Ray, Ez, and Mark you guys seem so close. You make me smile and sometimes just laugh out loud. God Bless you all as you continue to share the gospel with lost souls, Your programs are a blessing to me and I learn a lot. I will also continue to pray for you.
Heb 1:5 For to which of the angels did God ever say, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father"? Also, God never said of any angel, "I will be his Father, and he will be my Son." Job 4:18 He puts no trust even in His servants; And against His angels He charges error. How can an imperfect, created being offer a perfect sacrifice for atonement? And how can Jesus claim to be "I AM" and the "Alpha and Omega", titles which only God can claim, unless He is divine and perfect like God?
A JW Elder even shocked me last night when he said Isaiah 9:6 also applies to Angel Michael as he is the Everlasting Father. I was shocked beyond words.
1 John 5:7 as it read in the king James Version is omitted in most other modern English bible because scholars know that verse about 3 witness bearers in heaven namely the Father, the word and the Holy Ghost or spirit was not found in earlier Greek texts manuscripts of the bible...so bible scholars suspect it was a forgery since it was an latter addition during the 16th century. Its a spurious verse thats why its omitted in many other bible translations except the KJV or New King James version.
Jude 1:9 *Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”*
Compare that with Zechariah 3:2 then tell me what you think about Jude 1:9. Study the scriptures a little closer, and let the Bible be its own interpreter. In Daniel 12:1 Michael is called the Great prince. No angel can be called Great prince. Read Revelations 12:7 it says Michael and his angels, as if Michael owns and is in charge of them. There is only one deity, that owns angels, and that's Jesus. So if Michael owns angels, and so does Jesus, then they have to be, one in the same.
@@liquidswords9388 You have answered correctly. Indeed the Lord speaks of Himself in third person - this is the doctrine of the trinity at work. (Like Isaiah 48:16 etc). You make a valid point there. One should not assume the person speaking is NOT the Lord JUST because he quotes the Lord in 3rd person - point well made. However....Whilst it does bring into question Jude, it still does not make michael the Lord. You simply cannot overlook Hebrews ch1. It is the reason for the book - to state Jesus is the Lord and not a creation, nor an angel, nor a mere man, nor a prophet. He is the Son of God - God Almighty. As for head of the angels - so what? Joab was the head of the Israeli army, having many men under his command. Yet that did not make him king. Michael is head of the angels, that does not make him Lord and King either. Even in our government, we have several heads of state in different departments. We understand law and order. As for the voice of the archangel.. 1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: Consider this: If Jesus is an archangel because He is WITH the voice of the archangel, he also is a trumpet as He is WITH a trumpet too. Therefore Jesus... is an archangel AND a trumpet. LOL - really funny YES - there is a better explanation. Would it rather NOT be Jesus, WITH an archangel, WITH a trumpet, WITH all His saints? Which is, of course, what is written. This is confirmed here in Christs second coming in revelations: Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. Rev 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, This is a fulfilment of 1 thess 4:16. Jesus is on a white horse, the angel is standing in the sun. The angel is shouting with a loud cry whilst Lord Jesus leads the return. There are NOT one and the same. Please think again my friend. (i) Clearly, Jesus was NOT an angel at any time before. Heb 1:13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool? (ii) Jesus did NOT become an angel either. Heb 1:4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they. So this is wrong teaching
@@johnc4624 Also compare 1st Thessalonians 4:16 with John 5:25 Verily, Verily I say unto you, The hour is coming and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. And verse 28 says Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,. Now, it clearly states that Jesus is going to use his voice to raise the dead. And if he is using the voice of the Archangel, what does that tell you. He is not gonna use 2 voices. And an Archangel, is not an Angel but leader of the Angels. The Archangel is Commander and chief of the Angels.
@@liquidswords9388 Nothing. 1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: There are two ways of interpreting anything : the right way, the wrong way. At this point we both agree. When it says that Jesus shall shout with the voice of the archangel... it also says WITH the trumpet of God. SO.. if Jesus shouting WITH the voice of the archangel means Jesus's voice IS the archangel, then Jesus voice is also a trumpet. Now, Jesus is not a trumpet, therefore He is not an archangel either. So that is the wrong interpretation. Another interpretation is that they ALL shout at the same time. Can they ? Yes they can and they will. Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS. Rev 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God; I have already said this... but Jesus is on a horse, the angel shouting is not. They are not the same. BUT on the shouting all together, there is more. When Joshua and his army entered Jericho, they came with a shout and a trumpet blast. Sound similar? Should do, this is how Jesus (same name as Josh) will enter the world. Jos 6:16 And it came to pass at the seventh time, when the priests blew with the trumpets, Joshua said unto the people, Shout; for the LORD hath given you the city. So they all shouted. So what if the Lord is shouting, the archangel is also shouting...all the angels are shouting too. So what? The bible mentions the head angel, as he is the leader of the angels. Much like Trump may visit a country with his secretary of state. Trump still is the boss. Jesus still is Lord. Michael knows that. Shame you don't. :-)
Jesus was indeed the begotten Son of God As a unique being according to Hebrews 1,2....different than angels of whom are many. Micheal was one of these angels.
Peace brother, the mystery is not to see the mistake that many do say that, Jesus is an angel, because it seems that Micheal was call Lord from the lips of Daniel. But the mysteries to see Michael not like the other created angels. Because the Bible does mention that God created the angels. But the Bible does not say the Michael was created. Seek and investigate this mystery. Keep in mind that this knowledge was revealed to us but not before the appointed time. 1 Corinthians 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. Have fun searching the Bible every day!
@ Art Figueroa, Angel means messenger. The SDA believes that Michael is Jesus, but unlike the JWs, Adventists believe that Jesus is the Creator and He created all the angels.and everything. Jesus is the Son of God, He is God. I don't know but there are scriptures, that sure like it's possible. Praise the Lord
@@moisesbeyond Jesus is the Son of God, that doesn't make Him the Father. There are three manifestations in the one Godhead. There's only One God, and in that Godhead is The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit, which is God.
Oh Ray, that bit in John where Jesus said "Before Abraham was, I am." - I don't know if you've ever seen the movie "Gospel of John" but I have to say that the guy who played the part of Jesus was absolutely fantastic when he quoted that line. If you've never seen it, go find a copy, its awesome - especially that part. Amazing acting all around, including those confronting Jesus.
The distinction in Hebrews 1 is more specific than "distinct from angels." It teaches that Jesus has greater authority than angels which would hardly have to be explained if Jesus was almighty God.
Dear friend - that is a valid point. But that is forgetting a vital truth... ...The Son left His position of ONE with the Father and took on the nature of mankind. This is the bible message. There is no other message. AS that message is true, having left all glory by taking on our nature, so the Father raised Him above all other names. Read revelations, the Lamb and the Father are worshipped together, both receiving equal praise. Jesus said to Honour Him as we honour the Father. Qu: Do YOU honour Jesus as you honour the Father? I say that respectfully and I don't mean to be patronizing. Friend, this is too serious to play intellectual games. Our souls are at stake. If we do not believe Him when He said that "I AM HE", we will die in our sins. This is dynamite - we owe it to ourselves to be MIGHTY sure before we deny the Son is Jehovah. 1) First and Last is the ONLY Lord God Jehovah Isa 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and *beside me there is no God*. Do you agree? Good... let's proceed. Isa 48:12 Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last. (He that is speaking is the First and the Last - Lord God Jehovah) Isa 48:13 Mine hand also hath laid the foundation of the earth, and my right hand hath spanned the heavens: when I call unto them, they stand up together. (He made all things - God made all things - this is true of Jesus too... ) Isa 48:14 All ye, assemble yourselves, and hear; which among them hath declared these things? The LORD hath loved him: he will do his pleasure on Babylon, and his arm shall be on the Chaldeans. Isa 48:15 I, even I, have spoken; yea, I have called him: I have brought him, and he shall make his way prosperous. (The voice speaking called Jacob - this is God) Isa 48:16 Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, *there am I*: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, *hath sent me*. (The voice speaking - Jehovah - was sent from the Jehovah (Father) with the Holy Spirit) So Jehovah sent Jehovah with the Holy Spirit? How can this be? Here is the answer - it comes from Gods own lips.... (who cares what men say) HEAR OH ISRAEL... Our God is ONE (Echad: one in unity) ONE in unity - as a man and a woman are ONE flesh. Gen 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one (ECHAD) flesh. This... is the Image of God.... Says God - again ! Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in *our image*, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. Be blessed bro
@@johnc4624 I don't think he was "one with the Father" in the Trinitarian sense. Rather they were one in purpose and course. (John 17:21,22) Also Hebrews 1 puts a pattern before us in the categories being spoken of: 1) prophets (vs 1) 2) priests (vs 3C; 13 via allusion to Ps 110) 3) kings (5; 8-12) 4) Angels (4-7; 13,14) Jesus belongs to all the categories but is the example par excellence in each one. Why would the writer intend to exclude him from the category of "angel" while not explicitly saying so? Especially when Christ is in each of the other categories?
@@eew8060 I completely agree. Jesus and the Father DO agree. John 17:21-22 talk about common purpose. But why stop reading there.. read the next verse. Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me. "I in them, and thou in me.." "perfect one" Is this talking only about being in agreement? Friend - are you a married man? If your wife has the same business objective as her boss, would you object? Of course not. She is expected to share the same purpose with her other colleagues. But what if she shared the same bed? There is a difference between HAVING ONE accord and BEING ONE. You know that - I don't have to teach you about birds and bees. lol. We don't just become ONE in opinion and purpose, but ONE new spiritual man in Christ. (As Adam and Eve became ONE carnal man, ONE in the flesh - As God and Jesus were ONE God, ONE in the spirit) Understand the mystery. Eve came OUT of Adam, she therefore became ONE flesh with Adam. The two became ONE because the two WERE ONE from the very beginning. SO it is with the Father, Son and the Spirit. Jesus always used simple natural things to explain extremely complex spiritual truths. You can perceive GOD as a seed - ONE seed. (It is just a metaphor) That ONE seed, becomes two parts : a root and a stem. The root is hidden underground whilst the stem breaks out into the open and bears fruit. The sap travels from the roots upwards towards the plant and gives it life. The Father is the root, the Son is the plant, the Holy Spirit is the sap of life. You have ONE plant, three parts. Jesus is the Tree of Life, the Father is His source of Life. No man sees the Father, they see the Son. But you know a tree by its fruit, if you see Jesus, you see the Father. It is the mystery of God and us being in His image. Eve was IN Adam all along. Jesus came OUT of the Father, they WERE ONE and then they BECAME ONE again. ... that is v24 Joh 17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for *thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world*. He was ONE with God before creation. As a stem and the root were ONE in the ONE seed (form of GOD). There is but ONE God, ONE seed ONE plant. This is what John understood. Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God. This is what I understand too. So my friend - don't stop reading at v22. I hope this gives you food for thought. Your soul is worth my time.
@@johnc4624 Yes. Its definitely talking about being "one" in purpose. In harmony. Otherwise you have believers being co-equal/co-eternal with God. So its in agreement of purpose. Hebrews 1 shows that Christ is from one of the angelic sons of God
@@eew8060 God does not have many begotten Sons, He has an ONLY begotten Son. The rest were created. Jesus CAME from the Father... always having been IN the Father. Everything else is a creation. Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten (monogenes) Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. Gnosticism is not christian.
It is simple to explain this from my perspective...the reason why Micheal had the ability to rise Moses from the dead is because God was doing it through Micheal. Just as Jesus rose people from the dead through his disciples, and this is evident from the book of acts.
The scene in Courageous where the two cops are talking about Javier not realizing they were talking about a different Javier would be a great example of other religions having a different Jesus.
Hello, Ray Comfort and Team! I want to ask a question to you and anyone around here. I find this quote by Charles Spurgeon interesting. "We read that Michael and his angels fought against the dragon and his angels, and the dragon was cast down. The fight is going on every day. Michael is the Lord Jesus, the only Archangel." -- Charles Haddon Spurgeon (Source: The Angelic Life, Sermon delivered on Nov. 22, 1868) I'm not a JW, and I am in no way supporting JW's heresies, but let's think of the term "Archangel" like this: "Ruler of angels" or "Chief Messenger." Spurgeon, in his quote, implies that Jesus and Michael are the same, not taking away the deity from Christ. Here's the question: From this viewpoint, is there any possibility that Michael is another name for Jesus? (By the way, I'm standing with reformed theology.) God bless you in your ministry. - Josh
Context in John 8:58 shows their discussion was not about Jesus' identity as if he were God, but about his real age...How long he has existed because the people said "you are not yet 50 years of old, and yet you have seen Abraham?" So Jesus in reply gave statement about his age how long he has existed. "..before Abraham was, I have been".
@@roeltingzon758 what did Moses hear that God’s name was from the burning bush? Why would Jesus say “ego eime.”? Does he have a grammar problem? His real age vs his deity is not a real distinction. Since he is answering their age question by saying, “I have always been.” Meaning he is not simply what they see in the flesh, a 30-ish year old human. He is and has always been before time began. And there is only One who has always been, that is the Great I Am, YAHWEH. Therefore, Jesus claimed externality and the eternal name of YAHWEH given to Moses at the burning bush, and the meaning was not lost on the Pharisees in the slightest. Context doesn’t work the way you want it to.
@@DonicaTibbetts but the fact remains that nowhere in entire New Testament of the bible does Jesus make a statement saying that he is God Almighty or God in the flesh...its zilch & zero! That is perplexing given he had sufficent time (33 and half yrs) to give his identity as God by just exclaiming that he's God the father..it has to come our from his own mouth...the only confession Jesus ever makes of who he is can be found with his conversation with the woman by Jacob's well...he tells her straight up that he indeed is the promised Messiah the Jews had been expecting - he does not say anything about being a God-man or that he's God Almighty. Another event is when the Jews wanted to stone him as in John 10:25-31 because they mistakenly thought he - a man, was making himself to be God..a notion that Jesus sensed and their wrong attitude towards him, did not immediately claim to be God but rebutted them by citing their own scriptures of Psalms 82:6 which shows that even their human judges were addressed as 'gods' because they were bequeathed such authority & power from God himself and Jesus himself could rightfully be called a "Mighty God" or in Hebrew El' Gibbohr, someone who had power because he could perform miracles as a representative of God. But being enabled by Holy Spirit to do wonders of miracles did not mean Jesus was now God Almighty...in relation to his heavenly Father Jesus is a lesser god, a Mighty God but not God Almighty which alone applies to his Father. And so no Jesus did not claim to be God incarnate because the Jews knew he was just simply a man, but no ordinary man for Jesus was a perfect man with power, who was sinless and did not need to die. It would make no sense that Jesus as he was dying cried out: "Father! Forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.." was he as God incarnate crying out to himself? And to who was he praying to when he was arrested in garden on that night? God does not need to pray at all...but we read that Jesus prayed...was he praying to himself? And if he was really God then his death was faked all a trick.
@@DonicaTibbetts and Jesus is a created being for he says in Revelation 3:14 that he is..."the beginning of the Creation by God. The king James bible says the same reading of that verse. Jesus was a direct creation of God.
The Seventh day Adventist position is not that Jesus was ever an actual angel. But God from all eternity. But we need to ask the question still according to the position that it takes away from His divinity. Does Jesus becoming man (which is lower than the angels) take away from His divinity?
Well said. JWs always frame the debate regarding Michael's identity by assuming that "archangel" can only be an angel in the Hebrews 1:7 sense, and sadly most Christians take the bait and end up on the defensive. Archangel can be translated chief messenger, and Jesus himself is the chief messenger of the Gospel. Even if Michael turns out to be Christ, such a conclusion in no way detracts from His divinity nor does it "lower" Him to the status of a mere angel in the Hebrews 1:7 sense.
In Daniel 10, Gabriel is telling Daniel why he was delayed (as Daniel spent 3 weeks fasting and praying). He says he was delayed by the prince of Persia (possibly a fallen angel). Dan. 10:13 "But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia. 20 Then said he, Knowest thou wherefore I come unto thee? and now will I return to fight with the prince of Persia: and when I am gone forth, lo, the prince of Grecia shall come. 21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince." He clearly says that Michael is ONE OF THE CHIEF PRINCES. That means there are others, and he names the prince of Persia and the prince of Grecia; and calls Michael the prince of your people (Israel). These princes obviously have spiritual dominion of principalities or governments. Michael is Not JESUS, who is God; and the WORD who was there in the beginning at creations, according to John 1:1 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”
Yes but angels do not reign and rule over us as princes. The Bible says they are ministering spirits. Michael is a Prince and He reigns over us! Jesus is the Prince of Peace!
Jesus was GOD incarnate on earth, He is part of the Holy Trinity. He is God, He is not Michael. Michael is highly favored angel. And he also will probably be utilized in the coming last days.
It is very unlikely that Jesus is Micheal the Archangel....considering he is God. In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. - John 1:1-3 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth. - John 1:14 Now ask yourself, is God an angel?
This what I needed to try and discuss with my son, who is a JW, about Jesus being both "a" God and also Michael the Arch Angel. I still have other issues that need to be clarified as well. I do not understand how my son can say what he does about Jesus and yet offer up a mealtime blessing in the name of Jesus, which he did in my presence. I am believing that something is changing inside and I continue to pray for God to pierce his heart and make an opening in his understanding of scripture.
I read the JW explanation for “a God” and I get what they are saying in that the Word is Devine in a sense of importance. But still every single word should be translated letter for letter exactly as it was written in the first place. You don’t just assume you know what the writer is meaning and change it bc it makes more sense to you. There are so many scriptures I feel are pretty cut and dry and obvious. Like “God was manifest in the flesh”. Okay, so, God is Jesus. And after the resurrection when Jesus says : I’m not a spirit bc a spirit doesn’t have flesh and bone as do I”. It’s pretty plain and simple so how can you see that as anything other than a physical resurrection? It seems like people just make it more complicated than it is. I did the same thing until I learned to pray and ask God to show me the truth from lies and from my own opinions. It’s called discernment. He will show you. Don’t depend solely on what a “human” tells you it means. God Bless.
Yahuchanan: Yah has Favoured [“John”] 14:28 “You have heard how I [Yahusha] said to you, I go away, and come (again) to you. If you loved Me, you would rejoice, because I said, I go to the Father; for My Father [YAHUAH] is greater than I.” Where exactly did the Anointed One [translated "Messiah"] teach anyone to worship Him or His mother? Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the set-apart ones: Here are they that keep the Commandments of YAHUAH (יהוה) AND the faith of YAHUSHA (יהושע)
Some examples Gen 21:17-18, 22:11-12,15-18, Acts 3:25, Gen 16:7,13. Also Michael means one who is like God, Arch means Chief, angel means messenger from God. So it could fit together like this. Michael the Archangel is a messenger of God who is like unto God Himself.
I am thankful that you didnt listen to me but took it into consideration that the bible can interprete itself. I am also thankful that you didnt let your ego cloud your judgement. Only a true Christian will ever admit he is wrong. With an attitude like that nothing will be hidden from you. God bless you and your endeavors- I too make mistakes ,that's why I use the bible to defend the bible. If you are ever interested in reasoning biblically,just let me know-will be glad to .
Indeed, and no I would say that it does not. The Bible is clear that Jesus became a human being and was yet still God. But it never indicates that Jesus became an angel or has the nature of an angel OR _was_ Michael the Archangel specifically. The SDA folks assume that when the Bible refers to Michael that this was actually Jesus appearing AS an angel, which is fine in theory I suppose but the Bible does not support that belief unless you jump through some pretty crazy hoops.
It matters because there are people who believe that Jesus is Michael the archangel. Until they learn better, they are lost individuals. Jesus stated in the 32nd verse of the 8th chapter of John, that ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. Knowledge of the truth is the law of liberty.
@michelle louise , thank you for confirming what I knew was right. I was talking to one of my neighbors who is a shunned Jehovah's witness, who truly believes this. He even gave me scripture to read, which has nothing to do with his belief.
I'm just trying to tell you what the Bible says.Which is Michael is a different person than Jesus.Since Michael is an Archangel Jesus is God in human form who died for my sins and rose again on the third day.
I enjoyed your video It’s not only the Jehovah witness it’s also the 7 Day Adventist Have this false doctrine and have been mislead by pastors I have rebuked them kindly but need help to get through to them the End is nearing and they are good people 🙏🏾❤️🇮🇱
First of all, Michael the arch-angel being Jesus is not just a Jehovahs Witness doctrine. Most of the Protestant reformers believed this to be true. Second, Angel means “messenger” and arch-angel means “leader of the “messengers”. It does not mean an angel or ”a created being”. Jesus is not a created being. Third, Jesus is coming with the voice of the arch-angel and raise the dead. Only Jesus can raise the dead. Fourth, Jesus is messiah the prince, the prince of princes. Most characters in the Bible were given name changes when their role changed. Lucifer, Abraham, Jacob, Peter, Paul, Judas, and Jesus. Michael was Jesus’ name before He became our messiah.
You mean only God and Jesus can save. They are one and the same. Jesus has the keys of life and death. He will come with the voice of the Archangel and raise the dead at the second coming.
@@davidjohnson3095 second coming!! He comes in spirit with the father during baptisim. Without the light of the father we are dead living a life not created by the father. We die in our sins, and born again in the light of the Father, Jesus the comforter.
you are correct that I should not have inserted the word one. Can you help me with theses verses?"Gen 48:15,16And he blessed Joseph, and said, God, before whom my fathers Abraham and Isaac did walk, the God which fed me all my life long unto this day, Gen The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth." Can an angel redeem? continued.
Peace brothers in Christ. Jesus is the verb, He is all the words that cometh out of the Father’s mouth. And that’s why He said” I am the true bread they came down from heaven. I am the truth.” Jesus has always been with God and he is God! And one day the Father got His words/(The Verve), and sat Him next to Him, and said “ I will be Father onto Him, and he will be Son on to Me“ Hebrews 1:5. Making Jesus, God that is visible. The name Micheal means ” whom like God” and the great mystery is that the Bible does not say that Micheal was created! Just like the mystery of Melchisedec! Yes I tell you my brother Michael is not an angel that was created! Daniel 10:16 And, behold, one like the similitude of the sons of men touched my lips: then I opened my mouth, and spake, and said unto him that stood before me, O my lord, by the vision my sorrows are turned upon me, and I have retained no strength. Daniel 10:17 For how can the servant of this my lord talk with this my lord? for as for me, straightway there remained no strength in me, neither is there breath left in me. Daniel 10:18 Then there came again and touched me one like the appearance of a man, and he strengthened me, - The one with the appearance of a man was Michael! Study this and you will see........ The truth! Michael it’s not an angel like the other created angels! Just like the angel from the book of Revelation 10, the One that put His feet on the water and on the land and cried out to God who lives forever! See the similarity! Have fun searching the truth every day! Love you all brothers!!!
I love the video, but you didnt touch on other verses about Jesus or Michael. Here is one for instance, why is Jesus going to sit next to God, His right hand I think He said, as we are going to sit at His right. I do believe Jesus is God in the flesh, but there is more to the story of Michael.
Just a thought: Does God love the Angels just as he loves man? Is it possible that Just as He became man to save man? That He may have done something similar to try to save the angels. I’m not saying this is in the Bible but it is an interesting thought. I believe that it is in God’s nature to save even if it were possible satan himself. Although I don’t believe that they are redeemable now. But, perhaps before they were cast out of heaven.
I've was brought up to believe Jesus is God and Michael is just an Archangel but I have known actual Christians who could make pretty decent-sounding arguments that Michael as well as the rider of the first horse in Revelations was Christ. If either Michael or the first of the four horsemen turns out to be Christ, it won't shake my own faith in any way since these are not nearly the most essential things to know when relating to Christ.
I have been asked before to read these places you reference and they seem pretty thin. When the angel spoke to Abraham he said "saith the Lord". The Bible is quite clear that we are not to worship angels. How do you explain Hebrews chapter 1, or Colossians 2:18, and Revalation 22:9. Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to discourage a follower of Christ, but I see a danger in your position. P.S. I assume the blue is a link. Can you tell me how to do that?
Okay well I’m also listening to Christians who deny the 4th commandment If you choose to misunderstand that you just might choose to misunderstand more to
Does not God receive more glory condescending to become man as it reveals His true Character, that being God He humbled himself and became a servant? This unfathomable love has broken my heart time and time again. Do we think that we are better than the Angels, and that He would not have made similar provisions for them?
Tim, help me understand cotrectly because maybe the SDA position on this was explained better to you. Are they saying that Jesus is an angel (in other words less than God, like the JW) or are they actually saying that the angel is Jesus/God? Because they are not the same thing though both heretical and blasphemous views.
Birke Thaumüller-Grobler from my understanding, they are saying that archangel is a position of authority and that an archangel isn’t a physical angel. This is how they justify Michael being another name for Jesus.
The position is that Michael is not an angel in the first place. Your confusing the position that I take. and I also never said God is not over the angels. Are you just trying to win an argument or are we looking for clearity of position?
GBY all, I've only recently started watching you guys. 👍👍!!! I did notice one thing. You mentioned several different beliefs and the different ways they look at Jesus. Non of witch were the one that wanted to stone Jesus. The assignment is, show us the way the Jew's saw Him then and the way they see Him now. 😀 thx n God bless Yr brother in Christ Vicente
Seventh Day Adventists believe Michael is Jesus as well right? I listen to the Forerunner Chronicles a lot here on youtube but I realize he is a SDA. Are SDA considered Christians? They sure seem to be.
Because we shall work 6 days a week but the 7 which is sunday is to keep it holy for our Lord our God. This is called Sabbath day, and according to the calendet we use that would fall on sunday. However we can still go to church fridays, saturday, everyday we can worship our God, but he should be the center and be in our memory. I feel that sunday is perfect because mostly everyone gets break from jobs sundays. So we should all be able to attend a service.
I understand, and agree. In those cases you refer to, He is referred to as the "Angel of the Lord" not "Michael". I was merely saying that scripture doesn't support the SDA position that Michael is really Jesus incognito. They came to their conclusion with extra-biblical logic, or just conjecture.
I'm having a hard time moving forward. Thank you for continuing to dialog and your patients. But I need a place to anchor from. I need to know that we are listening to each other. So once again, what is it that you think that I believe about Jesus and Michael? do you think that i believe that Michael is and angel in the literal sense (in other words a created being).
It should also be noted that Jesus has a habit of "guest-staring in his own movie" from time to time, appearing as Melchiszidek, the "angel" whose name was "Wonderful" who appeared to Samson's parents, and the man who confronted Joshua prior to the attack on Jericho, to name a few. It's harder to see Him taking on the form of an angel since He is clearly a MAN, in addition to being God, of course.
Correction: John 1:1 says in Greek: In the beggining was the word and the word was with the god and god was the word. This Syntax is right in Greek. It doesn't say that the word was the god clearly. Please consider this. Trinitarian here.
The teaching comes from the Father and His written Word. Ignore all man made theology and seek the Truth for yourself. I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High. Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. Matthew 18:10-11 KJV Jesus is a child of God just as you are, we are all angels fallen away from heaven earthbound. We are to be in the image of God, Jesus was that image, just how God made us all.
@@achildofthelight4725 That's what I am doing. I am searching the truth for myself. No, we are not angels. The angels in the Bible are distinct from humans. Read the Apocalypse, written by John. Some angels are depicted there. Satan is not a human but a spirit. Angels are not humans but spirits. We are humans fallen away from heaven earthbound. I agree with the last sentences but Jesus is not a child of God like us. It's right in front of you in John 1:1. He existed with the Father in the beggining and it is nowhere written in the Bible that he was created since he is the word of god.😉Note this, he came as a human with a virgin birth, he was not only human since he kept saying he was the son of God making himself equal with the father.
@@achildofthelight4725 1) You didn't answer my arguments because I am right.😁😅 Or did you overlook them? 2) Of cource I didn't overlook the verses you sent me. Let me explain the Matthew abstract to you. He said that we humans are gods (creators) and children of the most high. He didn't include himself as being one of the Father's creation. He explains that even while he is on earth, the angels who are in heaven are worshipping the Father. And then he said he came to save that which was lost. Us! Jesus came as a man to save us. And he expressed that with the ressurection after his crucifiction. Also nowhere here he says that he or the people around him are angels. He and the Father are one. Nobody else has said that. And since the Father isn't an Angel, so does Christ.
@@babisbabinos8075 Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have entertained angels unawares. Hebrews 13:2 KJV An angel is a messenger. Someone who hears Gods voice and will have a message for us. That could be anyone who is living on the earth
Jesus is god in the flesh manifest through the blood of the lamb and god is the host(vessel)of heaven and omnipresent,so god is not only michael but all angels, all saints;all prophets;all knowing, all powerful and totally righteous. And the quizzlings can quiz all they want but all they do is condemn themselves.
Now can you explain to me with scripture ,Why is Christ called a prince,a mediator? Plz do it with scripture-i dont want your opinion -its not legit. Explain to me who"s voice will raise the dead -Christ or another archangel, with scripture-once again. Explain to me why the Bible says Michael and HIS angels in ONE instant ,but in over 10 places its the son of man or God and HIS angels. Now let the fun begin... Here is a reminder to use the bible it can defend itself.
Amen, Jesus is God, always has been God, and always will be God. Some Christians believe that Jesus is also the master of angels. I believe that as well. The Bible does not say that Michael was a created being. There is a difference from believing that Jesus is Michael and the belief that Michael was just another angel (created being). There are many examples in Bible where it appears that the Bible writers use the word angel to describe and encounter with God and it wasn't just and angel.
Agreed, He did not become less than God When he became a man. Lets make sure our thought process is consistent. And also understand that many that say that Jesus is Michael are not saying that He is or ever was an actual angel. So following through with the logic, If becoming man (which is according to the Bible lower than the angels) did not make less than God, why would saying He is over all the angels (which according to the Bible Michael is) make Him less than God? Answer directly please?
Praise God, and thank you for you're work, Michael and Jesus are not the same being! Michael in terms of the second advent of Christ, is comparable to John the Baptist, at the first advent, John the Baptist, sent ahead to prepare the path and prepare the way, for the coming of the Lord. and reading Jude 1:9 in proper context illustrates this and shows this perfectly, read if properly, read Jude 1:8-10, now here it says, " Yet even Michael the Arch Angel, dare not cast a railing judgment against Satan when arguing with him about the body of Moses, he only rebukes Satan in the name of the Lord" While Jesus name above all names, every knee shall bow, not only could he simply cast Satan away by his own power, but also he had the Authority, to give the power of his true pure Holey name to his true children, and by his name any with true faith can cast out demons in and by the power of the name of Jesus! nowhere in scripture does it say anyone can cast out demons by the name of Michael! Michael is an Angel, a created being! the holey messenger and high general of the all the Angels, but not Jesus! Jesus is God!
Did the Watchtower come up with the notion that Jesus was also the Archangel? Well, here are a number of Baptist, Methodist, Calvinist and Judaic commentaries which predate the existence of the Watch Tower Society. Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible "Yet Michael the archangel,.... By whom is meant, not a created angel, but an eternal one, the Lord Jesus Christ; as appears from his name Michael, which signifies, "who is as God": and who is as God, or like unto him, but the Son of God, who is equal with God? and from his character as the archangel, or Prince of angels, for Christ is the head of all principality and power; and from what is elsewhere said of Michael, as that he is the great Prince, and on the side of the people of God, and to have angels under him, and at his command, Daniel 10:21. So Philo the Jew (o) calls the most ancient Word, firstborn of God, the archangel; Uriel is called the archangel in this passage from the Apocrypha:Jude 1:9" biblehub.com/commentaries/jude/1-9.htm Joshua 5:13 and, behold, there stood a man over against him; not a mere man, nor a created angel in an human form, but a divine Person in such a form, even the Son of God, who frequently appeared in this manner to the patriarchs; as is clear from the worship paid unto him by Joshua, by his calling him Lord, and owning himself to be his servant; and by the ground on which he stood, being holy through his presence, as well as by his title, the Captain of the Lord's host. Jarchi says, this is Michael, which, if understood of Michael the uncreated angel, the head of all principality and power, is right, who is always meant by Michael, whenever he is spoken of in Scripture; and so this is interpreted by the ancient Jews F11 of the Angel the Redeemer: www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/gills-exposition-of-the-bible/joshua-5-13.html Geneva Study Bible Joshua 5:14 And he said, Nay; but [as] captain of the host of the LORD am I now come. And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and g did worship, and said unto him, What saith my lord unto his servant? (g) In that Joshua worships him, he acknowledges him to be God: and in that he calls himself the Lords captain he declares himself to be Christ. www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/geneva-study-bible/joshua/joshua-5.html Matthew Henry Commentary on the Whole Bible Joshua 5:13 He appeared to him as a man, but a considerable man, and one fit to be taken notice of. Now, 1. We have reason to think that this man was the Son of God, the eternal Word, who, before he assumed the human nature for a perpetuity, frequently appeared in a human shape. www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/matthew-henry-complete/joshua/5.html Wesley's Explanatory Notes Joshua 5:14 As captain - I am the chief captain of this people, and will conduct and assist thee and them in this great undertaking. Now this person is not a created angel, but the son of God, who went along with the Israelites in this expedition, as their chief and captain. And this appears, By his acceptance of adoration here, which a created angel durst not admit of, Revelation 22:8 ,9. Because the place was made holy by his presence, Joshua 5:15 , which was God's prerogative, Exodus 3:5 . Because he is called the Lord, Heb. Jehovah, Joshua 6:2 . My Lord - I acknowledge thee for my Lord and captain, and therefore wait for thy commands, which I am ready to obey www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/wesleys-explanatory-notes/joshua/joshua-5.html Jewish Encyclopedia "Similarly in Aramaic, "son of man" is the usual designation for "man," and occurs in the inscriptions in Syriac, Mandaic, Talmudic, and other dialects (see Nathanael Schmidt in Cheyne and Black, "Encyc. Bibl." iv. 4707-4708). In Dan. vii. 13, the passage in which it occurs in Biblical Aramaic, it certainly connotes a "human being." Many see a Messianic significance in this verse, but in all probability the reference is to an angel with a human appearance, perhaps Michael." www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/13913-son-of-man
wow IMJ1000 that is an awsome reply to show our oppossers that we were not alway the ones who came up with the fact that Jesus is in fact Michael the Archangel. at 1st 4:16 Jesus whom they claim is God could have descended with the voice of God , but no, he came with the voice of an Archangel which shows he is using Michael's voice to raise the dead just like at John 5:28 that those who hear the voice of Jesus will come to life just like they hear the voice of the archangel and come to life.Irrefutable.
Obviously not IMJW but what does that change, they are the only Christian faith preaching this truth worldwide, nobody else fulfils prophecy that I can see. If I misunderstood your meaning I apologise in advance.
+MrHawkwind posted, The WTS is"the only Christian faith preaching this truth worldwide..." You are correct. The Witnesses preach this doctrine. So does Judaism, and it has done so since long before the birth of Jesus. Jewish Encyclopedia "Similarly in Aramaic, "son of man" is the usual designation for "man," and occurs in the inscriptions in Syriac, Mandaic, Talmudic, and other dialects (see Nathanael Schmidt in Cheyne and Black, "Encyc. Bibl." iv. 4707-4708). In Dan. vii. 13, the passage in which it occurs in Biblical Aramaic, it certainly connotes a "human being." Many see a Messianic significance in this verse, but in all probability the reference is to an angel with a human appearance, perhaps Michael." The Jews just don't believe that Jews is the Son of man. Those who did believe such, became Christian. John 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. At first, one had to be a Jew, in order to become a Christian. Baptism was limited to Jews, as per the promise that God made to Abraham that his decedents would be a nation of kings and priests. Acts 24:14, But I admit that I follow the Way, which they call a cult. I worship the God of our ancestors, and I firmly believe the Jewish law and everything written in the prophets. Christians were Torah following Jews who followed, "the Way". They were just Jews, who had accepted Jesus as Messiah. No change in beliefs, yet. Pure Judaism. Unitarian. They followed the law, recited the Shema and met at the synagogue. Act 10:28, He told them, "You understand how wrong it is for a Jew to associate or visit with a gentile. But God has shown me that I should stop calling anyone common or unclean Then, under inspiration, Peter opened Christianity to the gentiles. Act 15:5, But some believers from the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, "The gentiles must be circumcised and ordered to keep the Law of Moses." 6 So the apostles and the elders met to look into this claim. Once the gentiles were allowed into Christianity, a problem arose. The Jews were following the law of Moses and the gentiles were not. Remember, the Shema which the Jews recited daily. They understood God, as they still do to be one God of one person. Act 15:28, For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay on you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication; from which, if you keep yourselves, you shall do well. Be prospered. The issue was resolved, by no longer requiring Christians to follow the law of Moses, following the law of Christ, instead. At this point, Christianity became a new and separate religion, distinct from Judaism Hellenistic pagan personalities, holidays and doctrines came later.
That is truth. Jesus is God and our only savior. But God can become human, So why he cant transform himself like an angel..Read Luke 9. The mount of Transfuguration..Luke 9:29As He prayed, the appearance of His face was altered, and His robe became white and glistening. Everything is posible for God. He can become flesh, So why he cant look or transform as an Angel?
Yes Jesus is Lord to the Glory of God the Father which trinitarians always leave out this fact. God made him both Lord and Saviour.act 2:36 " King James Bible Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.Philip 2:11 " New International Version and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father> Jesus is not LORD but Lord small letters. King james _psalsm 110:1 confirms that 10 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool" NOTICE Jesus is Lord not LORD as your statement shows .The truth is always the truth my friend hope you can see it .
Jesus is the Angel of the LORD in the OT because in Hebrew it really means Messanger of Yahweh. He was a distinct person from the Father yet was one with Him in essence and being and He is also the eternal God. One God three persons is clealry seen in the Ot. The Angel of the LORd is the preincarnate Jesus Christ. Thats why Monah said we have seen God- Judges 13:3-23. When we see Jesus we see God because 1. He is God 2. He is everying the Father is, the exact representaion of the Father.
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first. LOL-bring with him the voice of the archangel? IS GOD GOD? Does my GOD need the voice of an angel to raise the dead. that is the worst comment on biblical reasoning ive heard in ages... John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear HIS voice. You fail hard.
there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.(who can stand up for us, deliver us -can a mere angel ?) 2 daniel 10:21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.(who is OUR prince of Peace?) more...
This is why it is wise to use the bible to interprete itself- Isaiah 42:8 I am the LORD: that is my name: and my GLORY will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images. If michael was not God, then we would have another created being sharing God's glory,and many biblical text would be contradicting themselves.. eg.romans 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the CREATURE more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen AND ALOT MORE...!
Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost. Matthew 18:10-11 KJV We are all angels, children of God. Jesus was the chosen one to lead us back to the Father, who was exactly the way we were made in the beginning, the image of God. Since Jesus was raised above all of us, it's only fitting, JW's have some truth behind their theology.
Yes, this verse is indicating that the Lord is coming with a Shout, and he will bring with him the voice of the Archangel, please tell me....where does this indicate Jesus as being the archangel Micheal? Could it not be saying that he is bringing archangels with him?
Amen my brother,I have given ample reasons yet they strain a gnat and swallow a camel... ArchAngel Michael-mediator for angels Emmanuel -mediator for man- Most dont study so they fail to realize -the entire bible prophesy of Christ. I Am Sda and that is not an issue any adventist should have, unless they are not studying..
wasn't aware that anyone really knew how to pronounce His name correctly, there are no vowels, it becomes all speculation. Main point of Him giving a name is to relate His character or His nature. Jehovah Witness believed they are saved because they use that name. This presupposes that Hebrew is only be used when speaking about God. This is a human language. God uses human language to speak to us. God didn't choose Abraham because of the language he spoke. continued.
The answer is simple, Michael is just another name for Jesus before He was born as a man. Since all Christians believe that Jesus existed before He was born a man it stands to reason that the Bible would actually talk a little bit about His preexistence, right? Well, it does and it's all through out the Old Testament. It's when the OT talks about the Angel of the LORD and Michael. FaithAndLogic did a good summary of all the similarities between Michael, the Angel of the LORD and Jesus. So to make it clear, you can believe that Michael is the name Jesus was referred by before He became a man without believing that Jesus is a created being. No, Jesus is the eternal God who has always existed and created everything. Michael is just the name He is referred to before He became a man.
I dont like to put ppl on the spot, but The truth must be revealed-you have two choices. 1-Acknowledge that hrist is michael 2-Acknowledge that michael is a created angel who can raise the dead- and if you chosse number 2 -( I know you want to) -BLASPHEMY Again only God can raise the dead,If a created being can do it with his voice-we have a serious problem. Plz use the bible to interprete itself,because when you try to use your wisdom you fail.
The dead in Christ rise from the dead in the same way that Christ rose from the dead - the Spirit of God within. Christ bestows upon all the Father's children His same power. The angel's trump is just the outwardly sign. This is similar to Jericho...it wasn't the trumpets that brought the walls down...it was God's power. The trumpets were just the outward sign.
You know, this is an interesting topic (the video). I once met a couple who was Seventh Day Adventist, and they also insisted that Jesus was Michael the Archangel. When I pointed out the same thing Ray said here that this would take away the divinity of Jesus, they said Oh, no we still think Jesus is God, but that in scripture where Michael appears, that was really Jesus. Um, wow ok well that's really weird and I don't agree, but its definitely another spin on the Michael thing.
The name "Michael" does NOT mean One who is like God as you say,... The name "Michael" actually means, "Who is like God?". The name Michael again, is a question, and the question is the meaning, "Who is like God?". And the answer is found in many places such as Exodus 15:11 "Who among the gods is like you, O LORD? Who is like you--majestic in holiness, awesome in glory, working wonders?" Hebrews 1:14 "Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?"
Ella the Angel of the LORD in the OT is God. Look at the scriptures. Who appeared to Moses in the burning bush and said I am who I am. The Angel of the LORD. Who did Monah say she saw when she saw the Angel of the LORD. God. He is the preincarnate Jesus Christ. Yes Jesus is not a creation He is the eternal God. I know that.
Yahusha is The Word of YAHUAH made flesh, and through Him; that is The Word of YAHUAH everything that is was brought into existence. YAHUAH [whose name means who is, was, will be] is our Father; the Creator of the Universe and everything in it. Yahusha [whose name means Yah is (our) Salvation] is His Son and those who deny Him will be denied in front of YAHUAH and His mal'akym ["angels"] and those who practice lawlessness are liable to hear the words, Depart from Me, you who work lawlessness.
1. I do not claim the word became flesh, that is right from the bible itself, Gospel of John to be specific. And your right, the word was something else before, but does that indicate that he was micheal the archangel? that is a major assumption, i hope you realize that. Who stood for the angels? God, obviously since it says that God threw/kicked lucifer out of the garden. Micheal should be on the cross other then Jesus? that is absurd and that is not my argument at all.
Jesus does not mean Jehovah. The name means Jehovah saved. Are you telling me that Joshua from the old testament is also God? And my brother, God did not change Xerxes name. Please answer this directly Did Jesus become less than God when He literally became a man?
sorry, don't know why it is blue. I understand your concern also. one could start believing that Jesus is not God or that He was created. I do not believe that. Niether would I be discouraged, thank you for being concerned though. My faith is in Christ and I'm ok with being wrong. I just trust HIm as He continues to lead me.
you sould re-examine. There are many names for Jesus. The name Jesus was only usesd once He came as a man. Other examples of different names used for the same person are Jacob=Israel, Saul =Paul, how about persian kings. Xerxes and Ahasuerus same person. What did Jesus say His name was at the burning bush? What was the name God used for Himself in Creation or in the Duet 6:4? acording to what He wants to reveal about Himself He uses different names. revealing different aspects of His Nature.
Im not one who likes to argue senseless arguments- you say-"So i do not see how it is possible that Micheal can be God" But can you refute the biblical claims with scripture? I thought that it was only atheist who didnt see? anyways-plz explain to everyone here- 1Thess 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a SHOUT, with the voice of the ARCHANGEL, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: plz explain.
You can't say that Jesus and Michael are the same.It is like saying Greg and George are the same person.You see the Bible talks Michael and Jesus but they were two different people.The Bible does not talk about Samson being Goliath it does not have any people being different people.It has people changing names but never having multiple names at one time.If you say Jesus was Michael you are taking away His deity and saying He was just an Archangel.Either way you are taking away His deity.
The SDA position is not that Michael the archangel was ever an angel, but that it is more of a title. And in my limited capacity it seems the case is not as weak as I once thought. Jesus is refered to as coming with the shout of the Angel. That one small clue is just a starting point. But made me question if it was possibly refering to Jesus. If we dissagree I'm ok with that as long as people understand that I don't believe that Jesus was ever created. That to my understanding would blasphemy.
Psalms 138:2: “For You have magnified Your word above all Your name, Again- John 17:17 “Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth. What do you gather from those two text my friend? Think like this-you have a son,or a friend,who does not listen to you,your words. Even if that friend knows your secret childhood closet name-why should you respond to them?They can call till their throat runs dry,- YHWH, Yaweh,yashua,El shaddai, jehovah, etc means nothing if we dont listen to him.
Ray, Ez, and Mark you guys seem so close. You make me smile and sometimes just laugh out loud. God Bless you all as you continue to share the gospel with lost souls, Your programs are a blessing to me and I learn a lot. I will also continue to pray for you.
Heb 1:5 For to which of the angels did God ever say, "You are my Son; today I have become your Father"? Also, God never said of any angel, "I will be his Father, and he will be my Son."
Job 4:18 He puts no trust even in His servants; And against His angels He charges error.
How can an imperfect, created being offer a perfect sacrifice for atonement? And how can Jesus claim to be "I AM" and the "Alpha and Omega", titles which only God can claim, unless He is divine and perfect like God?
A JW Elder even shocked me last night when he said Isaiah 9:6 also applies to Angel Michael as he is the Everlasting Father.
I was shocked beyond words.
Rev John You should asked him why they abbreviated the text of 1 John 5:7 from there bibles in other words its an anti God secret Luciferian cult
Jesus is God and not an angel that’s why, peace brother love you!
Great answer!
1 John 5:7 as it read in the king James Version is omitted in most other modern English bible because scholars know that verse about 3 witness bearers in heaven namely the Father, the word and the Holy Ghost or spirit was not found in earlier Greek texts manuscripts of the bible...so bible scholars suspect it was a forgery since it was an latter addition during the 16th century. Its a spurious verse thats why its omitted in many other bible translations except the KJV or New King James version.
Great episode guys! Jesus is LORD! Gos bless!
Jude 1:9
*Yet Michael the archangel, in contending with the devil, when he disputed about the body of Moses, dared not bring against him a reviling accusation, but said, “The Lord rebuke you!”*
FOUR THUMBS UP !!! Well said !!!!
Compare that with Zechariah 3:2 then tell me what you think about Jude 1:9. Study the scriptures a little closer, and let the Bible be its own interpreter. In Daniel 12:1 Michael is called the Great prince. No angel can be called Great prince. Read Revelations 12:7 it says Michael and his angels, as if Michael owns and is in charge of them. There is only one deity, that owns angels, and that's Jesus. So if Michael owns angels, and so does Jesus, then they have to be, one in the same.
@@liquidswords9388
You have answered correctly.
Indeed the Lord speaks of Himself in third person - this is the doctrine of the trinity at work. (Like Isaiah 48:16 etc).
You make a valid point there. One should not assume the person speaking is NOT the Lord JUST because he quotes the Lord in 3rd person - point well made.
However....Whilst it does bring into question Jude, it still does not make michael the Lord.
You simply cannot overlook Hebrews ch1. It is the reason for the book - to state Jesus is the Lord and not a creation, nor an angel, nor a mere man, nor a prophet. He is the Son of God - God Almighty.
As for head of the angels - so what?
Joab was the head of the Israeli army, having many men under his command.
Yet that did not make him king.
Michael is head of the angels, that does not make him Lord and King either.
Even in our government, we have several heads of state in different departments.
We understand law and order.
As for the voice of the archangel..
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
Consider this: If Jesus is an archangel because He is WITH the voice of the archangel, he also is a trumpet as He is WITH a trumpet too.
Therefore Jesus... is an archangel AND a trumpet.
LOL - really funny
YES - there is a better explanation.
Would it rather NOT be Jesus, WITH an archangel, WITH a trumpet, WITH all His saints?
Which is, of course, what is written.
This is confirmed here in Christs second coming in revelations:
Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
Rev 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice,
This is a fulfilment of 1 thess 4:16.
Jesus is on a white horse, the angel is standing in the sun. The angel is shouting with a loud cry whilst Lord Jesus leads the return. There are NOT one and the same.
Please think again my friend.
(i) Clearly, Jesus was NOT an angel at any time before.
Heb 1:13 But to which of the angels said he at any time, Sit on my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool?
(ii) Jesus did NOT become an angel either.
Heb 1:4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.
So this is wrong teaching
@@johnc4624 Also compare 1st Thessalonians 4:16 with John 5:25 Verily, Verily I say unto you, The hour is coming and now is, when the dead shall hear the voice of the Son of God: and they that hear shall live. And verse 28 says Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear his voice,. Now, it clearly states that Jesus is going to use his voice to raise the dead. And if he is using the voice of the Archangel, what does that tell you. He is not gonna use 2 voices. And an Archangel, is not an Angel but leader of the Angels. The Archangel is Commander and chief of the Angels.
@@liquidswords9388 Nothing.
1Th 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first:
There are two ways of interpreting anything : the right way, the wrong way.
At this point we both agree.
When it says that Jesus shall shout with the voice of the archangel... it also says WITH the trumpet of God.
SO.. if Jesus shouting WITH the voice of the archangel means Jesus's voice IS the archangel, then Jesus voice is also a trumpet.
Now, Jesus is not a trumpet, therefore He is not an archangel either.
So that is the wrong interpretation.
Another interpretation is that they ALL shout at the same time.
Can they ? Yes they can and they will.
Rev 19:16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, KING OF KINGS, AND LORD OF LORDS.
Rev 19:17 And I saw an angel standing in the sun; and he cried with a loud voice, saying to all the fowls that fly in the midst of heaven, Come and gather yourselves together unto the supper of the great God;
I have already said this... but Jesus is on a horse, the angel shouting is not.
They are not the same.
BUT on the shouting all together, there is more.
When Joshua and his army entered Jericho, they came with a shout and a trumpet blast.
Sound similar? Should do, this is how Jesus (same name as Josh) will enter the world.
Jos 6:16 And it came to pass at the seventh time, when the priests blew with the trumpets, Joshua said unto the people, Shout; for the LORD hath given you the city.
So they all shouted.
So what if the Lord is shouting, the archangel is also shouting...all the angels are shouting too.
So what?
The bible mentions the head angel, as he is the leader of the angels.
Much like Trump may visit a country with his secretary of state.
Trump still is the boss.
Jesus still is Lord.
Michael knows that.
Shame you don't.
:-)
Jesus was indeed the begotten Son of God As a unique being according to Hebrews 1,2....different than angels of whom are many. Micheal was one of these angels.
Peace brother, the mystery is not to see the mistake that many do say that, Jesus is an angel, because it seems that Micheal was call Lord from the lips of Daniel. But the mysteries to see Michael not like the other created angels. Because the Bible does mention that God created the angels. But the Bible does not say the Michael was created. Seek and investigate this mystery. Keep in mind that this knowledge was revealed to us but not before the appointed time. 1 Corinthians 2:8 Which none of the princes of this world knew: for had they known it, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. Have fun searching the Bible every day!
@ Art Figueroa, Angel means messenger. The SDA believes that Michael is Jesus, but unlike the JWs, Adventists believe that Jesus is the Creator and He created all the angels.and everything. Jesus is the Son of God, He is God. I don't know but there are scriptures, that sure like it's possible. Praise the Lord
Well that is not what Revelation 10 shows
@@1stockdale159 Jesus is the Son of God almighty , and also He is God almghty...Jesus is his own father.
@@moisesbeyond Jesus is the Son of God, that doesn't make Him the Father. There are three manifestations in the one Godhead. There's only One God, and in that Godhead is The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit, which is God.
Actually, Emanuel means "God with us"
muhhamad hijab moment
GOD was with the nation of Israel by means of Jesus ministry right there in their land, for he said he came as his Father's representative.
Oh Ray, that bit in John where Jesus said "Before Abraham was, I am." - I don't know if you've ever seen the movie "Gospel of John" but I have to say that the guy who played the part of Jesus was absolutely fantastic when he quoted that line. If you've never seen it, go find a copy, its awesome - especially that part. Amazing acting all around, including those confronting Jesus.
The distinction in Hebrews 1 is more specific than "distinct from angels." It teaches that Jesus has greater authority than angels which would hardly have to be explained if Jesus was almighty God.
Dear friend - that is a valid point.
But that is forgetting a vital truth...
...The Son left His position of ONE with the Father and took on the nature of mankind. This is the bible message. There is no other message.
AS that message is true, having left all glory by taking on our nature, so the Father raised Him above all other names.
Read revelations, the Lamb and the Father are worshipped together, both receiving equal praise.
Jesus said to Honour Him as we honour the Father.
Qu: Do YOU honour Jesus as you honour the Father?
I say that respectfully and I don't mean to be patronizing. Friend, this is too serious to play intellectual games. Our souls are at stake.
If we do not believe Him when He said that "I AM HE", we will die in our sins.
This is dynamite - we owe it to ourselves to be MIGHTY sure before we deny the Son is Jehovah.
1) First and Last is the ONLY Lord God Jehovah
Isa 44:6 Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and *beside me there is no God*.
Do you agree?
Good... let's proceed.
Isa 48:12 Hearken unto me, O Jacob and Israel, my called; I am he; I am the first, I also am the last.
(He that is speaking is the First and the Last - Lord God Jehovah)
Isa 48:13 Mine hand also hath laid the foundation of the earth, and my right hand hath spanned the heavens: when I call unto them, they stand up together.
(He made all things - God made all things - this is true of Jesus too... )
Isa 48:14 All ye, assemble yourselves, and hear; which among them hath declared these things? The LORD hath loved him: he will do his pleasure on Babylon, and his arm shall be on the Chaldeans.
Isa 48:15 I, even I, have spoken; yea, I have called him: I have brought him, and he shall make his way prosperous.
(The voice speaking called Jacob - this is God)
Isa 48:16 Come ye near unto me, hear ye this; I have not spoken in secret from the beginning; from the time that it was, *there am I*: and now the Lord GOD, and his Spirit, *hath sent me*.
(The voice speaking - Jehovah - was sent from the Jehovah (Father) with the Holy Spirit)
So Jehovah sent Jehovah with the Holy Spirit?
How can this be?
Here is the answer - it comes from Gods own lips....
(who cares what men say)
HEAR OH ISRAEL... Our God is ONE (Echad: one in unity)
ONE in unity - as a man and a woman are ONE flesh.
Gen 2:24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one (ECHAD) flesh.
This... is the Image of God.... Says God - again !
Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in *our image*, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.
Be blessed bro
@@johnc4624
I don't think he was "one with the Father" in the Trinitarian sense. Rather they were one in purpose and course. (John 17:21,22)
Also Hebrews 1 puts a pattern before us in the categories being spoken of:
1) prophets (vs 1)
2) priests (vs 3C; 13 via allusion to Ps 110)
3) kings (5; 8-12)
4) Angels (4-7; 13,14)
Jesus belongs to all the categories but is the example par excellence in each one. Why would the writer intend to exclude him from the category of "angel" while not explicitly saying so? Especially when Christ is in each of the other categories?
@@eew8060 I completely agree.
Jesus and the Father DO agree.
John 17:21-22 talk about common purpose. But why stop reading there.. read the next verse.
Joh 17:23 I in them, and thou in me, that they may be made perfect in one; and that the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast loved me.
"I in them, and thou in me.."
"perfect one"
Is this talking only about being in agreement?
Friend - are you a married man? If your wife has the same business objective as her boss, would you object? Of course not.
She is expected to share the same purpose with her other colleagues. But what if she shared the same bed?
There is a difference between HAVING ONE accord and BEING ONE. You know that - I don't have to teach you about birds and bees. lol.
We don't just become ONE in opinion and purpose, but ONE new spiritual man in Christ. (As Adam and Eve became ONE carnal man, ONE in the flesh - As God and Jesus were ONE God, ONE in the spirit)
Understand the mystery.
Eve came OUT of Adam, she therefore became ONE flesh with Adam. The two became ONE because the two WERE ONE from the very beginning.
SO it is with the Father, Son and the Spirit.
Jesus always used simple natural things to explain extremely complex spiritual truths.
You can perceive GOD as a seed - ONE seed. (It is just a metaphor)
That ONE seed, becomes two parts : a root and a stem. The root is hidden underground whilst the stem breaks out into the open and bears fruit. The sap travels from the roots upwards towards the plant and gives it life.
The Father is the root, the Son is the plant, the Holy Spirit is the sap of life.
You have ONE plant, three parts.
Jesus is the Tree of Life, the Father is His source of Life. No man sees the Father, they see the Son. But you know a tree by its fruit, if you see Jesus, you see the Father.
It is the mystery of God and us being in His image. Eve was IN Adam all along.
Jesus came OUT of the Father, they WERE ONE and then they BECAME ONE again.
... that is v24
Joh 17:24 Father, I will that they also, whom thou hast given me, be with me where I am; that they may behold my glory, which thou hast given me: for *thou lovedst me before the foundation of the world*.
He was ONE with God before creation. As a stem and the root were ONE in the ONE seed (form of GOD). There is but ONE God, ONE seed ONE plant.
This is what John understood.
Joh 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
Joh 1:2 The same was in the beginning with God.
This is what I understand too.
So my friend - don't stop reading at v22.
I hope this gives you food for thought. Your soul is worth my time.
@@johnc4624
Yes. Its definitely talking about being "one" in purpose. In harmony. Otherwise you have believers being co-equal/co-eternal with God. So its in agreement of purpose.
Hebrews 1 shows that Christ is from one of the angelic sons of God
@@eew8060 God does not have many begotten Sons, He has an ONLY begotten Son. The rest were created. Jesus CAME from the Father... always having been IN the Father.
Everything else is a creation.
Joh 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time; the only begotten (monogenes) Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.
Gnosticism is not christian.
Jesus said so himself that in the time of Abraham "I AM" which means he could be on earth before his mother birthed him.
Known as Theophany,
THE ANGEL of the LORD !!!
Before abrham i am, not in the time of abrham.John 8 (KJV) -
58: Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
It is simple to explain this from my perspective...the reason why Micheal had the ability to rise Moses from the dead is because God was doing it through Micheal. Just as Jesus rose people from the dead through his disciples, and this is evident from the book of acts.
The scene in Courageous where the two cops are talking about Javier not realizing they were talking about a different Javier would be a great example of other religions having a different Jesus.
Hello, Ray Comfort and Team! I want to ask a question to you and anyone around here. I find this quote by Charles Spurgeon interesting.
"We read that Michael and his angels fought against the dragon and his angels, and the dragon was cast down. The fight is going on every day. Michael is the Lord Jesus, the only Archangel." -- Charles Haddon Spurgeon (Source: The Angelic Life, Sermon delivered on Nov. 22, 1868)
I'm not a JW, and I am in no way supporting JW's heresies, but let's think of the term "Archangel" like this: "Ruler of angels" or "Chief Messenger." Spurgeon, in his quote, implies that Jesus and Michael are the same, not taking away the deity from Christ. Here's the question: From this viewpoint, is there any possibility that Michael is another name for Jesus?
(By the way, I'm standing with reformed theology.)
God bless you in your ministry.
- Josh
Micheal is one of the chief princes. Michael is only above angels and Jesus above all.
Thank you for sharing truth, brothers!!
In the NWT they change Jesus' words from "Before Abraham was I AM" TO "...I have been."
Deceivers, JESUS warned us about them more than anything else !!
Context in John 8:58 shows their discussion was not about Jesus' identity as if he were God, but about his real age...How long he has existed because the people said "you are not yet 50 years of old, and yet you have seen Abraham?" So Jesus in reply gave statement about his age how long he has existed. "..before Abraham was, I have been".
@@roeltingzon758 what did Moses hear that God’s name was from the burning bush?
Why would Jesus say “ego eime.”? Does he have a grammar problem? His real age vs his deity is not a real distinction. Since he is answering their age question by saying, “I have always been.” Meaning he is not simply what they see in the flesh, a 30-ish year old human. He is and has always been before time began. And there is only One who has always been, that is the Great I Am, YAHWEH. Therefore, Jesus claimed externality and the eternal name of YAHWEH given to Moses at the burning bush, and the meaning was not lost on the Pharisees in the slightest.
Context doesn’t work the way you want it to.
@@DonicaTibbetts but the fact remains that nowhere in entire New Testament of the bible does Jesus make a statement saying that he is God Almighty or God in the flesh...its zilch & zero! That is perplexing given he had sufficent time (33 and half yrs) to give his identity as God by just exclaiming that he's God the father..it has to come our from his own mouth...the only confession Jesus ever makes of who he is can be found with his conversation with the woman by Jacob's well...he tells her straight up that he indeed is the promised Messiah the Jews had been expecting - he does not say anything about being a God-man or that he's God Almighty. Another event is when the Jews wanted to stone him as in John 10:25-31 because they mistakenly thought he - a man, was making himself to be God..a notion that Jesus sensed and their wrong attitude towards him, did not immediately claim to be God but rebutted them by citing their own scriptures of Psalms 82:6 which shows that even their human judges were addressed as 'gods' because they were bequeathed such authority & power from God himself and Jesus himself could rightfully be called a "Mighty God" or in Hebrew El' Gibbohr, someone who had power because he could perform miracles as a representative of God. But being enabled by Holy Spirit to do wonders of miracles did not mean Jesus was now God Almighty...in relation to his heavenly Father Jesus is a lesser god, a Mighty God but not God Almighty which alone applies to his Father. And so no Jesus did not claim to be God incarnate because the Jews knew he was just simply a man, but no ordinary man for Jesus was a perfect man with power, who was sinless and did not need to die. It would make no sense that Jesus as he was dying cried out: "Father! Forgive them, for they do not know what they are doing.." was he as God incarnate crying out to himself? And to who was he praying to when he was arrested in garden on that night? God does not need to pray at all...but we read that Jesus prayed...was he praying to himself? And if he was really God then his death was faked all a trick.
@@DonicaTibbetts and Jesus is a created being for he says in Revelation 3:14 that he is..."the beginning of the Creation by God. The king James bible says the same reading of that verse. Jesus was a direct creation of God.
Yes Bother, And it does not diminish His divinity at all. Praise God.
The Seventh day Adventist position is not that Jesus was ever an actual angel. But God from all eternity. But we need to ask the question still according to the position that it takes away from His divinity. Does Jesus becoming man (which is lower than the angels) take away from His divinity?
Excellent show! God bless you guys.
If Jesus Christ is Michael the Archangel why does God call Him Son and not an angel and all angels worship Jesus in Hebrews 1:5-6?
Because an Archangel is not an Angel, but leader of the Angels.
Well said. JWs always frame the debate regarding Michael's identity by assuming that "archangel" can only be an angel in the Hebrews 1:7 sense, and sadly most Christians take the bait and end up on the defensive. Archangel can be translated chief messenger, and Jesus himself is the chief messenger of the Gospel. Even if Michael turns out to be Christ, such a conclusion in no way detracts from His divinity nor does it "lower" Him to the status of a mere angel in the Hebrews 1:7 sense.
Amen. Jesus is not Michael the Archangel. Jesus is The God of Michael the Archangel.
In Daniel 10, Gabriel is telling Daniel why he was delayed (as Daniel spent 3 weeks fasting and praying). He says he was delayed by the prince of Persia (possibly a fallen angel). Dan. 10:13 "But the prince of the kingdom of Persia withstood me one and twenty days: but, lo, Michael, one of the chief princes, came to help me; and I remained there with the kings of Persia. 20 Then said he, Knowest thou wherefore I come unto thee? and now will I return to fight with the prince of Persia: and when I am gone forth, lo, the prince of Grecia shall come. 21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince."
He clearly says that Michael is ONE OF THE CHIEF PRINCES. That means there are others, and he names the prince of Persia and the prince of Grecia; and calls Michael the prince of your people (Israel). These princes obviously have spiritual dominion of principalities or governments.
Michael is Not JESUS, who is God; and the WORD who was there in the beginning at creations, according to John 1:1 “In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 The same was in the beginning with God. 3 All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.”
Yes but angels do not reign and rule over us as princes. The Bible says they are ministering spirits. Michael is a Prince and He reigns over us! Jesus is the Prince of Peace!
Heaven is God's throne... We enter heaven when we achieve righteousness of the Father in wisdom and understanding of Him
Jesus was GOD incarnate on earth, He is part of the Holy Trinity. He is God, He is not Michael. Michael is highly favored angel. And he also will probably be utilized in the coming last days.
It is very unlikely that Jesus is Micheal the Archangel....considering he is God.
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. - John 1:1-3
The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth. - John 1:14
Now ask yourself, is God an angel?
This what I needed to try and discuss with my son, who is a JW, about Jesus being both "a" God and also Michael the Arch Angel. I still have other issues that need to be clarified as well. I do not understand how my son can say what he does about Jesus and yet offer up a mealtime blessing in the name of Jesus, which he did in my presence. I am believing that something is changing inside and I continue to pray for God to pierce his heart and make an opening in his understanding of scripture.
all angels are called gods in the bible in the book of Psalms, also read 1 Corithians 8:5-6
Psalms 82:6 - where human judges in Israel are referred to as 'gods' but that they are not to be worshipped.
I read the JW explanation for “a God” and I get what they are saying in that the Word is Devine in a sense of importance. But still every single word should be translated letter for letter exactly as it was written in the first place. You don’t just assume you know what the writer is meaning and change it bc it makes more sense to you. There are so many scriptures I feel are pretty cut and dry and obvious. Like “God was manifest in the flesh”. Okay, so, God is Jesus. And after the resurrection when Jesus says : I’m not a spirit bc a spirit doesn’t have flesh and bone as do I”. It’s pretty plain and simple so how can you see that as anything other than a physical resurrection? It seems like people just make it more complicated than it is. I did the same thing until I learned to pray and ask God to show me the truth from lies and from my own opinions. It’s called discernment. He will show you. Don’t depend solely on what a “human” tells you it means. God Bless.
Yahuchanan: Yah has Favoured [“John”] 14:28 “You have heard how I [Yahusha] said to you, I go away, and come (again) to you. If you loved Me, you would rejoice, because I said, I go to the Father; for My Father [YAHUAH] is greater than I.”
Where exactly did the Anointed One [translated "Messiah"] teach anyone to worship Him or His mother?
Revelation 14:12 Here is the patience of the set-apart ones: Here are they that keep the Commandments of YAHUAH (יהוה) AND the faith of YAHUSHA (יהושע)
A video if your willing to learn more about what the bible says.
ua-cam.com/video/eIwRVdc4FfQ/v-deo.html
Some examples Gen 21:17-18, 22:11-12,15-18, Acts 3:25, Gen 16:7,13. Also Michael means one who is like God, Arch means Chief, angel means messenger from God. So it could fit together like this. Michael the Archangel is a messenger of God who is like unto God Himself.
Very profound answer, I could not explain it any better myself.
Michael the arch angel is not angel it means 1 like God and commander and creator of angels I believe Jesus is God and the arch angel
Praise God!
great show brothers,
David in Ireland
Thank you
I am thankful that you didnt listen to me but took it into consideration that the bible can interprete itself. I am also thankful that you didnt let your ego cloud your judgement.
Only a true Christian will ever admit he is wrong. With an attitude like that nothing will be hidden from you. God bless you and your endeavors- I too make mistakes ,that's why I use the bible to defend the bible. If you are ever interested in reasoning biblically,just let me know-will be glad to .
Indeed, and no I would say that it does not. The Bible is clear that Jesus became a human being and was yet still God. But it never indicates that Jesus became an angel or has the nature of an angel OR _was_ Michael the Archangel specifically. The SDA folks assume that when the Bible refers to Michael that this was actually Jesus appearing AS an angel, which is fine in theory I suppose but the Bible does not support that belief unless you jump through some pretty crazy hoops.
why even touch on this, "Is Jesus Michael the Archangel?" when it is the gospel of Jesus Christ that matter?
It matters because there are people who believe that Jesus is Michael the archangel. Until they learn better, they are lost individuals. Jesus stated in the 32nd verse of the 8th chapter of John, that ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free. Knowledge of the truth is the law of liberty.
@michelle louise , thank you for confirming what I knew was right. I was talking to one of my neighbors who is a shunned Jehovah's witness, who truly believes this. He even gave me scripture to read, which has nothing to do with his belief.
I'm just trying to tell you what the Bible says.Which is Michael is a different person than Jesus.Since Michael is an Archangel Jesus is God in human form who died for my sins and rose again on the third day.
I enjoyed your video It’s not only the Jehovah witness it’s also the 7 Day Adventist Have this false doctrine and have been mislead by pastors I have rebuked them kindly but need help to get through to them the End is nearing and they are good people 🙏🏾❤️🇮🇱
I see the Israeli flag are you an Israeli?
First of all, Michael the arch-angel being Jesus is not just a Jehovahs Witness doctrine. Most of the Protestant reformers believed this to be true.
Second, Angel means “messenger” and arch-angel means “leader of the “messengers”. It does not mean an angel or ”a created being”. Jesus is not a created being.
Third, Jesus is coming with the voice of the arch-angel and raise the dead. Only Jesus can raise the dead.
Fourth, Jesus is messiah the prince, the prince of princes. Most characters in the Bible were given name changes when their role changed. Lucifer, Abraham, Jacob, Peter, Paul, Judas, and Jesus. Michael was Jesus’ name before He became our messiah.
Only Jesus can raise the dead? Jesus has to ask the Father, and by His will will be done. Only God can save
We were all like God, before we became earth bound, fallen angels and creating our own image, replacing Father and Son with satan and lucifer
You mean only God and Jesus can save. They are one and the same. Jesus has the keys of life and death. He will come with the voice of the Archangel and raise the dead at the second coming.
We were never like God. God alone is immortal. We are mortal created beings. We are nothing like God, nor will ever be.
@@davidjohnson3095 second coming!! He comes in spirit with the father during baptisim. Without the light of the father we are dead living a life not created by the father. We die in our sins, and born again in the light of the Father, Jesus the comforter.
Yes all Glory to God
you are correct that I should not have inserted the word one. Can you help me with theses verses?"Gen 48:15,16And he blessed Joseph, and said, God, before whom my fathers Abraham and Isaac did walk, the God which fed me all my life long unto this day, Gen The Angel which redeemed me from all evil, bless the lads; and let my name be named on them, and the name of my fathers Abraham and Isaac; and let them grow into a multitude in the midst of the earth." Can an angel redeem? continued.
Peace brothers in Christ. Jesus is the verb, He is all the words that cometh out of the Father’s mouth. And that’s why He said” I am the true bread they came down from heaven. I am the truth.” Jesus has always been with God and he is God! And one day the Father got His words/(The Verve), and sat Him next to Him, and said “ I will be Father onto Him, and he will be Son on to Me“ Hebrews 1:5. Making Jesus, God that is visible. The name Micheal means ” whom like God” and the great mystery is that the Bible does not say that Micheal was created! Just like the mystery of Melchisedec! Yes I tell you my brother Michael is not an angel that was created! Daniel 10:16 And, behold, one like the similitude of the sons of men touched my lips: then I opened my mouth, and spake, and said unto him that stood before me, O my lord, by the vision my sorrows are turned upon me, and I have retained no strength.
Daniel 10:17 For how can the servant of this my lord talk with this my lord? for as for me, straightway there remained no strength in me, neither is there breath left in me.
Daniel 10:18 Then there came again and touched me one like the appearance of a man, and he strengthened me, - The one with the appearance of a man was Michael! Study this and you will see........ The truth! Michael it’s not an angel like the other created angels! Just like the angel from the book of Revelation 10, the One that put His feet on the water and on the land and cried out to God who lives forever! See the similarity! Have fun searching the truth every day! Love you all brothers!!!
I love the video, but you didnt touch on other verses about Jesus or Michael.
Here is one for instance, why is Jesus going to sit next to God, His right hand I think He said, as we are going to sit at His right.
I do believe Jesus is God in the flesh, but there is more to the story of Michael.
Just a thought: Does God love the Angels just as he loves man? Is it possible that Just as He became man to save man? That He may have done something similar to try to save the angels. I’m not saying this is in the Bible but it is an interesting thought. I believe that it is in God’s nature to save even if it were possible satan himself. Although I don’t believe that they are redeemable now. But, perhaps before they were cast out of heaven.
I've was brought up to believe Jesus is God and Michael is just an Archangel but I have known actual Christians who could make pretty decent-sounding arguments that Michael as well as the rider of the first horse in Revelations was Christ. If either Michael or the first of the four horsemen turns out to be Christ, it won't shake my own faith in any way since these are not nearly the most essential things to know when relating to Christ.
I have been asked before to read these places you reference and they seem pretty thin. When the angel spoke to Abraham he said "saith the Lord". The Bible is quite clear that we are not to worship angels. How do you explain Hebrews chapter 1, or Colossians 2:18, and Revalation 22:9. Don't get me wrong, I am not trying to discourage a follower of Christ, but I see a danger in your position. P.S. I assume the blue is a link. Can you tell me how to do that?
Okay well I’m also listening to Christians who deny the 4th commandment If you choose to misunderstand that you just might choose to misunderstand more to
Does not God receive more glory condescending to become man as it reveals His true Character, that being God He humbled himself and became a servant? This unfathomable love has broken my heart time and time again. Do we think that we are better than the Angels, and that He would not have made similar provisions for them?
One of my friends (ex co-worker) tried to make me believe this but I didn't buy it. She was a Seventh Day Adventist (before she passed away)
Tim, help me understand cotrectly because maybe the SDA position on this was explained better to you. Are they saying that Jesus is an angel (in other words less than God, like the JW) or are they actually saying that the angel is Jesus/God? Because they are not the same thing though both heretical and blasphemous views.
Birke Thaumüller-Grobler from my understanding, they are saying that archangel is a position of authority and that an archangel isn’t a physical angel. This is how they justify Michael being another name for Jesus.
The position is that Michael is not an angel in the first place. Your confusing the position that I take. and I also never said God is not over the angels. Are you just trying to win an argument or are we looking for clearity of position?
GBY all, I've only recently started watching you guys.
👍👍!!!
I did notice one thing.
You mentioned several different beliefs and the different ways they look at Jesus. Non of witch were the one that wanted to stone Jesus.
The assignment is, show us the way the Jew's saw Him then and the way they see Him now.
😀 thx n God bless
Yr brother in Christ
Vicente
Seventh Day Adventists believe Michael is Jesus as well right? I listen to the Forerunner Chronicles a lot here on youtube but I realize he is a SDA. Are SDA considered Christians? They sure seem to be.
Johnny Sahn Yes SDA’s are Christians moreover protestants.
Come on gentlemen,
Mark Spencer
was (and still is) excellent !
Why do we go to church on Sunday?
What about the 4th commandment?
Because we shall work 6 days a week but the 7 which is sunday is to keep it holy for our Lord our God. This is called Sabbath day, and according to the calendet we use that would fall on sunday. However we can still go to church fridays, saturday, everyday we can worship our God, but he should be the center and be in our memory. I feel that sunday is perfect because mostly everyone gets break from jobs sundays. So we should all be able to attend a service.
Melvin Hernandez Sunday is the 1st day
Melvin Hernandez in fact in Latin Sabado is Saturday looks and sounds like Sabbath to me
Because the law was given to the Jews.
Read Galations
I understand, and agree. In those cases you refer to, He is referred to as the "Angel of the Lord" not "Michael". I was merely saying that scripture doesn't support the SDA position that Michael is really Jesus incognito. They came to their conclusion with extra-biblical logic, or just conjecture.
I'm having a hard time moving forward. Thank you for continuing to dialog and your patients. But I need a place to anchor from. I need to know that we are listening to each other. So once again, what is it that you think that I believe about Jesus and Michael? do you think that i believe that Michael is and angel in the literal sense (in other words a created being).
ua-cam.com/video/eIwRVdc4FfQ/v-deo.html
A video with more scripture talking about this same subject.
Plz check it out.
It should also be noted that Jesus has a habit of "guest-staring in his own movie" from time to time, appearing as Melchiszidek, the "angel" whose name was "Wonderful" who appeared to Samson's parents, and the man who confronted Joshua prior to the attack on Jericho, to name a few. It's harder to see Him taking on the form of an angel since He is clearly a MAN, in addition to being God, of course.
Just looking for some teaching But finding it so hard to keep track and concentrate in this particular Broadcast
Correction: John 1:1 says in Greek: In the beggining was the word and the word was with the god and god was the word. This Syntax is right in Greek. It doesn't say that the word was the god clearly. Please consider this. Trinitarian here.
The teaching comes from the Father and His written Word. Ignore all man made theology and seek the Truth for yourself.
I have said, Ye are gods; and all of you are children of the most High.
Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.
Matthew 18:10-11 KJV
Jesus is a child of God just as you are, we are all angels fallen away from heaven earthbound.
We are to be in the image of God, Jesus was that image, just how God made us all.
@@achildofthelight4725 That's what I am doing. I am searching the truth for myself. No, we are not angels. The angels in the Bible are distinct from humans. Read the Apocalypse, written by John. Some angels are depicted there. Satan is not a human but a spirit. Angels are not humans but spirits. We are humans fallen away from heaven earthbound. I agree with the last sentences but Jesus is not a child of God like us. It's right in front of you in John 1:1. He existed with the Father in the beggining and it is nowhere written in the Bible that he was created since he is the word of god.😉Note this, he came as a human with a virgin birth, he was not only human since he kept saying he was the son of God making himself equal with the father.
@@babisbabinos8075 did you over look matthew verse I have you?
@@achildofthelight4725 1) You didn't answer my arguments because I am right.😁😅 Or did you overlook them?
2) Of cource I didn't overlook the verses you sent me. Let me explain the Matthew abstract to you. He said that we humans are gods (creators) and children of the most high. He didn't include himself as being one of the Father's creation. He explains that even while he is on earth, the angels who are in heaven are worshipping the Father. And then he said he came to save that which was lost. Us! Jesus came as a man to save us. And he expressed that with the ressurection after his crucifiction. Also nowhere here he says that he or the people around him are angels. He and the Father are one. Nobody else has said that. And since the Father isn't an Angel, so does Christ.
@@babisbabinos8075 Be not forgetful to entertain strangers: for thereby some have entertained angels unawares.
Hebrews 13:2 KJV
An angel is a messenger. Someone who hears Gods voice and will have a message for us. That could be anyone who is living on the earth
I'm not j.w. but wanna ask about the Angel of The Lord in the o.t. that we all believe that incarnate as angel but act as God Himself?
Jesus is god in the flesh manifest through the blood of the lamb and god is the host(vessel)of heaven and omnipresent,so god is not only michael but all angels, all saints;all prophets;all knowing, all powerful and totally righteous.
And the quizzlings can quiz all they want but all they do is condemn themselves.
Now can you explain to me with scripture ,Why is Christ called a prince,a mediator?
Plz do it with scripture-i dont want your opinion -its not legit.
Explain to me who"s voice will raise the dead -Christ or another archangel, with scripture-once again.
Explain to me why the Bible says Michael and HIS angels in ONE instant ,but in over 10 places its the son of man or God and HIS angels.
Now let the fun begin...
Here is a reminder to use the bible it can defend itself.
Amen, Jesus is God, always has been God, and always will be God. Some Christians believe that Jesus is also the master of angels. I believe that as well. The Bible does not say that Michael was a created being. There is a difference from believing that Jesus is Michael and the belief that Michael was just another angel (created being). There are many examples in Bible where it appears that the Bible writers use the word angel to describe and encounter with God and it wasn't just and angel.
Agreed, He did not become less than God When he became a man. Lets make sure our thought process is consistent. And also understand that many that say that Jesus is Michael are not saying that He is or ever was an actual angel. So following through with the logic, If becoming man (which is according to the Bible lower than the angels) did not make less than God, why would saying He is over all the angels (which according to the Bible Michael is) make Him less than God? Answer directly please?
Praise God, and thank you for you're work, Michael and Jesus are not the same being! Michael in terms of the second advent of Christ, is comparable to John the Baptist, at the first advent, John the Baptist, sent ahead to prepare the path and prepare the way, for the coming of the Lord.
and reading Jude 1:9 in proper context illustrates this and shows this perfectly, read if properly, read Jude 1:8-10, now here it says, " Yet even Michael the Arch Angel, dare not cast a railing judgment against Satan when arguing with him about the body of Moses, he only rebukes Satan in the name of the Lord" While Jesus name above all names, every knee shall bow, not only could he simply cast Satan away by his own power, but also he had the Authority, to give the power of his true pure Holey name to his true children, and by his name any with true faith can cast out demons in and by the power of the name of Jesus! nowhere in scripture does it say anyone can cast out demons by the name of Michael! Michael is an Angel, a created being! the holey messenger and high general of the all the Angels, but not Jesus! Jesus is God!
these guys are great
I continue to send topics to the onthebox email, but I never hear you all talking about it or get a response that you all have received it.
Did the Watchtower come up with the notion that Jesus was also the Archangel?
Well, here are a number of Baptist, Methodist, Calvinist and Judaic commentaries which predate the existence of the Watch Tower Society.
Gill's Exposition of the Entire Bible
"Yet Michael the archangel,.... By whom is meant, not a created angel, but an eternal one, the Lord Jesus Christ; as appears from his name Michael, which signifies, "who is as God": and who is as God, or like unto him, but the Son of God, who is equal with God? and from his character as the archangel, or Prince of angels, for Christ is the head of all principality and power; and from what is elsewhere said of Michael, as that he is the great Prince, and on the side of the people of God, and to have angels under him, and at his command, Daniel 10:21. So Philo the Jew (o) calls the most ancient Word, firstborn of God, the archangel; Uriel is called the archangel in this passage from the Apocrypha:Jude 1:9"
biblehub.com/commentaries/jude/1-9.htm
Joshua 5:13 and, behold, there stood a man over against him;
not a mere man, nor a created angel in an human form, but a divine Person in such a form, even the Son of God, who frequently appeared in this manner to the patriarchs; as is clear from the worship paid unto him by Joshua, by his calling him Lord, and owning himself to be his servant; and by the ground on which he stood, being holy through his presence, as well as by his title, the Captain of the Lord's host. Jarchi says, this is Michael, which, if understood of Michael the uncreated angel, the head of all principality and power, is right, who is always meant by Michael, whenever he is spoken of in Scripture; and so this is interpreted by the ancient Jews F11 of the Angel the Redeemer:
www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/gills-exposition-of-the-bible/joshua-5-13.html
Geneva Study Bible
Joshua 5:14 And he said, Nay; but [as] captain of the host of the LORD am I now come. And Joshua fell on his face to the earth, and g did worship, and said unto him, What saith my lord unto his servant?
(g) In that Joshua worships him, he acknowledges him to be God: and in that he calls himself the Lords captain he declares himself to be Christ.
www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/geneva-study-bible/joshua/joshua-5.html
Matthew Henry Commentary on the Whole Bible
Joshua 5:13 He appeared to him as a man, but a considerable man, and one fit to be taken notice of. Now, 1. We have reason to think that this man was the Son of God, the eternal Word, who, before he assumed the human nature for a perpetuity, frequently appeared in a human shape.
www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/matthew-henry-complete/joshua/5.html
Wesley's Explanatory Notes
Joshua 5:14 As captain - I am the chief captain of this people, and will conduct and assist thee and them in this great undertaking. Now this person is not a created angel, but the son of God, who went along with the Israelites in this expedition, as their chief and captain. And this appears,
By his acceptance of adoration here, which a created angel durst not admit of, Revelation 22:8 ,9.
Because the place was made holy by his presence, Joshua 5:15 , which was God's prerogative, Exodus 3:5 .
Because he is called the Lord, Heb. Jehovah, Joshua 6:2 . My Lord - I acknowledge thee for my Lord and captain, and therefore wait for thy commands, which I am ready to obey
www.biblestudytools.com/commentaries/wesleys-explanatory-notes/joshua/joshua-5.html
Jewish Encyclopedia
"Similarly in Aramaic, "son of man" is the usual designation for "man," and occurs in the inscriptions in Syriac, Mandaic, Talmudic, and other dialects (see Nathanael Schmidt in Cheyne and Black, "Encyc. Bibl." iv. 4707-4708). In Dan. vii. 13, the passage in which it occurs in Biblical Aramaic, it certainly connotes a "human being." Many see a Messianic significance in this verse, but in all probability the reference is to an angel with a human appearance, perhaps Michael."
www.jewishencyclopedia.com/articles/13913-son-of-man
wow IMJ1000 that is an awsome reply to show our oppossers that we were not alway the ones who came up with the fact that Jesus is in fact Michael the Archangel. at 1st 4:16 Jesus whom they claim is God could have descended with the voice of God , but no, he came with the voice of an Archangel which shows he is using Michael's voice to raise the dead just like at John 5:28 that those who hear the voice of Jesus will come to life just like they hear the voice of the archangel and come to life.Irrefutable.
Obviously not IMJW but what does that change, they are the only Christian faith preaching this truth worldwide, nobody else fulfils prophecy that I can see. If I misunderstood your meaning I apologise in advance.
+MrHawkwind posted, The WTS is"the only Christian faith preaching this truth worldwide..."
You are correct. The Witnesses preach this doctrine.
So does Judaism, and it has done so since long before the birth of Jesus.
Jewish Encyclopedia
"Similarly in Aramaic, "son of man" is the usual designation for "man," and occurs in the inscriptions in Syriac, Mandaic, Talmudic, and other dialects (see Nathanael Schmidt in Cheyne and Black, "Encyc. Bibl." iv. 4707-4708). In Dan. vii. 13, the passage in which it occurs in Biblical Aramaic, it certainly connotes a "human being." Many see a Messianic significance in this verse, but in all probability the reference is to an angel with a human appearance, perhaps Michael."
The Jews just don't believe that Jews is the Son of man. Those who did believe such, became Christian.
John 4:22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews.
At first, one had to be a Jew, in order to become a Christian. Baptism was limited to Jews, as per the promise that God made to Abraham that his decedents would be a nation of kings and priests.
Acts 24:14, But I admit that I follow the Way, which they call a cult. I worship the God of our ancestors, and I firmly believe the Jewish law and everything written in the prophets.
Christians were Torah following Jews who followed, "the Way". They were just Jews, who had accepted Jesus as Messiah. No change in beliefs, yet. Pure Judaism. Unitarian. They followed the law, recited the Shema and met at the synagogue.
Act 10:28, He told them, "You understand how wrong it is for a Jew to associate or visit with a gentile. But God has shown me that I should stop calling anyone common or unclean
Then, under inspiration, Peter opened Christianity to the gentiles.
Act 15:5, But some believers from the party of the Pharisees stood up and said, "The gentiles must be circumcised and ordered to keep the Law of Moses." 6 So the apostles and the elders met to look into this claim.
Once the gentiles were allowed into Christianity, a problem arose. The Jews were following the law of Moses and the gentiles were not. Remember, the Shema which the Jews recited daily. They understood God, as they still do to be one God of one person.
Act 15:28, For it seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us to lay on you no greater burden than these necessary things: 29 that you abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood, and from things strangled, and from fornication; from which, if you keep yourselves, you shall do well. Be prospered.
The issue was resolved, by no longer requiring Christians to follow the law of Moses, following the law of Christ, instead. At this point, Christianity became a new and separate religion, distinct from Judaism
Hellenistic pagan personalities, holidays and doctrines came later.
GOD the father JESUS the son 🙏
That is truth. Jesus is God and our only savior. But God can become human, So why he cant transform himself like an angel..Read Luke 9. The mount of Transfuguration..Luke 9:29As He prayed, the appearance of His face was altered, and His robe became white and glistening.
Everything is posible for God. He can become flesh, So why he cant look or transform as an Angel?
you can't get no clearly than this, JESUS IS LORD
Yes Jesus is Lord to the Glory of God the Father which trinitarians always leave out this fact. God made him both Lord and Saviour.act 2:36 " King James Bible
Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ.Philip 2:11 " New International Version
and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father>
Jesus is not LORD but Lord small letters. King james _psalsm 110:1 confirms that
10 The LORD said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool"
NOTICE Jesus is Lord not LORD as your statement shows .The truth is always the truth my friend hope you can see it .
Jesus is the Angel of the LORD in the OT because in Hebrew it really means Messanger of Yahweh. He was a distinct person from the Father yet was one with Him in essence and being and He is also the eternal God. One God three persons is clealry seen in the Ot. The Angel of the LORd is the preincarnate Jesus Christ. Thats why Monah said we have seen God- Judges 13:3-23. When we see Jesus we see God because 1. He is God 2. He is everying the Father is, the exact representaion of the Father.
For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.
LOL-bring with him the voice of the archangel? IS GOD GOD?
Does my GOD need the voice of an angel to raise the dead. that is the worst comment on biblical reasoning ive heard in ages...
John 5:28 Marvel not at this: for the hour is coming, in the which all that are in the graves shall hear HIS voice. You fail hard.
there shall be a time of trouble, such as never was since there was a nation even to that same time: and at that time thy people shall be delivered, every one that shall be found written in the book.(who can stand up for us, deliver us -can a mere angel ?)
2 daniel 10:21 But I will shew thee that which is noted in the scripture of truth: and there is none that holdeth with me in these things, but Michael your prince.(who is OUR prince of Peace?)
more...
This is why it is wise to use the bible to interprete itself-
Isaiah 42:8 I am the LORD: that is my name: and my GLORY will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.
If michael was not God, then we would have another created being sharing God's glory,and many biblical text would be contradicting themselves..
eg.romans 1:25 Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the CREATURE more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen
AND ALOT MORE...!
Starts @ 13m 30 sec........
Take heed that ye despise not one of these little ones; for I say unto you, That in heaven their angels do always behold the face of my Father which is in heaven. For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.
Matthew 18:10-11 KJV
We are all angels, children of God. Jesus was the chosen one to lead us back to the Father, who was exactly the way we were made in the beginning, the image of God.
Since Jesus was raised above all of us, it's only fitting, JW's have some truth behind their theology.
Yes, this verse is indicating that the Lord is coming with a Shout, and he will bring with him the voice of the Archangel, please tell me....where does this indicate Jesus as being the archangel Micheal? Could it not be saying that he is bringing archangels with him?
Amen my brother,I have given ample reasons yet they strain a gnat and swallow a camel...
ArchAngel Michael-mediator for angels
Emmanuel -mediator for man-
Most dont study so they fail to realize -the entire bible prophesy of Christ. I Am Sda and that is not an issue any adventist should have, unless they are not studying..
1 Corinthians 6 (KJV) - 1ይ ቆረንቶስ
3: Know ye not that we shall judge angels? how much more things that pertain to this life?
wasn't aware that anyone really knew how to pronounce His name correctly, there are no vowels, it becomes all speculation. Main point of Him giving a name is to relate His character or His nature. Jehovah Witness believed they are saved because they use that name. This presupposes that Hebrew is only be used when speaking about God. This is a human language. God uses human language to speak to us. God didn't choose Abraham because of the language he spoke. continued.
The answer is simple, Michael is just another name for Jesus before He was born as a man. Since all Christians believe that Jesus existed before He was born a man it stands to reason that the Bible would actually talk a little bit about His preexistence, right?
Well, it does and it's all through out the Old Testament. It's when the OT talks about the Angel of the LORD and Michael. FaithAndLogic did a good summary of all the similarities between Michael, the Angel of the LORD and Jesus. So to make it clear, you can believe that Michael is the name Jesus was referred by before He became a man without believing that Jesus is a created being. No, Jesus is the eternal God who has always existed and created everything. Michael is just the name He is referred to before He became a man.
I dont like to put ppl on the spot, but The truth must be revealed-you have two choices.
1-Acknowledge that hrist is michael
2-Acknowledge that michael is a created angel who can raise the dead-
and if you chosse number 2 -( I know you want to) -BLASPHEMY
Again only God can raise the dead,If a created being can do it with his voice-we have a serious problem.
Plz use the bible to interprete itself,because when you try to use your wisdom you fail.
The dead in Christ rise from the dead in the same way that Christ rose from the dead - the Spirit of God within. Christ bestows upon all the Father's children His same power. The angel's trump is just the outwardly sign. This is similar to Jericho...it wasn't the trumpets that brought the walls down...it was God's power. The trumpets were just the outward sign.
You know, this is an interesting topic (the video). I once met a couple who was Seventh Day Adventist, and they also insisted that Jesus was Michael the Archangel. When I pointed out the same thing Ray said here that this would take away the divinity of Jesus, they said Oh, no we still think Jesus is God, but that in scripture where Michael appears, that was really Jesus. Um, wow ok well that's really weird and I don't agree, but its definitely another spin on the Michael thing.
The name "Michael" does NOT mean One who is like God as you say,... The name "Michael" actually means, "Who is like God?".
The name Michael again, is a question, and the question is the meaning, "Who is like God?". And the answer is found in many places such as Exodus 15:11 "Who among the gods is like you, O LORD? Who is like you--majestic in holiness, awesome in glory, working wonders?"
Hebrews 1:14 "Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?"
Ella the Angel of the LORD in the OT is God. Look at the scriptures. Who appeared to Moses in the burning bush and said I am who I am. The Angel of the LORD. Who did Monah say she saw when she saw the Angel of the LORD. God. He is the preincarnate Jesus Christ. Yes Jesus is not a creation He is the eternal God. I know that.
Michael is the Archangel we already clarified that.
Yahusha is The Word of YAHUAH made flesh, and through Him; that is The Word of YAHUAH everything that is was brought into existence.
YAHUAH [whose name means who is, was, will be] is our Father; the Creator of the Universe and everything in it.
Yahusha [whose name means Yah is (our) Salvation] is His Son and those who deny Him will be denied in front of YAHUAH and His mal'akym ["angels"] and those who practice lawlessness are liable to hear the words, Depart from Me, you who work lawlessness.
Michael was THE archangel, that doesn't take away from the "deity".
1. I do not claim the word became flesh, that is right from the bible itself, Gospel of John to be specific. And your right, the word was something else before, but does that indicate that he was micheal the archangel? that is a major assumption, i hope you realize that.
Who stood for the angels? God, obviously since it says that God threw/kicked lucifer out of the garden.
Micheal should be on the cross other then Jesus? that is absurd and that is not my argument at all.
Ofcourse Jesus is Michael.
That is how he defeats satan.
Don't overthink it.
Who else would defeat satan, other than Christ.
Jesus does not mean Jehovah. The name means Jehovah saved. Are you telling me that Joshua from the old testament is also God? And my brother, God did not change Xerxes name. Please answer this directly Did Jesus become less than God when He literally became a man?
sorry, don't know why it is blue. I understand your concern also. one could start believing that Jesus is not God or that He was created. I do not believe that. Niether would I be discouraged, thank you for being concerned though. My faith is in Christ and I'm ok with being wrong. I just trust HIm as He continues to lead me.
you sould re-examine. There are many names for Jesus. The name Jesus was only usesd once He came as a man. Other examples of different names used for the same person are Jacob=Israel, Saul =Paul, how about persian kings. Xerxes and Ahasuerus same person. What did Jesus say His name was at the burning bush? What was the name God used for Himself in Creation or in the Duet 6:4? acording to what He wants to reveal about Himself He uses different names. revealing different aspects of His Nature.
Im not one who likes to argue senseless arguments-
you say-"So i do not see how it is possible that Micheal can be God"
But can you refute the biblical claims with scripture? I thought that it was only atheist who didnt see?
anyways-plz explain to everyone here-
1Thess 4:16 For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a SHOUT, with the voice of the ARCHANGEL, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first: plz explain.
Somehow I think you guys haven't answered the question. Rather u you went off tangent instead of examining the real question!
Jesus IS NOT A CREATED BEING!!! Michael is an Angel and Jesus is GOD!!!
You can't say that Jesus and Michael are the same.It is like saying Greg and George are the same person.You see the Bible talks Michael and Jesus but they were two different people.The Bible does not talk about Samson being Goliath it does not have any people being different people.It has people changing names but never having multiple names at one time.If you say Jesus was Michael you are taking away His deity and saying He was just an Archangel.Either way you are taking away His deity.
The SDA position is not that Michael the archangel was ever an angel, but that it is more of a title. And in my limited capacity it seems the case is not as weak as I once thought. Jesus is refered to as coming with the shout of the Angel. That one small clue is just a starting point. But made me question if it was possibly refering to Jesus. If we dissagree I'm ok with that as long as people understand that I don't believe that Jesus was ever created. That to my understanding would blasphemy.
Psalms 138:2: “For You have magnified Your word above all Your name,
Again- John 17:17 “Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth.
What do you gather from those two text my friend?
Think like this-you have a son,or a friend,who does not listen to you,your words. Even if that friend knows your secret childhood closet name-why should you respond to them?They can call till their throat runs dry,-
YHWH, Yaweh,yashua,El shaddai, jehovah, etc means nothing if we dont listen to him.