@Wirrling A reference to the "somebody toucha my spaghett" meme. It's from an old cartoon where a girl went inside the house of a bear family, ate their food and fell asleep in one of their beds. The papa bear was not amused.
@Pap DM I know it's pretty much ancient, but the cartoon that the meme is from is only... Moderately old. Pretty sure the original didn't have a facepalming bear with a terrible fake italian accent.
The funny thing about the "Tolkien elf" is that no one gets what they are. The movies did a pretty bad portrayal of what they are supposed to be, especially the mirkwood elves in the Hobbit trilogy. By reading deeper about them, they are more similar to the bosmer than to what peter jackson made them out to be ;)
Honestly, I use these videos to get mods and make builds that fit each races belief system. When I play as any race, I want to encapsulate what they believe not just pretend to. Thank you dude
@@thalmoragent9344 oh no... the Thalmor found me On a serious note, it really is more fun. That's the few crappy things about vanilla Skyrim, you don't really get to see the diverse cultures
@@mickobinsotosworth9759 100%! I absolutely love playing as Khajiit but there's not many options. For races like Altmer it makes sense cause great war or whatever but I really hope ES:6 includes better racial abilities and more diverse religions even if it's subtle details
So a single playthrough of yours is sorta like a journey of perspective, like changing the name of divines from one mod-list to another? I like to make Skyrim a land that have certain attraction for any visitor or inhabitant. Abit more generalised, but I like to have alot of characters inhabit the same worldspace, splitting the quests like there are an elite group of adventurers fighting (or partake) different evils. I don't feel like there's alot for a Bosmer mage, tho. There was a cutting room spell that allowed you to turn into a Skeewer, quite an awsome idea. Champion of Kynareth is a great mod, and I think it is well executed at that. It is supposedly Fromser based, but I guess it works out for Wood Elves too. There's also a dude that REALLY like the idea of Spriggan magic, I'm aching to check out how far he's come - but it is as far as I got with Bosmer additions.
@@scuttleflip8650 I like to make multiples of each of my Dragonborns. My current one I'm working on (she has a 12 page build I'm still editing) she was originally my oblivion Character that after the crisis got severe PTSD and chose to numb the pain with ale. In a drunken panic, she accidentally killed a begger she was friends with and then as things in Oblivion go, she joined the DB, fell in love with Lucian but we all know what happened to him and she was so hurt by the betrayal, she vowed to kill any deceptive person on sight (she doesn't see herself as a liar, only someone that hides truths). She then turned into a vampire then enter SKYRIM Sorry, I just really wanted to talk about her lol But yeah, I'm always changing my mod list (sucks when you're on Xbox) to fit whatever kinda Dragonborn I'm playing as
The Silvenar sounds like Lorkhan after his heart was ripped out. The world aiding him to follow the Green Lady would also support that. The Green Lady having hair of wind and rain would indicate Kynereth, furthering the ties.
@@georgemurdock7670 Rudimentary logic. Metaphysical concepts even irl go beyond the simple concept of black and white. Though it's a very deep rabbit hole to get lost into and I don't have a degree in Philosophy to give justice to my sentiments. Good first comment btw, I'm a Muslim so I got the reference immediately, gave me a chuckle too.
This was a wonderful watch. It makes me think, if the Altmer are so focused on the past and what they've lost in Aetherius, the Bosmer so focused on the present and what they have in Mundus, would it be fair to say the Dunmer are focused on the future and what they can gain at the end of the Psjic Endeavour?
Totally not. One of the reasons of the Aldmeri-Chimer split was the corruption of Aldmeri thought (which led to development of Altmeri philosophy), that is true, but followers of Veloth were more preoccupied on making the best of the situation they were in (which implies that said corruption is exactly their yearning for era of shapelessness which, mind you, nobody living at that point could've experienced, and it's highly likely that it didn't even happen because religion). Then Chimer culture after some flourishing completely collapsed and they became little more than primitive tribespeople. The turn into the Dunmer was caused by mass convertion into ALMSIVI and their philosophy seems to be very much self-centred and Mundus-focused (not counting Vivec but he's not a Dunmer and his teachings only focus on the now too). Meanwhile the Psijics follow the original Old Ways and are focused on protecting Mundus (but also the whole Aurbis, at least according to their beliefs, as suggested by two books in ESO) and keeping the balance between Padomai and Anu (they also introduce the concept of good and evil in the world where most philosophy is focused on change-stasis dychotomy, basically saying that when change is good then it should be stimulated and when bad-prevented). While the reason for their conflict with the High Elf authorities is very similar to that of the Chimer (hurr we should've stayed immaterial durr; in later eras hurrr let's destroy mundus durr), the philosophical and religious differences are huge. In fact Celarus specifically mentions in his Old Ways Boethiah as an example of a horrible mortal ascended to godhood (princehood specifically, but imo it's just a title and the daedra/aedra differences are philosophical at best and artificial at worst). PS By the time of Skyrim the Dunmer have suffered another, probably the worst so far, collapse and multiple dialogues present a situation where they don't really give a damn about any "higher thought" focusing on attempts to find a new framework.
@@Sk0lzky I mean, if the Altmer and some other Elves and even many Redguards want to leave Mundus, I don't see why they should be forced to be tied to a Realm they don't want to be in We even know that Auri-El and his influence of Time was what gave the form and natures/limitations to the other Spirits in the Dawn Era, so it's not like they'd be immaterial. As long as the Time God exists, they won't be Shapeless, immaterial spirits. They will still be able to "measure themselves" as its so eloquently put. They wouldn't be Shapeless, Auriel's power bled into the Aurbis as a new force, called time. And so with that, they'd probably be like how Daedra are in Oblivion, but rather, in Aetherius. They wouldn't be mortal, wouldn't need any food, or wouldn't get tired, etc. They'd be, well, the Anuic version of Daedra/Dremora, they'd be that while the Aedra would of course have their own realms in Aetherius they could be tied too, like Daedra tied to Oblivion realms they wish to return too
@@thalmoragent9344 it is believed that he did, we don't know it as a fact. It's the beauty of TES, the in-universe narratives which often come into conflict with one another (and sometimes with themselves >
I believe that "the ooze" is simply a cultural variation of the Ehlnofey, similar to, in my opinion, Aldmeris is simply Aetherius, prior to Mundus' creation. The Ooze may be simply that early beginning of Mundus where the realm was still poisonous to the Et'Ada, forcing some of them to die to stabilize the realm for habitation. The Ehlnofey, prior to creation, would have no physical forms. "Unfettered by lips and teeth". They would be a chaotic "ooze", with no form, no self, no personhood. Ever changing, ever shifting. It would be the sacrifice of Yffre and other Ehlnofey to become the Earthbones, which would allow the Ehlnofey to take a permanent physical form. This would allow the Old and Wandering Ehlnofey to settle down and decide on a form to take. Hence the Ooze becomes the Bosmer, and the Ehlnofey become the races of Nirn. The "Sundering of Old Aldmeris" was simply the creation of Mundus, and the door to Aetherius forever cut off from the Aldmer. It was not a place on Nirn. It wasn't a diaspora in the typical sense. It was the creation of Mundus, the Old Ehlnofey being trapped here, and forever diminishing into mortal forms, away from their Aetherial perfection.
I share your take on it. Nords meanwhile don't see Aetherius as a past lost, but as paradise to gain. Soverngarde, Far Shores and other human afterlifes are their mortal path back to Aetherius, which in my opinion is like a soul well, from which soul are reincarnated back to Nirn or achieve godhood, sainthood and stay in Aetherius back as the original spirits.
Bosmer are hell to fight against, even among their own people. There's one story of two Bosmeri tribes who went to war against each other. Tribe 1 knew that Tribe 2 was going to beat them, so before they were overrun, all the members of Tribe 1 drank slow acting poison. Tribe 2 advanced and killed Tribe 1, then when they sat down to eat the corpses of Tribe 1, they ingested the poison coursing through Tribe 1's veins, which killed them all
Scott, in your discussion of Arkay you focus on his funerary aspects, but traditional Bosmeri cannibalism doesn’t mean they don’t hold funerals or give honor to their people’s bones (see the Bone Orchard in Grahtwood). Additionally, accepting that the Green subsumes what enters it, the Bosmer would have received from the First and Second Cyrodilic Empires the command taught in the Cyrods’ chapels: “Arkay says: Honor the earth, its creatures, and the spirits, living and dead. Guard and tend the bounties of the mortal world, and do not profane the spirits of the dead.” It’s not surprising, imo, that the Bosmer would genuinely revere Arkay, and it’s noted that he’s invoked when solving violations of the Green Pact, as does his role as a sort of psychopomp. Arkay may judge the spirits of those accused of breaking the Green Pact (i.e., of not tending the bounties of the mortal world), and he may escort them to and from their punishment, and perhaps judge when their penance is satisfied-or hold the keys to their release. Thanks for the video and channel, always a pleasure to engage!
I love the variations in adherence to the Green Pact and Meat Mandate. It makes them more realistic since our world has lots of variety in how people follow the teachings within the same religion.
Reminds me of Kosher (which my partner keeps in a relatively relaxed manner). Some people don’t eat meat and dairy on the same day, others permit it at different meals. Some only buy meat from kosher butchers, or forbid wine brewed by gentiles. Some don’t keep kosher at all, or do so in a very relaxed way. It all depends.
The relationship between the Silvenar and Green Lady sounds remarkably similar to that of Shezarr and Kynareth. Someone without a heart and someone with connections to wind and rain becoming lovers? I dunno man...
I'm just watching this video so I can impress the Bosmer chick at my local tavern. Gonna kill a homeless man and bring his corpse so we can eat him together
Ok, so if I may, this is my personal take on Y'ffre's view on Mundus; It's said that he had sacrificed himself so that the world would not die, after all they had put into it. I believe that what happened was that Y'ffre, while maybe not liking Lorkhan for his lies, he didn't exactly hate Mundus. He liked the Project, similar to Magnus who was also very invested into it. But Magnus was afraid, and understandably, so he fled, no longer taking part in Mundus except blessing magicka upon Nirn. Y'ffre however, while perhaps not too happy with Lorkhan, was still invested into Mundus. And so that Auriel and the other Aldmeri Gods that Y'ffre calls brothers and sisters would be able to at least live in a stabilized Nirn, Y'ffre took the "L" and made to so at the very least, the Elves could enjoy themselves with the Earthbones/Laws of Nature. So, my hot take; Y'ffre is an Elven Et'Ada who doesn't hate Mundus, but perhaps he doesn't like Lorkhan for his lies, which I think is why the humans, like the Nords and King Borgus, still see them as enemies for being Mer. Stendarr is seen as an "Apologist of Man", and so he's not too popular to many Mer, but the Altmer don't seem to dislike Jephre for his views. They appreciate him for taking the Sacrifice so they could at least live comfortably in Mundus, so they can plan to escape it.
congrats on a million subs boys. you've deserved it for a long time. beautiful video. you really have, dare I say, perfected your craft of script writing and narration. as far as I'm concerned you may as well be official TES content.
This epic explaining of the Bosmer culture and gods came at a great time! This has helped inspire me to and some depth and character to one of my characters im about to voice for a skit/guide im working on! 😁 Thank you do much for this high quality content!
As a fellow lover of theology and myth, these videos are amazing! I hope you end up covering more or all of the other ancient and modern Tamrielic religions
Hi scott let me just say that your videos about lore have made my introduction to tes lore very enjoyable, i would recommend doing a video about all types of tonal magic my undestarding is that every race has their type of tonal magic: norths thuum, redguard sword singing, dwemer tonal architecture and so on. Sorry for the long comment i just think that it would be awesome
they have mentioned it in a video, "The Elder Scrolls Universe is a Song and Here Is Why" ua-cam.com/video/_5MNnd2N05g/v-deo.html. There is definetly a link between them all, as it was a song that created it all. It takes direct inspiration from the song of Eru Ilùvatar and the song of the Ainur called "Ainulindale", the first part of Tolkien's Silmarillion.
I hope you tackle Bethesda's "retcon" of Alduin for Skyrim, @FudgeMuppet. I always thought it was a lot more interesting to have the Nords view the Dragon God of Time as an ender, and the Elves view him as a beginner, than simply for Alduin to be... well, "just" a big, literal dragon.
it would be incredibly fascinating to analyze the philosophy of the Bosmer throughout time and how it changed. Perhaps the early Wood Elves were monotheistic and it wasn't until the first contacts with the Altmer that they began to introduce new gods, starting with Auri-El and therefore open up to ideas that went against their initial beliefs, like..there must've been an elf at one point who wondered "what if an apple has fallen from the tree and is therefore bound to rot and die and gets consumed? I won't have harmed it because it's already dead" or "what if i'm a wood elf but i have never set foot in Valenwood? Does the Green Pact still apply to me?". Slowly, new beliefs and ideas must've shaped how the Bosmer thought. It's a good thing Bosmer don't dwell on the past because otherwise i guarantee there would be a movement of loud, originalist bosmer fundamentalists aimed at restoring the Green Pact faith. In a way the Bosmer focusing on the present is very similar to the Argonians' way of life. Even their origin from the Ouze compared to the Argonians' Hist makes the two people very similar, besides both of their strong connection to nature. I'd say, the Bosmer share more with the Argonians than any Mer. And yeah, of course i firmly believe the Bosmer originated on Tamriel, not Aldmeris. It makes little sense why they would come from the Aldmer, shut away from them only to them open up to them again...just from a conceptual point of view, it makes little sense and it's far more explainable that the Bosmer came from Y'ffre's Ouze and the Aldmeris creation myth is just an altering of the Altmer creation myth to include the Bosmer, told by the Altmer to form an alliance and a foothold on mainland Tamriel.
I think the story of the City of Ash dungeon in ESO is about Bosmer revolting against the Dominion/failure to comply with the Green Pact. There was also a rebellion against King Camoran for consessions he made for soldiers during the war. I think its the Black Sap rebellion.
You guys inspired me to make some of the best builds I swear. I think one of my first videos of yall I watched was the greenpact zealot and stormlord fenrir. I always try to make the builds my own taking alot of inspiration from yall. I just had a fun run as fenrir again on Xbox 1. Now I'm building a green pact wood elf based on the zealot build.
i got bosmer in a personality test, and even though personally id rather die than resort to cannibalism, the idea of the ooze absolutely terrifies me xD
There is a lot, I mean A LOT, of British Traditional Wicca/Witchcraft in Bosmer cosmology. It's a little wild and makes me think that the writers maybe read Gardner BoS or various other sources
12:21 goes on to discuss the green lady in the sylvanar. Could these just be iterations of shor and kyne? Lorkan with his heart removed from his chest falling in love with mother nature herself?
I just created a Bosmer Wood Elf… Here are my rules. And specialties. 1. Stealth Archer 2. Can only wear leather or hide armors 3. Only eat meat and cheese for survival. 4. Character is all about money and a search for gods/Daedra. Fascinated by it. 5. Muffle, invisibility, transmute, Ebonyflesh are the only spells I use. 6. Animal Allegience, whirlwhind sprint and Unrelwnting force are only shouts I use. 7. Character was outcast from Valenwood for researching the Wild Hunt. So I made him a Werewolf, cause it made sense… His name is Dakath Nightvale I’m making this up as I go, but still trying to keep it as lore friendly as I can. Not doing every quest line, just trying to do the ones that make sense to my character. Like, I let Sindig live. Stuff like that.
My first elder scrolls character was a wood elf. I was 13 in 2006 playing Oblivion. I remember telling my mom about The Dark Brotherhood and she got mad and told me she doesn't want me joining any gangs! I watched UFO tv shows and played Elder Scrolls. All that youth, wasted on a game and schizophrenic Conspiracy programs LOL I'm currently playing SKYRIM as a Redguard though 15 years later! Super cool vid
Beautiful... You captured a moment.. a feeling that we've all had. The childhood wonder and curiosity you expressed as a kid is something I relate to heavily and wish to experience again. Thanks for the story. Really reminds you of the moments stick with us the longest and lead to fulfilling lives
How would the Bosmer view Alchemy? That is because you are consuming many plant products to produce the potions. I would think that it would violate the Green Pact except when you use non plant products.
They can use plants that have naturally fallen. Leafs that fall from trees, petals that fell from flowers ect. There is a few Quests in ESO specifically about Bosmer alchemists.
There are a lot anti-vegan alchemy ingredients like torchbugs, troll liver, mammoth tusk, est. They can also import plants from outside Valenwood as a Green Pact loophole.
the back history and lore we get to hear about.....the history we get to create "run to cave in the middle of BF nowhere and get a broken flask for a sick elf"
So did anyone else make a connection between sylvannar and the green lady and Lorkhaj and Kyne? Like maybe post convention... An angry Kyne from being "tricked" but still in love and an aspect of Lorkhaj wandering the world.
Now here is a funny question. Does Ifri remind anyone of the Dreamer too? Telling tales, making stories, giving shape to the shapeless. Does that not sound like dreaming?
You can buy cut wood, you didn't personally harm the wood yourself. Bosmer can use wood of trees that have fallen, but not personally chop the tree down.
idk where I heard this, but somewhere I heard that the entire elder scrolls universe is just some beings dream. And hearing that the bosmer? bosmar? Believe in this being, that sort of spoke things into existence. Idk it just got my mind thinking to that thing i once heard. What if? That being was lucid dreaming, and interacting with his or her inner-world? psyche? Idek. It’s a long shot, and barely a theory. Just a small thing that came to mind
"Eat your broccoli." 'Mom, that's what FOOD eats!' FUDGE: would it be sacrilege for a Bosmer to gather potion ingredients, craft, & use potions outside Valinwood?
I was so heartbroken when I first saw ESO Valenwood in 2015. This is like 1/57th of what was described in the lore. Todd: "Welcome. It has a tree. It has 16x the leaves of other trees. And this whole area just works."
I swear, in the previous episode to this series, you stated that iffre (I know I'm spelling that wrong) was a she but in this episode you're referring to iffre as he. Either way, I LOVE this series! Lol That you guys for the amazing work! 👴📜 (The emojis are an old man and a scroll, i.e. elder scrolls. Lol)
Where do all these in game clips come from? They’re all so cool and look like they have been pulled from versions of the skyrim engine that were based on the relevant areas of Tamriel
Only at 3:30 and maybe he will touch on it in the video but Yffre shaping reality by telling tales reminds me of tonal architecture. Using sound to alter/shape reality
Okay wait. So the Bosmer were more or less Monotheistic. Also, there’s the godhead theory which is where all of TES is just a dream by a higher being. What if the Bosmer believe the Godhead theory and they try to worship the Godhead? It makes sense because they believe in the story-teller and dreams are basically stories. So like it kind of makes sense.
Over the years I've come to believe that likely all stories in the lore are pretty much mostly true. Especially the gods/spirits, they really just are all these versions and aspects. The gods/spirits were not bound by form or time before the Mundus was a thing. So its likely they also have a "true" name we don't know. For exampe: Auriel, Akatosh, Alduin. All those are splinter identities of the actual being who's true name we don't know. Gods/Spirits have these split forms due to how the mortal races percieve them, and the roles they are given within the system of the Mundus (for example, ensuring "time" exists as a natural force.) As they have a true name and form uknown, and possibly impossible to be known by mortal minds, they instead created these identities for those Gods/Spirits so they could know them. Due to the rules of the universe in TES, that translates in them actually becoming these beings, as mortals perceive them. Worship = Power, but likely also means that if you erase the knowledge of a god/spirit, they will crease to exist entirely. Whatever being they were split from will likely still exist, but that version of them will be gone. (essentially what the Thalmor are trying to do with Talos)
In the time of the Elder Scrolls Online, maybe the Bosmer that interact with the Dominion more follow King Camoran. And the Green Pact Bosmer of more traditional Bosmer faith follow the Wilderking. Its interesting to see how far the Bosmer stray from the Green Pact over time. I wonder if that straying will ever become a regret for them, or if there will ever be a day where they return to the ways of the Pact.
Altmer: You need to eat your greens.
Bosmer: That’s what wood orcs are for.
Altmer: What?
Bosmer: What.
You said... genes?
SHUT UP IM DYING
Bosmer humor is the best humor
Bosmer eat their own kind and other species including Humans and Beastfolk.
Youngest child: dies
Wood elf mother: we don't waste food in this house!
Somebody toucha ma baby!
*Facepalm*
Somebody is in thisa house!
@Wirrling A reference to the "somebody toucha my spaghett" meme. It's from an old cartoon where a girl went inside the house of a bear family, ate their food and fell asleep in one of their beds. The papa bear was not amused.
@Wirrling Yeah, no problem.
@Pap DM I know it's pretty much ancient, but the cartoon that the meme is from is only... Moderately old.
Pretty sure the original didn't have a facepalming bear with a terrible fake italian accent.
Make sure you finish all of your younger sibling, there are children starving to death in Elsweyr!
Hands down the best shake up of a "Tolkien Elf"
Agreed. Right up their with Snow Elves.
Personally I really enjoy the elves in the Will Smith movie “Bright,” although the movie isn’t very good. 😅
@@DharmaDerelict i actually really liked Bright. Obviously without the shoehorned racism commentary.
@@tspoon772 That was literally the entire point of the movie bud.
The funny thing about the "Tolkien elf" is that no one gets what they are. The movies did a pretty bad portrayal of what they are supposed to be, especially the mirkwood elves in the Hobbit trilogy. By reading deeper about them, they are more similar to the bosmer than to what peter jackson made them out to be ;)
Honestly, I use these videos to get mods and make builds that fit each races belief system. When I play as any race, I want to encapsulate what they believe not just pretend to. Thank you dude
Yep, nice to be role-playing a race in the way they typically would, or even perhaps may take certain stances on different situations/views
@@thalmoragent9344 oh no... the Thalmor found me
On a serious note, it really is more fun. That's the few crappy things about vanilla Skyrim, you don't really get to see the diverse cultures
@@mickobinsotosworth9759 100%! I absolutely love playing as Khajiit but there's not many options. For races like Altmer it makes sense cause great war or whatever but I really hope ES:6 includes better racial abilities and more diverse religions even if it's subtle details
So a single playthrough of yours is sorta like a journey of perspective,
like changing the name of divines from one mod-list to another?
I like to make Skyrim a land that have certain attraction for any visitor or inhabitant. Abit more generalised, but I like to have alot of characters inhabit the same worldspace, splitting the quests like there are an elite group of adventurers fighting (or partake) different evils.
I don't feel like there's alot for a Bosmer mage, tho. There was a cutting room spell that allowed you to turn into a Skeewer, quite an awsome idea.
Champion of Kynareth is a great mod, and I think it is well executed at that. It is supposedly Fromser based, but I guess it works out for Wood Elves too.
There's also a dude that REALLY like the idea of Spriggan magic, I'm aching to check out how far he's come - but it is as far as I got with Bosmer additions.
@@scuttleflip8650 I like to make multiples of each of my Dragonborns. My current one I'm working on (she has a 12 page build I'm still editing) she was originally my oblivion Character that after the crisis got severe PTSD and chose to numb the pain with ale. In a drunken panic, she accidentally killed a begger she was friends with and then as things in Oblivion go, she joined the DB, fell in love with Lucian but we all know what happened to him and she was so hurt by the betrayal, she vowed to kill any deceptive person on sight (she doesn't see herself as a liar, only someone that hides truths). She then turned into a vampire then enter SKYRIM
Sorry, I just really wanted to talk about her lol
But yeah, I'm always changing my mod list (sucks when you're on Xbox) to fit whatever kinda Dragonborn I'm playing as
The Silvenar sounds like Lorkhan after his heart was ripped out. The world aiding him to follow the Green Lady would also support that. The Green Lady having hair of wind and rain would indicate Kynereth, furthering the ties.
"Skaal Gods EXPLAINED" is going to be a very short video.
"There is no god besides the all maker and Freas dad is his prophet"
"There's the All-maker. He made everything. There's the Adversary. He's bad, and maybe Hermaeus Mora."
@@RaunienTheFirst did the all maker made the adversary? If no hes a liar cuz he didn’t make all, if yes he is bad cuz only bad can create other bads.
@@georgemurdock7670 Rudimentary logic. Metaphysical concepts even irl go beyond the simple concept of black and white. Though it's a very deep rabbit hole to get lost into and I don't have a degree in Philosophy to give justice to my sentiments.
Good first comment btw, I'm a Muslim so I got the reference immediately, gave me a chuckle too.
@@JHS270694 pretty sure the qoute was from star wars tho
This was a wonderful watch. It makes me think, if the Altmer are so focused on the past and what they've lost in Aetherius, the Bosmer so focused on the present and what they have in Mundus, would it be fair to say the Dunmer are focused on the future and what they can gain at the end of the Psjic Endeavour?
Totally not. One of the reasons of the Aldmeri-Chimer split was the corruption of Aldmeri thought (which led to development of Altmeri philosophy), that is true, but followers of Veloth were more preoccupied on making the best of the situation they were in (which implies that said corruption is exactly their yearning for era of shapelessness which, mind you, nobody living at that point could've experienced, and it's highly likely that it didn't even happen because religion). Then Chimer culture after some flourishing completely collapsed and they became little more than primitive tribespeople. The turn into the Dunmer was caused by mass convertion into ALMSIVI and their philosophy seems to be very much self-centred and Mundus-focused (not counting Vivec but he's not a Dunmer and his teachings only focus on the now too).
Meanwhile the Psijics follow the original Old Ways and are focused on protecting Mundus (but also the whole Aurbis, at least according to their beliefs, as suggested by two books in ESO) and keeping the balance between Padomai and Anu (they also introduce the concept of good and evil in the world where most philosophy is focused on change-stasis dychotomy, basically saying that when change is good then it should be stimulated and when bad-prevented). While the reason for their conflict with the High Elf authorities is very similar to that of the Chimer (hurr we should've stayed immaterial durr; in later eras hurrr let's destroy mundus durr), the philosophical and religious differences are huge. In fact Celarus specifically mentions in his Old Ways Boethiah as an example of a horrible mortal ascended to godhood (princehood specifically, but imo it's just a title and the daedra/aedra differences are philosophical at best and artificial at worst).
PS By the time of Skyrim the Dunmer have suffered another, probably the worst so far, collapse and multiple dialogues present a situation where they don't really give a damn about any "higher thought" focusing on attempts to find a new framework.
PPS Sorry for the wall of text and lack of specific references to lorebooks and dialogues, hope it's not too long to read
@@Sk0lzky
I mean, if the Altmer and some other Elves and even many Redguards want to leave Mundus, I don't see why they should be forced to be tied to a Realm they don't want to be in
We even know that Auri-El and his influence of Time was what gave the form and natures/limitations to the other Spirits in the Dawn Era, so it's not like they'd be immaterial.
As long as the Time God exists, they won't be Shapeless, immaterial spirits. They will still be able to "measure themselves" as its so eloquently put. They wouldn't be Shapeless, Auriel's power bled into the Aurbis as a new force, called time. And so with that, they'd probably be like how Daedra are in Oblivion, but rather, in Aetherius.
They wouldn't be mortal, wouldn't need any food, or wouldn't get tired, etc. They'd be, well, the Anuic version of Daedra/Dremora, they'd be that while the Aedra would of course have their own realms in Aetherius they could be tied too, like Daedra tied to Oblivion realms they wish to return too
@@thalmoragent9344 it is believed that he did, we don't know it as a fact. It's the beauty of TES, the in-universe narratives which often come into conflict with one another (and sometimes with themselves >
@@mickobinsotosworth9759 and there in is the problem with discourse today. @Sk0lzky made good points.
I believe that "the ooze" is simply a cultural variation of the Ehlnofey, similar to, in my opinion, Aldmeris is simply Aetherius, prior to Mundus' creation.
The Ooze may be simply that early beginning of Mundus where the realm was still poisonous to the Et'Ada, forcing some of them to die to stabilize the realm for habitation.
The Ehlnofey, prior to creation, would have no physical forms. "Unfettered by lips and teeth". They would be a chaotic "ooze", with no form, no self, no personhood. Ever changing, ever shifting.
It would be the sacrifice of Yffre and other Ehlnofey to become the Earthbones, which would allow the Ehlnofey to take a permanent physical form. This would allow the Old and Wandering Ehlnofey to settle down and decide on a form to take.
Hence the Ooze becomes the Bosmer, and the Ehlnofey become the races of Nirn.
The "Sundering of Old Aldmeris" was simply the creation of Mundus, and the door to Aetherius forever cut off from the Aldmer.
It was not a place on Nirn. It wasn't a diaspora in the typical sense. It was the creation of Mundus, the Old Ehlnofey being trapped here, and forever diminishing into mortal forms, away from their Aetherial perfection.
This is the first time I'm actually seeing the spelling of a lot of these words and uhhh what the fuck
I share your take on it. Nords meanwhile don't see Aetherius as a past lost, but as paradise to gain. Soverngarde, Far Shores and other human afterlifes are their mortal path back to Aetherius, which in my opinion is like a soul well, from which soul are reincarnated back to Nirn or achieve godhood, sainthood and stay in Aetherius back as the original spirits.
“Hey we’re going to war”
“With who?”
“The wood elves”
“.yeeeeeaaaaaa that’s a no from me chief”
Bosmer are hell to fight against, even among their own people. There's one story of two Bosmeri tribes who went to war against each other. Tribe 1 knew that Tribe 2 was going to beat them, so before they were overrun, all the members of Tribe 1 drank slow acting poison. Tribe 2 advanced and killed Tribe 1, then when they sat down to eat the corpses of Tribe 1, they ingested the poison coursing through Tribe 1's veins, which killed them all
@@woohoomusic5098 Uno Reverse Card
The Khajit will take you up on that offer.
Scott, in your discussion of Arkay you focus on his funerary aspects, but traditional Bosmeri cannibalism doesn’t mean they don’t hold funerals or give honor to their people’s bones (see the Bone Orchard in Grahtwood). Additionally, accepting that the Green subsumes what enters it, the Bosmer would have received from the First and Second Cyrodilic Empires the command taught in the Cyrods’ chapels: “Arkay says: Honor the earth, its creatures, and the spirits, living and dead. Guard and tend the bounties of the mortal world, and do not profane the spirits of the dead.” It’s not surprising, imo, that the Bosmer would genuinely revere Arkay, and it’s noted that he’s invoked when solving violations of the Green Pact, as does his role as a sort of psychopomp. Arkay may judge the spirits of those accused of breaking the Green Pact (i.e., of not tending the bounties of the mortal world), and he may escort them to and from their punishment, and perhaps judge when their penance is satisfied-or hold the keys to their release. Thanks for the video and channel, always a pleasure to engage!
Argonian God's explained next please!
Cheers cobba! Love ya work mate!
I thought it was just Sithis and the Hist, but ESO Blackwoods has a tribe that acknowledges Dagon as an aspect of Sithis.
@@badluck5647 i could see Mehrunes and Sithis being connected
I love the variations in adherence to the Green Pact and Meat Mandate. It makes them more realistic since our world has lots of variety in how people follow the teachings within the same religion.
Reminds me of Kosher (which my partner keeps in a relatively relaxed manner). Some people don’t eat meat and dairy on the same day, others permit it at different meals. Some only buy meat from kosher butchers, or forbid wine brewed by gentiles. Some don’t keep kosher at all, or do so in a very relaxed way. It all depends.
The relationship between the Silvenar and Green Lady sounds remarkably similar to that of Shezarr and Kynareth. Someone without a heart and someone with connections to wind and rain becoming lovers? I dunno man...
I just like Elf Chicks, and here goes Scott making other Valid reasons to love Bosmer and their traditions.
Good to know Clavicus, good to know
I'm just watching this video so I can impress the Bosmer chick at my local tavern. Gonna kill a homeless man and bring his corpse so we can eat him together
Ok, so if I may, this is my personal take on Y'ffre's view on Mundus;
It's said that he had sacrificed himself so that the world would not die, after all they had put into it. I believe that what happened was that Y'ffre, while maybe not liking Lorkhan for his lies, he didn't exactly hate Mundus. He liked the Project, similar to Magnus who was also very invested into it.
But Magnus was afraid, and understandably, so he fled, no longer taking part in Mundus except blessing magicka upon Nirn. Y'ffre however, while perhaps not too happy with Lorkhan, was still invested into Mundus. And so that Auriel and the other Aldmeri Gods that Y'ffre calls brothers and sisters would be able to at least live in a stabilized Nirn, Y'ffre took the "L" and made to so at the very least, the Elves could enjoy themselves with the Earthbones/Laws of Nature.
So, my hot take;
Y'ffre is an Elven Et'Ada who doesn't hate Mundus, but perhaps he doesn't like Lorkhan for his lies, which I think is why the humans, like the Nords and King Borgus, still see them as enemies for being Mer.
Stendarr is seen as an "Apologist of Man", and so he's not too popular to many Mer, but the Altmer don't seem to dislike Jephre for his views. They appreciate him for taking the Sacrifice so they could at least live comfortably in Mundus, so they can plan to escape it.
No hair don't care gamer
@@ciaranmck4469 then why are you here? If not to nerd about it?
@@artisticbang9111 nah he's from this discord chill ye tits
Can’t believe you guys hit a million. Been with y’all a long time since I found Skyrim builds in like 2013. Congrats boys y’all deserve it.
congrats on a million subs boys. you've deserved it for a long time. beautiful video. you really have, dare I say, perfected your craft of script writing and narration. as far as I'm concerned you may as well be official TES content.
This epic explaining of the Bosmer culture and gods came at a great time! This has helped inspire me to and some depth and character to one of my characters im about to voice for a skit/guide im working on! 😁 Thank you do much for this high quality content!
As a fellow fan of mythology, this series sounds awesome!
As a fellow lover of theology and myth, these videos are amazing! I hope you end up covering more or all of the other ancient and modern Tamrielic religions
Hi scott let me just say that your videos about lore have made my introduction to tes lore very enjoyable, i would recommend doing a video about all types of tonal magic my undestarding is that every race has their type of tonal magic: norths thuum, redguard sword singing, dwemer tonal architecture and so on. Sorry for the long comment i just think that it would be awesome
they have mentioned it in a video, "The Elder Scrolls Universe is a Song and Here Is Why" ua-cam.com/video/_5MNnd2N05g/v-deo.html. There is definetly a link between them all, as it was a song that created it all. It takes direct inspiration from the song of Eru Ilùvatar and the song of the Ainur called "Ainulindale", the first part of Tolkien's Silmarillion.
As an anthropologist, the mythology of the elder scrolls has always been my favorite part.
As a human being, no one gives a crap about anthropology
I hope you tackle Bethesda's "retcon" of Alduin for Skyrim, @FudgeMuppet. I always thought it was a lot more interesting to have the Nords view the Dragon God of Time as an ender, and the Elves view him as a beginner, than simply for Alduin to be... well, "just" a big, literal dragon.
Really looking forward to the rest of this series. I find the Green Pact pretty fascinating.
I would absolutely love to see you continue this series!! Absolutely loved it!
it would be incredibly fascinating to analyze the philosophy of the Bosmer throughout time and how it changed. Perhaps the early Wood Elves were monotheistic and it wasn't until the first contacts with the Altmer that they began to introduce new gods, starting with Auri-El and therefore open up to ideas that went against their initial beliefs, like..there must've been an elf at one point who wondered "what if an apple has fallen from the tree and is therefore bound to rot and die and gets consumed? I won't have harmed it because it's already dead" or "what if i'm a wood elf but i have never set foot in Valenwood? Does the Green Pact still apply to me?". Slowly, new beliefs and ideas must've shaped how the Bosmer thought. It's a good thing Bosmer don't dwell on the past because otherwise i guarantee there would be a movement of loud, originalist bosmer fundamentalists aimed at restoring the Green Pact faith. In a way the Bosmer focusing on the present is very similar to the Argonians' way of life. Even their origin from the Ouze compared to the Argonians' Hist makes the two people very similar, besides both of their strong connection to nature. I'd say, the Bosmer share more with the Argonians than any Mer. And yeah, of course i firmly believe the Bosmer originated on Tamriel, not Aldmeris. It makes little sense why they would come from the Aldmer, shut away from them only to them open up to them again...just from a conceptual point of view, it makes little sense and it's far more explainable that the Bosmer came from Y'ffre's Ouze and the Aldmeris creation myth is just an altering of the Altmer creation myth to include the Bosmer, told by the Altmer to form an alliance and a foothold on mainland Tamriel.
I think the story of the City of Ash dungeon in ESO is about Bosmer revolting against the Dominion/failure to comply with the Green Pact.
There was also a rebellion against King Camoran for consessions he made for soldiers during the war. I think its the Black Sap rebellion.
You guys inspired me to make some of the best builds I swear. I think one of my first videos of yall I watched was the greenpact zealot and stormlord fenrir. I always try to make the builds my own taking alot of inspiration from yall. I just had a fun run as fenrir again on Xbox 1. Now I'm building a green pact wood elf based on the zealot build.
Every fight is a food fight when you're a bosmer ♡
It’d be great if you guys could include which tracks you used for BG music in the description. This episode was particularly spot on!
Congrats on a million subscribers!! Well deserved. I love yalls content! Makes me keep my love for Skyrim without having to put 1,000 hours ha!
the Bosmer are my absolute favourite -- i play one every time, and always have
Would be really interestng to hear how the Bosmer are handling Thalmor rule. Gotta be some issues there.
25:21 So there's a part of Valenwood that worships and is ruled by Swamp Thing lol
i got bosmer in a personality test, and even though personally id rather die than resort to cannibalism, the idea of the ooze absolutely terrifies me xD
I found it interesting that in Skyrim you need a ring of Namira to properly RP Bosmer following the Green Pact.
26:03 Classic Bosmer Wood Mammoth
There is a lot, I mean A LOT, of British Traditional Wicca/Witchcraft in Bosmer cosmology. It's a little wild and makes me think that the writers maybe read Gardner BoS or various other sources
Excellent theory on Woodelf lore. Very interesting. Thank you.
🙃☕❤❤❤
Hold on, the Silvenar is a god of the land whose heart was torn from his chest ?
...Hmm, why does that sound familiar?
This series is goin' to be SO AWESOME!!🖤
Can't wait for the Argonians and it's basically: *TREE.*
...(and the void)
Me: Starts bosmer playthrough
Fudgemuppet: time to make a bosmer video
I'm enjoying this series and only recently started watching your videos, at least as a subscriber, Thank you for making such good content. :D
I’m really looking forward to your video on the Snow Elf pantheon.
Same, they're my favorite
Spoiler it the same as the high elf.
@@badluck5647 They also worship either Daedra or giant insects.
Bosmer are my favorite Elven Race in the series. Both Lore and Gameplay Mechanics.
Definitely in my top three races/provinces to visit in no particular order.
Bosmer: still the nearest thing to "nice" Elves in Elder Scrolls...and they practice ritual Cannibalism
Yall should do a series where each episode is a lesson of vivec
12:21 goes on to discuss the green lady in the sylvanar. Could these just be iterations of shor and kyne? Lorkan with his heart removed from his chest falling in love with mother nature herself?
Nope
I just created a Bosmer Wood Elf… Here are my rules. And specialties.
1. Stealth Archer
2. Can only wear leather or hide armors
3. Only eat meat and cheese for survival.
4. Character is all about money and a search for gods/Daedra. Fascinated by it.
5. Muffle, invisibility, transmute, Ebonyflesh are the only spells I use.
6. Animal Allegience, whirlwhind sprint and Unrelwnting force are only shouts I use.
7. Character was outcast from Valenwood for researching the Wild Hunt. So I made him a Werewolf, cause it made sense…
His name is Dakath Nightvale
I’m making this up as I go, but still trying to keep it as lore friendly as I can. Not doing every quest line, just trying to do the ones that make sense to my character. Like, I let Sindig live. Stuff like that.
This series is pretty awesome guys, TES mythology is one of my favorite things
When your Yffre and you think sky burials are cool but you followers were hungry when you tried explaining that.
Bro how you gon talk about Auriel (Altmer god) for like 5 mins but the beef between Y’ffre and Hircine is for “another video” lmao
14:20
*Lorkhan intensifies*
Always help me role play my characters thanks man!
There is evidence to suggest that the all Mer came from the Ooze, but Bosmer religion merely emphasizes it more than the others.
I've seen the ooze, it was behind my fridge. The Bosmer don't have to worry anymore, I cleaned it up.
My first elder scrolls character was a wood elf. I was 13 in 2006 playing Oblivion. I remember telling my mom about The Dark Brotherhood and she got mad and told me she doesn't want me joining any gangs! I watched UFO tv shows and played Elder Scrolls. All that youth, wasted on a game and schizophrenic Conspiracy programs LOL I'm currently playing SKYRIM as a Redguard though 15 years later!
Super cool vid
Beautiful... You captured a moment.. a feeling that we've all had. The childhood wonder and curiosity you expressed as a kid is something I relate to heavily and wish to experience again. Thanks for the story. Really reminds you of the moments stick with us the longest and lead to fulfilling lives
Good video man
How would the Bosmer view Alchemy? That is because you are consuming many plant products to produce the potions. I would think that it would violate the Green Pact except when you use non plant products.
They can use plants that have naturally fallen. Leafs that fall from trees, petals that fell from flowers ect.
There is a few Quests in ESO specifically about Bosmer alchemists.
There are a lot anti-vegan alchemy ingredients like torchbugs, troll liver, mammoth tusk, est.
They can also import plants from outside Valenwood as a Green Pact loophole.
Men races: nirn was made for us so its ours
Bosmer: nirn was a a gift so take care of it
I made the right choice when I chose the Bosmer in my first playthrough of Skyrim.
Your Skyrim gets prettier every episode I swear
Amazing video, bosmer definitely stick out after you go into detail
Whats the race he says at 9:20 after minotaurs?
the back history and lore we get to hear about.....the history we get to create "run to cave in the middle of BF nowhere and get a broken flask for a sick elf"
So did anyone else make a connection between sylvannar and the green lady and Lorkhaj and Kyne? Like maybe post convention... An angry Kyne from being "tricked" but still in love and an aspect of Lorkhaj wandering the world.
I was almost cheering for the Hound for fight for love and against an unfair destiny.
Love this series. So interesting!
Tree-hugging cannibal Hobbits, I love Elder Scrolls.
"What about second breakfast?"
'I thought you liked me, Pip...'
Босмеры моя одна из любимых рас :)
Now here is a funny question.
Does Ifri remind anyone of the Dreamer too?
Telling tales, making stories, giving shape to the shapeless. Does that not sound like dreaming?
That awkward moment when you are cutting timber to build your house in skyrim.
You can buy cut wood, you didn't personally harm the wood yourself.
Bosmer can use wood of trees that have fallen, but not personally chop the tree down.
Interesting how the description of the Silvanar sounds very Lorkhanic...im just saying.
I still like to think some bosmer turn into spriggons when they die
They turn into sausages
beautiful as always guys keep em comin!
Silvenar and the Green Lady remind me a little of Lorkhan and Kyne.
Maybe I’m on UA-cam too much because the notification for the video played whilst watching it 😳
*_"Only good _**_-cannibal-_**_ wood elf is a dead _**_-cannibal-_**_ wood elf"_*
- Silt strider Bumper sticker
idk where I heard this, but somewhere I heard that the entire elder scrolls universe is just some beings dream. And hearing that the bosmer? bosmar? Believe in this being, that sort of spoke things into existence. Idk it just got my mind thinking to that thing i once heard. What if? That being was lucid dreaming, and interacting with his or her inner-world? psyche? Idek. It’s a long shot, and barely a theory. Just a small thing that came to mind
The thumbnail gave me a medieval “ghost” for cod vibes
You should do a video on how Nordic Drauger came to be.
"Eat your broccoli."
'Mom, that's what FOOD eats!'
FUDGE: would it be sacrilege for a Bosmer to gather potion ingredients, craft, & use potions outside Valinwood?
outside of their homeland theyre allowed to do whatever they want to nature
I was so heartbroken when I first saw ESO Valenwood in 2015. This is like 1/57th of what was described in the lore.
Todd: "Welcome. It has a tree. It has 16x the leaves of other trees. And this whole area just works."
ESO can be a little too PG and Black & White for my taste.
I swear, in the previous episode to this series, you stated that iffre (I know I'm spelling that wrong) was a she but in this episode you're referring to iffre as he. Either way, I LOVE this series! Lol
That you guys for the amazing work! 👴📜
(The emojis are an old man and a scroll, i.e. elder scrolls. Lol)
soiled times line? what do they know about the future?
Hey fudgemuppet, what armor mods do you have in this one?
i remember when i found wood elves were cannibals back when i played morrowind, i didnt want to play as them anymore lol.
How do the bosmer view hircine?
Where do all these in game clips come from? They’re all so cool and look like they have been pulled from versions of the skyrim engine that were based on the relevant areas of Tamriel
Woodelfs are weird because they are probably a perfect 50/50 split of believing nirn is a prison and a gift
Only at 3:30 and maybe he will touch on it in the video but Yffre shaping reality by telling tales reminds me of tonal architecture. Using sound to alter/shape reality
What hunter armor mod is this? This simple hunter armor?
*Anything dies in their region
Wood Elf: hey it’s a free meal \o/
starting around 3:40, what is the music playing?
Getting hyped for the podcast and also our tenth Devine is doing a Q and A too. (Todd Howard ❤️)
Bosmer gods. I wonder if they were the ones responsible for bosmer bussy
By far my favorite race. 🖤
Okay wait. So the Bosmer were more or less Monotheistic. Also, there’s the godhead theory which is where all of TES is just a dream by a higher being. What if the Bosmer believe the Godhead theory and they try to worship the Godhead?
It makes sense because they believe in the story-teller and dreams are basically stories. So like it kind of makes sense.
“More or less” than monotheistic is either polytheistic or atheist
Does the green pact include already dead plants ? Can they use fallen tree for anything? I always wondered that.
Over the years I've come to believe that likely all stories in the lore are pretty much mostly true.
Especially the gods/spirits, they really just are all these versions and aspects.
The gods/spirits were not bound by form or time before the Mundus was a thing.
So its likely they also have a "true" name we don't know.
For exampe: Auriel, Akatosh, Alduin.
All those are splinter identities of the actual being who's true name we don't know.
Gods/Spirits have these split forms due to how the mortal races percieve them, and the roles they are given within the system of the Mundus (for example, ensuring "time" exists as a natural force.)
As they have a true name and form uknown, and possibly impossible to be known by mortal minds, they instead created these identities for those Gods/Spirits so they could know them.
Due to the rules of the universe in TES, that translates in them actually becoming these beings, as mortals perceive them.
Worship = Power, but likely also means that if you erase the knowledge of a god/spirit, they will crease to exist entirely.
Whatever being they were split from will likely still exist, but that version of them will be gone.
(essentially what the Thalmor are trying to do with Talos)
In the time of the Elder Scrolls Online, maybe the Bosmer that interact with the Dominion more follow King Camoran. And the Green Pact Bosmer of more traditional Bosmer faith follow the Wilderking.
Its interesting to see how far the Bosmer stray from the Green Pact over time. I wonder if that straying will ever become a regret for them, or if there will ever be a day where they return to the ways of the Pact.
"His heart torn from its primal aspects, was an empty pit" 🤔
Is there any mods about this?