The video says the the 'Guard' would tell passengers which station it was - in fact it was probably the 'Gateman' who travelled on the 'balcony' to open and close the gates at each station to allow passengers to alight & embark - no power door in those days.
Ah, I can explain the issues with the observatory as I work in that field. As the trains run and pick up power from the power supplies they induce a magnetic field. The kind of magnetic instrumentation needed to make accurate measurements of the Earth's magnetic field over time will pick that field up, even at very long distance. We still have that problem today when we do field measurements, and the electromagnetic interference specifications on railways are a lot stricter than in the early 20th century. Eventually the trams and tube caused so many problems that they had to move the astronomical observatory to Herstmonceux near Hastings and the Magnetic Observatory from Kew to Eskdalemuir in the Scottish Borders.
I've been to Herstmonceux! I was at a LARP event there in August 2019, (basically Hogwarts in real life.) It's a lovely place, although I spent half the time feeling miserable (not great when you've spent a fortune to get there and months looking forward to it, as I decided I was going in 2018.) The rest of the time was fun, and at least I can say I did it. 🙂
Magnetic measurements continued at Greenwich until WW2 when the magnetic and time departments were moved to Abinger in Surrey. The big problem the London Tramways caused to the Royal Observatory at Greenwich was the Power Station by the river. The hot air from the chimneys disturbed the observations of stars on the North transit. The Greenwich meridian runs through the power station - some of the chimneys are in the Eastern Hemisphere and the rest in the west.
There's a railway line in Japan - the Tsukuba express, which runs to the north-east of Tokyo - which switches from DC to AC for the outer portion of the line so that geomagnetic measurements by the Japan Meteorological Agency aren't affected by interference at one its labs near to the line. So dual-voltage AC/DC trains are used for services that run the whole line and DC only trains are used for the DC portion (the DC portion is the inner portion of the line on the Tokyo end so requires a higher frequency of trains).
I was going to say that as I worked at Kew Observatory in the 60s with my now wife. She also worked at Eskdalemuir. Visited there once and going round the grounds to look at teh instruments, we had to remove anything metal we were wearing. We were told it was the trams in Richmond causing the issues. The building at Kew is now a dwelling - anyone got £1m to spare to buy it?
23 and 24 Lenister Gardens were demolished to make way for the railway between Bayswater and Piddington; façades were then erected in their place to give the impression that there were still buildings there, which are still around today.
Windowless carriages in a tube proved unpopular? Who'd have thunk it? Maybe Elon Musk should have visited the London Transport Museum before he started all that Hyperloop bollocks.
He dug a tunnel and is running cars through it. There are plans to make the cars bigger, and even run them in groups. Truly a revolution in urban transportation.
@@billpugh58 Exactly the sort of thing you'd expect from somebody who has no real experience in engineering or dealing with real-world consequences. Like having people inside a vacuum chamber where loss of vacuum means pretty much instant death. And the funniest thing is that the actual capacity, in terms of passenger-miles/hour, is less than a conventional high-speed railway, so it doesn't even improve performance.
Despite having the right idea, the Liverpool Overhead Railway ended up being torn up. It's a rather tragic story which you should at the very least look into.
IIRC, from memory of E. L. Ahrons writings, fireboxes suitable for coal came along around 1860-1865, so coke was the fuel until then. I need to check this, as I suffered disbelief at the realisation, but imagine the impact of the change from a smokeless fuel at the time.
@@Tevildo You are correct but Midland Railway historians claim Kirtley devised his own arch design, and it does appear to have been superior to the earlier American design, cheaper to install and more durable. I wonder what he knew of the earlier design.
Coke was still the fuel on the Metropolitan even after that, because it burns cleaner. I mean, you've still got carbon monoxide and carbon dioxide, but at least no sulfur dioxide.
@@SynchroScore what did/do coke works do with the sulphur? Was it just sent to atmosphere, or was a way devised to capture it and use it for other purposes?
It's interesting that no matter the technology the S curve of development still applies and a lot of early stuff becomes redundant when speed of progress builds up.
An overview of the early Underground EMUs would be great (anything pre-Standard Stock). If required, perhaps split it into two videos, one for sub-surface and one for deep-level.
The Royal Observatory at Greenwich has a lot to answer for. They insisted the trams had double trolley poles instead of earth return. Until the 1940s when it was all proved a nonsense with everything else going on.
An excellent piece as ever, but... "Swap a broken down locomotive for another." Why would you replace a defective loco with another defective loco? He asks in all innocence. 😉😂
May I mention the relatively little known Giant's Causeway, Portrush and Bush valley Rly and Tmy. This was electrified to Dr Siemens system (the only working one) and opened in 1882. Power, a nightmare, was ingenious using an installation at Salmon's Leap to provide a hydro electric supply. The tale is told in A History of the British Steam Tram vol 6 pp 53-56. Steam was used as a supplement for the area where electrics were not allowed......the opposite to the Ubahn!!
@@ubergeekian Nonsense. LOL! Underground stations *are* railway stations in tunnels. What else are they? Stand on the platforms of underground stations, then look both ways. What do you see? Read up on the Mersey Railway, that later became a part of Merseyrail. Merseyrail was expanded in the 1970s with additional tunnelling in the centre's of Liverpool and Birkenhead. One third was cancelled by Thatcher when under construction. Miles of tunnel and trackbed still await trains and rails. A 6-platform underground parkway station at Broad Green was shelved - men were about to put shovels in the ground. An underground burrowing junction was built under the centre, which is still not fully used. If it was above ground on flyovers it would finished and used by now. But out of sight, out of mind. The first _deep_ underground stations were in Liverpool. London's were near the surface being cut & cover. Now you know.
@@johnburns4017 There are more now, but an underground railway system is far more than a tunnel with a station in it. The Mersey Railway system as built was a perfectly normal railway with a couple of miles of tunnel containing two stations. It was not in any sense an underground railway system, which is why no histories of such things include it. It would be like calling the Kingsway Tram tunnel and the end of the Liverpool Overhead "underground railways". Congratulations on getting a grievance out of it.
The City & South London railway was not designed for electric traction, it was an after thought The cable installer contractor went bust. The Liverpool Overhead Railway was the first metro to be conceived and designed from the outset using electric traction. Also using electric light signals. And as mentioned, the first EMUs. The Mersey Railway, now a part of Merseyrail metro, is interesting, especially the tunnel. The tunnel drainage water was used to extract the heat from it using heat pumps, to heat and cool an office block in Liverpool - _in the 1970s._ Eco before eco. The first group of stations on the Mersey Railway were all below ground level, either in cuttings, or fully underground. James St in Liverpool and Hamilton Squ, Birkenhead were the first *deep* underground stations. Two interesting railways that are really worth a vid.
At 5:56 I was worried about the exposed contacts on the massive rheostat-shaped widow-maker, but you put my mind at rest when you explained that it used 450v DC...
Unlike AC that throws you off, you tend to hang on to DC: after a while you start smelling like bacon cooking! On tube trains there is a wooden pole provided for pushing people off live rails. Alternatively you can risk using the shorting bar across the current rails to try to trip the relevant circuit breaker: however this does not always work. Far better to pinch the two bare wires together that run in the tunnels in such a position that the train operator can lean out of a cab side window to do so: this also trips the circuit breaker. These wires are also a direct telephone system to the service controller: you just need to connect the 'tunnel telephone' headset across them using the attached 'croc clips'. I'll shut up now.
@@caramelldansen2204 a widow maker is anything deadly, I believe. (Edit: I looked it up just in case and it’s specifically a deadly _machine,_ but of course I was already thinking in terms of machinery…)
@@kaitlyn__L In 150 years our descendants will probably be laughing at us seeing these comments while cruising around in an electrically-powered spaceship to their holiday destination on Mars "Oh, those people of the olden days..."
I believe the Army & Navy just bought the plain maps and printed their location on them. This one is the best example in the collection of the London Transport Museum, so it's the one used for all the on-line images.
@@Tevildo I see. As it appears to be the only place of interest marked, and with a large and conspicuous red circle, I assumed they had paid to be included.
It's a great shame that the only bit of it still existing is stuffed and mounted in a museum. It would have been such an asset to the waterfront, linking what are becoming fashionable living areas with the main tourist & shopping ones; not to mention being a great tourist attraction in its own right.
The shot from the window at 3:23 is actually quite nice. Lots of colour and it's well balanced. I'll need at least 2 memory cards for photos of the Underground and all its features and scenery when/if I ever do get to London. 2 major stations will be Paddington and Baker street. I work in a library - can you tell? I love your history lessons almost as much as I love anything with wheels/rails and an engine.
Ask and ye shall receive. Type "Liverpool Overhead Railway" in the UA-cam search and you will find a bunch of videos on the system, including archival footage. 😆
@@delurkor Yes, much of which I have seen before. Would like something with a 'modern' feel to it and delving into the whys and wherefores for a replacement. It could be done! We used to go to Liverpool a lot when I was just a small child, but sadly I cannot remember it. New Brighton was the main destination having crossed the Mersey on the ferry. Which bring us to a song. . . No.
So my typical Austrian Friday as a an ex London Transport British gent consists of a fine beer an oven ready pizza and a superb episode from Jagos history class... And class it is, thank you again sir for a splendid episode... 😊😊👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽
This is the reason modern electrical distribution uses AC. Transformers can step up AC to very high voltage, which has very little power loss over hundreds of miles, then back to lower voltage at the destination. Transformers don't work with DC, so you're stuck with whatever voltage the generator produced. DC powered railroads have substations ever few miles to take in high voltage AC, and convert it to medium voltage DC to the track. Originally this was done by rotary converters, an AC motor driving a DC generator. Later via massive vacuum tube rectifiers, now via solid state diode circuits.
It's always struck me as odd, bearing in mind that the London Underground is so predominantly north of the river, that the first tube line was actually mostly in South London and designed to get pasengers from south of the river to the north bank. Where did it all go wrong?!
Hang on, any chance of the Generators at Borough - were they Diesel or Coal Fired ? Were they mentioned in the Borough Tube Station Video, is the place they were located extant?
@@the_retag Indeed most of the private power stations owned by "London Transport" were coal until the late 1960s or early 1970s were steam using oil firing only in the later years of use. One, Lots Road, continued to operate (using oil firing) until about 2002.
It's so strange to look at the Ashbury coaches (sorry, *cars,* I know the Tube uses American railway jargon), and seeing how many traits pass over to modern deep-level Tube stock to this day (such as not being as tall and wide as regular trains, as well as fairly round). I mean, because they still use the same tunnels, I guess it makes sense. EDIT: The longitudinal seating too. Sorry, should've put that in.
Another minor 'rail-tale' stems from this: The aforementioned Ashbury's Co. later suffered losses and closed - its works apparently 'completely forgotten about.' But when Network Rail was doing the 'ground-work' for its new whiz-bang ROCC - Regional Operations Control Centre (a GRAND signalbox, built like Fort Knox) on the outskirts of Manchester, the remains of the old Ashbury's factory were unearthed and building-works delayed whilst a sizeable archaeological site was established there.
Jago describes the "padded cell" cars on the C&SL Railway as having their very small windows from new.I was always taught that when they first went into service they had no windows at all and were then retro fitted for the reasons Jago states.
According to Andrew "Steam Detective" Martin they originally had clear glass windows but these caused a disturbing strobing effect so were replaced with opaque glass. (Presumably frosted like in a bathroom.)
@@caw25sha That's one I hadn't heard. Incidentally just this very morning I was on an overground train travelling from Edmonton Green to Seven sisters and the morning sun was very bright. As we passed obstructions that caused the sun to be blocked out in a rapid flickering (I'm starting to sound like corporal Jones from Dad's Army !) motion I said to myself this could cause someone who was susceptible to have an epileptic fit.
I wonder how many more subscribers left you got until you reach 200,000 subscribers Jago. No wonder Jago Hazzard’s channel has expanded since I have subscribed. And London loves it’s own transportation and making transport more environmentally friendly and greener is one way for London to cut down on pollution. I like how Jago Hazzard makes such amazing videos & content and explains them in context that is understandable. And once again I do apologise for deleting my comments because someone has been harassing me so many times and I still don’t know why I keep on getting bullied.
I assume that these days, its all AC traction. There must have been a critical point of switching from DC to AC....which, knowing how these things happen, probably resulted in lines shutting down for a week or more.
@@Damien.D in the Wellington NZ region the voltage is only 1,500 volts (1.5kV). 25kV AC is used more often as the voltage in railway overhead cables because its more economical than a 1.5kV DC voltage system.
There is something rather splendid about the little C&SLR engine. I get the same vide as the Sentinal locos or even Quarry Hunslets: a relatively diminutive, basic machine but which does the job that you would maybe expect of a far bigger engine. 🤔 And those old carriages are wonderfully crafted vehicles that make it worth visiting the LT Museum in itself. 🤓 As for the conventional signals, I’d not be surprised if there was mixture of fiscal and practical reasons for this: electric signals were probably more costly whereas semaphores were two a penny (well, probably a bit more but you know…😋) and readily available, plus as you say there was a power issue anyway, so I suspect the preventative cost of extra power on an unknown venture was just to much of a gamble 🤷🏻♂️ Splendid stuff as ever sir 👍🍻🍀
Tangentially relevant, but I read somewhere that George Stephenson predicted the widespread use of electric traction in his own lifetime. He was unfortunately wrong, but is the story, at least, true?
Along with all the engineering reasons why the Hyperloop is a stupid concept, the lack of windows is a compelling psychological reason, as any student of mass transit history should know, and as you demonstrate here. People don't like it when they can't see where they are, and especially don't like when motion is felt by not seen. But that's the sort of thing you'd expect from somebody who thinks they're a genius by inventing the underground railway, only more complicated and 150 years too late. But this also reminds me of one of my other enjoyments, Gilbert & Sullivan. In their opera "Patience; or Bunthorne's Bride", the song "I'm a Waterloo House young man" was originally written, in 1881, with the line "A three-penny bus young man". When it was revived in 1900, that line became "A two-penny tube young man".
Not sure you're right about the lack of windows being a problem. Removing windows from aircraft and replacing them with super high resolution video screens will probably happen soon as it will make lighter, stronger more fuel efficient aircraft. However you're right that the Hyperloop is a non-starter for many reasons. Mostly because the slightest problem will result in the instantaneous death of any passengers. Sub orbital space flight would be cheaper, safer and easier to achieve. See the UK company Reaction Engines for the possibilities.
@@AnthonyHigham6414001080 Well, I'm not getting on any aircraft, regardless of the windows, so I wouldn't really know. But yes, Hyperloop is hilariously impractical.
How spooky, only a few hours ago I was reading the article about the reconstruction of the C&SLR to fit in with the loading gauge of the London Electric Railways and become part of their Highgate/Hendon to Charing Cross/Moorgate (and extensions), especially the intricate tunnelling at Camden Town....in The Railway Magazine June 1924.
I imagine the introduction of multiple units must have helped with the steep grades, since more of the weight is over driven axles - although maybe by that point it was not a problem since King William Street was closed
Excellent video. I've lived in London most of my life now and you can't get by in this city without using one of the oldest and largest transport networks in the world. Indeed UK has two or three(if you include busiest shipping lane). I appreciate the architecture, engineering and the work put in. I appreciate the inventions and innovations. I know that it's what makes modern, and by extension, post modern life possible in 2022.
Fascinating as usual. Northern Line - whatever happened to the incredible noise as one went north to Barnet, Deafening ! Was it ever reduced and, if so, how ?
Look, Mr Hazard. I absolutely insist the next station you "do" is Redbridge. You might even include that non-Oscar winning (and very seldom watched because it's a pile of poo) film "Last train to Redbridge". So get your finger out and do it. NOW. Remember, I know where you live... !
The First Electric Tube Trains The City & Sth London, which is a metro, for sure in 1892. But *electric* metros, which the City & Sth London is, then one other joins the pack, which was partially underground: *1)* City & Sth London Rly - 1892; *2)* Liverpool Overhead - 1893; *3)* Budapest Metro - May 1896; *4)* Liverpool Overhead underground extension - Dec 1896; *5)* Paris Metro; *6)* Mersey Railway electrification - 1903. *7)* New York Subway - 1904 *8)* London Metropolitan & District Line electrification - 1906;
Speaking of Magnus Volk, he also installed the first electric telephone in Brighton. It ran between his house and that of his friend William JAGO (Hazzard?).
I mistakenly thought this wouldn't be interesting. I was completely wrong! I hadn't realised London underground railways were amongst the pioneers of electrical haulage.
The Trains are all so very beautiful. I don't know any history about Trains except for what I just recently been viewing. I had something about Railroads amongst other things on my Income Tax & its crazy to know nothing about the industry LoL.
Yet another video I didn't get a notification for. Seriously, youtube is getting bothersome. And they like to unsubscribe people without warning or reason. Great video, though. Learned a lot. And I still enjoy the asides and puns. Still got it, sir.
A second locomotive was preserved and pit on display at Moorgate station, but was destroyed in a bombing raid during WW2. The motorised axle from it was kept and displayed next to the other locomotive in the days when this was at the Science Museum. The carriages were fitted with air brakes, the train pipe being carried at roof level, but the locomotives did not have compressors, the air system being recharged at the terminus. There are air hoses low down on the sides of the locomotive and I assume that is what these were for. Doing this would have further complicated operations at terminus stations.
I want to see underwater maglev tunnel networks in full operation before I die. I would like to see routes to northern Europe from Scotland via environmentally friendly maglev tunnel networks within this decade. Both Europe and Scotland are housed upon the same continental shelf and it is a more than probable proposal to begin investments into such a transport link. The fields of South Eastern Fife are longing for an international underwater maglev station serving Northern Europe. I hope to see this in my lifetime. If you can dream it It must be done. ☯️
I think electric locomotives remained in use on the Metropolitan Line until the 1960s for services to Rickmansworth (and then steam to Aylesbury) although every other line used multiple units.
In a sense one could say that the first multiple-units were on Volk's Electric Railway itself? Certainly they seem to be the first self-propelled electric trains, predating the Liverpool Overhead.
It seems there's some debate about whether Volk's railway or the Portrush & Giant's Causeway line were the first to run electric trains in the British Isles. Not being an expert, the argument does appear to revolve around the interpretation of terms.....
You didn’t mention the Glasgow subway which had copied this in 1896 (originally cable hauled, with electrically powered lights, but converted to use electricity)
Underground coaches complete with balconies - what a very Vrctorian conceit. Great narrative, many thanks.
The video says the the 'Guard' would tell passengers which station it was - in fact it was probably the 'Gateman' who travelled on the 'balcony' to open and close the gates at each station to allow passengers to alight & embark - no power door in those days.
Commuters nauseous in carriages without windows - at the start of the week ? As my sectretary phoned in once, Sick Transit, Gloria, Monday.
Intelligence well and truly not insulted.
Seek Gloria's transit mondaaaay
"Such are the glories of this world."
Ah, I can explain the issues with the observatory as I work in that field. As the trains run and pick up power from the power supplies they induce a magnetic field. The kind of magnetic instrumentation needed to make accurate measurements of the Earth's magnetic field over time will pick that field up, even at very long distance. We still have that problem today when we do field measurements, and the electromagnetic interference specifications on railways are a lot stricter than in the early 20th century. Eventually the trams and tube caused so many problems that they had to move the astronomical observatory to Herstmonceux near Hastings and the Magnetic Observatory from Kew to Eskdalemuir in the Scottish Borders.
I've been to Herstmonceux! I was at a LARP event there in August 2019, (basically Hogwarts in real life.) It's a lovely place, although I spent half the time feeling miserable (not great when you've spent a fortune to get there and months looking forward to it, as I decided I was going in 2018.) The rest of the time was fun, and at least I can say I did it. 🙂
Bravo. You answered my question 5 hours before i had a chance to think it!
Thank you !:-)
⚡️🙏⚡️
Magnetic measurements continued at Greenwich until WW2 when the magnetic and time departments were moved to Abinger in Surrey. The big problem the London Tramways caused to the Royal Observatory at Greenwich was the Power Station by the river. The hot air from the chimneys disturbed the observations of stars on the North transit. The Greenwich meridian runs through the power station - some of the chimneys are in the Eastern Hemisphere and the rest in the west.
There's a railway line in Japan - the Tsukuba express, which runs to the north-east of Tokyo - which switches from DC to AC for the outer portion of the line so that geomagnetic measurements by the Japan Meteorological Agency aren't affected by interference at one its labs near to the line. So dual-voltage AC/DC trains are used for services that run the whole line and DC only trains are used for the DC portion (the DC portion is the inner portion of the line on the Tokyo end so requires a higher frequency of trains).
I was going to say that as I worked at Kew Observatory in the 60s with my now wife. She also worked at Eskdalemuir. Visited there once and going round the grounds to look at teh instruments, we had to remove anything metal we were wearing.
We were told it was the trams in Richmond causing the issues. The building at Kew is now a dwelling - anyone got £1m to spare to buy it?
1:12 Nice guy that Peter Barlow, he had a bit of a drink problem though. Knew his father Ken quite well.
I can proudly say I was subscribed to this man since 10,000 subs! I love how every one of his videos is informative
I did too!
Same
Got you beat, for me it was less than a thousand, so pleased you got to enjoy this too.
Same here!
@@darkjudge8786 oh dear, somebody doesn't know the difference between socialism and communism.
I can confirm Volk's Railway at Brighton has no smokey tunnels, or tunnels of any kind, save for rolling stock sheds
Thanks for the video Jago. I learned something new today. My cat watched the video too. She says purrrrrrr.
23 and 24 Lenister Gardens were demolished to make way for the railway between Bayswater and Piddington; façades were then erected in their place to give the impression that there were still buildings there, which are still around today.
That tinny engine is the cutest thing ever!
Windowless carriages in a tube proved unpopular? Who'd have thunk it? Maybe Elon Musk should have visited the London Transport Museum before he started all that Hyperloop bollocks.
History always repeats itself.
He dug a tunnel and is running cars through it. There are plans to make the cars bigger, and even run them in groups. Truly a revolution in urban transportation.
@@SynchroScore musks hyperlooooop sound nightmarish. 600 km/h and no escape, anywhere, if something goes wrong.
@@billpugh58 Exactly the sort of thing you'd expect from somebody who has no real experience in engineering or dealing with real-world consequences. Like having people inside a vacuum chamber where loss of vacuum means pretty much instant death. And the funniest thing is that the actual capacity, in terms of passenger-miles/hour, is less than a conventional high-speed railway, so it doesn't even improve performance.
@@billpugh58 The same can be said about a plane travelling at 900 km/h in 30,000ft.
Despite having the right idea, the Liverpool Overhead Railway ended up being torn up. It's a rather tragic story which you should at the very least look into.
IIRC, from memory of E. L. Ahrons writings, fireboxes suitable for coal came along around 1860-1865, so coke was the fuel until then. I need to check this, as I suffered disbelief at the realisation, but imagine the impact of the change from a smokeless fuel at the time.
The critical component of a coal firebox is the brick arch, first introduced in America in 1854 and in the UK (on the MIdland Railway) in 1858.
@@Tevildo thank you !:-)
@@Tevildo You are correct but Midland Railway historians claim Kirtley devised his own arch design, and it does appear to have been superior to the earlier American design, cheaper to install and more durable. I wonder what he knew of the earlier design.
Coke was still the fuel on the Metropolitan even after that, because it burns cleaner. I mean, you've still got carbon monoxide and carbon dioxide, but at least no sulfur dioxide.
@@SynchroScore what did/do coke works do with the sulphur? Was it just sent to atmosphere, or was a way devised to capture it and use it for other purposes?
goodness, a Jago video with no puns. The world has gone to the dogs. However, what a fine and informative video it is. Well done JH.
No puns, but purposely shown incorrect photos. Such as the Subway restaurant when he talked about the subway.
There was a nice demonstration of the steam engine smoke that would have caused such a problem in tunnels.
@@rjjcms1 that wasn't smoke, that was vapour from the cylinder drain cocks.
It's interesting that no matter the technology the S curve of development still applies and a lot of early stuff becomes redundant when speed of progress builds up.
Brilliantly delivered and comprehensively explained, need I say more. Now I am sounding like Jago......
I’d like to hear more about that three month cable railway! That is of course, if there is anything more to hear.
I did a video on it quite a while back - The Tiny Tube of Tower Hill.
He's already done a video about that.
ua-cam.com/video/gcVKQSz47CI/v-deo.html
@@JagoHazzard Oh, awesome! Going to go and search for it now, thank you! :)
An overview of the early Underground EMUs would be great (anything pre-Standard Stock). If required, perhaps split it into two videos, one for sub-surface and one for deep-level.
Thanks for a informative video/blog up to your usual standard and educational to boot. Thank you Jago.
We still use cable haulage in London. Emirates Air Line.
Really enjoyed this one, most informative and interesting. Thank you.
The Tower subway only lasted 3 months as the cable snapped 😃
The Royal Observatory at Greenwich has a lot to answer for. They insisted the trams had double trolley poles instead of earth return. Until the 1940s when it was all proved a nonsense with everything else going on.
An excellent piece as ever, but...
"Swap a broken down locomotive for another."
Why would you replace a defective loco with another defective loco? He asks in all innocence. 😉😂
It's also very difficult underground because the giant hand from the sky can't reach down and swap them over.
@@GreenJimll An excellent point well made. 😂
I think he means 'swap with a working one'.....
@@johndavies1090 Indeed, bravo for working that out.
@@johndavies1090 Humour not your métier, then?
May I mention the relatively little known Giant's Causeway, Portrush and Bush valley Rly and Tmy. This was electrified to Dr Siemens system (the only working one) and opened in 1882. Power, a nightmare, was ingenious using an installation at Salmon's Leap to provide a hydro electric supply. The tale is told in A History of the British Steam Tram vol 6 pp 53-56. Steam was used as a supplement for the area where electrics were not allowed......the opposite to the Ubahn!!
I’ve been on the preserved line! A nice ride.
You forgot to mention the 3rd oldest underground system in the world, and the only one never expanded was cable hauled...Glasgow
and theres the other under ground train system the old post office line
Underground railways:
*1)* London 1863;
*2)* Liverpool 1886;
*3)* Budapest May 1896;
*4)* Glasgow Subway Dec 1896.
@@johnburns4017 Liverpool doesn't have an underground railway system, just a couple of railway stations in tunnels. Glasgow was indeed #3.
@@ubergeekian
Nonsense. LOL! Underground stations *are* railway stations in tunnels. What else are they? Stand on the platforms of underground stations, then look both ways. What do you see?
Read up on the Mersey Railway, that later became a part of Merseyrail. Merseyrail was expanded in the 1970s with additional tunnelling in the centre's of Liverpool and Birkenhead. One third was cancelled by Thatcher when under construction. Miles of tunnel and trackbed still await trains and rails. A 6-platform underground parkway station at Broad Green was shelved - men were about to put shovels in the ground. An underground burrowing junction was built under the centre, which is still not fully used. If it was above ground on flyovers it would finished and used by now. But out of sight, out of mind.
The first _deep_ underground stations were in Liverpool. London's were near the surface being cut & cover.
Now you know.
@@johnburns4017 There are more now, but an underground railway system is far more than a tunnel with a station in it. The Mersey Railway system as built was a perfectly normal railway with a couple of miles of tunnel containing two stations. It was not in any sense an underground railway system, which is why no histories of such things include it. It would be like calling the Kingsway Tram tunnel and the end of the Liverpool Overhead "underground railways".
Congratulations on getting a grievance out of it.
The City & South London railway was not designed for electric traction, it was an after thought The cable installer contractor went bust. The Liverpool Overhead Railway was the first metro to be conceived and designed from the outset using electric traction. Also using electric light signals. And as mentioned, the first EMUs.
The Mersey Railway, now a part of Merseyrail metro, is interesting, especially the tunnel. The tunnel drainage water was used to extract the heat from it using heat pumps, to heat and cool an office block in Liverpool - _in the 1970s._ Eco before eco. The first group of stations on the Mersey Railway were all below ground level, either in cuttings, or fully underground. James St in Liverpool and Hamilton Squ, Birkenhead were the first *deep* underground stations.
Two interesting railways that are really worth a vid.
There's a railway tunnel in Switzerland that also has drainage of warm water. It's piped to a conservatory to grow bananas and other tropical plants.
At 5:56 I was worried about the exposed contacts on the massive rheostat-shaped widow-maker, but you put my mind at rest when you explained that it used 450v DC...
Unlike AC that throws you off, you tend to hang on to DC: after a while you start smelling like bacon cooking! On tube trains there is a wooden pole provided for pushing people off live rails. Alternatively you can risk using the shorting bar across the current rails to try to trip the relevant circuit breaker: however this does not always work. Far better to pinch the two bare wires together that run in the tunnels in such a position that the train operator can lean out of a cab side window to do so: this also trips the circuit breaker. These wires are also a direct telephone system to the service controller: you just need to connect the 'tunnel telephone' headset across them using the attached 'croc clips'. I'll shut up now.
@@1963TOMB You're good. Your comment was valuable. No need to be so reserved.
btw what's a widow-maker? I can't for the life of me see what you mean. (tbf I'm on mobile...)
@@caramelldansen2204 a widow maker is anything deadly, I believe. (Edit: I looked it up just in case and it’s specifically a deadly _machine,_ but of course I was already thinking in terms of machinery…)
It's high amps not volts that kill you.
It'll never catch on. They'll switch back to (internal/external) combustion in a jiffy when they realise electricity is just a fad.
And an expensive one at that!
I like how we’re beginning to hear this said about cars as well now :D
@@kaitlyn__L In 150 years our descendants will probably be laughing at us seeing these comments while cruising around in an electrically-powered spaceship to their holiday destination on Mars
"Oh, those people of the olden days..."
Another great video Jago. Many thanks 😊
Interesting pre-Beck map. I wonder how much the Army and Navy ponied up to get on the map.
Specifically, how much did the Army's Cavalry pony up for this. (I'll see myself out now.)
I believe the Army & Navy just bought the plain maps and printed their location on them. This one is the best example in the collection of the London Transport Museum, so it's the one used for all the on-line images.
@@Tevildo I see. As it appears to be the only place of interest marked, and with a large and conspicuous red circle, I assumed they had paid to be included.
Jago your video's are brilliant and informative. Thank you
Brilliant video.
'You are the Mather to my Platt.' Brilliant! 🙂
The Liverpool Overhead Railway would make a good subject for a video.
It's a great shame that the only bit of it still existing is stuffed and mounted in a museum. It would have been such an asset to the waterfront, linking what are becoming fashionable living areas with the main tourist & shopping ones; not to mention being a great tourist attraction in its own right.
@@18robsmith the steel structures was rustling away from the steam engines running beneath it!
Jago is really going to town 👍🏻🇬🇧
Nice video Jago. Love the Brighton connection- I’ve got some happy childhood memories of the Volk’s Railway.
Me too. ❤️
They should use your videos at the transport museum!
The shot from the window at 3:23 is actually quite nice. Lots of colour and it's well balanced. I'll need at least 2 memory cards for photos of the Underground and all its features and scenery when/if I ever do get to London. 2 major stations will be Paddington and Baker street. I work in a library - can you tell? I love your history lessons almost as much as I love anything with wheels/rails and an engine.
It would be nice if someone did something on the Liverpool Overhead (Dockers' Umbrella), a little forgotten railway.
Ask and ye shall receive. Type "Liverpool Overhead Railway" in the UA-cam search and you will find a bunch of videos on the system, including archival footage. 😆
It’s something I would certainly like to cover at some point. Also the Mersey Railway.
Ahh, someone asked my very question! Another vote for a Liverpool Overhead video!
@@delurkor Yes, much of which I have seen before. Would like something with a 'modern' feel to it and delving into the whys and wherefores for a replacement. It could be done!
We used to go to Liverpool a lot when I was just a small child, but sadly I cannot remember it. New Brighton was the main destination having crossed the Mersey on the ferry. Which bring us to a song. . . No.
@@WolfmanWoody I agree a Jago vid would be most enjoyable and informative.
Wot, no Yerkes?
Very much enjoyed this video!
So my typical Austrian Friday as a an ex London Transport British gent consists of a fine beer an oven ready pizza and a superb episode from Jagos history class... And class it is, thank you again sir for a splendid episode... 😊😊👍🏽👍🏽👍🏽
There's an episode of Bramwell, where they recreate part of a platform at King William Street Station and a train carriage in it.
Season 2 Episode 1.
Electrical distances 5 miles away?!? How intriguing !:-) ⚡️🙏⚡️
This is the reason modern electrical distribution uses AC. Transformers can step up AC to very high voltage, which has very little power loss over hundreds of miles, then back to lower voltage at the destination. Transformers don't work with DC, so you're stuck with whatever voltage the generator produced. DC powered railroads have substations ever few miles to take in high voltage AC, and convert it to medium voltage DC to the track. Originally this was done by rotary converters, an AC motor driving a DC generator. Later via massive vacuum tube rectifiers, now via solid state diode circuits.
It's always struck me as odd, bearing in mind that the London Underground is so predominantly north of the river, that the first tube line was actually mostly in South London and designed to get pasengers from south of the river to the north bank. Where did it all go wrong?!
Love the Liverpool Overhead Railway. What a damn shame. Researching it is fascinating!
Hang on, any chance of the Generators at Borough - were they Diesel or Coal Fired ? Were they mentioned in the Borough Tube Station Video, is the place they were located extant?
At that time likely coal
@@the_retag Yes, diesel engines hadn't been invented at that stage. Indeed Mr Benz's new-fangled petrol car was only a few years old.
@@the_retag Indeed most of the private power stations owned by "London Transport" were coal until the late 1960s or early 1970s were steam using oil firing only in the later years of use. One, Lots Road, continued to operate (using oil firing) until about 2002.
Always enjoy a video on electric locomotives.
3:32 I wonder if this map said "Power Station Battersea" in the first week of the new extension.
It's so strange to look at the Ashbury coaches (sorry, *cars,* I know the Tube uses American railway jargon), and seeing how many traits pass over to modern deep-level Tube stock to this day (such as not being as tall and wide as regular trains, as well as fairly round). I mean, because they still use the same tunnels, I guess it makes sense.
EDIT: The longitudinal seating too. Sorry, should've put that in.
I think the Metropolitan would have used Carriages or Coaches. Only Yerkes' railways had the idea of Cars, being American
Another minor 'rail-tale' stems from this: The aforementioned Ashbury's Co. later suffered losses and closed - its works apparently 'completely forgotten about.'
But when Network Rail was doing the 'ground-work' for its new whiz-bang ROCC - Regional Operations Control Centre (a GRAND signalbox, built like Fort Knox) on the outskirts of Manchester, the remains of the old Ashbury's factory were unearthed and building-works delayed whilst a sizeable archaeological site was established there.
@@richardberechula2942 The Name of the Station Ashburys comes from the area, a large house or the Company ?
@@highpath4776 The Company (named after its Proprietor, John Ashbury).
In NZ ... I always refer to the carriage I am in.
..the subway in Monteal, Canada uses ribber tires...
Jago describes the "padded cell" cars on the C&SL Railway as having their very small windows from new.I was always taught that when they first went into service they had no windows at all and were then retro fitted for the reasons Jago states.
According to Andrew "Steam Detective" Martin they originally had clear glass windows but these caused a disturbing strobing effect so were replaced with opaque glass. (Presumably frosted like in a bathroom.)
@@caw25sha That's one I hadn't heard. Incidentally just this very morning I was on an overground train travelling from Edmonton Green to Seven sisters and the morning sun was very bright. As we passed obstructions that caused the sun to be blocked out in a rapid flickering
(I'm starting to sound like corporal Jones from Dad's Army !) motion I said to myself this could cause someone who was susceptible to have an epileptic fit.
@@simonwinter8839 As someone who is a photo-sensitive epileptic I can tell you that effect in cars and trains is very unpleasant.
@@GreenJimll
It was pretty unpleasant for me and I don't suffer with epilepsy. I am sorry you do and you have my sympathy.
Would love to see a video on the Richmond Union Passenger Railway and its effect on the development of electric traction
Very interesting - thank you for your tails from the Tube - most enjoyable 😉🚂🚂🚂
I wonder how many more subscribers left you got until you reach 200,000 subscribers Jago. No wonder Jago Hazzard’s channel has expanded since I have subscribed. And London loves it’s own transportation and making transport more environmentally friendly and greener is one way for London to cut down on pollution.
I like how Jago Hazzard makes such amazing videos & content and explains them in context that is understandable. And once again I do apologise for deleting my comments because someone has been harassing me so many times and I still don’t know why I keep on getting bullied.
11:29 You are the what to my what? (Please don't reply with "you got clorf ears or summink". Thank you.)
Mather and Platt - The people who built the first electric locomotive (in Manchester)
@@roderickmain9697 Ah, thank you.
@@caw25sha Do try to keep up
I assume that these days, its all AC traction. There must have been a critical point of switching from DC to AC....which, knowing how these things happen, probably resulted in lines shutting down for a week or more.
subways, trams, and light rail in general are still DC all over the world, including London underground.
750VDC is somewhat of a light rail standard.
It is AC traction, but they take DC from the 3rd rail and convert it to AC onboard the train.
The Tyne and Wear Metro is electrified with overhead lines at 1,500 V DC, and is now the only rail network in the United Kingdom to use this system.
@@Damien.D in the Wellington NZ region the voltage is only 1,500 volts (1.5kV).
25kV AC is used more often as the voltage in railway overhead cables because its more economical than a 1.5kV DC voltage system.
So what speed did the original electric trains manage back in 1890?
There is something rather splendid about the little C&SLR engine. I get the same vide as the Sentinal locos or even Quarry Hunslets: a relatively diminutive, basic machine but which does the job that you would maybe expect of a far bigger engine. 🤔 And those old carriages are wonderfully crafted vehicles that make it worth visiting the LT Museum in itself. 🤓
As for the conventional signals, I’d not be surprised if there was mixture of fiscal and practical reasons for this: electric signals were probably more costly whereas semaphores were two a penny (well, probably a bit more but you know…😋) and readily available, plus as you say there was a power issue anyway, so I suspect the preventative cost of extra power on an unknown venture was just to much of a gamble 🤷🏻♂️
Splendid stuff as ever sir 👍🍻🍀
Tangentially relevant, but I read somewhere that George Stephenson predicted the widespread use of electric traction in his own lifetime. He was unfortunately wrong, but is the story, at least, true?
Along with all the engineering reasons why the Hyperloop is a stupid concept, the lack of windows is a compelling psychological reason, as any student of mass transit history should know, and as you demonstrate here. People don't like it when they can't see where they are, and especially don't like when motion is felt by not seen. But that's the sort of thing you'd expect from somebody who thinks they're a genius by inventing the underground railway, only more complicated and 150 years too late.
But this also reminds me of one of my other enjoyments, Gilbert & Sullivan. In their opera "Patience; or Bunthorne's Bride", the song "I'm a Waterloo House young man" was originally written, in 1881, with the line "A three-penny bus young man". When it was revived in 1900, that line became "A two-penny tube young man".
Not sure you're right about the lack of windows being a problem. Removing windows from aircraft and replacing them with super high resolution video screens will probably happen soon as it will make lighter, stronger more fuel efficient aircraft.
However you're right that the Hyperloop is a non-starter for many reasons. Mostly because the slightest problem will result in the instantaneous death of any passengers. Sub orbital space flight would be cheaper, safer and easier to achieve. See the UK company Reaction Engines for the possibilities.
@@AnthonyHigham6414001080 Well, I'm not getting on any aircraft, regardless of the windows, so I wouldn't really know. But yes, Hyperloop is hilariously impractical.
How spooky, only a few hours ago I was reading the article about the reconstruction of the C&SLR to fit in with the loading gauge of the London Electric Railways and become part of their Highgate/Hendon to Charing Cross/Moorgate (and extensions), especially the intricate tunnelling at Camden Town....in The Railway Magazine June 1924.
I imagine the introduction of multiple units must have helped with the steep grades, since more of the weight is over driven axles - although maybe by that point it was not a problem since King William Street was closed
Excellent video. I've lived in London most of my life now and you can't get by in this city without using one of the oldest and largest transport networks in the world. Indeed UK has two or three(if you include busiest shipping lane). I appreciate the architecture, engineering and the work put in. I appreciate the inventions and innovations. I know that it's what makes modern, and by extension, post modern life possible in 2022.
Fascinating as usual. Northern Line - whatever happened to the incredible noise as one went north to Barnet, Deafening ! Was it ever reduced and, if so, how ?
Did not the Egyptians invent electric tube trains in 1750BC using ancient technology?
A cable hauled railway can stull be seen and ridden in Llandudno in Wales, the Great Orme Tramway.
Does this tunnel enlargement have anything to do with why the central platform is so narrow at Clapham South and Common?
Look, Mr Hazard. I absolutely insist the next station you "do" is Redbridge. You might even include that non-Oscar winning (and very seldom watched because it's a pile of poo) film "Last train to Redbridge". So get your finger out and do it. NOW. Remember, I know where you live... !
Roger S
Not only do you not know where Mr.Hazzard lives you also don't know, like the rest of us,what he looks like.
@@simonwinter8839 I know where he lives - London
@@dukenukem5768 Well that narrows it down then.
ua-cam.com/video/iJB3c91qu0I/v-deo.html
@@simonwinter8839 I have a pretty good idea when Jago lives AND what he looks like, not that he has darkened my door-step , yet.
Go on, electricity!
Entertaining, and informative as always, Jago ! Thank you !
Electrifying. I've always wondered about thee locomotives.
The First Electric Tube Trains
The City & Sth London, which is a metro, for sure in 1892. But *electric* metros, which the City & Sth London is, then one other joins the pack, which was partially underground:
*1)* City & Sth London Rly - 1892;
*2)* Liverpool Overhead - 1893;
*3)* Budapest Metro - May 1896;
*4)* Liverpool Overhead underground extension - Dec 1896;
*5)* Paris Metro;
*6)* Mersey Railway electrification - 1903.
*7)* New York Subway - 1904
*8)* London Metropolitan & District Line electrification - 1906;
Personally I prefer the 1904 Interborough Rapid Transit Company steel subway trains in 1904 which were part of the original fleet.
Another excelent video
Super stuff, Mr H. Really most interesting. Fascinating even. Thanks, Simon T
Seems odd, if you're underground, why would you ever need a grade? Just build longer stairwells.
Geology. Avoid water tables and unstable layers, for example.
🤔 I believe that gradients were built in to slow down a train when entering a station, then increasing speed when departing.
@@sirmeowthelibrarycat so steep the trains couldn't use them?
@@PtolemyJones well not as planned for adhesion
@@oscar_charlie And avoid utilities and other tunnels, in some cases.
Speaking of Magnus Volk, he also installed the first electric telephone in Brighton. It ran between his house and that of his friend William JAGO (Hazzard?).
I mistakenly thought this wouldn't be interesting. I was completely wrong! I hadn't realised London underground railways were amongst the pioneers of electrical haulage.
The Trains are all so very beautiful. I don't know any history about Trains except for what I just recently been viewing. I had something about Railroads amongst other things on my Income Tax & its crazy to know nothing about the industry LoL.
You could say.... they were really useful engines!
Thank god Volk copyrighted Volkswagen before anyone else had the same idea.
Yet another video I didn't get a notification for. Seriously, youtube is getting bothersome. And they like to unsubscribe people without warning or reason. Great video, though. Learned a lot. And I still enjoy the asides and puns. Still got it, sir.
Thanks Jago, fascinating as always.
A second locomotive was preserved and pit on display at Moorgate station, but was destroyed in a bombing raid during WW2. The motorised axle from it was kept and displayed next to the other locomotive in the days when this was at the Science Museum.
The carriages were fitted with air brakes, the train pipe being carried at roof level, but the locomotives did not have compressors, the air system being recharged at the terminus. There are air hoses low down on the sides of the locomotive and I assume that is what these were for. Doing this would have further complicated operations at terminus stations.
Always interesting, perfectly presented and informative. Very impressed.
I want to see underwater maglev tunnel networks in full operation before I die.
I would like to see routes to northern Europe from Scotland via environmentally friendly maglev tunnel networks within this decade.
Both Europe and Scotland are housed upon the same continental shelf and it is a more than probable proposal to begin investments into such a transport link.
The fields of South Eastern Fife are longing for an international underwater maglev station serving Northern Europe.
I hope to see this in my lifetime.
If you can dream it
It must be done. ☯️
I thought that the in cab tube line display was going to be real time illuminated from the previous Sarah Beeny voiced UA-cam video.
4:30 So Volk made a train with wagons... the first Volk's Wagon perhaps?
Underground railways? They’ll never catch-on!
No credit where credit is too.
The Liverpool overhead railway also known as the dockers umbrella must be worth a video, 🤞
I wanna know what the electric locomotive would've sounded like
nice one Jago
I think electric locomotives remained in use on the Metropolitan Line until the 1960s for services to Rickmansworth (and then steam to Aylesbury) although every other line used multiple units.
In a sense one could say that the first multiple-units were on Volk's Electric Railway itself? Certainly they seem to be the first self-propelled electric trains, predating the Liverpool Overhead.
It seems there's some debate about whether Volk's railway or the Portrush & Giant's Causeway line were the first to run electric trains in the British Isles. Not being an expert, the argument does appear to revolve around the interpretation of terms.....
Another great video, Jago! watts the current situation?
well done.
The current situation is that Jago's at ohm making a potentially different video.
Just don't touch the current. Ouch, it hertz!
You didn’t mention the Glasgow subway which had copied this in 1896 (originally cable hauled, with electrically powered lights, but converted to use electricity)
“The trains burned coke” wait. Coca*ne?
I get the impression we're going over old ground here. Oh wait never mind.