There are some real gold nuggets in this video that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else from the dozen other sag videos i've watched over the years... like: it's ok to leave your settings alone if you know you like them when testing sag... The markings on a RS shock won't be true if the stroke is changed.
According to Pivot they say this to set sag for the shock: *_While standing on the pedals, sit down hard into the saddle to cycle the suspension well into the stroke. This will ensure the bike comes to rest at the natural sag setting with the rider in the saddle._* When I follow this I get consistent readings no troubles at all. However, they mention nothing on the fork section, and so many people try to teach that you should be in a standing position while trying to do the same upfront on the forks. This is where I wish things could be cleared up because if I try that approach on the fork I get inaccurate and inconsistent readings for the sag that are just way too high to be believeable even when I try to be as cautious as possible. I have all compression *_and_* rebound settings in fully open front to back before I start, as recommended. If I try to measure sag exactly the same way on the fork as with the recommended approach for the shock, I all of a sudden get consistent readings time and time again, and the numbers also feel correct. This is why I wonder why it has to be so hard to get this right from the manufacturers when I see so many throw out information that just make you confused. The other thing are the rebound and compression knobs on shocks and forks that often can be very hard to understand what is actually the full open or full closed. I say that because on my Fox Float X shock the compression knob has no really defined clicks so I have to just go by the written numbers on the side. Then on the very same shock on the rebound knob, it actually has very defined clicks, but here's where things get weird. The last written number is 12 but the dial itself actually has 2 defined clicks after that where I apply no more force than any other previous click, and I've never seen or heard anything mention of that. I've heard that there can be 1/2 click extra after full closed that actually isn't really there, but no mention of 2 extra clicks past the full open. The only way I noticed is that the amount of clicks from what I thought was full open did not add up to full closed. All of a sudden the shock feels way better given I must have been riding 2 clicks faster rebound than I should've had, and how the hell should I know. I do not make these things, and there's too much information missing in general on this topic that you just have the stumble your way into and somehow figure out as you go along. And on the fork side from Fox it states that: *_Based on our research and feedback we have found that running two or three rows up the chart will give most riders in most conditions a more balanced feeling suspension._* Well, that's very good to know, but on that bombshell it would be very good to know if I should then apply rebound and compressions settings according to a lighter rider as I would according to recommended settings run a PSI for a lighter rider. It does say that lower PSI means you should have a faster rebound, but it doesn't say if it also applies to a lower PSI *_BUT_* at a higher weight. They also say nothing about if you should still try to aim for 20% sag in the front or if you should just screw that if you try to aim for a more balanced feel given I don't exactly ride Red Bull Hardline stuff at all. If I bump 2 rows up the chart I end at 23.2% sag in the fork and it feels more correct. With 30% sag in the rear and now rebound and compression more dialed as well as the fork in 23.2% sag and more dialed it just feels way better than I've felt it before. Personally I just feel frustrated that people who know these things leave so much of this info out of explanations as if I should just automatically know. I need experience before I can know and given I don't make suspension I have to get correct info from the one's who do. There's a lot of bad and lacking explanation in the industry as a whole, just look at all the brake bleeding videos that still pops up here and there, like what the hell is this mess. Just hand out enough of the correct way to do it, and there wouldn't need to be so much confusion. Anyhow, that's it for now...
Actually a good video on sag. I had an interesting situation with my trail bike that I rode an enduro race on recently. It was at a bike park that was so steep I had to run more sag and an extra token. This was actually completely to slacken my bike and allow more weight bias to go towards the back. The tokens to stop bottom out at lower spring rate. I’m interested to know if the vivid is a better shock on Santa Cruz bikes due to the vpp
I have a TB4 and have the same issue. What I did is take a firm piece of thin cardboard and measure the sag distance I want (13.5mm for example) and cut a piece longer than that (say 30mm) and then I cut out a little notch in the side of the cardboard at my desired sag. The notch is where the o-ring will sit if my sag is set right (13.5mm in my example). I set my sag and then measure with the cardboard piece by putting one edge against the seal and seeing if the o-ring fits in my little notch. Hard to explain fully without a pic but hope this helps!
I’m a simple guy…I see Santa Cruz Bikes…I click.
simple guys unite
Me too pal 😂
santa cruz videos always have such a great vibe. nice one and now i'm going to check my sag
If you said to my mom that you need to check your sag she'd generously offer to tailor your pants so you don't lose them ...
Enjoy!
Garen. You did great.
I was thinking the same....he always does great. Love these guys
There are some real gold nuggets in this video that I haven't seen mentioned anywhere else from the dozen other sag videos i've watched over the years... like: it's ok to leave your settings alone if you know you like them when testing sag... The markings on a RS shock won't be true if the stroke is changed.
According to Pivot they say this to set sag for the shock: *_While standing on the pedals, sit down hard into the saddle to cycle the suspension well into the stroke. This will ensure the bike comes to rest at the natural sag setting with the rider in the saddle._* When I follow this I get consistent readings no troubles at all.
However, they mention nothing on the fork section, and so many people try to teach that you should be in a standing position while trying to do the same upfront on the forks. This is where I wish things could be cleared up because if I try that approach on the fork I get inaccurate and inconsistent readings for the sag that are just way too high to be believeable even when I try to be as cautious as possible.
I have all compression *_and_* rebound settings in fully open front to back before I start, as recommended.
If I try to measure sag exactly the same way on the fork as with the recommended approach for the shock, I all of a sudden get consistent readings time and time again, and the numbers also feel correct. This is why I wonder why it has to be so hard to get this right from the manufacturers when I see so many throw out information that just make you confused.
The other thing are the rebound and compression knobs on shocks and forks that often can be very hard to understand what is actually the full open or full closed. I say that because on my Fox Float X shock the compression knob has no really defined clicks so I have to just go by the written numbers on the side. Then on the very same shock on the rebound knob, it actually has very defined clicks, but here's where things get weird. The last written number is 12 but the dial itself actually has 2 defined clicks after that where I apply no more force than any other previous click, and I've never seen or heard anything mention of that. I've heard that there can be 1/2 click extra after full closed that actually isn't really there, but no mention of 2 extra clicks past the full open.
The only way I noticed is that the amount of clicks from what I thought was full open did not add up to full closed. All of a sudden the shock feels way better given I must have been riding 2 clicks faster rebound than I should've had, and how the hell should I know. I do not make these things, and there's too much information missing in general on this topic that you just have the stumble your way into and somehow figure out as you go along.
And on the fork side from Fox it states that: *_Based on our research and feedback we have found that running two or three rows up the chart will give most riders in most conditions a more balanced feeling suspension._*
Well, that's very good to know, but on that bombshell it would be very good to know if I should then apply rebound and compressions settings according to a lighter rider as I would according to recommended settings run a PSI for a lighter rider. It does say that lower PSI means you should have a faster rebound, but it doesn't say if it also applies to a lower PSI *_BUT_* at a higher weight.
They also say nothing about if you should still try to aim for 20% sag in the front or if you should just screw that if you try to aim for a more balanced feel given I don't exactly ride Red Bull Hardline stuff at all. If I bump 2 rows up the chart I end at 23.2% sag in the fork and it feels more correct.
With 30% sag in the rear and now rebound and compression more dialed as well as the fork in 23.2% sag and more dialed it just feels way better than I've felt it before.
Personally I just feel frustrated that people who know these things leave so much of this info out of explanations as if I should just automatically know. I need experience before I can know and given I don't make suspension I have to get correct info from the one's who do. There's a lot of bad and lacking explanation in the industry as a whole, just look at all the brake bleeding videos that still pops up here and there, like what the hell is this mess. Just hand out enough of the correct way to do it, and there wouldn't need to be so much confusion.
Anyhow, that's it for now...
Great info. My wife has a Bronson on the way!
Great choice. Let us know how it goes. And hit up the website for set up guides, including detailed suspension settings.
Actually a good video on sag. I had an interesting situation with my trail bike that I rode an enduro race on recently.
It was at a bike park that was so steep I had to run more sag and an extra token. This was actually completely to slacken my bike and allow more weight bias to go towards the back. The tokens to stop bottom out at lower spring rate.
I’m interested to know if the vivid is a better shock on Santa Cruz bikes due to the vpp
Hey it’s my pal Garen
I prefer no sag for that roadbike feeling.
Chill vibes guys 😎
There's laid back and then there's this guy. Nice.
Is this applicable to hekler? Love my Santa Cruz btw
Yup, it's the same for all bikes. This provides the how and the model specific setup guides show the specific for settings.
ok primo pero ahora ves a una nomad 5 con un dhx 2 y explica como mides con muelle
Garen is the shi7, xoxox
Any tips setting sag on a Tallboy 4? The shock is tucked well away from view.
I have a TB4 and have the same issue. What I did is take a firm piece of thin cardboard and measure the sag distance I want (13.5mm for example) and cut a piece longer than that (say 30mm) and then I cut out a little notch in the side of the cardboard at my desired sag. The notch is where the o-ring will sit if my sag is set right (13.5mm in my example). I set my sag and then measure with the cardboard piece by putting one edge against the seal and seeing if the o-ring fits in my little notch. Hard to explain fully without a pic but hope this helps!
Can I drill a hole into my 2020 Hightower to see the sag indicator? 😂😂😂😂
Nope.
@@santacruzbicycles2841 Just kidding 😄
🙃