@altreon3608 she only used lightning realese once remember ? It was op but she did it on a genius ( koboto) so it didn't matter. The punch she uses lightning style in it to target the nervous system and confuse the connection to the brain and limbs . She is capable of so much more .but u know the author don't like girls so haha
To say Tsunade doesn't have crazy chakra reserves is disrespectful. She literally had enough to heal the entire village while using 1000 healing technique
@@moatazabdelraouf4059edo tobirama has lowkey ten-tails level ap based on his tandem paper bombs jutsu so he pretty casually obliterates the entire akatsuki
I think Hidan would be the best assassin ever, just think about it he could go undercover as a doctor and take the blood of every Kage and kill them. I think Hidan as a hitman like character would have been quite a cool concept.
He probably did that before, like this is a world of ninja. So stealth missions are important. He probably got cocky and wanted to be recognized to the point he didn't play things safe.
Nice to see some respect getting put on the Sannin! Recently they've been trashed a lot by some power scalers, so it's nice to see a different perspective on them.
That's because they've been surpassed. The last 2 arcs bumped up everyone in terms of scaling. The sannin r strong but they're not top of the verse. They're shown to have clear power cliffs, which r meant for the next generation to surpass.
@@Bloooo95 solo fight? my boy was jumped and did better than MS Kakashi while fighting more paths of Pain. Is he kage lvl? probably not. Is he the goat? yes.
@@fox2569 yeah but Kage level is very broad, he's not high end Kage level. I'd put him like mid to lower Kage level (also at the time the leaf literally had no one else to pick other than Kakashi, and I think we all know that Jiraiya > part 1 Kakashi).
14:08 something I rarely hear brought up is that Sasuke was also not trying to kill Deidara in their fight since he wanted information about Itachi, but Deidara was clearly trying to kill Sasuke. Also, it definitely makes sense for Orochimaru to be a counter to Sasori. It would be weird for them to see themselves as rivals if Orochimaru didn't have some degree of poison resistance, but even if he didn't I think you could argue he just uses that body replacement thing. PS SHOUTOUT MR. GAMAKEN
I don't think Orochimaru saw Sasori as a rival at all. The fact he was confident him and Kabuto were going to defeat Sasori says a lot. Orochimaru does know about the Hiruko shell and keep in mind this Orochimaru is at the point his body is constantly rejecting him. Sasuke also paints a clear picture in terms of his strength to Orochimaru. Sasuke tells Orochimaru that he's stronger than him before he absorbs him. This Orochimaru is on his death bed with a body that is rejecting him on top of having his arms sealed and no ninjutsu for a guy who mastered all 5 chakra natures naturally Sasuke checks Karin and doubles down that he only defeated Orochimaru cause of his sickness. He still deems Orochimaru's + his own power necessary to beat Itachi. I agree with you, Sasuke in no way was going all-out to even defeat Deidara. Sasuke I think was just blatantly ahead in the entire fight and had the elemental counter as well as the physicals, blitzing Deidara multiple times The Hydra Form of Orochimaru could force Itachi to utilize his yata mirror and totsuka blade. This near blind to literal blind MS Itachi, Sasuke in his novel internally thinks that he's weaker than this Itachi when he first awakens his MS. Considering that he's monologuing how painful the susano'o is early in the Kage Summit, Itachi should still be stronger with Sasuke not clearing this Itachi until he first opens EMS (or arguable when in MS he shows the armored version briefly). Not saying Oro is at Itachi's level, he's clearly a level weaker than even a blind Itachi but he should be capable of contending with a MS user that has susano'o like a Kage Summit Sasuke before losing. Meanwhile, Sasori in my opinion is weaker than the Sasuke that Deidara lost to also.
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 On no planet is Hebi Sasuke stronger than Sasori, he’s not even stronger than war Gaara lmao. Deidara was also fully confident in killing Orochimaru, and Orochimaru was fully confident he’d roll Hiruzen. Confidence is not the end all he all of evaluating these characters in fact it’s THE most vague metric since Orochimaru planned on a sneak attack. Hell Sakura was confident that she on her own would force Sasori to spill the beans on Orochimaru and he literally responded with a “stfu” and would’ve 0 diffed her without Chiyo there. Itachi was also already using the Susanoo, and couldn’t even use Amaterasu anymore lol. Orochimaru basically showed up and was instantly dealt with by a heart attack victim, it’s really not a good look for anything other than his endurance and regen which we already know is top tier.
@@hobbyhorse5848 Well it's certainly a possibility and why even include war arc Gaara? He doesn't even have a direct scaling to these two. YES HE DOES NOT. 3rd Kazekage being called the strongest war in the beginning of part 2 and in the 3rd databook, which goes all the way up to Sasuke awakening his MS. If your second paragraph has to do with Orochimaru vs. Sasori, keep in mind this Orochimaru is at one of the weakest points we see him. He doesn't even have a body that isn't rejecting him, he isn't in his snake form and of course he doesn't even have his jutsu & arms. So yes by all intention he was going to get rid of Sasori then and there as stated that was there intention. I personally am not seeing the comparison besides the lore of both killing a Kazekage. Besides that, while Sasori does have a . As far as a Hebi Sasuke vs. Sasori fight, I would take Sasuke in that fight as he counters Sasuke and has the elemental advantage. Hebi Sasuke would defeat a beginning of series Gaara too but not war arc Gaara who by the Kage Summit shows impressive feats, let alone the war that would put him easily as the strongest Kazekage or Sand shinobi for that matter As for Itachi, the fact that he needed to use the yata mirror, totsuka blade and full armored susano'o against Orochimaru is saying something. Itachi being blind and on his deathbed doesn't make it an anti-feat for Orochimaru (and Itachi brought them out specifically for Orochimaru as stated by Obito and the text that he was pushing Sasuke so Orochimaru would come out to free him of the curse mark) especially since Sasori does not come close to this Itachi in power, let alone a healthier Akatsuki Itachi or Edo Itachi. This isn't even bringing up the fact that Orochimaru at his strongest in the series outside of chapter 700 (Naruto Gaiden both Mitsuki's and Sarada's stories) is during the war arc where he has his full jutsu arsenal + white zetsu body + all of the chakra & powers of the Sound 5 + the best refined edo tensei in the series with better control than Kabuto given the Hashi cells. So yeah, Orochimaru alone is more than a match for Sasori even in his weaker forms. Hebi Sasuke is as well although that's a different story and war arc Gaara has feats being both Hebi Sasuke and Sasori
To be fair, pretty much ALL of Sasori's attacks are lethal, regardless of poison. The poison is just if you happen to dodge enough just to get grazed instead of instantly dying
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 You’re incorrect in your assertions about Gaara’s war scaling and I’ll do my best to explain why. For one war Gaara and a weakened edo Rasa are dead even in the strength, speed, and power of their sand. Gaara himself only defeated Rasa because he had the advantage over Rasa’s Edo auto reactions lifting his gold dust to protect the other Kage which left him open to be sealed. Any assertions of Gaara “surpassing him long ago” are based entirely on Gaara surpassing him in character and it makes literally 0 sense as a power statement due to the fact that a Gaara who is much stronger than he was in the past failed to overpower him or outspeed him without exploiting a cheat (in fact, Rasa explicitly states that Gaara is stronger now than he was in full Bijuu mode). The third Kazekage was so monumentally powerful that his mere presence held together the stability of the Land of Wind. The sand elders who were obviously alive for Rasa’s tenure state “That such a strong man could be killed…no one believed it possible.” Rasa who literally died 3 years ago is not even remotely spoken of in these terms and in fact is not even spoken of at all. The third was extraordinary, Rasa was mediocre. If you STILL don’t believe this despite the narrative spamming it in our face, Chiyo explicitly says that the iron sand is the MOST FEARED weapon in the HISTORY of the sand. More than the gold dust and more than Shukaku himself. It’s as blatant as possible that War Gaara is weaker than Sasori when you actually take his feats in context and don’t wank the shit out of him to say he’s 8GG level in speed like some tend to do. As for Orochimaru v Sasori, I have always asserted that any victory he’d get over Sasori while nerfed would he the result of trickery and slippery tactics. He’s obviously weaker while nerfed by RDS and in a direct fight he will be forced to resort to Hydra which will likely beat Sasori due to its nature. Part 1 Orochimaru in base defeats Sasori but he does not low diff him by any stretch of the imagination without ET or Hydra. Killing someone much stronger than Rasa while at a disadvantage AND destroying a country blatantly put him as a peer of Orochimaru by lore and accomplishments. As for Hebi Sasuke, this “elemental advantage” you speak of does not exist even for an inferior form of sand (Gaara’s shield) which tanked the Raikage’s Guillotine drop (which can crack parts off the Susanoo ribcage). His only actual advantage is the sharingan which will allow him to aimdodge Sasori’s iron sand blocks, it’s entirely ambiguous if he could evade the iron sand shower. Even if he can Sasori will just do what he did in canon, immediately pick up on Sasuke reading his moves w/ the sharingan and then use Iron Sand world order which Sasuke cannot evade. He can only oral rebirth once, and he’s fighting an uphil battle against someone who’s 1) stronger 2) Can easily play keep away 3) Can throw wave after constant wave of BS at him. It’s also not likely that Sasuke is immune to all poison as he wasn’t immune to the white snakes blood, and he’s only shown to inherit a stamina buff and some jutsu, he sure as hell can’t reconnect his body from bisection. He doesn’t have the physical strength to knock away any of the iron sand blocks either or any jutsu with enough AP to blatantly cut through the large iron sand constructs unless he gets off a real Kirin. He simply struggled too much with Deidara who is barely clearing Rasa on the food chain to beat Sasori more times out of ten than not.
Itachi actually has huge chakra reserves - If we take what happens before he fights Sasuke - He transfers the crow to Naruto with a genjutsu trap.... then he "fights" Kisame, then messes around with Sasuke
I have a major issue with people mentioning Itachi taking out Orochimaru's 5 headed snake form. The reason for this is, let me ask you, what body is Orochimaru using at this point? The vessel that was rejecting him so hard that he was weaker than Sasuke? Or his Original body which is very old and weak? Or what? I know the 5 headed snake his Orochimaru's strongest "form" but Orochimaru's base is likely at his weakest by FAR! Orochimaru in a fresh vessel should be much stronger in the same form! And Orochimaru in the white zetsu Body is far stronger than any other previous form of Orochimaru Base-Base. I'd like to hear your thoughts on this!
This is actually a really good point! I would add that by this point orochimaru had lost his host Body that was rejecting him and is actually attacked to Sasuke. The Form that emerges is the amount of chakra Sasuke was suppressing with his own which could be far weaker than if a Full Health Full Body version emerged. This is supplemented by each curse mark having small portions of Orochimaru’s chakra that he notes are not much as when he emerges against EMS Sasuke he says he’s pretty weak at that moment. The form itself is just Orochimaru’s failed version of Sage Mode that Kabuto achieves both marked to be Dragons, I’d say it’s more comparable to a sage mode amp more than anything else. But generally the form shouldn’t vary too much. So I could def agree a FP Hydra form would more than likely be much stronger than what’s seen we just have no measure other than it’s just stronger.
@@nzephier orochimaru mentions that itachi was stronger than him even when he fought hiruzen. It's why orochimaru bid his time hoping to catch itachi off guard and low on chakra. Sadly for him itachi was planning on it
For Sasori I'd say it's very clear that he is above Rasa. While we don't have feats for the third Lazekage we do know that he was the strongest kazekage to ever exist by the start of shipuden. This means that he would by default be above Rasa. Plus Sasori also has the third kazekage as a puppet so even if you assume Sasori is only equal to the third kazekage (he's not, he beat him and his puppet body is directly stated to be stronger) that would still mean that Sasori with the third kazekage puppet I at minimum 2x stronger than someone who was stronger than Rasa. The same Rasa that Orochimaru felt the need to jump and sneak attack to beat. Not saying Rasa I stronger than Orochumaru but he's at least relative since Orochimaru was as cautious as he was.
@@Shadows1Fan he plans when going against opponents that could be a threat to him. He didn't need to plan before menacing Akakashi for example. The fact that he didn't just attack him shows that he at least didn't think that was a good idea.
@@alexanderasher8037 but we already know Orochimaru is more of a strategist. He could have killed the kazekage right off the bat, but we gotta remember he wanted to destroy the Leaf Village, so he manipulated them. He also wouldve had a whole village on his ass
Some things to be taken into account, in my opinion. Tsunade specially was throughout ignored in this vid. 1 - Katsuyu's acid can't be absorbed (or reflected by Yata mirror), so that would be a huge problem to Itachi's Susano'o, since it's not very mobile, and would be a ko for Konan if it lands (would need a distraction, though). 2 - Tsunade's strengh is not being taken into account, on a 1 x 1 it's one thing, but with the other two, plus summons pressuring, it's not very likely that it won't land once. Even Madara had to use a clone. 3 - Reverse summon and sealing techniques. The 3 are experts in this department, meaning chibaku tensei or water prison won't work, and the only reason Orochimaru stayed sealed was because Manda was f pissed at him and he also used Anko as backup plan. Also, Jiraiya sealed amaterasu on his first encounter with Itachi and Kisame. 4 - Tsunade's chakra and byakugo. She usually don't use jutsus, probably because her taijutsu is stronger (take Mei acid, for example, did nothing to Madara's ribcage), but she can overload someone's if needed. Dust release became 100 times larger, imagine most jutsus that take 1/10th that chakra. That alone leads me to believe that she has way much more chakra than Nagato. Not to mention that she can heal Jirayia remotely and tank barely anything these guys can throw (she endured a whole day against 5 Madara clones on full ofense, and here it's only her, Jiraiya and maaaaybe Orochimaru here and there) 5 - Adding Tsunade perfect chakra control, and the fact that it's 3 + summons, I don't think genjutsu would be a factor.
42:00 did everyone forget how pa died? He tried using frog song and was instantly killed lol. Frog song is pretty op but has the worst start up time. If you actually think about it, it was a miracle jiriaya was even able to use it. And theres also the issue that itll more than likely incapacitate the other sannin too
Exact people are just not good at reading. Frog song is a genjutsu comprised of LITERAL SOUND WAVES. Guess how fast sound waves travel. The speed of sound. You know who was dodging the speed of sound?? LITERAL CHUNIN IN PART 1. Jiraiya only got frog song off on Pain because Pain sent his 3 WEAKEST PATHS TO FIGHT JIRAIYA and Jiraiya prepped frog song while hiding ahead of time and boxed all the paths into an area in a narrow tunnel with 0 escape routes and thus released it instantly and there was nowhere for the paths to go/dodge. Frog song is hilariously useless against Itachi or honestly anybody that is Kage level+ in a relatively open battlefield.
How strong is katsuyu’s acid? Cuz I feel like that’s not being considered enough in these matchups. Mei’s acid really messed up Sasuke’s Susano. Plus the acid would be the best way to combat pain’s dog summons if the acid is strong enough. Also, I know u said Amaterasu takes out the summons, but I don’t think itatchi can spam Amaterasu that much without his eyes going out or running out of chakra. Cuz the sanin can all summon loads of snakes/frogs/slugs. If he does spam it, there’s no way he will have enough chakra/eye-stamina to hang with all 3 sanin.
Strongest burning/melting ability shown so far in the series. It vaporizes rocks immediately upon contact and no other firestyle or acid has shown than potency. Plus its natural so you cannot absorb it and it has massive aoe. Orochimaru even said it can one shot him, so its that instantaneous.
Katsuya is considered to be one of the strongest summons in the show. I think manda is stronger? But she Is def top 5 in summons. That's why Sakura summoning her was an important character moment.
I don't really see how Konan is a hard counter to Tsunade. Tsunade can tank the paper bombs with seal release/strength of 100, she was able to survive Mabui teleporting her and the Raikage at the speed of sound (it is stated that any normal person would be torn to shreds). She could use Katsuyu to dissolve Konan with acid slime or weigh down her papers like Jiraiya would do with toad oil. Obviously if Konan ever made the mistake of staying to solid form it wouldn't even be a contest. Quite the opposite I don't see much of an opening for Konan to come out on top in that match up.
28:52 Here, the Sannin have a good chance, but they have to go all out. Tsunade can break Itachi's Susanoo, so that's a priority. I'd match Orochimaru+Tsunade vs. Itachi and Jiraiya vs. Kisame. Jiraiya has good options for underwater fighting so he could stall Kisame with a frog army and possibly win. If he wins, the fight is probably won. If he won't win and can only stall, then Orochimaru and Tsunade need to defeat Itachi. To consider... Susanoo is very taxing and Tsunade can break it. Itachi's Susanoo has a shield so depending on how exactly it works breaking Susanoo will be hard. But the Susanoo is not that fast, it's made more like to be able to seal big enemies than normal sized shinobi. Tsukuyomi can be counteracted reliably and both Tsunade and Orochimaru should do well counteracting any other genjutsu. Orochimaru can take Amaterasu and survive, but it's still not a good idea. If they work together they could trap Itachi into either getting poisoned by Orochimaru's blood, getting cut by Kusanagi, or being stomped by Tsunade. If Orochimaru uses Edo Tensei, though, Itachi's probably done for, depending on what Orochimaru summons. Alternatively, Orochimaru could fight against Itachi, and Jiraiya against Kisame, while Tsunade goes full healing. I don't think Orochimaru can win that one, but Jiraiya will destroy Kisame, because he can cause damage to him, and can heal anything Kisame does. It becomes a fight of attrition. If Orochimaru can survive Itachi until then, the fight is won. Otherwise, there is a similar thing going on with Tsunade+Jiraiya vs Itachi. They want to be able to break the Susanoo, and they probably have better chances than Tsunade+Orochimaru, but they are more vulnerable to Amaterasu. Note that Amaterasu is only strong because it's hard to get rid of it. Someone who has been hit by Amaterasu can still counterattack through it. ----------------- That, assuming Itachi is healthy. Ill Itachi won't be able to fight as hard and will likely be defeated in a 2v1.
But itachi can only use his ms 3 times, his amaterasu can only travel 0-5 meters, jiraya can use the barrier and than doesn't need to look at itachis eyes, jiraya can use jis dark swamp on the susanoo, tsunade can heal the sanin, jiraya only had to charge up because he didn't think he was going to use sage mode, but if he prapers (knowing that jiraya in sage mode is a above itachi (not that much)since he counters him pretty bad). Jiraya alone can sommun 3 gigantic toads, orochimaru 2-3 snakes, and katsuyu can separate, amaterasu would not be a problem to the sommons. Knowing that alive itachi is weaker than jiraya (base jiraya is same tear but still weaker, but in sage mode he beats itachi) and could have support from tsunade while orochimaru deals whit kisame. They should win against itachi and kisame. Also that pain himself said if jiraiya had info he would win. Chubaku tensei's core can be destroyed by jiriya big ball rasengan. If they have info the sanin win if not than...
People underestimate the Sanin.They’re all really strong. And as a team they’re stronger than as individual like how Naruto and Sasuke are working as a team
37:32 Here probably the Sannin have better chances. Tsunade can do a lot as long as she's not busy protecting and healing an entire village and Orochimaru is the brain that can figure out what the paths do. Jiraiya himself can do a lot against Konan and some paths. If a path gets taken out of the battlefield Nagato cannot revive it, and that's likely to happen. It's also a matter of time until the Preta path tries to eat sage mode chakra and gets turned into a toad statue. The idea for the Sannin is to fight a completely defensive and covert battle. Orochimaru can hide and move underground and catch a path unawares. Jiraiya can do something similar with water. When they get a chance, they might be able to get rid of up to two paths just like that. Depending on the lost paths, we might have an "easy" fight, or a very difficult one. If they get the Deva path and the Naraka path they remove Nagato's ability to revive the paths and the most powerful path. In a more normal scenario, if they take Naraka and Human, the summons can stall the animal path, and they might be able to catch other paths into the sound genjutsu. So, if they succeed with "troll" tactics, they have a decent chance, if they fail, they lose.
@@ThunderGodTG It's your analysis that I didn't agree with, so extra work probably wouldn't address the part of the video I disliked. Others have said it better than I can but I'll sum up my thoughts as best I can. Your Sannin scaling is still off even though you give way more credit to them than most of the other Naruto UA-camrs do. Base Sannin generally scale above most Akatsuki members. Itachi says Jiraiya can beat him and Kisame together. Nagato says that Jiraiya could have beat Pain if he had intel, after Jiraiya beats Konan. Sannin together easily take those fights. Others also pointed out that Sannin have a good chance against Obito as well, so that would have been cool to have in the video. The bonus round vs Taka section seemed like an afterthought, but like you said there's really nothing they could do against any of the Sannin so it's not really a match to discuss. EMS Sasuke would have been a better bonus round, but he probably still gets body slammed. Others talked about Sage Kabuto in their comments, I think that could have been a cool bonus round idea.
Ahhh yeah we for sure disagree on Sannin scaling I think EMS Sasuke would violate pretty badly. I know some of the Base Sannin stuff but, again I personally don’t agree with it. Appreciate the comment though we can just agree to disagree on that front.
Tsunade counter Genjustu hard. With mini Katsuyu constantly pumping out out chakra to disrupt a genjustu similar to how tailed beast does it for their Jinchuuriki. Orochimaru hard counters Amaterasu. His body shedding, shed Amaterasu, it was also genjsutu that Itachi used to defeat Orochimaru, which Tsunade covers for. Jiraiya hard counter Kisame, frogs do very well in waters plus absorbing sage chakra will turn him into stone. Then frog song to counter Susanoo, by using Swamp of the Underworld and Rashmon gates, to stop itachi's movement.
Tsunade does counter genjutsu but it’s actually via Byakugo seal since it’s a foreign influx of chakra that would agitate her chakra that’s being controlled.
@@ThunderGodTG that would be for herself yes. But Orochimaru and Jiriya need katsuyu, there is a possibility that Ma and Pa can help Jiriya but there also a chance that they get trapped too, but not mini katsuyu
I remember people always said Itachi would stomp Jiraiya, but if you think about it, many of Jiraiyas attacks are actually direct counters to Itachis moves. Not saying he'd get an easy win but its possible he could beat him.
The problem is Itachi's virtually unparalleled ability to come up with lethal attacks before his opponents even begin to prepare any of their fancy powers or put up any meaningful resistance, decisively beating them without much of a fight. To stand a chance, I imagine Jiraiya would have to be in Sage Mode before he even meets Itachi, and Orochimaru would have to fight remotely through Edo Tensei, minimizing exposure to the Sharingan and taking advantage of Itachi's relatively low chakra reserves.
That's exactly the point, Itachi's greatest power is the element of surprise, but Jiraiya is an expert spy, he wouldn't go head on like Orochimaru. And the longer the battles draggs, the harder it would be for Itachi
21:14 I mean... he has Kusanagi, he has the snake substitution, he can turn into the snake, he has Rashomon, and he has big summons. That alone can destroy Deidara. Orochimaru can also survive C4. He just goes underground and waits until the danger is over.
Love your channel bro. Just peeped the video with swagkage before this one. Definitely one of the better naruto channels🙏 also I'd be interested in a tailed beasts ranked. Im always curious to see how people rank them. Yea aint a lot of feats for some but still
41:11 That's the thing. If the Deva path gets distracted by the summons for a second, the other paths will have issues dealing with the Sannin. Chances are they can be taken out.
I think its fair to say Pain's fatigue was more of just the long cooldown on his shinra tensei, which recovered mid-fight with Naruto. I think this matters because the pain bodies aren't alive and dont have stamina, so what they are really referring to is Nagato, who isnt using stamina, but chakra. Nagato had less chakra, but all he had to do was transmit chakra into the chakra receiver rods. Nagato did not run out of chakra in his fight, so it didnt matter. The only time it made a difference is when fighting Hinata because the receivers lost chakra momentarily, or something. Idk maybe they just glitched LOL but it happened only once, after technically defeating Naruto anyways. I dont think Tendo Pain was slower, or the animal summonings were any weaker, etc. because Pain nuked the village. Nagato just had less chakra to fight for less time, which doesnt matter because he still had chakra left after the fight (as evidenced by him using rinne rebirth)
Further evidence of this being the fact that other paths were still able to use their abilities just fine, but Tendo was the only one incapable. It's stated to have a 5 second cooldown minimum, with bigger blasts taking longer. So with this being a big blast, it took more than 5 seconds, and when he got it back he spammed it and dominated lol
40:08 Pain spending chakra is of no consequence. There is an entire village of chakra for the Preta path to drain. Also Nagato has so much chakra that even after all the pains were gone, he still had chakra to spare.
@@ThunderGodTG oh yeah if you need any help with the discord I'd be more then happy to help I'm technically a mod in 2 and have a test server of my own
Video idea suggestion, what are your defining marks on what makes a ninja a certain tier? Like a detailed look on what qualifications as shown in the show would make someone that certain tier.
Not much would change honestly. C, Fuu and Ao all knew where Sasuke was being each great sensors. While they weren't focused on him, they were already each on high guard given they just caught Danzo using Shisui's eye and all the Kage guards were on high alert after the Raikage broke the table. I doubt they even catch them off guard not to mention Sasuke was literally only there for Danzo so at best he corners Danzo before the Raikage and Gaara inevitably interrupts the fight for different reasons
@@Necromancer4267 My point is too that Sasuke wasn’t near the room where the Summit was taking place. Also the samurai guards found them out without even sensing chakra so it’s not like he was going to sneak up on the Gokage. Besides, Sasuke was literally only after Danzo and couldn’t care about any other, maybe besides hearing what Gaara has to say before dismissing him like he did. Sasuke can’t hide his chakra so in your scenario he only wants the smoke with Danzo where as the original timeline it’s the same but still gives the hands to everyone there lol
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 You keep giving information completely predicated on Zetsu ratting them out. No one knew they were there. No one found them without Zetsu.
For some reason people don't put Katsuyu in Tsunade's fights. Katsuyu is a direct counter to kisame and itachi. Acid when in contact with water explodes so kisame becomes useless amateratsu gets sealed by any of the sannin as jiraiya can seal it with a decent sealing jutsu. Katsuyu will provide healing, defense, battle information and being a direct counter to genjutsu(being able to disrupt it), Slugs don't have eyes😅. Can split into smaller but still larger clones to spew acid, body slam, suffocate and just be good distractions/diversions. Katsuyu also negates Pain and konan, they can't damage her and she too will be providing shared/link vision like the paths of pain. She negates the push and pull techniques. Konan will get vaporized 😅 Also many of the old war veterans called Tsunade slug princess. That just shows its not out of character for her to summon Katsuyu in her fights.
Jiraiya had to take out a scroll to seal it. Amaterasu would severely burn him by the time he takes out the scroll. I'd even argue the Amaterasu would burn the scroll before he has the time to open it up.
Orochimaru and Tsunade probably have more efficient sealing techniques. All of jiraiya moves tend to take time to build up while Tsunade and Orochimaru can just whip them out save for edo tensei
In Sanin vs Itachi and Kisame, If Jirayai is able to activate the sound genjutsu, its over for Itachi and Kisame, since Kisame cannot break Itachi free even though Itachi can free Kisame by casting his own genjutsu. But that Itachi will still die since its 3 vs 2. 1 person will take care of Itachi while 2 keep Kisame busy
Itachi probably knows about the frogs since he read up on sage chakra and jutsu (to the point of knowing what the fuck Kabuto was doing in that fight, he know that he was using sage mode and each sage move he was going to throw out). Itachi then just stops everything from happening, or even just does that round start (like he has already done to Orochimaru before).
@@SuperDababy2 The frogs genjutsu is their own unique attack. Its not linked to sage mode. If I remember correctly, it seems even Jiraiya didn't know about it.
Itachi had the chakra illness. Something jiraya was well aware of. The sannine would use orochimaru to stall kisame while the other two wear itachi down. Itachi acknowledged that Jiraya is not some one to fuck with.
@@thelandlord111 Itachi said that just so Kisame and him would have to kill Jiraiya. We saw how easy Itachi best a prime Orochimaru when he was like 13, I don't think the Sannin are winning
I'd day they actually beat Itachi and Kisame. For the simple fact that Itachi is sick and his fight against Sasuke showed how much it affects him. Orochimaru is stronger than that Sasuke and he put up a decent fight.
I just hate how people overrate itachi and don’t take some things into full account. For example orochimaru and itachi never had a true fight yet people just want to jump to the conclusion that itachi is stronger. When you take into account everything orochimaru can do is say he beat itachi 6/10 because he will just put last him. Orochimaru never once approached him with killing intent
@t-god2439 Wish I could upvote your comment a million times. While I do find Itachi a handsome and alluring character, I can't stand how so many viewers act as if that scene means Orochimaru is sooo much weaker, when it was clear that he was only toying Itachi around.
@@kiravampira1456 I think it was his arrogance imo that got the best of him. But I do think if he approached him prepared itachi would have died. He could have just poisoned him if he wanted to kill him. Also despite the weapons itachi’s Susano has it is imo the weakest one we see in the series. It has no legs and can be taken advantage of by anyone who has earth style or mud style for that matter
If Orochimaru had access to ET, then the sannin + summons would make any fight an 8 v 2 💀 8:10 Honestly when it doesn’t contradict the manga I don’t see why people feel like the anime has no place in discussing the manga 12:06 I honestly disagree, I think Sasori is a rival to Orochimaru both in terms of lore and power. The third kazekage’s Iron sand is verbatim stated to be the strongest weapon in the history of the sand, even over Rasa who as a weakened Edo can match Gaara’s sand in power and speed despite stating “he’s even stronger than in full Bijuu mode.” Sasori also says that the 3KK was difficult to kill and Chiyo also says iron sand has an advantage over puppets. The third was also so powerful that the sand elders who were alive for Rasa’s tenure glaze the shit out of him and even state that he was so strong he held the land of wind together and upon his death it triggered multiple wars that destroyed multiple small countries. Chiyo’s puppetry doesn’t have any speed anti feats and Jiraiya himself isn’t a speedster in any way with the other Sannin being relative to him in base. Gamabunta and Jiraiya being somewhat relative also puts this into perspective as Sasori>Third Kazekage>Rasa~War Gaara>Shukaku>~Gamabunta. I also believe that the relativity is a little overblown as Orochimaru implies he can just beat up base Jiraiya. 17:37 I personally think Orochimaru is immune to most poison as his blood itself is poison. The sannin honestly probably survived Hanzo because of Tsunade, Jiraiya looks beat to hell and he couldn’t even stand up. 19:03 Tsunade can be cut by the kusanagi, the Yasaka heads are very powerful but they’re a blunt force form of damage which cracks bones and destroys organs which doesn’t cause visible damage against Tsunade’s regen. Either way I think a 3 v 2 against 3 sannin and 1 Orochimaru rival and someone weaker the outcome is pretty clear. 20:44 The toad oil only works that way on paper and Gaara’s regular sand (as opposed to metal dust held together with magnetism). Not saying they can endure it at all because fire style is fire style but Sasori’s puppets according to the Gaara novel are apparently made of fire resistant clay. Sasori can also just telekinetically manipulate his body parts, so don’t really see how oil does anything to that. In fact even if his limbs were blown to smithereens he directly states he can recreate his body endlessly as long as his core survives. 27:31 Manda endured the initial shockwave of C0 but that still killed him, so I think they’ll all die. 30:35 Poor Tsunade is an anchor and an Amaterasu victim in this fight. 37:51 Pain beats all the Sannin on his own imo. 1 strong shinra Tensei broke all of Gamabunta’s bones, so Gama & Manda are now bodied instantly. All their ninjutsu is negged, even Sage Jiraiya cannot tag the Pains with shared vision up, Tsunade is also negged by universal pull into soul rip or Rinnegan rods which disrupts her chakra control. People forget how nerfed Pain was against Naruto, there is very little any of the 5 Kage can do against the Deva, Preta, and Naraka paths just camping with the other paths as support. Against the Leaf the Pains chose to separate themselves, Pain together chooses to stay in a close unit. I do think Pain will be forced to actually try though because of Orochimaru, but Jiraiya here is the weak link due to his fragility. Also Obito solos.
W comment, the Sasori lore stuff is fair enough depending how you interpret it, I would also say to the Toad Oil point while it’s obviously just a bit of spit balling we do see that puppets can be locked up or have their movements hindered like when Shino locks crows joints, so I still think it’s fair enough and more so interpret Sasori just repairing himself via chakra threads and other puppets nearby endlessly. Again not absolute by any means but I think worth a discussion.
@@ThunderGodTG the way I see it oil is a lubricant, against paper it seeps into it and makes it heavy which is why Jiraiya says Konan can’t peel her paper apart. Against Sasori he’s basically oiling up the tin man lol. As for Sasori’s real body, we never see any threads and from the presentation of it, his core, and the lore implications that he wanted to learn Edo Tensei his core is most likely the result of dark forbidden ninjutsu. Chakra threads for example don’t explain why Sasori is able to “see” and has functioning eyes and why his core physically alters the appearance of whatever puppet it switches to match his. The reason why Sasori was forced into switching bodies is because he was about to be hit by Chiyo’s sealing jutsu which totally immobilizes you and seals all your chakra so he couldn’t afford to take the hit (and her sealing jutsu is no joke as she is the one who seals the sands Bijuu into the sands Jinchuriki). The databook even says that under regular circumstances his body is “indestructible” and that his core is his “one and only weakness.”
I would make the case it definitely depends on how you interpret the core itself since by some notion it has to move, The core itself isn’t really something that has mobility or any sort of capacity for it, so I always saw that’s primarily how Sasori transferred it either physically taking it out or threading it to another puppet - we just don’t know cause it wasn’t show. As far as the oil I’m more so on the basis it just too sticky generally speaking which the databook backs up by it restricting movement - which isn’t exclusive to Konan she just got counter by it. Either way it’s not a break it or make it but, it def is possible it could effect how smoothly Sasori can dissipate his puppet body or transfer his core. Either way not full proof on either front but, more so just good stuff against Sasori’s core which is noted to be his greatest weakness.
Possibly .but Jiraiya took 3 paths on and won with no info adding the extra 2 people who also cover his weakness at least makes it's mid-high diff fight for pain
@@codbeast914right he beat three with no Intel and didn't know they can revive. If all the pains showed up and with some time ,front song wins. Also orochimaru is supposed to be comparable to Jiraiya. Orochimaru is takes the other 2 which leaves us with the one and I think the can do it
@@codbeast914 Jiraiya beat them after being given the motherload of all time saving and the fact they didn't bother enough to actually try. One single Shinra Tensei and Jiraiya is dead.
Tg I think you didn’t give kisame enough credit. I think he’s stronger than all the sannin individually. Also I think you lowballed sasori because you capped him at rasa level but he beat the third kazekage who was stated to be the strongest kazekage ever. And rasa was able to beat shukaku repeatedly. But keep up the videos hope you keep going up 💯💯
So with the Rasa stuff we just don't have a measure speed wise beyond Rasa as Gaara grows beyond him and the Third is beyond, Sasori is def stronger we just don't know by how much, Kisame was also just not necessary for the bout and is contentious at points, depends where you think base Kisame is honestly, but yeah that's fair it's just a closer debate than Itachi vs any of the sannin, thanks for the support my guy!
I’d like to point out 4th would be brought in too as it was what he was going to do. So you got yellow flash able to blitz itachi or at least separate the team or get a person out of attacks that could wipe.
@@orochimarupr Animal path by itself was able to stalemate base Jiriaya and Jiriaya just so happens to be the only one who can get rid of the Cerberus. Two more paths caused Sage Jiriaya to retreat. Deva path by itself could use either chaotic Shira tensei or Chibaku Tensei which held the entire half nine tails at bay and he even said he could've made it bigger.
@@ShadowFiend777 The 3 sannins have the best chemistry, jiraya having someone like orochimaru makes it easier since they can't kill him. Tsunade is also not dying at full power. Edo tensei + all the summonings pain loses. If is prime orochimaru he solos
@@orochimarupr I agree the sannin are exceptionally powerful, but Pain shouldn't be downplayed. Jiriaya is the only one that can deal with Animal path, but with the other 5 paths present, his focus will be elsewhere. Again, the Deva path can always resort to the two powerful jutsu I mentioned earlier or he could combine with another path e.g. Human or Preta and drain chakra or rip out souls. He did this against Kakashi with Asura and Sage Naruto with Preta. In other words, Deva path would universal pull and Human path would catch them and soul rip. The Sannin as a team honestly go between Sasori&Deidara and Itachi&Kisame.
@@orochimaruprorochimaru can definitely be killed by pain. Animal and asura can be used as heavy distractions Human path can go in with taijutsu while supported by deva and look for soul rips Which does bypass orochimarus hax and tsunades 100 healings or chibaku tensei and gg them anyway. Especially since pain has the feat of still attacking and defending himself with gravity while chibaku tensei is active. The sannin actually get dropped off
Alright, how about this. Not sure if this matchup was thought up before but here it is: Sanin + the 4 modern Kage(Mei, Onoki, A, and Gaara), vs the Akatsuki(obviously not Orochimaru), including Obito. A full team battle.
Honestly for the pain portion of the video, if u just split it into the 3 paths that fought jiraiya, konan and a path vs tsunade, and the deva and a path vs orochimaru there’s nothing they can do. Hell even konan with two paths and just the deva vs orochimaru alone would work. The sanin more times than not lose. I’d say they win like 2/10 times being generous. Konan being there is honestly a huge huge problem.
Konan without prep time ocean is nothing .Her " strongest " projectiles are no stronger than the kunai paper tags of regular jounins .And besides the paper tags she only has paper shuriken and that slow sheet suffocation jutsu .Even freaking Karin has a more dangerous " arsenal " than Konan .
12:03 I think Tsunade alone can defeat Sasori. With the Hyakugou she only needs to keep punching all his marionettes until there's nothing left. Any shinobi with Hyakugou could do exactly that, since the poison can be counteracted with it (while it lasts). Sasori vs. Sakura was only a fight because Sakura was inexperienced and she didn't have the Hyakugou, that Tsunade has. Sakura counteracted her inexperience with Chiyo's help, and the lack of Hyakugou by having the antidote to Sasori's venom and being able to heal her wounds. But the Hyakugou makes it a no contest. For Orochimaru or Jiraiya Sasori might be a problem (I'd wager Orochimaru is vastly resistant to all sorts of venoms and can spit himself worst case scenario), but they should easily be able to deal with Deidara. Orochimaru's attack range is enormous and the Rashomon can protect from the big explosions. Worst case scenario they can all reverse summon somewhere if Deidara decides to blow himself up. But it's not a close fight at all so I don't think they'll allow him to do that.
Itachi and Pein are the only two that *really* stand a chance against one of the sanin. Although the entire group is powerful, pitting any dou vs The Strongest Team in Konaha (prior to team 7) just isn't fair.
Stand a chance, are you drunk?! They put right clap, lol. Itachi at age 14 put Orochimaru under genjutsu without even looking at him. Pain's Animal path stalemates base Jiriaya and with two more paths, makes sage Jiriaya retreat. Sasori and Kisame fall under "stand a chance" Kisame has the feats to potentially scale him higher, while Sasori literally battled Orochimaru twice and while the sannin are RELATIVE that doesn't mean they're EQUAL. So while Sasori may not beat Orochimaru, he could potentially beat Jiriaya or Tsunade. Even Deidara (who I rank slightly below Sannin and Sasori) could kill one with C4 if he last long enough to land that attack.
@@jonny7444 zetsu was temporary and he didn’t use him on the attack against konoha. Kamui is his own ms ability so I don’t know why you included that. Hashirama cells ain’t his but it’s still a power up nonetheless.
“Stand a chance”? Are we kidding? Most of the Akatsuki beat Tsunade and a healthy number take out Jiraiya. Orochimaru, the strongest member, got dog walked by a 14 year old Itachi with base Sharingan and a kunai. 💀
I got baited by the title, well played TG. Kakuzu and Hidan were losing to Kakashi with minimal back up, any one of the Sannin can clean stomp them. Sasori and Deidara is interesting to talk about, but Orochimaru already beat Sasori and Tsunade's apprentice is the one who beat his poison. Deidara's C4 presents an interesting problem, but I just don't think he even gets the chance to use it here. I always like your Deidara videos for some reason. Also loving the Gamaken respect and it clarified something to me. The statement about Sage Jiraiya being above the five kage always bothered me because I didn't see how he could beat Onoki due to the flight and just sort of had to accept it, but Gamaken putting Pain's drill bird in the dirt is the answer. Thank you for that, it's been messing me up for years. Itachi and Kisame section of the video confused me because we already know Jiraiya alone can stalemate Itachi and Kisame. The statement that Itachi is a speed tier above the Sannin is just incorrect, not sure what that's about. I wonder how juiced up Kisame would get off of Tsunade, but I doubt it would matter because he still lost to Guy while juiced on Bee. Pain and Konan also seems clear to me considering Sage Jiraiya almost did that fight by himself and Nagato said Jiraiya could have gotten the W if he knew how the Pains worked. Jiraiya with Tsunade and Orochimaru as back up should be able to beat Pain and Konan. I was actually most looking forward to Sannin vs Obito because it's the only real fight, sad to see it got glossed over but I guess talking about how insane Kamui is can get a little dull. I think the Sannin have a legitimate chance with Frog Song and Orochimaru's Hydra Blood. It's doubtful that Obito could use Kamui to evade Frog Song, and he still has to breathe so blood paralysis is on the table. A lot of people tend to overrate how fast Obito is. Obito was getting boxed by Kakashi, base Naruto, base Guy, and base Bee. The only speedster we see Obito ever fight is Minato. In that interaction, Obito warps behind Minato and then attempts to grab him to suck him into Kamui. Before Obito can even reach his hand out to touch Minato: Minato realizes Obito is there, turns around, draws a kunai, swing the kunai through Obito's head, reacts to phasing through Obito, and then warps away from him. In the next interaction, Minato absolutely punks him. I would need to re-read the whole War Arc to see at what point I think Obito becomes out of reach for the Sannin, particularly if we give Orochimaru access to Hashirama and Tobirama. EDIT: This is specifically talking about pre-Rinnegan Obito. Couple things on Sannin evaluation: Downplaying Sage Mode by saying "but it takes a long time to start it." doesn't hold much ground. Jiraiya got Sage Mode off against Pain inside the rain village. If anyone could stop him or punish him for doing it, it would be Pain. Tsunade is fast, just not insanely fast. She's able to fight together on the same scale with Raikage + Onoki combo and throw hands with Madara even if she doesn't outspeed them. Katsuyu saved the entire leaf village from Super Shinra Tensei. The only Akatsuki members with that kind of fire power are Deidara and Pain, but Katsuyu only has to defend the three Sannin. I wish we got to see Orochimaru do more impressive things, he kind of gets slapped in every showing he has unless he's fighting against literal children. The White Hydra is hard to evaluate because the only time we see it, Orochimaru willingly face tanks a one shot attack because usually anything stabbing him ends in his enemy getting paralyzed from the blood. Overall, really high quality video by you. One of the best you've done imo. Up there with the Shino and Dosu videos.
Itachi being a speed tier above the Sannin is because he was keeping up with KCM Naruto, and mind you, this was an Edo Tensei Itachi. This means his physical stats were lower than his living version at full health.
Scrolled to find your comment after I finished the video. There's actually another comment that said something really similar to yours and I thought it was you, so I had to double check the names lol. Thinking the Sannin can take Obito is pretty crazy, but I went to rewatch Obito vs Minato and you're 100% right. They might be able to get a win on Orange Mask Obito if he isn't allowed to run away. Rinnegan Obito is hard to scale because he brings six Jinchuriki to fight Naruto and Bee. Good points on pretty much all your Sannin stuff though. I'm curious why you think Orochimaru gets slapped because most people think he's the strongest Sannin.
@@pkj2148 Common misconception. KCM Naruto wasn't trying to defeat Edo Itachi at all there, he was just blocking and trying to talk to him. You can reference Chapter 549, Naruto does not throw a single attack against Itachi. In the same chapter, Naruto and Bee also block every attack Itachi makes. This shouldn't need saying, but Edo Itachi is the strongest version of Itachi we ever see. Your example of living full health Itachi is the guy who said he couldn't beat Jiraiya even with Kisame there to help him. Not to say Itachi isn't fast, but he's on the same tier of speed as the Sannin.
@@dualblades7742 Glad to see I have a fan, I suppose. I'll scroll to find that other comment because you've got me interested now. I honestly don't remember the finer details of the War Arc from about where Madara and Obito meet back up, I would need to read it. There is something to be said about Obito not feeling confident enough to fight Naruto and Bee without have six Jinchuriki with him, but I wouldn't make any claims until I refreshed my memory on it. Obito is difficult to scale because Kamui automatically defeats anybody who can't blatantly outspeed him unless they have some kind of counter measure for it. We see counter measures in the form of Kakashi's Kamui and persisting effects like Konan's 600 billion paper bombs. Instantaneous effects are also logical counters to it, which are most kinds of Genjutsu. Frog Song would fall under the category of instantaneous attack and genjutsu, therefore it would be effective. We don't know how long Orochimaru's blood vapors linger in the air for in order to induce paralysis, but it would fall under the category of persisting effects. I'm going to talk about Danzo for a moment. The reason why Obito needed Sasuke to kill Danzo for him is because he couldn't risk getting close to Danzo. Danzo's ultimate goal was to hit "Madara" with Kotoamatsukami in order to gain control over him. Obito somehow had knowledge of Shisui's eye being in Danzo's possession, and never engaged with Danzo because he knew Kotoamatsukami is game over for him. Danzo also knew that he needed to save Kotoamatsukami for "Madara", which is why he didn't use it on Sasuke. If Danzo uses Kotoamatsukami on Sasuke, Obito will just mop him up after. In a way, Danzo had checkmate on Obito if he got a free move, but Obito was able to keep Danzo in check by using Sasuke. It's a grand strategy being utilized by both parties and that aspect of the battle often goes over the head of most people. Orochimaru thought he needed four Kage level assistants (Hashirama, Tobirama, Minato, and Kimimaro) in order to attempt a fight with old Hiruzen. Orochimaru only managed to have two of the strongest people in all of recorded history on his side, and then he barely scraped a win off Hiruzen while receiving permanent damage that is life lasting for anybody who can't body hop. Then Orochimaru runs away. I don't understand interpretations of that fight that suggest Orochimaru could ever be considered stronger than Hiruzen. The next time we see Orochimaru fight, it's while he has no arms and it's against the extremely nerfed Tsunade and the Jiraiya that was drugged to the point where the extreme nerfed Tsunade would have been able to fold him. As soon as Tsunade gets her resolve back, she instantly turns the tables and massively outperforms everyone there. Then Orochimaru runs away. People say things like "Armless Orochimaru was beating Jiraiya and Tsunade" while ignoring all of the context of the fight. The next time we see Orochimaru fight, it's against 4 Tail Naruto. Orochimaru at this point isn't quite his peak self, but his body isn't rejecting him yet. This Orochimaru is able to fight with 4 Tail Naruto, but unable to restrain or even inflict damage on him. During the fight, Orochimaru uses his most powerful defensive technique. the Triple Rashomon Gate, because he thinks to himself "If I get hit by that attack, I will die." Then Orochimaru runs away. People suggest that Orochimaru is stronger than Jiraiya because Jiraiya states that he almost died while fighting 4 Tail Naruto. There's a huge difference there though, Jiraiya's goal was to defeat and not kill Naruto, and he actually did it. Orochimaru didn't even defeat 4 Tail Naruto, he gave up. The next time we see Orochimaru fight, it's against Sasuke and the body absorption thing happens. It isn't really a fight, but the end result was Sasuke paralyzed on the ground while Orochimaru tried to do the body swap which fails for arbitrary reasons. The next time we see Orochimaru fight is against Itachi after he pops out of Sasuke. At this point Orochimaru's body is still rejecting him, but we see that the White Hydra can stand against Itachi's Susanoo for a short time. Orochimaru willingly tanks the Totsuka Blade while laughing about how that kind of attack won't work on him, only for it to be unveiled as an attack that seals you away if it hits you. Orochimaru could never have known it would do that, but that was an incredibly poor decision by him either way. Consistently throughout the series, Orochimaru does not have good showings and almost all of his recognition and power comes in the form of lore or implications. His power set is pretty crazy though, which is why I wish we got showings from him that more accurately match how strong he is stated to be. The entire theme of the manga also supports the fact that Orochimaru plateaued, whereas the others continued to grow. Orochimaru is the weakest of the Sannin, but most people in the series are weaker than Jiraiya and Tsunade so that isn't exactly a slight against him.
@@SirGregarious The Edo Tenseis are weaker than their living versions, so there is no way Edo Itachi is the strongest version of him. And I still can't believe you guys still use Itachi's statement about Jiraiya as proof, even after finding out Itachi isn't a bad guy. You really think Jiraiya can take on Itachi and Kisame at the same time. Itachi who Orochimaru, the strongest Sannin, was scared of. Jiraiya isn't fast at all. His fastest techniqie, Kebari Senbon, was blocked by Pain casually. He had the time to weave the signs to summon the panda, and mind you, Jiraiya isn't even the one moving for the Kebari Senbon.
Sasuke vs. Deidara might make the most Sasuke slander in the series, possibly only eclipsed by Naruto vs. Sasuke part 2. The amount of people that think Sasuke lost and was bailed out by plot when 1. It was a 2v1 fight, 2. Sasuke literally forewent killing blows because he wanted information, and 3. Sasuke held back his arsenal, is bananas. In a true Sasuke vs. Deidara 1v1, Sasuke fuckin slaps.
You are absolutely correct but Sasuke was still bailed out by plot llab. Diedara last bomb is basically a particle style jutsu. His last bomb disintegrates you completely down to your cells. Sasuke hiding inside of Manda should not have protected him. If Manda died Sasuke should have too.
Not everything disintegrates when hit by it. Mandas skin or shell could somewhat withstand not being decimated to where Sasuke could live. Also if they rerun it back. Sasuke still is slightly more powerful than Deidara. He doesn’t slap. But, he wins. The last jutsu by Deidara is kinda bs anyway.
Sasuke *was* bailed out by plot. It’s not even about the chakra. He summoned Manda, put the snake under a genjutsu, and then managed to get inside its mouth in the instant between Deidara turning into a bomb and him exploding?
@@BuzzabeelYT Yes. That is all very easily possible... Never mind the fact that everything after Sasuke punched Deidara was completely irrelevant in a real battle that isn't to capture and that isn't 2v1.
You dont even need the whole akatuski. It can be a fair 3v3 and the sanin still get slapped. Itachi, Pain & Obito or if you dont want to use Obito it can be Itachi, Pain & Kisame. Kisame vs Tsunade, Itachi vs Orochimaru and Pain vs Jaraiya
@@zerox6615 Who said anything about Itachi defeating the 5 kage. I also disagree with Itachi being able to take all three by himself especially after seeing how well Jariaya did by himself vs pain. Tsunade with hundred healing was able to survive being impaled by Madara Susanoo sword and survived being cut in 2. A healthy Itachi is not defeating sage mode Jariaya, immortal Tsunade and immortal Orochimaru at the same time. So the canon Itachi aka sick and half blind is definitely not beating all 3 at the same time
@@zerox6615Also the fandom needs to stop saying sanin level or hokage level because all the kage are not equal and all the sanin are not equal. A good example is hokage kakashi & Hashirama. Both are Hokages but Hashirama far out classes Kakashi. Or Minato and Tobirama it's the same situation so you cannot power scale by saying Hokage level or Jonin level etc
Bro Itachi is duf beating sage mode Jiraiya stop using (run kisame) dialouge, Itachi didn't want to fight jiraiya as he is sided with the Konoha Tsunade gets blitzed and outhaxed You already know what 14 year old Iatchi did to Orochimaru
27:29 😅I feel like this is contradicted a little when Manda 2 needs help flipping the island turtle in the war arc (bigger and stronger than Manda) and Deidara does it with a regular bomb.
Also Kaskashi was injured by Naruto's Futton Rasenshurriken when he "tested" it against his rasengan it's shown that Kakashi is injured after the clash and is later seen with that arm bandaged up. So Kakashi was nowhere near peek form when he fought against Hidan / Kakazu
Much of youtubers have been downplaying too much the sannins. Orochimaru just lost that easy against Itachi because he was too arrogant and didn't take in consideration Itachi's genjutsu, in a more directly combat against each other Itachi couldn't win that easy. Orochimaru on inself is strong enough to handle with Kisame, and he's almost a counter to him. Sage mode Jiraiya and Tsunade can take with Itachi. It's stated in the lore that Itachi can only spam Tsukuyomi and amaterasu once in a day. I think that sannins has too much chances to win that match.
I think you forgot to mention the Sannin's scaling to Hanzo, who they couldn't beat. Pain did beat him. I do think the Sannin got stronger since then, but if I remember correctly, the Sannin still held Hanzo on a pedestal for how strong he was. That could change the Sannin's chances of winning against Pain from a fair percentage to next to none. That said, great video. It's always fun to watch these long vs videos.
Yeah but we all saw how Jiraiya was giving the 6 paths them hands. I'm sure if he had just a bit more intel on how pain worked. Naruto benefited from the info that was given to him against pain. Hanzo did almost nothing to pain compared to a matured Jiraiya.
@@lobsterjohnson8642 Bro really said Jiraiya was giving the 6 paths them hands.. did he watch the fight? Jiraiya was getting jumped so hard bro had to cut his losses and retreat 3 times throughout the entire fight. He was getting so pushed & beaten by a *barely trying* Pain, that as soon as Pain got remotely serious, Jiraiya lost an arm and then got his ass curbstomped. Jiraiya gets fucking folded. Even one Path is huge overkill against Jiraiya on average.
@@lobsterjohnson8642 Rewatch the fight. Jiraiya only got 3 of them after running his ass off and away, hauling it the fuck out and then had a sound genjutsu that, later on, Pain immediately kills off against Naruto. At no point was Jiraiya winning until then, and then he immediately got his ass torn apart without any ability to fight back. He couldn't even fight those three by himself, he was getting folded by them. Hell, he wasn't even stronger than the Animal Path, which was already posing too big of a threat for him.
I love this video one of your best ones I got a good laugh during the undead duo and the part with tusnade you about to learn what pain is part it made my day better given how it started thanks 😂
What is Hidan gonna do when: 1) Orochimaru poisons him with snake venom before he can get any blood? He's immortal but doesn't instantly heal. 2) Tsunade punches his head 5 kilometerss off his body and has her summon melt his body down?
Sannins vs. Pain & Konan: Jiraiya could take care of Konan while Orochimaru and Tsunade handle with 6 paths of pain, and later Jiraiya join with the group.
Just think tho. With each MS ability, itachi gets considerably weaker. And jiraiya’s giant toads are a problem if you don’t want to waste an Amaterasu. Orochimaru probably only goes down from toska blade or maybe tsykinomi. And if one of those is used on tsunade, orochimaru will know about it. And it’s possible tsunade could break tsykinomi
@@spit-fire Orochimaru bowed down to normal Sharingan genjutsu, and I think you're just making up Tsunade breaking Tsukuyomi, I don't think there's ANY evidence to even suggest this, this is made up
@@spit-fireItachi clapped Orochimaru with basic genjutsu. Orochimaru is also the strongest genjutsu user among the Sannin (without Ma and Pa involved).
@@spit-fire I don't care. You can't break a Mangekyo genjutsu (especially not the most powerful offensive genjutsu casted by one of the best genjutsu users in the show) with good chakra control. It just wouldn't happen
Manda didn’t tank that bomb, sasuke summoned him and then transported them out, manda only got hit by a little bit of it and from that little bit he still died from it. Kisame dominates in an under water fight, when he fuses with samehada, sage mode jiriya ain’t winning. The few win conditions they have would be tricking kisame into absorbing Jiriya’s sage chakra. But then itachi may very well just tell him to be careful.
Itachi in character would tell him during the beginning of the fight. We know Itachi knows everything about Sage jutsu (he literally says this in this Kabuto fight) and he wouldn't want to make this fight harder on himself if Kisame fucks up.
Crazy thing about itachi is; orochimaru thought he stood a better chance fighting the strongest of the gokage than even attempting to fight itachi again without a sharingan and Uchiha body
Kakuzu: basically base Jiraya less mobile when he uses a durability technique. But Jiraiya has summons to help him and overcome his own limitations. Anyone of the Sannin kills him 1v1. He's between Kakashi and Sannin tier. Sasori: Manda solos 0 diff (took hits from Tsunade wielding Gamabunta's sword and didn't have a scar, nothing Sasori can do will even scratch him). None of the Sannin even need to fight him. Sasori is match-up reliant, he's an assassin and his only way to way is with poison. Tsunade has fought Chiyo it seems in their past, so she'll definitely find the antidote to his poison faster than Sakura who did so without Tsunade's experience. Deidara: depends on what he does, he can take one out with him if he surprises them, but they can all be reverse summoned and he would suicide for nothing. Itachi & Kisame: Itachi counters Orochimaru, impossible to tell if Tsunade neg diffs his genjutsu or not since they never faced each other, if the two of them manage to buy Jiraiya enough time to enter sage mode, he cleans house. Sage mode counters Kisame's absorption and Itachi's genjutsu, Tsunade one hit bursts a much stronger Susanô, Orochimaru can extend Kusanagi at will and use his extensible body to fight a kenjutsu battle from fifty meters away, Rashomon gates tank any direct attack, sage mode amped ninjutsu completely outclasses any ninjutsu Kisame and Itachi can use. Jiraiya can even intercept Kisame's absorption and put him out of commission via stoning, Itachi ends up 1v3 and gets ganged up on. Ironically one of the worst possible match-ups for Itachi and Kisame. Konan & Pain Nagato: Konan is a non factor. She's fodder and Pain will ask her to stay behind because he doesn't want her to be collateral, that's literally what she'd be in this fight, and it's in character for him and for her to listen to him. So it's Pain vs the Sannin. 3 people, Jiraiya has his canon Pain fight to go with, Orochimaru counters Asura path while Tsunade destroys it, anyone can kill the human path (the only dangerous one), Katsuyu negates any level of chibaku tensai (she did it for most of Konoha's population, she has no difficulty doing it for the Sannin and their summons), Tsunade can heal any injury on any team member, they will quickly learn that one path revives and teleports the others and find a way to destroy it, from then it's easy. Honestly Pain is only good when his kage level opponents fight alone and/or try to defend someone/something. In a fight on neutral ground where collateral is not an issue any duo of kage destroy all of his bodies and then it's a matter of finding Nagato if he isn't already dead from exhaustion. The Sannin mid diff him together and Konan can only watch him be defeated. As for Konan's power, just to try and kill Tobi it took her weeks of prep for her ultimate paper explosion and after that (failed) she was vulnerable. In a fight without weeks of prep she doesn't do anything but maybe a small distraction every once in a while. Taka: that's not even a fight, A4 solos so any of the Sannin in good shape (not bed ridden Orochimaru) solos. If we take Sasuke once his Susanô got better towards the end of the fight in the kage summit (before the Danzô fight) then any combination of 2 Sannin defeat Taka. Not prime Kimimaro solos everyone in the team but Sasuke, Orochimaru does the same. Kimimaro (sick/not sick/post time skip survived and cured) vs Akatsuki done or yet to be done? I think he solos but loses to Pain except post time skip survived cured with training then he would be much stronger if we take Sasuke's improvements and give Kimimaro half of them over his prime 15 YO version, then he could have a chance against Pain too because his durability would be absurd, his speed scales to KCM1 Naruto (roughly equal to the sage mode that one tapped several paths of Pain) and his offense with 2.5 years of training would be improved to even higher levels (remembering his performance in p1 was under terminal stage of something akin to cancer and he was paralyzed, probably moving through dead bone pulse puppeteering his own body).
I found this to be really complex and simple at the same time which is intriguing and makes me want to come back to your channel. Thank you for sharing; Your insight is flawless.
Great video as always and can tell the editing quality keeps going up more and more. Now in my opinion (and it seems like you agree), about half the Akatsuki the Sannin each are just unobjectively strong in base. I think it's important to note the scaling of the series at a given point in time. Granted, it seems like some arguments you were making for arguments sake as like the Sannin, none of the Akatsuki have just a basic arsenal and allows them to capture/defeat those who are clearly stronger than them (i.e. Killer Bee > Kisame although Bee is nowhere near his full power, Kisame ragdolls him). My point to that is, the scaling of the "Base" Sannin. Half of the Akatsuki weren't even alive when in series we see the Sannin at their full power. Mind you, this version of them is what I like to call "Beyond" Sannin level where it's stated for Orochimaru it surpasses his own power and the strongest sage snake in Ryuchi Cave. Jiraiya himself says he's beyond that of a Sannin but a great toad sage. Tsunade literally rewrote the medical ninja rules with her jutsu, and her as a medic and her monstrous strength is what is stated to put her every bit equal as the other Sannin. I say all this to say, the Sannin themselves are at the peak of the Gokage. They scale to Hiruzen in part 1 (granted, it takes Orochimaru two, even when nerfed, stated Hokage level edo tensei to push Hiruzen) who is numerous times even at old age stated to be the strongest of the Gokage. It is also something to note that the Hokage have always been the strongest of their era. Maybe you can argue against Tsunade even though she is physically the strongest but even then, her feats only get outpaced by Onoki who has resolve and a bit more experience than all of the others both as a warrior (being in all 4 ninja wars) and Kage (being Kage in all 4 ninja wars). So Part 1 Sannin = Peak of Gokage Full Power in "Beyond Sannin" Forms = Stronger than any of Gokage, can put up a fight against those in the next tier of power With that... Hidan, Kakazu, Sasori and Deidara no matter how you slice it at NO POINT in the series do they even scale to Part 1 Sannin. Each of them can lose in a 1v1 and for both pairs one can argue that each of the Sannin should beat them in a 2v1. Konan should just scale below the Base Sannin which is formidable but Obito preemptively underestimates her and Jiraiya negs her (granted he knows at least what her ability should mainly focus around). Kisame is tricky as he only scales to them when he's aided. The two times we know that he clearly scales to at least Part 1 Sannin is his Fused Samehada and vs. 7th Gate Guy. Granted, in both fights he's not close in power to Full Power Bee who just moments later in the war is stronger than original KCM Naruto. His v2 lariat should rival Raikage's full power one, considering his v1 lariat is equal match for Raikage with his lightning cloak not at full power. When he's amped on Bee's chakra he can at least jutsu clash 7th Gate Guy although he's nowhere near Guy's level and this is early war arc 7th Gate, not the one who can knock back Edo Madara and susano'o, let alone Six Paths Madara with a hirudoura. With that being said, I think Kisame even Fused should still be weaker than Full Power Sannin and generally is weaker than Part 1 Sannin before he absorbs chakra from Samehada. Technically in part 1 he's on the same level as Sharingan Kakashi, Base Guy and Asuma. Even in early part 2 with the 30% clone, Guy destroys him in the 6th gate but is put on the defensive in base due to his students getting captured. So a base KIsame is for sure below base Sannin Pain, Itachi and Obito of course all 3 are easily stronger than the Sannin at full power. With that being said, them defeating the Sannin in a 3v1 would prove difficult. A full power Itachi most likely can do it, Obito theoretically can if he's bfr them and could most easily do it in his MS + Rinnegan war arc version. A full power Nagato can also do it as he scales to full power Itachi (Itachi > Nagato but they are relative) and both I can see giving the Gokage a challenge although I don't think they can beat the war arc Gokage as I believe they fall short of initial KCM2 level
@@hobbyhorse5848 Rasengan to the face lol but in all seriousness I'm providing an analysis based off scaling and lore of the series not a jutsu/styles matchup. Part 1, the Sannin were stated to be equal to each other (this statement never really changed) with one of them being stated a match for Old Hiruzen. Hiruzen is stated numerous times to be the strongest of the Gokage during his reign even in his old age. So take it up with Kishimoto for having the Sannin in high regard to be above the Gokage. That's why they were all Hokage candidates / Hokage at one point and it isn't just cause of prestige/title. Also, it's interesting seeing the communities take on different vs. matchups after they finished a series compared to it during the actual releases of the series or the strength of characters at different points in the series.
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 Hiruzen is stated exactly once to he the strongest of the Gokage, once by Kabuto. And Kabuto specifically says “He had the reputation as being the strongest of the 5 Kage.” The key word here is reputation. How exactly would old man Hiruzen have gotten the reputation as being the greatest of the 5 Kage when he hasn’t even engaged in battle for multiple decades? It’s because it’s a reputation earned in his youth, his prime, which just reinforces the entire theme presented by Orochimaru in part 1, that Hiruzen was a shadow of his former self because he had grown old and weak and even a Hiruzen pushing 60 would’ve been able to defeat Orochimaru. Onoki is, pretty blatantly the strongest of the 5 Kage as we see in the war and he also takes up the position of leader among them, something Tsunade distinctly doesn’t. None of the Sannin are anywhere near as fast as Ay, and Jiraiya was near mortally wounded by the 4 tailed cloak of Naruto, a blood lusted Raikage going straight for him with attacks that can chop the 8 tails horn of will do genuinely fatal damage before he can appropriately react. Hell even among the Sannin Jiraiya is portrayed as an objective inferior to base Orochimaru. As much as the Hokage is usually the greatest of the Kage that is simply a precedent, and the Leaf had for more going for it than just their Kage, no village has more kekkei genkai users and hiden ninjutsu than the leaf does per clan. Personally I think it’s best the judge characters holistically, new information can always come out. I remember people including me used to say that Minato’s greatest weakness was AP (not that his was bad mind you), but after his One Shot it’s indisputable that’s not the case. I would like it if instead of Boruto we could’ve gotten more side stories of characters like Sannin, the other Kage, legends like Hanzo etc. to help clear up lots of the confusion. But as we don’t have that, this is my interpretation based on the material presented.
I was looking for another person's comment and ended up reading yours. I like your Part 1 Sannin points a lot and just wanted to give some props for it.
Someone pointed me to your comment. Your Part 1 scaling of the Sannin and interpretations of their base form is correct, but I disagree with some of your final conclusions. There's no argument to be made about Kisame against Jiraiya, that was settled in Part 1 when Kisame admits he has no chance and then Itachi says that Jiraiya would beat them both to confirm it. There's a great deal of evidence that suggests Orochimaru plateaued, through all of his showings as well as the narrative of the story. Tsunade is the strongest of the Kage, and Tsunade plainly states that Jiraiya is stronger than her, therefore Jiraiya must be stronger than A4. Nagato states that Jiraiya could have gotten the win over Pain if he knew how they worked, and that was after he slapped Konan. Jiraiya did the fight in the video by himself and almost won. Orochimaru's mental is made of glass when it comes to Uchiha, but Itachi stands no chance against Jiraiya and you could argue that Tsunade could take a win off Itachi on her own as well. It talk more in depth about Obito in my own comment, but I also think the three Sannin together have a pretty good chance at taking him out. Full Power Nagato is a different animal and Itachi isn't even close. Nagato defeated Hanzo's entire army and forced him to run away, then he hunted him down afterward anyway. I think he would wash the Sannin and might be able to beat the 5 Kage. Just to reiterate, even though we disagree about some scalings, I think your comment is great.
I would have reworded that segment if I could go back, more so just saying the Sannin could use their summons as a defense which is more applicable to Katsuyu character and summon wise.
@@mrmoonman7380 Tsunade would lose to the Animal path 1v1. She has no way of getting rid of the Cerberus, not to mention all the other animals. Eventually, even 100 healings Tsunade would run out of stamina or chakra and the Dog would simply torture her. The Charmeleon keeping the Animal path hidden from sight the whole time.
@@ShadowFiend777 the only summon she couldn’t one tap is the three headed dog because of its multiplying but Katsuya can do the same thing and has a long list of jutsu to either dissolve Cerberus with acid or immobilize to. so I don’t see the advantage. And she has senju and uzumaki blood she’s caked out in chakra, if she wasn’t busy healing the entirety of the leaf village all that healing would be focused on herself and she’d toss them all around except the Deva path.
25:18 Nope. She is the perfect counter for Sasori. So, Tsunade eats Sasori alive, Orochimaru eats Deidara alive, and Jiraiya sits down to watch and support anyone who seems to be incompetent enough to lose an unlosable fight. Deidara and Sasori can be very nasty, but two of the Sannin are the perfect counters for them.
@ThunderGod Your forgetting that the akatsuki members have to be relative to the biju in order to beat them and hidan was able to wound the 2 tails in order to get it's blood for his ritual he also had to be fast enough to pull that off too. To say he's just jonin level is crazy. Even if you wanna say that was just kakuzu hidan has shown the durability to be able to tank attacks from a full biju in that fight.
You are correct, Hidan also just blatantly attacks from Kakuzu’s wind heart. I more so am just saying Jonin can combat Hidan confidently without getting dominated compared to someone like Kakuzu. Also that fight was off screen so we have no idea how it actually went down.
@@ThunderGodTG The only jonin we have been shown who confidently fought Hidan was Kakashi. And even Kakashi was doing his absolute best to stay out of Hidan's attacking range. Asuma only ever got proper hits in when Hidan let him or was possessed by Shikamaru's shadow technique. And Asuma is comparable to Zabuza, not at all a standard Jonin.
The thing about 3rd kazekage is he was hailed as "stronger than his predecesors". Not raza, who was the 4th. So we honestly have no idea how strong he was alive. Also sasori using him as a puppet doesnt really tell us how good he was himself, he might be clever in battle like gaara or sasuke, or have high i.Q. aswell like shikamaru. We also dnt knw how sasori defeated him. Alot of fans like the opinion that he secretly poisoned him and took his body from the village. Who knows, itd be a great graphic novel
i never realized how funny it is that jiraya and orochimaru have two of the most complex arsenals in the show and tsunades only attack is punching
That's not true! She also has kicks
What if I told u that tsunada has mastery over earth and lightning Chakra changes and knows multi shadow clone jutuse😂 if anime is Canon lol
@@komlat253 about half of anine is canon.
@@komlat253 how awesome, she can use those releases to add elements to her punches and kicks
@altreon3608 she only used lightning realese once remember ? It was op but she did it on a genius ( koboto) so it didn't matter. The punch she uses lightning style in it to target the nervous system and confuse the connection to the brain and limbs . She is capable of so much more .but u know the author don't like girls so haha
To say Tsunade doesn't have crazy chakra reserves is disrespectful. She literally had enough to heal the entire village while using 1000 healing technique
I hope he doesn't say that cause that is absolutely false she is pretty much a god of chakra control this woman STORES CHAKRA IN HER FOREHEAD!!! 😭
People forget she is also part of the Uzumaki clan
@@MaliceDraclaushe’s not uzumaki she’s senju
@@qity5170She's descended from both Senju and Uzumaki cause Hashirama's wife was from the Uzumaki clan.
@@Awoken0 so technically, Naruto isn’t lying when he calls her granny Tsunade 😂
Lmao imagine
Its the Sanin vs Itachi/Kisame,
Orochimaru summons Tobirama, Tsunade tells him that she's fighting a Uchiha.
Tobirama: "say less fam."
Itachi: I killed the uchiha clan
Tobitama: *Switches teams* Say less fam
Tobirama gets smoked by Itachi so it doesn't really matter 🤷♂
@@moatazabdelraouf4059i think you mean Tobirama smokes Itachi
@@timetraveler5547 that’s where we disagree, at least edo to edo, itachi takes it for sure
@@moatazabdelraouf4059edo tobirama has lowkey ten-tails level ap based on his tandem paper bombs jutsu so he pretty casually obliterates the entire akatsuki
I think Hidan would be the best assassin ever, just think about it he could go undercover as a doctor and take the blood of every Kage and kill them. I think Hidan as a hitman like character would have been quite a cool concept.
He probably did that before, like this is a world of ninja. So stealth missions are important. He probably got cocky and wanted to be recognized to the point he didn't play things safe.
If only we got that Hidan one shot then we would have seen him clashing with the Nine Tails smh
Lmao we find out Kakazu survived his encounter with Hashirama because Hidan knocked him out
@@brandonreed3670where??
@@gavinhiggins2778episode 501 of shippuden
Bro missed the OVA
@@brandonreed3670 Nah man, Kakuzu doesn't need Hidan to help him. His raw durability scales to Hashirama pretty consistently.
Nice to see some respect getting put on the Sannin! Recently they've been trashed a lot by some power scalers, so it's nice to see a different perspective on them.
Watori
It's L
The sannin are taking a l if they fought the akatsuki
That's because they've been surpassed. The last 2 arcs bumped up everyone in terms of scaling. The sannin r strong but they're not top of the verse. They're shown to have clear power cliffs, which r meant for the next generation to surpass.
If you did this video: Kisame solos
Jiraiya indeed was past the hokage power level. His character has always stood it's ground in every fight
He had one solo fight in the series. And he died in it. 😵💫
@@Bloooo95 solo fight? my boy was jumped and did better than MS Kakashi while fighting more paths of Pain. Is he kage lvl? probably not. Is he the goat? yes.
He has no dubs
@@SuperDababy2He’s clearly Kage level lol he was considered for the position but didn’t want it
@@fox2569 yeah but Kage level is very broad, he's not high end Kage level. I'd put him like mid to lower Kage level (also at the time the leaf literally had no one else to pick other than Kakashi, and I think we all know that Jiraiya > part 1 Kakashi).
14:08 something I rarely hear brought up is that Sasuke was also not trying to kill Deidara in their fight since he wanted information about Itachi, but Deidara was clearly trying to kill Sasuke.
Also, it definitely makes sense for Orochimaru to be a counter to Sasori. It would be weird for them to see themselves as rivals if Orochimaru didn't have some degree of poison resistance, but even if he didn't I think you could argue he just uses that body replacement thing.
PS SHOUTOUT MR. GAMAKEN
I don't think Orochimaru saw Sasori as a rival at all. The fact he was confident him and Kabuto were going to defeat Sasori says a lot. Orochimaru does know about the Hiruko shell and keep in mind this Orochimaru is at the point his body is constantly rejecting him.
Sasuke also paints a clear picture in terms of his strength to Orochimaru.
Sasuke tells Orochimaru that he's stronger than him before he absorbs him. This Orochimaru is on his death bed with a body that is rejecting him on top of having his arms sealed and no ninjutsu for a guy who mastered all 5 chakra natures naturally
Sasuke checks Karin and doubles down that he only defeated Orochimaru cause of his sickness. He still deems Orochimaru's + his own power necessary to beat Itachi. I agree with you, Sasuke in no way was going all-out to even defeat Deidara. Sasuke I think was just blatantly ahead in the entire fight and had the elemental counter as well as the physicals, blitzing Deidara multiple times
The Hydra Form of Orochimaru could force Itachi to utilize his yata mirror and totsuka blade. This near blind to literal blind MS Itachi, Sasuke in his novel internally thinks that he's weaker than this Itachi when he first awakens his MS. Considering that he's monologuing how painful the susano'o is early in the Kage Summit, Itachi should still be stronger with Sasuke not clearing this Itachi until he first opens EMS (or arguable when in MS he shows the armored version briefly). Not saying Oro is at Itachi's level, he's clearly a level weaker than even a blind Itachi but he should be capable of contending with a MS user that has susano'o like a Kage Summit Sasuke before losing. Meanwhile, Sasori in my opinion is weaker than the Sasuke that Deidara lost to also.
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 On no planet is Hebi Sasuke stronger than Sasori, he’s not even stronger than war Gaara lmao.
Deidara was also fully confident in killing Orochimaru, and Orochimaru was fully confident he’d roll Hiruzen. Confidence is not the end all he all of evaluating these characters in fact it’s THE most vague metric since Orochimaru planned on a sneak attack. Hell Sakura was confident that she on her own would force Sasori to spill the beans on Orochimaru and he literally responded with a “stfu” and would’ve 0 diffed her without Chiyo there.
Itachi was also already using the Susanoo, and couldn’t even use Amaterasu anymore lol. Orochimaru basically showed up and was instantly dealt with by a heart attack victim, it’s really not a good look for anything other than his endurance and regen which we already know is top tier.
@@hobbyhorse5848 Well it's certainly a possibility and why even include war arc Gaara? He doesn't even have a direct scaling to these two. YES HE DOES NOT. 3rd Kazekage being called the strongest war in the beginning of part 2 and in the 3rd databook, which goes all the way up to Sasuke awakening his MS.
If your second paragraph has to do with Orochimaru vs. Sasori, keep in mind this Orochimaru is at one of the weakest points we see him. He doesn't even have a body that isn't rejecting him, he isn't in his snake form and of course he doesn't even have his jutsu & arms. So yes by all intention he was going to get rid of Sasori then and there as stated that was there intention. I personally am not seeing the comparison besides the lore of both killing a Kazekage. Besides that, while Sasori does have a . As far as a Hebi Sasuke vs. Sasori fight, I would take Sasuke in that fight as he counters Sasuke and has the elemental advantage. Hebi Sasuke would defeat a beginning of series Gaara too but not war arc Gaara who by the Kage Summit shows impressive feats, let alone the war that would put him easily as the strongest Kazekage or Sand shinobi for that matter
As for Itachi, the fact that he needed to use the yata mirror, totsuka blade and full armored susano'o against Orochimaru is saying something. Itachi being blind and on his deathbed doesn't make it an anti-feat for Orochimaru (and Itachi brought them out specifically for Orochimaru as stated by Obito and the text that he was pushing Sasuke so Orochimaru would come out to free him of the curse mark) especially since Sasori does not come close to this Itachi in power, let alone a healthier Akatsuki Itachi or Edo Itachi.
This isn't even bringing up the fact that Orochimaru at his strongest in the series outside of chapter 700 (Naruto Gaiden both Mitsuki's and Sarada's stories) is during the war arc where he has his full jutsu arsenal + white zetsu body + all of the chakra & powers of the Sound 5 + the best refined edo tensei in the series with better control than Kabuto given the Hashi cells. So yeah, Orochimaru alone is more than a match for Sasori even in his weaker forms. Hebi Sasuke is as well although that's a different story and war arc Gaara has feats being both Hebi Sasuke and Sasori
To be fair, pretty much ALL of Sasori's attacks are lethal, regardless of poison. The poison is just if you happen to dodge enough just to get grazed instead of instantly dying
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 You’re incorrect in your assertions about Gaara’s war scaling and I’ll do my best to explain why. For one war Gaara and a weakened edo Rasa are dead even in the strength, speed, and power of their sand. Gaara himself only defeated Rasa because he had the advantage over Rasa’s Edo auto reactions lifting his gold dust to protect the other Kage which left him open to be sealed. Any assertions of Gaara “surpassing him long ago” are based entirely on Gaara surpassing him in character and it makes literally 0 sense as a power statement due to the fact that a Gaara who is much stronger than he was in the past failed to overpower him or outspeed him without exploiting a cheat (in fact, Rasa explicitly states that Gaara is stronger now than he was in full Bijuu mode).
The third Kazekage was so monumentally powerful that his mere presence held together the stability of the Land of Wind. The sand elders who were obviously alive for Rasa’s tenure state “That such a strong man could be killed…no one believed it possible.” Rasa who literally died 3 years ago is not even remotely spoken of in these terms and in fact is not even spoken of at all. The third was extraordinary, Rasa was mediocre. If you STILL don’t believe this despite the narrative spamming it in our face, Chiyo explicitly says that the iron sand is the MOST FEARED weapon in the HISTORY of the sand. More than the gold dust and more than Shukaku himself. It’s as blatant as possible that War Gaara is weaker than Sasori when you actually take his feats in context and don’t wank the shit out of him to say he’s 8GG level in speed like some tend to do.
As for Orochimaru v Sasori, I have always asserted that any victory he’d get over Sasori while nerfed would he the result of trickery and slippery tactics. He’s obviously weaker while nerfed by RDS and in a direct fight he will be forced to resort to Hydra which will likely beat Sasori due to its nature. Part 1 Orochimaru in base defeats Sasori but he does not low diff him by any stretch of the imagination without ET or Hydra. Killing someone much stronger than Rasa while at a disadvantage AND destroying a country blatantly put him as a peer of Orochimaru by lore and accomplishments.
As for Hebi Sasuke, this “elemental advantage” you speak of does not exist even for an inferior form of sand (Gaara’s shield) which tanked the Raikage’s Guillotine drop (which can crack parts off the Susanoo ribcage). His only actual advantage is the sharingan which will allow him to aimdodge Sasori’s iron sand blocks, it’s entirely ambiguous if he could evade the iron sand shower. Even if he can Sasori will just do what he did in canon, immediately pick up on Sasuke reading his moves w/ the sharingan and then use Iron Sand world order which Sasuke cannot evade. He can only oral rebirth once, and he’s fighting an uphil battle against someone who’s 1) stronger 2) Can easily play keep away 3) Can throw wave after constant wave of BS at him. It’s also not likely that Sasuke is immune to all poison as he wasn’t immune to the white snakes blood, and he’s only shown to inherit a stamina buff and some jutsu, he sure as hell can’t reconnect his body from bisection. He doesn’t have the physical strength to knock away any of the iron sand blocks either or any jutsu with enough AP to blatantly cut through the large iron sand constructs unless he gets off a real Kirin. He simply struggled too much with Deidara who is barely clearing Rasa on the food chain to beat Sasori more times out of ten than not.
Itachi actually has huge chakra reserves - If we take what happens before he fights Sasuke - He transfers the crow to Naruto with a genjutsu trap.... then he "fights" Kisame, then messes around with Sasuke
and sends 2 clones out
Sure if you exclude the top 10 he has a huge pool but compared to the top he’s not close.
@@nomad4411 oh for sure
Great vid as usual! I’m glad to see the Sanin getting some appropriate power scaling for once
Yessir! Appreciate it!
I have a major issue with people mentioning Itachi taking out Orochimaru's 5 headed snake form. The reason for this is, let me ask you, what body is Orochimaru using at this point? The vessel that was rejecting him so hard that he was weaker than Sasuke? Or his Original body which is very old and weak? Or what?
I know the 5 headed snake his Orochimaru's strongest "form" but Orochimaru's base is likely at his weakest by FAR! Orochimaru in a fresh vessel should be much stronger in the same form! And Orochimaru in the white zetsu Body is far stronger than any other previous form of Orochimaru Base-Base.
I'd like to hear your thoughts on this!
This is actually a really good point! I would add that by this point orochimaru had lost his host Body that was rejecting him and is actually attacked to Sasuke.
The Form that emerges is the amount of chakra Sasuke was suppressing with his own which could be far weaker than if a Full Health Full Body version emerged. This is supplemented by each curse mark having small portions of Orochimaru’s chakra that he notes are not much as when he emerges against EMS Sasuke he says he’s pretty weak at that moment.
The form itself is just Orochimaru’s failed version of Sage Mode that Kabuto achieves both marked to be Dragons, I’d say it’s more comparable to a sage mode amp more than anything else. But generally the form shouldn’t vary too much. So I could def agree a FP Hydra form would more than likely be much stronger than what’s seen we just have no measure other than it’s just stronger.
Also this is when Orichimaru's arms were gone in the God of deaths stomach lol
@@nzephier orochimaru mentions that itachi was stronger than him even when he fought hiruzen. It's why orochimaru bid his time hoping to catch itachi off guard and low on chakra. Sadly for him itachi was planning on it
@@ThunderGodTG I cant wait for Orochimaru to make an Otsutsuki vessel lmao
Stop the cope Orochimoro is Fodder compared to itachi he even said it
For Sasori I'd say it's very clear that he is above Rasa. While we don't have feats for the third Lazekage we do know that he was the strongest kazekage to ever exist by the start of shipuden. This means that he would by default be above Rasa. Plus Sasori also has the third kazekage as a puppet so even if you assume Sasori is only equal to the third kazekage (he's not, he beat him and his puppet body is directly stated to be stronger) that would still mean that Sasori with the third kazekage puppet I at minimum 2x stronger than someone who was stronger than Rasa. The same Rasa that Orochimaru felt the need to jump and sneak attack to beat. Not saying Rasa I stronger than Orochumaru but he's at least relative since Orochimaru was as cautious as he was.
That wouldnt mean he’s relative to Orochinaru. Orochimaru just doesnt go in straight ahead. He always plans
@@Shadows1Fan he plans when going against opponents that could be a threat to him. He didn't need to plan before menacing Akakashi for example. The fact that he didn't just attack him shows that he at least didn't think that was a good idea.
@@alexanderasher8037 but we already know Orochimaru is more of a strategist. He could have killed the kazekage right off the bat, but we gotta remember he wanted to destroy the Leaf Village, so he manipulated them. He also wouldve had a whole village on his ass
Some things to be taken into account, in my opinion. Tsunade specially was throughout ignored in this vid.
1 - Katsuyu's acid can't be absorbed (or reflected by Yata mirror), so that would be a huge problem to Itachi's Susano'o, since it's not very mobile, and would be a ko for Konan if it lands (would need a distraction, though).
2 - Tsunade's strengh is not being taken into account, on a 1 x 1 it's one thing, but with the other two, plus summons pressuring, it's not very likely that it won't land once. Even Madara had to use a clone.
3 - Reverse summon and sealing techniques. The 3 are experts in this department, meaning chibaku tensei or water prison won't work, and the only reason Orochimaru stayed sealed was because Manda was f pissed at him and he also used Anko as backup plan. Also, Jiraiya sealed amaterasu on his first encounter with Itachi and Kisame.
4 - Tsunade's chakra and byakugo. She usually don't use jutsus, probably because her taijutsu is stronger (take Mei acid, for example, did nothing to Madara's ribcage), but she can overload someone's if needed. Dust release became 100 times larger, imagine most jutsus that take 1/10th that chakra. That alone leads me to believe that she has way much more chakra than Nagato. Not to mention that she can heal Jirayia remotely and tank barely anything these guys can throw (she endured a whole day against 5 Madara clones on full ofense, and here it's only her, Jiraiya and maaaaybe Orochimaru here and there)
5 - Adding Tsunade perfect chakra control, and the fact that it's 3 + summons, I don't think genjutsu would be a factor.
You are the only valid opinion here!! 😍😍😍
42:00 did everyone forget how pa died? He tried using frog song and was instantly killed lol. Frog song is pretty op but has the worst start up time. If you actually think about it, it was a miracle jiriaya was even able to use it. And theres also the issue that itll more than likely incapacitate the other sannin too
Exact people are just not good at reading. Frog song is a genjutsu comprised of LITERAL SOUND WAVES. Guess how fast sound waves travel. The speed of sound. You know who was dodging the speed of sound?? LITERAL CHUNIN IN PART 1. Jiraiya only got frog song off on Pain because Pain sent his 3 WEAKEST PATHS TO FIGHT JIRAIYA and Jiraiya prepped frog song while hiding ahead of time and boxed all the paths into an area in a narrow tunnel with 0 escape routes and thus released it instantly and there was nowhere for the paths to go/dodge. Frog song is hilariously useless against Itachi or honestly anybody that is Kage level+ in a relatively open battlefield.
He wasn’t attached
@HC-gm4fo so? Doesn't change the fact pain would still kill him regardless
@dragondrakage2402 the frog song is very potent to those you have experienced it before
@@michaeliheagwara9355 what
How strong is katsuyu’s acid? Cuz I feel like that’s not being considered enough in these matchups. Mei’s acid really messed up Sasuke’s Susano. Plus the acid would be the best way to combat pain’s dog summons if the acid is strong enough. Also, I know u said Amaterasu takes out the summons, but I don’t think itatchi can spam Amaterasu that much without his eyes going out or running out of chakra. Cuz the sanin can all summon loads of snakes/frogs/slugs. If he does spam it, there’s no way he will have enough chakra/eye-stamina to hang with all 3 sanin.
Strongest burning/melting ability shown so far in the series. It vaporizes rocks immediately upon contact and no other firestyle or acid has shown than potency. Plus its natural so you cannot absorb it and it has massive aoe. Orochimaru even said it can one shot him, so its that instantaneous.
this was one of my main thoughts throughout the video…katsuyu isn’t mainly for fighting but she definitely still has the power to do some big damage
Katsuya is considered to be one of the strongest summons in the show. I think manda is stronger? But she Is def top 5 in summons. That's why Sakura summoning her was an important character moment.
That Squidward clip got me. I wasn't expecting it
😂😂
The editing on this was insane 🔥 w video as usual. Glad you’re getting the recognition you deserve bro‼️
My man!
I guess it would've been too unfair to include Tobi in the match up 😂
Add prime orochimaru gg
@@orochimaruprjuubito claps
@@obsidianquill7949 Juubito got beat by edo Minato and tobirama lol
Add boruto era Orochimaru
@@orochimarupr didn’t it take like all 4 hokage, kcm2 sm Naruto, and ems sasuke to take down juubito? Prime orochimaru isnt outscaling juubito at all.
@@obsidianquill7949 Boruto era Orochimaru with edo tensei for sure.
Juubito claps a lot of people from boruto though especially delta.
I don't really see how Konan is a hard counter to Tsunade. Tsunade can tank the paper bombs with seal release/strength of 100, she was able to survive Mabui teleporting her and the Raikage at the speed of sound (it is stated that any normal person would be torn to shreds). She could use Katsuyu to dissolve Konan with acid slime or weigh down her papers like Jiraiya would do with toad oil. Obviously if Konan ever made the mistake of staying to solid form it wouldn't even be a contest. Quite the opposite I don't see much of an opening for Konan to come out on top in that match up.
speed of light *
It was the speed of light😅.
28:52 Here, the Sannin have a good chance, but they have to go all out. Tsunade can break Itachi's Susanoo, so that's a priority. I'd match Orochimaru+Tsunade vs. Itachi and Jiraiya vs. Kisame.
Jiraiya has good options for underwater fighting so he could stall Kisame with a frog army and possibly win. If he wins, the fight is probably won. If he won't win and can only stall, then Orochimaru and Tsunade need to defeat Itachi.
To consider... Susanoo is very taxing and Tsunade can break it. Itachi's Susanoo has a shield so depending on how exactly it works breaking Susanoo will be hard. But the Susanoo is not that fast, it's made more like to be able to seal big enemies than normal sized shinobi. Tsukuyomi can be counteracted reliably and both Tsunade and Orochimaru should do well counteracting any other genjutsu. Orochimaru can take Amaterasu and survive, but it's still not a good idea. If they work together they could trap Itachi into either getting poisoned by Orochimaru's blood, getting cut by Kusanagi, or being stomped by Tsunade. If Orochimaru uses Edo Tensei, though, Itachi's probably done for, depending on what Orochimaru summons.
Alternatively, Orochimaru could fight against Itachi, and Jiraiya against Kisame, while Tsunade goes full healing. I don't think Orochimaru can win that one, but Jiraiya will destroy Kisame, because he can cause damage to him, and can heal anything Kisame does. It becomes a fight of attrition. If Orochimaru can survive Itachi until then, the fight is won. Otherwise, there is a similar thing going on with Tsunade+Jiraiya vs Itachi. They want to be able to break the Susanoo, and they probably have better chances than Tsunade+Orochimaru, but they are more vulnerable to Amaterasu.
Note that Amaterasu is only strong because it's hard to get rid of it. Someone who has been hit by Amaterasu can still counterattack through it.
-----------------
That, assuming Itachi is healthy. Ill Itachi won't be able to fight as hard and will likely be defeated in a 2v1.
We do love Mr. Gamekin.
But itachi can only use his ms 3 times, his amaterasu can only travel 0-5 meters, jiraya can use the barrier and than doesn't need to look at itachis eyes, jiraya can use jis dark swamp on the susanoo, tsunade can heal the sanin, jiraya only had to charge up because he didn't think he was going to use sage mode, but if he prapers (knowing that jiraya in sage mode is a above itachi (not that much)since he counters him pretty bad). Jiraya alone can sommun 3 gigantic toads, orochimaru 2-3 snakes, and katsuyu can separate, amaterasu would not be a problem to the sommons. Knowing that alive itachi is weaker than jiraya (base jiraya is same tear but still weaker, but in sage mode he beats itachi) and could have support from tsunade while orochimaru deals whit kisame. They should win against itachi and kisame.
Also that pain himself said if jiraiya had info he would win. Chubaku tensei's core can be destroyed by jiriya big ball rasengan. If they have info the sanin win if not than...
People underestimate the Sanin.They’re all really strong. And as a team they’re stronger than as individual like how Naruto and Sasuke are working as a team
37:32 Here probably the Sannin have better chances. Tsunade can do a lot as long as she's not busy protecting and healing an entire village and Orochimaru is the brain that can figure out what the paths do. Jiraiya himself can do a lot against Konan and some paths.
If a path gets taken out of the battlefield Nagato cannot revive it, and that's likely to happen. It's also a matter of time until the Preta path tries to eat sage mode chakra and gets turned into a toad statue.
The idea for the Sannin is to fight a completely defensive and covert battle. Orochimaru can hide and move underground and catch a path unawares. Jiraiya can do something similar with water. When they get a chance, they might be able to get rid of up to two paths just like that. Depending on the lost paths, we might have an "easy" fight, or a very difficult one. If they get the Deva path and the Naraka path they remove Nagato's ability to revive the paths and the most powerful path. In a more normal scenario, if they take Naraka and Human, the summons can stall the animal path, and they might be able to catch other paths into the sound genjutsu.
So, if they succeed with "troll" tactics, they have a decent chance, if they fail, they lose.
Loved the video even if I disagree with half the conclusions. Keep em coming.
My man appreciate that! If I could inquire which parts did you disagree on or think needed work?
@@ThunderGodTG It's your analysis that I didn't agree with, so extra work probably wouldn't address the part of the video I disliked. Others have said it better than I can but I'll sum up my thoughts as best I can. Your Sannin scaling is still off even though you give way more credit to them than most of the other Naruto UA-camrs do. Base Sannin generally scale above most Akatsuki members. Itachi says Jiraiya can beat him and Kisame together. Nagato says that Jiraiya could have beat Pain if he had intel, after Jiraiya beats Konan. Sannin together easily take those fights. Others also pointed out that Sannin have a good chance against Obito as well, so that would have been cool to have in the video. The bonus round vs Taka section seemed like an afterthought, but like you said there's really nothing they could do against any of the Sannin so it's not really a match to discuss. EMS Sasuke would have been a better bonus round, but he probably still gets body slammed. Others talked about Sage Kabuto in their comments, I think that could have been a cool bonus round idea.
Ahhh yeah we for sure disagree on Sannin scaling I think EMS Sasuke would violate pretty badly. I know some of the Base Sannin stuff but, again I personally don’t agree with it. Appreciate the comment though we can just agree to disagree on that front.
@@ThunderGodTG Yeah for sure, nothing wrong with agreeing to disagree. You do a good job making fun videos to listen to, that's the point.
Tsunade counter Genjustu hard. With mini Katsuyu constantly pumping out out chakra to disrupt a genjustu similar to how tailed beast does it for their Jinchuuriki. Orochimaru hard counters Amaterasu. His body shedding, shed Amaterasu, it was also genjsutu that Itachi used to defeat Orochimaru, which Tsunade covers for. Jiraiya hard counter Kisame, frogs do very well in waters plus absorbing sage chakra will turn him into stone. Then frog song to counter Susanoo, by using Swamp of the Underworld and Rashmon gates, to stop itachi's movement.
Tsunade does counter genjutsu but it’s actually via Byakugo seal since it’s a foreign influx of chakra that would agitate her chakra that’s being controlled.
@@ThunderGodTG that would be for herself yes. But Orochimaru and Jiriya need katsuyu, there is a possibility that Ma and Pa can help Jiriya but there also a chance that they get trapped too, but not mini katsuyu
I remember people always said Itachi would stomp Jiraiya, but if you think about it, many of Jiraiyas attacks are actually direct counters to Itachis moves. Not saying he'd get an easy win but its possible he could beat him.
The problem is Itachi's virtually unparalleled ability to come up with lethal attacks before his opponents even begin to prepare any of their fancy powers or put up any meaningful resistance, decisively beating them without much of a fight.
To stand a chance, I imagine Jiraiya would have to be in Sage Mode before he even meets Itachi, and Orochimaru would have to fight remotely through Edo Tensei, minimizing exposure to the Sharingan and taking advantage of Itachi's relatively low chakra reserves.
Nah he definitely stomps jiraiya
That's exactly the point, Itachi's greatest power is the element of surprise, but Jiraiya is an expert spy, he wouldn't go head on like Orochimaru. And the longer the battles draggs, the harder it would be for Itachi
@@foreighteen7797q
21:14 I mean... he has Kusanagi, he has the snake substitution, he can turn into the snake, he has Rashomon, and he has big summons. That alone can destroy Deidara.
Orochimaru can also survive C4. He just goes underground and waits until the danger is over.
Love your channel bro. Just peeped the video with swagkage before this one. Definitely one of the better naruto channels🙏 also I'd be interested in a tailed beasts ranked. Im always curious to see how people rank them. Yea aint a lot of feats for some but still
My man appreciate it! and noted!
@@ThunderGodTG yessir keep up the good work!
This is an amazing video honestly.
Love this video idea 🙏🏼
41:11 That's the thing. If the Deva path gets distracted by the summons for a second, the other paths will have issues dealing with the Sannin. Chances are they can be taken out.
I think its fair to say Pain's fatigue was more of just the long cooldown on his shinra tensei, which recovered mid-fight with Naruto.
I think this matters because the pain bodies aren't alive and dont have stamina, so what they are really referring to is Nagato, who isnt using stamina, but chakra. Nagato had less chakra, but all he had to do was transmit chakra into the chakra receiver rods. Nagato did not run out of chakra in his fight, so it didnt matter.
The only time it made a difference is when fighting Hinata because the receivers lost chakra momentarily, or something. Idk maybe they just glitched LOL but it happened only once, after technically defeating Naruto anyways.
I dont think Tendo Pain was slower, or the animal summonings were any weaker, etc. because Pain nuked the village. Nagato just had less chakra to fight for less time, which doesnt matter because he still had chakra left after the fight (as evidenced by him using rinne rebirth)
Further evidence of this being the fact that other paths were still able to use their abilities just fine, but Tendo was the only one incapable.
It's stated to have a 5 second cooldown minimum, with bigger blasts taking longer. So with this being a big blast, it took more than 5 seconds, and when he got it back he spammed it and dominated lol
40:08 Pain spending chakra is of no consequence. There is an entire village of chakra for the Preta path to drain. Also Nagato has so much chakra that even after all the pains were gone, he still had chakra to spare.
Yo props on the swag colab 👍
My man big ups only possible cause of the support
@ThunderGodTG oh yeah if you need any help with the discord I'd be more then happy to help I'm technically a mod in 2 and have a test server of my own
@@ThunderGodTG oh yeah if you need any help with the discord I'd be more then happy to help I'm technically a mod in 2 and have a test server of my own
Video idea suggestion, what are your defining marks on what makes a ninja a certain tier? Like a detailed look on what qualifications as shown in the show would make someone that certain tier.
Ohhh I really like this! I’m gonna write it down and shout you out for the vid idea
You should do a "What if Zetsu didn't rat out Sasuke during the 5 Kage Summit"
I would love to see how that would've worked out
Not much would change honestly. C, Fuu and Ao all knew where Sasuke was being each great sensors. While they weren't focused on him, they were already each on high guard given they just caught Danzo using Shisui's eye and all the Kage guards were on high alert after the Raikage broke the table. I doubt they even catch them off guard not to mention Sasuke was literally only there for Danzo so at best he corners Danzo before the Raikage and Gaara inevitably interrupts the fight for different reasons
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 None of them knew Sasuke was there until Zetsu ratted them out, so... none of that is relevant, really.
@@Necromancer4267 My point is too that Sasuke wasn’t near the room where the Summit was taking place. Also the samurai guards found them out without even sensing chakra so it’s not like he was going to sneak up on the Gokage. Besides, Sasuke was literally only after Danzo and couldn’t care about any other, maybe besides hearing what Gaara has to say before dismissing him like he did. Sasuke can’t hide his chakra so in your scenario he only wants the smoke with Danzo where as the original timeline it’s the same but still gives the hands to everyone there lol
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 You keep giving information completely predicated on Zetsu ratting them out. No one knew they were there. No one found them without Zetsu.
Great video!!! Spelling in thumbnail needs a little work ;)
I just noticed this lmao! Thanks for the heads up
For some reason people don't put Katsuyu in Tsunade's fights. Katsuyu is a direct counter to kisame and itachi. Acid when in contact with water explodes so kisame becomes useless amateratsu gets sealed by any of the sannin as jiraiya can seal it with a decent sealing jutsu. Katsuyu will provide healing, defense, battle information and being a direct counter to genjutsu(being able to disrupt it), Slugs don't have eyes😅. Can split into smaller but still larger clones to spew acid, body slam, suffocate and just be good distractions/diversions. Katsuyu also negates Pain and konan, they can't damage her and she too will be providing shared/link vision like the paths of pain. She negates the push and pull techniques. Konan will get vaporized 😅 Also many of the old war veterans called Tsunade slug princess. That just shows its not out of character for her to summon Katsuyu in her fights.
Jiraiya had to take out a scroll to seal it. Amaterasu would severely burn him by the time he takes out the scroll. I'd even argue the Amaterasu would burn the scroll before he has the time to open it up.
Orochimaru and Tsunade probably have more efficient sealing techniques. All of jiraiya moves tend to take time to build up while Tsunade and Orochimaru can just whip them out save for edo tensei
Itachi could also just like idk... use it again on them while they take out big ass scrolls to seal it@@OkairMcLaren
@@SuperDababy2It literally can be evaded or deflected.
DANG the edits go hard
In Sanin vs Itachi and Kisame, If Jirayai is able to activate the sound genjutsu, its over for Itachi and Kisame, since Kisame cannot break Itachi free even though Itachi can free Kisame by casting his own genjutsu. But that Itachi will still die since its 3 vs 2. 1 person will take care of Itachi while 2 keep Kisame busy
Itachi probably knows about the frogs since he read up on sage chakra and jutsu (to the point of knowing what the fuck Kabuto was doing in that fight, he know that he was using sage mode and each sage move he was going to throw out). Itachi then just stops everything from happening, or even just does that round start (like he has already done to Orochimaru before).
@@SuperDababy2 The frogs genjutsu is their own unique attack. Its not linked to sage mode. If I remember correctly, it seems even Jiraiya didn't know about it.
Itachi had the chakra illness. Something jiraya was well aware of. The sannine would use orochimaru to stall kisame while the other two wear itachi down. Itachi acknowledged that Jiraya is not some one to fuck with.
@@thelandlord111 Itachi said that just so Kisame and him would have to kill Jiraiya. We saw how easy Itachi best a prime Orochimaru when he was like 13, I don't think the Sannin are winning
Jiraiya didn’t even know about frog song in his fight with Pain and you have him starting with it? 😵💫
45:06 that voice crack was crazy fam🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣. pAtHs of pain
Man I be thirsty during some of these vids LMAO
I'd day they actually beat Itachi and Kisame. For the simple fact that Itachi is sick and his fight against Sasuke showed how much it affects him. Orochimaru is stronger than that Sasuke and he put up a decent fight.
I just hate how people overrate itachi and don’t take some things into full account. For example orochimaru and itachi never had a true fight yet people just want to jump to the conclusion that itachi is stronger. When you take into account everything orochimaru can do is say he beat itachi 6/10 because he will just put last him. Orochimaru never once approached him with killing intent
@t-god2439 Wish I could upvote your comment a million times. While I do find Itachi a handsome and alluring character, I can't stand how so many viewers act as if that scene means Orochimaru is sooo much weaker, when it was clear that he was only toying Itachi around.
@@kiravampira1456 I think it was his arrogance imo that got the best of him. But I do think if he approached him prepared itachi would have died. He could have just poisoned him if he wanted to kill him. Also despite the weapons itachi’s Susano has it is imo the weakest one we see in the series. It has no legs and can be taken advantage of by anyone who has earth style or mud style for that matter
AWESOME VIDEO CONCEPT
I mean, Orochimaru was still technically apart if the Akatsuki since he kept one of the rings.
That's one advantage for the Sannin since orochimaru for sure noted most of their weaknesses before he left.
Still get folded
I liked how well you analyzed the fight vs Pain and Konan.
If Orochimaru had access to ET, then the sannin + summons would make any fight an 8 v 2 💀
8:10 Honestly when it doesn’t contradict the manga I don’t see why people feel like the anime has no place in discussing the manga
12:06 I honestly disagree, I think Sasori is a rival to Orochimaru both in terms of lore and power. The third kazekage’s Iron sand is verbatim stated to be the strongest weapon in the history of the sand, even over Rasa who as a weakened Edo can match Gaara’s sand in power and speed despite stating “he’s even stronger than in full Bijuu mode.” Sasori also says that the 3KK was difficult to kill and Chiyo also says iron sand has an advantage over puppets. The third was also so powerful that the sand elders who were alive for Rasa’s tenure glaze the shit out of him and even state that he was so strong he held the land of wind together and upon his death it triggered multiple wars that destroyed multiple small countries. Chiyo’s puppetry doesn’t have any speed anti feats and Jiraiya himself isn’t a speedster in any way with the other Sannin being relative to him in base. Gamabunta and Jiraiya being somewhat relative also puts this into perspective as Sasori>Third Kazekage>Rasa~War Gaara>Shukaku>~Gamabunta. I also believe that the relativity is a little overblown as Orochimaru implies he can just beat up base Jiraiya.
17:37 I personally think Orochimaru is immune to most poison as his blood itself is poison. The sannin honestly probably survived Hanzo because of Tsunade, Jiraiya looks beat to hell and he couldn’t even stand up.
19:03 Tsunade can be cut by the kusanagi, the Yasaka heads are very powerful but they’re a blunt force form of damage which cracks bones and destroys organs which doesn’t cause visible damage against Tsunade’s regen. Either way I think a 3 v 2 against 3 sannin and 1 Orochimaru rival and someone weaker the outcome is pretty clear.
20:44 The toad oil only works that way on paper and Gaara’s regular sand (as opposed to metal dust held together with magnetism). Not saying they can endure it at all because fire style is fire style but Sasori’s puppets according to the Gaara novel are apparently made of fire resistant clay. Sasori can also just telekinetically manipulate his body parts, so don’t really see how oil does anything to that. In fact even if his limbs were blown to smithereens he directly states he can recreate his body endlessly as long as his core survives.
27:31 Manda endured the initial shockwave of C0 but that still killed him, so I think they’ll all die.
30:35 Poor Tsunade is an anchor and an Amaterasu victim in this fight.
37:51 Pain beats all the Sannin on his own imo. 1 strong shinra Tensei broke all of Gamabunta’s bones, so Gama & Manda are now bodied instantly. All their ninjutsu is negged, even Sage Jiraiya cannot tag the Pains with shared vision up, Tsunade is also negged by universal pull into soul rip or Rinnegan rods which disrupts her chakra control. People forget how nerfed Pain was against Naruto, there is very little any of the 5 Kage can do against the Deva, Preta, and Naraka paths just camping with the other paths as support. Against the Leaf the Pains chose to separate themselves, Pain together chooses to stay in a close unit. I do think Pain will be forced to actually try though because of Orochimaru, but Jiraiya here is the weak link due to his fragility.
Also Obito solos.
I love reading ur comments, straight fax
W comment, the Sasori lore stuff is fair enough depending how you interpret it, I would also say to the Toad Oil point while it’s obviously just a bit of spit balling we do see that puppets can be locked up or have their movements hindered like when Shino locks crows joints, so I still think it’s fair enough and more so interpret Sasori just repairing himself via chakra threads and other puppets nearby endlessly. Again not absolute by any means but I think worth a discussion.
@@ThunderGodTG the way I see it oil is a lubricant, against paper it seeps into it and makes it heavy which is why Jiraiya says Konan can’t peel her paper apart. Against Sasori he’s basically oiling up the tin man lol.
As for Sasori’s real body, we never see any threads and from the presentation of it, his core, and the lore implications that he wanted to learn Edo Tensei his core is most likely the result of dark forbidden ninjutsu. Chakra threads for example don’t explain why Sasori is able to “see” and has functioning eyes and why his core physically alters the appearance of whatever puppet it switches to match his. The reason why Sasori was forced into switching bodies is because he was about to be hit by Chiyo’s sealing jutsu which totally immobilizes you and seals all your chakra so he couldn’t afford to take the hit (and her sealing jutsu is no joke as she is the one who seals the sands Bijuu into the sands Jinchuriki). The databook even says that under regular circumstances his body is “indestructible” and that his core is his “one and only weakness.”
I would make the case it definitely depends on how you interpret the core itself since by some notion it has to move, The core itself isn’t really something that has mobility or any sort of capacity for it, so I always saw that’s primarily how Sasori transferred it either physically taking it out or threading it to another puppet - we just don’t know cause it wasn’t show.
As far as the oil I’m more so on the basis it just too sticky generally speaking which the databook backs up by it restricting movement - which isn’t exclusive to Konan she just got counter by it. Either way it’s not a break it or make it but, it def is possible it could effect how smoothly Sasori can dissipate his puppet body or transfer his core. Either way not full proof on either front but, more so just good stuff against Sasori’s core which is noted to be his greatest weakness.
Wait where does it say Orochimaru has all the elements? And Ying & Yang?
Databook for Oro
itachi simping.
sannin obviously beat konan/pain. Jiraiya already did that fight and didn't do bad enough to think he'd lose with his 2 buddies.
Pain fp low diffs jiraiya
22:38 does anyone know which storm game that is
Pain beats the sannin on his own
Fact
Possibly .but Jiraiya took 3 paths on and won with no info adding the extra 2 people who also cover his weakness at least makes it's mid-high diff fight for pain
@@codbeast914right he beat three with no Intel and didn't know they can revive. If all the pains showed up and with some time ,front song wins. Also orochimaru is supposed to be comparable to Jiraiya. Orochimaru is takes the other 2 which leaves us with the one and I think the can do it
@@codbeast914 Jiraiya beat them after being given the motherload of all time saving and the fact they didn't bother enough to actually try. One single Shinra Tensei and Jiraiya is dead.
@@MysticalArcane it took a few to kill Kakashi sage Jiraiya has higher durability then Kakashi
17:24 Untrue. The Hyakugou would make you immune to poison, just because the poison doesn't damage you fast enough that the Hyakugou cannot heal you.
Tg I think you didn’t give kisame enough credit. I think he’s stronger than all the sannin individually. Also I think you lowballed sasori because you capped him at rasa level but he beat the third kazekage who was stated to be the strongest kazekage ever. And rasa was able to beat shukaku repeatedly. But keep up the videos hope you keep going up 💯💯
So with the Rasa stuff we just don't have a measure speed wise beyond Rasa as Gaara grows beyond him and the Third is beyond, Sasori is def stronger we just don't know by how much, Kisame was also just not necessary for the bout and is contentious at points, depends where you think base Kisame is honestly, but yeah that's fair it's just a closer debate than Itachi vs any of the sannin, thanks for the support my guy!
@@ThunderGodTG yo tg noodles wants to talk to you about your opinion on Tobirama in the rencent collab with swag
Oh tell homie to hit me on twitter it’s legit on every vid description or on my channel link super aviable
I’d like to point out 4th would be brought in too as it was what he was going to do. So you got yellow flash able to blitz itachi or at least separate the team or get a person out of attacks that could wipe.
Pain vs all 3 would be closer 😂
Not even he gets clapped
@@orochimarupr Animal path by itself was able to stalemate base Jiriaya and Jiriaya just so happens to be the only one who can get rid of the Cerberus. Two more paths caused Sage Jiriaya to retreat.
Deva path by itself could use either chaotic Shira tensei or Chibaku Tensei which held the entire half nine tails at bay and he even said he could've made it bigger.
@@ShadowFiend777 The 3 sannins have the best chemistry, jiraya having someone like orochimaru makes it easier since they can't kill him. Tsunade is also not dying at full power.
Edo tensei + all the summonings pain loses. If is prime orochimaru he solos
@@orochimarupr I agree the sannin are exceptionally powerful, but Pain shouldn't be downplayed. Jiriaya is the only one that can deal with Animal path, but with the other 5 paths present, his focus will be elsewhere.
Again, the Deva path can always resort to the two powerful jutsu I mentioned earlier or he could combine with another path e.g. Human or Preta and drain chakra or rip out souls. He did this against Kakashi with Asura and Sage Naruto with Preta. In other words, Deva path would universal pull and Human path would catch them and soul rip.
The Sannin as a team honestly go between Sasori&Deidara and Itachi&Kisame.
@@orochimaruprorochimaru can definitely be killed by pain.
Animal and asura can be used as heavy distractions
Human path can go in with taijutsu while supported by deva and look for soul rips
Which does bypass orochimarus hax and tsunades 100 healings or chibaku tensei and gg them anyway.
Especially since pain has the feat of still attacking and defending himself with gravity while chibaku tensei is active.
The sannin actually get dropped off
Alright, how about this. Not sure if this matchup was thought up before but here it is:
Sanin + the 4 modern Kage(Mei, Onoki, A, and Gaara), vs the Akatsuki(obviously not Orochimaru), including Obito. A full team battle.
Honestly for the pain portion of the video, if u just split it into the 3 paths that fought jiraiya, konan and a path vs tsunade, and the deva and a path vs orochimaru there’s nothing they can do. Hell even konan with two paths and just the deva vs orochimaru alone would work. The sanin more times than not lose. I’d say they win like 2/10 times being generous. Konan being there is honestly a huge huge problem.
Konan without prep time ocean is nothing .Her " strongest " projectiles are no stronger than the kunai paper tags of regular jounins .And besides the paper tags she only has paper shuriken and that slow sheet suffocation jutsu .Even freaking Karin has a more dangerous " arsenal " than Konan .
12:03 I think Tsunade alone can defeat Sasori. With the Hyakugou she only needs to keep punching all his marionettes until there's nothing left. Any shinobi with Hyakugou could do exactly that, since the poison can be counteracted with it (while it lasts). Sasori vs. Sakura was only a fight because Sakura was inexperienced and she didn't have the Hyakugou, that Tsunade has. Sakura counteracted her inexperience with Chiyo's help, and the lack of Hyakugou by having the antidote to Sasori's venom and being able to heal her wounds. But the Hyakugou makes it a no contest.
For Orochimaru or Jiraiya Sasori might be a problem (I'd wager Orochimaru is vastly resistant to all sorts of venoms and can spit himself worst case scenario), but they should easily be able to deal with Deidara. Orochimaru's attack range is enormous and the Rashomon can protect from the big explosions. Worst case scenario they can all reverse summon somewhere if Deidara decides to blow himself up. But it's not a close fight at all so I don't think they'll allow him to do that.
Itachi and Pein are the only two that *really* stand a chance against one of the sanin. Although the entire group is powerful, pitting any dou vs The Strongest Team in Konaha (prior to team 7) just isn't fair.
Stand a chance, are you drunk?! They put right clap, lol. Itachi at age 14 put Orochimaru under genjutsu without even looking at him.
Pain's Animal path stalemates base Jiriaya and with two more paths, makes sage Jiriaya retreat.
Sasori and Kisame fall under "stand a chance" Kisame has the feats to potentially scale him higher, while Sasori literally battled Orochimaru twice and while the sannin are RELATIVE that doesn't mean they're EQUAL. So while Sasori may not beat Orochimaru, he could potentially beat Jiriaya or Tsunade.
Even Deidara (who I rank slightly below Sannin and Sasori) could kill one with C4 if he last long enough to land that attack.
Obito as a 14 year old is already scaling above all the sannin individually
@@obsidianquill7949with zetsu and hashirama cells and kamui
@@jonny7444 zetsu was temporary and he didn’t use him on the attack against konoha. Kamui is his own ms ability so I don’t know why you included that. Hashirama cells ain’t his but it’s still a power up nonetheless.
“Stand a chance”? Are we kidding? Most of the Akatsuki beat Tsunade and a healthy number take out Jiraiya. Orochimaru, the strongest member, got dog walked by a 14 year old Itachi with base Sharingan and a kunai. 💀
Very well done video
I got baited by the title, well played TG. Kakuzu and Hidan were losing to Kakashi with minimal back up, any one of the Sannin can clean stomp them. Sasori and Deidara is interesting to talk about, but Orochimaru already beat Sasori and Tsunade's apprentice is the one who beat his poison. Deidara's C4 presents an interesting problem, but I just don't think he even gets the chance to use it here. I always like your Deidara videos for some reason. Also loving the Gamaken respect and it clarified something to me. The statement about Sage Jiraiya being above the five kage always bothered me because I didn't see how he could beat Onoki due to the flight and just sort of had to accept it, but Gamaken putting Pain's drill bird in the dirt is the answer. Thank you for that, it's been messing me up for years. Itachi and Kisame section of the video confused me because we already know Jiraiya alone can stalemate Itachi and Kisame. The statement that Itachi is a speed tier above the Sannin is just incorrect, not sure what that's about. I wonder how juiced up Kisame would get off of Tsunade, but I doubt it would matter because he still lost to Guy while juiced on Bee. Pain and Konan also seems clear to me considering Sage Jiraiya almost did that fight by himself and Nagato said Jiraiya could have gotten the W if he knew how the Pains worked. Jiraiya with Tsunade and Orochimaru as back up should be able to beat Pain and Konan.
I was actually most looking forward to Sannin vs Obito because it's the only real fight, sad to see it got glossed over but I guess talking about how insane Kamui is can get a little dull. I think the Sannin have a legitimate chance with Frog Song and Orochimaru's Hydra Blood. It's doubtful that Obito could use Kamui to evade Frog Song, and he still has to breathe so blood paralysis is on the table. A lot of people tend to overrate how fast Obito is. Obito was getting boxed by Kakashi, base Naruto, base Guy, and base Bee. The only speedster we see Obito ever fight is Minato. In that interaction, Obito warps behind Minato and then attempts to grab him to suck him into Kamui. Before Obito can even reach his hand out to touch Minato: Minato realizes Obito is there, turns around, draws a kunai, swing the kunai through Obito's head, reacts to phasing through Obito, and then warps away from him. In the next interaction, Minato absolutely punks him. I would need to re-read the whole War Arc to see at what point I think Obito becomes out of reach for the Sannin, particularly if we give Orochimaru access to Hashirama and Tobirama. EDIT: This is specifically talking about pre-Rinnegan Obito.
Couple things on Sannin evaluation: Downplaying Sage Mode by saying "but it takes a long time to start it." doesn't hold much ground. Jiraiya got Sage Mode off against Pain inside the rain village. If anyone could stop him or punish him for doing it, it would be Pain. Tsunade is fast, just not insanely fast. She's able to fight together on the same scale with Raikage + Onoki combo and throw hands with Madara even if she doesn't outspeed them. Katsuyu saved the entire leaf village from Super Shinra Tensei. The only Akatsuki members with that kind of fire power are Deidara and Pain, but Katsuyu only has to defend the three Sannin. I wish we got to see Orochimaru do more impressive things, he kind of gets slapped in every showing he has unless he's fighting against literal children. The White Hydra is hard to evaluate because the only time we see it, Orochimaru willingly face tanks a one shot attack because usually anything stabbing him ends in his enemy getting paralyzed from the blood.
Overall, really high quality video by you. One of the best you've done imo. Up there with the Shino and Dosu videos.
Itachi being a speed tier above the Sannin is because he was keeping up with KCM Naruto, and mind you, this was an Edo Tensei Itachi. This means his physical stats were lower than his living version at full health.
Scrolled to find your comment after I finished the video. There's actually another comment that said something really similar to yours and I thought it was you, so I had to double check the names lol. Thinking the Sannin can take Obito is pretty crazy, but I went to rewatch Obito vs Minato and you're 100% right. They might be able to get a win on Orange Mask Obito if he isn't allowed to run away. Rinnegan Obito is hard to scale because he brings six Jinchuriki to fight Naruto and Bee. Good points on pretty much all your Sannin stuff though. I'm curious why you think Orochimaru gets slapped because most people think he's the strongest Sannin.
@@pkj2148 Common misconception. KCM Naruto wasn't trying to defeat Edo Itachi at all there, he was just blocking and trying to talk to him. You can reference Chapter 549, Naruto does not throw a single attack against Itachi. In the same chapter, Naruto and Bee also block every attack Itachi makes. This shouldn't need saying, but Edo Itachi is the strongest version of Itachi we ever see. Your example of living full health Itachi is the guy who said he couldn't beat Jiraiya even with Kisame there to help him. Not to say Itachi isn't fast, but he's on the same tier of speed as the Sannin.
@@dualblades7742 Glad to see I have a fan, I suppose. I'll scroll to find that other comment because you've got me interested now.
I honestly don't remember the finer details of the War Arc from about where Madara and Obito meet back up, I would need to read it. There is something to be said about Obito not feeling confident enough to fight Naruto and Bee without have six Jinchuriki with him, but I wouldn't make any claims until I refreshed my memory on it. Obito is difficult to scale because Kamui automatically defeats anybody who can't blatantly outspeed him unless they have some kind of counter measure for it. We see counter measures in the form of Kakashi's Kamui and persisting effects like Konan's 600 billion paper bombs. Instantaneous effects are also logical counters to it, which are most kinds of Genjutsu. Frog Song would fall under the category of instantaneous attack and genjutsu, therefore it would be effective. We don't know how long Orochimaru's blood vapors linger in the air for in order to induce paralysis, but it would fall under the category of persisting effects.
I'm going to talk about Danzo for a moment. The reason why Obito needed Sasuke to kill Danzo for him is because he couldn't risk getting close to Danzo. Danzo's ultimate goal was to hit "Madara" with Kotoamatsukami in order to gain control over him. Obito somehow had knowledge of Shisui's eye being in Danzo's possession, and never engaged with Danzo because he knew Kotoamatsukami is game over for him. Danzo also knew that he needed to save Kotoamatsukami for "Madara", which is why he didn't use it on Sasuke. If Danzo uses Kotoamatsukami on Sasuke, Obito will just mop him up after. In a way, Danzo had checkmate on Obito if he got a free move, but Obito was able to keep Danzo in check by using Sasuke. It's a grand strategy being utilized by both parties and that aspect of the battle often goes over the head of most people.
Orochimaru thought he needed four Kage level assistants (Hashirama, Tobirama, Minato, and Kimimaro) in order to attempt a fight with old Hiruzen. Orochimaru only managed to have two of the strongest people in all of recorded history on his side, and then he barely scraped a win off Hiruzen while receiving permanent damage that is life lasting for anybody who can't body hop. Then Orochimaru runs away. I don't understand interpretations of that fight that suggest Orochimaru could ever be considered stronger than Hiruzen. The next time we see Orochimaru fight, it's while he has no arms and it's against the extremely nerfed Tsunade and the Jiraiya that was drugged to the point where the extreme nerfed Tsunade would have been able to fold him. As soon as Tsunade gets her resolve back, she instantly turns the tables and massively outperforms everyone there. Then Orochimaru runs away. People say things like "Armless Orochimaru was beating Jiraiya and Tsunade" while ignoring all of the context of the fight. The next time we see Orochimaru fight, it's against 4 Tail Naruto. Orochimaru at this point isn't quite his peak self, but his body isn't rejecting him yet. This Orochimaru is able to fight with 4 Tail Naruto, but unable to restrain or even inflict damage on him. During the fight, Orochimaru uses his most powerful defensive technique. the Triple Rashomon Gate, because he thinks to himself "If I get hit by that attack, I will die." Then Orochimaru runs away. People suggest that Orochimaru is stronger than Jiraiya because Jiraiya states that he almost died while fighting 4 Tail Naruto. There's a huge difference there though, Jiraiya's goal was to defeat and not kill Naruto, and he actually did it. Orochimaru didn't even defeat 4 Tail Naruto, he gave up. The next time we see Orochimaru fight, it's against Sasuke and the body absorption thing happens. It isn't really a fight, but the end result was Sasuke paralyzed on the ground while Orochimaru tried to do the body swap which fails for arbitrary reasons. The next time we see Orochimaru fight is against Itachi after he pops out of Sasuke. At this point Orochimaru's body is still rejecting him, but we see that the White Hydra can stand against Itachi's Susanoo for a short time. Orochimaru willingly tanks the Totsuka Blade while laughing about how that kind of attack won't work on him, only for it to be unveiled as an attack that seals you away if it hits you. Orochimaru could never have known it would do that, but that was an incredibly poor decision by him either way. Consistently throughout the series, Orochimaru does not have good showings and almost all of his recognition and power comes in the form of lore or implications. His power set is pretty crazy though, which is why I wish we got showings from him that more accurately match how strong he is stated to be. The entire theme of the manga also supports the fact that Orochimaru plateaued, whereas the others continued to grow. Orochimaru is the weakest of the Sannin, but most people in the series are weaker than Jiraiya and Tsunade so that isn't exactly a slight against him.
@@SirGregarious The Edo Tenseis are weaker than their living versions, so there is no way Edo Itachi is the strongest version of him. And I still can't believe you guys still use Itachi's statement about Jiraiya as proof, even after finding out Itachi isn't a bad guy. You really think Jiraiya can take on Itachi and Kisame at the same time. Itachi who Orochimaru, the strongest Sannin, was scared of.
Jiraiya isn't fast at all. His fastest techniqie, Kebari Senbon, was blocked by Pain casually. He had the time to weave the signs to summon the panda, and mind you, Jiraiya isn't even the one moving for the Kebari Senbon.
TC YOU WERE ON SWAGS VID DUDE WHAT A W
Yessir appreciate it my guy
I thought 90% of people already knew this 🤔
Guess this for the 10% of those who gas up the Sannin
In the meantime, Tsunade and my Serpent King are the ones still alive🐍 missing beautiful Konan though🪻
Sasuke vs. Deidara might make the most Sasuke slander in the series, possibly only eclipsed by Naruto vs. Sasuke part 2. The amount of people that think Sasuke lost and was bailed out by plot when 1. It was a 2v1 fight, 2. Sasuke literally forewent killing blows because he wanted information, and 3. Sasuke held back his arsenal, is bananas.
In a true Sasuke vs. Deidara 1v1, Sasuke fuckin slaps.
You are absolutely correct but Sasuke was still bailed out by plot llab. Diedara last bomb is basically a particle style jutsu. His last bomb disintegrates you completely down to your cells. Sasuke hiding inside of Manda should not have protected him. If Manda died Sasuke should have too.
Not everything disintegrates when hit by it. Mandas skin or shell could somewhat withstand not being decimated to where Sasuke could live. Also if they rerun it back. Sasuke still is slightly more powerful than Deidara. He doesn’t slap. But, he wins. The last jutsu by Deidara is kinda bs anyway.
Sasuke *was* bailed out by plot. It’s not even about the chakra. He summoned Manda, put the snake under a genjutsu, and then managed to get inside its mouth in the instant between Deidara turning into a bomb and him exploding?
@@BuzzabeelYT Yes. That is all very easily possible...
Never mind the fact that everything after Sasuke punched Deidara was completely irrelevant in a real battle that isn't to capture and that isn't 2v1.
@@Necromancer4267 It's only possible if Sasuke suddenly developed Shisui or Raikage level speed when no one was looking.
Video idea: what if the real sasori showed up to tenji bridge
You dont even need the whole akatuski. It can be a fair 3v3 and the sanin still get slapped. Itachi, Pain & Obito or if you dont want to use Obito it can be Itachi, Pain & Kisame. Kisame vs Tsunade, Itachi vs Orochimaru and Pain vs Jaraiya
Bro it's a stop if it's just Itachi, you don't even need to give him Kisame and it's done.
@@SuperDababy2 You are heavily underestimating the Sanin especially all 3 working together
@@zerox6615 Who said anything about Itachi defeating the 5 kage. I also disagree with Itachi being able to take all three by himself especially after seeing how well Jariaya did by himself vs pain. Tsunade with hundred healing was able to survive being impaled by Madara Susanoo sword and survived being cut in 2. A healthy Itachi is not defeating sage mode Jariaya, immortal Tsunade and immortal Orochimaru at the same time. So the canon Itachi aka sick and half blind is definitely not beating all 3 at the same time
@@zerox6615Also the fandom needs to stop saying sanin level or hokage level because all the kage are not equal and all the sanin are not equal. A good example is hokage kakashi & Hashirama. Both are Hokages but Hashirama far out classes Kakashi. Or Minato and Tobirama it's the same situation so you cannot power scale by saying Hokage level or Jonin level etc
Bro Itachi is duf beating sage mode Jiraiya stop using (run kisame) dialouge, Itachi didn't want to fight jiraiya as he is sided with the Konoha
Tsunade gets blitzed and outhaxed
You already know what 14 year old Iatchi did to Orochimaru
27:29 😅I feel like this is contradicted a little when Manda 2 needs help flipping the island turtle in the war arc (bigger and stronger than Manda) and Deidara does it with a regular bomb.
My point was mainly that the summons themselves could offer a layer of protection not that Manda > C0 which I should have made more clear
@@ThunderGodTG I agree also I feel like you've heard my take on Deidara before and don't agree so I won't go into it
I do not recall actually remind me if you don't mind
Can’t wait to see how Hidan is the only guy who gets clapped😊
Also Kaskashi was injured by Naruto's Futton Rasenshurriken when he "tested" it against his rasengan it's shown that Kakashi is injured after the clash and is later seen with that arm bandaged up. So Kakashi was nowhere near peek form when he fought against Hidan / Kakazu
Tanked C0?
Bro what are we talking about manda died😂😂😂
Tanked in the sense his body didn’t evaporate on site, I should have clarified
Wasnt manda only hit by the shock wave not the blast, or something like that
It doesn’t really make a difference since it basically killed him but, the point was that manda can be used as a meat shield lmao
what naruto game is being shown throughout besides ninja storm?
Much of youtubers have been downplaying too much the sannins. Orochimaru just lost that easy against Itachi because he was too arrogant and didn't take in consideration Itachi's genjutsu, in a more directly combat against each other Itachi couldn't win that easy. Orochimaru on inself is strong enough to handle with Kisame, and he's almost a counter to him. Sage mode Jiraiya and Tsunade can take with Itachi. It's stated in the lore that Itachi can only spam Tsukuyomi and amaterasu once in a day. I think that sannins has too much chances to win that match.
Also, Orochimaru's goal was less to outright murder or obliterate Itachi and more to overwhelm him and take his body.
I see the akatsuki winning still.
@@xDiViNexInfectedx Orochimaru is broken
R u brain damaged itachi is a tier above sannin how tf could u watch Naruto and not think that
49:11 what is this clip from it’s so cool
I think you forgot to mention the Sannin's scaling to Hanzo, who they couldn't beat. Pain did beat him. I do think the Sannin got stronger since then, but if I remember correctly, the Sannin still held Hanzo on a pedestal for how strong he was. That could change the Sannin's chances of winning against Pain from a fair percentage to next to none.
That said, great video. It's always fun to watch these long vs videos.
Yeah but we all saw how Jiraiya was giving the 6 paths them hands. I'm sure if he had just a bit more intel on how pain worked. Naruto benefited from the info that was given to him against pain. Hanzo did almost nothing to pain compared to a matured Jiraiya.
@@lobsterjohnson8642 Bro really said Jiraiya was giving the 6 paths them hands.. did he watch the fight?
Jiraiya was getting jumped so hard bro had to cut his losses and retreat 3 times throughout the entire fight.
He was getting so pushed & beaten by a *barely trying* Pain, that as soon as Pain got remotely serious, Jiraiya lost an arm and then got his ass curbstomped.
Jiraiya gets fucking folded. Even one Path is huge overkill against Jiraiya on average.
@@MysticalArcane Jiraiya killed 3 of them, did you watch the fight? 🤔 L bozo
@@lobsterjohnson8642 Rewatch the fight. Jiraiya only got 3 of them after running his ass off and away, hauling it the fuck out and then had a sound genjutsu that, later on, Pain immediately kills off against Naruto.
At no point was Jiraiya winning until then, and then he immediately got his ass torn apart without any ability to fight back.
He couldn't even fight those three by himself, he was getting folded by them.
Hell, he wasn't even stronger than the Animal Path, which was already posing too big of a threat for him.
@@MysticalArcane It's a 1v6+summons and you're mad that jiraiya also summoned? L mans moment.
Tldr: Jiraiya killed 3 of the paths.
I love this video one of your best ones I got a good laugh during the undead duo and the part with tusnade you about to learn what pain is part it made my day better given how it started thanks 😂
Glad you enjoyed it and happy I could make someone's day better!
So people think Itachi can solo but not Pain??
pain is stronger than Itachi
What is Hidan gonna do when:
1) Orochimaru poisons him with snake venom before he can get any blood? He's immortal but doesn't instantly heal.
2) Tsunade punches his head 5 kilometerss off his body and has her summon melt his body down?
Sannins vs. Pain & Konan:
Jiraiya could take care of Konan while Orochimaru and Tsunade handle with 6 paths of pain, and later Jiraiya join with the group.
19:38 Orochimaru alone has ways to deal with it. The range of Kusanagi is enormous, as can be seen in his fight against 4 tails Naruto.
I think Itachi would actually stomp the Sannin all together. So, with Kisame, I don't see how they win
Just think tho. With each MS ability, itachi gets considerably weaker. And jiraiya’s giant toads are a problem if you don’t want to waste an Amaterasu. Orochimaru probably only goes down from toska blade or maybe tsykinomi. And if one of those is used on tsunade, orochimaru will know about it. And it’s possible tsunade could break tsykinomi
@@spit-fire Orochimaru bowed down to normal Sharingan genjutsu, and I think you're just making up Tsunade breaking Tsukuyomi, I don't think there's ANY evidence to even suggest this, this is made up
@@spit-fireItachi clapped Orochimaru with basic genjutsu. Orochimaru is also the strongest genjutsu user among the Sannin (without Ma and Pa involved).
@@jaredgreathouse3672 100 healings tsunade has insane amounts of chakra, and one of the best chakra control
@@spit-fire I don't care. You can't break a Mangekyo genjutsu (especially not the most powerful offensive genjutsu casted by one of the best genjutsu users in the show) with good chakra control. It just wouldn't happen
If tsunade use thousand healing technique and orichimaru use Edo tense and jiraiya use sage mode pain have no chance against 3 sanins 🛐🔥
Manda didn’t tank that bomb, sasuke summoned him and then transported them out, manda only got hit by a little bit of it and from that little bit he still died from it.
Kisame dominates in an under water fight, when he fuses with samehada, sage mode jiriya ain’t winning. The few win conditions they have would be tricking kisame into absorbing Jiriya’s sage chakra. But then itachi may very well just tell him to be careful.
Itachi in character would tell him during the beginning of the fight. We know Itachi knows everything about Sage jutsu (he literally says this in this Kabuto fight) and he wouldn't want to make this fight harder on himself if Kisame fucks up.
9:11 *Talking about Kakuzu* _Mentions durability_
Swagkage: 🤬
Crazy thing about itachi is; orochimaru thought he stood a better chance fighting the strongest of the gokage than even attempting to fight itachi again without a sharingan and Uchiha body
You say that but Orochimaru didn't know about Itachi's illness either.
@@mikeoxlong3676 so?
Kakuzu: basically base Jiraya less mobile when he uses a durability technique. But Jiraiya has summons to help him and overcome his own limitations. Anyone of the Sannin kills him 1v1. He's between Kakashi and Sannin tier.
Sasori: Manda solos 0 diff (took hits from Tsunade wielding Gamabunta's sword and didn't have a scar, nothing Sasori can do will even scratch him). None of the Sannin even need to fight him. Sasori is match-up reliant, he's an assassin and his only way to way is with poison. Tsunade has fought Chiyo it seems in their past, so she'll definitely find the antidote to his poison faster than Sakura who did so without Tsunade's experience.
Deidara: depends on what he does, he can take one out with him if he surprises them, but they can all be reverse summoned and he would suicide for nothing.
Itachi & Kisame: Itachi counters Orochimaru, impossible to tell if Tsunade neg diffs his genjutsu or not since they never faced each other, if the two of them manage to buy Jiraiya enough time to enter sage mode, he cleans house. Sage mode counters Kisame's absorption and Itachi's genjutsu, Tsunade one hit bursts a much stronger Susanô, Orochimaru can extend Kusanagi at will and use his extensible body to fight a kenjutsu battle from fifty meters away, Rashomon gates tank any direct attack, sage mode amped ninjutsu completely outclasses any ninjutsu Kisame and Itachi can use. Jiraiya can even intercept Kisame's absorption and put him out of commission via stoning, Itachi ends up 1v3 and gets ganged up on. Ironically one of the worst possible match-ups for Itachi and Kisame.
Konan & Pain Nagato: Konan is a non factor. She's fodder and Pain will ask her to stay behind because he doesn't want her to be collateral, that's literally what she'd be in this fight, and it's in character for him and for her to listen to him. So it's Pain vs the Sannin. 3 people, Jiraiya has his canon Pain fight to go with, Orochimaru counters Asura path while Tsunade destroys it, anyone can kill the human path (the only dangerous one), Katsuyu negates any level of chibaku tensai (she did it for most of Konoha's population, she has no difficulty doing it for the Sannin and their summons), Tsunade can heal any injury on any team member, they will quickly learn that one path revives and teleports the others and find a way to destroy it, from then it's easy. Honestly Pain is only good when his kage level opponents fight alone and/or try to defend someone/something. In a fight on neutral ground where collateral is not an issue any duo of kage destroy all of his bodies and then it's a matter of finding Nagato if he isn't already dead from exhaustion. The Sannin mid diff him together and Konan can only watch him be defeated. As for Konan's power, just to try and kill Tobi it took her weeks of prep for her ultimate paper explosion and after that (failed) she was vulnerable. In a fight without weeks of prep she doesn't do anything but maybe a small distraction every once in a while.
Taka: that's not even a fight, A4 solos so any of the Sannin in good shape (not bed ridden Orochimaru) solos. If we take Sasuke once his Susanô got better towards the end of the fight in the kage summit (before the Danzô fight) then any combination of 2 Sannin defeat Taka. Not prime Kimimaro solos everyone in the team but Sasuke, Orochimaru does the same.
Kimimaro (sick/not sick/post time skip survived and cured) vs Akatsuki done or yet to be done? I think he solos but loses to Pain except post time skip survived cured with training then he would be much stronger if we take Sasuke's improvements and give Kimimaro half of them over his prime 15 YO version, then he could have a chance against Pain too because his durability would be absurd, his speed scales to KCM1 Naruto (roughly equal to the sage mode that one tapped several paths of Pain) and his offense with 2.5 years of training would be improved to even higher levels (remembering his performance in p1 was under terminal stage of something akin to cancer and he was paralyzed, probably moving through dead bone pulse puppeteering his own body).
Persona 5 music!
Yessir!
I found this to be really complex and simple at the same time which is intriguing and makes me want to come back to your channel. Thank you for sharing; Your insight is flawless.
Hey! I really appreciate that! Thank you glad you enjoyed!
Great video as always and can tell the editing quality keeps going up more and more.
Now in my opinion (and it seems like you agree), about half the Akatsuki the Sannin each are just unobjectively strong in base. I think it's important to note the scaling of the series at a given point in time. Granted, it seems like some arguments you were making for arguments sake as like the Sannin, none of the Akatsuki have just a basic arsenal and allows them to capture/defeat those who are clearly stronger than them (i.e. Killer Bee > Kisame although Bee is nowhere near his full power, Kisame ragdolls him).
My point to that is, the scaling of the "Base" Sannin. Half of the Akatsuki weren't even alive when in series we see the Sannin at their full power. Mind you, this version of them is what I like to call "Beyond" Sannin level where it's stated for Orochimaru it surpasses his own power and the strongest sage snake in Ryuchi Cave. Jiraiya himself says he's beyond that of a Sannin but a great toad sage. Tsunade literally rewrote the medical ninja rules with her jutsu, and her as a medic and her monstrous strength is what is stated to put her every bit equal as the other Sannin.
I say all this to say, the Sannin themselves are at the peak of the Gokage. They scale to Hiruzen in part 1 (granted, it takes Orochimaru two, even when nerfed, stated Hokage level edo tensei to push Hiruzen) who is numerous times even at old age stated to be the strongest of the Gokage. It is also something to note that the Hokage have always been the strongest of their era. Maybe you can argue against Tsunade even though she is physically the strongest but even then, her feats only get outpaced by Onoki who has resolve and a bit more experience than all of the others both as a warrior (being in all 4 ninja wars) and Kage (being Kage in all 4 ninja wars).
So Part 1 Sannin = Peak of Gokage
Full Power in "Beyond Sannin" Forms = Stronger than any of Gokage, can put up a fight against those in the next tier of power
With that... Hidan, Kakazu, Sasori and Deidara no matter how you slice it at NO POINT in the series do they even scale to Part 1 Sannin. Each of them can lose in a 1v1 and for both pairs one can argue that each of the Sannin should beat them in a 2v1. Konan should just scale below the Base Sannin which is formidable but Obito preemptively underestimates her and Jiraiya negs her (granted he knows at least what her ability should mainly focus around). Kisame is tricky as he only scales to them when he's aided. The two times we know that he clearly scales to at least Part 1 Sannin is his Fused Samehada and vs. 7th Gate Guy. Granted, in both fights he's not close in power to Full Power Bee who just moments later in the war is stronger than original KCM Naruto. His v2 lariat should rival Raikage's full power one, considering his v1 lariat is equal match for Raikage with his lightning cloak not at full power. When he's amped on Bee's chakra he can at least jutsu clash 7th Gate Guy although he's nowhere near Guy's level and this is early war arc 7th Gate, not the one who can knock back Edo Madara and susano'o, let alone Six Paths Madara with a hirudoura. With that being said, I think Kisame even Fused should still be weaker than Full Power Sannin and generally is weaker than Part 1 Sannin before he absorbs chakra from Samehada. Technically in part 1 he's on the same level as Sharingan Kakashi, Base Guy and Asuma. Even in early part 2 with the 30% clone, Guy destroys him in the 6th gate but is put on the defensive in base due to his students getting captured. So a base KIsame is for sure below base Sannin
Pain, Itachi and Obito of course all 3 are easily stronger than the Sannin at full power. With that being said, them defeating the Sannin in a 3v1 would prove difficult. A full power Itachi most likely can do it, Obito theoretically can if he's bfr them and could most easily do it in his MS + Rinnegan war arc version. A full power Nagato can also do it as he scales to full power Itachi (Itachi > Nagato but they are relative) and both I can see giving the Gokage a challenge although I don't think they can beat the war arc Gokage as I believe they fall short of initial KCM2 level
Literally what does base Jiraiya do to Onoki or the fourth Raikage
@@hobbyhorse5848 Rasengan to the face lol but in all seriousness I'm providing an analysis based off scaling and lore of the series not a jutsu/styles matchup. Part 1, the Sannin were stated to be equal to each other (this statement never really changed) with one of them being stated a match for Old Hiruzen. Hiruzen is stated numerous times to be the strongest of the Gokage during his reign even in his old age. So take it up with Kishimoto for having the Sannin in high regard to be above the Gokage. That's why they were all Hokage candidates / Hokage at one point and it isn't just cause of prestige/title.
Also, it's interesting seeing the communities take on different vs. matchups after they finished a series compared to it during the actual releases of the series or the strength of characters at different points in the series.
@@emssasukeisunderrated7946 Hiruzen is stated exactly once to he the strongest of the Gokage, once by Kabuto. And Kabuto specifically says “He had the reputation as being the strongest of the 5 Kage.”
The key word here is reputation. How exactly would old man Hiruzen have gotten the reputation as being the greatest of the 5 Kage when he hasn’t even engaged in battle for multiple decades? It’s because it’s a reputation earned in his youth, his prime, which just reinforces the entire theme presented by Orochimaru in part 1, that Hiruzen was a shadow of his former self because he had grown old and weak and even a Hiruzen pushing 60 would’ve been able to defeat Orochimaru.
Onoki is, pretty blatantly the strongest of the 5 Kage as we see in the war and he also takes up the position of leader among them, something Tsunade distinctly doesn’t. None of the Sannin are anywhere near as fast as Ay, and Jiraiya was near mortally wounded by the 4 tailed cloak of Naruto, a blood lusted Raikage going straight for him with attacks that can chop the 8 tails horn of will do genuinely fatal damage before he can appropriately react. Hell even among the Sannin Jiraiya is portrayed as an objective inferior to base Orochimaru. As much as the Hokage is usually the greatest of the Kage that is simply a precedent, and the Leaf had for more going for it than just their Kage, no village has more kekkei genkai users and hiden ninjutsu than the leaf does per clan.
Personally I think it’s best the judge characters holistically, new information can always come out. I remember people including me used to say that Minato’s greatest weakness was AP (not that his was bad mind you), but after his One Shot it’s indisputable that’s not the case. I would like it if instead of Boruto we could’ve gotten more side stories of characters like Sannin, the other Kage, legends like Hanzo etc. to help clear up lots of the confusion. But as we don’t have that, this is my interpretation based on the material presented.
I was looking for another person's comment and ended up reading yours. I like your Part 1 Sannin points a lot and just wanted to give some props for it.
Someone pointed me to your comment. Your Part 1 scaling of the Sannin and interpretations of their base form is correct, but I disagree with some of your final conclusions. There's no argument to be made about Kisame against Jiraiya, that was settled in Part 1 when Kisame admits he has no chance and then Itachi says that Jiraiya would beat them both to confirm it. There's a great deal of evidence that suggests Orochimaru plateaued, through all of his showings as well as the narrative of the story. Tsunade is the strongest of the Kage, and Tsunade plainly states that Jiraiya is stronger than her, therefore Jiraiya must be stronger than A4. Nagato states that Jiraiya could have gotten the win over Pain if he knew how they worked, and that was after he slapped Konan. Jiraiya did the fight in the video by himself and almost won. Orochimaru's mental is made of glass when it comes to Uchiha, but Itachi stands no chance against Jiraiya and you could argue that Tsunade could take a win off Itachi on her own as well. It talk more in depth about Obito in my own comment, but I also think the three Sannin together have a pretty good chance at taking him out. Full Power Nagato is a different animal and Itachi isn't even close. Nagato defeated Hanzo's entire army and forced him to run away, then he hunted him down afterward anyway. I think he would wash the Sannin and might be able to beat the 5 Kage. Just to reiterate, even though we disagree about some scalings, I think your comment is great.
how did manda tank C0 when it literally killed him
I would have reworded that segment if I could go back, more so just saying the Sannin could use their summons as a defense which is more applicable to Katsuyu character and summon wise.
What ge means is that manda did die but his body was still relatively intact
If the Sannin can stall and Jiraya is able to summon Gamatatsu they win easily
they will stall hidan and thats probably it lmao, gamatatsu is a big target, thats literally begging for an amataratsu to 1 tap him
Gamatasu?! He ain't doing shit. He only wants snacks after someone croaks.
This is what ı was waiting for
I'd argue zetsu body Orochimaru could destroy the Akatsuki by himself.
Then you need meds
It may not be close now, but wait til I pull up. I'd handle it fr fr, say I won't! 🗣️🔥
pain alone solos the sanin 🤣💀
Tsunade solos 5/6 paths
@@mrmoonman7380 nope
@@resolute7177 she’d solo your favorite character too
@@mrmoonman7380 Tsunade would lose to the Animal path 1v1. She has no way of getting rid of the Cerberus, not to mention all the other animals. Eventually, even 100 healings Tsunade would run out of stamina or chakra and the Dog would simply torture her. The Charmeleon keeping the Animal path hidden from sight the whole time.
@@ShadowFiend777 the only summon she couldn’t one tap is the three headed dog because of its multiplying but Katsuya can do the same thing and has a long list of jutsu to either dissolve Cerberus with acid or immobilize to. so I don’t see the advantage. And she has senju and uzumaki blood she’s caked out in chakra, if she wasn’t busy healing the entirety of the leaf village all that healing would be focused on herself and she’d toss them all around except the Deva path.
Video idea team 7 against akatsuki beginning 12 year old team 7 to the strongest until they win
25:18 Nope. She is the perfect counter for Sasori. So, Tsunade eats Sasori alive, Orochimaru eats Deidara alive, and Jiraiya sits down to watch and support anyone who seems to be incompetent enough to lose an unlosable fight.
Deidara and Sasori can be very nasty, but two of the Sannin are the perfect counters for them.
@ThunderGod Your forgetting that the akatsuki members have to be relative to the biju in order to beat them and
hidan was able to wound the 2 tails in order to get it's blood for his ritual he also had to be fast enough to pull that
off too. To say he's just jonin level is crazy. Even if you wanna say that was just kakuzu hidan has shown the
durability to be able to tank attacks from a full biju in that fight.
You are correct, Hidan also just blatantly attacks from Kakuzu’s wind heart. I more so am just saying Jonin can combat Hidan confidently without getting dominated compared to someone like Kakuzu. Also that fight was off screen so we have no idea how it actually went down.
@@ThunderGodTG The only jonin we have been shown who confidently fought Hidan was Kakashi. And even Kakashi was doing his absolute best to stay out of Hidan's attacking range.
Asuma only ever got proper hits in when Hidan let him or was possessed by Shikamaru's shadow technique.
And Asuma is comparable to Zabuza, not at all a standard Jonin.
The thing about 3rd kazekage is he was hailed as "stronger than his predecesors". Not raza, who was the 4th. So we honestly have no idea how strong he was alive. Also sasori using him as a puppet doesnt really tell us how good he was himself, he might be clever in battle like gaara or sasuke, or have high i.Q. aswell like shikamaru. We also dnt knw how sasori defeated him. Alot of fans like the opinion that he secretly poisoned him and took his body from the village. Who knows, itd be a great graphic novel
I'd like to add in the sosori fight about the poison Tsunade is a medical ninja and katsuya can attach herself to all three and heal them