Brother, the Lord bless you, I ask He will continue to use you and your videos to simplify greek, get men and women excited to study God's word in the original language. The way you teach is so easy to understand, very broken down into digestible terms and examples. Thank you kindly for you videos, keep it up. I'm excited to watch more.
Thank you! I'm glad the series is helpful. I'm actively recording more now -- Easter weekend is busier than expected, but you'll have more biblical Greek videos in the next couple of days.
@@GulfsideMinistries see the greek orthodox church. In all it says prays hymns readings in church uses koine greek never the erasmius way to say the words
I'm only 5 min in and already know I'm going to really enjoy this. A little disappointed with the Erasmian pronunciation but I understand it dominates the seminary world. Coming more from the language learning world I'm happy to see a move towards a more historic pronunciation within NT Greek studies... but I'm splitting hairs. The whole idea of this project is great.
Just got my Greek New Testament book, I just finished learning the alphabet an hour ago and have come here! Already I'm very encouraged based on my progress due to this video. Thanks for having this up for free! It's so helpful
Thank you! I struggled through Bill Mounce’s book even though I learned quite a bit! I also gained appreciation for the impact learning Greek can have… The only problem….when I finished the course (I got up to Level 2 in an online Biblical course)…I moved on to greener pastures. I’ve been feeling the need to go back to Greek but apply it directly to my Bible study. This video does that! Thanks!
Thank you so much for taking this approach. Grammar-forward teaching makes learning much harder. After years of exposure to Greek, I have begun to arrive at a place where grasping it more fully seems possible. This teaching style is accelerating my apprehension of things I have been struggling to understand for some time.
This is the most clearly and simply articulated explanation I have heard on John 1:1 and the JW mistranslation of it. Thank you so much for this! God Bless!
Great series so far. I’ve been wanting to get back into my study of biblical Greek as a lay-person but didn’t think I’d be able to find the drive to do so by looking at one of my older academic books on biblical Greek. I love this approach of just jumping right in.
It is so impressive to listen to the NT in ancient greek. Thank you for your detailed explanation on the original text. What a wonderful work you did. I will follow your channel from now on.
Wow! I mean, it's powwrful enough in English but this understanding shook me and brought tears to my eyes. Wow! Thank you for this video! It makes me excited about going forward in Greek and your making it so much easier teaching it this way! You mention the JWs but I thought of the gnostics and their belief in a demi urge and how all the gnostic pretension at knowledge is just totally blown out of the water by this one verse.
There is much that I like about how you have done this. In fact, in general, I like everything about it. I especially like the explanation of the accusative and nominative cases. Another excellent way to help clarify the accusative and nominative case, is to refer to the distinction between "him" and "he" as well as "them" and "they" etc. Your analogy is better than those examples, but using both ways of conveying the matter provides further ease of clarity. I would like to offer how I would use details to give clearer understanding to those who are brand new to Greek. If we start with an even more wooden translation, then we get intuitive insight into some matters, and we also introduce a few concepts, and this will preempt some future questions to simplify those matters when it becomes necessary to address them. What is nice about addressing a matter before it becomes necessary, is it provides some exposure and primes for when it is necessary. If we write it three times, progressively, then we offer an easy bridge to all of the details. -"In first had been being he the statement and he the statement had been being toward him the God and God had been being he the statement." -"In beginning was the statement, and the statement was toward the God, and, God, was the statement." -"In the beginning was the Statement, and the Statement was toward God, and the Statement was God." I think it's confusing to teach that "logos" means "word" without explaining exactly what we do not mean by "word". I prefer to translate "pros" more literally; whether we say "toward" or "with" we are really not conveying the full semantic of the contextual application, but at least "toward" builds an accurate vocabulary. I also think that the definite articles are absent from "arche" and "theos" for intuitive semantic reasons (though I assumed your explanation in the final translation). I openly admit, especially in the case of "theos", that I may easily be wrong, so I am hearing you and I will carefully consider what you have taught here. I really like what you've done here. I happen to be a stickler (ask anyone who knows me), and I like to offer details; but that has more to do with me, rather than indicating any posture of criticalness toward you. I can take what I dish out, so if you have any details or correction to offer me, I'll receive such discussion gladly. Shalom.
I would tell people to look into the word pros(with) I believe there are about 4 word for out ONE "with" and pros(with) is really cool cause it denotes that the Word and God are "facing each other" in a trajectory that moves together. They are interfaced together.
Thank you so much for these videos. I took a little Greek many years ago for fun but didn't learn much really. Now I'm much more interested and your videos have helped explain things that I needed help with.
En Greek language there are two types of articles : definite articles and indefinite articles 1- Ο Η Το 2- ένας - μία - ένα For example: θα ήθελα έναν καφέ Τhanks
You are on to something really big. I just spent about 4 hours looking into Greek teaching tools I have in Logos software, a class on learning Greek at Christian Leaders Institute, and a couple of UA-cam beginner Greek classes. Until I found this video, everything had the same process of teaching, even when they said theirs was unique. Learn the alphabet, diphthongs, vowels, consonants, rules, exception to the rules, and in some cases, random vocabulary words as if you already knew all of the above. I learned more in 8 minutes of your video than in all the hours above. It could have been faster. If all you did was read along the Greek verse, then show the vocabulary from the verse and pointed out one Greek grammar point and stopped. That would be less than 10 minutes. The student could review each previous verse a few times each day and add a new verse each day for just 30 minutes. Then, the student could spend the rest of the hour memorizing the alphabet, the diphthongs, etc., and going through whatever grammar book. I'll bet that student would have a huge head start in understanding and in vocabulary than anyone starting Greek II. You could even throw in a bonus vocabulary word that isn't in the verse of the day, especially when, like verse 2, there will be some repetition from verse 1. If you taught an NT Greek class like that, I'd bet you'd have the lowest drop out rate of any other professor. I'm looking forward to the 11 other videos in this series. I'm sorry to see you quit, but I'll sure enjoy the ones you made. Shabbat Shalom!
I must say, you break it down so it's easy to understand. I've wanted to learn Greek to get more out of my Bible reading but most other YT channels teaching Greek don't seem to simplify it enough. Well done! I will be watching for the next lesson. One question. I've read some of Bruce M Metzger's literature (in case you don't know who he is he's a famous Bible Scholar and translator) who said in regard to John 1:1 and the NWT of Jehovah's Witnesses that with them adding the indefinite article it violates the Greek grammar rule called Colwell's rule. My question is, does that rule apply to that scripture or not? I had another YTber teaching Greek say that rule doesn't apply. I would think someone like Bruce Metzger who has had a long and famous career in translating Biblical Greek would know. Just want to get your take on it. Thanks
Well, it is a little more complicated than that... Colwell's Rule definitely applies to New Testament era Koine Greek, but unfortunately the rule has been somewhat misunderstood by Bible scholars. Essentially, the rule says that if there is a predicate nominative before the copulative verb (a "to be" verb) in word order, and that predicate nominative lacks the article (such as appears in καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος), the predicate nominative cannot be translated indefinitely based solely upon it lacking the article. Rather, you have to keep all three possibilities (definite, indefinite, qualitative) for the noun open and allow context to determine its meaning. In the case of John 1:1, Daniel B. Wallace ("Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics") makes an excellent case for the qualitative notion for θεὸς in John 1:1c (without taking away at all from the deity of Christ). Wallace states, "The most likely candidate for θεός is qualitative. This is true both grammatically (for the largest proportion of pre-verbal anarthrous predicate nominatives fall into this category) and theologically (both the theology of the Fourth Gospel and of the NT as a whole). There is a balance between the Word’s deity, which was already present in the beginning (ἐν ἀρχῇ . . . θεὸς ἦν [1:1], and his humanity, which was added later (σὰρξ ἐγένετο [1:14]). The grammatical structure of these two statements mirrors each other; both emphasize the nature of the Word, rather than his identity. But θεός was his nature from eternity (hence, εἰμί is used), while σάρξ was added at the incarnation (hence, γίνομαι is used)" ("Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics," 269).
@@reformeddogmatics8317 The other problem is that JWs believe that the θεὸς should have the definite article ὁ in front of it also. This is bad Greek. If this happened, then it would signify that ALL there is to θεὸς is ὁ λόγος [Jesus]. This is promoting the idea of Oneness/Jesus Only being all there is to God. In other words, Jesus ALONE is God. This was regarded as a heresy by the various Councils and even the JWs wouldn't accept this.
It's been a long time since I've had Koine Greek, but I thought that they shared the article making them equal to the point that one is exactly the same as the other, or one IS the other.
Hey Eric. Thanks for watching! No, they don't share an article. You might be thinking about adjectives, which we haven't covered much yet in this series. Sometimes, an adjective can share an article with the noun it modifies. So the phrase ho agathos anthrwpos would mean "the good man," with "ho" being the article for both the adjective (agathos) and the noun (anthrwpos). Outside of that, though, I'm not sure what you have in mind. If you find a reference to your idea, do share!
I am learning biblical (Koine) and Attic Greek and like your approach, but I am learning with modern Greek pronunciation, which I think is more useful than Erasmian for learning to deeply read ancient Greek ) and appreciate it as proper language, so sadly, it will confuse me to hear you read the biblical text.
You're just right. Nobody really knows how the Koine Greek used to sound. They believe they know what can't be known. To learn modern Greek is a lot more useful. You can even speak to the Greek people.
By convention, the Greek text doesn't typically capitalize "God" (theos). In the same way, it doesn't capitalize the pronoun when referring to God. Now, when I translate, I follow English conventions and I do capitalize "God" and pronouns (He/Him). But don't be surprised/offended when the Greek text doesn't do so. Just a bit of fun FYI, some Greek manuscripts have no spaces, punctuation, or even lowercase letters. They were just long strings of capitalized letters. SOTHOSEMANUSCRIPTSLOOKLIKETHISITMAYSOUNDCRAZYBUTTHEYCOULDREADITASEASILYASYOUCANREADTHIS It was called "scriptio continua" - feel free to look it up! :-)
Isn't the Koine Greek alpha pronounced like the a in father, not like the a in bat? This is harder for English speakers, since there are 26 different allophones for the letter a; but in Greek, like Spanish, is not each single vowel pronounced only one way?
Yes, you are correct. And as I think through my actual pronunciation of the various words, I find myself actually using the 'ah' sound. I just never say "ahl-fa." It's amazing what habits can do! But good catch.
@@GulfsideMinistries the guy above is correct. You put to much "New World" sounds in our ears. Try this: In your next video put a reminding note on a piece of paper behind your camera, writing: "I'm now a Mexican reading koine with Erasmian constructed pronunciation". Problem solved ! I'm Greek btw.
Did John put Qeos instead of Qeon to further emphasize equality by making it Nominative to match logos? (Sorry can't get Greek letters to work right on You Tube)
Also, I've heard different people say different things. Even as Norse and Welsh have a soft th (as in the) and a hard th (as in thorn), which way is the Greek theyta pronounced?
I've read conflicting reports on this. I've read some say that the theta is actually pronounced with a hard t, as it "top," and that the "th" sound (as in "thin") is due to Koine's relationship to Coptic. That said, everyone (at least in the field of biblical studies) pronounces it with the hard "th," as in your example of "thorn." I don't think most of us concerned primarily with exegesis get far enough down morphological and historical phonetic studies to made an educated claim at this level as to what it would have sounded like coming out of Paul's mouth (for instance). But at the same time, dialects and accents have been a thing out of every language ever, so I, for one, wouldn't be surprised that in a language as wide spoken as Koine that you didn't have everything from hard thetas to soft thetas to even a theta with a strong dental "t" sounds (as in "top"). My primary concern for this series, and indeed for my own studies, is consistency. If you have a consistent way to pronounce it, especially if its consistent with how your fellow interpreters/translators say it, you'll find the language easier to learn and talk about. There's an excellent case, by the way, to be made for using all modern Greek pronunciations. Part of me wishes I had done that in my own studies. But, to be honest, I'm not looking to retrain my ear after fifteen years of what I've been hearing. X-) Thanks for watching!
@@GulfsideMinistries Agreed. However, as bad habits are hard to break, I always endeavor to try to find the correct pronunciation, so I don't have to unlearn my mistakes. Thanks. And as I have long said, unfortunately for us, the original Biblical manuscripts did not come on cassette.
@@GulfsideMinistries "There's an excellent case, by the way, to be made for using all modern Greek pronunciations. " This is very true. " I'm not looking to retrain my ear after fifteen years of what I've been hearing. X-)" Isn't this being lazy? This is how the error of Erasmian pronunciation is perpetuated. A native Greek-speaker finds it torture listening to American Erasmian pronunciation. It's like listening to Shakespeare in "Erasmian English". Search for "Teaching Shakespeare's Hamlet to Greeks Using Erasmian English Pronunciation" and you'll understand what I mean.
@@learnbiblicalgreek316 Are you under the impression that koine speakers would have pronounced the words like modern Greek speakers do? Of course they didn't. The same case can be made for learning biblical Hebrew using modern pronunciation. So, no, it's not "laziness." It's a matter of what your goals are.
It is not true that the reason John left out the article in the third part is, as you say, because there would have been no way to specify the subject. There are other constructions he could have used to clearly indicate the subject and still maintain the article. The truth is that whatever the reason, it was left out on purpose and the possibility remains that the reason might be to distinguish both uses of Theos. The church father and greek grammar teacher Origen of Alexandria wrote on John 1:1, He [John] uses the article, when the name of God refers to the uncreated cause of all things, and omits it when the Logos is named God. This distinction would not necessarily imply the meaning being "a (different) god". That is a false dichotomy. It could also have the meaning of "divine", in the sence of sharing the same essence as God the father.
I'm so disappointed seen all day (blame UA-cam algorithm), Americans with a lot of zeal and love for Greek, knowing the grammar, the various elements of the language, the tricks that it makes using or not using some of them, to emphasize the meanings, until they stop taking their perfect English lecture and actually read Greek. Blood is purring out of my ears because of it ! Oh guys. Why ?
You're not alone. The entire seminary Biblical Greek teaching system is built up around speaking 99% in English, and mostly just explaining Greek Grammar. But of course not every seminary or class is like that, but it sure feels like it. I like to joke saying: "People would rather talk about Greek, than they would actually start practicing it."
The original to listen the exact greek of the New testament go to any greek orthodox church world wide always in all says prays hymns readings koine greek is used
The Koine Greek "Ton Theon" one is to recognise this to be *THE GOD* great I am with you there. Now so far we got the Word(Jesus) was *with* THE GOD in the beginning.. Great John 1:1c now becomes problematic because with or without the definite article it still means Jesus is *THE GOD* then is he with himself or are there two Almighty Gods because he is already with *THE GOD* that you now claim he is. Confusing!!
Have you ever thought about using the actual Greek pronunciation instead of a reconstructive pronunciation? Για 2.000 χρόνια ο κοινὴ διάλεκτος δεν έπαψε ποτέ να ομιλείται στις ανατολικές χριστιανικές ορθόδοξες εκκλησίες. Χρησιμοποιώντας τη σωστή προφορά!
Sadly this is not how it is supposed to sound. May I suggest you walk to your local Greek Orthodox church and ask them to teach you how to read Greek. They will do it for free.
@@ericdisisto3926 why not? Do you have any idea how much smoother koine Greek sounds with a "modern" pronunciation? Do you know how easy it is to learn to read Greek? A lot easier than the Erasmus and the other strange accents you guys are using.
@@mariamentis3428 As much as I agree with you that a modern Greek pronunciation is far more enjoyable to listen to than the artificial system Erasmus came up with (which sounds to me like an American walking off a cruise ship for the first time into a foreign city and using a phrase book to pronounce the native language as if its English), I don't think we should make it too much of an issue of which pronunciation someone prefers. The main thing is to get back into the original text. Although having said that I'm very happy about the growing movement to adopt a reconstructed koine Greek using misspellings and transliterated words to approximate the original sounds of the language. Surprisingly, or maybe not so surprisingly, listening to the reconstructed pronunciation sounds a lot more like modern Greek.
I don't why people find it necessary to come to a video like this and be critical. This kind of inconsiderate behavior is why we keep comments off on our church YT channel. To much toxicity out there when this brother is trying to help people study God's word.
@@jimyoung9262What was said that was toxic? Is it possible (I’m not accusing you) that you’re a bit too sensitive? People are just discussing things they may not entirely agree but so what? I found the discussion interesting and there were no personal insults or disrespect that I could see.
*[Just Facts, No Attacks]* *Question To Trinitarians Who Prefer The Authorized King James Version [1611]* Please explain why the KJV Bible (and other off-shoot bibles) add the indefinite article [a] in several texts but remove it at John 1:1? [Some Examples]: a) Acts 28:6 - People viewed Paul as *[a] god* (In Ancient Koine Greek, there is no “a” before “God, right?”) b) Mark 6:49 - [a] spirit c) John 6:70 - Judas called [a] devil ~~~~~~~ [Hebrew Scriptures] d) Exodus 7:1 - Moses called *[a] god* to Pharaoh... *[NOTE]: There were "no" vowels in Ancient Hebrew, only consonants.* They wrote the way we text msg & abbreviate today: Examples: • msg (message) • ystrdy (yesterday) • btw (between), etc.
Brother, the Lord bless you, I ask He will continue to use you and your videos to simplify greek, get men and women excited to study God's word in the original language. The way you teach is so easy to understand, very broken down into digestible terms and examples. Thank you kindly for you videos, keep it up. I'm excited to watch more.
Thank you! I'm glad the series is helpful. I'm actively recording more now -- Easter weekend is busier than expected, but you'll have more biblical Greek videos in the next couple of days.
@@GulfsideMinistries see the greek orthodox church. In all it says prays hymns readings in church uses koine greek never the erasmius way to say the words
very helpful, thank you
I'm only 5 min in and already know I'm going to really enjoy this. A little disappointed with the Erasmian pronunciation but I understand it dominates the seminary world. Coming more from the language learning world I'm happy to see a move towards a more historic pronunciation within NT Greek studies... but I'm splitting hairs. The whole idea of this project is great.
Just got my Greek New Testament book, I just finished learning the alphabet an hour ago and have come here! Already I'm very encouraged based on my progress due to this video. Thanks for having this up for free! It's so helpful
How are you doing now? I'm just starting. I hope you're cooking away at it.
Thank you! I struggled through Bill Mounce’s book even though I learned quite a bit! I also gained appreciation for the impact learning Greek can have…
The only problem….when I finished the course (I got up to Level 2 in an online Biblical course)…I moved on to greener pastures. I’ve been feeling the need to go back to Greek but apply it directly to my Bible study. This video does that!
Thanks!
Thank you so much for taking this approach. Grammar-forward teaching makes learning much harder. After years of exposure to Greek, I have begun to arrive at a place where grasping it more fully seems possible. This teaching style is accelerating my apprehension of things I have been struggling to understand for some time.
This is the most clearly and simply articulated explanation I have heard on John 1:1 and the JW mistranslation of it. Thank you so much for this! God Bless!
Brother my the lord bless you all throughout your life, thank you so much🙏🏻❤️
You are a perfect teacher. Love, Kryios Evangelos.💗
One of the best videos I have ever seen! ❤
Thanks A lot, it was a joy to learn greeks to understand clearly NT for spreading the gospel.
Great series so far. I’ve been wanting to get back into my study of biblical Greek as a lay-person but didn’t think I’d be able to find the drive to do so by looking at one of my older academic books on biblical Greek. I love this approach of just jumping right in.
It is so impressive to listen to the NT in ancient greek. Thank you for your detailed explanation on the original text. What a wonderful work you did. I will follow your channel from now on.
Thank you brother, just a baby studyin Greek but you have been very helpful, Thank You and PTL...
Καλὸν Πάσχα; Καλὴ Ἀνάστασις; καὶ Χριστὸς ἀνέστη!
Αληθώς Ανέστη !
Wow! I mean, it's powwrful enough in English but this understanding shook me and brought tears to my eyes. Wow! Thank you for this video! It makes me excited about going forward in Greek and your making it so much easier teaching it this way!
You mention the JWs but I thought of the gnostics and their belief in a demi urge and how all the gnostic pretension at knowledge is just totally blown out of the water by this one verse.
Besides the Greek lesson, an excellent commentary on the meaning of the verse!
Thanks! Glad you enjoyed it.
There is much that I like about how you have done this. In fact, in general, I like everything about it. I especially like the explanation of the accusative and nominative cases. Another excellent way to help clarify the accusative and nominative case, is to refer to the distinction between "him" and "he" as well as "them" and "they" etc. Your analogy is better than those examples, but using both ways of conveying the matter provides further ease of clarity.
I would like to offer how I would use details to give clearer understanding to those who are brand new to Greek.
If we start with an even more wooden translation, then we get intuitive insight into some matters, and we also introduce a few concepts, and this will preempt some future questions to simplify those matters when it becomes necessary to address them. What is nice about addressing a matter before it becomes necessary, is it provides some exposure and primes for when it is necessary.
If we write it three times, progressively, then we offer an easy bridge to all of the details.
-"In first had been being he the statement and he the statement had been being toward him the God and God had been being he the statement."
-"In beginning was the statement, and the statement was toward the God, and, God, was the statement."
-"In the beginning was the Statement, and the Statement was toward God, and the Statement was God."
I think it's confusing to teach that "logos" means "word" without explaining exactly what we do not mean by "word". I prefer to translate "pros" more literally; whether we say "toward" or "with" we are really not conveying the full semantic of the contextual application, but at least "toward" builds an accurate vocabulary. I also think that the definite articles are absent from "arche" and "theos" for intuitive semantic reasons (though I assumed your explanation in the final translation). I openly admit, especially in the case of "theos", that I may easily be wrong, so I am hearing you and I will carefully consider what you have taught here.
I really like what you've done here. I happen to be a stickler (ask anyone who knows me), and I like to offer details; but that has more to do with me, rather than indicating any posture of criticalness toward you. I can take what I dish out, so if you have any details or correction to offer me, I'll receive such discussion gladly.
Shalom.
I would tell people to look into the word pros(with) I believe there are about 4 word for out ONE "with" and pros(with) is really cool cause it denotes that the Word and God are "facing each other" in a trajectory that moves together. They are interfaced together.
Thank you so much for these videos. I took a little Greek many years ago for fun but didn't learn much really. Now I'm much more interested and your videos have helped explain things that I needed help with.
Just tuned into your channel, thank you brother for your time and teaching!
Good work sir.
Thank you from Australia.
En Greek language there are two types of articles : definite articles and indefinite articles
1- Ο Η Το
2- ένας - μία - ένα
For example: θα ήθελα έναν καφέ
Τhanks
He said in his notes the indefinate article is implied. I think the articles he is referring to are seperate from the word.❤
May I suggest “Was Christ God?” by Spiros Zodhiates. You will then understand why John chose the words he used.
wow Spiros! That takes me back a few years, great teaching ❤
The Father and The Son And The Holy Spirit are all one God
Amen
You are on to something really big. I just spent about 4 hours looking into Greek teaching tools I have in Logos software, a class on learning Greek at Christian Leaders Institute, and a couple of UA-cam beginner Greek classes. Until I found this video, everything had the same process of teaching, even when they said theirs was unique.
Learn the alphabet, diphthongs, vowels, consonants, rules, exception to the rules, and in some cases, random vocabulary words as if you already knew all of the above.
I learned more in 8 minutes of your video than in all the hours above. It could have been faster.
If all you did was read along the Greek verse, then show the vocabulary from the verse and pointed out one Greek grammar point and stopped. That would be less than 10 minutes. The student could review each previous verse a few times each day and add a new verse each day for just 30 minutes. Then, the student could spend the rest of the hour memorizing the alphabet, the diphthongs, etc., and going through whatever grammar book. I'll bet that student would have a huge head start in understanding and in vocabulary than anyone starting Greek II. You could even throw in a bonus vocabulary word that isn't in the verse of the day, especially when, like verse 2, there will be some repetition from verse 1.
If you taught an NT Greek class like that, I'd bet you'd have the lowest drop out rate of any other professor.
I'm looking forward to the 11 other videos in this series. I'm sorry to see you quit, but I'll sure enjoy the ones you made.
Shabbat Shalom!
I must say, you break it down so it's easy to understand. I've wanted to learn Greek to get more out of my Bible reading but most other YT channels teaching Greek don't seem to simplify it enough.
Well done! I will be watching for the next lesson.
One question. I've read some of Bruce M Metzger's literature (in case you don't know who he is he's a famous Bible Scholar and translator) who said in regard to John 1:1 and the NWT of Jehovah's Witnesses that with them adding the indefinite article it violates the Greek grammar rule called Colwell's rule.
My question is, does that rule apply to that scripture or not?
I had another YTber teaching Greek say that rule doesn't apply.
I would think someone like Bruce Metzger who has had a long and famous career in translating Biblical Greek would know.
Just want to get your take on it. Thanks
Well, it is a little more complicated than that...
Colwell's Rule definitely applies to New Testament era Koine Greek, but unfortunately the rule has been somewhat misunderstood by Bible scholars. Essentially, the rule says that if there is a predicate nominative before the copulative verb (a "to be" verb) in word order, and that predicate nominative lacks the article (such as appears in καὶ θεὸς ἦν ὁ λόγος), the predicate nominative cannot be translated indefinitely based solely upon it lacking the article.
Rather, you have to keep all three possibilities (definite, indefinite, qualitative) for the noun open and allow context to determine its meaning. In the case of John 1:1, Daniel B. Wallace ("Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics") makes an excellent case for the qualitative notion for θεὸς in John 1:1c (without taking away at all from the deity of Christ).
Wallace states, "The most likely candidate for θεός is qualitative. This is true both grammatically (for the largest proportion of pre-verbal anarthrous predicate nominatives fall into this category) and theologically (both the theology of the Fourth Gospel and of the NT as a whole). There is a balance between the Word’s deity, which was already present in the beginning (ἐν ἀρχῇ . . . θεὸς ἦν [1:1], and his humanity, which was added later (σὰρξ ἐγένετο [1:14]). The grammatical structure of these two statements mirrors each other; both emphasize the nature of the Word, rather than his identity. But θεός was his nature from eternity (hence, εἰμί is used), while σάρξ was added at the incarnation (hence, γίνομαι is used)" ("Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics," 269).
@@reformeddogmatics8317 The other problem is that JWs believe that the θεὸς should have the definite article ὁ in front of it also. This is bad Greek. If this happened, then it would signify that ALL there is to θεὸς is ὁ λόγος [Jesus]. This is promoting the idea of Oneness/Jesus Only being all there is to God. In other words, Jesus ALONE is God. This was regarded as a heresy by the various Councils and even the JWs wouldn't accept this.
@@Spartanthermopylae I think J. H. Bernard says the same in his ICC commentary :)
It's been a long time since I've had Koine Greek, but I thought that they shared the article making them equal to the point that one is exactly the same as the other, or one IS the other.
Hey Eric. Thanks for watching! No, they don't share an article. You might be thinking about adjectives, which we haven't covered much yet in this series. Sometimes, an adjective can share an article with the noun it modifies. So the phrase ho agathos anthrwpos would mean "the good man," with "ho" being the article for both the adjective (agathos) and the noun (anthrwpos). Outside of that, though, I'm not sure what you have in mind. If you find a reference to your idea, do share!
Hi Brother, just wanna ask if logos can only be translated as WORD?
I am learning biblical (Koine) and Attic Greek and like your approach, but I am learning with modern Greek pronunciation, which I think is more useful than Erasmian for learning to deeply read ancient Greek ) and appreciate it as proper language, so sadly, it will confuse me to hear you read the biblical text.
You're just right. Nobody really knows how the Koine Greek used to sound. They believe they know what can't be known. To learn modern Greek is a lot more useful. You can even speak to the Greek people.
Should the theta in theos be capitalized ?
By convention, the Greek text doesn't typically capitalize "God" (theos). In the same way, it doesn't capitalize the pronoun when referring to God. Now, when I translate, I follow English conventions and I do capitalize "God" and pronouns (He/Him). But don't be surprised/offended when the Greek text doesn't do so. Just a bit of fun FYI, some Greek manuscripts have no spaces, punctuation, or even lowercase letters. They were just long strings of capitalized letters. SOTHOSEMANUSCRIPTSLOOKLIKETHISITMAYSOUNDCRAZYBUTTHEYCOULDREADITASEASILYASYOUCANREADTHIS
It was called "scriptio continua" - feel free to look it up! :-)
@@GulfsideMinistries Thankyou , Brother, I enjoyed the first three videos
Modern Greek does have indefinite articles (ένα, ένασ, μία)
Isn't the Koine Greek alpha pronounced like the a in father, not like the a in bat? This is harder for English speakers, since there are 26 different allophones for the letter a; but in Greek, like Spanish, is not each single vowel pronounced only one way?
Yes, you are correct. And as I think through my actual pronunciation of the various words, I find myself actually using the 'ah' sound. I just never say "ahl-fa." It's amazing what habits can do! But good catch.
@@GulfsideMinistries the guy above is correct. You put to much "New World" sounds in our ears.
Try this: In your next video put a reminding note on a piece of paper behind your camera, writing:
"I'm now a Mexican reading koine with Erasmian constructed pronunciation".
Problem solved !
I'm Greek btw.
Sounds a bit shifty concerning the "wooden" reading in part 3. If it says "God was the logos" Oneness doctrine is revealed.
Did John put Qeos instead of Qeon to further emphasize equality by making it Nominative to match logos? (Sorry can't get Greek letters to work right on You Tube)
I don't understand why God in greek is being written in John with two differents spelling!can you explain the reason for that?pls
if I'm correct it because it changing subjects of what the word is grabbing onto last I remember
Very old textbook, he just released a 4th edition.
Also, I've heard different people say different things. Even as Norse and Welsh have a soft th (as in the) and a hard th (as in thorn), which way is the Greek theyta pronounced?
I've read conflicting reports on this. I've read some say that the theta is actually pronounced with a hard t, as it "top," and that the "th" sound (as in "thin") is due to Koine's relationship to Coptic.
That said, everyone (at least in the field of biblical studies) pronounces it with the hard "th," as in your example of "thorn." I don't think most of us concerned primarily with exegesis get far enough down morphological and historical phonetic studies to made an educated claim at this level as to what it would have sounded like coming out of Paul's mouth (for instance). But at the same time, dialects and accents have been a thing out of every language ever, so I, for one, wouldn't be surprised that in a language as wide spoken as Koine that you didn't have everything from hard thetas to soft thetas to even a theta with a strong dental "t" sounds (as in "top").
My primary concern for this series, and indeed for my own studies, is consistency. If you have a consistent way to pronounce it, especially if its consistent with how your fellow interpreters/translators say it, you'll find the language easier to learn and talk about.
There's an excellent case, by the way, to be made for using all modern Greek pronunciations. Part of me wishes I had done that in my own studies. But, to be honest, I'm not looking to retrain my ear after fifteen years of what I've been hearing. X-)
Thanks for watching!
@@GulfsideMinistries Thanks. I've never heard the t, but I have heard the soft th claimed to be the way it should be pronounced. Thanks again.
@@GulfsideMinistries Agreed. However, as bad habits are hard to break, I always endeavor to try to find the correct pronunciation, so I don't have to unlearn my mistakes. Thanks. And as I have long said, unfortunately for us, the original Biblical manuscripts did not come on cassette.
@@GulfsideMinistries "There's an excellent case, by the way, to be made for using all modern Greek pronunciations. " This is very true. " I'm not looking to retrain my ear after fifteen years of what I've been hearing. X-)" Isn't this being lazy? This is how the error of Erasmian pronunciation is perpetuated. A native Greek-speaker finds it torture listening to American Erasmian pronunciation. It's like listening to Shakespeare in "Erasmian English". Search for "Teaching Shakespeare's Hamlet to Greeks Using Erasmian English Pronunciation" and you'll understand what I mean.
@@learnbiblicalgreek316 Are you under the impression that koine speakers would have pronounced the words like modern Greek speakers do? Of course they didn't. The same case can be made for learning biblical Hebrew using modern pronunciation.
So, no, it's not "laziness." It's a matter of what your goals are.
It is not true that the reason John left out the article in the third part is, as you say, because there would have been no way to specify the subject. There are other constructions he could have used to clearly indicate the subject and still maintain the article. The truth is that whatever the reason, it was left out on purpose and the possibility remains that the reason might be to distinguish both uses of Theos. The church father and greek grammar teacher Origen of Alexandria wrote on John 1:1,
He [John] uses the article, when the name of God refers to the uncreated cause of all things, and omits it when the Logos is named God.
This distinction would not necessarily imply the meaning being "a (different) god". That is a false dichotomy. It could also have the meaning of "divine", in the sence of sharing the same essence as God the father.
Are all Greek New Testaments in Greek Koine or are some in modern Greek?
Your link to the text of the Gospel of John in your description is broken.
I'm so disappointed seen all day (blame UA-cam algorithm), Americans with a lot of zeal and love for Greek, knowing the grammar, the various elements of the language, the tricks that it makes using or not using some of them, to emphasize the meanings, until they stop taking their perfect English lecture and actually read Greek.
Blood is purring out of my ears because of it ! Oh guys. Why ?
You're not alone. The entire seminary Biblical Greek teaching system is built up around speaking 99% in English, and mostly just explaining Greek Grammar. But of course not every seminary or class is like that, but it sure feels like it. I like to joke saying: "People would rather talk about Greek, than they would actually start practicing it."
Not definite article, just article (no definite article in koine greek)
Is this the original Greek used by John when he wrote his account, or is this a more modern form of the language?
The original to listen the exact greek of the New testament go to any greek orthodox church world wide always in all says prays hymns readings koine greek is used
The Koine Greek "Ton Theon" one is to recognise this to be *THE GOD* great I am with you there. Now so far we got the Word(Jesus) was *with* THE GOD in the beginning.. Great
John 1:1c now becomes problematic because with or without the definite article it still means Jesus is *THE GOD* then is he with himself or are there two Almighty Gods because he is already with *THE GOD* that you now claim he is. Confusing!!
No, a better rendering is “the word was with God and the word was divine” or John ends up contradicting himself in less than 18 verses.
In the beginning was Logic
and Logic was before Love
and Love was Logical
Have you ever thought about using the actual Greek pronunciation instead of a reconstructive pronunciation? Για 2.000 χρόνια ο κοινὴ διάλεκτος δεν έπαψε ποτέ να ομιλείται στις ανατολικές χριστιανικές ορθόδοξες εκκλησίες. Χρησιμοποιώντας τη σωστή προφορά!
Sadly this is not how it is supposed to sound. May I suggest you walk to your local Greek Orthodox church and ask them to teach you how to read Greek. They will do it for free.
Modern Greek isn’t the pronunciation that is taught for New Testament Greek.
@@ericdisisto3926 why not? Do you have any idea how much smoother koine Greek sounds with a "modern" pronunciation? Do you know how easy it is to learn to read Greek? A lot easier than the Erasmus and the other strange accents you guys are using.
@@mariamentis3428 As much as I agree with you that a modern Greek pronunciation is far more enjoyable to listen to than the artificial system Erasmus came up with (which sounds to me like an American walking off a cruise ship for the first time into a foreign city and using a phrase book to pronounce the native language as if its English), I don't think we should make it too much of an issue of which pronunciation someone prefers. The main thing is to get back into the original text. Although having said that I'm very happy about the growing movement to adopt a reconstructed koine Greek using misspellings and transliterated words to approximate the original sounds of the language. Surprisingly, or maybe not so surprisingly, listening to the reconstructed pronunciation sounds a lot more like modern Greek.
I don't why people find it necessary to come to a video like this and be critical. This kind of inconsiderate behavior is why we keep comments off on our church YT channel. To much toxicity out there when this brother is trying to help people study God's word.
@@jimyoung9262What was said that was toxic? Is it possible (I’m not accusing you) that you’re a bit too sensitive? People are just discussing things they may not entirely agree but so what? I found the discussion interesting and there were no personal insults or disrespect that I could see.
*[Just Facts, No Attacks]*
*Question To Trinitarians Who Prefer The Authorized King James Version [1611]*
Please explain why the KJV Bible (and other off-shoot bibles) add the indefinite article [a] in several texts but remove it at John 1:1?
[Some Examples]:
a) Acts 28:6 - People viewed Paul as *[a] god*
(In Ancient Koine Greek, there is no “a” before “God, right?”)
b) Mark 6:49 - [a] spirit
c) John 6:70 - Judas called [a] devil
~~~~~~~
[Hebrew Scriptures]
d) Exodus 7:1 - Moses called *[a] god* to Pharaoh...
*[NOTE]: There were "no" vowels in Ancient Hebrew, only consonants.* They wrote the way we text msg & abbreviate today:
Examples:
• msg (message)
• ystrdy (yesterday)
• btw (between), etc.
Thank you so much for sharing.. I really needed to know this Truth, it has settled my heart.. the JWs can be very convincing, almost! 🩵🤍🕊️