieving enough to many and the want to dethrone capitalism will vanish as people think socialism is viable because a series portrays it as good.
"You can't thrive in capitalism and be a good person." Is one of the stupidest quotes I have ever heard on youtube.
@@johnathanjarisch7323 I hope you're enjoying your first day here on UA-cam!
The analysis falls pretty flat. But the editing is fun.
The editing in this video is bananas.
Where Nootrac at tho?
“In related news, Spider-Man was seen downtown today, fighting a lizard person, finally confirming what I’ve been telling everyone THIS WHOLE DAMN TIME-“
Me: Confirming what? *You didn’t finish!*
Love your stuff, Stephan. Every so often I have to go back and watch your Pirates and TLJ videos. Any chance you could cover PotC 2 and 3? They might not be as 'good' as the original, but as a whole trilogy, it's still one of my favorite series.
Also, the actual quote is, 'the LOVE of money is the root of evil.'
Did this man just tape Spider-Man related disc cases on his wall?
Idk how I came across this but I’m intrigued
Yes kids, there is more than one way of looking at the world, other than a class struggle for power and wealth
Need to link this beauty
16:32
Love your video man, your videos are always great, even for the ones on movies i didn't watch.
always look forward to seeing your content
No Spider-verse?
This video didn’t consider Spiderverse and is therefore invalid
I mean, great video otherwise though
Man, this guy makes suck cool vids. But so inconsistently.
Peter didn’t seem poor at all, at all
Where’s Into the Spider-verse?
This whole video is a hot take
Love the vids man pls make more
Nice video.
12:00 holy shit this slaps
Man I love these videos
The worst thing about tom and Andrew that they are not the unlucky nerd we love .
But Spider-Man did get who John Galt was! He spent like a week thinking he was the new one after reading Atlas Shrugged and yelled at some protestors. Fun times.
Have you read the comic or the page you're mocking, he didn't yell anything, he simply told them that he didn't care for their partucular cause as he was making an actual difference, by being spider-man.
@@Bobo011 What I’m referencing is from another comic. Mighty Avengers by Al Ewing. Its a joke about Peter’s college days and being tongue-in-cheek about Steve Ditko’s objectivism.
28:44 oh god Tony, if you’re going to parent a baby superhero, you need to be there to parent. Get a book and study. 🤣
This video is AMAZING !!! The Capitalists are SHOOK !
Love this take. Great video!
Now that No Way Home’s been out, we need Spider-Man Movies & Marxist Themes 2: Kalabar’s Revenge
edit: “Asshole” playing over Denis Leary’s ghost lookin at Peter, golden references, Spider-Man, and leftist ideals, what a perfect video
You were right, it shows!
38:00 Nope, still on the Right...and probably won’t be leaving anytime soon
You moved further left in the last year?
@@itcouldbelupus2842 no sir
@@pianocard2786 That's wild. What's your opinion on the current state of the world?
@@itcouldbelupus2842 I’m worried. I think Russia will invade Ukraine by the end of the year, and China’s obsession towards Taiwan is also troubling.
@@pianocard2786 what about rising wealth inequality in the United States and the rest of the developed world?
The increased number of fascist militias and white supremacists, domestic terrorists?
Climate change?
Any of these things worry you?
You probably shouldn't be sorting the comments by new right now.
3:42
im impressed that you managed to do scare quotes with an audiovisual cue
also, appreciate the brutal crimes you have done against the music in this video. You need a superhero to stop you from these music crimes
Spidermarx
*Nerdsync has entered the chat*
I am sure that we as a society can have a mature and respectful discussion in this comment section. Right, gentlemen
When dealing with communist ideals yeah no way
As individuals people can probably have such discussions, on mass in a comment section, probably not, and especially not when part of the topic revolves around a ideology which in part is heavily influenced by victimhood narrative.
I'm confused I don't think I subbed to you I dont agree with your views when did this happen god I must subbed years ago. I'm not complaining just nothing really lines up here in my head.
My head feels lighter after watching this video
Toby will always be the best until we get a real nerd with bad luck .
You can trace here how superhero movies got progressively worse with time.
Wow i love emma stone and andrew garfield so much it made oblivious to how bad these movies are
The comments are more about what actually constitutes as “socialism”, “communism”, “Marxism” and theories than the actual video 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Loved this. I love Spiderman and I love Marx. If people want to critique your marxist analysis of a movie series, maybe they first should try to get a grasp of what the theory is actually about, instead of just echoing myths and misconceptions. You made good use of an overlooked perspective, and you did it in a nuanced and critical way so I don't undestand the complaints. I'd love to see more of this!
(BTW: If you're interested, it would be really cool to hear what you think about my videos about the Toy Story movies, where at times I also use philosophical and political lenses to get a better grip on the storytelling.)
How did I get subscribed to this channel?
Probably the pirates of the Caribbean video. I had no idea who this was either
Same
Same
Same
Abridge on Titan was my reason.