A36 vs F33 Bonanza Shootout
Вставка
- Опубліковано 24 лют 2020
- FlyWire compares the A36 Bonanza with the F33 Bonanza. A real old fashioned shootout to see which one is better. We explore some of the myths and pros and cons of each aircraft type. We had a lot of fun doing it, if you don't believe it- pay attention to the last few minutes! Which airplane is best for you!
FlyWire is about exploring flight and the freedom this incredible experience brings us on a personal level. Flying has always captured the imagination and excitement of living life to its fullest. Hi, I'm Scott Perdue. In a former life I flew the F-4 and F-15E, more recently I retired from a major airline. I've written for several aviation magazines over the years, was a consultant for RAND, the USAF, Navy, NASA as well as few others, wrote a military thriller- 'Pale Moon Rising' (still on Kindle). But mostly I like flying, or teaching flying. Some of the most fun I had was with Tom Gresham on a TV show called 'Wings to Adventure". We flew lots of different airplanes all over the country. Now with FlyWire I want to showcase the fun in flying, share the joy and freedom of flight and explore the world with you. Make sure you subscribe if you want to go along for the ride!
#Pilot #Fly #Flying #Fly yourself #aviation #Flying Training #Learn to Fly #adventure
Website: www.flywire.online
Merch Links: T-Shirts, My Novel: www.flywire.online/merch
Twitter: @FlyWireO / flywire.online
Facebook: / flywireonline
I flew a "straight 36" for several years, during which period we replaced the IO-520 with an IO-550 and 3-blade "Black Mac" propeller. With the IO-520, TAS was 187 mph (162k), fuel flow 14.5 gph at density altitude of 5,000-6,500, WOT LOP. With the IO-550, it became 200 mph (174k), fuel flow 15 gph, WOT LOP. Plus, of course, noticeably stronger during takeoff and climb. It was a great engine swap. Edited to correct TAS (I had read from the wrong column).
Finally see the flight and see the parachute being worn. Thought why the dramatics, then see the barrel rolls and say Ooooooo.... Fun.
I owned an F-33 for a couple of years but as the kids got older, the CG became a real problem.. Bought my A-36 back in 1989 and have never looked back.. It's virtually impossible to get the A-36 out of the weight and balance envelope and the quality and craftsmanship of Beech makes the plane a dream to fly..
It is a lovely airplane!
Well, I own a 1969 E33 Bonanza. So in my mind, the E33 Bonanza is the best. Once I get an A36 or a Barron 58, then my mind will change, lol.
Sure, I totally get it!
I absolutely love my A36. Truly the best single engine pistons out there. I had he opportunity to fly a Cirrus recently. Nice plane and can easily compete for second plane with the rest of the chickens.
Best does not mean anything. A plane cannot be the best on every single aspect of performances whether it is speed, mpg, payload, pax, price....let s say that your A36 fulfill your expectations!
Very nice video. Brought back memories of my Dads V35B.
I always wondered exactly where they stretched the A36’s fuselage; thanks for that, Scott. I have put about 430hr on my 1980 A36 since purchasing it 2-1/2 years ago: what a great machine.
They have good ranges. I always delighted in how much farther I could go in much less time than driving, even in a little Citabria. I used to strap a 10-speed in the back of the plane so I had some kind of transportation when I landed. Fun.
Thank you so much for that great video! Well done. Those rolls at the end were fantastic. I hate to admit this but even watching you do that literally had me giggling like a school girl. Now, THAT'S flying!
I had my fly training in Bakersfield with A36. Love those good memories with her.
Let me observe that the longer fuselage Bonanzas and Barons (A-36 and B-58 and the TC and P derivatives) are inarguably the finest IFR platforms I have ever flown. Simply the finest balanced aircraft, sweetest handling aircraft in the skies.
Good fun to watch.
Sweet Roll! Love your channel.
Much appreciated!
We had VH-WLP (Bill Prouse) and VH-FIJ and they must have been very early A36s we used for country newspaper delivery.
Felt like a Rolls of the air.
Love my A36. Cargo doors are a must have. Once you have cargo doors, you never want to go back.
Hi
Loved it , Thanks
Thank you too!
Your 80s SNL references are hilarious.
Rjh- thanks, my humor is dated, what can I say.
I nearly died when I heard that. Lmao. Thank you!
@@FlyWirescottperdue loved it! Snorted milk out of my nose and my wife just stared at me. She is 10 years younger than I am so any 70s or 80s reference is lost on her. She didn’t appreciate my WKRP Turkey reference over Thanksgiving either...
@@charleseinarson Who can forget those Turkey's!
Great roll!
Thanks, it really is a great roller! I wasn't kidding!
Well done
You have been bless to be able to fly
I purchased my first plane in 2019. A 1981 beech c23 sundowner. Its challenging to keep the CG within limits but other than that its a good first plane. Hopefully I can graduate to the A36 one day.
Hi
Oh man I saw the chute after the fuel stop and I wondered if you were going to roll that baby. Awesome video, Id give anything to get to roll a bonanza one day.
N8, well you're in luck. The reason EFM bought the airplane is for training, Dual instruction, aerobatics and UPRT. WE can make that happen!
Where are you guys located Scott?
@@princessbananahammock7942 Southwest of Fort Worth. But in certain circumstances we can travel with the airplane.
I wondered who bought that plane when I saw it listed awhile back...a missed opportunity for me, hope you guys enjoy it! Will have to come out and see all the other planes when back in DFW
Those intro overhead shots of the two planes nose-to-nose was worth the effort, for sure. Son of a Beech if Textron doesn't have a couple of pretty airplanes there - just too bad they don't have that Mooney tail to give them a little more pizzazz... '😂
I almost agree totally... except for the Mooney tail;)
I have a 1952 C35 love that airplane! Nothing flies like a Beech.
i will love to see a V35B vs f33 vs A36 by this guys
Hi
Love your videos Scott, very informative… I may have missed it but I have not seen you do anything with the JPI. Thinking about getting one, can you tell me how you like yours and maybe do a short video on it.
I'll add it to the list! I have a JPI 900 in the A36 and a CGR-30P in the Skywagon... so I think I can cover the bases. Good idea!
Hello Scott, I am getting ready to purchase the JPI EDM-900 and am filling out the order sheet. I do not see a place for tach, airframe, hobbs etc... times. Do you know if that is set at the factory before shipping or does the shop do that when installing?
Love the video! I thought active runways were assigned by a tower. And an airport without a tower was pilot discretion for which runway to use.
True… Most who use the phrase get that wrong. Active Runways are assigned by ATC. At non-towered airports the runway is at pilot’s discretion not assigned.
If one has ever built RC planes before & extended the fuselage or tail.
Only options are:
1- Add more weight to nose
2- Move entire win back so plane CG will balance and the plane will safely fly.
hi Scott, great vdieo, looking forward to more spoty flying in the F33, I did not realise you could do rolls in her
Full disclosure.. it is an F33C, an Aerobatic version.
Hi
Considering joining a flying club that is mulling over an additional airplane. They are stuck on the A36, I am trying to get them to consider the F instead
Nice video! Thanks!! One thing I noticed: Your F33C has those vortex generators that my post 1984 A36 has. Was that standard at 33Cs? I saw them on B36TCs and post 84 A36.
Timm- The E33c and F33C did not come with those vortex generators. There was a modification in the late 80's I think that required them in order to stay in the aerobatic category.
Wow I’ve discovered another airplane nut, excellent.
Looking at the "Over the top" image of the 2 beechcrafts the one with tip tanks looks like the width if the wing itself is double in size.
The lengths look about the same but from trailing edge to end of flaps are not by this video top looking downward at the both side to side.
So not only is the wing pushed back its also wider than its counterpart.
No, the wing is exactly the same.
I wondered why the parachute. Haha. Nice
Checkerboard wingtips was a clue. 😉
Lol that ending was perfect...comedy level of delay and presentation
Scott , if someone hasn’t pointed out already the errors in the Bonanza airspeed indicators can be significant at cruise speeds . My V35 overstates IAS by +5kts. As you know this will similarly effect an E6B calculation .
Do a four cardinal heading GS check . Let IAS stabilize on each leg , note the GS, average the four . This will net a real TAS with the exception of minor wind variations on each leg .
Use your basic algebra and solve for IAS. Note the difference between indicated and computed IAS . This is your airplanes individual error that you can apply in subsequent checks .
I see you have an Aspen. If it’s calculating a TAS can you see the IAS input it uses ? Does correlate to your steam gauge ?
Good video
Jim, Thanks! I actually use a triangle test 'track' and reduce the results to get the speed.
Scott outstanding video comparison of these two aircraft
Beach craft designers and engineers were really brilliant increasing the capabilities of both planes for sure
Great research and I was glued to my seat seeing and learning their differences from your video
You’re getting so good at amazing your audience
Best wishes always
Las Vegas Craig
5 out of 5 stars ✨
⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
Again 👏🏻😇✨
Many thanks!
Awesome machines ❤️ I haven’t had any experience with bonanza but certainly it looks fast , and what about campare it to a cessna 210 ( speed )
Cessna 210, Piper Comanche... those class of airplanes.
4:30 ...just guessing , but I'll bet
they moved the wing back,
plug is somewhere under
the 4 vs 3 window array,.
The leading edge of the A36
appears to be almost dead on
with the 'A' pillar , where the A33
edge is considerably forward of
that pillar.
:shrugs:
Scott, enjoyed watching this since my highly modified M35 is nearly identical to that F33 in many respects. Tell me about the mount that’s suspending the GoPro from the ceiling.
It's just a GoPro sticker mount.
Remember Klaus? "Would you like to touch my monkey?.....touch it, touch it!!!" Hahah!
This is my one question can u remove the two back seats and install the far back seats like they do in the piper stretch6. So everyone is seating forward. And load the plan luggage forward. Does it mess with cg to have 2 150 pound people all the way in back
There is a limit to how much weight the rear most seats can handle.
Two very nice looking rides. I think I'd personally prefer the F33 after watching this.
Fair enough! It's where I ended up... sold the A36.
The Conti CD-300 might be fitted in the 36?
I would be cautious of that shoulder harness setup. With the anchor point being so low, it can crush your spine downward on an impact. The anchor point needs to much higher to prevent this problem. Check out harness installations in race cars. The shoulder harness anchors are always up high and not down low.
I think I made that observation in this video or a different one.
Beech created the first "model 36" in 1969 (ive got one). Then yes i believe in '70 they named it the A-36. Difference between the '69 and the '70? Not a thing...I even saw a '68 on controller one time for sale. Never took the time to determine if they made a 1968 "model 36" or not. Its hard to find correct info on that subject.
Can anyone tell me if the long body A36 has anymore head room than a 33/35? I’m 6’5” and fly an S35 v tail. I’m just about touching the headliner with the seat leaned back. I’m guessing height is same but couldn’t find data. Thanks Scott
Erik, the fuselage is pretty much the same width for all of them. The A36 has a plug... I made a video on that the Shootout Between the F33 and the A36.
@@FlyWirescottperdue Yes, great video. It seems I’ll need to have the seat cushion modified or maybe age will shrink me a bit.
I like your videos i have just a question how you record tho voice in tho cockpit please ? Thank you
I use a mic adapter and a mini-Sony voice recorder to record cockpit audio.
you plug it into the headset circuits
@@aymaneelouadi4199 Yes, the adapter goes between the headset and the headset jack.
If you put a I/O 550 with the D Shannon Upgrade you can get about 185 TAS.
Now that would be nice!
Pros and cons of 3blade probes 4 blade and 5 blade probes and can this 2 planes use them ??
Are you talking Props? Propellers?
Great video but what’s the deal with the parachute? Just in case?
The F33C is aerobatic... folks generally agree that wearing a parachute is a good idea when going upside down. Maybe I need to do a video on that!
My S35 has a much larger baggage area. Nwhy is the F33 baggage area smaller?
The folks that ordered it from the factory didn’t want to pay for the extended baggage option. Bummer.
You said you used to own a V35B - where do they lie in Bonanza line in your eyes with regards to pros and cons.
My first V-Tail was a P35, then a J35 and the V35B. The P was nice and set the hook. The J was the nicest flying V-Tail, but the fuel system was a hassle and the load was miniscule. The V35B was a great airplane, large baggage door, quite a load, it would do 174TAS on 12.5 gph (with an IO550). But still a bit of a hassle to get in and out of. It was the fastest normally aspirated Beech I've flown.
So if I am doing 3-400 miles each trip. No kids. Prob just 2-3 people in at a time. U recommend 33 or 36?
The A36 is a great XC IFR platform. I love my F33C!
@@FlyWirescottperdue cool thx my missions are mostly ca to Az or Nv. Thinking 33 will be more fun
Were you wearing a parachute during this flight? If so, why?
Mario- If you watch to the end I do a couple of rolls and a half turn spin. The FAA says I should wear a parachute. Actually, if I do aerobatics by myself I don't have to wear a chute. If someone else is in the plane everyone must wear a chute. This is an F33C, an aerobatic Bonanza, and the owner wants to use it for training aerobatics and upset recovery techniques. So, I thought it a good idea to try the chute out and see how it fits. Ready for a different perspective?
FlyWire- scott perdue Thanks for the explanation Scott, I didn’t knew the F33C was approved for aerobatics, the POH in my Deb says Spins are prohibited so it’s is a maneuver I’ll never try
@@marioalbertocasanovaguio4271 Mario- I think that is a good plan. But since the airplane can spin... it might be a good idea to come fly this one with me to explore the envelope safely. It'll make you a better pilot!
Very cool! What speed did you perform rolls?
140 knots for an ARoll
@@FlyWirescottperdue thank you. Is the “C” model an STC, or production only?
I was wondering why you wore a parachute.... then I saw the rolls!
So, how does it work? Whats the likely risk? A broken spar? An unrecoverable spin?
And then how do you get the door open and out clear to pull the chute?
Good questions. But that’s the regs - parachute required for aerobatics
@@srnunan4783 Scott explained it in the video and numerous times already in the comments. It's and aerobatic rated F33C, and the door has a second handle that pops the pins and the door fly's off if needed to bail out.
Haha I was wondering why the Softie.
Haha, I thought folks might like that;) It was fun!
You can’t just take a tapered shape cut it in half and add a plug. You have to reshape the entire taper to make the length work which is what they did. So the fuselages aren’t the same shape and taper.
What are the measurements from your A36?
@@FlyWirescottperdue I don’t have one but Piper did the same thing from the Cherokee to the archer. The angle of the taper is more gradual whenever they stretch the fuselage.
Really the only handling quality difference is the ground turn radius. The 33, 35, and Baron 55 all have a tighter turn radius.
Difference between long body and short body... about 10". The Turn radius is 1' 7" great for the A36 (wingtip).
ROFL... Rolls for the win!
When you work on them (especially under the panel) the change becomes fairly obvious. 33s and 35s were much easier for me 25 years ago!
The spar is in the wrong place;)
@@FlyWirescottperdue
Depends on if you are flying or working on them, really. At 50 my beloved V tails have become more difficult to work on!
I am surprised that the AOPA has it wrong. The POH has the answers. The serial numbers of each model and equipment make all the difference. A better source than AOPA would be the American Bonanza Society.
It is conventional wisdom... the nose is longer, so the easiest explanation is the 10" plug in front of the wing.
Wow…surprisingly small baggage area
I wondered why you were wearing that parachute. I had an F33A for a dozen years or so. Loved it. And I also took an aerobatics course many years ago in a Cessna Aerobat. But I never tried to roll the F33A (though I was very tempted a few times). Nice touch!
They are nice rolling airplanes! But going beyond 60 degrees is an issue... except for the F33C. What fun!
F33a with IO550 = 185 TAS. ( D Shannon Upgrade )
Now that sounds like fun!
FlyWire- scott perdue had one. Best single engine ever!
Thanks for the explanation regarding the 10” placement.
My ‘82 F33A, IO-550B5 trues at 183 KTS. I previously owned a ‘78 F33A (also with the IO-550 B4F) and it would true 183 KTS after I added a Hartzell Scimitar Prop. My ‘82 will eventually receive a Scimitar Prop as well.
Me I like the F33 and 35 Bonanza’s over the 36. Why most people fly 2 people so do you buy a plane for 1% of your flights or 99%. I started General Aviation and have flown Beechcraft 33,35,36,55,58, Pressurized 58, King Air 90E and King Air 200 and King Air 350. What I love about Beechcraft is control balance is Excellent IMHO. Better than the Cessna CJ-4 that I fly for work.
I would agree. Sold the A36 for the F33C.
You said the F-33 can roll but the A-36 can't??? Did I hear that correctly. Sorry, but not (exactly) true. Been there, done that. F-33, V-35, A-36, B-55 and B-58. Guaranteed: they all can roll quite easily. However, and this is where your statement can be accurate, only the F-33 aerobatic version is certified to do it legally. (Ah, I see in a comment further down the page that it is an F-33C. Kudos.)
Wow....what a fucking neighborhood
v tail?
The only difference between the 33 and the 35 is the v-tail... and the 35 does have less drag.
You just said an A-36 cannot do an aileron roll? Huh? Why not?
Not sure I said it couldn't. But I'm damn sure I said it shouldn't. It is not stressed for aerobatics, not legal for it. If you are in an A36 and find yourself unintentionally upside down the A36 will be able to roll out of it.
Are you based at Bourland?
I am indeed.
@@FlyWirescottperdue My name is Steve Schillio, co-owner of Parker County Today Magazine. I would love to do a story on you. Plesase contact me at 817-629-7872 if you are interested. I love flying.
I am trying to work towards my certificate, need my medical, etc. Have been flying with a friend out of Granbury. Love your videos. You seem like a great person.
Great Video! But, it needs more cowbell!
You can always use more Cowbell!
O Bonanza é um avião espetacular , mas eu prefiro um cesnna 210
Why won't the A36 roll?
They will. But F33C's are approved for aerobatics (some minor structural upgrades and a quick release door) and the 36 is not approved. My "Straight 36" was a 1969 model, and production began the year before in '68.
@@N8844H good deal. I understand now the difference is just the legality of the maneuver.
Robin White answered pretty well. But, please dwell on more than the legality. The F33C is stressed to +6/-3g, the A36 is only stressed to +4.4 depending on the category. You can easily exceed that in a botched maneuver. Aerobatics should be the province of airplanes stressed for the environment. Gotta go with the official answer!