Best Snowboard Stance , Binding Placement - PART 2
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- Опубліковано 5 сер 2024
- The Follow up to Our Stance Angles EPI - ( Part 1 )
Start here if you have not watched it :
LINK :
• Best Stance Angles - S...
*** Light Rig was down so we apologize for the florescent white light !
Thanks for all the great questions , we will continue to do our best to get back to all of you !
Board : 147 Korua Pencil
Bindings : 2024 Union Atlas Pro
Filmed & Edited by : Mark Morrison ( FSM Productions)
Music : S. Johnsen
End Screen : Fitz McGooey
Hosted by : Mark Fawcett & Shane Johnsen
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Once again amigos, you guys nailed it with those techy details that so many people dont realize how it can change their riding style or even maybe riding pains... Mark is a wizard and it would be really cool if you guys did a vid on dialing in the turn! styles of turns, different key motions of the body, weight shift through a turn, utilizing the effective edge, and different boards/shapes binding configurations for carving seamless turns in pow or on cord. Anyhow sorry for the long winded recommendation, you guys have been exposing some serious nuggets for people and I love hearing your insights. Peace from mammoth lakes!
I've been riding for 37 years, started in 1986 (Burton Performer) and am now 50 riding a Jones Project X and Burton Mystery Skeleton Key...I have learned more from you two, in this ONE VIEDO, than anyone else in my entire career. I need to ride with you two and have you assess me to help tweak my gear to optimize! If you are ever in the USA Northeast please let me know so we can ride together! AMAZING info, delivery of said info, and humility. Cheers lads!!!
Thanks so much for the Support! Stoked we could help further inform on your shred journey!
Thanks from France guys. There is a lot to learn from this podcast !
Thanks for the Support!
Thank you both for this fantastic content ! Love the presentation ! Confirms alot of what I have been feeling through experimentation. Especially the leverage over the tail and wider stance in the trees and tight spots
Thanks for the great info guys. This couldn't have come through my feed at a better time. A few weeks ago I finally dusted off the board and got back on the slopes for the first time in about 10 years. I did make some binding adjustments trying to make things little easier on the old bones but I was just going with gut instinct. I wasn't too far off base but this will definitely help me dial things in properly. Looking forward to more good stuff!
Thank you for this series. Sending both of these videos to my board buddies
Our pleasure!
Thanks again for a meaningful video on very helpful channel. So much knowledge is imparted in the nuances and detailing of a particular experience concerning wha#ever piece of gear. There has never been so much to choose from, but we all can’t try everything- I really appreciate your/y’all’s insights.
Wicked informative. I feel like I figured out most of this from constantly testing diff angles/stances, but the risers are a wicked idea, always thought forward lean would be the same front/back, and rotational highback sounds interesting to play around with. Great tips!🙏
wow thank you guys so much what a grat vid, great content.
Love all the positivity and Stoke u guys have!!!!!
I fully agree!! 👍👍
Be very careful listening to UA-cam people about snowboarding. A lot of bad snowboarding advice and misinformation like in this video is cloaked in “positivity” but without proof or evidence. You won’t feel like that if you try their binding recommendations though while you’re crashing into someone bc you can’t turn. Stay safe.
You guys are awesome!!! No Thank You!!! Such valuable information and wow incredible videos of you guys on the mountain so amazing. I wish I could come visit you guys.
I am turning 60 this year and I think I started snowboarding 15 years ago when my kids first started. I am more of a visual guy and was hoping in the future you could do a video where you show the setup / installation in combination with having multiple people stepping in the bindings and strapping in to show the differences. I have to say after watching your videos I question if I am doing anything correctly. I have always been a hands on guy so when I started I setup not only my board but my kids boards approximately shoulder width apart and 12 deg positive for both feet. My kids are pretty good and hopefully I did not screw up their progression. As for me I ride a 163 wide with size 12 boots and stand at just under 6' and 205lbs. I still struggle being comfortable at speeds over 25mph and wonder if that has to do with a lack of confidence related to my stance / setup. Can you provide any advice / suggestions> I ride regular with my left / leading knee not the greatest as I have had ACL surgery and it gets sore. I use K2 Cinch bindings as this old man also has a stiff back and it help get in and out. I refuse to take up Pickleball!! I will continue watching and learning any advice is greatly appreciated!!
Great job, guys.
Great stuff guys!
Thank you teaching us how to snowboard 🏂 lot better. 🎉🤙
great content thanks guys
Your analysis on width matches what I think I’ve found myself. At 6ft 34” inseam I always rode about 21.75” but never really knew if it was right. Got a little longer 160cm and set back board to use in the deeper snow we got this season and last trip felt like I kept getting kicked around in heavy wet snow so first I set both bindings back then I finally move one binding out (rear) which brought it to about 22.5” and all of a sudden I had way more control over the board and could keep the rear where I wanted. So the last run of the day I figured I still don’t really feel stretched out so let’s try one more position wide (front one this time) to 23.375” and now I think I have found my stance. I have a lot more board control, more leverage over the board so I can whip it around easier and I think it’s also taken some strain off my lower back since I’m more squared down with my knees. Now i am really curious to try same width on my centered board and see if it helps that one too. So the wider stand and malavitas autocant has worked out well for me last trip, has probably been one of my better days controlling the board.
Yeah 5'8" crew, keepin it real! I wasn't expecting that when you said 23" stance width. I have average proportions (neither stubby or long legs) and 21" has been my go-to. Going to try 20 and maybe even 19+ with more aggressive +/+ for carving this season.
Ow ow they back!!😎😎
A+ technical content. Thank you. Please do dedicate an episode to risers, heel rise, and cants--I use all three, but there are so few options out there.
Epic content!
It came quickly n it is very nice my kid loved it
I came to this video for different reasons, but noted that the formerly secret board is a Mega Death. And I agree, that "minute" stance adjustments make a world of difference with this board. When I got mine, I set my stance width to what I had on my Ravine, the MD's ref stance being wider, I put my front foot binding a hole towards the back. Oh boy, what a mistake that was.
Awesome content guys. Stoked I stumbled across it! Would love a video on cambers and board size selection. Super generic but you dudes communicate this stuff so well
Thanks for the Support! We for sure will get an EPI out on that topic !
Drinkin' tall-bois and talking about snowboards, heck yeah!
great stuff. learned a ton. you guys should do some workshops ;)
Bring on the reviews!!🎉
Capita and Union 🙌🏼🔥 for the win
Shadowban and Katanas for a real win.
I would love to hear more about heel lifts because I’ve been considering it now that im trying some + +
Great content, happy to have found your channel.
Newby here (1st year).
Just went from a rental board (Rossi bindings - Salomon boots - Head Transit board 159) to a newly purchased setup (Burton Instigator PurePop 160 - Burton Photon Soft - Borton Re:Flex Step On).
I had to purchase everything, so rented the step ons and was hooked automatically.
Stance-wize, at first was setup with +15 -15 but hated it.
Tried +12 -6, still not sure but better.
Mostly carving corduroy and icy condition (eastern Canada / Vermont), and apart from stability at speed (thanks to previous board), I keep on fighting for heel turns.
Any recommendation to start with on the new setup ?
5ft10, 195lbs
What's your thought on binding angle in relation to stance width? I find that I would need more stance width when bring the back binding angles in(i.e. -12 -> -6). I also seen those japanses softboot carver running fairly wide stance with posi posi angle(+36 and +27).
Hey guys, thanks for your tech-clinics, very useful 👍 I'd have one question: how do you manage toe drag in the back foot? I've had some problems with bent toestrap's ladders and buckles clogged with snow lately. I like to lay down some pretty rad snowsurf-style frontside turns and I ride a pretty wide board (Jones Storm Chaser 152 with posi-posi 9° 27° angles on 9.5 Burton Tourists), I had to run the backfoot's toestrap over the toe to avoid this problem. Shall I put some more angle (say 12° or something) on my backfoot?
Great content. Best on the internet IMO.
Mark, what risers do you use? Do you ride with them all of the time or only on specific boards when carving?
I use Apex risers. Not in production at the moment. Might be back in the fall. I use anytime I'm riding resort groomers, on multiple boards. Definately anytime I'm carving.
I hope you are going to review the arbor veda in men size since its now unisex. I demoed it in 159 and liked it but I am curious to know what you guys think.
Great production once again ! Thank you so much ! I am also curious to know more about risers, the one used by Mark and is comments on how often he rides on them. Cheers from Charlevoix !
Apex risers were the most popular, and most accessible in the past. I'm trying to establish a resurection. Look for them next fall.
@@markfawcett8142 thank you for the response Mark !! Looking forward to see their return !
To center my bindings:
1. I mount them at zero angle on the reference stance, and screws at the center of the disk.
2. I strap one boot then turn around the board (so I look the at the base).
You then can CLEARLY see if the boot is hanging more over one edge or the other.
To get the most of my boards performance/design I set my bindings on their reference stance (assuming I choose the right size's board).
To adapt to different terrains I'm changing my board instead of changing my stance.
That's why I have a quiver and not simply a daily driver
Hi guys, i ride posi posi 36 27, I'm wondering which brand of bindings has the most rotatable highbacks to make it paralleled to the edge? Thank you, you guys rock
Does it make any difference whether bindings are mounted in the the 2x4 pattern vs 4x4 pattern if the binding mini disc supports both mounting patterns?
Really Interesting. That Korua Pencil is wider under your front foot than your rear foot, meaning you're set forward on the sidecut. The narrowest part of the board (waist width), is closer to your rear foot. This is all because of Taper. Being set forward on sidecut, but still set back on the length of the edge is the key to locked in carves.
Having the taper make you have less width on the back foot, doesn’t mean you are set forward on side cut. Using the most narrow part of the board as a reference for center of sidecut would only work for non tapered snowboards
Curious question if my board is directional and has a refrecne point of 22 and my stance is 21.5-21
ish is it better to move the front binding back one for more nose or to move the rear bind forward for more tail?
Is the heal wedge under your back foot only effective on a posi posi stance or would it still have an effective on a +18 -9 stance ?
Great presenters & content! Detailed & fun! I have a 2019 Jones Frontier 159. The reference stance is 23.6 which is too wide for me as I am 5’ 10”. I’m going to try a 21” width stance. I want to unleash the turning capabilities of the board, but also want to turn quickly in tight trees. I’m going to try +3 /+21 (I usually ride duck).
Do I:
1 . Move BOTH bindings inwards from the reference equal amounts.
2. Keep the front binding at reference and move the back binding to forward.
3. Keep the back binding at reference and move the front binding backwards.
Thanks!
On That model try Back on Reference and pull the front foot back an inch to start ... more weight on the Tail of a Frontier is a good thing!
Excellent! Thank you!
After the last video on binding angles I’ve been messing with mine almost every day. I’m still trying to figure out what works best for me. On my dart I found it easier to put my bindings as close to the nose as possible so I can have more control over the huge nose.
Same. Moved my bindings as far up on the dart front and back to be as centered on the board as it will allow. For POW, I’ll certainly be moving it to reference. Same with the pocket rocket.
@@STAyTHIrstyMyFREind What bindings you got on it? I broke my rome cleavers 2 weeks ago on a sketchy landing.
@@tbaart4428 cartel X on both
If they don’t print the reference (lib) how can you know where the ref stance sit. I’ve been measuring tip to center of bindings for setback- I may have been doing it wrong for 20 years and now I’m curious…keep up the good work.⚡️🔥
Hey Lars. Have a line on a lightly used pair of Now O Drives, do you recommend that particular model? Thanks.
Glad to see it boys, might want to tame the lights a bit, shane is looking 50% goth
haha - true - morrison needs to get that color grading dialed in the new studio !
@@tributeboardshop loving these nerdier tech series, keep them coming!
Just lean into it… go 100% goth!
@@thecertifiedboss cure cover for the new opening track, get fawcett a long black wig, we can totally work with this
Friday I’m in Love? And the new opening can be Shane and Mark bummed out every other day of the week… and on Friday they drop the new episode.
watching this again after the Mega Death review and going "ohhhhhh" 😂
Thanks for the tech talks! this goes back to your last video - you were against the 15/=15 stance, but what would you use if you did want to ride symmetrical and centered on a pure twin?
If you ride switch nearly as much as forward, try 12/-12. Even if you ride forward 60% of the time, we'd suggest 15 / -9
Would you recommend setting my stance back for a Burton Deep Thinker? I only ride groomers and no pow. And usually have it pretty close to centered
On that Model you should ride set back - even on groomers its designed with a set-back sidecut so will perform better 1" or more back! Shane has a 57 and always rides it full set back no matter the conditions!
Question: I’m curious about the relation between stance and camber? Like if the board has a center camber and you set back your stance, how would that change the riding?
Have you guys done an episode on risers and cants yet, like you talked about doing in this video? Definitely interested in your insights on that topic. I have been riding Palmer risers on a Burton Custom X with 250 mm waist since the early 2000's and I just got a new alternative freeride board and am wondering if I finally ride without risers...
We Plan in a In Depth epi in the next season - its been very cool to see how many out there are interested in Binding Canting! Stay Tuned
I want buy board tomorrow
For all mountain ride
I am 175 cm boots size 8 and 73-75 kg what board size I need 154 or 157?
My go-to stance is 20", 35/15. That's how I start on any new directional board, and then I play with it to find what works best for THAT BOARD, changing angles and widths (up to 20.5" at the extreme). Even 21" feels to me like I'm doing the splits. I'm 5'8" 180lbs. I also flip the buckles to have them on the inside of my foot to reduce the pressure point of that giant buckle from the outside of my foot (and its easier to reach to click together having hands inside your legs than twisting them to the outside). I ride with a very neutral front highback, and minimal contact rear (cut down or leaned back).
Thanks for another great and thoughtful video! You brought up something that breaks conventional wisdom, and in some way contradicts your other video. I thought you should always stay proportional to reference stance for both board flex (as designed) and to be centered withing the sidecut (again, as designed). Last video I believe Shane said he likes to stay near reference for the as-designed flex of the board, but here @markfawcett8142 said he moves just the rear foot back as a way to control the tail of the board a bit more. Can you elaborate that a bit more? What adjustments to your riding do you need to make given you are now offset from being in the center of the sidecut? Can you still lay out your carves? Are there examples of boards where you tend to do that, or is it more situational than based on the board? It is just for turning or do you do it to enhance your ollies on a given board?
In terms of being not centered to the sidecut and carving... the only riding adjustment you make is how you weight your turns... your board flex, sidecut, and camber/rocker profile will play a role in how much adjustment is needed...
I wouldn't think too much about it as you can always just feel out what adjustments are needed. Ride centered, rail carves as hard as you can, adjust bindings to whatever off-sidecut-center you want... rail carves as hard as you can with new binding stance... in my experience, most people with basic proper technique can easily and quickly discern how their weighting needs to adjust. If you're watching these videos, I'm sure you will too.
✌
@@TheRealWarez Thanks. I played with this during the season and found it worked well for me to tweak the torque and pop from my tail. The adjustment to my weighting was instinctive and a non-issue. In hindsight it's a little silly that I was so stuck on "the rules" of staying centered/symmetrical in the stance, but given this is a game where we talk about 3cm and 3 degrees I don't feel bad. I love these vids!
Hello! My jones boards are a 158 mind expander twin and a 164 flagship, the reference is 60 cm! That's 23.6 inch and I am 178 cm tall (5'8) and the narrowest the boards get me Is between 50 (MET) to 53 (flagship) and ive read that it is still a bit wide, is it okay to ride on the narrowest setting available on the board?
They put the inserts in there for them to be used.
Question. I’ve been debating getting a pair on canted bindings because I get pressure points through my ankle on my front foot only. Do you think canted bindings would help to lessen that? I’d love to crank down my bindings but it gets uncomfortable after a couple runs. Thanks!
What boot are you riding? Sound like a possible fit issue as well
@@tributeboardshop I have the Ride anthem. Fit wise they feel fine to me
You guys mentioned Apex Manta risers but I can't find anything doing a Google search. I have size 14 shoes and wear a 15 boot so I need a riser like the Burton Elevators (no longer made or sold) as even wide boards aren't wide enough for me. Can you give me an idea of where to get a proper riser and what you'd recommend?
Apex stoppped production. I'm trying to resurect. Check back in the fall on the inter-web. Size 15 boot, you are definately in custon board territory for an extra wide deck. Check with Winterstick, Donek, Jasey-jay, or Vaughn snowboards. They make X-wide boards. You shoule be on a deck with at least a 28cm waist.
After buying new, bigger boots I looked for risers and couldn’t find any anywhere so made a test set out of two sheets of 5mm rubber with 10mm longer bolts and they worked out fine and made a noticeable improvement but the dense rubber added a lot of weight.
The next set I made for a wider board I used a 6mm thick IKEA poly chopping board and matching bolts. Much neater, stiffer and lighter.
I traced out and cut with a hacksaw to match the binding baseplate, used a hole saw to cut a mounting disc into them for adjustability and again got matching length bolts. Really easy to make.
@@markfawcett8142 appreciate the feedback. I'll keep an eye out on Apex risers. Hopefully they listen to you guys and bring them back to production. I'll check out thse x-wide boards you mentioned. Cheers fellas and keep doing your thing. Great and valuable content you're putting out there for the masses.
Keep up the great work. Love your videos. Could you do a spot on best directional boards for soft boot carving (high speed, deep carving & euro carving) and revisit ideal possible binding riding angles.
Cheers:)
Hi guys, i ride posi posi 36 27, I'm wondering which brand of bindings has the most rotatable highbacks to make it paralleled to the edge? Thank you, you guys rock
Burton will be the Most Adjustable in this aspect - Look at the Cartel X or consider Step On as this matters a bit less with those - really impressive Performance as well !
@@tributeboardshop Thanks man!
Hello where can i buy risers which can be internationally shipped to NZ?
I feel that 23 width for someone who is 5’8 is a lot? I’m 6 foot and I’m at a little more than 21, but I’m more focused on carving. When riding choppy terrain should it be better to go a little wider for more stability ?
Yes , thats usually when either of us go wider …. Always changing with the conditions !
Good place to start.. centre of knee to floor = stance width
Do you guys prefer bindings with or with out canting?
3 Degrees of Canting is always a good thing - we love that a lot of brands are designing this into their bindings- We may look at adding more for Banked Slalom or hard carving days!
Have never had the experience of too much tail!!
Freestylers of today will have a small width stance, it is anatomicaly easier to spin to. (see Markus Cleveland, Seb Toots ...)
This said, if you like to bomb and that freestyle is not always the plan, you better low down your gravity center: 22" to 23".
How much forward lean for powder riding?
“Usually” less than park or groomer carving - we often use none ( fawcett keeps some on his front foot ) 🤜
None, it'll just burn your quads.
@@tributeboardshop Thanks appreciate the advice and the great content, y'all rock
Hey Everyone, can you rotate the high-back on a Burton Step-On?
No, and I wonder what Mark would say about that as he rides them but loves high back rotation.
@@joshuasills You can , ever so slightly. There are two set screws that adjust the fwd lean. By offsetting them, you can "twist" the highback.....a bit. I wish I could rotate them more.
You can , ever so slightly. There are two set screws that adjust the fwd lean. By offsetting them, you can "twist" the highback.....a bit. I wish I could rotate them more.
@@markfawcett8142 Can you use your station in the industry to get Burton to fix this?
Glad to see you guys back, your videos have been helpful. Just picked up a new board after riding a rental for 2 season & 16+ years off before that…
the boards a more fun arbor westmark (5 flex) and I grabbed some Union Force classics…
so my question is I noticed in the video you had the forma elite straps on those binding which are a little more flexy than what that atlas comes with… any benefit to switching up that heel strap to loosen things up a bit to more match the flex of the board? It was a thought I had and then saw you do it. I appreciate your time for a response!
Yes , we often play around with the different Ankle straps offered by the brands - Union specifically do sell other options and often our Team and ourselves customize the Ankle strap specifically!
Awesome, I think I’ll grab a pair to mess around with. Thanks
Can't find binding risers anywhere.. got links? 🙏
Not really - its something that needs to hit the market on a less race inspired level!
union uses a 3* canting on there bindings.
All shall be well, Jack shall have Jill
I’m trying to get better at my jumps. I been kinda adjusting my bindings but can’t find the perfect spot. My problem is that as I’m in the air I can’t stay straight is it me? Or one of bindings needs to be adjusted so I’m able to stay straight? I ride a -12 +18
I’ll appreciate any advice thank you!
Either you're trolling or you mean +18, -12 lol
@@carsythe my back foot -12 my front foot +18
If my back foot has heel lift, how can I negate that and have an easier time going on my toes? My back foot pops up much more than my front and when I ride switch, it feels even looser.
NEW boots !! Not sure how old yor are, but the newer boots have WAY more heel hold-down built into the volume of the liners. try on EVERTHING. If you have lower volume ankles, you'll need "J bar " pads taht go between your liners and shell. they run along the sides of your achilles, and "J" under your ankel bone.
I saw this method of measuring your lower leg as an indication of stance width. ua-cam.com/video/2rTGnWFYee8/v-deo.html
I am 5'10" and this gave me 21 1/8", very close to my usual stance of 54cm. I wonder what you think of this method. It seems like you guys like wider stances generally than this method may produce.
Heyyy, is stance width from binding center or inside the bindings? Tons of pros just use the fist to elbow method. What do you guys thing of that one?
Center of the binding
The measurement is from binging center to binding center. I'm not sure about the fist to elbow measuement reference. I just tried it, does not seem to work even between the bindings. Do you multiple by a factor to yeild an appropriate stance width ? thanks.
+18 -12 for me
Shoulder width measurement for stance width?? 😂 are people riding with their arms? Leg length measurement is the best way to start.
Sorry but the shoulder width spacing doesn't work. Heel to bent knee measurement works. My brother is 3 inches shorter and at least 2 inches per side wider delts. Strap that board on at home, lean forward/back/left/right/adjust several times. That's a good starting point.