I was weighing the use of this kit on a midlength barrel and Geissele handguard. THEN, I watched your video and took note of your comment about the Aero Preision barrel nut. THANK YOU for pointing this out. I do think that the piston could use better retention, especially the longer throw of midlength systems. Ordering a Aero rail now to finish this build with confidence in its success. Thank you!
I have a midlength Suparms kit. Clamp on. Mine is gassed well and shoots steel case no problems. Very very clean and cool shooter. Just use a good bolt. I like AO Precision
I have used this system on 2 ar15 builds and they both work great.i used a 18"faxon gunner barrel's on both.it shoots sub moa all day.one tip i can give is to buy a dimple jig by KAW Valley for what ever size barrel gas block diameter for precision gas hole allignment
I've got a tip for you. STOP DRILLING IN YOUR BARREL! Buy a CLAMP on version. My clamp on versions pass the pipe wrench test. I have never met a set screw version that will. I need to start video taping all the horrific wails when every single one of my challengers looses. Serioulsy., ALL of them loose. Horribly. I let them wrench on my clamp on gas block for two minutes. None succeed. I rotate their set screw versions in three seconds. Every time. Does not matter a whit about dimples or not.
I was looking to do the same thing on my 300 but was told, as well as read it causes nothing but problems in that caliber so I backed off on it for now until I do more research on it.
@@richardbranton2780 Your probably debating doing it like I am because it's just something a little different than what we have. I was thinking about trying it on a new 556 build but haven't decided. It's $260 for the SA kit, plus the cost of a bolt. Then I have to use a larger handguard to accommodate the piston system. If HK'S system wasn't so expensive I'd rather try that. Best of luck on your build 👍
I built this exact handrail and SA kit make sure you dimple the barrel they will 100 be like its your fault, if your op rod bends like mine did. Although the cause was a case jaming in the charging handle slot then the bolt slammed the empty casing against the rod bending it slightly. Not noticing this was possible and a inherent design flaw. After clearing i shot two more times finishing the mag then I couldn’t clear the bolt because the rod was bent into the charging handle. Im pretty pissed their customer service is garbage they want a 100 dollars for a new rod and to drill a dimple to fix it supposedly. Get the clamp on to avoid this or dont buy, you get a jam like i did your gun is a literal paper weight.
I dimpled my barrel for the gas block. I never want to say never, but I have not to this point had any jamming issues with the rifle. I’m not even to 1000 rounds on the piston, but the rifle has a few thousand on it. I haven’t dealt with SA customer service much, but I did have to get a longer op rod, as the kit I got was for carbine length and my gas system is mid length; I had no customer service issues doing that.
Upper bushing needed. Piston op rod will gouge both holes, barrel nut and upper, pretty quickly without it. Although uppers are cheap in your country, it's bunch of them, and replacement easy peasy...
I notice you stated this isn’t compatible with 300 blackout. Currently, I have the set up on a 6.5 Grendel. I know that’s not blk but I would think it could run any small frame cartridge if it can run Grendel.
I tried it… mid length on criterion core barrel. I sold it after one year. It was super clean and awesome but it messed up with barrel harmonics with too many moving parts and creating shock from hitting carrier caused inaccuracy. It had often flyers from the group. I ended up going back to DI.
Something I often don't see mentioned with long-stroke pistons is that the distance between the gas port and the piston is shorter than the distance from the gas port and the muzzle. This means the gun begins recoiling from the movement of the action before the bullet leaves the barrel. Compare that to a DI gun where the distance from the gas port to the gas key is longer than the distance from the gas port to the muzzle. The bullet has already left before the action begins cycling.
@@AndyAdventuring actually this is short stroke piston not long stroke but your observations apply the same. The gas coming out of gas block creates propulsion to push the piston rod to move backwards very quickly in a very short distance creating an impact to the carrier. The carrier then moves backwards cycling from the momentum of the impact. I think this happened while the bullet is moving out of the barrel which causes a disruption in natural barrel harmonics. That was why I had random flyers and I switched back to DI for my SPR project
I still have my mid length gas tube and gas block if I feel like I need to switch back, but I’m building several uppers, so it might not come off, but rather just go into the rotation. I am currently building a 6.5 Grendel upper with a 20” barrel, for longer distances. That one is definitely going to be DI.
I’m curious as well. They are easy to swap if need be, but they are slightly thicker than the gas tube and made of solid stainless steel. It definitely feels much sturdier than it looks. Particularly more than it looks on camera.
@@gentlemangreyman yeah I have the wolf A1 upper had it for 2 weeks now and I'm totally satisfied. I'm curious about converting another DI gun to a short stroke piston and I heard superlative Arms was easy to install.
@@universallaw8850 it didn’t work out well tho I went back to DI because short stroke piston tends to mess up with barrel harmonics so my criterion barrel had flyers often
Did you have to do any modifications to the barrel nut to fit this? That is the gen 2 enhanced hang guard. I'd like to buy the same just wondering how much work it'd be
Does that left handed upper require a special bolt carrier? If so, then this will not work. If it can take a standard automatic bolt carrier, then you theoretically should be good, but it is always worth calling or emailing to check first before shelling out a couple hundred bucks
300BLK ammo in general, but especially subs, doesn’t produce enough pressure to reliably push the op rod from the gas block. It’s not to say you can’t do it at all, but Superior Arms won’t guarantee that it would work reliably. It would be interesting to see someone try it and what their results are. It might work better when suppressed.
Super glad I watched this as I have that piston kit (carbine), and those handguards and barrel nut. I didn't think to check if they were compatible
I was weighing the use of this kit on a midlength barrel and Geissele handguard. THEN, I watched your video and took note of your comment about the Aero Preision barrel nut. THANK YOU for pointing this out. I do think that the piston could use better retention, especially the longer throw of midlength systems. Ordering a Aero rail now to finish this build with confidence in its success. Thank you!
I have a midlength Suparms kit. Clamp on. Mine is gassed well and shoots steel case no problems. Very very clean and cool shooter. Just use a good bolt. I like AO Precision
I like how that barrel nut acts as a guide for the op-rod
I have used this system on 2 ar15 builds and they both work great.i used a 18"faxon gunner barrel's on both.it shoots sub moa all day.one tip i can give is to buy a dimple jig by KAW Valley for what ever size barrel gas block diameter for precision gas hole allignment
I got a buddy of mine that is an armorer to lend a hand dimpling. He has all the cool jigs and stuff.
I've got a tip for you. STOP DRILLING IN YOUR BARREL! Buy a CLAMP on version. My clamp on versions pass the pipe wrench test. I have never met a set screw version that will. I need to start video taping all the horrific wails when every single one of my challengers looses. Serioulsy., ALL of them loose. Horribly.
I let them wrench on my clamp on gas block for two minutes. None succeed.
I rotate their set screw versions in three seconds. Every time. Does not matter a whit about dimples or not.
I'm getting ready to get a piston system for my 300 blackout but I'm not sure which one yet. I definitely like that handguard. Great video
I was looking to do the same thing on my 300 but was told, as well as read it causes nothing but problems in that caliber so I backed off on it for now until I do more research on it.
It's hard to beat a di system they work great. I don't know why I want to try a piston I'm probably just going to waste money
@@richardbranton2780 Your probably debating doing it like I am because it's just something a little different than what we have. I was thinking about trying it on a new 556 build but haven't decided. It's $260 for the SA kit, plus the cost of a bolt. Then I have to use a larger handguard to accommodate the piston system. If HK'S system wasn't so expensive I'd rather try that. Best of luck on your build 👍
This is what you want if you are suppressing
U can’t use these on .300 blk out if that what you was thinking
Good to see a more recent video on it finally have one in route
I built this exact handrail and SA kit make sure you dimple the barrel they will 100 be like its your fault, if your op rod bends like mine did. Although the cause was a case jaming in the charging handle slot then the bolt slammed the empty casing against the rod bending it slightly. Not noticing this was possible and a inherent design flaw. After clearing i shot two more times finishing the mag then I couldn’t clear the bolt because the rod was bent into the charging handle. Im pretty pissed their customer service is garbage they want a 100 dollars for a new rod and to drill a dimple to fix it supposedly. Get the clamp on to avoid this or dont buy, you get a jam like i did your gun is a literal paper weight.
I dimpled my barrel for the gas block. I never want to say never, but I have not to this point had any jamming issues with the rifle. I’m not even to 1000 rounds on the piston, but the rifle has a few thousand on it. I haven’t dealt with SA customer service much, but I did have to get a longer op rod, as the kit I got was for carbine length and my gas system is mid length; I had no customer service issues doing that.
Are you able to do a maintenance/ cleaning video of the suplerative arms gas block?
Upper bushing needed. Piston op rod will gouge both holes, barrel nut and upper, pretty quickly without it.
Although uppers are cheap in your country, it's bunch of them, and replacement easy peasy...
Subbed. I love your channel name
Thanks!
I notice you stated this isn’t compatible with 300 blackout. Currently, I have the set up on a 6.5 Grendel. I know that’s not blk but I would think it could run any small frame cartridge if it can run Grendel.
Grendel should have higher pressures than 5.56, whereas 300blk is lower. You can always bleed more gas off, but you can’t add gas that’s not there.
I tried it… mid length on criterion core barrel. I sold it after one year. It was super clean and awesome but it messed up with barrel harmonics with too many moving parts and creating shock from hitting carrier caused inaccuracy. It had often flyers from the group. I ended up going back to DI.
Something I often don't see mentioned with long-stroke pistons is that the distance between the gas port and the piston is shorter than the distance from the gas port and the muzzle. This means the gun begins recoiling from the movement of the action before the bullet leaves the barrel.
Compare that to a DI gun where the distance from the gas port to the gas key is longer than the distance from the gas port to the muzzle. The bullet has already left before the action begins cycling.
@@AndyAdventuring actually this is short stroke piston not long stroke but your observations apply the same. The gas coming out of gas block creates propulsion to push the piston rod to move backwards very quickly in a very short distance creating an impact to the carrier. The carrier then moves backwards cycling from the momentum of the impact. I think this happened while the bullet is moving out of the barrel which causes a disruption in natural barrel harmonics. That was why I had random flyers and I switched back to DI for my SPR project
I still have my mid length gas tube and gas block if I feel like I need to switch back, but I’m building several uppers, so it might not come off, but rather just go into the rotation.
I am currently building a 6.5 Grendel upper with a 20” barrel, for longer distances. That one is definitely going to be DI.
One of the reasons it is important to have the right length gas system for your barrel length. A carbine length gas system on a 16” is a bad idea.
@@gentlemangreyman it was mid lengtg
Did you get the added bolt assembly?
Yes. You need the s.a. Carrier to properly interface with the piston
I'm interested in how these gas pistons hold up I over time they seem really thin almost like a gas tube thickness.
I’m curious as well. They are easy to swap if need be, but they are slightly thicker than the gas tube and made of solid stainless steel. It definitely feels much sturdier than it looks. Particularly more than it looks on camera.
@@gentlemangreyman yeah I have the wolf A1 upper had it for 2 weeks now and I'm totally satisfied. I'm curious about converting another DI gun to a short stroke piston and I heard superlative Arms was easy to install.
It holds up good, I had put over 1k over it.
@@kms7852 sounds good 1,000 rounds is a good round count for reliability glad it's working out for you.
@@universallaw8850 it didn’t work out well tho I went back to DI because short stroke piston tends to mess up with barrel harmonics so my criterion barrel had flyers often
Did you have to do any modifications to the barrel nut to fit this? That is the gen 2 enhanced hang guard. I'd like to buy the same just wondering how much work it'd be
No modifications required. You just need to make sure the timing is dead on.
Any update on the reliability of this system? Would you use it on your Life & Liberty rifle?
I wish they had a non adjustable set up
adjustable gas blocks eventually become nonadjustable
They do....you just install it with the gas port fully open and then don't adjust it. Easy life.
Adam arms has some that are 3 or a 5 adjustable positions
You’ve got to let SOME gas out with a piston AR, otherwise you’ll be slapping that BCG back waaaaay to hard.
Will this work on a left hand stag arms upper?
Does that left handed upper require a special bolt carrier? If so, then this will not work. If it can take a standard automatic bolt carrier, then you theoretically should be good, but it is always worth calling or emailing to check first before shelling out a couple hundred bucks
Have you put many rounds through it since installing? How has it been?
Working on the video for this. First, the local range flooded. Then travel. Editing has been a nightmare. Update soon.
Do you have to use the bcg from the kit?
You have to use the provided carrier, but you can supply your own bolt
Care to explain why it wouldn't work with 300blk? They make a pistol length version. Why wouldn't it work?
300BLK ammo in general, but especially subs, doesn’t produce enough pressure to reliably push the op rod from the gas block. It’s not to say you can’t do it at all, but Superior Arms won’t guarantee that it would work reliably. It would be interesting to see someone try it and what their results are. It might work better when suppressed.
So how has this worked out for you after a 1 year trial?
Getting it dialed into the the exact amount of gas I wanted has taken more time than I had hoped (especially when my friend brings his can with us).