When you look inside of ti200's barrel, you can see it's machined from solid chunk of metal. So that makes the thickness of barrel much thicker than WS601. And ti200 has solid metal clip but WS601 has sheet metal clip, so that also makes ti200 heavyer. So i'm sure ti200 is made of titanium.
You are correct. But, I'm dubious about how much of this metal is titanium. As I said, I'm sure there is SOME titanium content to that "titanium alloy". How much is the question. And is it worth the higher price tag because of it? It isn't lighter and it doesn't need to be stronger. So, why is it titanium at all?
@@InkquiringMinds most metals used for anything are alloys, with almost no pure elements, so it's not dubious because it's called an alloy? I don't think there are many metal alloys which contain any titanium other than ones which are primarily titanium, with the usual additives for improved machinability and other features (molybdenum, chromium, etc.). It'd be more expensive for them to some rare titanium alloy, probably? If it's significantly less magnetic and twice the cost (titanium is more difficult to machine on top of raw costs), I'd be quite confident that it is a titanium pen. Unless they got a hold of that very new iron-aluminum alloy with extremely similar properties, which is arguably cooler.
Finally! I've been hoarding Montblanc Lavender Purple because I could not find any writing samples of the new Amethyst Purple, and I was afraid that it would be as disappointing a comparison as their Modena vs Corn Poppy Red. The Amethyst looks both beautiful and comparable though, so I should probably let go of one of my backups 🤣 Thank you!
Clash between clip and body colors breaks deal for me. Ears 2nd deal breaker for me. Price is third. Wing Sung for the win. I love Wing Sung. I still kind of want a Moonman just cause I love the name so much.
My 601 "Flighter" with SS hood weighs in at 31.5gm, my Ti200 is 33.7gm, heavier but not by a lot. What are the advantages of a Titanium Alloy pen? Why advertise it as Titanium? Those are my questions. No one asks what type of Stainless steel is used, there are many kinds. One thing they both share, no steel parts that a magnet attracts. Better grade stainless steels are non-magnetic. Carbon steel is magnetic & costs less. for me, it's a metal pen. I enjoy the F nib that is on the Ti200. When I need a fine line or using porous paper, the F nib works perfectly. Alan also likes it.
Thanks, Chris! I enjoyed both Alan's and your reviews. I still love my WS601 Flighter, though the Ti200 is growing on my now that the sticker shock is wearing off! :)
Titanium was first used as an aerospace alloy for the SR-71 Blackbird. It has a high strength to weight ratio and is corrosion resistant in seawater and chloride rich environments. It also has a fairly low heat expansion coefficient, meaning it changes shape less than other materials at high temperatures. For a pen, it has a unique gray color, feels warm in the hand because of its low thermal conductivity and inks will generally not attack the metal. 😁
I totally agree with you. People are so easy to agree with a Chinese merchant just because they say what they say it is not challenging the statement for the obvious reason.
There is a huge amount of outright lying going on with most products from Chinese vendors - especially on Aliexpress. One of my favourite vendors is "Bobby" whose store is called "St. Penpps Chinese Pen Store". And he calls EVERY brand he sells, whether it is MaJohn, WingSung or Jinhao, "St. Penpps". So the Jinhao x159 is called "St. Penpps x159 fountain pen". Ludicrous.
When you reviewed the Wing Sung 601 Flighter and waxed poetic about the Stainless Steel Nosecone I was somewhat intrigued, so looking on Etsy I found the items and noted that the Stainless Steel Grip Section was listed at a whopping $1000.00 US, while also noting that they had sold hundreds. I Emailed Customer Service and got the customary "no response." Now that it's back from the Stratosphere to a more realistic price I've decided that I like the black plastic anyway. I did order the Bobby nibs, so thanks for the Nailclipper-ectomy hint. Works wonders.
Thanks Doug for a detailed review of this pen. I am also not a big fan of hooded nibs so I probably won't rush out to buy this or the Wing Sung. Of the two the Wing Sung does appear to be the best value.
Great review Doug. Thank you for your honesty, especially in mentioning whether or not a fountain pen is worth its price tag. As far as hooded nibs go, my only experience is a Lamy 2000, which is a semi-hooded nib. I've been enjoying it for some time and I hope you enjoy it also. Again, 👍👍!
Hi Doug- received my Ti200 today. Happy enough with the pen and the 14K nib- feedback but not scratchy . My major gripe is with the converter which doesn’t fill to more than a third full - fill it fast or slow. A bit like trying to cross the US/Canada on a Harley Sportster with a peanut gas tank. A decent converter would make a huge difference. I shall wander this Green Earth like Fugitive looking for a functional converter.
If you have some strong magnets perhaps you could test how they react to the magnets? I was able to distinguish titanium nibs and steel nibs by doing this as titanium is not attracted to magnets and the steel as ever so slightly.
The magnet is more attracted to the WS601 than the Ti200. I'm willing to believe there is some titanium in the pen (a titanium alloy of some percentages) but not enough to justify that price.
I saw this on ebay from $59 USD to $112USD and reached the same conclusion you did that it was overpriced since I bought 2 WS 601A pens for about the price of 1 of the Moonman pens. Thanks, Doug!
Thanks, Doug, for this review and taking a bullet for us. If I were to test whether it is real titanium, I would anodize it with three or four 9V batteries. That would change the color to a pretty blue.
I would have really preferred this Ti 200 not to be in titanium, but in simple stainless steel, with the same finish and a price around 20€... I really like its design, especially the matte version (basically a better finished and more durable version of the Jinhao 911).
I don't see anything wrong with the density measurements you made, though I notice there's a plastic liner in my wing sung 601 flighter. Not sure if there is a plastic liner in the moonman but that might throw the measurements off. Plus I've always found Archimedes' principle to be a bit finicky whenever students do it in intro labs. In any case, I doubt it's pure titanium.
Yes, I mentioned the plastic liner in the Ti200. Yes, the plastic in there is more boyant as well which might account for the lighter than expected readings on the WS601.
Been waiting for this review! Long edit with some coments: since it isn't based on the same design, I don't think you can directly compare the density - it might be thrown off by the thickness of components, for instance. Plus, aren't some parts which are plastic in the Wing Sung, made out of metal in the Moonman? In metallurgy, "Titanium alloys" refer to alloys whose main component is Titanium. Titanium is almost always alloyed with aluminium and vanadium for better properties. But of course, AliExpress sellers don't know anything about this. All in all, I'm still unsure about this pen. Guess I might have to end up buying both :P. But I completely agree with you on the 14K gold. It's just completely wasted under a rigid hood.
On testing for titanium: "Hold any genuine titanium metal object to a grinding wheel (even a little grindstone on a Dremel tool will do), and it gives off a shower of brilliant white sparks unlike any softer common metal. The sparks are tiny pieces of cut titanium--the friction of the grinder heats them till they burn white-hot. Hold a grindstone to the shackle of a "titanium" padlock from Master Lock, however, and you'll instead see the telltale fine, long, yellow sparks of high-carbon steel." I might end up doing that if I buy it.
Yeah, that's why I mentioned the various materials in the cap from plastic to brass and also that I was unwilling to destroy a $70US pen for "science" LOL
I appreciate the review. I am now glad I did not purchase the mock titanium Moonman. I had seen the same pen, for same price advertised as stainless steel. I became distracted (probably by those noisy kids) & did not order. Now I’m glad I did not waste my money…
Wow ! You’ve done some serious research and experiment to determine the ‘titaniumness’ of TI200.. I’d pick 601 over TI200 mainly because of those golden trims.. While I was wondering how the overall shape and the name ‘flighter’ appear familiar, I suddenly realized that I got a Parker 45 Flighter recently !
The "flighter" was a model that Ken Parker put out for the Parker 51 and other models that was all stainless steel because of his love of aircraft and the sleek style of the modern planes and jets of that era.
Nice video Doug. Glad to see you're already trying a Lamy 2000. About this Moonman, yeah, I don't believe that's titanium. Anyway, apart from the design being sleeker, I don't find any compelling reason to worth the price in comparison to any other Hero o Wing Sung 51-like pens. Thank you for the video. And Thanks for take another one for your viewers.
Thanks for another very informative video. Wish I would wait for your review before I order it Now I have a quick question. Did you buy or planning to buy Moonman X1? The only reason I didn't buy one yet is because it is available only with EF nib everywhere while F is out of stock
I won't be getting an X1. I don't think the pen it copies (Montblanc Boheme) makes any sense either. Why have a retractable nib in a pen that has a cap? Other than a gimmick, I have no clue.
I went to school in a large Greek community in Queens NY. I had classmates named Yanni, Cosmo, Aristotle, Socrates, but we had no Archimedes. Maybe that is another reason why this all looked new to me! :-)
To obtain the density of this "titanium" fountain pen, you must: 1- weigh the barrel (cap) 2- determine the volume of the barrel (cap) 3- divide the first by the second You should get something around 4.5 g / cm³. I doubt very much that you will be able to accurately implement the second point at home. PS: Titanium is absolutely indifferent to the magnet. Pure titanium, like aluminum, leaves a dirty mark on your hands.
I did 1-3 and got lower numbers. I determined volume by displacement. But there are a lot of materials in the cap like plastic and brass that will skew the numbers.
I do like the looks of the TI200 better but the WS 601 easily wins with it's filling system. Really a shame MM didn't put more into this especially with that tall price tag.
Loved the intro!! Way to Go Doug! You mentioned bent nib Bobby. I am thinking of getting another Jinghao 100 with a bent nib...how do those work? I've heard of a 1.1mm stub nib, or just a stub nib but does a bent or "Fude" nib Ive heard them called, are they like a calligraphy dip pen nib? The harder you press the broader the line width?
No. The bent nib "fude" was designed for asian language calligraphy but can be used for western cursive. The end of the nib is bent up and you write with the flat part of the tines touching the paper so you get a brush-like stroke.
Hello, Doug. I was wondering how you converted the WINGSUNG to all Stainless steel? I’m seeing there looks to be a black ablative section originally from the photo. So how and where do you buy I’m assuming a stainless steel section for the WINGSUNG 601? Did you take the T 200 section off that really is stainless and not Titanium and use that in the Wingsung??? @InkquiringMinds need to know ???
I bought the stainless steel hood for the 601 from Bobby's Aliexpress store: tinyurl.com/5d2h455b The Ti200 section is titanium alloy and doesn't fit the Wing Sung 601.
Determination of the composition of steel in a few seconds.There are devices: The Olympus DELTA / VANTA express analyzers are able to perform any necessary measurements with accuracy and excellent speed due to the advanced X-ray fluorescence analysis technology.Often such devices are available to people engaged in buying gold products or collectors of rare coins.
@@InkquiringMinds The device is manufactured in the USA. If there is a dealer in your country, then I think they would not refuse to check the composition of steel with the issuance of an opinion. This is a free advertising of their products. I do not recommend buying it, it is quite expensive. And in everyday life, if you do not sell gold bars, you do not need it. Just throw a cry, suddenly among your viewers there is a flaw detector from the laboratory of non-destructive testing methods. Titanium alloys ( with a high titanium content)they leave a trace on glass, porcelain, earthenware. It is erased from the earthenware with strong, poisonous acids.
Thanks for another interesting analysis and comparison. Moonman drives me bonkers with its (I guess it’s one) business model and inconsistent design choices. Some are among my favorite pens, and some are just pointless/confusing. I totally agree with you on the 601. I actually do like hooded nibs, and my 601 Flighter is one of my favorite pens. I also went to a Bobby bent nib, although I didn’t switch to the stainless section cover. I missed that along the way somehow. I’m not sure I would want to swap, but where did you get that? Anyway, keep the good ones coming, and have a great summer.
Revisiones de plumas con partes que no son las originales para mi carecen de sentido. Si para que una pluma sea buena hay que cambiar su nib o su feed ,entonces evaluaras una frankenfountain pen. Cordial saludo
Ahí es donde te equivocas. Mostré una muestra de escritura con la punta original y con la punta de reemplazo a propósito debido a que los puristas dirán que no revisé la pluma original. Hice.
@@InkquiringMinds Es justamente lo que quería expresar. Seguramente para quienes tiene acceso por sus ingresos, por disponibilidad en el mercado de comprar distintos nibs y el conocimiento para intercambiarlos, es posible considerar ese tipo de opciones. TIENE SENTIDO. Pero la mayoría quisiéramos que cada pluma, en su totalidad, fuera totalmente operativa y satisfactoria para el cliente que la adquiere. Hay un video de Stevebrown sobre este tema. Es interesante, sin ninguna duda, saber que opciones de nibs se pueden considerar para mejorar cada estilográfica. A mi en particular me gustaría conocer nibs FLEXIBLES para cada caso y sobre este tema quisiera pensar que alguien se atreva a diseñar un nib flexible para Lammy y sus replicas. Cordial saludo.
You should consult with your other Canadian pen guru, Doodlebud, to see what he thinks it’s made of. Great review as usual. I thought you didn’t care for the 628 with gold nib?
I found them on Ali-Express US $18.00 50%OFF | 1Pc Steel Grip For Wing Sung 601 Hooded Nib Fountain Pen Ink Pen Stationery Office school supplies a.aliexpress.com/_mMCx3cz
@@zeroday4281 No problem, I coincidentally was also looking for them as I want to upgrade my 601 but at the moment I'm torn between the tubular section & hooded one, similar to Doug, I dislike hooded nibs but those bobby nibs have started to grow on me.
I have to admit to liking the LOOKS of this pen, and the Wing Sung 601A Flighter with the stainless steel section. But sometime after getting a raft of Jinhao Sharks with the hooded EF nibs, a couple of Jinhao 911 pens with hooded nibs, some Jinhao 51a pens with hooded nibs, and an honest-to-gosh vintage Parker 51 with a hooded nib and aerometric filler, I finally realized, I don't really care for hooded nibs. When I first saw this, I thought it was an integrated nib, and I would have been all over that like white on Chinese rice. But when I realized that it was a hooded nib, I pulled the throttles back and shut down the afterburner and just kind of soared past at altitude on autopilot. I don't think there is a price point above $5 that would redeem what I don't like about this pen, as well as my utter lack of desire to own one, and convince me to purchase it. Sorry, Moonman. Normally a fan, but this one is a swing and a miss. Incidentally, my test for titanium would have required a bore hole and a mass chromatograph. Not worth the effort.
Yeah, if I grind the shit out of the Ti200, the sparks would tell me if it is titanium, but then I'd have another dead, expensive pen. LOL If Moonman had made this an integrated nib I'd be sooo excited!
Some ways it’s a shame you changed the nib as it would have been interesting to see how the stock nib wrote regardless.I thought it would be ordinary so I ordered the gold nib 14k. Hopefully it will write a bit more smoothly. I’ve always liked hooded nibs since my father came back from the States in the sixties with a Parker 51. Fingers crossed. I’m told the cap is steel but the body is titanium. Have you weighed the uncapped bodies of the Moonman and the Flighter?
I did show the writing sample I made with the original nib right out of the box. It was thin and dry and lacked any kind of character. The uncapped Ti200 and WS601 are basically the same weight - WS is .5 grams heavier.
@@InkquiringMinds At the end of the day I like a pen that writes decently and has a bit of heft. Always get some 12-15,000 micro mesh paper, do a few figure 8s. I am hoping it turns out to be a landmark pen quality wise for Chinese manufacturers no longer content to just be imitators. Penbbs year of the Ox is a very good ( my 2nd Penbbs) as has been the Calyarts & other Chinese demonstrator piston fillers.
You mention a guy named Chris that reviews pens and is a metallurgist. I was wondering what his channel name is? I tried to spell his last name, but nothing comes up on UA-cam. I’m assuming I’m spelling his name wrong or his channel is of a different name. Cheers.
I agree the Amethyst ink is lovely. I don't know about Canada but in the US, Allie Express is well known for having knock off fake items. Alot of people goto the sight to get Louis Vuitton,Channel,Supreme,Cartier jewelry,clothing, handbags. And other expenses items because they come from overseas and are well made. I myself bought a handbag from there. Took forever to get here but has the same look and markings where you would expect and even came with Authenticity paper work and paid maybe 25% of what the real bag was worth instead of thousands I paid under $200.00. Just thought you should be aware of all the fakes on that website because they are good fakes. They fake makeup,jewelry, shoes,clothing anything that is more expensive brands. Just thought you should be aware. Just looking out for my Canadian pen loving pal.
Yikes! Put it on the short list for worst pen of 2021. So, you have a LAMY 2K!!! I cannot wait to hear your opinion. I hate mine! Bwa-hahahaha! Totally true though. I don't care for it. I hope to see your review soon?!?! Thank you!
I thought it would be nice to send these spare noisy kids your way.. Funny story, they’re still hopped up on Halloween Candy. Oh, and one of them is ‘Pirate Spider-Man’ which I believe may be a permanent condition. And just so you don’t think me a heartless monster, these are my nieces and nephews, meaning they only share 25% of my DNA… Have fun or not… Lol…. 😉
An ode to Glen Campbell and Jimmy Webb and 1968 - the single best music year ever! However my bad memories of Parker 51s and other hooded nibs of that ilk have turned me off, even after another stirring review by Doug.🤔
I have a WS601 (although not the stainless steel version) and together with my vintage Markant 160 they are the best Parker 51 clones I have. I use them for taking quick notes but not for long writing sessions. I don't care if the Moonman is really made of titanium (they call it a titanium alloy). For that price you can start looking for a real vintage Parker 51/61. According to several people "Mojiang" is actually pronounced "More Junk" which is unfortunate as it is the chinese company/brand name meaning "last artisan". This might be a reaction to Kaweco registering "Moonman" and "Wing Sung" as international trademarks for themselves. So these companies can't use the names for now in certain countries preventing them from exporting their evil Kaweco clones to countries like Germany. trademarks.justia.com/792/96/moonman-79296553.html trademarks.justia.com/792/98/wing-79298548.html (The Gutberlet GmbH mentioned in the registrations is the owner of Kaweco). We'll see how this develops. I haven't heard of any complaints of customs confiscating Moonman pens here yet. But if this will prevent me from buying more Moonman/WS pens it will also prevent me from buying more Kaweco pens.
@@InkquiringMinds There was a discussion about this on chrisrap52's channel when he was reviewing the Mojiang/Moonman M700. To quote another viewer: "Mojiang: Mo(末) Jiang (匠). The Chinese name of the Moonman brand - the Moonman logo is a stylized design of 末匠.". Someone on reddit translated it to "Last Artisan" where Google translates it to "last craftsman". So "Mojiang" addresses the same company as "Moonman" but the chinese name has a different meaning. And someone else adjusted the pronunciation a bit to "more junk" without the "k" at the end. I guess we all have to get used to it...
Sorry that Bobby is participating in this nefarious scheme. Boo, hiss, Moonman. I fart in your general direction and shake the titanium "dust" from my feet. Thanks, Doug!
Love your vids man
When you look inside of ti200's barrel, you can see it's machined from solid chunk of metal. So that makes the thickness of barrel much thicker than WS601. And ti200 has solid metal clip but WS601 has sheet metal clip, so that also makes ti200 heavyer. So i'm sure ti200 is made of titanium.
You are correct. But, I'm dubious about how much of this metal is titanium. As I said, I'm sure there is SOME titanium content to that "titanium alloy". How much is the question. And is it worth the higher price tag because of it? It isn't lighter and it doesn't need to be stronger. So, why is it titanium at all?
@@InkquiringMinds most metals used for anything are alloys, with almost no pure elements, so it's not dubious because it's called an alloy? I don't think there are many metal alloys which contain any titanium other than ones which are primarily titanium, with the usual additives for improved machinability and other features (molybdenum, chromium, etc.). It'd be more expensive for them to some rare titanium alloy, probably?
If it's significantly less magnetic and twice the cost (titanium is more difficult to machine on top of raw costs), I'd be quite confident that it is a titanium pen.
Unless they got a hold of that very new iron-aluminum alloy with extremely similar properties, which is arguably cooler.
As an "Inkquiring" Minds fan..loved the poly-screen intro besides the review. Thought of ordering but I was also skeptical.
Thanks, Wendy!
Finally! I've been hoarding Montblanc Lavender Purple because I could not find any writing samples of the new Amethyst Purple, and I was afraid that it would be as disappointing a comparison as their Modena vs Corn Poppy Red. The Amethyst looks both beautiful and comparable though, so I should probably let go of one of my backups 🤣
Thank you!
Clash between clip and body colors breaks deal for me. Ears 2nd deal breaker for me. Price is third. Wing Sung for the win. I love Wing Sung. I still kind of want a Moonman just cause I love the name so much.
The Ti200 is a touch thinner than the WS601 as well and I like the added girth.
Thanks so much for this glowing review of the WS 601A! Or, um, you know what I mean. Thanks for warning us off of this one.
LOL Thanks Thomas!
Professor Doug, Oh great now I have to be mature! So many boundaries in life.
Adulting sucks.
Super video thanks Prof. It’s the way things are going isn’t it? Increasing prices for dubious benefits. Or something. 👍👌🙏
Yes, exactly
My 601 "Flighter" with SS hood weighs in at 31.5gm, my Ti200 is 33.7gm, heavier but not by a lot. What are the advantages of a Titanium Alloy pen? Why advertise it as Titanium? Those are my questions. No one asks what type of Stainless steel is used, there are many kinds. One thing they both share, no steel parts that a magnet attracts. Better grade stainless steels are non-magnetic. Carbon steel is magnetic & costs less. for me, it's a metal pen. I enjoy the F nib that is on the Ti200. When I need a fine line or using porous paper, the F nib works perfectly. Alan also likes it.
Thanks, Chris! I enjoyed both Alan's and your reviews. I still love my WS601 Flighter, though the Ti200 is growing on my now that the sticker shock is wearing off! :)
Titanium was first used as an aerospace alloy for the SR-71 Blackbird. It has a high strength to weight ratio and is corrosion resistant in seawater and chloride rich environments. It also has a fairly low heat expansion coefficient, meaning it changes shape less than other materials at high temperatures.
For a pen, it has a unique gray color, feels warm in the hand because of its low thermal conductivity and inks will generally not attack the metal. 😁
@@Kenjiro5775 Great info! Thanks!
I totally agree with you. People are so easy to agree with a Chinese merchant just because they say what they say it is not challenging the statement for the obvious reason.
There is a huge amount of outright lying going on with most products from Chinese vendors - especially on Aliexpress. One of my favourite vendors is "Bobby" whose store is called "St. Penpps Chinese Pen Store". And he calls EVERY brand he sells, whether it is MaJohn, WingSung or Jinhao, "St. Penpps". So the Jinhao x159 is called "St. Penpps x159 fountain pen". Ludicrous.
Thanks for the video! Are the nibs interchangeable between the 601 and ti200?
Yes they are.
LOL. I had subtitles enabled from a prior video, and you'll be amused to learn that UA-cam says,
"I am alignment for the county...." Hilarity ensued.
LOL Keeping it "straight".
When you reviewed the Wing Sung 601 Flighter and waxed poetic about the Stainless Steel Nosecone I was somewhat intrigued, so looking on Etsy I found the items and noted that the Stainless Steel Grip Section was listed at a whopping $1000.00 US, while also noting that they had sold hundreds. I Emailed Customer Service and got the customary "no response." Now that it's back from the Stratosphere to a more realistic price I've decided that I like the black plastic anyway. I did order the Bobby nibs, so thanks for the Nailclipper-ectomy hint. Works wonders.
$1000 is a placeholder for an item out of stock on Etsy.
@@InkquiringMinds
Ah-ha, one of the many hidden secrets of penpersonship......
Thanks Doug for a detailed review of this pen. I am also not a big fan of hooded nibs so I probably won't rush out to buy this or the Wing Sung. Of the two the Wing Sung does appear to be the best value.
Fair enough!
Great review Doug. Thank you for your honesty, especially in mentioning whether or not a fountain pen is worth its price tag. As far as hooded nibs go, my only experience is a Lamy 2000, which is a semi-hooded nib. I've been enjoying it for some time and I hope you enjoy it also. Again, 👍👍!
I'm working on my Lamy 2000 review this week!
@@InkquiringMinds Excellent! Looking forward to seeing it.
Just got one of these and it looks like Sailor cartridges fit.
Hi Doug- received my Ti200 today. Happy enough with the pen and the 14K nib- feedback but not scratchy . My major gripe is with the converter which doesn’t fill to more than a third full - fill it fast or slow. A bit like trying to cross the US/Canada on a Harley Sportster with a peanut gas tank. A decent converter would make a huge difference. I shall wander this Green Earth like Fugitive looking for a functional converter.
I fill my converters with a syringe so I've never noticed issues like that.
@@InkquiringMinds I’ll have to scratch around for an ink syringe.
If you have some strong magnets perhaps you could test how they react to the magnets? I was able to distinguish titanium nibs and steel nibs by doing this as titanium is not attracted to magnets and the steel as ever so slightly.
The magnet is more attracted to the WS601 than the Ti200. I'm willing to believe there is some titanium in the pen (a titanium alloy of some percentages) but not enough to justify that price.
I saw this on ebay from $59 USD to $112USD and reached the same conclusion you did that it was overpriced since I bought 2 WS 601A pens for about the price of 1 of the Moonman pens. Thanks, Doug!
Thank you, Kevin!
@@InkquiringMinds , you are welcome Doug! I might look into a stainless section for my WS 601A flighter before I order the MMTI-200
Thanks, Doug, for this review and taking a bullet for us. If I were to test whether it is real titanium, I would anodize it with three or four 9V batteries. That would change the color to a pretty blue.
And what do you do with the burn marks?? LOL
If it’s titanium, there will be no burn marks. I’ve anodized titanium scales on a few of my knives.
I would have really preferred this Ti 200 not to be in titanium, but in simple stainless steel, with the same finish and a price around 20€... I really like its design, especially the matte version (basically a better finished and more durable version of the Jinhao 911).
I don't see anything wrong with the density measurements you made, though I notice there's a plastic liner in my wing sung 601 flighter. Not sure if there is a plastic liner in the moonman but that might throw the measurements off. Plus I've always found Archimedes' principle to be a bit finicky whenever students do it in intro labs. In any case, I doubt it's pure titanium.
Yes, I mentioned the plastic liner in the Ti200. Yes, the plastic in there is more boyant as well which might account for the lighter than expected readings on the WS601.
Interesting review!
Glad you enjoyed it
from the image it supposed stainless steel, as titanium color is more to warm side, I have 2 titanium watch before, that is just my eye inspect ^_^
The Ti200 is slightly darker than the WS601.
Been waiting for this review!
Long edit with some coments: since it isn't based on the same design, I don't think you can directly compare the density - it might be thrown off by the thickness of components, for instance. Plus, aren't some parts which are plastic in the Wing Sung, made out of metal in the Moonman?
In metallurgy, "Titanium alloys" refer to alloys whose main component is Titanium. Titanium is almost always alloyed with aluminium and vanadium for better properties. But of course, AliExpress sellers don't know anything about this.
All in all, I'm still unsure about this pen. Guess I might have to end up buying both :P.
But I completely agree with you on the 14K gold. It's just completely wasted under a rigid hood.
On testing for titanium: "Hold any genuine titanium metal object to a grinding wheel (even a little grindstone on a Dremel tool will do), and it gives off a shower of brilliant white sparks unlike any softer common metal. The sparks are tiny pieces of cut titanium--the friction of the grinder heats them till they burn white-hot. Hold a grindstone to the shackle of a "titanium" padlock from Master Lock, however, and you'll instead see the telltale fine, long, yellow sparks of high-carbon steel."
I might end up doing that if I buy it.
Yeah, that's why I mentioned the various materials in the cap from plastic to brass and also that I was unwilling to destroy a $70US pen for "science" LOL
I appreciate the review. I am now glad I did not purchase the mock titanium Moonman. I had seen the same pen, for same price advertised as stainless steel. I became distracted (probably by those noisy kids) & did not order. Now I’m glad I did not waste my money…
Wow ! You’ve done some serious research and experiment to determine the ‘titaniumness’ of TI200..
I’d pick 601 over TI200 mainly because of those golden trims..
While I was wondering how the overall shape and the name ‘flighter’ appear familiar, I suddenly realized that I got a Parker 45 Flighter recently !
The "flighter" was a model that Ken Parker put out for the Parker 51 and other models that was all stainless steel because of his love of aircraft and the sleek style of the modern planes and jets of that era.
The link to Bobby bent nibs is gone. Sad. I have the ti200 and AM very anxious to swap out the nib.
C$ 10.11 50％ Off | 4Pcs Fountain Pen Nibs 0.5-0.8mm Bent Nib For St Penpps 618 601 613 Fountain Pen Ink Pen Stationery Office school supplies
a.aliexpress.com/_m05ehxY
Nice video Doug. Glad to see you're already trying a Lamy 2000. About this Moonman, yeah, I don't believe that's titanium. Anyway, apart from the design being sleeker, I don't find any compelling reason to worth the price in comparison to any other Hero o Wing Sung 51-like pens.
Thank you for the video. And Thanks for take another one for your viewers.
Right on! The Lamy 2K will be next Saturday.
Thanks for another very informative video. Wish I would wait for your review before I order it
Now I have a quick question. Did you buy or planning to buy Moonman X1? The only reason I didn't buy one yet is because it is available only with EF nib everywhere while F is out of stock
I won't be getting an X1. I don't think the pen it copies (Montblanc Boheme) makes any sense either. Why have a retractable nib in a pen that has a cap? Other than a gimmick, I have no clue.
Bravo on your attempt to do the math on the titanium vs the stainless steel. I missed that day in school apparently.
Thank you! Archimedes Eureka! Day!
I went to school in a large Greek community in Queens NY. I had classmates named Yanni, Cosmo, Aristotle, Socrates, but we had no Archimedes. Maybe that is another reason why this all looked new to me! :-)
LOL
@@InkquiringMinds To quote the irreplaceable Terry Pratchett: "Eureka," he said. "Going to have a bath then?"
SCNR
To obtain the density of this "titanium" fountain pen, you must:
1- weigh the barrel (cap)
2- determine the volume of the barrel (cap)
3- divide the first by the second
You should get something around 4.5 g / cm³. I doubt very much that you will be able to accurately implement the second point at home.
PS: Titanium is absolutely indifferent to the magnet. Pure titanium, like aluminum, leaves a dirty mark on your hands.
I did 1-3 and got lower numbers. I determined volume by displacement. But there are a lot of materials in the cap like plastic and brass that will skew the numbers.
I do like the looks of the TI200 better but the WS 601 easily wins with it's filling system. Really a shame MM didn't put more into this especially with that tall price tag.
The new Ti500 is very interesting - piston filler! Coming soon.
Loved the intro!! Way to Go Doug! You mentioned bent nib Bobby.
I am thinking of getting another Jinghao 100 with a bent nib...how do those work? I've heard of a 1.1mm stub nib, or just a stub nib but does a bent or "Fude" nib Ive heard them called, are they like a calligraphy dip pen nib? The harder you press the broader the line width?
No. The bent nib "fude" was designed for asian language calligraphy but can be used for western cursive. The end of the nib is bent up and you write with the flat part of the tines touching the paper so you get a brush-like stroke.
Wichita Lineman, favorite Glen Campbell song. Freddie Hubbard did a jazz trumpet rendition of the song as well.
Beautiful Jimmy Webb song!
Hello, Doug. I was wondering how you converted the WINGSUNG to all Stainless steel? I’m seeing there looks to be a black ablative section originally from the photo. So how and where do you buy I’m assuming a stainless steel section for the WINGSUNG 601? Did you take the T 200 section off that really is stainless and not Titanium and use that in the Wingsung??? @InkquiringMinds need to know ???
I bought the stainless steel hood for the 601 from Bobby's Aliexpress store: tinyurl.com/5d2h455b The Ti200 section is titanium alloy and doesn't fit the Wing Sung 601.
@@InkquiringMinds okay got it! I’m going to go check that out. Thank you!!! Cheers
Determination of the composition of steel in a few seconds.There are devices: The Olympus DELTA / VANTA express analyzers are able to perform any necessary measurements with accuracy and excellent speed due to the advanced X-ray fluorescence analysis technology.Often such devices are available to people engaged in buying gold products or collectors of rare coins.
Do you think I could get one of those Olympus Delta/Vanta machines for less than the cost of the pen?
@@InkquiringMinds The device is manufactured in the USA. If there is a dealer in your country, then I think they would not refuse to check the composition of steel with the issuance of an opinion. This is a free advertising of their products. I do not recommend buying it, it is quite expensive. And in everyday life, if you do not sell gold bars, you do not need it. Just throw a cry, suddenly among your viewers there is a flaw detector from the laboratory of non-destructive testing methods. Titanium alloys ( with a high titanium content)they leave a trace on glass, porcelain, earthenware. It is erased from the earthenware with strong, poisonous acids.
I was totally unimpressed by this pen, initially. After watching your review... well, my first impression is confirmed.
Glad it helped!
i did not go out to buy the Moonman like you usually intice me to do with your reviews. Chalk one up for the wife!
I'll get you next time! :)
Thanks for another interesting analysis and comparison. Moonman drives me bonkers with its (I guess it’s one) business model and inconsistent design choices. Some are among my favorite pens, and some are just pointless/confusing. I totally agree with you on the 601. I actually do like hooded nibs, and my 601 Flighter is one of my favorite pens. I also went to a Bobby bent nib, although I didn’t switch to the stainless section cover. I missed that along the way somehow. I’m not sure I would want to swap, but where did you get that? Anyway, keep the good ones coming, and have a great summer.
The sections are available on Bobby's Etsy, eBay and AliExpress pages - ChinesePen, office_supplies_pen, and St Penpps Chinese Pen Store
Revisiones de plumas con partes que no son las originales para mi carecen de sentido. Si para que una pluma sea buena hay que cambiar su nib o su feed ,entonces evaluaras una frankenfountain pen.
Cordial saludo
Ahí es donde te equivocas. Mostré una muestra de escritura con la punta original y con la punta de reemplazo a propósito debido a que los puristas dirán que no revisé la pluma original. Hice.
@@InkquiringMinds Es justamente lo que quería expresar. Seguramente para quienes tiene acceso por sus ingresos, por disponibilidad en el mercado de comprar distintos nibs y el conocimiento para intercambiarlos, es posible considerar ese tipo de opciones. TIENE SENTIDO. Pero la mayoría quisiéramos que cada pluma, en su totalidad, fuera totalmente operativa y satisfactoria para el cliente que la adquiere. Hay un video de Stevebrown sobre este tema. Es interesante, sin ninguna duda, saber que opciones de nibs se pueden considerar para mejorar cada estilográfica. A mi en particular me gustaría conocer nibs FLEXIBLES para cada caso y sobre este tema quisiera pensar que alguien se atreva a diseñar un nib flexible para Lammy y sus replicas.
Cordial saludo.
You should consult with your other Canadian pen guru, Doodlebud, to see what he thinks it’s made of. Great review as usual. I thought you didn’t care for the 628 with gold nib?
Good idea! I've already corresponded with him about other things. He actually convinced me to get a Lamy 2K!
Where did you get the stainless steel nib section?
I found them on Ali-Express
US $18.00 50%OFF | 1Pc Steel Grip For Wing Sung 601 Hooded Nib Fountain Pen Ink Pen Stationery Office school supplies
a.aliexpress.com/_mMCx3cz
@@i.c.3157 thank you for the link
@@zeroday4281 No problem, I coincidentally was also looking for them as I want to upgrade my 601 but at the moment I'm torn between the tubular section & hooded one, similar to Doug, I dislike hooded nibs but those bobby nibs have started to grow on me.
Bobby has them on both his Etsy page and his eBay page. (ChinesePen and office_supplies_pen respectively)
Hmm...all in all, a bit underwhelming. But your 'custom' WS is still cool.
Thank you, archivist17!
I rather like my 601, too - much more than my Parker 51
Me too!
Haha, Titanium dust sprinkled over it! Satire at its best!
LOL
I have to admit to liking the LOOKS of this pen, and the Wing Sung 601A Flighter with the stainless steel section. But sometime after getting a raft of Jinhao Sharks with the hooded EF nibs, a couple of Jinhao 911 pens with hooded nibs, some Jinhao 51a pens with hooded nibs, and an honest-to-gosh vintage Parker 51 with a hooded nib and aerometric filler, I finally realized, I don't really care for hooded nibs. When I first saw this, I thought it was an integrated nib, and I would have been all over that like white on Chinese rice. But when I realized that it was a hooded nib, I pulled the throttles back and shut down the afterburner and just kind of soared past at altitude on autopilot. I don't think there is a price point above $5 that would redeem what I don't like about this pen, as well as my utter lack of desire to own one, and convince me to purchase it.
Sorry, Moonman. Normally a fan, but this one is a swing and a miss.
Incidentally, my test for titanium would have required a bore hole and a mass chromatograph. Not worth the effort.
Yeah, if I grind the shit out of the Ti200, the sparks would tell me if it is titanium, but then I'd have another dead, expensive pen. LOL If Moonman had made this an integrated nib I'd be sooo excited!
Some ways it’s a shame you changed the nib as it would have been interesting to see how the stock nib wrote regardless.I thought it would be ordinary so I ordered the gold nib 14k. Hopefully it will write a bit more smoothly. I’ve always liked hooded nibs since my father came back from the States in the sixties with a Parker 51. Fingers crossed. I’m told the cap is steel but the body is titanium. Have you weighed the uncapped bodies of the Moonman and the Flighter?
I did show the writing sample I made with the original nib right out of the box. It was thin and dry and lacked any kind of character. The uncapped Ti200 and WS601 are basically the same weight - WS is .5 grams heavier.
@@InkquiringMinds At the end of the day I like a pen that writes decently and has a bit of heft. Always get some 12-15,000 micro mesh paper, do a few figure 8s. I am hoping it turns out to be a landmark pen quality wise for Chinese manufacturers no longer content to just be imitators. Penbbs year of the Ox is a very good ( my 2nd Penbbs) as has been the Calyarts & other Chinese demonstrator piston fillers.
You mention a guy named Chris that reviews pens and is a metallurgist. I was wondering what his channel name is? I tried to spell his last name, but nothing comes up on UA-cam. I’m assuming I’m spelling his name wrong or his channel is of a different name. Cheers.
His channel is chrisrap52
@@InkquiringMinds ahhh, okay. I am subbed to him. I must have missed that one. Thanks much!
Do cartridges fit this pen? If so, which ones?
Pilot cartridges fit, but I've not tested to see if they leak.
Okay, thank you for the reply.
That's a bold price for the same old. You shouldn't have Doug. You really shouldn't have hehehe.
Meh. It is a nice pen to hold and write with now that it has the Bobby nib and the sticker shock has faded. :)
@@InkquiringMinds Well that's good. The cloud has a titanium silver lining 😉
I agree the Amethyst ink is lovely. I don't know about Canada but in the US, Allie Express is well known for having knock off fake items. Alot of people goto the sight to get Louis Vuitton,Channel,Supreme,Cartier jewelry,clothing, handbags. And other expenses items because they come from overseas and are well made. I myself bought a handbag from there. Took forever to get here but has the same look and markings where you would expect and even came with Authenticity paper work and paid maybe 25% of what the real bag was worth instead of thousands I paid under $200.00. Just thought you should be aware of all the fakes on that website because they are good fakes. They fake makeup,jewelry, shoes,clothing anything that is more expensive brands. Just thought you should be aware. Just looking out for my Canadian pen loving pal.
Yes. AliExpress is a hoot to watch actually. All of the Montblanc pens for $30. Amazing deals! NOT! LOL
Yikes! Put it on the short list for worst pen of 2021. So, you have a LAMY 2K!!! I cannot wait to hear your opinion. I hate mine! Bwa-hahahaha! Totally true though. I don't care for it. I hope to see your review soon?!?! Thank you!
Yes! Working on the review for this Saturday.
I thought it would be nice to send these spare noisy kids your way.. Funny story, they’re still hopped up on Halloween Candy. Oh, and one of them is ‘Pirate Spider-Man’ which I believe may be a permanent condition. And just so you don’t think me a heartless monster, these are my nieces and nephews, meaning they only share 25% of my DNA… Have fun or not… Lol…. 😉
LOL
An ode to Glen Campbell and Jimmy Webb and 1968 - the single best music year ever! However my bad memories of Parker 51s and other hooded nibs of that ilk have turned me off, even after another stirring review by Doug.🤔
Thanks, Brad. The Webb-Campbell partnership was awesome!
I have a WS601 (although not the stainless steel version) and together with my vintage Markant 160 they are the best Parker 51 clones I have. I use them for taking quick notes but not for long writing sessions.
I don't care if the Moonman is really made of titanium (they call it a titanium alloy). For that price you can start looking for a real vintage Parker 51/61.
According to several people "Mojiang" is actually pronounced "More Junk" which is unfortunate as it is the chinese company/brand name meaning "last artisan". This might be a reaction to Kaweco registering "Moonman" and "Wing Sung" as international trademarks for themselves. So these companies can't use the names for now in certain countries preventing them from exporting their evil Kaweco clones to countries like Germany.
trademarks.justia.com/792/96/moonman-79296553.html
trademarks.justia.com/792/98/wing-79298548.html
(The Gutberlet GmbH mentioned in the registrations is the owner of Kaweco).
We'll see how this develops. I haven't heard of any complaints of customs confiscating Moonman pens here yet. But if this will prevent me from buying more Moonman/WS pens it will also prevent me from buying more Kaweco pens.
I've been told Mojiang means "Moonman" in Chinese.
@@InkquiringMinds There was a discussion about this on chrisrap52's channel when he was reviewing the Mojiang/Moonman M700. To quote another viewer:
"Mojiang: Mo(末) Jiang (匠). The Chinese name of the Moonman brand - the Moonman logo is a stylized design of 末匠.". Someone on reddit translated it to "Last Artisan" where Google translates it to "last craftsman". So "Mojiang" addresses the same company as "Moonman" but the chinese name has a different meaning.
And someone else adjusted the pronunciation a bit to "more junk" without the "k" at the end.
I guess we all have to get used to it...
@@stephanfeinen3923 Thanks for this. MoreJun it is!
Sorry that Bobby is participating in this nefarious scheme. Boo, hiss, Moonman. I fart in your general direction and shake the
titanium "dust" from my feet. Thanks, Doug!
Oh he's just reselling like everyone else. Thanks, David! :)