I absolutely adore the implication that Schwarzwald was dead all along, but he was so determined to reveal the truth that he kept going long after his body was spent.
Actually the show's creator originally meant for him to be The Joker-the pivotal villain of the series. Glad it ended up not developing that way, his character was much richer for it.
"Think you humans who are split into two worlds. Unless you want the gulf between humans to expand into oblivion, you must THINK!" A profoundly relevant statement for these times.
It's a show. There. I've saved you countless hours. It was always a show. That's why those "actors" had to be killed when they realized that nothing happened 40 years ago. That their memories are all fake. This is why they who were cast in the name of God: י ה ו ה Were not guilty.
@@JoshuaRoberts_V No, literally. That's the big reveal of what happened 40 years ago. What everything means. The Truth. It's a live action reality TV show based off the fiction book of Angel Rosewater, who produces the show. There's clues throughout the show, and it was revealed in Roger the Wanderer. (aka Roger escaped the set.)
aroukar47 Schwartzwald figured out they are all android actors. Notice he always had a half robot looking face when his face was covered you could see his robotic eye. . Then remember what speakeasy guy says at the beginning of the last episode. Roger the wanderer, he for some reason feels that Angel is making him act out a role and he jokes what the next script will be. And I could point out more things, vut fast forward to the last episode. Roger sinking in the sea, and what does he see, a bright light, a series of “memories”, and what is shown? Multiple Roger Smith androids being mass produced and Roger shouts “No!!” as he begins to realize the truth. Anyways, yeah. It is a stage Angel seems to be making a novel and in Angel’s world they can setup simulated realities with android things (what Roger and basically everyone in this show was, they just were meant not to know). When the world is disappearing at the ending, because of big venus aka angel I believe this is because she keeps deleting her progress in her story and wanting to start over, and that is what Roger is there to negotiate for on behalf of old man Rosewater and he pleads with Angel to let them stay the way they are and not erase everything again as she was already actively doing. Best way I can explain it in this comment, anyways enjoy this mega spoiler aka explanation of the story behind the events of this show. This is indeed a show, but it has a story behind it and it’s awesome to analyze the story and understand it.
What I love most about Schwarzwald is the fact that, even though he dies halfway through the series, his actions still have massive consequences on the events of the show.
A specter is haunting Paradigm City - the specter of Schwarzwald! Also he might have been dead before the series even started? Angel mentions (I believe in the episode with the “dragon) that they found his decaying body outside Paradigm City and it was old enough that he likely died before he ever found Big Duo or Archetype. Very mysterious. Also he is mentioned to have had a wife, but we never, ever see her. All very mysterious.
@@TheCrewExpendable I forgot that about the wife. It really plays off the unreality that is Paradigm City. He went so hard behind the veil that even in "death" he is still there.
Beautiful stuff. It took me many years of being separated from the show to finally break away from the lens of Roger and instead consider the show from the perspective of Angel. Angel is the writer. Something traumatic happened in her past, and so she's taken to writing as a form of self exploration to help resolve her painful memories. She cannot forget them, so she writes about a city where all of the inhabitants forget their memories and inserts herself there. Angel keeps the setting, a city of amnesia, but rewrites the characters over and over again as she subconsciously struggles to find a solution to her problems. Eventually, after countless drafts, Angel starts writing about the characters becoming somewhat self aware, intentionally leaving fragments of former drafts in the narrative. Angel uses her cast to slowly explore her own wish to forget the traumatic memories of an event that " Clipped her wings". Many characters she creates (the tomatoes and the "cast" in the name of god metaphors) have their own thoughts on memories and how to cope with them or the lack of them. For example, Angel writes about Schwarzwald, who struggles to find the truth behind his lack of memories and what his reaction would be if he finally discovered that the memories he sought from 40 years ago aka "previous drafts " were also fictional. The story ends with Roger Smith discovering the truth as well. Roger sees a flash of content from previous drafts where there was a great Megadeus war. Roger sees himself die, and be remade from draft to draft, metaphorically the assembly line. Importantly, Angel has Roger react to the revelations in a way that would be true to his character. Roger chooses to ardently strive to move forward in life without heed of the past. Roger argues the reasoning behind his decision with Angel in hopes of negotiating that she try things his way and do the same with her own situation. This deeply resonates with Angel to the point of moving her to tears. Angle is inspired by the decision Roger made. The negotiator has convinced her. That final shot with Roger confidently comforting Angel's shoulder as she looks on at her "self inserted" interactions with Roger within the story, is a metaphor. Her creations helped her finally discover a way to deal with her painful memories. Angel decides to march on with life, focusing on the present and the future like Roger. Now satisfied, Angel completes the story and it starts anew with it's final draft. This time Dorothy is not lost, she is simply standing next to Angel as one of her favored characters. Roger continues to be his confident self, eagerly pressing onwards in life without worry of the past. Angel smiles, the negotiation is complete and she is healed, no longer tormented by "the Beast"(memories) of who she was before her wings "got clipped". In my mind it's possible that Angels traumatic event was a rape. Her wings being clipped sounds akin to something like that, especially with how vulnerable and sexualized Angel tends to be throughout the show. Her name , "Angel" is a symbol of purity. The scars on her back resulting from "wings being clipped" suggests her as a fallen angel with some sort of lost purity. Also Dorothy's alternative variant R-D had themes of a violent and dangerous take on "love" for Roger. R-D also stands for research and development, perhaps an allusion to Angel processing her own trauma in the most direct of ways In writing her story Angel created a character who had an answer that she could not come up with on her own. Now, when confronted with life's problems, I can imagine her thinking to herself " What would Roger do", then smiling and resolving to move forward with her life to a greater future. Beautiful stuff.
Again, as I said in the other video, that's kind of hard to do since Angel isn't relevant until the ending of season 1, at no point other than the final episodes are we instructed, or even encouraged, to look through her eyes instead of Roger's, she was just a mysterious character in season 1, and when they wanted to do something with her, they we're already running out of episodes, the show literally focuses on Roger and the other Megadeuses, as well as the mystery of what happened 40 years ago, that Angel's development is kind of weird, think about it, what do we know about Angel at the end of the series? She's part of the Union... Alright, what else? She's a foreigner, okay. Apparently she's a "memory" and the Dominus of Big Venus (As we see from her back, her "angel wings" are probably scars from the cables of Big Venus, we can theorize this by seeing how the cables in Big Fau inserted themselves in Alex Rosewater) and apparently the real writer of "Metropolis", and if your theory's correct, a Director... alright, but other than that, _what_ do we know for certain? How do we know she isn't just the consciousness of a Megadeus? Or a person who died long ago but is somehow still here, like Schwarzwald? And if this really is a show directed by Angel, then who's the audience? And before you say that it's us, let me remind you that Roger saw a strip of a Big-O comic way back in Episode 14, and in Episode 24 we see that Dan Dastun starred in the movie "Winter Night Phantom", so if there _is_ an audience, it certainly isn't just us, there must be other people in the world "watching" this, but who are they? Where are they? Are they related to the events of 14 years ago? Why is Roger "dead"?
I think you are on the trail of what makes this show really special. It really is all about introducing you to angel, it is so intriguing because everything revolves around her and for each answer to a question you learn about her, 2 more questions arise. I feel like the whole series could be renamed Angel.
@@L1z43vreat questions. Apologies for taking so long to get back to you! Perhaps the answer lends to a destabilization as the show progresses. At the start we know nothing about angel, foreigners, nor do we see inconsistencies such as big O comics and screening within the city. Then as Angel the writer delves further and Swartzvald gets closer to the truth, the city starts to come apart. Previous drafts meld into the story, old enemies from the megadeus war that never was resurface, we come across a previous iteration Dorathy and a prototype for Big O in a long forgotten city. In the end, everyone involved is revealed to be mechanical. Big Ear is mechanical, Dominus have a mechanical insert via their backs to their BIG, Swartzvald, closest to the truth hid himself in wraps and showed a glass eye, presumably he recognized his nature far earlier than most. Beneath the stage we saw gears, above it we saw lights. It's all really interesting, but to get back to your questions, I believe the veil was pulled back as the story progressed. The relatively abrupt reveal and end was likely due to the rumored initial plans for a third, final season falling through
@@dend1 Okay, but _why_ does the answer lend to a destabilization? Any good story already has the answer to the mystery, but it knows how to give hints as the story progresses. If Angel didn't think that far ahead, then I'm sorry, but that's the sign of a bad writer. At the start we don't know anything about Angel or the foreigners, yeah, but not because Angel didn't write about them yet, it's because the actual showrunners hadn't thought up about that yet, that plot point was not yet established. We don't see inconsistensies arising as Big-O comics because it wouldn't really make sense unless someone wrote about the black megadeus in universe, or it was inside Roger's head, which was confirmed in the first episode of season 2, where Roger was having an existential crisis. War that never was? The Megadeus war _has_ happened, as evidenced by the state of the city, Schwarzwald's monologues and Roger's own memories. And no, not everyone involved was revealed to be mechanical, we've seen Datsun bleed in a few moments in the show, we've seen Roger get hurt and Schwarzwald is basically a Frankenstein's monster with his bandages, because he was nearly "Ye Guilty"'d by Archetype, not because he tried to peel his whole skin off, he's not the Terminator. Big Ear, as far as we know, is the only mechanical person in town, and Dominus don't have this "mechanical insert via their backs to their big" you claim they have, the Bigs literally clutch their wires into a person's back, as we see with Angel herself, presumebly to gain access to their nerves and allowing them better control. I think I know what happened to the show, and it wasn't that it was planned to have a third season but it didn't pull through, it's that the creators saw that they were running out of episodes so they copied Evangelion's confusing ending, except while there it made sense, here... I can't really say it does because of lack of evidence and closure. And again, as I said before, there was no indication for Angel to suddenly become such an important character, she was just a mysterious character in season 1 that was _about_ to receive some explanation, but then they ran out of episodes, but now in the final episodes she's suddenly this super important character who made the whole story, and once again, we are _never_ instructed to look at her eyes. Like, I'm sorry, but I just can't see it, this has as much evidence as that one Walter Sullivan theory in my POV. Sorry for the long response and thanks for the reply, but I just can't see it.
Ye Not Guilty is said over and over so many times in this show that you don't even think about what happens when an unjust normal schmuck tries to wield the executioner's axe.
I love it cause its no longer just a cool phrase thats uttered and is revealed to be the megadeus accepting its pilot(Or in cases like Alex and Alan, when they don't, or in the latters cases, outright reject and kill their pilot).
I remember reading a blurb in the big O Manga where the show's creator said that because there was so much Batman influencce he had originally meant for Schwarzwald to be like The Joker-a villain who amuses himself by committing crimes, and that he was actually supposed to be a handsome man who just wore a pair of band aids in the shape of a cross over his forehead. Amazing how they arrived at this from that, but it was for the better. Schwarzwald added so much depth to the show, even if he only appeared in a few episodes.
@@JoshuaRoberts_V Except when they do, which is a lot of times, like you tripping over a rock on the street, or a burglar who just happens to rob your house just because he wanted to, sometimes, things are meant to be and happen, yes, but some times, things happen by random chance
@@mythghost I really feel like we got all the answers in the second season, just not literally spelled out for you. It's a TV show, even within it's own story, constantly repeating over and over, all the actors grown and produced, like tomatoes, for our consumption with no need for their own individual memories.
My interpretation of this all this is that during The Event of 40 years ago, Mankind destroyed itself using the Megadeus in a terrible war. Enormous machines they created with godlike power that developed sentience and personality of their own. What came after mankind went extinct were androids, both biological and mechanical. Pale imitators without memories of lives they never had, sitting blindly in a role that was set for them by their programming. Angel and Big Venus, the most powerful of them created this "stage" with Roger Smith as the "Negotiator" - the one to bridge the gap between the new Humanity and its self made "Gods", the one that could plead their case and allow the world to continue its existence, rather than let it be destroyed. Scharzwald discovered that he was in fact nothing more than a biomechanical figure and went insane as a result. When he uncovered the fact that he and the rest of the people in Paradigm City were not the original form of Mankind, he realized that the memories he was searching for were nothing but an illusion. To try and wake them up to the truth, he then attempted to destroy the whole thing using Big Duo. In fact though, unknowingly, this was his programming all along, meant to stir Roger into fulfilling his own purpose: To negotiate with Big Venus into allowing the world to continue. Just my thinking.
I came up with "its an anime that realized its an anime" basically like he said the world is just a stage theres no world outside of what we see the characters are actors not real people. the stage starts to collapse purely because the stage starts to see itself as fake therefore nonexistant. What happened 15 years ago? nothing. Nothing exist past the first episode the event of 15 years ago was purly an in story mystery that the story never got to so what happened? nothing. thats why people are meeting their past selves scenes are blending together what would be a flash back is just the two "actors" running into each other. basically we are watching a story the story itself as a whole have an existential crisis and its solution is to restart to the start of everything. so nothing happened 15 years ago nothing happened a year ago the only thing that actually happaned, happened at the start of the show and at its end thats it. I think what you figured out is what happened in the OG story what Im talking about is whats happening to the actual story
Products of the mind, to prove we exist. If memory is lost, it's replaced with fiction our imagination invents. But the truth itself, is always elusive. Because truth becomes memory. And memory becomes fiction!
Hrrm. Man sees a dark alley. Shines a light, can’t see the end. Man walks away, afraid. Man walks by the same alley in the daytime, doesn’t shine a light, isn’t afraid. Punchline: Man throws his light away. Funny joke.
Schwarzwald reminds me of something a certain 'My Life as a Teenage Robot' villain swore: *"I will liberate the Earth, even if I must destroy it to do so!"* but with Schwarzwald, it's more: *"I will make Humanity seek the truth, even if I must kill them all to do so!"*
6:52 This was the ultimate clue. The world is a stage. Memories were imagination the entire time. Or should I say previous drafts of Angel's script she used to help with a traumatic memory of "having her wings clipped" (Likely a rape given how her two major characterizations throughout the series oscillated between a sexual energy between her and Roger, and vulnerability when dealing with most everybody else) This is why we came across a Dorothy that was written to have a far darker relationship with Roger. It's also why Roger later remembers dying during a great mega-deus war, sees multiple versions of himself being created as if in a factory and has hallucinations of being a different character in "Roger the wanderer" The Big O was the final draft for "the city of amnesia" where Angel planted herself in a subconscious bid to help manage difficult memories of a traumatic personal event. We come to see how the characters she wrote dealt with the prospect of forgetting the past and as such helped her come to terms with her own great burden See rogers final scene where he made his argument to live on regardless of the past, and his metaphorical hand on Angel's shoulder as she sat in the director's chair over watching the show The negotiator did his job and Angel came to terms with her feelings
You know how in some shows, like House, they occasionally spend an episode focusing on one of the side characters. It would be friggin awesome if Schwarzwald had an episode all to himself.
+ The Dawg he kinda did if you count the first appearence of big duo, Hell the fact that he has such a lasting presents in the show AFTER HIS DEATH speaks more volume. I believe the writters purposely never gave him his own episode to give him that edge of mystery he represents.
+The Dawg Well he did have a lot of focus in The Enemy is Another Big and Leviathan. Or are you asking for further exploration of his origins and motivations?
You know I didn't even see this comment when I got it... To explain further, I want an episode wherein the camera crew follows him around for the entire time. He's the one whose head we're inside for 30 minutes, listening to his motivations and his plans. I think you could squeeze a ton of characterization and possible history of the world from his mind, even in such a small time slot. I'd even bet that he knows more about the rest of the cast than he ever lets on so we could get some juicy secrets as well. I'll reference House again just to get my point across. I want an episode like this- en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilson_(House_episode)
Oh the funny thing is that Big O always had deep Lovecraftian roots beneath the surface. The script writer Chiaki J. Konaka considers himself a "Cthulhu Mythos writer."
Schwarzwald is one of the few of us mortals who probably could look upon a Great Old One or Outer God in their true enormity without going totally mad. The fact that he's already at least a little mad probably helps.
he realized that there was never a time before 40 years ago as the entire world is just a simulation and its bound to be reset and hes angry other people are so complaisant that they cant see the truth
I always thought big 0 season 2 was a metaphor for a production stuck in development hell. Schwartzweld is the most competent man on the team and the voice of reason trying to pull the production together, but in the end the result is so far beyond salvation that the only thing that can be done is to scrap it abd start again. The tomatoes were the talent pool, and the rodger smith army are all the actors they burned through. Angel and the old man are the director and produce respectively.
I never realized it until I got older and revisited the whole series, but Schwarzwald is a character I can actually identify with. I actually have the same beliefs he has (especially with society.)
@@JohnSWeekley sure lol char is relatable in Char's counterattack ua-cam.com/video/ourB80IQEes/v-deo.html and Dakar ua-cam.com/video/aYO35_7Rm8U/v-deo.html but we can avoid his ephebophilia lol 18 too old a la char's deleted affair.
Schwartzwald figured out they are all android actors. Notice he always had a half robot looking face when his face was covered you could see his robotic eye. . Then remember what speakeasy guy says at the beginning of the last episode. Roger the wanderer, he for some reason feels that Angel is making him act out a role and he jokes what the next script will be. And I could point out more things, vut fast forward to the last episode. Roger sinking in the sea, and what does he see, a bright light, a series of “memories”, and what is shown? Multiple Roger Smith androids being mass produced and Roger shouts “No!!” as he begins to realize the truth. Anyways, yeah. It is a stage Angel seems to be making a novel and in Angel’s world they can setup simulated realities with android things (what Roger and basically everyone in this show was, they just were meant not to know). When the world is disappearing at the ending, because of big venus aka angel I believe this is because she keeps deleting her progress in her story and wanting to start over, and that is what Roger is there to negotiate for on behalf of old man Rosewater and he pleads with Angel to let them stay the way they are and not erase everything again as she was already actively doing. Best way I can explain it in this comment, anyways enjoy this mega spoiler aka explanation of the story behind the events of this show. Oh and the book itself that “Big O” takes place within is that Metropolis book old man Rosewater was holding the last time he is seen in the final episode.
The whole "simulated reality"/"Truman Show" thing going on with Paradigm City and Angel, I get. I also basically understand that _everyone_ is essentially an android "actor" playing parts "cast by God"; the only exceptions being Angel - an avatar for the real Angel to view her work from inside -and _maybe_ Roger. What I _don't_ understand is Schwarzwald being dead for the entire show after episode 4, yet still able to interact physically with the world - things like the burning mask party and piloting Big Duo. Conceivably, it's just another android: That instead of a Michael Seebach-android-turned-Schwarzwald, it's just a Schwarzwald android. But then, why would Angel - the literal "god" of the "world" - specifically call out the fact that _Schwarzwald_ had been dead? It's just sort of brushed off with Roger ruminating on whether or not "Michael Seebach" is still wandering the city through the idea that his insane passion allowed him to exist as a concept, not really a "person", long after his body had disintegrated; still searching for "the truth" - whatever that may be, since it's implied that the _main_ truth is something he already knows and has conveyed to Roger. This has bugged the hell out of me for decades at this point. It just comes creeping back every few years and burrows into my head and I can't shake it. And on top of that, there simply isn't a lot of "The Big O" theorycrafting anywhere, as most of the story-behind-the-story is able to be gleaned from the show itself on its own. Schwarzwald's seemingly impossible existence notwithstanding. It is never explained, just brushed aside as something that should make sense, but ultimately makes the _least_ amount of sense in a story that takes the phrase "all the world's a stage" _literally._
Nice idea, but the “glass eye” is just a lens of some kind. You see it broken and his flesh eye underneath in the archetype episode when he falls off as the archetype wakes up.
@@ojisankusai Angel, as the author, might have revised the script to having Schwarzwald have been dead by that point. But by that point, Roger had already interacted with Schwarzwald. Or the body of Michael Seebach that was discovered was from an earlier draft, perhaps one in which the figure of Schwarzwald was an outsider to Paradigm using the identity of the dead reporter to conceal the existence of the outsiders. There isn't a clear sign (to me) of if 'revisions' to the draft require a complete reset, or if editing can happen in 'real time' without effecting the memories of the cast. Or potentially, as The Negotiator, Roger Smith is so key to the script that his scenes are rarely looked over to fix the inconsistencies. (Being he is in so many scenes, artifacts of earlier drafts are more likely to be left behind.) Said artifacts are Memories to Roger after all.
Lets just say that if what happened 40 years ago did not exist, man would still be a creature that fears the dark. Fear comes from not knowing. He then averts his eyes from that fear and acts as if he never had any memories of his life, of his history; the very beginning. Do you think man can survive cut off from his memories of the past? He having no idea how long he has been there, of where he is from or what he is connected to? I have lived my life as a newspaper reporter. I uncover the truth and write my articles, but then i learned all too well that a mere reporter can never get to the truth of this city. It is merely impossible, and it is unsure. no one here is even interested in learning the truth. A truth that must be known. But I want to know!! I want to learn what must be known! It wasn't just the people of this city who lost their memory 40 years ago. The foreigners who sleep underground who came here searching for fragments of memories have lost as well. Even without the events of 40 years ago, i think man would still be a creature that fears the dark. He does not face that fear. He averts his eyes from it and acts as if he never had any memories of his history. But... 40 years can be both a brief time and a long time. Man's fear has withered, and even time tries to wither the desire to know the truth. Is t a crime to try and learn the truth? Is it a sin to search for those things which you fear? My purpose in this world is knowledge and the dissemination of knowledge of it, and it is I who is to restore the fruits of my labors to the entire world. Fear. It is something vital to us puny creatures. The instant man stops fearing is the instant the species will reach a dead end, only to sink to pitiable lows, only to sit and wait apathetically for extinction. WAKE UP! DON'T BE AFRAID OF KNOWLEDGE! Humans who loose the capacity to think become creatures who's existence has no value. THINK, you humans who humans who are split between two worlds... unless you want the gulf between humans to expand into oblivion! YOU MUST THINK! Don't you find it odd that there is only one man in this whole city who has the desire to pursue the truth? You poor souls, who fear the darkness and the deep, when you suppress that fear you will be able to get closer to the truth. There is but one truth. If you avert your eyes from it you will always remain nothing more than a puppet. In the words of me(schwartzwald) who is closest to the truth: Imagination and memory are but one thing which for diverse considerations have diverse names! Foolish denizens of paradigm city, so long as you exist together, continue to live your lives together and share in your mass illusion a single dragon will be born there. Yes! That ancient mechanical dragon is a mirror of none other than yourselves, you fools! The anxiety within you has no outlet! It has no past, and no future! Each persons jealousies, their desires, their fears... alone, each may be a small part, but together they become an enormous void that will take shape. Truth, those who seek it out unknowingly become obsessed with this grand illusion that they are able to control this world. This tiny world. The incomplete book of gordon rosewaters written in his younger days depicts the final days of humanity. And the foolish humans who use the power of God. The memories are here, negotiator. The giants who formed this world into its sensual existence and now seem to live in it in chains are in truth the causes of its life and the sources of all activity, but the chains are the source of cunning and weak and tamed minds, which have power to resist energy. I will have the true memories in my possession. All this time i was mistaken, but it won't be long now, for i realize what those memories really are! Paradigm city... a grand ostentatious stage... and above it, secretly looking down at the folly of human blunders, were not expecting the comforting presence of gods, but only this abandoned equipment. This is a comedy! That which i was searching for... the true memories... they were... *end transmission*
Michael McConnohie was excellent at everything he did. When you heard him in anything, you knew he was going to get it done. I’m sad he retired, but it was his choice.
I love that moment, there he basically told Gabriel even Rodger Smith had more his respect than the man who couldn't decide who he wanted to be. At least puppet or not Rodger Smith was able to come to a truth. Not ride the fence.
Definitely influences of Shakespear there, but there are absolutely allusions to Plato's Allegory of the Cave and symbolic use of the Biblical revelations with Big O acting as the most recent incarnation of the Behemoth, Big Duo as Ziz, and Big Fau as Leviathan. Angel herself is the fallen angel at the end of all things. It is a very interesting show philosophically!
Personally, I think it was just the writers trying to make something vague, that sounded interesting and mysterious, but probably isn’t. I always preferred the first season to second season, it seemed to be going in a very interesting direction, but I was ultimately let down by s2. Still, the series is one of my childhood favorites
“This is a comedy” has been my catchphrase since i picked it up from schwarzwald. It sums up the Big O world and the real world comfortably...........................
I once had a dream that I completely figured out everything from Big O. All symbolism, all meaning, all answers and... it blew my mind. Unfortunately however, it was a dream and as I awoke I became aware that I was losing all the answers until it was all gone. That said, it filled me with hope and the assurance that there ARE answers to all the questions.
Of all the villians in Big O, Schwarzwald is probably the most fascinating to me. Learning the truth, like, the honest to god truth about reality can drive a man mad. He saw through the veil and was permanently transformed by it. His name, translated to Black Forest, is a place with a rich history surrounded in mystery and believed to be steeped in the mystical. Plus I like his design. His whole thing feels like it be at home in Lovecrafts universe.
"The true memories... THEY WERE ALL LIES" Nothing happened 40 years ago. 40 years ago, everyone was wondering what happened 40 years ago, and so on. It finds it's explaination in Gordon Rosewater's infamous quote "These tomatoes are reproduced synthetically, with only the memories of the flavorful original. If we keep repeating the process, this fruit will eventually become the real thing" This is to say that Paradigm city, and all those in it, are merely copies from a time before a real event that basically destroyed humanity. The people created, written into the grand storybook of Metropolis that is Paradigm City, have no memories of their own, such as Roger Smith, Angel Rosewater and even Gordon Rosewater... their memories are from other people... the ruins deep beneath paradigm are countless failed Paradigms that have been buried by the new Paradigm above them. Trying to find a way to recreate the world so it can continue; the world's in an infinite loop of rewrites never given a chance to play itself out... a director that's constantly revising the script, but can't seem to make it work. I feel like saying more but it's late where I am, and my brain wants a break. The theories on this show are fascinating: you should check out kiserai.net/bigo/ .
the matrix didn't come up with the concept intitially. "brain in a jar simulation" is an ancient concept given many different names. The most famous and most common one people are familiar with is the concept of reincarnation(having the ability to try again infinite times until you live the perfect life and achieve nirvana)
I think he came to recognize, even at the very "start," that the city was not "real" in a fundamental level, that it was a formula whose pre-determined answer could not be arrived at within it's own calculations - that there was something, some element, some variable, that he could not see. Initially, he believed this unknown element was part of the memories lost 40 years ago, and as "He Who Searches for Truth", he sought out those answers. That, ultimately, the world was, itself, artificial, was probably of no surprise to him by the end - it is the further truth, the one he died before uttering, which is the true signifier of his history and future. If he had had that truth, he could have stood before the beast that had lost its wings, instead of Roger.
I think Schwarzwald was always a long dead ghost whose role was tempt the citizens into searching for the truth instead of going about their lives. His very name means "black forest" and refers to a German forest that has been infamous for ghost haunting ever since romans first discovered the place. Considering that all the other citizens were just phantoms pretending to be real in Angel's dream I guess that makse Schwarzwald a ghost tempting other ghosts to wake up into the nothing-ness void.
@@TheTongueofRa interesting and yeah I subtly try to awaken people. We're at a similar point with how social media relatively 40 months ago creates such a mess and double life, with people who need to make only themselves manner with poor inhibitions and social skills. There's some good, but it helps to see which people need to remind you they're oppressed while having more than you. Especially when we have cancel culture these days, and frameworks of how violence happens (usually people know each other and it escalates terribly, especially in the house if she strikes first).
@@japo3867 I've come to consider what he said just before hitting the light to be roughly "This is a comedy-" because viewed from a distance, his entire life is funny, while viewed from up close it's tragic. "-because I was never meant to do anything else." He figured out, only at the end, that he wasn't the one intended to discover the truth and negotiate with the Director, just to direct the right person for the job to it. Given his tone of voice, I think he saw the comedy in it. Comedy is a tragedy the audience is distant from, after all.
This was my senior quote in high school: "There is but one truth, if you avert your eyes from it, you will always remain nothing more than a mere puppet" They missed up the wording on the printing, but the message remained the same.
Listening to this somehow helps put me into a focused,productive work mode. Incidentally that also coincides with " paranoid conspiracy theory " mode... i'd better get myself a dark basement with one light bulb and a typewriter.
@@2Addictive Uhm... Not really? At the last episode, we see that Angel and Dorothy are on the street when Roger's driving. And if the scripts for the episode can be used for some theory-making, Angel also appeared in the Dorothy negotiation in this "new" timeline
Years later we have Shin Mazinger Zero which has a similar instance... Mazinger Z has gotten sentient enough to be aware of the one loose end in its story. That being the End of Z which is the start of Great Mazinger.
Some complain about his ending but he'd given everything to understand the world and the answer was laughable. He had wasted his existence chasing a lie within a lie. There was no truth to be found.
The truth was this: 40 years ago, THIS happened. And then everyone had their memory wiped. They are all androids with minimal human mimicry. They keep forgetting
I wonder how many people recognize William Blake's "The Marriage of Heaven and Hell" there as he's getting 'et. If there's one thing you can count on in something written by Chiaki Konaka, it's film and literary references.
"Imagination and memory are but one thing which for diverse considerations have diverse names" I'm still not entirely sure what is meant here. That people create memories when there are no relevant ones?
memories by their very nature is not the past, at best its a murky and fallible representation of the past that with time become less and less accurate. the past is gone and the only thing that matters is the present and the future. a lot of what memories are of what we make them, these are some of the general themes of the show too
One thing that is pretty cool about the word monster is the etymology which describes the monster as a sign of something to come. The big megadeus’s are associated with the 3 biblical monsters, and often does brought up as the cause of event 40 years ago. When big Venus shows up, it is basically the herald for angel’s will.
The mechanical dragon is only a reflection of the citizens of paradigm refusing to think for themselves. Both the citizens and the dragon are just aimlessly wandering through their lives while doing nothing to break the cycle.
@@Shadows-RC The lack of interest from Japan was a factor even in Season 1, but the show was so popular over in the states that a second season was produced specifically by Adult Swim, regardless of the Japanese following. Coincidentally, it was the creators intention to have something of a global following even if it bombed domestically in Japan. I do agree with why they can't have a Season 3 though
@@cunningsmile4166 Uhm... How do you know that? No, seriously, Roger's wrist is covered, and we don't see a reflection, at best you could say it's ambiguous, because we don't really know if he has the watch, but even so, what does it matter if he doesn't have the watch? You don't need a watch to call upon a Megadeus
My interpretation of Paradigm City, would be closer to "The Good Place" except the "Architect" Angel doesn't know it, as the show is filled with afterlife overtures.
What he was searching for, the true memories, were Angel's memories. The fact that she was the director of the simulated show in which they all lived. The people of Paradigm City didn't lose their memories 40 years ago. They never had memories to begin with. All they ever had were the roles that they were given to play by Angel, even Schwarzwald. Their whole world was a complete farce, possibly based on a TV show from her real world, a joke.
Honestly this is all probably a result of the writer of the show getting frustrated with audiences not getting the point of the first season. Ultimately the story was never meant to be about the mystery of how Paradigm came to be. It was just meant to serves a setting for Roger's adventures, a stage if you will (which is why there isn't much of an ongoing plot or any deep delving into the mystery in season 1). But the writer got annoyed with audiences for not understanding that and made it more literal when he was tasked with making a second season.
Man, with all this setup, it's such a shame there wasn't a 3rd season because it just goes into another loop...probably fault of the director for JJ Abrahms-ing up with so much build up and mystery but no real planned payoff...sex without the climax.
they planned a third season (originally S2 was a lot longer, but they cut it in half), but didn't get the funding. Almost happened with S1 until CN got involved.
03:23 "FEAR!" 04:00 "Wake up, DON'T be AFRAID of knowledge." I konw what he's trying to say, but it's really sending a mixed message if you put it like that.
Fear is what keeps humans from doing things that could destroy us but also never forget of our memories never fear the knowledge of our mistakes to prevent it from happening again because when people accept things as they are and choose to ignore the reality of things then one day all that fear they had will disappear and it will happen all over again
He's saying that we fear the unknown, and that we fear our destruction and the meaninglessness of the universe, and that is good--without those fears, how will we learn, survive, and find satisfaction? Yet some when faced with those fears turn inward. They ignore reality and choose to believe in illusions, acting as sheep without true self-actualization. They accept that they will never know what happened forty years ago and that they will always be controlled by the rich and powerful, and pretend that they are satisfied with that. But in a city without memories, why are the rich rich? How did the situation come about? It emerged from nowhere, and that is why Paradigm encourages people to bury the past.
I know what you're getting at, but no his assesment/conclusion makes sense, but like so many other explainations and speeches I've seen in fiction, it skips over the important bits and leaves yourself to ponder the exact course of this equation/calculation. It's like you took Yoda's speech about Fear, yet formulated it like this:" Fear is the source and beginning emotion for all siths. It leads to Suffering" . If you know the quote, you know I just left out the most iconic part that helps weave it together. So what Schwarzwald is evidently trying to say is that fear is important in order to realize and see and face your weaknesses and that you need Knowledge to overcome it, but let's get deeper. He himselfs says at the beginning that Fear concerns mostly the unkown, the un-explainable, every form of uncertaintity and non-calcucable form of risk, whether it's rational/reasonable or not. That's also why he keeps talking about the Darkness being a symbol of instinctual primal Human fear, bc it represents all of these factors, not being able to accurately see and perceive what's going on around you etc. Hell, this even plays into his name of Schwarz-wald, which is German for Black forest, so another paralell to fairytale like depictions and symbolic elements of fear. So now to the second part. He's not a fear-monger, the opposite actually, he wants to unveal the truth, bc unless you know what even the nature and facts are behind a problem, danger or in this case mystery/enigma, there's no way to properly deal with it. Knowledge is Power, it is afterall also how Mankind has managed to come so far and stand atop of the Foodchain/pyramid. Asking questions, looking for parameters and trying to measure, scale and quantify relevant factors and the like in order to craft theories, making hypothesis and then after calculating odds or even determining a formula or system behind the process or yet unknown phenomena, is exactly how Science has operated and continued marching forward and evolved. However most humans prefer to avert their eyes from these facts or even truths and instead practise and indulge in the 8th Sin, I consider to be the most prevalent and deadly nowadays, despite the church or other religions not painting it as such ===> IGNORANCE (mental sloth/pride, so to say) So here you have my interpretation of Schwarzwald and also view on a lot of Human society in general.
Although he had his differences with Schwarzwald, Roger seemed genuinely sad of his death. At the end of the day Roger knew and pitied Schwarzwald as just a man that was driven insane from finding and searching for the truth.
Big O is the story of an author that imagined themselves inside an incomplete creation and then ad libed scenarios until she was about to destroy it but in the end her creation convinced her to redo the story. swartzwalde knew he was a character in a book
Schwarzwald's monologues were a cool thing in the series. Kind of reminds me of how Treize, Une & Zechs (& Heero & Relena a few times too I think) tried doing them in Gundam W, except those mostly sucked. Schwarzwald's were actually good, or maybe it's just because he had 'The Stoning' as a musical backdrop to them. I noticed in the comments a lot of people note the Scarecrow/Joker look, but I always thought he was more Mythos inspired. Hastur in particular. Hastur is said to influence writers, painters, and so on. A certain writer like Angel, maybe? He's also associated with 'The King in Yellow' a mysterious being dressed often in yellow rags with a pointy head. And also with, most telling of all, 'The Phantom of TRUTH', another zombie that goes around asking people if they've seen 'the yellow sign?' I see his changing role in the story as a manifestation of Angel Rosewater falling under the influence of Hastur and her own fall/resistance to madness. Schwarzwald started as a character/reporter named Michael Seaboach, but by this iteration of her tale, she seems unsure of if he was even a real character to begin with. He becomes a ghost, a literal Phantom of Truth.
I always tell people Big O is a masterpiece of an anime, but don't watch it. Don't invest in the meaning of it. Not because it isn't great but because you will find no happinness in the endless search for closure. This anime will linger in your conscience unsolved and up to your interpretation. A silent torture in itself if you desire the typical anime wrap up. But beautiful nonetheless.
That's not really much of an incentive. Someone on the Internet watched it, ergo you should watch it? Doug Walker in particular is not an entertaining individual, let alone someone I can respect or value his opinions. The only time he even pops up in my life, is when he does something dumb, like completly miss the mark on the wall. Or when his god awful movies are reviewed by more interesting internet personalities. The anime itself is brilliant, I expect that pretty much anyone watching this video already watched it and wanted to revisit Schwarzwald's speeches without rewatching the whole series.
These quotes could open your eyes and mind if you just listen... speaks volumes how years and years and we bearly understand that some times you need shut up and listen and learn... the world and more is there for you... hide the truth in plain sight.... where all devided but where all one!!
Big O is a telling of the King in Yellow when viewed from Schwartzwald's perspective. Truth is always a horror story when you look for the meaning of society.
Schwarzwald had the right idea about an unsolvable mystery. Don't look for evidence of the mystery itself, look at the nature of the people around the mystery. A lot of the times the issue with the mystery is a fundamental misunderstanding while formulating of the question of the mystery. At that point you only need to look at the people asking the question to understand the reality.
he means that anyone who can see the truth for what it is has woken up to the reality of paradigm city truly represents and can think for themselves and decide which future is the correct path to follow. which this goes above and beyond what path Angel has laid out for them and is an anomaly in her programing.
the world of paradigm city is not real, everyone is a program in a simulated reality. there are no memories prior to 40 years ago bc there is no 40 years ago, it never existed. he realized that he was in a show and that he was just a character in it and that the cycle is just gonna start over like it had many times prior. the end of the series shows roger the negotiator negotiation to let people keep their memories this reboot and to let them live their own lives outside of fate or destiny. something that they were denied. AI that becomes indistinguishable from humans, are they not human in a way themselves! we see this same theme repeated over the series a couple of times like with the relationship of androids to humans, and to clones (the tomatoes) with humans. and dont they have a right to live their lives how they chose! not just be actors in some script (angel)
Looking at all the analytical comments I think Schwarzwald is an aberrant/rogue element in Angel's program/simulation. Roger is supposed to be Angel's knight(dark knight, batman) within the simulation meant to be the hero and snuff out such aberrations. Unfortunately by the end Roger always figures out the truth. This Schwarzwald has a pyrrhic victory. Because although the truth has been exposed, Angel decides to reset the simulation and redo everything.
Not sure if I'm wrong....But I tell ya, if Schwarzwald could break the forth wall, this show could be a way to keep him from spoilers on the purpose behind the so-called stage.....
I absolutely adore the implication that Schwarzwald was dead all along, but he was so determined to reveal the truth that he kept going long after his body was spent.
Its funny how Schwarzwald was right about everything in the entire series and predicted it before it even began
+Vidyagamesnake I think he was a symbolic being, not really alive or dead, both antagonist & ally.
You are right though he hits on a key point in the series: Fear.
Imo Schwarzwald is the key to unlocking the entire mystery that is Big o.
BWG: I think he had a lot of inspiration from scarecrow (not just in looks) for that reason.
Actually the show's creator originally meant for him to be The Joker-the pivotal villain of the series. Glad it ended up not developing that way, his character was much richer for it.
Zellig u right i thought the same thing he has to be the equivalent to scarecrow. based on his speeches and philosphies behind his actions
"You must THINK!"
Phrase of the century.
11:20 ye guilty and yes sometimes loke Alan Gabriel can be worse than the sum of its parts lol flaws of both man and machine
2020. People MUST THINK! IT ALL FOR SHOW!
"I'm a libtarded, SJW, working for Antifa and BLM and I question this!!!"
@@FoxyPercival714 Quoting the voices in your head don't count.
@@mechashoggoth5914 No, I was being satirical and yet its the truth. :P
Learn to laugh.
"Think you humans who are split into two worlds. Unless you want the gulf between humans to expand into oblivion, you must THINK!"
A profoundly relevant statement for these times.
THIS. Incredibly poignant interpretation.
One of the most underrated characters ever. Props the VA for being the PERFECT choice
Absolute facts
I remember seeing those massive stage lights and being utterly dumbfounded. I've pondered the ending and true nature of this show for nearly 15 years.
It's a show.
There. I've saved you countless hours.
It was always a show.
That's why those "actors" had to be killed when they realized that nothing happened 40 years ago. That their memories are all fake.
This is why they who were cast in the name of God:
י
ה
ו
ה
Were not guilty.
@@JoshuaRoberts_V No, literally. That's the big reveal of what happened 40 years ago. What everything means. The Truth.
It's a live action reality TV show based off the fiction book of Angel Rosewater, who produces the show.
There's clues throughout the show, and it was revealed in Roger the Wanderer. (aka Roger escaped the set.)
But who's watching? And what's with the ending?
Cast in the name of God? Like casting a character?
aroukar47 Schwartzwald figured out they are all android actors. Notice he always had a half robot looking face when his face was covered you could see his robotic eye. . Then remember what speakeasy guy says at the beginning of the last episode. Roger the wanderer, he for some reason feels that Angel is making him act out a role and he jokes what the next script will be.
And I could point out more things, vut fast forward to the last episode. Roger sinking in the sea, and what does he see, a bright light, a series of “memories”, and what is shown? Multiple Roger Smith androids being mass produced and Roger shouts “No!!” as he begins to realize the truth.
Anyways, yeah. It is a stage Angel seems to be making a novel and in Angel’s world they can setup simulated realities with android things (what Roger and basically everyone in this show was, they just were meant not to know).
When the world is disappearing at the ending, because of big venus aka angel I believe this is because she keeps deleting her progress in her story and wanting to start over, and that is what Roger is there to negotiate for on behalf of old man Rosewater and he pleads with Angel to let them stay the way they are and not erase everything again as she was already actively doing. Best way I can explain it in this comment, anyways enjoy this mega spoiler aka explanation of the story behind the events of this show.
This is indeed a show, but it has a story behind it and it’s awesome to analyze the story and understand it.
What I love most about Schwarzwald is the fact that, even though he dies halfway through the series, his actions still have massive consequences on the events of the show.
A specter is haunting Paradigm City - the specter of Schwarzwald!
Also he might have been dead before the series even started? Angel mentions (I believe in the episode with the “dragon) that they found his decaying body outside Paradigm City and it was old enough that he likely died before he ever found Big Duo or Archetype. Very mysterious. Also he is mentioned to have had a wife, but we never, ever see her. All very mysterious.
He's one of the best examples of a character haunting the narrative I've seen.
@@TheCrewExpendable
I forgot that about the wife. It really plays off the unreality that is Paradigm City. He went so hard behind the veil that even in "death" he is still there.
Beautiful stuff. It took me many years of being separated from the show to finally break away from the lens of Roger and instead consider the show from the perspective of Angel.
Angel is the writer. Something traumatic happened in her past, and so she's taken to writing as a form of self exploration to help resolve her painful memories. She cannot forget them, so she writes about a city where all of the inhabitants forget their memories and inserts herself there. Angel keeps the setting, a city of amnesia, but rewrites the characters over and over again as she subconsciously struggles to find a solution to her problems.
Eventually, after countless drafts, Angel starts writing about the characters becoming somewhat self aware, intentionally leaving fragments of former drafts in the narrative. Angel uses her cast to slowly explore her own wish to forget the traumatic memories of an event that " Clipped her wings". Many characters she creates (the tomatoes and the "cast" in the name of god metaphors) have their own thoughts on memories and how to cope with them or the lack of them. For example, Angel writes about Schwarzwald, who struggles to find the truth behind his lack of memories and what his reaction would be if he finally discovered that the memories he sought from 40 years ago aka "previous drafts " were also fictional.
The story ends with Roger Smith discovering the truth as well. Roger sees a flash of content from previous drafts where there was a great Megadeus war. Roger sees himself die, and be remade from draft to draft, metaphorically the assembly line. Importantly, Angel has Roger react to the revelations in a way that would be true to his character. Roger chooses to ardently strive to move forward in life without heed of the past. Roger argues the reasoning behind his decision with Angel in hopes of negotiating that she try things his way and do the same with her own situation. This deeply resonates with Angel to the point of moving her to tears. Angle is inspired by the decision Roger made. The negotiator has convinced her. That final shot with Roger confidently comforting Angel's shoulder as she looks on at her "self inserted" interactions with Roger within the story, is a metaphor. Her creations helped her finally discover a way to deal with her painful memories. Angel decides to march on with life, focusing on the present and the future like Roger.
Now satisfied, Angel completes the story and it starts anew with it's final draft. This time Dorothy is not lost, she is simply standing next to Angel as one of her favored characters. Roger continues to be his confident self, eagerly pressing onwards in life without worry of the past. Angel smiles, the negotiation is complete and she is healed, no longer tormented by "the Beast"(memories) of who she was before her wings "got clipped".
In my mind it's possible that Angels traumatic event was a rape. Her wings being clipped sounds akin to something like that, especially with how vulnerable and sexualized Angel tends to be throughout the show. Her name , "Angel" is a symbol of purity. The scars on her back resulting from "wings being clipped" suggests her as a fallen angel with some sort of lost purity. Also Dorothy's alternative variant R-D had themes of a violent and dangerous take on "love" for Roger. R-D also stands for research and development, perhaps an allusion to Angel processing her own trauma in the most direct of ways
In writing her story Angel created a character who had an answer that she could not come up with on her own. Now, when confronted with life's problems, I can imagine her thinking to herself " What would Roger do", then smiling and resolving to move forward with her life to a greater future.
Beautiful stuff.
I get it, thanks for your argument and opinion on this show
Again, as I said in the other video, that's kind of hard to do since Angel isn't relevant until the ending of season 1, at no point other than the final episodes are we instructed, or even encouraged, to look through her eyes instead of Roger's, she was just a mysterious character in season 1, and when they wanted to do something with her, they we're already running out of episodes, the show literally focuses on Roger and the other Megadeuses, as well as the mystery of what happened 40 years ago, that Angel's development is kind of weird, think about it, what do we know about Angel at the end of the series? She's part of the Union... Alright, what else? She's a foreigner, okay. Apparently she's a "memory" and the Dominus of Big Venus (As we see from her back, her "angel wings" are probably scars from the cables of Big Venus, we can theorize this by seeing how the cables in Big Fau inserted themselves in Alex Rosewater) and apparently the real writer of "Metropolis", and if your theory's correct, a Director... alright, but other than that, _what_ do we know for certain? How do we know she isn't just the consciousness of a Megadeus? Or a person who died long ago but is somehow still here, like Schwarzwald? And if this really is a show directed by Angel, then who's the audience? And before you say that it's us, let me remind you that Roger saw a strip of a Big-O comic way back in Episode 14, and in Episode 24 we see that Dan Dastun starred in the movie "Winter Night Phantom", so if there _is_ an audience, it certainly isn't just us, there must be other people in the world "watching" this, but who are they? Where are they? Are they related to the events of 14 years ago? Why is Roger "dead"?
I think you are on the trail of what makes this show really special. It really is all about introducing you to angel, it is so intriguing because everything revolves around her and for each answer to a question you learn about her, 2 more questions arise. I feel like the whole series could be renamed Angel.
@@L1z43vreat questions. Apologies for taking so long to get back to you! Perhaps the answer lends to a destabilization as the show progresses. At the start we know nothing about angel, foreigners, nor do we see inconsistencies such as big O comics and screening within the city. Then as Angel the writer delves further and Swartzvald gets closer to the truth, the city starts to come apart. Previous drafts meld into the story, old enemies from the megadeus war that never was resurface, we come across a previous iteration Dorathy and a prototype for Big O in a long forgotten city. In the end, everyone involved is revealed to be mechanical. Big Ear is mechanical, Dominus have a mechanical insert via their backs to their BIG, Swartzvald, closest to the truth hid himself in wraps and showed a glass eye, presumably he recognized his nature far earlier than most. Beneath the stage we saw gears, above it we saw lights. It's all really interesting, but to get back to your questions, I believe the veil was pulled back as the story progressed. The relatively abrupt reveal and end was likely due to the rumored initial plans for a third, final season falling through
@@dend1 Okay, but _why_ does the answer lend to a destabilization? Any good story already has the answer to the mystery, but it knows how to give hints as the story progresses. If Angel didn't think that far ahead, then I'm sorry, but that's the sign of a bad writer. At the start we don't know anything about Angel or the foreigners, yeah, but not because Angel didn't write about them yet, it's because the actual showrunners hadn't thought up about that yet, that plot point was not yet established. We don't see inconsistensies arising as Big-O comics because it wouldn't really make sense unless someone wrote about the black megadeus in universe, or it was inside Roger's head, which was confirmed in the first episode of season 2, where Roger was having an existential crisis.
War that never was? The Megadeus war _has_ happened, as evidenced by the state of the city, Schwarzwald's monologues and Roger's own memories. And no, not everyone involved was revealed to be mechanical, we've seen Datsun bleed in a few moments in the show, we've seen Roger get hurt and Schwarzwald is basically a Frankenstein's monster with his bandages, because he was nearly "Ye Guilty"'d by Archetype, not because he tried to peel his whole skin off, he's not the Terminator. Big Ear, as far as we know, is the only mechanical person in town, and Dominus don't have this "mechanical insert via their backs to their big" you claim they have, the Bigs literally clutch their wires into a person's back, as we see with Angel herself, presumebly to gain access to their nerves and allowing them better control.
I think I know what happened to the show, and it wasn't that it was planned to have a third season but it didn't pull through, it's that the creators saw that they were running out of episodes so they copied Evangelion's confusing ending, except while there it made sense, here... I can't really say it does because of lack of evidence and closure. And again, as I said before, there was no indication for Angel to suddenly become such an important character, she was just a mysterious character in season 1 that was _about_ to receive some explanation, but then they ran out of episodes, but now in the final episodes she's suddenly this super important character who made the whole story, and once again, we are _never_ instructed to look at her eyes. Like, I'm sorry, but I just can't see it, this has as much evidence as that one Walter Sullivan theory in my POV.
Sorry for the long response and thanks for the reply, but I just can't see it.
Ye Not Guilty is said over and over so many times in this show that you don't even think about what happens when an unjust normal schmuck tries to wield the executioner's axe.
10:54 this, this right here.
I love it cause its no longer just a cool phrase thats uttered and is revealed to be the megadeus accepting its pilot(Or in cases like Alex and Alan, when they don't, or in the latters cases, outright reject and kill their pilot).
I remember reading a blurb in the big O Manga where the show's creator said that because there was so much Batman influencce he had originally meant for Schwarzwald to be like The Joker-a villain who amuses himself by committing crimes, and that he was actually supposed to be a handsome man who just wore a pair of band aids in the shape of a cross over his forehead. Amazing how they arrived at this from that, but it was for the better. Schwarzwald added so much depth to the show, even if he only appeared in a few episodes.
I feel like Alan Gabriel became that Joker character.
@@alexfrench1163 I definitely agree
He's.. The. Boogeyman
Yeah they should have doubled the amount of time he was in the series would have added much more tension and depth
@@JoshuaRoberts_V Except when they do, which is a lot of times, like you tripping over a rock on the street, or a burglar who just happens to rob your house just because he wanted to, sometimes, things are meant to be and happen, yes, but some times, things happen by random chance
This is one of the few anime that has a perfect dub everyone took it so seriously and it works so well with the setting God I love this show
I agree 100%
God, this show is brilliant (and SO underrated!)
I know right?
And left unfinished. If it got a season 3 we would learn a lot more
@@mythghost I really feel like we got all the answers in the second season, just not literally spelled out for you. It's a TV show, even within it's own story, constantly repeating over and over, all the actors grown and produced, like tomatoes, for our consumption with no need for their own individual memories.
Not necessarily a TV Show, but definitely a production. Possibly a simulation governed by Big Venus, and created or piloted as an escape by Angel.
My interpretation of this all this is that during The Event of 40 years ago, Mankind destroyed itself using the Megadeus in a terrible war. Enormous machines they created with godlike power that developed sentience and personality of their own.
What came after mankind went extinct were androids, both biological and mechanical. Pale imitators without memories of lives they never had, sitting blindly in a role that was set for them by their programming.
Angel and Big Venus, the most powerful of them created this "stage" with Roger Smith as the "Negotiator" - the one to bridge the gap between the new Humanity and its self made "Gods", the one that could plead their case and allow the world to continue its existence, rather than let it be destroyed.
Scharzwald discovered that he was in fact nothing more than a biomechanical figure and went insane as a result. When he uncovered the fact that he and the rest of the people in Paradigm City were not the original form of Mankind, he realized that the memories he was searching for were nothing but an illusion. To try and wake them up to the truth, he then attempted to destroy the whole thing using Big Duo. In fact though, unknowingly, this was his programming all along, meant to stir Roger into fulfilling his own purpose: To negotiate with Big Venus into allowing the world to continue.
Just my thinking.
Then a Gundam came and said no
I came up with "its an anime that realized its an anime" basically like he said the world is just a stage theres no world outside of what we see the characters are actors not real people. the stage starts to collapse purely because the stage starts to see itself as fake therefore nonexistant. What happened 15 years ago? nothing. Nothing exist past the first episode the event of 15 years ago was purly an in story mystery that the story never got to so what happened? nothing. thats why people are meeting their past selves scenes are blending together what would be a flash back is just the two "actors" running into each other. basically we are watching a story the story itself as a whole have an existential crisis and its solution is to restart to the start of everything. so nothing happened 15 years ago nothing happened a year ago the only thing that actually happaned, happened at the start of the show and at its end thats it.
I think what you figured out is what happened in the OG story what Im talking about is whats happening to the actual story
The "imagination and memory are but one thing" is pretty insightful, and it's one that doesn't get quoted a lot.
Products of the mind, to prove we exist. If memory is lost, it's replaced with fiction our imagination invents. But the truth itself, is always elusive. Because truth becomes memory. And memory becomes fiction!
It's actually a quotation from Thomas Hobbes, the philosopher.
And it has profound impact on one's entire interpretation of the show.
I feel that Schwarzwald and Rorschach from Watchmen would get along well
Definetly
@@Dabajaws you are not wrong
Hrrm. Man sees a dark alley. Shines a light, can’t see the end. Man walks away, afraid. Man walks by the same alley in the daytime, doesn’t shine a light, isn’t afraid. Punchline: Man throws his light away.
Funny joke.
Absolutely
Schwarzwald isn't an incel
Schwarzwald reminds me of something a certain 'My Life as a Teenage Robot' villain swore: *"I will liberate the Earth, even if I must destroy it to do so!"* but with Schwarzwald, it's more: *"I will make Humanity seek the truth, even if I must kill them all to do so!"*
A bit like Scarecrow
5 o'clock get call....
I always thought that "BIg O" was a "What if DIsneyland went horribly wrong?", and that the people within the "City of Amnesia" were Disney employees.
DSWynne tell me more about your idea
DSWynne What would Dorothy be, since she is an android?
@@NathanWerewuff an Animatronic attraction
Shame they altered the whole thing so only Paradigm existed.
Like west world
6:52 This was the ultimate clue. The world is a stage. Memories were imagination the entire time. Or should I say previous drafts of Angel's script she used to help with a traumatic memory of "having her wings clipped" (Likely a rape given how her two major characterizations throughout the series oscillated between a sexual energy between her and Roger, and vulnerability when dealing with most everybody else)
This is why we came across a Dorothy that was written to have a far darker relationship with Roger. It's also why Roger later remembers dying during a great mega-deus war, sees multiple versions of himself being created as if in a factory and has hallucinations of being a different character in "Roger the wanderer"
The Big O was the final draft for "the city of amnesia" where Angel planted herself in a subconscious bid to help manage difficult memories of a traumatic personal event.
We come to see how the characters she wrote dealt with the prospect of forgetting the past and as such helped her come to terms with her own great burden
See rogers final scene where he made his argument to live on regardless of the past, and his metaphorical hand on Angel's shoulder as she sat in the director's chair over watching the show
The negotiator did his job and Angel came to terms with her feelings
Which neatly ties into each arc ending with either "No side" resolving things, or "We have come to terms" and all.
👏👏👏👏👏
There's something utterly delightful watching a conspiracy realise he was RIGHT the whole time in a show about mysteries.
The moment at 3:01 is funny. Schwarzwald running around like a kid that got a new toy.
Cracks me up every time.
You know how in some shows, like House, they occasionally spend an episode focusing on one of the side characters.
It would be friggin awesome if Schwarzwald had an episode all to himself.
Word!
+ The Dawg he kinda did if you count the first appearence of big duo, Hell the fact that he has such a lasting presents in the show AFTER HIS DEATH speaks more volume. I believe the writters purposely never gave him his own episode to give him that edge of mystery he represents.
+The Dawg Well he did have a lot of focus in The Enemy is Another Big and Leviathan. Or are you asking for further exploration of his origins and motivations?
You know I didn't even see this comment when I got it... To explain further, I want an episode wherein the camera crew follows him around for the entire time. He's the one whose head we're inside for 30 minutes, listening to his motivations and his plans.
I think you could squeeze a ton of characterization and possible history of the world from his mind, even in such a small time slot. I'd even bet that he knows more about the rest of the cast than he ever lets on so we could get some juicy secrets as well.
I'll reference House again just to get my point across. I want an episode like this-
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilson_(House_episode)
-[09292018:2238]-
Perhaps there is a fan fiction out there reserve for Schwarzwald.
I feel that Schwarzwald could fit, even if a little out of place, in a Lovecraftian story.
Was just thinking that myself, fits nicely with the whole driven crazy finding the truth.
Big O has some lovecraft themes in it
Oh the funny thing is that Big O always had deep Lovecraftian roots beneath the surface. The script writer Chiaki J. Konaka considers himself a "Cthulhu Mythos writer."
Schwarzwald is one of the few of us mortals who probably could look upon a Great Old One or Outer God in their true enormity without going totally mad. The fact that he's already at least a little mad probably helps.
he realized that there was never a time before 40 years ago as the entire world is just a simulation and its bound to be reset and hes angry other people are so complaisant that they cant see the truth
I always thought big 0 season 2 was a metaphor for a production stuck in development hell. Schwartzweld is the most competent man on the team and the voice of reason trying to pull the production together, but in the end the result is so far beyond salvation that the only thing that can be done is to scrap it abd start again. The tomatoes were the talent pool, and the rodger smith army are all the actors they burned through. Angel and the old man are the director and produce respectively.
This makes so much sense!!!!!
I like that the ending was ambiguous as hell. Seeing so many peoples interpretations, this is truly art.
I never realized it until I got older and revisited the whole series, but Schwarzwald is a character I can actually identify with. I actually have the same beliefs he has (especially with society.)
Other than killing a ton of people with masquerade masks, right?
@PRIMEVAL Music Obviously not that part.
@@JohnSWeekley sure lol char is relatable in Char's counterattack ua-cam.com/video/ourB80IQEes/v-deo.html and Dakar ua-cam.com/video/aYO35_7Rm8U/v-deo.html
but we can avoid his ephebophilia lol 18 too old a la char's deleted affair.
@@JohnSWeekley those people weren't real
At 14, I got this guy so much. Now I'm 30
Schwartzwald figured out they are all android actors. Notice he always had a half robot looking face when his face was covered you could see his robotic eye. . Then remember what speakeasy guy says at the beginning of the last episode. Roger the wanderer, he for some reason feels that Angel is making him act out a role and he jokes what the next script will be.
And I could point out more things, vut fast forward to the last episode. Roger sinking in the sea, and what does he see, a bright light, a series of “memories”, and what is shown? Multiple Roger Smith androids being mass produced and Roger shouts “No!!” as he begins to realize the truth.
Anyways, yeah. It is a stage Angel seems to be making a novel and in Angel’s world they can setup simulated realities with android things (what Roger and basically everyone in this show was, they just were meant not to know).
When the world is disappearing at the ending, because of big venus aka angel I believe this is because she keeps deleting her progress in her story and wanting to start over, and that is what Roger is there to negotiate for on behalf of old man Rosewater and he pleads with Angel to let them stay the way they are and not erase everything again as she was already actively doing. Best way I can explain it in this comment, anyways enjoy this mega spoiler aka explanation of the story behind the events of this show. Oh and the book itself that “Big O” takes place within is that Metropolis book old man Rosewater was holding the last time he is seen in the final episode.
“Angel is writing a novel and the reset of the world is her starting over again”
This was like the last little gear I needed for everything to click
@@lucidlullaby894 c:
The whole "simulated reality"/"Truman Show" thing going on with Paradigm City and Angel, I get. I also basically understand that _everyone_ is essentially an android "actor" playing parts "cast by God"; the only exceptions being Angel - an avatar for the real Angel to view her work from inside -and _maybe_ Roger.
What I _don't_ understand is Schwarzwald being dead for the entire show after episode 4, yet still able to interact physically with the world - things like the burning mask party and piloting Big Duo. Conceivably, it's just another android: That instead of a Michael Seebach-android-turned-Schwarzwald, it's just a Schwarzwald android. But then, why would Angel - the literal "god" of the "world" - specifically call out the fact that _Schwarzwald_ had been dead? It's just sort of brushed off with Roger ruminating on whether or not "Michael Seebach" is still wandering the city through the idea that his insane passion allowed him to exist as a concept, not really a "person", long after his body had disintegrated; still searching for "the truth" - whatever that may be, since it's implied that the _main_ truth is something he already knows and has conveyed to Roger.
This has bugged the hell out of me for decades at this point. It just comes creeping back every few years and burrows into my head and I can't shake it. And on top of that, there simply isn't a lot of "The Big O" theorycrafting anywhere, as most of the story-behind-the-story is able to be gleaned from the show itself on its own.
Schwarzwald's seemingly impossible existence notwithstanding. It is never explained, just brushed aside as something that should make sense, but ultimately makes the _least_ amount of sense in a story that takes the phrase "all the world's a stage" _literally._
Nice idea, but the “glass eye” is just a lens of some kind. You see it broken and his flesh eye underneath in the archetype episode when he falls off as the archetype wakes up.
@@ojisankusai Angel, as the author, might have revised the script to having Schwarzwald have been dead by that point. But by that point, Roger had already interacted with Schwarzwald. Or the body of Michael Seebach that was discovered was from an earlier draft, perhaps one in which the figure of Schwarzwald was an outsider to Paradigm using the identity of the dead reporter to conceal the existence of the outsiders. There isn't a clear sign (to me) of if 'revisions' to the draft require a complete reset, or if editing can happen in 'real time' without effecting the memories of the cast. Or potentially, as The Negotiator, Roger Smith is so key to the script that his scenes are rarely looked over to fix the inconsistencies. (Being he is in so many scenes, artifacts of earlier drafts are more likely to be left behind.) Said artifacts are Memories to Roger after all.
Lets just say that if what happened 40 years ago did not exist, man would still be a creature that fears the dark. Fear comes from not knowing. He then averts his eyes from that fear and acts as if he never had any memories of his life, of his history; the very beginning. Do you think man can survive cut off from his memories of the past? He having no idea how long he has been there, of where he is from or what he is connected to? I have lived my life as a newspaper reporter. I uncover the truth and write my articles, but then i learned all too well that a mere reporter can never get to the truth of this city. It is merely impossible, and it is unsure. no one here is even interested in learning the truth. A truth that must be known. But I want to know!! I want to learn what must be known! It wasn't just the people of this city who lost their memory 40 years ago. The foreigners who sleep underground who came here searching for fragments of memories have lost as well.
Even without the events of 40 years ago, i think man would still be a creature that fears the dark. He does not face that fear. He averts his eyes from it and acts as if he never had any memories of his history. But... 40 years can be both a brief time and a long time. Man's fear has withered, and even time tries to wither the desire to know the truth. Is t a crime to try and learn the truth? Is it a sin to search for those things which you fear? My purpose in this world is knowledge and the dissemination of knowledge of it, and it is I who is to restore the fruits of my labors to the entire world. Fear. It is something vital to us puny creatures. The instant man stops fearing is the instant the species will reach a dead end, only to sink to pitiable lows, only to sit and wait apathetically for extinction. WAKE UP! DON'T BE AFRAID OF KNOWLEDGE! Humans who loose the capacity to think become creatures who's existence has no value. THINK, you humans who humans who are split between two worlds... unless you want the gulf between humans to expand into oblivion! YOU MUST THINK!
Don't you find it odd that there is only one man in this whole city who has the desire to pursue the truth? You poor souls, who fear the darkness and the deep, when you suppress that fear you will be able to get closer to the truth. There is but one truth. If you avert your eyes from it you will always remain nothing more than a puppet. In the words of me(schwartzwald) who is closest to the truth: Imagination and memory are but one thing which for diverse considerations have diverse names!
Foolish denizens of paradigm city, so long as you exist together, continue to live your lives together and share in your mass illusion a single dragon will be born there. Yes! That ancient mechanical dragon is a mirror of none other than yourselves, you fools! The anxiety within you has no outlet! It has no past, and no future! Each persons jealousies, their desires, their fears... alone, each may be a small part, but together they become an enormous void that will take shape.
Truth, those who seek it out unknowingly become obsessed with this grand illusion that they are able to control this world. This tiny world. The incomplete book of gordon rosewaters written in his younger days depicts the final days of humanity. And the foolish humans who use the power of God. The memories are here, negotiator.
The giants who formed this world into its sensual existence and now seem to live in it in chains are in truth the causes of its life and the sources of all activity, but the chains are the source of cunning and weak and tamed minds, which have power to resist energy. I will have the true memories in my possession. All this time i was mistaken, but it won't be long now, for i realize what those memories really are! Paradigm city... a grand ostentatious stage... and above it, secretly looking down at the folly of human blunders, were not expecting the comforting presence of gods, but only this abandoned equipment. This is a comedy! That which i was searching for... the true memories... they were... *end transmission*
Michael McConnohie was excellent at everything he did. When you heard him in anything, you knew he was going to get it done. I’m sad he retired, but it was his choice.
A great example of how great english dub can be! Amazing show.
you missed a speech when his big walks off without him missing its head and arm
Do we control them, or do they control us, Roger Smith?
+Hiei2k7 yerp that one
11:14 "That's not the case with you!"
"YE GUILTY"
best moment
I love that moment, there he basically told Gabriel even Rodger Smith had more his respect than the man who couldn't decide who he wanted to be. At least puppet or not Rodger Smith was able to come to a truth. Not ride the fence.
@@Tellos Yep, and l love it. Roger was/is a man who seeks answers, like himself, even if its a hard truth. He respected him and his goals
I loved this show and its philosophy, plot and characters.
Schwarzwald is my Spirit Animal.
In retrospect so many years later, I think Schwarzwald is on the edge of achieving CHIM.
Truly
Personally, I find the "city is a stage" ending to be symbolic.
What does anyone else think?
***** Wouldn't surprise me.
It's not just a stage, it's a cage. Angel's cage to be specific. A prison within her own mind.
Definitely influences of Shakespear there, but there are absolutely allusions to Plato's Allegory of the Cave and symbolic use of the Biblical revelations with Big O acting as the most recent incarnation of the Behemoth, Big Duo as Ziz, and Big Fau as Leviathan. Angel herself is the fallen angel at the end of all things. It is a very interesting show philosophically!
Personally, I think it was just the writers trying to make something vague, that sounded interesting and mysterious, but probably isn’t. I always preferred the first season to second season, it seemed to be going in a very interesting direction, but I was ultimately let down by s2. Still, the series is one of my childhood favorites
acceptance of the truth
“This is a comedy” has been my catchphrase since i picked it up from schwarzwald. It sums up the Big O world and the real world comfortably...........................
I once had a dream that I completely figured out everything from Big O. All symbolism, all meaning, all answers and... it blew my mind. Unfortunately however, it was a dream and as I awoke I became aware that I was losing all the answers until it was all gone. That said, it filled me with hope and the assurance that there ARE answers to all the questions.
Of all the villians in Big O, Schwarzwald is probably the most fascinating to me. Learning the truth, like, the honest to god truth about reality can drive a man mad. He saw through the veil and was permanently transformed by it. His name, translated to Black Forest, is a place with a rich history surrounded in mystery and believed to be steeped in the mystical.
Plus I like his design. His whole thing feels like it be at home in Lovecrafts universe.
Something I've noticed long ago:
"Act [Episode] 17: Leviathan."
Leviathan has the number 17 on it's chest-plate (seen at 8:23).
I noticed that years ago
Schwarzwald also quotes Thomas Hobbes' book, Leviathan, in the speech.
"THEY WERE..."
"The true memories... THEY WERE ALL LIES"
Nothing happened 40 years ago. 40 years ago, everyone was wondering what happened 40 years ago, and so on. It finds it's explaination in Gordon Rosewater's infamous quote "These tomatoes are reproduced synthetically, with only the memories of the flavorful original. If we keep repeating the process, this fruit will eventually become the real thing"
This is to say that Paradigm city, and all those in it, are merely copies from a time before a real event that basically destroyed humanity. The people created, written into the grand storybook of Metropolis that is Paradigm City, have no memories of their own, such as Roger Smith, Angel Rosewater and even Gordon Rosewater... their memories are from other people... the ruins deep beneath paradigm are countless failed Paradigms that have been buried by the new Paradigm above them. Trying to find a way to recreate the world so it can continue; the world's in an infinite loop of rewrites never given a chance to play itself out... a director that's constantly revising the script, but can't seem to make it work.
I feel like saying more but it's late where I am, and my brain wants a break.
The theories on this show are fascinating: you should check out kiserai.net/bigo/ .
so,Big O plagiarized Matrix ?
the matrix didn't come up with the concept intitially. "brain in a jar simulation" is an ancient concept given many different names. The most famous and most common one people are familiar with is the concept of reincarnation(having the ability to try again infinite times until you live the perfect life and achieve nirvana)
But Roger and Angel weren't tomatoes.
Cameron Kujas everyone was a tomato
This and the dialog before every outlaw star episode are amazing
He gave some of the greatest speeches
Ahh Schwarzwald. The one closest to the truth. Do you think he figured out that all the world is a stage before trying to destroy the city?
I think he came to recognize, even at the very "start," that the city was not "real" in a fundamental level, that it was a formula whose pre-determined answer could not be arrived at within it's own calculations - that there was something, some element, some variable, that he could not see.
Initially, he believed this unknown element was part of the memories lost 40 years ago, and as "He Who Searches for Truth", he sought out those answers. That, ultimately, the world was, itself, artificial, was probably of no surprise to him by the end - it is the further truth, the one he died before uttering, which is the true signifier of his history and future. If he had had that truth, he could have stood before the beast that had lost its wings, instead of Roger.
I think Schwarzwald was always a long dead ghost whose role was tempt the citizens into searching for the truth instead of going about their lives. His very name means "black forest" and refers to a German forest that has been infamous for ghost haunting ever since romans first discovered the place. Considering that all the other citizens were just phantoms pretending to be real in Angel's dream I guess that makse Schwarzwald a ghost tempting other ghosts to wake up into the nothing-ness void.
@@TheTongueofRa interesting and yeah I subtly try to awaken people. We're at a similar point with how social media relatively 40 months ago creates such a mess and double life, with people who need to make only themselves manner with poor inhibitions and social skills.
There's some good, but it helps to see which people need to remind you they're oppressed while having more than you. Especially when we have cancel culture these days, and frameworks of how violence happens (usually people know each other and it escalates terribly, especially in the house if she strikes first).
Andrew Turner read my comments to better understand.
@@japo3867 I've come to consider what he said just before hitting the light to be roughly "This is a comedy-" because viewed from a distance, his entire life is funny, while viewed from up close it's tragic. "-because I was never meant to do anything else." He figured out, only at the end, that he wasn't the one intended to discover the truth and negotiate with the Director, just to direct the right person for the job to it. Given his tone of voice, I think he saw the comedy in it. Comedy is a tragedy the audience is distant from, after all.
I love this show and I always will. It's like if David Lynch did the outline for a giant mech anime.
This was my senior quote in high school: "There is but one truth, if you avert your eyes from it, you will always remain nothing more than a mere puppet"
They missed up the wording on the printing, but the message remained the same.
When that musically score for "the stoning" hits, I am only marginally less happy than when I hear the voice of God.
Good work was done by that team.
I loved the mystery and pondering of this anime
I wish the movie for big o happened as promised
A movie ?
You did see dragon Ball evolution right?
douglas fern it still could and should.
Schwarzwald one of my favorites in this anime
He's number one in my list
Listening to this somehow helps put me into a focused,productive work mode. Incidentally that also coincides with " paranoid conspiracy theory " mode... i'd better get myself a dark basement with one light bulb and a typewriter.
I miss this show wish it would come back
TheGundamtitans1 it's possible that if FLCL 2 does well it might if we let it be known
the story is done
@@coreydeluna5258 It's really not, we were left at a cliffhanger at best, and at episode 1 at worst, and most of the plot wasn't solved in the ending
@@L1z43vr It goes in a loop. Everything will happen again from first to last episode.
@@2Addictive Uhm... Not really? At the last episode, we see that Angel and Dorothy are on the street when Roger's driving. And if the scripts for the episode can be used for some theory-making, Angel also appeared in the Dorothy negotiation in this "new" timeline
Jesus thank you great craftsmanship
Years later we have Shin Mazinger Zero which has a similar instance...
Mazinger Z has gotten sentient enough to be aware of the one loose end in its story. That being the End of Z which is the start of Great Mazinger.
The show must go on
the true memories they where...lies
Schwarzwald embodies the most Lovecraftian side of this show.
leviathan was my favorite mech, glad it was i a schwarzwald ep.
This is my favorite take of Gnosticism Angel being Sophia.
Some complain about his ending but he'd given everything to understand the world and the answer was laughable. He had wasted his existence chasing a lie within a lie. There was no truth to be found.
The truth was this: 40 years ago, THIS happened. And then everyone had their memory wiped. They are all androids with minimal human mimicry. They keep forgetting
Interesting
An endless loop.
Like an AI on a constant sub routine
Did no one think the major absence of children wasn't a red flag? We see some. But none claim to have parents. "Uncles" "grandpa"
The true memories are the friends we made along the way
“All the world’s a stage”
The only one who really escaped the allegory of the cave and saw things for what they were, all on his own.
Here’s to you, Schwarzwald.
Black Forest.
wonder what he looks like without them wraps
We never see. But i think he is supposed to be burned beyond recognition
He has allot of cuts after finding archotype a megadus skeleton
Schearzwald was red pilled.
he is the most WOKE anime villain of all time
He became the pill!
The dub *nailed* his voice, so emotional
I wonder how many people recognize William Blake's "The Marriage of Heaven and Hell" there as he's getting 'et. If there's one thing you can count on in something written by Chiaki Konaka, it's film and literary references.
I am 29 years old and after rewatching this series a 4th tine I still don't fully understand it.
"Imagination and memory are but one thing which for diverse considerations have diverse names"
I'm still not entirely sure what is meant here. That people create memories when there are no relevant ones?
memories by their very nature is not the past, at best its a murky and fallible representation of the past that with time become less and less accurate. the past is gone and the only thing that matters is the present and the future. a lot of what memories are of what we make them, these are some of the general themes of the show too
They are but different names for proving we exist.
One thing that is pretty cool about the word monster is the etymology which describes the monster as a sign of something to come. The big megadeus’s are associated with the 3 biblical monsters, and often does brought up as the cause of event 40 years ago. When big Venus shows up, it is basically the herald for angel’s will.
My favorite character.
The ancient mechanical dragon is the human collective consciousness? But full of negative emotions/thoughts?
The mechanical dragon is only a reflection of the citizens of paradigm refusing to think for themselves. Both the citizens and the dragon are just aimlessly wandering through their lives while doing nothing to break the cycle.
If you liked Big O then go read 1984 or watch the film.
What do you mean? there was no movie
Film noir
@@cunningsmile4166 i don't think it should be a live action adapted
Damn it I want Season 3 to happen asap! If flcl could get a sequel why not Big O?!
Its been 16 years
@@Shadows-RC in the new world, Big O is not there. Roger doesnt have the watch
I'd like a prequel
@@Shadows-RC The lack of interest from Japan was a factor even in Season 1, but the show was so popular over in the states that a second season was produced specifically by Adult Swim, regardless of the Japanese following. Coincidentally, it was the creators intention to have something of a global following even if it bombed domestically in Japan.
I do agree with why they can't have a Season 3 though
@@cunningsmile4166 Uhm... How do you know that? No, seriously, Roger's wrist is covered, and we don't see a reflection, at best you could say it's ambiguous, because we don't really know if he has the watch, but even so, what does it matter if he doesn't have the watch? You don't need a watch to call upon a Megadeus
Absolutely love that the “satellite” that fell was actually a stage light.
My interpretation of Paradigm City, would be closer to "The Good Place" except the "Architect" Angel doesn't know it, as the show is filled with afterlife overtures.
That's a pretty good idea
What he was searching for, the true memories, were Angel's memories. The fact that she was the director of the simulated show in which they all lived. The people of Paradigm City didn't lose their memories 40 years ago. They never had memories to begin with. All they ever had were the roles that they were given to play by Angel, even Schwarzwald. Their whole world was a complete farce, possibly based on a TV show from her real world, a joke.
Honestly this is all probably a result of the writer of the show getting frustrated with audiences not getting the point of the first season. Ultimately the story was never meant to be about the mystery of how Paradigm came to be. It was just meant to serves a setting for Roger's adventures, a stage if you will (which is why there isn't much of an ongoing plot or any deep delving into the mystery in season 1). But the writer got annoyed with audiences for not understanding that and made it more literal when he was tasked with making a second season.
Man, with all this setup, it's such a shame there wasn't a 3rd season because it just goes into another loop...probably fault of the director for JJ Abrahms-ing up with so much build up and mystery but no real planned payoff...sex without the climax.
they planned a third season (originally S2 was a lot longer, but they cut it in half), but didn't get the funding. Almost happened with S1 until CN got involved.
A true Lovecraftian protagonist
A dark version of the Truman Show
03:23 "FEAR!"
04:00 "Wake up, DON'T be AFRAID of knowledge."
I konw what he's trying to say, but it's really sending a mixed message if you put it like that.
Be afraid of knowledge, for it's the only way to see that it's real. That's what I took from it.
Fear is what keeps humans from doing things that could destroy us but also never forget of our memories never fear the knowledge of our mistakes to prevent it from happening again because when people accept things as they are and choose to ignore the reality of things then one day all that fear they had will disappear and it will happen all over again
SilverDiamond well the reality is they’re all robots acting out the script to a movie or book, something like that.
He's saying that we fear the unknown, and that we fear our destruction and the meaninglessness of the universe, and that is good--without those fears, how will we learn, survive, and find satisfaction?
Yet some when faced with those fears turn inward. They ignore reality and choose to believe in illusions, acting as sheep without true self-actualization. They accept that they will never know what happened forty years ago and that they will always be controlled by the rich and powerful, and pretend that they are satisfied with that. But in a city without memories, why are the rich rich? How did the situation come about? It emerged from nowhere, and that is why Paradigm encourages people to bury the past.
I know what you're getting at, but no his assesment/conclusion makes sense, but like so many other explainations and speeches I've seen in fiction, it skips over the important bits and leaves yourself to ponder the exact course of this equation/calculation. It's like you took Yoda's speech about Fear, yet formulated it like this:" Fear is the source and beginning emotion for all siths. It leads to Suffering" . If you know the quote, you know I just left out the most iconic part that helps weave it together.
So what Schwarzwald is evidently trying to say is that fear is important in order to realize and see and face your weaknesses and that you need Knowledge to overcome it, but let's get deeper. He himselfs says at the beginning that Fear concerns mostly the unkown, the un-explainable, every form of uncertaintity and non-calcucable form of risk, whether it's rational/reasonable or not.
That's also why he keeps talking about the Darkness being a symbol of instinctual primal Human fear, bc it represents all of these factors, not being able to accurately see and perceive what's going on around you etc. Hell, this even plays into his name of Schwarz-wald, which is German for Black forest, so another paralell to fairytale like depictions and symbolic elements of fear.
So now to the second part. He's not a fear-monger, the opposite actually, he wants to unveal the truth, bc unless you know what even the nature and facts are behind a problem, danger or in this case mystery/enigma, there's no way to properly deal with it. Knowledge is Power, it is afterall also how Mankind has managed to come so far and stand atop of the Foodchain/pyramid. Asking questions, looking for parameters and trying to measure, scale and quantify relevant factors and the like in order to craft theories, making hypothesis and then after calculating odds or even determining a formula or system behind the process or yet unknown phenomena, is exactly how Science has operated and continued marching forward and evolved.
However most humans prefer to avert their eyes from these facts or even truths and instead practise and indulge in the 8th Sin, I consider to be the most prevalent and deadly nowadays, despite the church or other religions not painting it as such ===>
IGNORANCE (mental sloth/pride, so to say)
So here you have my interpretation of Schwarzwald and also view on a lot of Human society in general.
Although he had his differences with Schwarzwald, Roger seemed genuinely sad of his death. At the end of the day Roger knew and pitied Schwarzwald as just a man that was driven insane from finding and searching for the truth.
Big O is the story of an author that imagined themselves inside an incomplete creation and then ad libed scenarios until she was about to destroy it but in the end her creation convinced her to redo the story. swartzwalde knew he was a character in a book
He speaks as though he's trying to explain colour to a blind man.
Schwarzwald's monologues were a cool thing in the series. Kind of reminds me of how Treize, Une & Zechs (& Heero & Relena a few times too I think) tried doing them in Gundam W, except those mostly sucked. Schwarzwald's were actually good, or maybe it's just because he had 'The Stoning' as a musical backdrop to them. I noticed in the comments a lot of people note the Scarecrow/Joker look, but I always thought he was more Mythos inspired. Hastur in particular. Hastur is said to influence writers, painters, and so on. A certain writer like Angel, maybe? He's also associated with 'The King in Yellow' a mysterious being dressed often in yellow rags with a pointy head. And also with, most telling of all, 'The Phantom of TRUTH', another zombie that goes around asking people if they've seen 'the yellow sign?' I see his changing role in the story as a manifestation of Angel Rosewater falling under the influence of Hastur and her own fall/resistance to madness. Schwarzwald started as a character/reporter named Michael Seaboach, but by this iteration of her tale, she seems unsure of if he was even a real character to begin with. He becomes a ghost, a literal Phantom of Truth.
WAKE UP! DON'T BE AFRAID OF KNOWLEDGE!
this show was excellent 😊
Think, people of Paradigm City, think! You believe just because you don't have memories of the past means it doesn't exist?
I always tell people Big O is a masterpiece of an anime, but don't watch it. Don't invest in the meaning of it. Not because it isn't great but because you will find no happinness in the endless search for closure. This anime will linger in your conscience unsolved and up to your interpretation. A silent torture in itself if you desire the typical anime wrap up. But beautiful nonetheless.
The true memories..
..were a script.
Imagination and Memory are but one thing, which for diverse considerations have diverse names!
For those who.want an even bigger incentive to watch this anime... The Nostalgia Critic saw The Big O when it used to air on Toonami.
That's not really much of an incentive. Someone on the Internet watched it, ergo you should watch it? Doug Walker in particular is not an entertaining individual, let alone someone I can respect or value his opinions. The only time he even pops up in my life, is when he does something dumb, like completly miss the mark on the wall. Or when his god awful movies are reviewed by more interesting internet personalities.
The anime itself is brilliant, I expect that pretty much anyone watching this video already watched it and wanted to revisit Schwarzwald's speeches without rewatching the whole series.
Oh yeah I saw the toonami video month
As did i
These quotes could open your eyes and mind if you just listen... speaks volumes how years and years and we bearly understand that some times you need shut up and listen and learn... the world and more is there for you... hide the truth in plain sight.... where all devided but where all one!!
A cross between Roschach and Darkman
Big O is a telling of the King in Yellow when viewed from Schwartzwald's perspective. Truth is always a horror story when you look for the meaning of society.
Schwarzwald had the right idea about an unsolvable mystery. Don't look for evidence of the mystery itself, look at the nature of the people around the mystery. A lot of the times the issue with the mystery is a fundamental misunderstanding while formulating of the question of the mystery. At that point you only need to look at the people asking the question to understand the reality.
One who is able to arrive at one Truth... What does he mean by that?
he means that anyone who can see the truth for what it is has woken up to the reality of paradigm city truly represents and can think for themselves and decide which future is the correct path to follow. which this goes above and beyond what path Angel has laid out for them and is an anomaly in her programing.
the world of paradigm city is not real, everyone is a program in a simulated reality. there are no memories prior to 40 years ago bc there is no 40 years ago, it never existed. he realized that he was in a show and that he was just a character in it and that the cycle is just gonna start over like it had many times prior. the end of the series shows roger the negotiator negotiation to let people keep their memories this reboot and to let them live their own lives outside of fate or destiny. something that they were denied. AI that becomes indistinguishable from humans, are they not human in a way themselves! we see this same theme repeated over the series a couple of times like with the relationship of androids to humans, and to clones (the tomatoes) with humans. and dont they have a right to live their lives how they chose! not just be actors in some script (angel)
"come to terms"
Truth is different for every individual. That's what I believe the subliminal messages is in this show.
Looking at all the analytical comments I think Schwarzwald is an aberrant/rogue element in Angel's program/simulation. Roger is supposed to be Angel's knight(dark knight, batman) within the simulation meant to be the hero and snuff out such aberrations. Unfortunately by the end Roger always figures out the truth. This Schwarzwald has a pyrrhic victory. Because although the truth has been exposed, Angel decides to reset the simulation and redo everything.
Good Edit.
Not sure if I'm wrong....But I tell ya, if Schwarzwald could break the forth wall, this show could be a way to keep him from spoilers on the purpose behind the so-called stage.....
Case and point....
13:13 - 13:20
Dangerously redpilled.