I do the same, I drive in D and ev to accelerate, then switch to HV and maintain the speed. When I am below 70Km/h, I change into EV and S4 and maintain the speed. When approaching a red light, I switch to D mode coasting to full stop. Breaking gently is better than engine break in my opinion, the coasting distance is longer and one can decide how much to break. Crisping the toes leads to more breaking... a secret I learned from Inlineskating. cheers.
Good info - I’ve done this in my XSE since day 1 with the paddles. During the summer I frequently get 3.3 to 3.8 miles/kWh. One thing I would point out is in order to get max possible regen, put it in Sport mode. Also, if you have good control of the accelerator pedal, you can make the car truly coast when desired by slightly pushing on the pedal. The amount you have to push depends on which S “gear” you are in at the time. I am a little concerned that brake lights don’t come on when not pushing the brake pedal, but it’s really no different than downshifting (engine braking) in a vehicle with a manual transmission (brake lights don’t come in in that scenario either). Love my RAV4 Prime!
3.8 O_O dang man that's crazy!! No way I could ever touch that. Now that it's winter we've dipped down to 3.1 If I'm driving uphill on the freeway with the heater on, it's game over. LOL
Thank you - this was really enjoyable to watch. I assume that if you really like S-mode and use it often you can probably upgrade the steering wheel to include shifter paddles. I bet it is quite a simple upgrade for a good dealership. I don't get to test S-mode extensively as I live in a small village close to a motorway. So it's either 30mph for a few minutes or 70mph.
I drive 90% of the time in S mode. Shifting accordingly instead of using the brakes. (Single pedal driving basically. Something I have been doing for almost 17 years on my old 2005 Ford Escape Hybrid). Great for driving in the City. Have gotten as high as 50+ miles on a charge. Love to see all those "E"s popping up on the mileage graph.
@@junbox618 It's funny. Even in Eco mode and keeping the power meter in the highend of the eco range during acceleration, the Prime still has way more pickup in EV mode than my old Ford Escape Hybrid.
Great video, as I use S Mode all the time. So many comments but I'm still confused on one point - correlation between charging the battery rather than discussing just fuel efficiency which are all related. You do mention it around 7:40min in but not in detail. Obviously more battery charge = more fuel efficiency = more range . Just debating with a mate who just got his RAV4 Edge Hybrid (top of the range Hybrid in Australia) and I drive a Hybrid Cruiser (Same as an XSE). He is adamant that using the brakes generates more charge back to the High voltage EV Batteries than using S Mode? I disagree in that putting your foot on the brake will just have a similar effect as in telling the MG1 motor to go into regen mode. Not much is mentioned here about the charge rates in comparing D mode with braking vs S mode with it deacceleration capabilities? In simple terms, scenario.. So I'm doing 35mph (~60km) in D Mode and I apply the brakes gently down to say 20mph on a level road. If I do the same, but using S Mode switching from D to S4 and then S3 until I reach 20mph, which method charged the batteries more? (Based on the battery strange was ready to take 100% regeneration charge). Same thing going down a hill, my mate says applying the brakes down a hill generates more charge than S mode in S4 or S3 etc. Who is right?
Hey you upgraded your door handles to XSE handles too! Nice. I have to play around with the manual shifting more. last time I did I forgot to upshift & left it an S1 and the motor turned on so I haven’t played with it since. It looks like your technique pays off though b/c I get 2.7 miles/kwh
If you only gently press the brake, the mechanical brakes do not touch the discs. The car smoothly recovers up to the maximum level the battery can take. In the background, it goes from S(D) 6 to 1. This depends on how much you press the brake, the temperature of the battery and its level of charge. Only when the pointer reaches the minimum on the CHG field do the mechanical brakes start working. Therefore, I don't see the point of making a simple thing so complicated. It is enough to watch the CHG field. And if someone wants to see more precisely, he can install the Hybrid Assistant app on his phone. The principle is simple, you have to watch the road, if you brake, you lose.
I should get my XSE Prime in 4-6 weeks and I'm so excited! Great video, but one question. If the charge meter gets pegged to the side, doesn't that mean you're recovering more energy by using the breaks instead of just engine breaking? Or does the efficiency come from being able to maintain your speed?
Loving it. Driving it a lot and the only complains are the slow hatch and the Android auto doesn't like to connect via bluetooth about 30% of the time. LoL@@verynick
Just picked up mine 2 days ago as well and I love it. Although I leased mine to take advantage of the rebate but I will be keeping it as long as I can. Might as a sub later
I am quite surprised that you get 10-15% over careful D-mode driving. Does this mean that in D-mode RAV4 engages mechanical brakes earlier on in the braking process? It must be so, because where would the kinetic energy go otherwise? It's either heating up the brakes, charging the battery or heating some part of EV system (perhaps electric motors themselves)? I'd like to know more about this but there is no detailed description anywhere - just experiments and theories. I would have assumed that for safety and redundancy mechanical brakes activate outside of the EV control loop, but then the car does brake itself when it needs to when using Safety Sense braking. There must some movement in the position of crossover point for two types of braking between S and D modes.
Yea. When you start pressing the brake pedal, it definitely boosts regen braking, but the mechanical brakes do a lot of work too. Dropping it down to S2 or S1 is a good amount of engine brake. I've noticed getting off the freeway, slowing down in S6-5-4-3-2-1 will net me about 1.5 Es more than just stopping in D.
I think you can accomplish the same thing by switching back and forth from economy, normal and sport mode. Sport mode is probably closer to S2, normal is S4 and Economy like S6.
If you just gently press the brake pedal, i think it only uses regen so long as the charge meter is not pegged to the line. If this is true, is it really the same as downshifting? I suspect it may be. Thoughts?
Mechanical brake kicks in even without charge pegged. You are wrong. I've compared both methods on same stretch of road decelerating from same speed to same distance.
That's cool. But you're right.. hard to know if it's worth the effort. Still fun to get extra range though, especially someone like you who grew up with a manual.
@@holmesjustholmes9412 I used to daily drive a 1st gen Miata with a light flywheel so this a lot less work. Still, kinda breaks up the serene driving experience of the Rav4 Prime
I haven't started getting scientific with it, but I only just realized that I can completely kill the brake regen by throwing it in neutral. Have you played around with using neutral to freely coast when it feels you can get the best mileage from that? Interested how it would compare to the S6 method.
OOoo nice idea man. I'm not sure if the CVT is OK with taking load off into N then popping it back in D at speed. Not sure how the transmission will react to it. I think I'll let someone else try it. Back in the day I tried it in traditional auto tranny on the freeway and didn't have issues.
But if I want "one pedal driving" in the Rav4 Prime, can I drive in any of those gears in EV mode all the time? I'm always concerned about if something can get damaged...
I have just recently driven 3000 km across Europe in RAV4 PHEV (what is called RAV4 PRIME in the US). Very nice car. One thing I have to say about S mode is - don't use it in HV mode. It actually revs up the engine in lower S gears - like a good old mechanical gearbox. I have put the car into HV mode and could not understand what's all the racket about until I have noticed I left it in S3 gear.
Yup! I mentioned that in the video! Once you get down to about 1mile EV range remaining, if you drop it in S mode it'll kick on the gas engine and you'll hear that nasty CVT rev up LOL
@@junbox618 You gotta do it yourself to remember it lol. I have put RAV4 into HV mode myself while battery was full since I was driving down the motorway and wanted to preserve EV range for slow/stationary traffic and fooling around at Eurotunnel shuttle crossing. I have also taken an airbed with me and slept in the car at service stations (having folded the back seats) for a few hours when I felt a bit tired. Did 1100 miles in just over 24 hours.
Thanks for the video! Just got a Rav4 Prime and interested in boosting EV range. When using S1-S6 in EV mode can you just move them +/- without touching anything (brake or accelerator) as there is no clutch? And any time go between S Modes and normal Drive if HV kicks in? (I.e. Is it idiot proof like the paddle shifters in my previous TSX which would just auto adjust back up to higher gears if you hit the accelerator without shifting up or vice versa shift down breaking/stopping)? Unlike my Acura TSX it sounds like in HV mode it may not automatically adjust but does in EV mode. In EV want to try to do as much one pedal driving on local streets as possible and get the best rangel. I use ECO HV and Adaptive Cruise Control on highways so it is almost one pedal driving unless stopped in traffic.
S1 has the most aggressive regen brake and S6 least (pretty close to D). Yup when I'm getting off the freeway, I don't touch the brake, coast and go into S1 and it'll gently regen brake down to 15mph. After a few times you'll be able to judge at what distance you want to do it. I can usually gain 2.5-3 Es on the regen gauge when I get off the freeway. This only works when in EV mode. On Hybrid mode the cvt will just rev the engine and you won't gain any regen
I really do like driving by downshifting in sport mode but I just have a concern about the driver behind me since the brake light doesn't come on when you're regen braking.
Pads are pretty cheap and will last a long time on this vehicle. I'd rather not introduce engine/transmission wear by downshifting all the time. The one caveat to this is if I'm on a long downhill incline I put the vehicle in sport mode. Again brakes are very cheap in relation to transmission and engine if you aren't in pure ev mode.
I use sports mode 100 percent of the time,I find I get better ev range ,usually 55-57 miles .I average 3.5 mikes/kWh. That’s without using manual mode since sport gives you more aggressive regenerative braking without having to manually shift. I have a 22 Prime Se.
That makes total sense. If you have a light touch on the throttle in S mode then you won't burn off too much battery and you'll get more aggressive regen. Which S do you cruise in? S5 would be a nice compromise, I think.
"Over 130 pounds" is inaccurate. A full tank of gas 14.5gal in a Prime weighs under 90lbs. My wife weighs 100lbs. I weigh 180lbs, so our weight difference is basically a full tank of gas in a Prime. I still get at 10-15% more EV range than her driving it on the same loops driving in S mode versus her driving in D mode.
@@junbox618 Ok bro whatever floats your boat. For me it doesn't make sense do carry dead weight especially if your driving mostly on EV mode. I would think that is common sense. Car manufacturers try there best to reduce weight in every new model to get better mpg. But I guess you must know more then the engineers.
You drive it on E, that is a 60lb weight savings (you're down 10 gallons at E). On a car with a curb weight of 4300+ lbs, with a ton of EV torque, does 60lb equate to longer range? If so, how much? My 80lb weight difference with my wife has zero measurable range difference. I get what you're saying about common sense, but one must verify objectively. If this car weighed 2,000lbs, and you take 60lbs off. Yea. I would expect a measurable difference. This is not that different from having a hypothesis but no test carried out due to "it's true because common sense."
Cool. Thanks for making this video. I never saw a reason for using the s modes until now. Looking forward to trying it out
Have you tried it yet? Takes a bit to get used to, but you'll be stacking Es on that regen display
I do the same, I drive in D and ev to accelerate, then switch to HV and maintain the speed. When I am below 70Km/h, I change into EV and S4 and maintain the speed. When approaching a red light, I switch to D mode coasting to full stop. Breaking gently is better than engine break in my opinion, the coasting distance is longer and one can decide how much to break. Crisping the toes leads to more breaking... a secret I learned from Inlineskating. cheers.
Good info - I’ve done this in my XSE since day 1 with the paddles. During the summer I frequently get 3.3 to 3.8 miles/kWh. One thing I would point out is in order to get max possible regen, put it in Sport mode. Also, if you have good control of the accelerator pedal, you can make the car truly coast when desired by slightly pushing on the pedal. The amount you have to push depends on which S “gear” you are in at the time. I am a little concerned that brake lights don’t come on when not pushing the brake pedal, but it’s really no different than downshifting (engine braking) in a vehicle with a manual transmission (brake lights don’t come in in that scenario either). Love my RAV4 Prime!
3.8 O_O dang man that's crazy!! No way I could ever touch that. Now that it's winter we've dipped down to 3.1
If I'm driving uphill on the freeway with the heater on, it's game over. LOL
This video was a relief. I was worried I was getting bad range with 3.8 to 4.2 m/kwh
Thank you - this was really enjoyable to watch. I assume that if you really like S-mode and use it often you can probably upgrade the steering wheel to include shifter paddles. I bet it is quite a simple upgrade for a good dealership.
I don't get to test S-mode extensively as I live in a small village close to a motorway. So it's either 30mph for a few minutes or 70mph.
Duno if I really "like" it, but it works. Definitely works.
I just purchased my Prime and didn’t know what s mode was used for, great info thx.
I drive 90% of the time in S mode. Shifting accordingly instead of using the brakes. (Single pedal driving basically. Something I have been doing for almost 17 years on my old 2005 Ford Escape Hybrid). Great for driving in the City.
Have gotten as high as 50+ miles on a charge.
Love to see all those "E"s popping up on the mileage graph.
Heck yea man. If you can average 1.5 - 2 Es per minute you know you're really really efficient. LOL
@@junbox618 It's funny. Even in Eco mode and keeping the power meter in the highend of the eco range during acceleration, the Prime still has way more pickup in EV mode than my old Ford Escape Hybrid.
Great video, as I use S Mode all the time. So many comments but I'm still confused on one point - correlation between charging the battery rather than discussing just fuel efficiency which are all related. You do mention it around 7:40min in but not in detail. Obviously more battery charge = more fuel efficiency = more range . Just debating with a mate who just got his RAV4 Edge Hybrid (top of the range Hybrid in Australia) and I drive a Hybrid Cruiser (Same as an XSE). He is adamant that using the brakes generates more charge back to the High voltage EV Batteries than using S Mode? I disagree in that putting your foot on the brake will just have a similar effect as in telling the MG1 motor to go into regen mode. Not much is mentioned here about the charge rates in comparing D mode with braking vs S mode with it deacceleration capabilities?
In simple terms, scenario.. So I'm doing 35mph (~60km) in D Mode and I apply the brakes gently down to say 20mph on a level road. If I do the same, but using S Mode switching from D to S4 and then S3 until I reach 20mph, which method charged the batteries more? (Based on the battery strange was ready to take 100% regeneration charge). Same thing going down a hill, my mate says applying the brakes down a hill generates more charge than S mode in S4 or S3 etc. Who is right?
The added benefit to your method of driving is less wear on brakes or prolonged life of brakes.
interesting way of driving. Will the shifter work on the long run? I don't know it is designed for this many shifts
I'm wondering the same thing LOL. I don't drive the car much, though. My wife just puts it in D and drives.
Hey you upgraded your door handles to XSE handles too! Nice. I have to play around with the manual shifting more. last time I did I forgot to upshift & left it an S1 and the motor turned on so I haven’t played with it since. It looks like your technique pays off though b/c I get 2.7 miles/kwh
I have a 2022 SE no upgrade on the door handles. If I drive like a weenie on city roads I can get 4mi/kWh
If you only gently press the brake, the mechanical brakes do not touch the discs. The car smoothly recovers up to the maximum level the battery can take. In the background, it goes from S(D) 6 to 1. This depends on how much you press the brake, the temperature of the battery and its level of charge. Only when the pointer reaches the minimum on the CHG field do the mechanical brakes start working. Therefore, I don't see the point of making a simple thing so complicated. It is enough to watch the CHG field. And if someone wants to see more precisely, he can install the Hybrid Assistant app on his phone. The principle is simple, you have to watch the road, if you brake, you lose.
I should get my XSE Prime in 4-6 weeks and I'm so excited! Great video, but one question. If the charge meter gets pegged to the side, doesn't that mean you're recovering more energy by using the breaks instead of just engine breaking? Or does the efficiency come from being able to maintain your speed?
How are you liking your Prime?
Loving it. Driving it a lot and the only complains are the slow hatch and the Android auto doesn't like to connect via bluetooth about 30% of the time. LoL@@verynick
Just picked up mine 2 days ago as well and I love it. Although I leased mine to take advantage of the rebate but I will be keeping it as long as I can. Might as a sub later
I am quite surprised that you get 10-15% over careful D-mode driving. Does this mean that in D-mode RAV4 engages mechanical brakes earlier on in the braking process? It must be so, because where would the kinetic energy go otherwise? It's either heating up the brakes, charging the battery or heating some part of EV system (perhaps electric motors themselves)? I'd like to know more about this but there is no detailed description anywhere - just experiments and theories. I would have assumed that for safety and redundancy mechanical brakes activate outside of the EV control loop, but then the car does brake itself when it needs to when using Safety Sense braking. There must some movement in the position of crossover point for two types of braking between S and D modes.
Yea. When you start pressing the brake pedal, it definitely boosts regen braking, but the mechanical brakes do a lot of work too. Dropping it down to S2 or S1 is a good amount of engine brake. I've noticed getting off the freeway, slowing down in S6-5-4-3-2-1 will net me about 1.5 Es more than just stopping in D.
I think you can accomplish the same thing by switching back and forth from economy, normal and sport mode. Sport mode is probably closer to S2, normal is S4 and Economy like S6.
If you just gently press the brake pedal, i think it only uses regen so long as the charge meter is not pegged to the line. If this is true, is it really the same as downshifting? I suspect it may be. Thoughts?
Mechanical brake kicks in even without charge pegged. You are wrong. I've compared both methods on same stretch of road decelerating from same speed to same distance.
@@junbox618 I second that. Even gentle braking does not match what you can do with "S" mode.
That's cool. But you're right.. hard to know if it's worth the effort. Still fun to get extra range though, especially someone like you who grew up with a manual.
Thanks. Ya my wife said not worth the effort. It's more a game, I guess.
I'd hazard a guess that for a well-travelled city route this also helps to break up the boredom :)
@@holmesjustholmes9412 I used to daily drive a 1st gen Miata with a light flywheel so this a lot less work. Still, kinda breaks up the serene driving experience of the Rav4 Prime
I haven't started getting scientific with it, but I only just realized that I can completely kill the brake regen by throwing it in neutral. Have you played around with using neutral to freely coast when it feels you can get the best mileage from that? Interested how it would compare to the S6 method.
OOoo nice idea man. I'm not sure if the CVT is OK with taking load off into N then popping it back in D at speed. Not sure how the transmission will react to it. I think I'll let someone else try it. Back in the day I tried it in traditional auto tranny on the freeway and didn't have issues.
I get 3.4 m/KWh with normal driving in my RAV4 Prime. Using the brakes lightly regenerates charge.
3.4 is awesome. You must live in a nice warm climate and not running too many freeway miles
But if I want "one pedal driving" in the Rav4 Prime, can I drive in any of those gears in EV mode all the time? I'm always concerned about if something can get damaged...
Doesn't really have "gears" it's basically playing around with amount of throttle response and regen brake.
Is your "shifting" in S mode the same as using the paddle shifters on the XSE?
Yup. The SE doesn't have paddles!!
That explains it. I couldn’t figure out why you weren’t using the paddles……….
I have just recently driven 3000 km across Europe in RAV4 PHEV (what is called RAV4 PRIME in the US). Very nice car.
One thing I have to say about S mode is - don't use it in HV mode. It actually revs up the engine in lower S gears - like a good old mechanical gearbox. I have put the car into HV mode and could not understand what's all the racket about until I have noticed I left it in S3 gear.
Yup! I mentioned that in the video! Once you get down to about 1mile EV range remaining, if you drop it in S mode it'll kick on the gas engine and you'll hear that nasty CVT rev up LOL
@@junbox618 You gotta do it yourself to remember it lol. I have put RAV4 into HV mode myself while battery was full since I was driving down the motorway and wanted to preserve EV range for slow/stationary traffic and fooling around at Eurotunnel shuttle crossing.
I have also taken an airbed with me and slept in the car at service stations (having folded the back seats) for a few hours when I felt a bit tired. Did 1100 miles in just over 24 hours.
Thanks for the video! Just got a Rav4 Prime and interested in boosting EV range. When using S1-S6 in EV mode can you just move them +/- without touching anything (brake or accelerator) as there is no clutch? And any time go between S Modes and normal Drive if HV kicks in? (I.e. Is it idiot proof like the paddle shifters in my previous TSX which would just auto adjust back up to higher gears if you hit the accelerator without shifting up or vice versa shift down breaking/stopping)?
Unlike my Acura TSX it sounds like in HV mode it may not automatically adjust but does in EV mode. In EV want to try to do as much one pedal driving on local streets as possible and get the best rangel. I use ECO HV and Adaptive Cruise Control on highways so it is almost one pedal driving unless stopped in traffic.
S1 has the most aggressive regen brake and S6 least (pretty close to D). Yup when I'm getting off the freeway, I don't touch the brake, coast and go into S1 and it'll gently regen brake down to 15mph. After a few times you'll be able to judge at what distance you want to do it. I can usually gain 2.5-3 Es on the regen gauge when I get off the freeway.
This only works when in EV mode. On Hybrid mode the cvt will just rev the engine and you won't gain any regen
I really do like driving by downshifting in sport mode but I just have a concern about the driver behind me since the brake light doesn't come on when you're regen braking.
Yup same here. That's my only concern. It doesn't Regen brake hard but it's enough where someone not paying attention could rear end you
Pads are pretty cheap and will last a long time on this vehicle. I'd rather not introduce engine/transmission wear by downshifting all the time. The one caveat to this is if I'm on a long downhill incline I put the vehicle in sport mode. Again brakes are very cheap in relation to transmission and engine if you aren't in pure ev mode.
I use sports mode 100 percent of the time,I find I get better ev range ,usually 55-57 miles .I average 3.5 mikes/kWh. That’s without using manual mode since sport gives you more aggressive regenerative braking without having to manually shift. I have a 22 Prime Se.
That makes total sense. If you have a light touch on the throttle in S mode then you won't burn off too much battery and you'll get more aggressive regen. Which S do you cruise in? S5 would be a nice compromise, I think.
Thanks buddy
I feel like all that shifting is detrimental to the transmission life... idk
If I wanted to constantly shift I would have bought a stick shift mustang!!!
Not having a full tank will help you with range aslo, doesn't make sense to carry over 130 pounds of dead weight.
"Over 130 pounds" is inaccurate. A full tank of gas 14.5gal in a Prime weighs under 90lbs.
My wife weighs 100lbs. I weigh 180lbs, so our weight difference is basically a full tank of gas in a Prime. I still get at 10-15% more EV range than her driving it on the same loops driving in S mode versus her driving in D mode.
@@junbox618 Ok bro whatever floats your boat. For me it doesn't make sense do carry dead weight especially if your driving mostly on EV mode. I would think that is common sense. Car manufacturers try there best to reduce weight in every new model to get better mpg. But I guess you must know more then the engineers.
You drive it on E, that is a 60lb weight savings (you're down 10 gallons at E). On a car with a curb weight of 4300+ lbs, with a ton of EV torque, does 60lb equate to longer range? If so, how much? My 80lb weight difference with my wife has zero measurable range difference. I get what you're saying about common sense, but one must verify objectively.
If this car weighed 2,000lbs, and you take 60lbs off. Yea. I would expect a measurable difference.
This is not that different from having a hypothesis but no test carried out due to "it's true because common sense."