You do a very good in-depth job in your videos and that's why I like watching them. I wish that each of you, who make this type of video would explain the acronyms they use for the common layman in terms that are understandable. Most of the viewership is ignorant of the acronyms you are using and need to know about them if they are to learn. Thanks again, for another great video.
Thank you. You're right - I need to keep this in mind and try to explain better. I think it's mostly because I end up worry about the video being too long that I leave things out and/or cutting too much. I'll try to expand on the acronyms in the next video :)
I've had the 24v 4000w model for over a year, running low loads 24/7, and occasional high loads like a well pump, with no issues. I leave it in standby mode, which only consumes about 18w. It switches on when about 25w or greater load is sensed on the output.
@@goldienakamoto7894 Just the inverter frame has a ground. The AC output is only L1 - L2 - N. I use L1+L2 for a 240v well pump, and the L1+N and L2+N legs for 120v loads. (Note that L1 and L2 are limited to half the total rated watts each, so for my 4,000w model I don't exceed 2,000 watts on each 120v leg (at least not for a longer time than the specified "surge" time that is allowed) ).
@@montwell2 i just got the mpp lvx6058 well hasnt come yet man but im fricken excited!! yea im tryign to power my well to this solar stuff is the coolest thing to me
Looks Amies'ish. I like that inverter. Yes. That neutral is coming off the center tap of transformer. That's how it is done. Thanks for the review. Good job!
YIYEN makes all of this style of inverters. I have the 12kw and the 6kw inverters there great. My 12kw has been running for 3.5 years 24hrs a day off grid running everything on my property.
I got a tip to add to your testing setup use those rotating style DC shutoffs and wire in your resistor across both terminals so when the switch is off the resistor is connected then you can just plug in your Anderson connector with the switch off and it connects the resistor automatically that you can just flip the switch on for testing
Well, I purchased a Sigineer 6000W Split phase inverter... and it arrived damaged. Took a pretty good hit to the DC input side and pushed the rear panel in against the internal PCB. So looks like my review of the 24V version of the unit you reviewed here will have to wait. If UPS approves the damage claim and UPS doesn't want the inverter, I'll pull apart that one for the review. Thanks for doing this in depth review of the 48V version. The internal view and the quality of the wiring and assembly sold me on this manufacturer. I just didn't need a 48V system and in the event I ever need emergency juice I can just run 2x 12V AGM batteries in series to get 24V to run it vs needing 4. Plus, I will only really need 3000-3500W max typical for my needs currently so the 3,000W version was out and the next step up was the 6000W version. lol
I confirmed last month that the surge rating on this inverter is no joke. I fired up my 20,000 watt surround sound audio system and played at levels sufficient to bring down a section of my ceiling. Yeah, it handled it. No doubt I hit peaks over 14kW input power to the amplifier racks.
@@josemanuel2244 Form factor looks the same on the box, but I can tell you they have excellent customer support. They have an American engineer in CA that is knowledgeable about the products and offers good information when you have tech questions. The also provided me with the replacement cost of a noisy fan in their 18kW inverter with a quiet one I bought for $100. They work at customer satisfaction and I would not hesitate to recommend them.
I have this exact Inverter and have been testing it (real world) for about 4 months now. I currently have it hooked up to about 350Ah of Homemade 48V 18650 Packs (500Ah after this weekend) with about 8kW of Panels on the roof flowing through (2) Sunnysky Solar MPPT 60A Solar Charge Controllers (which are working great so far). I also have it connected to the Grid. I have it set to use the battery as priority and the Internal Charger turned off. If the battery goes below a certain point, it is supposed to switch to the Grid power and then switch back after the battery it is charged back up but I have had some issues with this functionality. I am currently working with SunGold (via emails) trying to figure it out but no resolution yet. The first problem that I experienced is that from time to time (with no rhyme or reason that I can see) it will switch off of battery power to grid power and then a few minutes later back to the battery. I have seen it do this as many as three times in a three hour time span when the battery was at 90% charge and the inverter at only 50% capacity. SunGold did not have an explanation for this but asked me to video tape it happening for them. The second issue I had is that one Saturday when I arrived just after daylight and the Inverter was on Grid power. The Battery was at 46V (around 60% capacity) and just started charging for the day. I waited for over an hour and but it never did switch back to battery power. When I finally switched the Inverter off and then back on it immediately went to Inverter (battery) mode. SunGold did not have an explanation for this either. Those issues are not as concerning as the third issue that I had. This set-up is in a building that I normally only go and visit on the weekends but about a month ago my wife had the need to go up there on a Wed. and when she opened the door to the building there was no power whatsoever. She called me and I had her go and flip the master switch to turn the building back on the Grid (totally bypassing the PV system) so she could do what she needed to do. Apparently the building had been without power for a couple of days as the freezers we have there were almost thawed out. Luckily we do not have much in them right now as I try and get the bugs worked out of the system. SunGold has yet to be able to provide me with any answers, the most concerning one is why the system just shut down and did not switch over to the Grid power. Since I was not up there that Wednesday, I was not able to observe the system. I just had my wife turn all of the switches and breakers off on the DC side as I did not know what had happened. I really do not even know what to do to try and repeat the fault. With all of the lights off in the building, the system just sits there and idles at about 0-10% (one full size fridge, one mini fridge and one chest freezer). Note: I have to leave it in active mode as I could not get Standby mode to work at all. Even when the 1 ton AC unit kicks on (small apt.) it only jumps to about 35% and a month ago it was still not very hot here so I don't even know if the unit had come on that week or not. When I was there last weekend with all of the lights on and running saws and other tools (air compressor) and the A/C in the Apt. kicking on and off everything worked great with zero issues. Even with all of that going on my batteries were at full charge by noon when we left. I was video taping the system trying to catch it tripping off battery to grid but it would not do it on camera. What I do know is that I cannot trust a couple of freezers worth of food to a system that might just shut down for no reason at all. Really wish I could figure it out.
Wow nothing worst than a system that you can't trust to leave alone. I have (2 ) 24v split phase 3000watt / 6000watt combined Growatt Inverters that I love. I use the same setup you mentioned and it's been working flawlessly.
I have the 3000w 110v version been running for over a year in our skoolie with no issues. Nice to see some reviews on them now, I had to buy almost blind when we got ours, aside from a few Amazon reviews. I've read these are exactly same as AIMS, maybe built by same company and rebranded?
Wow to see an inverter trip LBCO before the BMS cut off brought a smile to my face! 😃 This definitely LOOKS like the old AIMSPOWER unit, but it obviously has some charge profiles on their that the old AIMSPOWER version did not have.
Excellent review and presentation, like always! One thing I'd suggest: should (almost) always connect the positive side of negative/ground bonded DC circuits first. That way if you do accidentally contact the chassis with the other lead, there's no risk of a short. I'm sure you already know this, but my anxiety went up a little bit during the capacitor charging. :)
I have been running the Sigineer direct version with 9.8 KW AGM (don’t say it I will go LifePO4 when the bank dies, but I can’t just toss em out) for about 2 years as an emergency backup I love it, my only complaint is the fact it bonds neutral to ground, but yes the idle capacity is high, but mine is under load when used. Efficiency is better at higher loads
This inverter is actually the 6kw Sigineer-Power inverter someone stamped the sun gold on it, I have one that's connected to my 800Ah battery bank running water well, hybrid 50gal water heater & 12000BTU mini split AC, I really like this inverter over any other ones on market.
A large part is the magnetizing losses in the core. Grain oriented silicon steel laminations lose about 1/2 watts per pound of material when idling at normal operating flux. This loss is independent of the load in the transformer, and dominates the losses at idle. At full power, copper losses due to the resistance of the windings become the bigger portion.
When you add a 100W load, will it add up to 200W consumption with the 100W idle consumption, or will it be less? If less the 100W idle consumption will not be such a pain as it looks at first sight.
so who else took one look at that inverter and had a flashback to the Phoenix Gold/Orion/Soundstream mega-kW competition car audio amplifiers from the early 90's? you know, the ones that were "rated" at like 400w at 4Ω, but would push something ridiculous like 3kW - 4kW into a 0.125Ω load so they could compete (and dominate) in the lower-wattage classes...ah, the good 'ol days....LOL
My first one was damaged slightly.. cover bent. Inspected, no real damage inside. It’s a Beast and starts EVERYTHING! I complained about the packaging! The seller responded with good comments and would review the packing. My Second one I just received was packaged Much Better and had No Damage! I opted for these do to the Low Frequently design and the Heavy Duty Build! Thanks buddy ✌️PT
@@lesw8798 No sir.. I have a solar power shop with one of these running out there and the other one is for the house system as a backup.. redundancy is very important! Actually in my house I have two 12kw inverters and this 6kw for backup. Pretty dang soon I will upload a video of our home solar power system! It’s sooo cool to check out how much power your own system generates! Electrical Freedom! Thanks Les ✌️PT
I notice sungoldpower has an All In One hybrid unit with similar specs, but so much more in form of 120 amp ac and PV charging input to battery for about the same price.
The big difference being the one you mention will be a high-frequency inverter where as this is a low-frequency inverter. Both inverter types have different purposes. This one (low frequency) is designed to start heavy inductive loads.
@@LithiumSolar ... Just looked at specs; ... The Sungoldpower TP6048 includes a Low Frequency Inverter in All In One form with Solar PV option for current cost of $1,365 ... Plus can charge at 120 amps vs just 60 amps. I do see some mixed reviews. Would love to see you Test one of these.
@@CaptBill69 Ah, didn't know that was the unit you were referring to. I figured it was one of the more-popular HF models. In that case yes, I would consider that a superior choice.
Good Video really explained alot for me. I have a question for you. I have two of these inverters one is an old one that went out. Is there any companies that service these. Thank you in advanced.
Since your inverter is a source, providing a reference to ground will establish a stability of the neutral to stay fixed to zero volts AC at all times. There many be a bonding wire in that inverter to the neutral wire. The neutral is connected exactly at midpoint of the full coil in the transformer, which puts out 240 V AC, but unless it’s grounded, it will not stay electrically stable. Only voltage that will stay stable without a reference to ground is the 240.
It doesn't have to utilize an auto-transformer to "create" a neutral, a regular 2-winding isolation transformer can accomplish the same thing with a center tap secondary winding. The latter is a more safer way to create a neutral. Costs more that way too.
Correct. Just like isolation transformers, and the step down transformers at the service pole outside your house. The center tap of the transformer is your neutral. Yes, the 240 in to that unit creates that neutral on it's secondary output.
And yes on the neutral wire off the transformer it's tapped like an auto transformer I have changed my transformer in a victron inverter to be split phase single unit I know you can parallel them or split phase two units but I didn't need two units
Hoping you see this, as I am kinda stumped. This is the same inverter just re-branded as the Sigineer 6,000W model based on what I have seen of the internals and comparing it to my Sigineer. The question I have relates to your AC OUTPUT wiring. I have the same panel you have and am preparing to run lines to it. I do not ever plan on having an AC Input either. This will just be stand-alone, off grid. So my question relates to bonding the neutral and ground on this type of setup. Sigineer has kind of mixed messages regarding it, namely on removing the bonding screw. I guess what I am asking, How would you wire up this inverter in a stand-alone setup with no AC-Input to power a small house using the same panel you have in this video? As is expected- If I fry myself, it is my fault entirely. I am just looking for some advice on wiring it up. I am comfortable around AC wiring, just don't wanna screw up the inverter. lol
My Opinion) The neutral+ground bond should only occur at one location. Anything more turns the ground wire to a current-carrying conductor (very bad). If you're running it completely off-grid like I am (with no AC input ever), you would wire your inverter output to a breaker panel, then bond there. That's how I wired it in this video and how I have my AIMS 10kW wired. Official Answer) Contact an electrician ;)
@@LithiumSolar Do you have your AIMS chassis grounded to Earth? I actually need to open mine back up and see because I never noticed if they had bonded the ground inside the inverter. Some do that and some don't. Thank you for reading and replying. :-) I actually live next door to an electrician. lol. I was actually planning on asking his opinion on it at some point if I couldn't get the right consensus from others who have done the same things.
I saw the same loose studs on my Amazon warehouse (customer return) samlex PST 1500-12v inverter, I thought it was broken too but you just confirmed it's a design on purpose
You have to get more stronger battery to fully push that inverter I have the same one and I have 4/0 gauge wire with 230ah @48 volt. Thank you for your vedio it helped me alot
Yeah a bigger battery and thicker cabling would be much better. I think 4/0 is a bit overkill though? I pretty much wanted to test the two products as they came vs any custom changes/wiring.
Mine died after 2 years on the off grid house. It ran extremely hot right from day one, I think I was sold a faulty unit on Amazon. I own a second one that hasn't seen much use yet. The loads were always well under 6000w generally 200w or less. Occasionally used it for power tools, like the miter saw, cement mixer.
I see you bonded the ground and neutral inside your test breaker box. If the inverter is bonded ground to neutral that would create two paths for current to travel. Just curious about how you have it set up.
I tested mine, which is a 24v Sigineer 6kW Split-phase model and it is in fact a puresine wave, THD% was about 2-4% which is typical for on-grid or off-grid stuff.
I just bought the 24 volt model exactly like that. It seems to be nice so far. I think it's only 2000 watts per leg tho. I was kinda hoping for it to be more capable but it does power up a 15000 but ac on my camper
Get it hot and short the output frequently and repeatedly. If it survices that, it's awesome. You should be the one to do it, you got it free. If I buy one to test I'll show it no mercy.
Coolio. Thanks for the video. Got my 2kw 24v inverter/charger from them a few days ago. Been liking it so far. Worth the $500-$600, imo. Wont need to upgrade again for a while.
Just an update on my sungold 4000 split phase. Bro its still performing perfect. Mine is 24 volt on 840 ah of the eve 280k cells from 18650 battery store. I use 2 2-0 postive qnd 2 2-0 ground wires so its definitely not starved for power and i use victron charge controllers. My system is doing great and i was wondering how your sungold inverter was holding up?
Is it possible to use it in "AC coubling" in off grid use, along with grid tie inverter? As i see there are two transformers inside this thing, one for inverter, and another for charger! Is it possible that both used simultaneously?
I was looking into the 4000W split phase for my 50 Amp RV. I questioned sungold about the situation of a campsite only having 30 amp, as to whether the battery charger would work. I did not receive an answer. You having one, could test this. Does battery charging occur on single phase, bridged across both input hots.
You only did a power on test, you have not tested the power savings setting, which may/likely reduce the standby consumption. I'd be very interested in the power savings version of the test.
I have this same unit for a year and a half now. I use the hell out of it, well pump, compressors, 3hp table saw etc. and have no complaints save for the high idle consumption. Question, I have the neutral bonded to ground at the house panel, which is fine when on the inverter, but my 20kw genset is bonded at the genset. So when running on the genset I have two bonded points. Any thoughts as to how to avoid this?
I removed the bonding wire off my honda 3500 for use with my furnace otherwise the computer on the furnace gives a ground fault and won’t turn on during a power failure. Then i made a plug with the neutral and ground connected and plug it in whenever I use it not hooked up to my transfer switch.
Very good video...question here...When you set your battery as priority...when this inverter change to main AC ? ...It is not clear to me if you can set this parameter as in other inverters...for example for my LI-FE-PO4 52 volt battery pack...I will like to set that to 48 volts. Hence...when the system drop to 48 volt..the inverter will switch to main AC. Then when the inverter detect the voltage above 52 volts (battery where charged by a photovoltaic system)...the inverter switch back to battery....Thanks.
That transformer does appear to have a center tap(so like an auto transformer). That red stuff is Silastic. It would be really awesome to get the part number for that transformer inside. Additionally, those internal wires are probably 90+c rated, so they are probably fine to run those loads. I am pretty sure the manufacturer didn't size the cables to be cool to the touch.
You complain about the 'wasted' energy of the inverter/controller when idle. Did you try the power saving mode you mentioned at the beginning of the review? Just curious. On my inverter/controller, when you use the power saving mode, it shuts off the transformer/inverter until you begin to use a device. Thus saving that constant drain. Are you sure you haven't overlooked that feature on your's?
Yes it has power saver, no I did not try it. I don't fine that feature particularly useful as you still see pretty much the same self-consumption when a small load is applied. Additionally, my inverter is never off in my home - always something consuming power even if it's just phone or laptop chargers.
@@LithiumSolar So, I guess my next question is this, does that 100 watt consumption continue while using current consuming devices? Is the consumption always 100 watts over and above the load device? If not then your 'always' use may solve the issue. Just sayin'.
@@aday1637 Will do some further testing and provide a follow-up in a day or two :) There are a lot of efficiency questions being asked, so I'll collect them and answer as many as I can in a short video.
Do you know if i could run 2 110 volt inputs of the same phase into the ac input or would it mess it up or not work? I would like to charge batteries from my i inverter like this but i dont have a 220 line to connect to inverter.
Great video. Is there any way to set it up for demand sense so it isn't using 100W all the time ? Will the charger function work with a 120VAC source ? Or does it have to be 240VAC ? Can it charge while it is powering a load ? Will it sync with another inverter in parallel ?
1) Has a power savings mode that does just this - will be testing this in a follow-up video very soon 2) No, this inverter is 240VAC input only 3) Yes, it can power while charging and no it cannot be paralleled with other inverters.
I'm a bit late to this video! Thank you, really interesting! I'm considering this inverter right now. How noisy was it under moderate loads? Like 1-2kW.... I know you also have LV6548. Could you compare amounts of noise from LV6548 and this inverter? Assuming that LV6548 runs on battery only (no solar, night conditions and etc.).
Looks like the inverter/charger is built good. It had 12 gauge inside which is good for 20 amps at 240 volts. Those inverters are rated for the surge or peak wattage of 6000 watts but I would say they're about 4800 watts continuous. Those batteries are way over rated at 6000 watts. Running the dryer was exceeding the battery cables capacity. All these devices should be rated at their running watts not peak watts. 6000 watts at 48 volts is 125 amps and since you cannot exceed 85% of the cables capacity those batteries should have 1/0 cable. Those batteries are probably only 2400 Running watts each. It looked like the inverter went into self protect on one of the phase at 13:48 time of this video because the dryer was pulling more than it could handle.
LithiumSolar Brother, Awesome Review! Can I use AGM batteries? When you had the washer on why did it shut off because the battery or the inverter? Best Regards!
These look identical to AIMS inverters. I suspect there's a common family tree and marketed/sold in different ways? One difference is that AIMS has a couple of ETL certified versions - which I own - and I'm hoping (maybe) it has slightly more robust components? Be interested if someone knows what's up on all this :).
@@LithiumSolar Awhile back I purchased both the AIMS 48V input 6000W low frequency 240V/120V output split phase inverter, as well as a SUNGOLDPOWER 48V input 6000W low frequency 240V/120V output split phase inverter. I only just got the SUNGOLDPOWER unit hooked up about five days ago, and have only used it for about 12 hours under 5.4kW output load for electric car charging purposes (plus about 50 hours of idle time with no load). The AIMS and SUNGOLDPOWER seem very similar, but so far, I definitely prefer the SUNGOLDPOWER, for a few important reasons: 1. When I load the AIMS inverter output higher than 18A at 232V AC continuously for more than a few minutes at a time, the unit emits a worrisome burning electrical smell, although it smells fine at or below 18A even when operated at this level for several hours continuously. So far, the SUNGOLDPOWER unit seems to work fine at 22A at 244V AC continuous output (sustained for 6 hours during my first car charging session), although it does currently emit a foul burning Styrofoam smell. The burning Styrofoam smell is no doubt due to actual melting hot Styrofoam, since it gets packaged and shipped in Styrofoam, which tends to break off small pieces that then fall into the unit air intake holes. Then, upon operation, they get really hot and smell bad for awhile, but I expect this smell to eventually go away altogether, once the Styrofoam has finished baking off volatiles. The same burning Styrofoam smell was emitted from the AIMS unit early in it's operational history as well. 2. The AIMS unit cost me roughly $1900 after taxes, while the SUNGOLDPOWER cost me about $1300 after taxes. 3. The SUNGOLDPOWER has a small LCD display that shows input DC voltage (not too accurately though), input AC voltage, and output load in percentage of 6kW rating. The AIMS unit omits this rather valuable feature altogether, thus requiring an external DC power meter, which further increases the effective cost of the system. Overall, so far my impression is that the SUNGOLDPOWER is equivalent or better than the AIMS, especially the price tag and being able to more confidently sustain operation at its full power rating. Both units however have massive room for technical improvement, as they both lack proper 0.1V accurate configurability for charging voltage and low voltage cut-off, for safe use with various types of lithium ion batteries available today. They also both consume vastly excessive idle quiescent current, and have much too low overall efficiency under load (both rated around 88%). If they improved the efficiency from say 88% to 93%, this would effectively shrink the required battery bank of the solar system by about 5%, and simultaneously increase the "effective size" of the solar array by about 5%. For a $30k solar array + battery based system, this equates to a savings of $1500 on the overall system, which would easily justify paying over $500 more for the inverter (say if they doubled up the MOSFETs and improved the transformer, so as to get better efficiency - along with better overload capability). They should also improve the inverters to allow paralleling of multiple units, as a standard feature. Ideally, this would become a standard feature on all inverters from all manufacturers.
I do not understand why big battery sells 175 amp anderson connectors with 6 gauge wire installed in them. I noticed that immediately when I looked into their products. I haven't ordered from them, and I'm sure their batteries are good based on other reviews here on youtube but the 6 gauge wire bothers me. It should be 1 gauge minimum....
There are many charts on the Internet that show 200C-insulated wire can hit some pretty high amp ratings. For example, this one www.coonerwire.com/amp-chart/ says it can handle 165A. I agree though and have made the recommendation to them that they consider selling thicker gauge cabling. It sounds like it's possible they'll be carrying more options soon, but I can't speak for them.
@@LithiumSolar Dang, I have always kept 6 gauge to like 60 amps lol. I haven't ventured into the high temp rated wire yet. I suppose the larger amperage rating on the high temp rated stuff makes sense, but all that heat means resistance. I dunno, something about hot wires gives me anxiety hah. Thanks for the quick response and the enlightenment on high temp rated wires!
Do you feel this or a lower wattage unit would be good for a small office UPS substitute? I'm getting tired of conventional UPS units and want something a little more robust.
It would work but, at 6000W and low-frequency, is definitely overkill for that particular application. A smaller MPPSolar high-frequency would be best suited for an office UPS. I have a plan to build something exactly like this but video is a month or two out at this point.
It has a massive transformer that it needs to keep powered even if there is no load connected. You can try using the standby mode, though I don't personally recommend it as it doesn't work very well .
@@LithiumSolar so do you think It would be ok, or should I swap it out for another one? I'm going to be using it to power up 10 circuits, off my grid. I'm just running some tests on it for now.
interesting... my toriodal inverter 3kw is only idling at 25-30 watts... more efficient than my high frequency 6kw all in one inverter which idles at 60-65 watts.... so is size relative to idle power consumption? i'm curious.
Try to get a 3 prong 240v dryer cord and connect black and red to the inverter. Neutral is not used for charging. Therfore you can test the charge circuit
I have the 10k 24v model. I loved it until it stopped working. For Some reason the about 6-8 transistors on exploded out of the blue. No sure what happened the unit lasted just about over a year. Currently in the process of a warranty process. Any ideas? Company is telling its only a 1 yr warranty even though their website states 24 months🤷🏻♂️. Hopefully it goes through if not Victron here I come….
Nice looking inverter, I would like to have seen you push it more, even my cheap Giandel 4000/8000 inverter can start up an air compressor similar to yours. What it can't start is a 2300w mitre saw which is a crucial tool for a lot of people and has a start up load much higher than an air compressor.
Did you watch until the end? I ran a cloths drier on it that pulled 5500W. I would have loved to push it more, just don't have many 6000W appliances lying around AND the batteries were kindof the limiting factor in the test here :) :)
The presence of 60 volts between ground and neutral at the inverter outlet can be hazardous to common household appliances, such as refrigerators, etc. Attempting to connect ground to neutral at the inverter outlet will cause internal damage to the power circuits.
for the quality and for the price of the output this thing as a real bargain! to be completely honest I much rather have a loss of efficiency and have the unit actually be able to put up a power when I need it then worry about it not being as efficient as some other kind of inverter which will usually end up with problems with. this thing looks like a sturdy built product and it doesn't seem like they skipped out on actually building it either. I wonder how clean the AC is from this.?
Thanks for the video and all the useful info on this channel! I was surprised at the parasitic loss of 100w for just running this inverter. I'd be curious for you to get your hands on the digital Solar Edge HD Wave which sells a 6KW inverter for less $ than this model with a higher level of efficiency. Then discuss your findings for HD wave, vs. toroidal xformer vs. this style xformer. Anyway foopd for thought as you grow your channel.
The Solaredge is a great inverter but it's TOTALLY a different use case. The SE needs optimizers attached to solar panels vs a battery, it's not made for this kind of use. It's intended to be 100% grid-tied, whereas this is more of an off-grid solution that is NOT legal for connection to the grid (you can do it but you need to wire it like a generator and switch yourself off the grid when in use). I actually own both the SolarEdge and this 6K inverter and have tested them extensively.
Hello Sir,; Got this unit but is 24 DC and is 2000 watts , can it take or pull three batteries of 12 volts each??? Interms of charging system, it got 20Amp, how many solar panels i must connect so that it can charge nicely & with those panels how many batteries must be there?? Will be waiting for your reply plz
Did the battery saver mode help on the idle consumption at all? Curious if it takes longer to respond for AC power if the battery saver mode is on too. Very nice inverter though and great if you need to get a workout in. No need to but weights!
On mine, you do have to switch off then on again to restart the inverter after it goes off in the power saving mode. After a period of time (several minutes) the inverter shuts off when in the power saver mode.
Supposedly these inverters will wake up when you put a load of 25 or so watts, but my 2kw 24v model didnt do that in my test. I just leave mine on al the time.
You mention in this video that you can ground or not ground the neutral based on which inverter you're testing. Have you determined which inverters allow the ground and neutral to be connected? My house was built in 1987 and the utility feed only has three wires... the two hot wires and a combination ground/neutral. I have been having trouble getting the inverter manufacturers to tell me if this is a problem. Sigineer told me that this is not allowed on most of their inverters.
I've been having a similar issue...I have an 18K SunGold inverter..The neutral is not the sam as a ground, I've been told. They do not address this in their setup instructions. I connected the neutral wire to the neutral bar also. What I did, was connect a 2nd ground wire to the original ground and returned it to the main fuse panel. I also connected a physical ground to the square ground terminal with a bare copper wire. triple grounded. extra work, but I know the electricity will have a safe path back to ground this way for sure.
MPPSolar products are great as well. The most significant difference will be this is low frequency and the MPPSolar is high frequency. This means the SunGoldPower will have a huge/heavy transformer that allows it to start large inductive loads. The MPPSolar won't have this, won't have as much starting capacity, but will also be more efficient because of not having the transformer. I guess at the end of the day, it comes down to how you plan on using it / what loads you intend to run. If you're running a large air conditioner, welder, well pumps, etc - this may be better suited for you. MPPSolar also has the solar charge controller, which this does not, so you'd have to factor that into the price comparison as well :)
I assume you're asking about the Husky (48V)? I do think that is a more refined product than the Wolfs I have. It's slightly less capacity, but if I were buying again, I might consider the Husky over a pair of the Wolfs. I primarily went with the Wolfs as I was intrigued by the A123 cells vs the aluminum-cased cells in the Husky.
Do you still have the sungold inverter? Mine is working great for powering my 220 minisplit but i was wondering if you know if the ac input has to be 220 split phase since it dont use the neutral? Could i use 2 110 inputs of the same phase as my ac input ? Id like to have my generator charge my batteries thru this inverter but my generator is only 110.
@@LithiumSolarcan you use two 120v inverters on a double pole 240v breaker to make 240volts. One inverter on one leg l1 and the other on the other leg. L2
I have the 6000 split phase 24 volt unit that I am hooking up. That terminal block on the AC side is terrible. That tiny screw does not hold fine strand flexible wire very well. I tried a piece of 6 gauge wire with about 10 strands. Any slight movement of the wire will loosen that connection right up. What a terrible design. Should the wire end have some kind of solid ferrule crimped to the end to make full contact with the round hole in the terminal block?
@@LithiumSolar I'm using AWG 8 tinned fine strand 105C rated marine wire. Those inverter terminals with the setscrew have 6mm holes on the load side. I made a steel fixture with a pair of 5/8'' square steel bars with a 6mm hole drilled into the middle of the bars where they are clamped together. That way I have 2 halves of a 6mm hole split in the middle. I took a piece of 1/4 inch copper tube and made ferrules. The tube gets staked with a round nosed tool and then gets folded in the middle. Then a flat steel bar in a hydraulic press packs the ferrule into the bottom of the half hole and is flat on its top surface. The ferrule is then trimmed to 3/8'' long. So the ferrule looks like a solid copper ''D'' shaped lug in cross section. The cool thing is that the setscrew pushes that lug so the curvature of the lug exactly fits the upper half of the hole in the terminal board on the inverter. I polished the drill marks out of the half holes and when the copper lug comes out of the home brew die, it looks like a mirror finish. I am certain that there will be a generous contact area once that setscrew is tightened for good and there won't be any overheated connections. Yup, overkill, but I know that I will never have to worry about those connections again. There is only about 18 inches of load wires and ground going to a double circuit breaker. Next to it is a 240 volt 4 prong receptacle and a pair of 20 amp 120 volt outlets, one for L1 and the other for L2. Why Marine wire....I have rolls of it stockpiled away. 4/0 and 2/0 welding cable, too. Wire and cable is getting very expensive!
This unit is for standby for grid down situation. I copied your resistor charge setup. Since I will most likely have the battery bank switched off most of the time, I thought it would be cool to add a push button to pre charge the inverter capacitors before switching on. The input to the inverter comes from a 240 volt Onan standby diesel generator, not the grid. I went with a 24 volt system because I also have another 24 volt diesel driven large frame alternator with external lithium regulator. The unit also gets a pair of Aims 24 volt chargers as well. Our location has poor solar exposure. But that didn't stop me from installing a Growatt 120 amp MPPT. Thanks for your ideas and review!
I didn't see any chokes into the primary. If you add a choke to the primary input, from the transformer into the primary rail, wrap it twice through the core and connect back to the rail. The idle current should drop to about 20 watts.
Do you have your shop lights hooked up to the inverter? Cuz why the lights flicker when turning on the compressor. I’m not trying to say you have the compressor hooked up to grid power just looks suspicious.
The pole lamp, which you can see sitting behind the air compressor, is pugged in to the inverter at the bench outlets, which you can see at timestamp 15:05. So yes, they are dimming when the air compressor starts.
The silicone wire insulation is rated to 105C or 120C. At 75C it's not that hot. Of course, the heavier wire would be more efficient. The heat lost on the wire is energy lost from the battery. Also, these LF Inverters are not drawing a nice DC current. The current has a 120Hz ripple that can be rather large at full load. If your average current is 125A, then the peak current is probably 1.414X that value, or 176A. The battery may not be rated for 176A pk currents! That's the major difference between a LF and HF Inverter. The HF inverter has a nice, smooth DC input current, but the LF has a 120Hz, rectified sine dc current. That's why the capacitors eventually fail if not kept cool. If you want to reduce the heat and the ripple current, add a large electrolytic, 200,000 uF capacitor bank between the battery and the inverter.
@@LithiumSolar Nor any primary. In pass through, the incoming line is simply sent to the output through a relay. I haven't taken mine apart to look, but a presume it is a double pole double throw relay that connects the output to the incoming split phase 120/240, or to the center tapped secondary of the big transformer. The primary of the transformer is connected to an H bridge PWM sine wave generator running at the battery voltage. This makes ~ 30 VAC, which is stepped up to line voltage by the transformer, which has a 240 volt secondary with a center tap.
Mine arrived damaged. I wish I could review it. That thing is crazy heavy haha
I see it cost about the same as the MPP Solare LV6548 ALL in one... is there a reason to get this over the MPP Solar ? thanks
@@LithiumSolar No UPS need stop tossing things a round
UPS will do whatever it takes to deliver. If that means gobs of packing tape, then so be it.
@@SHSPVR YES!! Definitely that too...
How do I get started on this reviewer of great and terrible machines at?
seriously though... :)
(I fix welders btw :) )
You do a very good in-depth job in your videos and that's why I like watching them. I wish that each of you, who make this type of video would explain the acronyms they use for the common layman in terms that are understandable. Most of the viewership is ignorant of the acronyms you are using and need to know about them if they are to learn. Thanks again, for another great video.
Thank you. You're right - I need to keep this in mind and try to explain better. I think it's mostly because I end up worry about the video being too long that I leave things out and/or cutting too much. I'll try to expand on the acronyms in the next video :)
Iv got the 4000 watt split phase one and it’s been running almost three years 24/7 running my house
mine failed after 3 weeks of light usage and sungold gave me the runaround with warranty. I chucked up my losses and had to buy another inverter.
@@douggibson2428 what did you buy and how did that one last?
I've had the 24v 4000w model for over a year, running low loads 24/7, and occasional high loads like a well pump, with no issues. I leave it in standby mode, which only consumes about 18w. It switches on when about 25w or greater load is sensed on the output.
FOR THE LOAD OUT IS IT G N L1 AND L2 ? LIKE MY 4 PRONG DRYER
@@goldienakamoto7894 Just the inverter frame has a ground. The AC output is only L1 - L2 - N. I use L1+L2 for a 240v well pump, and the L1+N and L2+N legs for 120v loads. (Note that L1 and L2 are limited to half the total rated watts each, so for my 4,000w model I don't exceed 2,000 watts on each 120v leg (at least not for a longer time than the specified "surge" time that is allowed) ).
@@montwell2 i just got the mpp lvx6058 well hasnt come yet man but im fricken excited!! yea im tryign to power my well to this solar stuff is the coolest thing to me
Looks Amies'ish. I like that inverter. Yes. That neutral is coming off the center tap of transformer. That's how it is done. Thanks for the review. Good job!
YIYEN makes all of this style of inverters. I have the 12kw and the 6kw inverters there great. My 12kw has been running for 3.5 years 24hrs a day off grid running everything on my property.
I got a tip to add to your testing setup use those rotating style DC shutoffs and wire in your resistor across both terminals so when the switch is off the resistor is connected then you can just plug in your Anderson connector with the switch off and it connects the resistor automatically that you can just flip the switch on for testing
Siganeer. Finally a real inverter capable of running actual house loads.
Well, I purchased a Sigineer 6000W Split phase inverter... and it
arrived damaged. Took a pretty good hit to the DC input side and pushed the rear panel in against the internal PCB.
So looks like my review of the 24V version of the unit you reviewed here
will have to wait. If UPS approves the damage claim and UPS doesn't want the inverter, I'll pull apart that one for the review.
Thanks for doing this in depth review of the 48V version. The internal view and the quality of the wiring and assembly sold me on this manufacturer. I just didn't need a 48V system and in the event I ever need emergency juice I can just run 2x 12V AGM batteries in series to get 24V to run it vs needing 4. Plus, I will only really need 3000-3500W max typical for my needs currently so the 3,000W version was out and the next step up was the 6000W version. lol
I confirmed last month that the surge rating on this inverter is no joke. I fired up my 20,000 watt surround sound audio system and played at levels sufficient to bring down a section of my ceiling. Yeah, it handled it. No doubt I hit peaks over 14kW input power to the amplifier racks.
It look similar to" Aims" wonder how customer support works
@@josemanuel2244 Form factor looks the same on the box, but I can tell you they have excellent customer support. They have an American engineer in CA that is knowledgeable about the products and offers good information when you have tech questions. The also provided me with the replacement cost of a noisy fan in their 18kW inverter with a quiet one I bought for $100. They work at customer satisfaction and I would not hesitate to recommend them.
I have this exact Inverter and have been testing it (real world) for about 4 months now. I currently have it hooked up to about 350Ah of Homemade 48V 18650 Packs (500Ah after this weekend) with about 8kW of Panels on the roof flowing through (2) Sunnysky Solar MPPT 60A Solar Charge Controllers (which are working great so far). I also have it connected to the Grid. I have it set to use the battery as priority and the Internal Charger turned off. If the battery goes below a certain point, it is supposed to switch to the Grid power and then switch back after the battery it is charged back up but I have had some issues with this functionality. I am currently working with SunGold (via emails) trying to figure it out but no resolution yet.
The first problem that I experienced is that from time to time (with no rhyme or reason that I can see) it will switch off of battery power to grid power and then a few minutes later back to the battery. I have seen it do this as many as three times in a three hour time span when the battery was at 90% charge and the inverter at only 50% capacity. SunGold did not have an explanation for this but asked me to video tape it happening for them.
The second issue I had is that one Saturday when I arrived just after daylight and the Inverter was on Grid power. The Battery was at 46V (around 60% capacity) and just started charging for the day. I waited for over an hour and but it never did switch back to battery power. When I finally switched the Inverter off and then back on it immediately went to Inverter (battery) mode. SunGold did not have an explanation for this either.
Those issues are not as concerning as the third issue that I had. This set-up is in a building that I normally only go and visit on the weekends but about a month ago my wife had the need to go up there on a Wed. and when she opened the door to the building there was no power whatsoever. She called me and I had her go and flip the master switch to turn the building back on the Grid (totally bypassing the PV system) so she could do what she needed to do. Apparently the building had been without power for a couple of days as the freezers we have there were almost thawed out. Luckily we do not have much in them right now as I try and get the bugs worked out of the system.
SunGold has yet to be able to provide me with any answers, the most concerning one is why the system just shut down and did not switch over to the Grid power. Since I was not up there that Wednesday, I was not able to observe the system. I just had my wife turn all of the switches and breakers off on the DC side as I did not know what had happened. I really do not even know what to do to try and repeat the fault. With all of the lights off in the building, the system just sits there and idles at about 0-10% (one full size fridge, one mini fridge and one chest freezer). Note: I have to leave it in active mode as I could not get Standby mode to work at all. Even when the 1 ton AC unit kicks on (small apt.) it only jumps to about 35% and a month ago it was still not very hot here so I don't even know if the unit had come on that week or not. When I was there last weekend with all of the lights on and running saws and other tools (air compressor) and the A/C in the Apt. kicking on and off everything worked great with zero issues. Even with all of that going on my batteries were at full charge by noon when we left. I was video taping the system trying to catch it tripping off battery to grid but it would not do it on camera. What I do know is that I cannot trust a couple of freezers worth of food to a system that might just shut down for no reason at all. Really wish I could figure it out.
Wow nothing worst than a system that you can't trust to leave alone. I have (2 ) 24v split phase 3000watt / 6000watt combined Growatt Inverters that I love. I use the same setup you mentioned and it's been working flawlessly.
I have the 3000w 110v version been running for over a year in our skoolie with no issues. Nice to see some reviews on them now, I had to buy almost blind when we got ours, aside from a few Amazon reviews. I've read these are exactly same as AIMS, maybe built by same company and rebranded?
Yeah they are definitely buying and rebranding they've done it with a few other products and companies not just aims
Wow to see an inverter trip LBCO before the BMS cut off brought a smile to my face! 😃
This definitely LOOKS like the old AIMSPOWER unit, but it obviously has some charge profiles on their that the old AIMSPOWER version did not have.
Excellent review and presentation, like always!
One thing I'd suggest: should (almost) always connect the positive side of negative/ground bonded DC circuits first. That way if you do accidentally contact the chassis with the other lead, there's no risk of a short. I'm sure you already know this, but my anxiety went up a little bit during the capacitor charging. :)
That's a great tip to keep in mind!
@Simon Messer I don't sell anything, I just make videos. You'll have to ask the company if they sell replacement parts (I think they do).
I have been running the Sigineer direct version with 9.8 KW AGM (don’t say it I will go LifePO4 when the bank dies, but I can’t just toss em out) for about 2 years as an emergency backup I love it, my only complaint is the fact it bonds neutral to ground, but yes the idle capacity is high, but mine is under load when used. Efficiency is better at higher loads
I'm curious - have you opened it up by a chance? Does it look the same inside as what I showed here?
@@LithiumSolar I took a peak. I don’t remember the red goop, but otherwise yes
@@LithiumSolar I chuckled when you showed the display, it is identical too. Surprising after 2 years frankly
I've enjoyed you information, and am still learning what all the bells and whistles do on my 18K SunGold Inverter
This inverter is actually the 6kw Sigineer-Power inverter someone stamped the sun gold on it, I have one that's connected to my 800Ah battery bank running water well, hybrid 50gal water heater & 12000BTU mini split AC, I really like this inverter over any other ones on market.
Do you have any evidence that this is a Sigineer inverter? Sun Gold Power has told me that they are not in any way affiliated with Sigineer.
Most of the idle current is MOSFET gate current and keeping the iron core of the transformer saturated.
A large part is the magnetizing losses in the core. Grain oriented silicon steel laminations lose about 1/2 watts per pound of material when idling at normal operating flux. This loss is independent of the load in the transformer, and dominates the losses at idle. At full power, copper losses due to the resistance of the windings become the bigger portion.
Well said. I just point out above that you can't get away from it. Inherent.
When you add a 100W load, will it add up to 200W consumption with the 100W idle consumption, or will it be less? If less the 100W idle consumption will not be such a pain as it looks at first sight.
It will add to your regular load, can't get away from it.
so who else took one look at that inverter and had a flashback to the Phoenix Gold/Orion/Soundstream mega-kW competition car audio amplifiers from the early 90's? you know, the ones that were "rated" at like 400w at 4Ω, but would push something ridiculous like 3kW - 4kW into a 0.125Ω load so they could compete (and dominate) in the lower-wattage classes...ah, the good 'ol days....LOL
My first one was damaged slightly.. cover bent. Inspected, no real damage inside. It’s a Beast and starts EVERYTHING!
I complained about the packaging! The seller responded with good comments and would review the packing.
My Second one I just received was packaged Much Better and had No Damage!
I opted for these do to the Low Frequently design and the Heavy Duty Build!
Thanks buddy
✌️PT
PT do you have them both in parallel to the same breaker box?
@@lesw8798 No sir.. I have a solar power shop with one of these running out there and the other one is for the house system as a backup.. redundancy is very important! Actually in my house I have two 12kw inverters and this 6kw for backup. Pretty dang soon I will upload a video of our home solar power system!
It’s sooo cool to check out how much power your own system generates!
Electrical Freedom!
Thanks Les
✌️PT
I notice sungoldpower has an All In One hybrid unit with similar specs, but so much more in form of 120 amp ac and PV charging input to battery for about the same price.
The big difference being the one you mention will be a high-frequency inverter where as this is a low-frequency inverter. Both inverter types have different purposes. This one (low frequency) is designed to start heavy inductive loads.
@@LithiumSolar ... Just looked at specs; ... The Sungoldpower TP6048 includes a Low Frequency Inverter in All In One form with Solar PV option for current cost of $1,365 ... Plus can charge at 120 amps vs just 60 amps. I do see some mixed reviews. Would love to see you Test one of these.
@@CaptBill69 Ah, didn't know that was the unit you were referring to. I figured it was one of the more-popular HF models. In that case yes, I would consider that a superior choice.
Good Video really explained alot for me. I have a question for you. I have two of these inverters one is an old one that went out. Is there any companies that service these. Thank you in advanced.
Since your inverter is a source, providing a reference to ground will establish a stability of the neutral to stay fixed to zero volts AC at all times. There many be a bonding wire in that inverter to the neutral wire. The neutral is connected exactly at midpoint of the full coil in the transformer, which puts out 240 V AC, but unless it’s grounded, it will not stay electrically stable. Only voltage that will stay stable without a reference to ground is the 240.
It doesn't have to utilize an auto-transformer to "create" a neutral, a regular 2-winding isolation transformer can accomplish the same thing with a center tap secondary winding. The latter is a more safer way to create a neutral. Costs more that way too.
Yes, a regular 2-winding isolation transformer can accomplish the same thing - but that's not how this is wired here.
Correct. Just like isolation transformers, and the step down transformers at the service pole outside your house. The center tap of the transformer is your neutral. Yes, the 240 in to that unit creates that neutral on it's secondary output.
Without having to modify the house wiring, you could use a dryer plug lead to test the charging function.
That's a good idea
And yes on the neutral wire off the transformer it's tapped like an auto transformer I have changed my transformer in a victron inverter to be split phase single unit I know you can parallel them or split phase two units but I didn't need two units
This is the model I'm starting with for a practicality test with 40 240W solar panels and a 16S Lifepo4 battery bank of 14kWh capacity.
Hoping you see this, as I am kinda stumped. This is the same inverter just re-branded as the Sigineer 6,000W model based on what I have seen of the internals and comparing it to my Sigineer.
The question I have relates to your AC OUTPUT wiring. I have the same panel you have and am preparing to run lines to it. I do not ever plan on having an AC Input either. This will just be stand-alone, off grid. So my question relates to bonding the neutral and ground on this type of setup.
Sigineer has kind of mixed messages regarding it, namely on removing the bonding screw. I guess what I am asking, How would you wire up this inverter in a stand-alone setup with no AC-Input to power a small house using the same panel you have in this video?
As is expected- If I fry myself, it is my fault entirely. I am just looking for some advice on wiring it up. I am comfortable around AC wiring, just don't wanna screw up the inverter. lol
My Opinion) The neutral+ground bond should only occur at one location. Anything more turns the ground wire to a current-carrying conductor (very bad). If you're running it completely off-grid like I am (with no AC input ever), you would wire your inverter output to a breaker panel, then bond there. That's how I wired it in this video and how I have my AIMS 10kW wired.
Official Answer) Contact an electrician ;)
@@LithiumSolar Do you have your AIMS chassis grounded to Earth?
I actually need to open mine back up and see because I never noticed if they had bonded the ground inside the inverter. Some do that and some don't.
Thank you for reading and replying. :-)
I actually live next door to an electrician. lol. I was actually planning on asking his opinion on it at some point if I couldn't get the right consensus from others who have done the same things.
I saw the same loose studs on my Amazon warehouse (customer return) samlex PST 1500-12v inverter, I thought it was broken too but you just confirmed it's a design on purpose
Also you could if you're close to your clothes dryer make a plug-in off of it to get your 240 to test the charger in inverters on your bench
What Shunt and screen read out are you using ?? Great Video !!!
You have to get more stronger battery to fully push that inverter I have the same one and I have 4/0 gauge wire with 230ah @48 volt. Thank you for your vedio it helped me alot
Yeah a bigger battery and thicker cabling would be much better. I think 4/0 is a bit overkill though? I pretty much wanted to test the two products as they came vs any custom changes/wiring.
Mine died after 2 years on the off grid house. It ran extremely hot right from day one, I think I was sold a faulty unit on Amazon. I own a second one that hasn't seen much use yet. The loads were always well under 6000w generally 200w or less. Occasionally used it for power tools, like the miter saw, cement mixer.
I should note that the second one I bought runs much cooler
I am looking for a replacement inverter now, and this was a big help in my search. As usual, great job!
I see you bonded the ground and neutral inside your test breaker box. If the inverter is bonded ground to neutral that would create two paths for current to travel. Just curious about how you have it set up.
Great video. Can you also use the scope to see if it really maintain pure sine wave output? The inside looks like AIMS.
I do have an oscilloscope but am not familiar with it enough yet to be able to look at a waveform and say what is/isn't good.
I tested mine, which is a 24v Sigineer 6kW Split-phase model and it is in fact a puresine wave, THD% was about 2-4% which is typical for on-grid or off-grid stuff.
I just bought the 24 volt model exactly like that. It seems to be nice so far. I think it's only 2000 watts per leg tho. I was kinda hoping for it to be more capable but it does power up a 15000 but ac on my camper
Honest question- Would the AIMS Power remote LCD work on this unit if they are made pretty much by the same OEM?
Yes, I'm thinking it would work but I am not brave enough to plug mine in and try it nor would I recommend anyone else do it... lol
Get it hot and short the output frequently and repeatedly. If it survices that, it's awesome. You should be the one to do it, you got it free. If I buy one to test I'll show it no mercy.
Coolio. Thanks for the video. Got my 2kw 24v inverter/charger from them a few days ago. Been liking it so far. Worth the $500-$600, imo. Wont need to upgrade again for a while.
Just an update on my sungold 4000 split phase. Bro its still performing perfect. Mine is 24 volt on 840 ah of the eve 280k cells from 18650 battery store. I use 2 2-0 postive qnd 2 2-0 ground wires so its definitely not starved for power and i use victron charge controllers. My system is doing great and i was wondering how your sungold inverter was holding up?
Is it possible to use it in "AC coubling" in off grid use, along with grid tie inverter?
As i see there are two transformers inside this thing, one for inverter, and another for charger! Is it possible that both used simultaneously?
I was looking into the 4000W split phase for my 50 Amp RV. I questioned sungold about the situation of a campsite only having 30 amp, as to whether the battery charger would work. I did not receive an answer. You having one, could test this. Does battery charging occur on single phase, bridged across both input hots.
You only did a power on test, you have not tested the power savings setting, which may/likely reduce the standby consumption. I'd be very interested in the power savings version of the test.
From the OEM, AIMS Power, it is specifically deigned for sump pumps for marine use. Not for providing power for a home on "power saving".
Here's a follow-up video explaining and testing the power saver functionality > ua-cam.com/video/57Tuf6mXsL4/v-deo.html
I have this same unit for a year and a half now. I use the hell out of it, well pump, compressors, 3hp table saw etc. and have no complaints save for the high idle consumption.
Question, I have the neutral bonded to ground at the house panel, which is fine when on the inverter, but my 20kw genset is bonded at the genset. So when running on the genset I have two bonded points. Any thoughts as to how to avoid this?
I removed the bonding wire off my honda 3500 for use with my furnace otherwise the computer on the furnace gives a ground fault and won’t turn on during a power failure. Then i made a plug with the neutral and ground connected and plug it in whenever I use it not hooked up to my transfer switch.
Can you use this using receptacle box and connected to 48v battery to charge up Ecoflow Delta Pro automatically?
Very good video...question here...When you set your battery as priority...when this inverter change to main AC ? ...It is not clear to me if you can set this parameter as in other inverters...for example for my LI-FE-PO4 52 volt battery pack...I will like to set that to 48 volts. Hence...when the system drop to 48 volt..the inverter will switch to main AC. Then when the inverter detect the voltage above 52 volts (battery where charged by a photovoltaic system)...the inverter switch back to battery....Thanks.
That transformer does appear to have a center tap(so like an auto transformer).
That red stuff is Silastic. It would be really awesome to get the part number for that transformer inside.
Additionally, those internal wires are probably 90+c rated, so they are probably fine to run those loads. I am pretty sure the manufacturer didn't size the cables to be cool to the touch.
You complain about the 'wasted' energy of the inverter/controller when idle. Did you try the power saving mode you mentioned at the beginning of the review? Just curious. On my inverter/controller, when you use the power saving mode, it shuts off the transformer/inverter until you begin to use a device. Thus saving that constant drain. Are you sure you haven't overlooked that feature on your's?
Yes it has power saver, no I did not try it. I don't fine that feature particularly useful as you still see pretty much the same self-consumption when a small load is applied. Additionally, my inverter is never off in my home - always something consuming power even if it's just phone or laptop chargers.
@@LithiumSolar "I see", said the blind man.
@@LithiumSolar So, I guess my next question is this, does that 100 watt consumption continue while using current consuming devices? Is the consumption always 100 watts over and above the load device? If not then your 'always' use may solve the issue. Just sayin'.
@@aday1637 Will do some further testing and provide a follow-up in a day or two :) There are a lot of efficiency questions being asked, so I'll collect them and answer as many as I can in a short video.
Here's a follow-up video explaining and testing the power saver functionality > ua-cam.com/video/57Tuf6mXsL4/v-deo.html
Another honest review thanks for sharing
Do you know if i could run 2 110 volt inputs of the same phase into the ac input or would it mess it up or not work? I would like to charge batteries from my i inverter like this but i dont have a 220 line to connect to inverter.
Transformers, of many types, have very little loss when at idle. Majority of the loss during idle are from the power transistors and relays.
Great video.
Is there any way to set it up for demand sense so it isn't using 100W all the time ?
Will the charger function work with a 120VAC source ? Or does it have to be 240VAC ?
Can it charge while it is powering a load ? Will it sync with another inverter in parallel ?
1) Has a power savings mode that does just this - will be testing this in a follow-up video very soon
2) No, this inverter is 240VAC input only
3) Yes, it can power while charging and no it cannot be paralleled with other inverters.
@@LithiumSolar Thanks for the replies !
I'm a bit late to this video! Thank you, really interesting! I'm considering this inverter right now. How noisy was it under moderate loads? Like 1-2kW.... I know you also have LV6548. Could you compare amounts of noise from LV6548 and this inverter? Assuming that LV6548 runs on battery only (no solar, night conditions and etc.).
Looks like the inverter/charger is built good. It had 12 gauge inside which is good for 20 amps at 240 volts. Those inverters are rated for the surge or peak wattage of 6000 watts but I would say they're about 4800 watts continuous. Those batteries are way over rated at 6000 watts. Running the dryer was exceeding the battery cables capacity. All these devices should be rated at their running watts not peak watts. 6000 watts at 48 volts is 125 amps and since you cannot exceed 85% of the cables capacity those batteries should have 1/0 cable. Those batteries are probably only 2400 Running watts each. It looked like the inverter went into self protect on one of the phase at 13:48 time of this video because the dryer was pulling more than it could handle.
LithiumSolar Brother, Awesome Review! Can I use AGM batteries? When you had the washer on why did it shut off because the battery or the inverter? Best Regards!
Do you guys sell that subpanel pre made like that one you have. With outlets on the plywood?
I don't work for the company nor sell things. I purchased all of the components used for the subpanel setup from Home Depot.
0:50 Yep, is a lot similar to AIMS inverter with the same crap battery type selector dial button.
These look identical to AIMS inverters. I suspect there's a common family tree and marketed/sold in different ways? One difference is that AIMS has a couple of ETL certified versions - which I own - and I'm hoping (maybe) it has slightly more robust components? Be interested if someone knows what's up on all this :).
I agree. I'd love to buy an AIMS 6000W and compare them side-by-side but $1700 is a lot just for creating one video lol.
@@LithiumSolar Awhile back I purchased both the AIMS 48V input 6000W low frequency 240V/120V output split phase inverter, as well as a SUNGOLDPOWER 48V input 6000W low frequency 240V/120V output split phase inverter.
I only just got the SUNGOLDPOWER unit hooked up about five days ago, and have only used it for about 12 hours under 5.4kW output load for electric car charging purposes (plus about 50 hours of idle time with no load).
The AIMS and SUNGOLDPOWER seem very similar, but so far, I definitely prefer the SUNGOLDPOWER, for a few important reasons:
1. When I load the AIMS inverter output higher than 18A at 232V AC continuously for more than a few minutes at a time, the unit emits a worrisome burning electrical smell, although it smells fine at or below 18A even when operated at this level for several hours continuously. So far, the SUNGOLDPOWER unit seems to work fine at 22A at 244V AC continuous output (sustained for 6 hours during my first car charging session), although it does currently emit a foul burning Styrofoam smell. The burning Styrofoam smell is no doubt due to actual melting hot Styrofoam, since it gets packaged and shipped in Styrofoam, which tends to break off small pieces that then fall into the unit air intake holes. Then, upon operation, they get really hot and smell bad for awhile, but I expect this smell to eventually go away altogether, once the Styrofoam has finished baking off volatiles. The same burning Styrofoam smell was emitted from the AIMS unit early in it's operational history as well.
2. The AIMS unit cost me roughly $1900 after taxes, while the SUNGOLDPOWER cost me about $1300 after taxes.
3. The SUNGOLDPOWER has a small LCD display that shows input DC voltage (not too accurately though), input AC voltage, and output load in percentage of 6kW rating. The AIMS unit omits this rather valuable feature altogether, thus requiring an external DC power meter, which further increases the effective cost of the system.
Overall, so far my impression is that the SUNGOLDPOWER is equivalent or better than the AIMS, especially the price tag and being able to more confidently sustain operation at its full power rating. Both units however have massive room for technical improvement, as they both lack proper 0.1V accurate configurability for charging voltage and low voltage cut-off, for safe use with various types of lithium ion batteries available today. They also both consume vastly excessive idle quiescent current, and have much too low overall efficiency under load (both rated around 88%).
If they improved the efficiency from say 88% to 93%, this would effectively shrink the required battery bank of the solar system by about 5%, and simultaneously increase the "effective size" of the solar array by about 5%. For a $30k solar array + battery based system, this equates to a savings of $1500 on the overall system, which would easily justify paying over $500 more for the inverter (say if they doubled up the MOSFETs and improved the transformer, so as to get better efficiency - along with better overload capability). They should also improve the inverters to allow paralleling of multiple units, as a standard feature. Ideally, this would become a standard feature on all inverters from all manufacturers.
I do not understand why big battery sells 175 amp anderson connectors with 6 gauge wire installed in them. I noticed that immediately when I looked into their products. I haven't ordered from them, and I'm sure their batteries are good based on other reviews here on youtube but the 6 gauge wire bothers me. It should be 1 gauge minimum....
There are many charts on the Internet that show 200C-insulated wire can hit some pretty high amp ratings. For example, this one www.coonerwire.com/amp-chart/ says it can handle 165A. I agree though and have made the recommendation to them that they consider selling thicker gauge cabling. It sounds like it's possible they'll be carrying more options soon, but I can't speak for them.
@@LithiumSolar Dang, I have always kept 6 gauge to like 60 amps lol. I haven't ventured into the high temp rated wire yet. I suppose the larger amperage rating on the high temp rated stuff makes sense, but all that heat means resistance. I dunno, something about hot wires gives me anxiety hah. Thanks for the quick response and the enlightenment on high temp rated wires!
"something about hot wires gives me anxiety" > I completely agree! Lol. I've always tried to stick to the NEC numbers myself.
Didn't the unit have a low power mode?? What was the rocker switch for that was on the top left of the unit?? Thanks!
Here's a follow-up video explaining and testing the power saver functionality > ua-cam.com/video/57Tuf6mXsL4/v-deo.html
Do you feel this or a lower wattage unit would be good for a small office UPS substitute? I'm getting tired of conventional UPS units and want something a little more robust.
It would work but, at 6000W and low-frequency, is definitely overkill for that particular application. A smaller MPPSolar high-frequency would be best suited for an office UPS. I have a plan to build something exactly like this but video is a month or two out at this point.
@@LithiumSolar I look forward to seeing it!
I have the same inverter, just wondering why it gets so hot, with only my upright freezer hooked up to, it's only rated at 4.5amps.
It has a massive transformer that it needs to keep powered even if there is no load connected. You can try using the standby mode, though I don't personally recommend it as it doesn't work very well .
@@LithiumSolar so do you think It would be ok, or should I swap it out for another one? I'm going to be using it to power up 10 circuits, off my grid. I'm just running some tests on it for now.
interesting... my toriodal inverter 3kw is only idling at 25-30 watts... more efficient than my high frequency 6kw all in one inverter which idles at 60-65 watts.... so is size relative to idle power consumption? i'm curious.
How many batteries do you need for 6000 wat to run the whole hose and run everything
Somewhere between 1 and a lot.
Try to get a 3 prong 240v dryer cord and connect black and red to the inverter. Neutral is not used for charging. Therfore you can test the charge circuit
Those auto transformers your talking about are awesome. Just learned about them myself
Is that an 18650 kick-stand?
No, but that's a fun idea lol. It's a 10mm deep socket with red electrical tape.
I have the 10k 24v model. I loved it until it stopped working. For Some reason the about 6-8 transistors on exploded out of the blue. No sure what happened the unit lasted just about over a year. Currently in the process of a warranty process. Any ideas?
Company is telling its only a 1 yr warranty even though their website states 24 months🤷🏻♂️. Hopefully it goes through if not Victron here I come….
Nice looking inverter, I would like to have seen you push it more, even my cheap Giandel 4000/8000 inverter can start up an air compressor similar to yours.
What it can't start is a 2300w mitre saw which is a crucial tool for a lot of people and has a start up load much higher than an air compressor.
Did you watch until the end? I ran a cloths drier on it that pulled 5500W. I would have loved to push it more, just don't have many 6000W appliances lying around AND the batteries were kindof the limiting factor in the test here :) :)
The presence of 60 volts between ground and neutral at the inverter outlet can be hazardous to common household appliances, such as refrigerators, etc. Attempting to connect ground to neutral at the inverter outlet will cause internal damage to the power circuits.
Your local electrical codes will dictate how/where the neutral + ground bonding occurs. It is not bonded in the inverter.
They do studs like that on some power distribution blocks for DC also
for the quality and for the price of the output this thing as a real bargain! to be completely honest I much rather have a loss of efficiency and have the unit actually be able to put up a power when I need it then worry about it not being as efficient as some other kind of inverter which will usually end up with problems with.
this thing looks like a sturdy built product and it doesn't seem like they skipped out on actually building it either.
I wonder how clean the AC is from this.?
Thanks for the video and all the useful info on this channel! I was surprised at the parasitic loss of 100w for just running this inverter. I'd be curious for you to get your hands on the digital Solar Edge HD Wave which sells a 6KW inverter for less $ than this model with a higher level of efficiency. Then discuss your findings for HD wave, vs. toroidal xformer vs. this style xformer. Anyway foopd for thought as you grow your channel.
The Solaredge is a great inverter but it's TOTALLY a different use case. The SE needs optimizers attached to solar panels vs a battery, it's not made for this kind of use. It's intended to be 100% grid-tied, whereas this is more of an off-grid solution that is NOT legal for connection to the grid (you can do it but you need to wire it like a generator and switch yourself off the grid when in use). I actually own both the SolarEdge and this 6K inverter and have tested them extensively.
Thanks for the video. I noticed that on the inverter display it showed “abnormal “ voltage. What does that mean?
it was not connected to AC input
Hello Sir,;
Got this unit but is 24 DC and is 2000 watts , can it take or pull three batteries of 12 volts each???
Interms of charging system, it got 20Amp, how many solar panels i must connect so that it can charge nicely & with those panels how many batteries must be there??
Will be waiting for your reply plz
Did the battery saver mode help on the idle consumption at all? Curious if it takes longer to respond for AC power if the battery saver mode is on too. Very nice inverter though and great if you need to get a workout in. No need to but weights!
On mine, you do have to switch off then on again to restart the inverter after it goes off in the power saving mode. After a period of time (several minutes) the inverter shuts off when in the power saver mode.
Supposedly these inverters will wake up when you put a load of 25 or so watts, but my 2kw 24v model didnt do that in my test. I just leave mine on al the time.
Here's a follow-up video explaining and testing the power saver functionality > ua-cam.com/video/57Tuf6mXsL4/v-deo.html
Does it have a mppt charger as well, or just a AC charger?
You mention in this video that you can ground or not ground the neutral based on which inverter you're testing. Have you determined which inverters allow the ground and neutral to be connected? My house was built in 1987 and the utility feed only has three wires... the two hot wires and a combination ground/neutral. I have been having trouble getting the inverter manufacturers to tell me if this is a problem. Sigineer told me that this is not allowed on most of their inverters.
I've been having a similar issue...I have an 18K SunGold inverter..The neutral is not the sam as a ground, I've been told. They do not address this in their setup instructions. I connected the neutral wire to the neutral bar also. What I did, was connect a 2nd ground wire to the original ground and returned it to the main fuse panel. I also connected a physical ground to the square ground terminal with a bare copper wire. triple grounded. extra work, but I know the electricity will have a safe path back to ground this way for sure.
Very informative. Thank you!
thanks alot for this video , at the same time i'm interesting in inverters of sungold power
I see it cost about the same as the MPP Solare LV6548 ALL in one... is there a reason to get this over the MPP Solar ? thanks
MPPSolar products are great as well. The most significant difference will be this is low frequency and the MPPSolar is high frequency. This means the SunGoldPower will have a huge/heavy transformer that allows it to start large inductive loads. The MPPSolar won't have this, won't have as much starting capacity, but will also be more efficient because of not having the transformer. I guess at the end of the day, it comes down to how you plan on using it / what loads you intend to run. If you're running a large air conditioner, welder, well pumps, etc - this may be better suited for you. MPPSolar also has the solar charge controller, which this does not, so you'd have to factor that into the price comparison as well :)
Starting power of low frequency inverters is great.
Love your videos and your attention to detail!
FYI: The word chassis is pronounced CHASS-EEE. Weird, but... there you go.
Would the Big Battery 48volt batteries be any better you think?
I assume you're asking about the Husky (48V)? I do think that is a more refined product than the Wolfs I have. It's slightly less capacity, but if I were buying again, I might consider the Husky over a pair of the Wolfs. I primarily went with the Wolfs as I was intrigued by the A123 cells vs the aluminum-cased cells in the Husky.
@@LithiumSolar Yes, the Huskys I was considering getting two of those.
Have you figured out the 240VAC output wiring? What is the ground attached to? Docs are confusing!
Yes. There's a L1, L2, N, and Gnd coming out. You can see how I connected it to a panel at 8:16. If you're not sure, please contact an electrician!
So you never tried the input side. Thats where the problem is.
Is this the one you are giving to a subscriber?
Ha, I wish I could...
Do you still have the sungold inverter? Mine is working great for powering my 220 minisplit but i was wondering if you know if the ac input has to be 220 split phase since it dont use the neutral? Could i use 2 110 inputs of the same phase as my ac input ? Id like to have my generator charge my batteries thru this inverter but my generator is only 110.
The input has to be 240V. You cannot connect 120V unless you were to pass it through a 120 to 240V step-up transformer first.
@@LithiumSolarcan you use two 120v inverters on a double pole 240v breaker to make 240volts. One inverter on one leg l1 and the other on the other leg. L2
I have the 6000 split phase 24 volt unit that I am hooking up. That terminal block on the AC side is terrible. That tiny screw does not hold fine strand flexible wire very well. I tried a piece of 6 gauge wire with about 10 strands. Any slight movement of the wire will loosen that connection right up. What a terrible design. Should the wire end have some kind of solid ferrule crimped to the end to make full contact with the round hole in the terminal block?
What type of wire are you using? I've had no trouble at all with #6 or #8 THHN. I do not use ferrules on these terminals.
@@LithiumSolar I'm using AWG 8 tinned fine strand 105C rated marine wire. Those inverter terminals with the setscrew have 6mm holes on the load side. I made a steel fixture with a pair of 5/8'' square steel bars with a 6mm hole drilled into the middle of the bars where they are clamped together. That way I have 2 halves of a 6mm hole split in the middle. I took a piece of 1/4 inch copper tube and made ferrules. The tube gets staked with a round nosed tool and then gets folded in the middle. Then a flat steel bar in a hydraulic press packs the ferrule into the bottom of the half hole and is flat on its top surface. The ferrule is then trimmed to 3/8'' long.
So the ferrule looks like a solid copper ''D'' shaped lug in cross section. The cool thing is that the setscrew pushes that lug so the curvature of the lug exactly fits the upper half of the hole in the terminal board on the inverter. I polished the drill marks out of the half holes and when the copper lug comes out of the home brew die, it looks like a mirror finish. I am certain that there will be a generous contact area once that setscrew is tightened for good and there won't be any overheated connections. Yup, overkill, but I know that I will never have to worry about those connections again. There is only about 18 inches of load wires and ground going to a double circuit breaker. Next to it is a 240 volt 4 prong receptacle and a pair of 20 amp 120 volt outlets, one for L1 and the other for L2. Why Marine wire....I have rolls of it stockpiled away. 4/0 and 2/0 welding cable, too. Wire and cable is getting very expensive!
This unit is for standby for grid down situation. I copied your resistor charge setup. Since I will most likely have the battery bank switched off most of the time, I thought it would be cool to add a push button to pre charge the inverter capacitors before switching on. The input to the inverter comes from a 240 volt Onan standby diesel generator, not the grid. I went with a 24 volt system because I also have another 24 volt diesel driven large frame alternator with external lithium regulator. The unit also gets a pair of Aims 24 volt chargers as well. Our location has poor solar exposure. But that didn't stop me from installing a Growatt 120 amp MPPT. Thanks for your ideas and review!
Can I connect two of these from the batteries via bus bars to a load center ?
You cannot connect multiples of these inverters together. They do not support stacking/parallel connections.
I didn't see any chokes into the primary. If you add a choke to the primary input, from the transformer into the primary rail, wrap it twice through the core and connect back to the rail. The idle current should drop to about 20 watts.
I don't think you can get away from that 100W idle loss. It's the transformer core losses. Inherent. Magnetizing currents, eddy currents etc.
Do you have your shop lights hooked up to the inverter? Cuz why the lights flicker when turning on the compressor. I’m not trying to say you have the compressor hooked up to grid power just looks suspicious.
The pole lamp, which you can see sitting behind the air compressor, is pugged in to the inverter at the bench outlets, which you can see at timestamp 15:05. So yes, they are dimming when the air compressor starts.
I have a 3000 watt pure sine inverter with a 24 volt system and 30 100w batterys why will it not charge my 2021 chevy bolt ev
why not double the cable from bms to the connector?
You could replace the wiring fairly easily. But that's a lot of work you shouldn't have to do on something you purchase like this.
Hey how does one connect to solar panels ?
This inverter does not have a solar charge controller. You cannot connect solar panels.
Your claim around time 13:00 is a bit over the top. No way you were pulling 6million watts. :)
It's closer to 7 million I think.
Cam two or three be wired in parallel?
The batteries can be wired in parallel. The inverter does not support paralleling the AC output.
The silicone wire insulation is rated to 105C or 120C. At 75C it's not that hot. Of course, the heavier wire would be more efficient. The heat lost on the wire is energy lost from the battery. Also, these LF Inverters are not drawing a nice DC current. The current has a 120Hz ripple that can be rather large at full load. If your average current is 125A, then the peak current is probably 1.414X that value, or 176A. The battery may not be rated for 176A pk currents! That's the major difference between a LF and HF Inverter. The HF inverter has a nice, smooth DC input current, but the LF has a 120Hz, rectified sine dc current. That's why the capacitors eventually fail if not kept cool. If you want to reduce the heat and the ripple current, add a large electrolytic, 200,000 uF capacitor bank between the battery and the inverter.
The center tapped secondary is not an auto transformer. It is isolated from the primary, and that makes it simply a transformer.
There is no secondary when it's running in pass-through mode.
@@LithiumSolar Nor any primary. In pass through, the incoming line is simply sent to the output through a relay. I haven't taken mine apart to look, but a presume it is a double pole double throw relay that connects the output to the incoming split phase 120/240, or to the center tapped secondary of the big transformer.
The primary of the transformer is connected to an H bridge PWM sine wave generator running at the battery voltage. This makes ~ 30 VAC, which is stepped up to line voltage by the transformer, which has a 240 volt secondary with a center tap.