@@macnation300 I call shennanigans. Too big of a TB has been proven to cost a few ft lbs of torque below 4k rpm, but approaching redline the engine will always eek out a few more ft lbs given fewer intake restrictions. That dyno chart clearly showed the engine was losing torque in the upper rpms. There is absolutely no way that a bigger TB will cost ft lbs in the upper rpms.
@@macnation300 This was a hot topic twenty years ago, and back then 5.0 Magazine did several dyno tests over several months and they all came back to the same thing: "too large" of a throttle body will cost a handful of footpounds down low, and by 4000 rpm you start to gain a few. But if you're driving fast you're keeping the revs above 4k, so go big, right?
@@331SVTCobra I think the idea behind it is a slower airflow velocity through the intake. So the more stagnant air has less cylinder fill. The same manner scavenging for exhaust works, a properly sized throttle body for the airflow the engine combination requires, will work best. There are engine math formulas will provide a number of CFM the engine needs to reach peak hp. It can then be converted to the throttle body CFM capability. I like street manners so a properly sized engine combination is desirable to me for best throttle response, torque, and power in the mid range. This is what makes the fastest * street car
Man you can can really hear the difference on the second pull. How the timing was off from the first. it sounded like an old pickup truck motor that had 200,000 milies on it
Come on! Toss on some AFR’s, or a Trick Flow top end!! 1.6 ratio rollers, let that baby breathe!! Mid to late 90’s has these parts for the small block Fords. Don’t restrict this beauty! The top end of those curves would open up and climb nicely. 🇺🇸👍💪🦅
That is AWESOME. I would LOVE to do a 5.8 swap just like that. Maybe with a better cam. The stock intake and everything just makes it. It looks like it belongs. I love that.
@@superkillr That's almost what a stock one puts out (260/320). There's still something wrong. I built a 1988 Mercury Cougar 20 years ago and used a Gen 1 Lightning 5.8 shortblock (stock), a mild Lunati Cam (almost exactly the same spec as the old E-303) some old but heavily worked TFS aluminum canted valve heads (275CFM intake/235 CFM exhaust) and a stock lightning (GT40) intake. Tranny was a (new) Tremec 3550 (the original Cobra R tranny), stock driveshaft, stock 3.08 rear stock 15" turbine wheels BBK longtubes, 2.5 flowmaster 50 series cat back (no cats). All controlled by a 1993 Mustang GT Auto EEC with a Gen II lightning MAF custom tuned to it with 30lb injectors. I had almost exactly the same thing happen. 1st pull made 245rwhp and 305 ft/lbs. Turns out the one of the meter wires wasn't contacting properly. After a quick re-do of my MAF harness, 275 rwhp/ 312 ft lbs. Turns out it was running way over rich (the meter problem was causing it to run lean and I had turned up the FP to compensate). After turning the FP down, 301 rwhp/ 362 ft/lbs. Mind you also that it was indoors and 100 degrees and 95 percent humidity (I drove down to Atlanta in mid summer to get it tuned, I live in NJ). After getting it back home in some nice 50 degree air, 320 rwhp/379 ft/lbs. When I built the car I had set a goal of 360ish at the crank. Think I almost perfectly met it. The tuner who is actually the original founder of SCT and former FoMoCo Engineer Jerry W told me that I could have gotten more out of it even with the small cam if I had "good" heads. LOL.
@@BoardwalkBullies That sounds like it would’ve been a fun car too. I love all the details in a story with a resolute ending. I think we realize this dyno run was a verification of the swap. And the dyno did it’s job. It let these folks know there’s a lot of power being left somewhere. Without a lot to go from the clip I wonder if they see a need to be connected to a computer or something to watch and or log the AFRs, timing, compensated mass and so forth. It’s still great content car and a hot looking SN95, I’d watch more.
@@DoesItTho I wanted a monte carlo SS but I hated Chevy build quality. My parents were GM until my mother had to buy a 1985 cougar with the 5.0 out of necessity. I was instantly converted to Ford. They just got better from there until they cancelled the fox chassis cougar after 1988. It was the dream car I never knew I wanted. 😂
That’s a 12 sec car with 330 ft-lbs at the tire in a fox-4 chassis as is. Extruded honing the upper and lower with a set of longtubes would make that top end sing. So much meat left on the bone in that 9.5 deck.
No doubt, Windsor motors produce torque! Add a good set of aluminum heads, & cam... be a very fun street car! always had a place in my heart for the sn95 my first stang was a 95 GT. Went 13.67 @ 101, which was quick for the time I owned it 97-03
Man wish I would've kept my '95 Crystal White Cobra with the Black leather interior...I had that car trapping 118-120mph in the 1/4 mile back in '95-'96...mods were Edelbrock everything..heads, upper and lower intake, x cam, 1 3/4 Full length headers and the best secret weapon 9lbs Powerdyne supercharger it made no noise so nobody on the street never knew what hit them
This is basically the same engine build that I have in my Daddywagon so it was good info for sure. I would like you to put the Boss 427W short block in there without changing anything else because that's my next move! Haha!
Yeah, that's actually pretty standard. Using the same top-end components and cam, the 351 usually won't make much more hp than the 302, but you will get that extra torque. I usually don't put much stick in cold-air intakes, but I think the stock airbox and 65mm TB is really choking off this engine. They mentioned 24lb injectors but didn't say anything about the MAF, so if it's a stock MAF then that's hurting it too. My buddy had a 95gt back in the day, and put down a little over 300rwhp with the stock 302 block. Edelbrock performer heads with a basic Motorsport E cam and an untouched Cobra intake, 30lb injectors, 65mm TB, 75mm MAF. Your run of the mill heads/cam/intake 5.0 from back then.
Both my 93 and 94 Cobras (with same engine that was stock) made almost exactly the same power as this dyno run. Ford was definitely low balling their power/torque numbers for that Cobra engine. I sure do miss my Cobras 🐍
Very nice. You had to blow it up and race it back in the day to know how it would compete. Now you can just google your combo you want and know what its gonna make. That car would be "in the mix" back in the day. Remember, HP aluminum heads were still in there infancy. Ford had that head and World Sr's. SBC's had World Product iron heads, vortecs, Early Eddy's. If you had a ford back then you had to be "on the gun" or a blower to hang. We'd split 302 rollers in half with 300HP. Putting 2000 worth of 347 in a glass 302 block didnt make sense. Thats why the 351 swap was the way to go.
Man! I had (my dad still owns it),’89 LX back in the day with a Ford Racing 302 short block, and GT-40P heads that made 265 hp/365 ft/lbs at JBA here in San Diego. To have a 5.8l engine with aluminum GT-40X heads make similar power is disappointing. I blame the computer in those cars.
Nah I blame the cylinder heads. More cubic inches requires more airflow to fill the cylinders. Even a great set of 302 heads on a 351 means it will run out of CFMs in the higher RPMs. And since HP= Torque X RPM divided by 5252, unless your spinning the engine as high in the RPMs ( and feeding the air required to make more power at those RPMs), you will only see more low end torque. Not any horsepower advantage
@@benjaminwatson7868 I understand. But the gt-40 and the Gt-40p are similar (other than spark plug angle, combustion chamber CC, and the P head actually has smaller exhaust valves), a 351 with gt-40 heads in any form should make more power than that.
My California legal 95 Cobra with a 331 made 315 rwhp and 370 rwtq. 76 mm C&L maf and 70mm BBK TB kept that thing pulling strong to readline. The OHV is yesterday's news. Shoulda put a coyote between those fenders.
An rpm intake, good set of long tubes, 750 double pumper would be a game changer, but you couldn't drive it on the street in yuppie states!! I'll let you know. Gonna build a 95 roller 351, thinkin bout a f cam, TCI c4, 4:10 gears. Put it in the 94 f150 flairside my dad left me. Got little better heads, but it's a tank!! It's mine, I can be as stupid as I wanna be with it!! Maybe a single turbo setup later!???
That's disappointing for a 351w I have the same car im gearing up to put a 351 in it all most got the motor done mine is going to be a 427 aiming for nothing less that 700hp
Not really it has gt 40 heads, And lower intake. It needs to breath more. I'm sure pistons are stock truck pistons too. Probably needs some other pistons, and A bigger throttle body, air intake, Lower and upper Intake and It should make a whole bunch more
@@DominatorGarage Richard Holdner (check out his channel) has done a bunch of dyno tests, and just adding HCI on a bone stock junk yard 351W will surprise the crap outta you. This engine, as they set it up for period correct thinking, is HORRIBLE.
Period correct is some ported AFR 165cc with a comp xe274 wild child cam 💪🏻👊🏻🤙🏻 or for a stroker/5.8 AFR 185cc ported with comp xe276 black Betty cam 💪🏻👊🏻🤙🏻 or fk it and go 347 scat stroker kit with Vic Jr heads , lunati voodoo with a 100shot. 💪🏻👊🏻🤙🏻
You can play with Fuel Air Ratio to some degree by clocking the MAS at different points. Air flow is not consistent in the cross section the air inlet tube. By moving the MAS around you can find a more favorable result.
Some aftermarket MAF (Mass Air Flow) sensors could be clocked. C&L had an inlet tube that was rumored to perform better in a certain orientation. I never noticed any difference with mine. This car has a stock MAF in the stock airbox... this is fixed and can't be clocked. Furthermore the stock MAF created turbulence. There was a screen in front of its sampling tube and the design goal was to keep running in spite of a filthy sensor. (The design goal was NOT max hp.) That's how you sell cars, though... every time the car goes to the dealer for an oil change or service the dealer could clean the MAF sensor and the customer would feel like he had a brand new, more powerful car.
That's an NA motor right?? Can run single plug OHV 4 plus inch bore SBF at 33-36 degrees on 93 octane. It's no different than an LS or SBC. Optimum there is usually around 36 degrees on pump gas. 14 degrees is small bore hot spark land. Newer tiny chambers are more efficient. The new OE rule for emissions compliance and efficiency is to stay under 94mm bore. Between that and the plug in the center of the chamber, flame front propagates 10 plus degrees quicker. Ole
That is a flat tappet cam. I remember running them back in the day. Actually I just put one in a GT40 headed 351 build this past week. Same as a lunatic bate bones or the elgin 960p. Like a 224/224 at .50 112 and a 47x 49x ish lift if I remember right.
Isn't there supposed to be a 5.8l intake manifold instead of 5.0l manifold? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the 5.8 has kinda like oval ports, and the 5.0 more like squared???
@@latemodelrestoration got it thanks for the info. I really don't know much about these engines since I've only owned a 2v but I'm looking to get my hands on a 95 Cobra R which I know it comes w/5.8L so I'll be doing some homework
I had a 359W (.060 over) with KB 10.2:1 pistons, hand-ported 351W 4bbl heads with 1.84/1.60 valves, stock 5.0L HO roller cam retarded 4°, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake and 800 CFM carb along with swap headers and 2.5" exhaust. Made 297 whp SAE peaking at 5,600 rpm and it hung on until 6,000. 330 wtq. It was in a 1982 Mustang GT with T5 and 3.55 gears. Went 109 mph in the 1/4 in AZ with full interior, full weight with AC.
The GT40 (used on the Lightning), Cobra & '96-'01 Explorer/Mountaineer (upper is basically a cast aluminum version of the GT40) intakes are all interchangeable.
Would be nice to see a run without the stock airbox or lid removed for curiosity sakes. I mean I know you could put the lightning massair meter and cone filter, wouldn't that still be considered stock 😉😉 if you left the airbox on cause of epa
Those stock air boxes are actually better than a metal cold air intake up to around 300wheel. The metal ones don’t do anything except heat soak the engine
@@evanhajder putting a cold air intake in your fender well soaks up cooler air with less restriction and better airflow, have dynoed tons with good results. It also doesn't have to be metal, but also having a larger tube cools the air temps down as well.
@@JR-Rollin dynoing the car with the hood open will always show better results with a cold air, as soon as you close the hood and push the car hard, the metal definitely heats the air a lot more. I’ve seen a difference of 40-50 degrees IAT on track between plastic and metal. Although a plastic cold air with a fender filter would probably be the way to go
@@evanhajder that's why I posted my original post...would love to see difference with a kn, or open lid, etc. I know they make a difference and also it doesn't have to be metal, but the heat soak/dwell of aluminum isn't that bad compared to those heavy chrome plated ones, etc. Also increasing tube diameter also lowers IATs. One trick we used to do is a 4" tube to either a race throttlebody with larger mouth and smaller diameter intake side to increase velocity to motor but slower velocity on the intake side for lower IATs.
It could top 400 rwhp with a proper combo this is 302 sized parts from the 90s. This thing is choked bad on the intake and exhaust side and those heads are 302 heads from the 90s. Put some 205 afrs on that thing and a proper cam with a 5.8 liter edy or holley or trickflow intake and watch that thing make some nice power. Its all in the combo a 5.8 isn't gonna magically make power with parts that choke it down its common sense.
This 351w had a cam that's probably smaller than a e303. And even so, this thing made 333 lb-ft to the rear wheels. The 351w will always be a solid 40 lb-ft of torque ahead of a 302. Why not swap?
@@stevenchavez2003 up to 500hp there is no reason to swap, can make up to 500 w the 5.0 with bolt ons or stroker, if you plan on makn over 500hp then ya swap
Not only is it 30 year old tech its undersized 30 year old tech these are 90s 302 parts. 302 parts make 302 power. The combo has to be done correctly to take advantage of the cubes otherwise they do you no good. All these ppl saying oh my 302 made that no shit you probably were running similar parts on your 302 lol. To see benefits of the extra cubes you gotta have a heads cam intake package to maximize the setup. This engine is capable of over 400 rwhp with the right parts that let it shine and don't choke it down.
What v6 cars you talking about? If talking about the 3.7 mustangs they don't dyno this high when stock and they sure as hell don't come close to that torque number. The thing is choked off it isn't flowing up top the numbers reflect that. The v6 cars you speak of have vct, more rpm and alot of other tech like dohc. Their heads flow significantly better than the heads on this 5.8. Its got old school 302 parts on a 351. 302 parts will make 302 power. The extra displacement don't help at all unless you have the setup to take advantage of it....heads cam intake and supporting mods. A better set of heads cam intake and longtubes could add over 100 rwhp easily on the same bottom end. This thing isn't even close to what its capable of. Thats prob just over 300 horse at the flywheel and close to 400 torque.
Yea so do the parts the thing has on it. It won't make power without the right parts it isn't rocket science. Being 5.8 liter isn't gonna help without the parts to take advantage of it.
That little 65 mm throttle body on a 5.8 is choking it out
Them TB are actually pretty good its been known to upgrade to a bigger TB and you get less power on a 5.8
@@macnation300 I call shennanigans.
Too big of a TB has been proven to cost a few ft lbs of torque below 4k rpm, but approaching redline the engine will always eek out a few more ft lbs given fewer intake restrictions.
That dyno chart clearly showed the engine was losing torque in the upper rpms.
There is absolutely no way that a bigger TB will cost ft lbs in the upper rpms.
@@331SVTCobra read forms on it they say the same thing
@@macnation300 This was a hot topic twenty years ago, and back then 5.0 Magazine did several dyno tests over several months and they all came back to the same thing: "too large" of a throttle body will cost a handful of footpounds down low, and by 4000 rpm you start to gain a few. But if you're driving fast you're keeping the revs above 4k, so go big, right?
@@331SVTCobra I think the idea behind it is a slower airflow velocity through the intake. So the more stagnant air has less cylinder fill. The same manner scavenging for exhaust works, a properly sized throttle body for the airflow the engine combination requires, will work best. There are engine math formulas will provide a number of CFM the engine needs to reach peak hp. It can then be converted to the throttle body CFM capability. I like street manners so a properly sized engine combination is desirable to me for best throttle response, torque, and power in the mid range. This is what makes the fastest * street car
Love the SN-95 content. More of these I’m seeing getting modded and restored back.
Man you can can really hear the difference on the second pull. How the timing was off from the first. it sounded like an old pickup truck motor that had 200,000 milies on it
Come on! Toss on some AFR’s, or a Trick Flow top end!! 1.6 ratio rollers, let that baby breathe!! Mid to late 90’s has these parts for the small block Fords. Don’t restrict this beauty! The top end of those curves would open up and climb nicely.
🇺🇸👍💪🦅
Those trick flow heads will really wake up the bottom end !!
It already had 1.7 roller rockers
I miss my 66 mustang with a 351w stroked to 408. Man that thing could pull
That is AWESOME. I would LOVE to do a 5.8 swap just like that. Maybe with a better cam. The stock intake and everything just makes it. It looks like it belongs. I love that.
Go for a coyote swap instead.
Pretty cool! Some more content of this car would be awesome
I like the retro power idea. I also get the “R” type vibe. What about a do over with just a CAI? And just for fun bolt on the HIGH RAM.
Even with vintage mods, that's low. I'd expect over 300RWP. Did you guys compression test? Check spring pressures?
It's that gt40 junk.. Ford had their head too far up their own butt to know how to make a good cylinder head.
@@superkillr That's almost what a stock one puts out (260/320). There's still something wrong. I built a 1988 Mercury Cougar 20 years ago and used a Gen 1 Lightning 5.8 shortblock (stock), a mild Lunati Cam (almost exactly the same spec as the old E-303) some old but heavily worked TFS aluminum canted valve heads (275CFM intake/235 CFM exhaust) and a stock lightning (GT40) intake. Tranny was a (new) Tremec 3550 (the original Cobra R tranny), stock driveshaft, stock 3.08 rear stock 15" turbine wheels BBK longtubes, 2.5 flowmaster 50 series cat back (no cats). All controlled by a 1993 Mustang GT Auto EEC with a Gen II lightning MAF custom tuned to it with 30lb injectors. I had almost exactly the same thing happen. 1st pull made 245rwhp and 305 ft/lbs. Turns out the one of the meter wires wasn't contacting properly. After a quick re-do of my MAF harness, 275 rwhp/ 312 ft lbs. Turns out it was running way over rich (the meter problem was causing it to run lean and I had turned up the FP to compensate). After turning the FP down, 301 rwhp/ 362 ft/lbs. Mind you also that it was indoors and 100 degrees and 95 percent humidity (I drove down to Atlanta in mid summer to get it tuned, I live in NJ). After getting it back home in some nice 50 degree air, 320 rwhp/379 ft/lbs. When I built the car I had set a goal of 360ish at the crank. Think I almost perfectly met it. The tuner who is actually the original founder of SCT and former FoMoCo Engineer Jerry W told me that I could have gotten more out of it even with the small cam if I had "good" heads. LOL.
@@BoardwalkBullies That sounds like it would’ve been a fun car too. I love all the details in a story with a resolute ending. I think we realize this dyno run was a verification of the swap. And the dyno did it’s job. It let these folks know there’s a lot of power being left somewhere. Without a lot to go from the clip I wonder if they see a need to be connected to a computer or something to watch and or log the AFRs, timing, compensated mass and so forth. It’s still great content car and a hot looking SN95, I’d watch more.
@@DoesItTho I wanted a monte carlo SS but I hated Chevy build quality. My parents were GM until my mother had to buy a 1985 cougar with the 5.0 out of necessity. I was instantly converted to Ford. They just got better from there until they cancelled the fox chassis cougar after 1988. It was the dream car I never knew I wanted. 😂
That’s a 12 sec car with 330 ft-lbs at the tire in a fox-4 chassis as is. Extruded honing the upper and lower with a set of longtubes would make that top end sing. So much meat left on the bone in that 9.5 deck.
No doubt, Windsor motors produce torque! Add a good set of aluminum heads, & cam... be a very fun street car! always had a place in my heart for the sn95 my first stang was a 95 GT. Went 13.67 @ 101, which was quick for the time I owned it 97-03
Like it? Man we love it !! Keep it coming :)
Too bad there's not a "LOVE" button.
Man wish I would've kept my '95 Crystal White Cobra with the Black leather interior...I had that car trapping 118-120mph in the 1/4 mile back in '95-'96...mods were Edelbrock everything..heads, upper and lower intake, x cam, 1 3/4 Full length headers and the best secret weapon 9lbs Powerdyne supercharger it made no noise so nobody on the street never knew what hit them
I’m sure you were trapping low 12’s on street tires, and if you were on a full slick you’d be around low mid 11’s
Check out my brothers 95 gt on my channel, it has a similar set up like the one you have except his is all trick flow stuff with a vortech blower
This is basically the same engine build that I have in my Daddywagon so it was good info for sure. I would like you to put the Boss 427W short block in there without changing anything else because that's my next move! Haha!
Love it and that 5.8 sounds killer!
So essentially a gt40 top end 302 will make similar hp to a 351w with the same gt40 combo. Only difference being that extra 40ish lb-ft of torque.
Yeah, that's actually pretty standard. Using the same top-end components and cam, the 351 usually won't make much more hp than the 302, but you will get that extra torque. I usually don't put much stick in cold-air intakes, but I think the stock airbox and 65mm TB is really choking off this engine. They mentioned 24lb injectors but didn't say anything about the MAF, so if it's a stock MAF then that's hurting it too.
My buddy had a 95gt back in the day, and put down a little over 300rwhp with the stock 302 block. Edelbrock performer heads with a basic Motorsport E cam and an untouched Cobra intake, 30lb injectors, 65mm TB, 75mm MAF. Your run of the mill heads/cam/intake 5.0 from back then.
Both my 93 and 94 Cobras (with same engine that was stock) made almost exactly the same power as this dyno run. Ford was definitely low balling their power/torque numbers for that Cobra engine. I sure do miss my Cobras 🐍
There’s no way a 94 cobra made this power (stock or with minor bolt on’s), they were dogs, they would dyno low 200’s
@@CPAJayhawkexactly! And a stock 93 or 94 cobra will never make 330 lb-ft of torque to the rear wheels.
LOVE IT!!! Cobra R replica vibe going on!!
Nice mustang! This was awesome!
268 hp... now awesome. (in 1982 maybe)
Did the engine come out of a 93-95 lightning or a crashed 95 cobra R?
It looks like a truck motor with aluminum GT-40 heads and a cam.
Very nice. You had to blow it up and race it back in the day to know how it would compete. Now you can just google your combo you want and know what its gonna make. That car would be "in the mix" back in the day. Remember, HP aluminum heads were still in there infancy. Ford had that head and World Sr's. SBC's had World Product iron heads, vortecs, Early Eddy's. If you had a ford back then you had to be "on the gun" or a blower to hang. We'd split 302 rollers in half with 300HP. Putting 2000 worth of 347 in a glass 302 block didnt make sense. Thats why the 351 swap was the way to go.
Man! I had (my dad still owns it),’89 LX back in the day with a Ford Racing 302 short block, and GT-40P heads that made 265 hp/365 ft/lbs at JBA here in San Diego. To have a 5.8l engine with aluminum GT-40X heads make similar power is disappointing. I blame the computer in those cars.
Yeah it's sucking through straws. Typical Ford Motorsport thinking in the 90's.
Nah I blame the cylinder heads. More cubic inches requires more airflow to fill the cylinders. Even a great set of 302 heads on a 351 means it will run out of CFMs in the higher RPMs. And since HP= Torque X RPM divided by 5252, unless your spinning the engine as high in the RPMs ( and feeding the air required to make more power at those RPMs), you will only see more low end torque. Not any horsepower advantage
It doesn’t have those heads
@@benjaminwatson7868 I understand. But the gt-40 and the Gt-40p are similar (other than spark plug angle, combustion chamber CC, and the P head actually has smaller exhaust valves), a 351 with gt-40 heads in any form should make more power than that.
Get that beast to breathe more and give it another go round.
My California legal 95 Cobra with a 331 made 315 rwhp and 370 rwtq. 76 mm C&L maf and 70mm BBK TB kept that thing pulling strong to readline.
The OHV is yesterday's news. Shoulda put a coyote between those fenders.
My favorite day too. Dyno day!
My 95 with a 393 would run circles around that. Beautiful car though!
Time for some boost!
An rpm intake, good set of long tubes, 750 double pumper would be a game changer, but you couldn't drive it on the street in yuppie states!! I'll let you know. Gonna build a 95 roller 351, thinkin bout a f cam, TCI c4, 4:10 gears. Put it in the 94 f150 flairside my dad left me. Got little better heads, but it's a tank!! It's mine, I can be as stupid as I wanna be with it!! Maybe a single turbo setup later!???
So cool. LOVE THE DYNO VIDS!
Slap some trick flow heads and a cam I'm sure it would breathe alot better and make some good power
That red guy sounds like every nascar driver ever
The motor that Ford should have put in the mustangs. The 5.8 not the waste of time 302
That's disappointing for a 351w I have the same car im gearing up to put a 351 in it all most got the motor done mine is going to be a 427 aiming for nothing less that 700hp
Not really it has gt 40 heads, And lower intake. It needs to breath more. I'm sure pistons are stock truck pistons too. Probably needs some other pistons, and A bigger throttle body, air intake, Lower and upper Intake and It should make a whole bunch more
@@DominatorGarage Richard Holdner (check out his channel) has done a bunch of dyno tests, and just adding HCI on a bone stock junk yard 351W will surprise the crap outta you. This engine, as they set it up for period correct thinking, is HORRIBLE.
Period correct is some ported AFR 165cc with a comp xe274 wild child cam 💪🏻👊🏻🤙🏻 or for a stroker/5.8 AFR 185cc ported with comp xe276 black Betty cam 💪🏻👊🏻🤙🏻 or fk it and go 347 scat stroker kit with Vic Jr heads , lunati voodoo with a 100shot. 💪🏻👊🏻🤙🏻
You can play with Fuel Air Ratio to some degree by clocking the MAS at different points. Air flow is not consistent in the cross section the air inlet tube. By moving the MAS around you can find a more favorable result.
Some aftermarket MAF (Mass Air Flow) sensors could be clocked. C&L had an inlet tube that was rumored to perform better in a certain orientation. I never noticed any difference with mine. This car has a stock MAF in the stock airbox... this is fixed and can't be clocked.
Furthermore the stock MAF created turbulence. There was a screen in front of its sampling tube and the design goal was to keep running in spite of a filthy sensor. (The design goal was NOT max hp.) That's how you sell cars, though... every time the car goes to the dealer for an oil change or service the dealer could clean the MAF sensor and the customer would feel like he had a brand new, more powerful car.
Bad ass ride, that Windsor needs more air!
Nice car.
mo powah baby!
Have a friend Don Bowles who swapped a 358 FR9 nascar engine in his cobra
Not bad at all. Totally a old school set up. Love how people think it will make 2000hp or something
Good vid my guy
Those are 2.3 liter EcoBoost numbers, lol
I bet the ecoboost's curve is better. Pure speculation.
I got a 98 and thinking about swapping this engine in it .
? Old school-mod. 351w set up? Was thinking of one build new gen 5.8 from 2013/14 GT500 in a 99-04 new edge chassis.
Beautiful car, but wow, what a let down.
That's an NA motor right?? Can run single plug OHV 4 plus inch bore SBF at 33-36 degrees on 93 octane. It's no different than an LS or SBC. Optimum there is usually around 36 degrees on pump gas. 14 degrees is small bore hot spark land. Newer tiny chambers are more efficient. The new OE rule for emissions compliance and efficiency is to stay under 94mm bore. Between that and the plug in the center of the chamber, flame front propagates 10 plus degrees quicker. Ole
I don’t know much about these engines but 14 degrees is plenty ?
T5 transmission? This was made 2 years ago? RIP little T5.
It's still holding up! -Landan
My daughter: does he sing Texas music? 😂
Is that an early flat tappet 351W or a later roller engine?
65MM TB is too small for a 5.8 - 70 is usually minimum.
That is a flat tappet cam. I remember running them back in the day. Actually I just put one in a GT40 headed 351 build this past week. Same as a lunatic bate bones or the elgin 960p. Like a 224/224 at .50 112 and a 47x 49x ish lift if I remember right.
@@dgambrel9241 Thanks. I should have thought of that: The "letter cams" are the only small block roller cams Ford Racing ever made.
Isn't there supposed to be a 5.8l intake manifold instead of 5.0l manifold? Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the 5.8 has kinda like oval ports, and the 5.0 more like squared???
Julio - The 93-95 Lightning upper/lower intakes had round ports. The 94-95 5.0L Cobra intakes also had round ports. -Landan
@@latemodelrestoration got it thanks for the info. I really don't know much about these engines since I've only owned a 2v but I'm looking to get my hands on a 95 Cobra R which I know it comes w/5.8L so I'll be doing some homework
Need aluminum heads cam and intake next.
Gt40x is aluminum
I had a 359W (.060 over) with KB 10.2:1 pistons, hand-ported 351W 4bbl heads with 1.84/1.60 valves, stock 5.0L HO roller cam retarded 4°, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake and 800 CFM carb along with swap headers and 2.5" exhaust. Made 297 whp SAE peaking at 5,600 rpm and it hung on until 6,000. 330 wtq. It was in a 1982 Mustang GT with T5 and 3.55 gears. Went 109 mph in the 1/4 in AZ with full interior, full weight with AC.
No such thing as "351W 4bbl heads." 2V & 4V all used the same heads.
interested in what radiator is being used since it has a 96-04 coolant tank
Needs more fuel & long tubes
I didn't know that upper would work with lightning lower
The GT40 (used on the Lightning), Cobra & '96-'01 Explorer/Mountaineer (upper is basically a cast aluminum version of the GT40) intakes are all interchangeable.
I love it
Would be nice to see a run without the stock airbox or lid removed for curiosity sakes. I mean I know you could put the lightning massair meter and cone filter, wouldn't that still be considered stock 😉😉 if you left the airbox on cause of epa
Those stock air boxes are actually better than a metal cold air intake up to around 300wheel. The metal ones don’t do anything except heat soak the engine
@@evanhajder putting a cold air intake in your fender well soaks up cooler air with less restriction and better airflow, have dynoed tons with good results.
It also doesn't have to be metal, but also having a larger tube cools the air temps down as well.
@@JR-Rollin dynoing the car with the hood open will always show better results with a cold air, as soon as you close the hood and push the car hard, the metal definitely heats the air a lot more. I’ve seen a difference of 40-50 degrees IAT on track between plastic and metal. Although a plastic cold air with a fender filter would probably be the way to go
@@evanhajder that's why I posted my original post...would love to see difference with a kn, or open lid, etc. I know they make a difference and also it doesn't have to be metal, but the heat soak/dwell of aluminum isn't that bad compared to those heavy chrome plated ones, etc. Also increasing tube diameter also lowers IATs. One trick we used to do is a 4" tube to either a race throttlebody with larger mouth and smaller diameter intake side to increase velocity to motor but slower velocity on the intake side for lower IATs.
Man that's low numbers. My T56 1996 Z28 SS stock made 281rwhp and with a Kooks long tubes, tb air foil, egr deleted and untuned made 292rwhp.
Ha
that 5.8 should be above 300+ hp I make 260 hp with my original cobra 5.0
nice! 💪 does LMR make those curved deflectors that are under the front bumper?
Unfortunately, we do not offer the deflectors. It was included on the car when we purchased it.
@@latemodelrestoration ok, cause those plastic pieces are usually missing on the stock bumpers
I'm buying another 01-04 just to do this
Send it!
What did the 5.8 come out of?
Good video but, if you put a coyote engine in it your 5.8 would be eating dust!
Throw some boost on it, and see the results..
With these numbers you might as well just swap a 32 valve
What is the stock 94-95 302 numbers?
At the wheels? Probably something like 185-190 rwhp. I believe they were rated at 215hp/285ft-lbs stock.
@@branchtana315 you are correct!
What hood is that? HO Fibretrends 2.5 inch?
This is the correct OEM HO Fibertrends 1.5" hood- Jay
lmr.com/item/M16612R58/1995-Ford-Mustang-Cobra-R-Hood
Needs a 2.3 eco boost swap
I'm gonna say 340hp 365tq
Didn’t even break 300whp… smh
It could top 400 rwhp with a proper combo this is 302 sized parts from the 90s. This thing is choked bad on the intake and exhaust side and those heads are 302 heads from the 90s. Put some 205 afrs on that thing and a proper cam with a 5.8 liter edy or holley or trickflow intake and watch that thing make some nice power. Its all in the combo a 5.8 isn't gonna magically make power with parts that choke it down its common sense.
blew my mind, i was like damn even with more cubes the things still at 302 numbers. bad combo sounds on the money.
There is no excuse to build something like this in 2021. Maybe this video was made years ago, I don't know.
Makes no sense to me to 351 swap these cars and not do a stroker build.
Man, that makes the 351w look bad. Please don’t show anymore videos like this.There are already enough morons wanting to swap a LS.
Cam it and get 500hp with right upgrades
Has cams dummy
What year 351 is this
It's out of a 93-95 Lightning. -Landan
5.0 w gt40 heads, gt40 intake, any alphabet cam makes more than that, why swap?
This 351w had a cam that's probably smaller than a e303. And even so, this thing made 333 lb-ft to the rear wheels. The 351w will always be a solid 40 lb-ft of torque ahead of a 302. Why not swap?
@@stevenchavez2003 up to 500hp there is no reason to swap, can make up to 500 w the 5.0 with bolt ons or stroker, if you plan on makn over 500hp then ya swap
When did Ford offer a 5.8?
Oh 5.8 is 351 Cleveland or Windsor I guess . My bad
95 Cobra R
@@foxxrider250r Windsor, Cleveland 1971-73
Think the last time was 71 boss 351, then it showed up in the sn95 for the 95 cobra r only 300 were made. 300 hp 365 lft
@@josephf593 no, you’re confusing the engines
Quite disappointing, less then 300rwhp. Even 5.0L HCI can match or exceed this.
Put a LS in it if you want to make real power!!
Do something that hasn't been done a million times over. Godzilla swap that
Why even bother with this swap? Ford engines are trash and nothing more.
This is 30 year old tech. You are not going to get modern Coyote numbers. I still wouldn't drive a Camaro over this, eww!
Not only is it 30 year old tech its undersized 30 year old tech these are 90s 302 parts. 302 parts make 302 power. The combo has to be done correctly to take advantage of the cubes otherwise they do you no good. All these ppl saying oh my 302 made that no shit you probably were running similar parts on your 302 lol. To see benefits of the extra cubes you gotta have a heads cam intake package to maximize the setup. This engine is capable of over 400 rwhp with the right parts that let it shine and don't choke it down.
That’s laughable.
6 cylinder cars today make more power than that
What v6 cars you talking about? If talking about the 3.7 mustangs they don't dyno this high when stock and they sure as hell don't come close to that torque number. The thing is choked off it isn't flowing up top the numbers reflect that. The v6 cars you speak of have vct, more rpm and alot of other tech like dohc. Their heads flow significantly better than the heads on this 5.8. Its got old school 302 parts on a 351. 302 parts will make 302 power. The extra displacement don't help at all unless you have the setup to take advantage of it....heads cam intake and supporting mods. A better set of heads cam intake and longtubes could add over 100 rwhp easily on the same bottom end. This thing isn't even close to what its capable of. Thats prob just over 300 horse at the flywheel and close to 400 torque.
Weak
Those numbers suck
Yea so do the parts the thing has on it. It won't make power without the right parts it isn't rocket science. Being 5.8 liter isn't gonna help without the parts to take advantage of it.
Junk
Don’t understand your language but ok
What a waste I’ll just get me a hellcat
So 40 more hp than a stock 302? Seems like a lot of money for very little gain.