That mound of helmets doesn’t look like a memorial. It looks like a trophy collection Obelix made after he and Asterix had some fun with a bunch of Romans.
Seems like they either chickened out of creating the hill of bodies that it should have been, the Haudh-en-Ndengin, where the bodies of elves and men were piled up by orcs in the first age, or they wanted to use something similar in the second age for some reason.
Cut in - starting narration about the past war... Closeup of a person on a past battlefield, kneeling down and picking up spear and helmet of a fallen soldier. Gets up, rams spear into ground, puts helmet onto it does a vague gesture hinting some kind of chant of prayer. Person moves on a bit onto the next fallen soldier repeating the action. (opportunity for a closeup of the fallen soldiers showing the severety of the battle) BGM kicks in - camera zooms out - flies out - revealing a vast field with thousands of similar 'gravestones' - fade out to black - narration stops - oportunity to fade in title, logo or similar branding. This might be a rather clichéd framing, but it works basically all the time. It can make use of mostly CGI elements while delivering each and every relevant aspect of what it wants to tell us. It shows scale of the setting while also hinting different things - like the possibility of each and every gravestone being made by the one person (if that's relevant) over a long span of time - it adds to the size and scale and also conveys devotion and grief. Even if the person in the scene isn't relevant per se, they become a framing device and the pov for the viewer. It increases the gravitas of the scene because only someone grieving massively would go to such lengths - depending on how you set it up, it can convey all sorts of emotions and therefore increasing the impact. Nothing against trying out something different - but I'd say the 'usual' would have been sufficient here and I'd say it would have had more potential to reach the viewer that way...
@@christopherzajonskowski7123 I like that. The idea of someone spending this much time on a battlefield to create graves for all of their fallen comrades/friends/kin is very interesting. Surely that would change a person, even if they are a quasi-immortal elf. Could be a nice starting point for a character who was a bit reckless before and is now more withdrawn etc. Maybe spending this much time surrounded by death would cause them to gain a certain connection to things normally unseen or gain a deeper understanding of some kind of power they already possess. If they really have to go with Galadriel in this situation at least use it for some meaningful character development. Would work for Elrond or a non-canon character too, though. Also, while it would have used some CGI for the thousands of swords in the background this could still have been done with a real background/location - just put in the swords afterward and keep everything else real.
They are holding their swords like they are aiming with guns. Maybe they are using the same shooting sword the guy in the Dungeons and Dragons movie uses.
@@calibre97 the new DND movie has a snippet in the trailer of a blade launching from a sword leaving a dagger behind. I cringed horribly even though I knew it was a nod to the Sword and the Sorcerer
The worst thing with all this for me(especially with seeing the Balrog) is that the lore of Tolkien’s world has some utterly amazing stories. With a budget like what Amazon has, if they would have been faithful to Tolkien and his vision, I think this show could have been something incredible. Morgoth was such an oppressive and terrifying force. There was a great dragon who blackened the whole sky with his wings. So much epic stuff. Romance, drama, heroism, tragedy. All there and ripe for adaptation! But instead we are getting a modernized fan fiction which seems to go out of its way to ignore Tolkien in order to tell its more current, far inferior narrative.
100% agree, anyone who thinks they can write middle-earth better than tolkien is a maniac. He has more characters than a few legendariums combined and they STILL go out of their way to create new characters and bench the real characters he wrote that have depth and we actually give a shit about!!! infuriating 😡
They didn't have the rights to those stories, so they weren't allowed to. Which probably is a good thing really, those stories are superb, the first stories Tolkien ever wrote about Middle Earth, and these clowns never would be able to do them justice.
The irony is if they pull a small intro at the start of the show that reveals the events of the first age in a historic recap (similar to how the PJ Fellowship did), then that will probably be the best part of the show because it will be Tolkien’s first age. Not whatever they have cooked up to try and pad out the second age with a story that clashes with the lore and characters in so many different ways.
What I can't get over is the dialogue in this series, Tolkien would never have his characters say these things or act in this way. Tolkien himself says it best in letter 210 : "I do earnestly hope that in the assignment of actual speeches to the characters they will be represented as I have presented them: in style and sentiment. I should resent perversion of the characters (and do resent it, so far as it appears in this sketch) even more than the spoiling of the plot and scenery." -J.R.R. Tolkien
Sauron was well known, he was the lieutenant of Morgoth, Lord Of Werewolves, and he’s a master of dark arts. However, Sauron, to trick the Elves, made himself into a being known as Annatar, or the Bringer Of Gifts as Sauron is an incredibly wise and intelligent being, and the Elves hunger for knowledge and so he quickly integrated himself, but avoided certain Elves because they’d know he was Sauron. He tricked the Elves into forging the rings, for he wanted to control them, he wanted the Elves, Dwarves and Men under his dominion. The final ring, the One Ring, the Master Ring, he forged himself in Mordor. Once he put it on, the Elves immediately knew they were tricked and took them off and hid them away, the Dwarves were too stubborn to succumb but gained a gold lust from the rings, and the Men were corrupted into the Ringwraiths.
From my understanding, the elves knew that Annatar was Sauron, but they viewed him as a reformed being. I could be wrong of course, but that's how I remember his story. Of course, now I'll use this as an excuse to reread the whole silmarillion, which is always a good thing.
Sauron actually tried to deceive Gil-Galad first, but the High-King was too cautious, and left him out of his door. Galadriel was second, but she quickly almost saw through Annatar guise, and he left before she could figure out his true nature. Celebrimbor was then found and deceived - for some time. Celebrimbor eventually figure out there was something fishy about Annatar.
Totally agree on the male characters and female characters flip. In the stories, it was Elrond and Gil-galad who very early on saw right through the deceits of Sauron, and it was they who sent word to warn against Annatar (one of Sauron's corporeal forms) who appeared fair and wise. Galadriel ALSO saw right through the deceits immediately. But the key thing is, BOTH male and female characters were wise enough to know. There was no "only the men knew things." If they wanted equality, well, it's IN THERE in Tolkien's writing. But looks like they're making it UNequal by giving all the wisdom to just the females here. At least, judging by the teasers and trailer we've seen
Based on what the actor who played Gil-galad has said, he is also wary/suspicious. I highly doubt he and Elrond are going to be portrayed as idiots. My guess is they are just trying to streamline marketing since Galadriel seems to be the mc.
@@benjaminlew1322 Amazon is doing a horrible PR, they are going all in into wokeness marketing and this has led the hardcore fans to turn the whole fanbase against them. I dont believe the show will be that woke, but I also believe it will be mediocre at best because they decided to break the lore too much (as it seems at least), so when we combine people going in to watch with very low expectations and ready to hate it, with subpar or average quality and you have the formula for a series to flop. If only they were more cautious and smarter on their marketing strategy they could have limited the damage.
@@aesir1ases64 What do you think the likelihood of Amazon actually showing the construction of a temple to Morgoth is, or the human sacrifices that the Numenorians were making to him? Do you believe they will give the context of Numemnor sailing to attack Valinor and just what that means in the world of Arda? Do you think they will actually show the Valar laying down their guardianship of Arda and calling upon Eru Illuvatar? I have no faith that Amazon will portray any of the events of the Second Age of Arda with even a modicum of respect to Tolkien's written work. Look how they treat Haudh-en-Nirnaeth in the trailer; Galadriel should have had no ability to get to that hill after the thorough defeat the armies of elves and men took during the Nirnaeth Arnoediad. If its the War of Wrath the pile of helms is not appropriate at all. The elves were fighting with gods and angles against winged dragons and baulrogs. Do not forget that the War of Wrath featured Ancalagon the Black the greatest of all winged dragons. The elves that died went to the Halls of Mandos and were given new bodies to continue living in Valinor.
When I saw the first few seconds of the trailer I was like “hey, that looks like it could be The Battle of Unnumbered tears, even if that happened during the first age” but then I was like “the people in charge probably don’t know what that is”
Love you guys. I’m only 6 minutes in, and I need to clear something up. It’s beyond obvious how Galadriel made the helmet pile so high… she used The Force. She is, of course, the first Jedi.
brilliant, i love it :) that of course will be the sequel to the rings of power Galadriel and the first temple. this will also be when she crafts the dark saber and gives birth to the first mandalorian, but then her husband leaves her for a ferangi, and she vows to give up all human bonds and instead befriends a lion and teaches him to create a new world. once she finishes that she will get around to forging Callandor and Excalibur....
@@Mert_Yanik yes, after all the magic died, they were free to pursue science, and discovered the power of crystals thanks to someone killing a giant spider and recovering one of the simarils.
I just started reading Silmarillion to refresh my Middle-earth knowledge for when this series are out and I want to encourage everyone to do so. If this series is be good for anything it is to remind about how great Tolkien's world is and to read his works.
The show will likely flop but Amazon will make out like a bandit with people buying more of Tolkien's original works just to get their Middle Earth fix that this show won't grant them
YES! One is not a true LOTR nerd without reading the Silmarillion. It's really fun reading the LOTR again afterward where you can understand all of the songs and references
I think the guy holding the torch and sword is immitating a modern gun and flashlight (torch) combo. Source of light under the armed hand, helping aim. The people making the show may be clueless beyond belief.
Indeed... Unless 'they' are going to pull the whole, elves are so light and nimble on their feet (akin to Legolas in the snow) and hence that's why she didn't keep toppling the helms everywhere 🤷🏻♂️
@@lukeblundell5610 It still feels odd tho, like yeah Eleves have different biology and all but why the heck would she make an helmet pile? To honor de dead ig? It still feels dumb even tho it technically has a reason why.
@D. K. Meyer I don’t tell you what to do don’t tell me what to do. I made fun of everyone in that joke if you don’t like it that’s fine. This world doesn’t give a crap about anyone (me and you included).
18:10 Sauron's main Gift as Annatar WAS the very Ringlore that was needed to forge the Rings of power, it all came from him first. He had courted various Elven kings before finding an audience in Celebrimbor, the Elf-lord of Lindon. But all the Ringlore came from him and it's actually the reverse; Celebrimbor forged the Three Elven rings without Sauron's knowledge, but when Sauron finally forged the One Ring and put it on, they felt his presence and realized his deception immediately, and took them off until he was slain.
My favorite thing about the 'diversity' being wedged into the first age is that it implies that in all the races 'diversity' was evolved to extinction by the time of LOTR
Easterlings came to Beleriand though, the ones who served under Morgoth, Bor and Ulfangs groups. Bor stayed loyal to the elves and Ulfang betrayed them at the Nirnaeth Arnoediad.
I never met a bigger LOTR geek than myself in my life. As a wee boy I read LOTR books religiously before the movies even came out. I've won countless LOTR knowledge contest, have been ever since I was a kid. I've written my own fanfiction follow-ups to Silmarillion and LOTR when I was 10. I've played every single LOTR-themed computer game that came out in the early 2000s without bias. I've given myself my own elvish name using Tolkien's languages when I was 12 and I can even write them down in his runic language. I've been participating in fictional battle forum debates representing LOTR characters for years, and I proved once and for all that Gandalf can beat both Darth Vader and Dumbledore with one hand behind his back. Even though Hobbit disappointed me, I've still seen all of the movies back to back out of my loyalty for Jackson, including extended editions, and till this day I enjoy an occasional re-watch, even though I watch the fan-edits like the "Cardinal Cut" which is a cropped version of the Hobbit that removes most of the stuff that wasn't in the books and cuts it all down to one 4 hour long movie, which it should've been from the start. I must've watched Jackson's LOTR trilogy hundreds of times, and I'm not even kidding. Extended Fellowship loop used to be my background noise throughout the whole middle school. I know every line from those movies. Rings of Power? Yeah... I will be skipping this one. If some corporation wants to make Tolkien fan fiction from the ROTK footnotes and dance on Tolkien's grave as they do it, they're gonna have to do it *OUT OF MY FUCKING SIGHT.*
Want to see an authentic, non forced strong female lead? Ellen Ripley, Alien, 1979. Adapting a book or parts of the book is to bring the words of the author to the screen. Not changing a rich, detailed fantasy world to your own idea of a mirror of daily life 2022. If you want a woke fantasy movie, write your own and don't rape a beloved classic novel just because you have the money to spread a message. This is ignorant and racist in its own way. Want a show featuring mostly black people? Adapt one which hasn't mostly white people in it. Heck, the African lore is so rich, adapt a great story to the screen. Tons of talented black actors out there! Do something fresh! But please dont force your wokeness on my beloved Middle Earth.
An authentic, non forced strong female lead? Read any novel by Jane Austen. From the Napoleonic era. Or any novel by the Brontë sisters, from the mid 19th century. Or by Agatha Christie, from the Interbellum. This wheel was invented a long ago.
1930's movie, The Mystery of The Wax Museum. Main character is a female reporter, saves the life of a falsely accused man, discovers the real villain, and gets the guy falling for her in the end. 1930's. No one has issues with that Warner Brothers movie.
@@AnnaMarianne I just rewatched Pride and Prejudice last night. It's still beloved after 200 years, so there must be something profoundly enjoyable there
Ripley is a really bad example if you're trying to criticize modern Hollywood. The knights watch crew are constantly complaining about female characters who express male characteristics and lack femininity in modern cinema. Ripley is the epitome of this with the part originally being written for a male lead and only being filled by Sigourney Weaver at the last moment. Rewatch Alien with a critical eye and you'll see a lot of the tropes people attack modern Hollywood writing for in the film, including the dreaded, all the men are incompetent and the woman knows best.
I think what pisses me off the most, on the very FIRST pages of the Fellowship of the Ring is a Foreword by Tolkien. In which he states that NO PART of his story is ALLEGORICAL. And remember, this man experienced WW1, and was around for WW2. But he states explicitly that the story he has created does not have any deeper political meaning behind it, because in his eyes Allegory ruined stories and literature. I remember he specifically says he prefers "history" to "allegory". It's the first god damn thing you read in the trilogy. Deciding to use his stories and add your own allegory to it is spitting in the face of that brilliant man. I pray the show isn't as bad as people are presuming it will be, but man I have to say my hopes are not getting any bigger.
You lack critical thinking my friend. As much as he protested that he didn't like allegory, his works are allegorical none the less. Many of his peers, and other writers pointed out how closely the subject matter, symbolisms and general themes of Lord of the Rings mirror the experiences of Tolkien throughout the War and Apartheid in South Africa. Also, his inspirations for the mythology and spirituality of Middle Earth matches his own, and his own spiritual beliefs. It's not just some random mythology, the loss of magic in the world, the fate of the elves, all of that matches his own views on many subjects on the fall of humanity and romance in modernity. An artist saying their work isn't and shouldn't be read as allegorical, doesn't make it so. Actually, in one of George Orwell's final books, he speaks about this exact phenomenon. Orwell also wanted to write fiction for the sake of fiction, and avoid entering politicisation and allegory. But throughout his life he realised that detaching the art from the artist was impossible, so he leaned into it. After all of his work, his conclusion is that it is impossible for works of fiction to not reflect the biases and political motivations of their writer, no matter how hard they try to run away from doing so. Art is always allegorical, if you read into the life and beliefs of artists, you can quickly see what their story is about, and how they perceive reality. It is a reality artists cannot escape, whether they like it or not. There are many lyrcial sections and poems in LotR that reframe poems written by pen palls and friends of his that died at war. And even Tolkien, after a while, started admitting he had inserted parts of him and his experience in the story. C.S. Lewis wrote a bit on how much LotR is an experiential reflection of the War (as in, the feeling and reality of what it meant to be in those trenches), the experience of what it felt like returning home, the lack of female figures in the story, Saruman's obsession with industry (mirroring the state of the War)... honestly... There is TONs of evidence that the LotR is more of a 1 to 1 mirror of Tolkien's lived reality during the War than actual escapist fantasy. He's clearly coming to terms with what he is going through by writing about it, but unable to recognise it as such. Such is the nature of dissociation and trauma. People who are obsessed with this idea that fiction can be purely escapist are just not thinking about what they consume. The fiction they consume that they consider "escapist" isn't actually devoid of allegory or deeper meaning. It is usually that the themes and ideas being communicated don't challenge them or their views, either because those ideas align, or because the theme is too diluted or subtle to challenge them. The problem with modern media isn't that it's "too political" or "forcing a message". ALL works of fiction are allegorical and politcal. The problem is that they are actually not doing it through metaphors, allegory or symbolism. It's just there, on the surface. And that's why a lot of right leaning people, who generally lack critical thinking skills, get upset about it: media, literature and art has usually been left leaning in its subtext, but now it isn't even subtext. Because now they finally see what the message is, it has been made painfully obvious for them, without any poetry or artistic subterfuge to it. It's also why a big portion of left leaning people hate it. Because it's virtue signalling garbage with no substance or further commentary / thought behind it. These works are not made for people with strong political motivations of any kind, because they way they present their message is patronising and insulting. It's made for people who lack critical thinking skills, but who don't have a right wing political bias.
@@korsoredeemed4893 on the contrary, though you provide an excellent point, what I said still stands true. You are right, of course his experiences influenced his story telling and world building. But as you said, they are deep beneath the surface, and are vague metaphors at the most. None of it is right in your face. That's what makes LOTR timeless. It has no clear contemporary political message. But the themes are there. Though, disguised as they are, unless you try over analyzing his works, it's not easy to pick up on them. And that's the point. Though of course, you are absolutely right, as I said above he couldn't possibly write his stories without his experiences influencing his story, on the surface they do NOT present as allegorical. And that's all that matters. That is my point in my original comment. In the show they've made it very clear on the surface that they want to include political messages, and the merit of which is irrelevant - they could be good, positive messages, but it doesn't matter. It is still ruining the potential of the show. Taking a timeless story and world, and adding in contemporary messages renders it timeless no longer. Instead of focusing on what most Tolkien fans want, they are choosing to focus on things irrelevant to his works. That's the issue, bottom line. I pray that it won't be as bad as I hear it may be. But considering all of their marketing has chosen to focus on such political messages.. I don't have much hope. To say I lack critical thinking implicates you in the same way, as you are only looking at my comment on the surface as well - without even commenting upon the broader implications of my point. Debating semantics is pointless. The point still stands that Tolkien was not a fan of Allegory. Whether you want to call it on the surface allegory or not, it's still a fact that it's one of the very first things written in the LOTR trilogy. And it doesn't change the fact that they are going against his wishes by adding contemporary political messages to his work - which greatly reduces the immersion of what is supposed to be a different, fantastical world, something you can get lost in, something to wonder and marvel at, and completely immerse yourself within. To escape our own world. It ruins the experience, the story, the depth, and the timeless nature of his works. Nonetheless, I do admit that I should have been a bit more nuanced. Either way though, my point stands. But I do appreciate that you expanded upon such nuances, which are important.
@@devonchin94 "It has no clear contemporary political message." - It does have one. If there is one thing to take out of LotR is the stress, trauma and hardship of that specific era of War, violence and struggle. It is heavily contrasted through the peaceful life of the Hobbits, as they recall their experiences in the Shire amidst the hopeless chaos they face in their journey. The state of idyllic peace contrasted with the industrial engine of war, conquest and needless domination. Which was different to past Wars, and wars today. "None of it is right in your face." - It isn't explicit. The Hobbit is pretty crazy. You could completely glaze over the Dwarven metaphor of Jews as a nomadic people trying to reclaim their homeland that is the Lonely Mountain. "And that's all that matters. That is my point in my original comment." - Honestly, it came off as "why can't my media just be escapism, even the writer agrees with me". I'm sorry if I was a bit harsh in what I said. "Taking a timeless story and world, and adding in contemporary messages renders it timeless no longer" - I don't think it would have been bad for them to explore struggles of today that relate with the themes of Tolkien's work. Subtle metaphors about the war in Ukraine, for example, might have elevated it. I also think George Orwell is timeless, despite his works being explicit and contemporary. It's more about how it's done really. "Instead of focusing on what most Tolkien fans want" - I disagree. As an artist, I believe it is this exact sentiment that has led us specifically to this point where media has worsened, becoming meaningless, endless franchising. Pandering to audiences is how we got capitalists to suck the life and creativity out of the industry, and consolidate their influence. Now most media is washed out shades of the same stories, repackaged with a new look, safe and unambitious, with tasteless people just profitting off of all of it. "they are choosing to focus on things irrelevant to his works" - I don't think that is what is happening. I think it's a simple case of "this franchise makes money" - "sequel?" - "no, we'll have to pay too many writers" - "reboot?" - "nah, people will say we're just money grabbing" - "use older material but adapt it in a way for modern audiences" - "yes, brilliant"... and then proceed to vaguely gloss over everything taking two or three notes and make something out of it. "To say I lack critical thinking implicates you in the same way, as you are only looking at my comment on the surface as well" - Your comment was about allegory and Tolkien's thoughts on it. You implied that you were upset with the show's intention to force a message. It was important to you to claim that LotR doesn't have political meaning. I wasn't looking at your comment on the surface - there was just nothing else to indicate you have a nuanced opinion about this. This is an actual position people hold, that "their media doesn't have deeper meaning, it's just escapism, leave it be". I was addressing that with enough information to make that assumption from what you had written. "it's still a fact that it's one of the very first things written in the LOTR trilogy. And it doesn't change the fact that they are going against his wishes by adding contemporary political messages to his work" - That was part of my point. Whether he likes it or not, his work was allegorical. And whether he likes it or not, people who will interpret his work are going to insert their own experiences in some way or another. It's just a bit of a "bad take" overall from the writer. Writers are fallible humans with bad opinions too. My issue is that this is a pretty weak arguement against Amazon and corporate interest in media at large. Recycling, never taking risks, only following profit, taking works out of context, pandering to audiences, fan service... These are things they have been doing for ages, and it was so upsetting to see as an artist. But people didn't seem to mind because it wasn't forcing "a message" that upset them. However, tt was always forcing "a message" (not LotR specifically, but this phenomenon isn't exactly new). Many LotR fans argued back in the day that it was unfaithful to the books, and its action glorified something Tolkien was not about, while putting too little focus on the emotional aspect of the story - Tolkien's own son made this point. It's just that it has changed now, and people are catching on. "what is supposed to be a different, fantastical world, something you can get lost in" - this would be a specific arguement for lack of critical thinking btw. They're not supposed to be something you can get lost in. That's being intentionally ignorant of the impact and connection we have to these stories. These worlds are romantizations of experiences, thoughts, fears, emotions... everything the artist is going through. An artist can't escape that. And we connect with the works through the emotions we feel when we experience them. We connect with it, it isn't "just escapist fantasy" - there is something in there that speaks to us. The loss of magic, the innocence of a simple life, the corruption of the world, there are allegories of traditionalism, moral decay, etc. Whether intentional or not. We connect with his feelings about these subject, conciously or subconciously. Thinking about why we connect with things is important, especially because we are shaped by our experiences. There is no such thing as actual escapism. There is always a specific thing that draws us to the art, and something it awakens in us when we enjoy it.
The Orcs piled up the Hill of the Slain. It was a memorial of their victory. If this is supposed to remind us of it, NOT a good idea to have Galadriel fix/build it. I as a reader find it weird.
If you go back to the Song of the Ainur, one point Tolkien emphasized was the forces of good repurposing supposed triumphs of evil to highlight triumphs of good instead. So, rededicating a mound of elven dead raised by orcs as a sign of their victory into a memorial of elven valor would be in keeping with the Legendarium, so of course that can't be what the show runners were trying to do.
Referring to Sauron being the bad guy: Some knew of him only by name, for he was the principle lieutenant of Morgoth. So when Morgoth fell, Sauron took over. He had a form known as Annatar who was the bringer of gifts. Some fell for the ploy while others saw through it. People really recognized Sauron as the true enemy when the rings of power were forged. However, Sauron began corrupting people to his side before the rings were made. Like when Numenor fell into the sea.
Numenor fell long after the rings were made, though - like 1,700+ years after their forging. But you're right, corrupting and deceiving people was Sauron's 'thing' in the First Age already, as well as in the Second Age. The Elves never trusted him again after he forged the One Ring, but mortal men tend to forget things after more than a dozen generations, so Ar-Pharazon was fooled by Sauron's flattery, just like Celebrimbor was 17 centuries earlier.
Sauron was a shape shifter he could also transform himself into terrible beasts such as a were wolf and even a serpent . This is all described in silmirillion
Lore Dump: Numenor shouldn't encounter Sauron until almost 2,000 years after the rings are made. Galadriel has a husband who was a leader among the elves in the battle against Sauron and a daughter who later marries Elrond. Numenor is founded right at the beginning of the Second Age (32). The aesthetic is supposed to be the Great Byzantine (as far as I know) with extremely Anglo-Saxon features. 1500 years later, Sauron (In the guise of Annatar) introduced the concept of the rings to Celebrimbor (The greatest of the elf smiths). They crafted most of the rings together, but Celebrimbor became suspicious and forged three in secret (The Elf rings). In the meantime, Sauron forged the one ring. When he put the one ring on, he learned of the presence of the three elven rings. Sauron goes to war with the elves (1693) They fight for 1,500 years before Miriel (The Queen of Numenor) is even born... a little later (SA 3261), the Numenoreans actually get involved in the war with Sauron (Which lasted about a week). It isn't until the Third Age that the Balrog of Moria is even found...
@@thatguyonthespectrum4894 I've already been through this with WoT. Just ignore it and all the activists masquerading as fans. They want to demoralize you into capitulation. They're the Nazgul and we're the hobbits. Hairy, big footed, vertically challenged blighters that are too dumb to be sad. I can feel a Tom Bombadil song coming on.
While most of the Balrogs were killed in the War of Wrath, some escaped and hid deep underground, there is no mention of Balrogs being active in the second age at all so where they get a Balrog coming into this second age story baffles me. That said it may not necessarily be the the Balrog of Moria.
Correction about the numenorians and the war of elves and sauron: the war lasted for 8 years not 1500, and it was ended by the numenoreans led by minastir who came to middle earth to defeat sauron. Also the war starts about 200 years after the forging of the rings and about 100 years after sauron forges his one ring (the three elven rings are also forged shortly before the one ring)
20:43: I think that guy asked: "how am I supposed to hold these two things?" And then the showrunners just said "just pretend the torch is a flashlight and the sword is a gun, and you're a cop exploring some dark, dangerous cellar."
I bet that the torches are held that way just to light up the faces so you could properly see the actors, without them needing to put extra work into elaborate lighting. The same way they put light inside the space suit helmets in a lot of sifi movies.
I don't know the exact quote but every time Shad says "eh whatever it's fantasy I guess" I think of when Peter Jackson said he wanted everything to look as though it could have existed in history. So in other words, he and his team literally referenced actual historical armor and weapons and did their best to morph it into a fantasy setting and adapt that to each culture in Middle-Earth without making it look or feel in any way impractical. Meanwhile this show just be like "eh, I don't know put some fantasy crap all over it the nerds will eat it up" Little do they understand that Tolkien fans aren't just your typical nerd. ;P
Sauron was known in the 2nd age cause he was Morgoths Lieutenant in the first age. He used the guise of Annatar exactly because no one would trust him under his real name. I also think they are setting up some of the nazgul "origin stories".
@@matiashamalainen4574 Tbf, the time frames of the second age would be impossible to portray in a tv show even with the utmost care for the lore. All mortal characters would just die all the time of old age. Sauron spent centuries teaching Celebrimbor and his smiths new stuff, must make for a riveting montage though, as we see generations of peasant hobbits get old and die while they try new fancy ways of ringmaking. 😂
@@yeahjustme3680 The timeline is one of the reasons I would not even trust talented writers to pull off Second Age show. But, instead we have talentless hacks working on it.
One of the funnier parts was an interview with the woman who plays the drawf of colou (lol) claiming that her character is a magic user. Apparently magic is now as prevalent in Tolkien's works as it is in DnD.
So if I remember correctly, in the Hobbit, the dwarves did actually have a very limited capacity of magic. They use it to hide the gold they get from the trolls or something like that. They are also known for making magic toys in the books. So i guess it really depends on what the definition of magic user is for the show. If she runs around doing magic like a wizard, that would be supremely dumb though
The stance with the torch and the sword actually reminds me of a modern(ish) stance for holding a flashlight with a handgun called a "Harris hold" where you hold the flashlight in your support hand in a reverse grip and put your strong hand with the pistol over the wrist of the support hand so you can have isometric tension to stabilize your shot while holding the light forward. Thing is, it works for a handgun because you're pointing the gun forward (because that's where the bullets come out of), plus you need that tension in order to help mitigate recoil. Neither of which are relevant for swords, so clearly the directors copied something they learned from modern gunplay and tried applying it to medieval fantasy stuff. Lindybeige pointed out that the tendency in movies where people draw a bow and hold it there for long periods of time also comes from gunplay, as waiting for the perfect moment to fire is very much a key tactic for gunfighting (both in movies and real life, see "Don't shoot til you see the whites of their eyes" in the Battle of Bunker Hill). You can do that with a gun, because all you have to do to aim a gun is to hold it. You can't do that with bows and arrows because you'd rapidly fatigue if you attempted that.
Alternative is that they stole the pose from The Witcher because they thought it looked cool, at least whatever her name was had the questionable excuse that her enemy clearly (and believably) stated that he didn't want to kill her.
Which is why It works for a Crossbow better. Heck. Even the movie Trilogy showed this in the Battle of Helmsdeep when that Old man accidentally lost his grip and shot the first arrow of Helmsdeep
I'm not sure what's worse: The actual stuff we've seen so far (and by extension the show itself) or the creators still claiming they are honoring Tolkien, doing this in his vision and so on.
Years of First Age: 1-590 | Second Age: 1-3441 3:53 This is possibly *Dagor Bragollach* - one of the wars at the end of the First Age. Galadriel didn't fight that war and how did she piled up all the helmets of the dead? If this isn't Dagor Bragollach, then it can be many wars and it's too vague to guess which one they mean. 10:44 This is *Tar Miriel*, the queen of Numenor. But she got blackwashed and she's not suppose to be born until toward the end of the Second Age. She is not the queen of Gondor. Gondor kingdom was founded by Isildur and his brother toward the end of the Second Age, after the fall of Numenor. 11:40 This is a *Palantir*. There are few of them and essentially they act like a communication device between the 2 users. This was bad editing by Amazon, making the Palantir as if it can see the future. 11:56 This might be one of her brothers that died during the First Age. It can't be her husband, *Celeborn*, because he's still alive (although Amazon has no problem breaking lore) and we also see him in LotR. Celeborn never dies in Middle-Earth, he sails to Valinor/Aman at the end of Third Age after Sauron's defeat. ---12:50 Eminem cameo. 16:40 Assuming the Balrog we see during the end of the trailer is really *Durin's Bane*, then this is yet another lore breaking done by Amazon. Durin's Bane was in slumber for thousands of years until Third Age 1980 when the dwarves accidentally awaken him. But this could be "just" a Balrog that Amazon decided to shove in for some action. ---17:30 Evil Disney fortress cameo. 17:46 Actually, Sauron was known as the bad guy from early Second Age. He just shapeshifted to an Elf named *Annatar* and disguised himself as master craftsman. People didn't know that Annatar = Sauron, but some elves (Gil-Galad, Galadriel and Elrond) did had suspicion about him and didn't trust him when he came to them as Annatar "bringer of gifts". 18:00 As far as I remember, Sauron didn't steal the idea of forging rings to control people. Sauron was a disciple of *Aule* (god of crafting) so he always had a thing for crafting. Sauron knew he can't beat the elves and men by force, so he planned to corrupt them from within (by crafting magical rings), turning them against each other and perhaps turn them to his side. ---19:02 Freddy Krueger cameo. ---20:00 SHAD RANT! Firing lasers from his eyes. You've been warned. ---20:45 Chinese introduce gunpowder to Middle-Earth. 27:21 This is probably *Oath of Feanor* during the end of Years of the Trees (just before First Age). *Feanor* was the elf that forged the *3 Silmarils*. The elves are his 7 sons that swore to never rest until they return the stolen Silmarils from Morgoth/Melkor (the OG bad guy, the mightest of the gods). 35:25 Amazon don't care about diversity, they just want to corrupt and destroy Tolkien. If they really wanted diversity, they should have introduced the lands of *Harad and Rhun* that are heavily influenced by middle-east and african cultures (and maybe even some middle Asian cultures such as India). I'm sure that every fan of Tolkien would be psyched (myself included) to see those lands, the people and their culture. Amazon could have showed us Harad and Rhun, the *2 blue wizards* and the conflict between Sauron trying to corrupt the peolpe to his side and how the blue wizards undermine him. Amazon can still do it in later seasons but it will be a woke mess as everything else. But one beg the question, if they wanted diversity so much, why not show these lands first? 42:17 There should not be wizards in Middle-Earth Second Age. *The Istari* were 5 "wizards" (Maiar = angels equivalent, messengers of the gods), they were sent to Middle-Earth to help the people against Sauron. They appeared in *Mithlond / Grey Havens* at Third Age 1000 (one of the western city of elves, where in Return of the King the ship sails in the end of the movie). 46:42 Indeed, during Fellowship of the Ring, when the 4 hobbits travel to Bree, they get caught by the barrow-wights and Tom Bombadil comes to save them. (That scene, and Tom Bombadil were not shot unfortunately).
Funny enough there was a period where the numenoreans were essentially white slavers and colonizers like europeans where it was the perfect opportunity for amazon to "woke" showing the lands of southeast but i guess they cant even woke properly lol
"We thought the war" probably stands for "we fought against Morgoth", not some particular battle, and the pile of helmets is a metaphor of them all or somethong. The dialogue in the trailer is so empty. They should have used something like "We thought the war against the utmost evil. At last Morgoth was defeated, but not all of his deeds could be undone...". Even those who read the books are confused, let alone normies.
I already saw this comparison made on Twitter. More people are actually hating the look, including me-but that's obvious since I don't like what they're doing with the show anyway. But it's also the ones who're defending this show that are also put off by it. If that's actually Sauron, boy has the casting director made a mistake.
@@toodlescae Honestly, for the sake of the viewers who actually want to watch the show but doesn't like Sauron, or Annatar as he should be in this case, that would... be slightly better. I still don't like it but I already made my thoughts on that clear. I'm still wondering why they didn't just have Sauron be Annatar. The dynamic can be a bit like Palpatine in the Prequels: the viewers know he's bad but he's acting so charming and friendly that they get why others wouldn't see it.
@@toodlescae But he was hiding himself as Annatar, the gift bringer, to trick the elves into forging the rings pf power. Where did they get this Halbrand character from?
The pile of helms is a possible reference to a 19th century painting The Apotheosis of War by Vasily Vereshchagin. The scene and the painting have very similar composition. If you'll show human naked bones on screen, it will be difficult to get a distribution certificate in China. So the reference is needed to show the pile of sculls without showing any sculls at all.
The sword/arrow thing got me too. I was sure at fist he was holding a bow and arrow, but it was dumb as hell to hold the arrow on his wrist. Then I realised it was a sword, and that this shot was a different kind of stupid than I initially thought.
It's like that thing people do with flashlights and handguns, with the flashlight in reverse grip. But with torches and swords, as if that makes any sense or even looks remotely good or cool
It makes no sense for the elves to make a big memorial for fallen elves at all. When they die, they go to the Halls of Mandos and are reborn. Every single elf knows this so why pile helmets up when you know you will eventually see your dead friends again. The elves reaction in the Silmarilion when they discover that men die is one of the more impactful moments of the book and their collective reaction to Beren and Luthien shows a degree of grief beyond anything else they ever display for anyone else. Even when they lose Fingolfin there is nothing even close to the degree of mourning shown for Luthien.
@@lewiswarburton1224 the elves know what happens when they die as settled fact. While mankind believes in an afterlife they never return to Arda when they die. The separation of the elder children of Illuvatar from the younger children happens regardless of whether or not heaven exists and for men it is not confirmed concretely what happens when they die. Death is referred to as the Gift of Men but there is no elaboration on what this means. This ambiguity led directly to the Downfall of Numenor as Ar Pharazon rebelled against the Valar.
Who says the Elves made it? There was a mound after the Nirnaeth Arnoediad after all. Just because Galadriel is checking out a helmet doesn’t mean she piled them all.
What makes this even more hillarious is that I saw an article by the BBC saying that fans were amazed by the trailers that have been shown. Who were they refering to? None of what i've seen suggests that fans are excited by this utter rubbush.
4:13 That pile could be the hill of bodies (maybe it was just heads?) that was left after the Nirnaeth Arnoediad (Battle of Unnumbered Tears) where the combined forces of elves and men were slaughtered before the gates of angband during the first age. The orcs did that after the battle and eventually grass grew over the hill and they stayed away from it.
But as the theme progressed, it came into the heart of Melkor to interweave matters of his own imagining that were not in accord with the theme of Iluvatar; for he saught therein to increase the power and glory of the part assigned to himself.
About the Balrog at the end. It really depends on what they're doing with it. Just because "The Balrog" is not an individual entity but a variant of Maiar (the 5 wizards are also Maiar for example). After the first age the remaining Balrogs fled to underground caverns and hid there. So if this isn't turning out to be the Balrog of Kazhad-Dûm this could actually just be one of the escaped Balrogs hiding away somewhere. Although it would still be weird why the elves didn't make note of such a sighting during the Second Age.... y'know... the appearance of a Balrog, a prime soldier of the great enemy would really kick up some dust.
it has to be durin's bane, because durin's folk lived in kazad dum, and the name durin itself means that they lived and reclaimed this place if i'm correct (only seven durins throughougt history), so knowing diurin is here, and a balrog too .... yeah ....
Sauron according to Amazon: "I need to trick Elfars... I got it! I'll disguise myself as a doomed meth addict Eminem and Eldars will be enticed by that form, and I'll rap to Eldars and Eldars will forge me some bling-bling that will make me their pimp! I'm a freaking genius!
@@mikkelborchsenius1156 where is that guy shown? Also, who would that be? Saruman? Saruman didn't arrive until the third age, and only after the ue wizards
@@michelecastellotti9172 Halbrand is the white guy who is on the raft with Galadriel and is also seen in the halls of Numenor. I have no idea what you mean with your saruman reference, so I am just going to ignore it.
love your trailer breakdown, the trailer is really a mess to be honest but I like how you add a bit of banter here and there throughout your video, it's hilarious
I would hope they haven't killed off Celeborn (Galadriel's husband). I was assuming that was her brother who died that she was crying over.... In regards to Sauron, throughout the Second Age he was viewed in many different ways. Sometimes (mostly) a villain, other times kinda like a villain trying to reform (during his stay at Numenor), and as Annatar the Lord of Gifts (This was when he was with the Elves, not Numenor. Apparently this needed to be edited to clarify to people what I'm saying) he wasn't actually known to be Sauron.
He's assumed dead in the first season. They've also decided to ship Galadriel and Sauron on the show - Halbrand is supposed to be Sauron based on the recent leaks.
If I remember correctly, Sauron (then known as Annathar, the bringer of gifts) was presenting himself as a friend to the elves and helped celebrimbor in crafting the rings of power to then use his part in that to be able to forge the one ring. Sauron was known as a Leuitnat of Morgoth but no one guessed that the beautiful, wise and kind Annathar would be Sauron.
When it comes to the helmet pile, it is an interesting looking scene with it's desolate landscape, pile of shiny helms and a lone white gown figure at it's base. I can image the camera panning to the right where there is probably a large industrial conveyor belt which made that pile of SHAME!
I agree, why would Galadriel who knows that the elves are reembodied in the Halls of Mandos act like a human and create a pile of helmets like that as a symbol of death? Not to mention why would she take the same action that Morgoth used to mock the elves after the Nirnaeth Arnoediad?
33:10 You can see the chain that the block is attached with. It's probably for them to not have it drop and they can put it back easy for another shot OR That kicked "stone"block would not fall anywhere and make the kick inconsequential. but it feels more like a "ups-microphone-in-shot"-moment. I love you all, and tolkien's world.
As a rough estimation for that pile of helmets. Assuming it is 3 galadriels high (assuming 1 galadriel = 1.7 meters) and 6 galadriels wide at the botton that gives us about 15.5 m³. In those 15 m³ assuming a helmet has roughly 5 dm³ or 0.005 m€ you could fit a total of 3100 helmets in there. Seems at least reasonable as an amount killed on a large battlefield.
That is way more than 15m3. I have dug up slightly more than 15 cubic meters with a showel and that pile was many times smaller. If it's 6x1,7m wide then the area it covers at the bottom is about 80m2. 80x1,5 galadriel gives a volume about 10x your 15m3. So 30 000+ helmets. Looks more accurate
Sauron was one of two lieutenants of Morgoth ( the other one was Gothmog, captain of the Belryg) he was not the boogieman at this point. But he must have been known to the elves, especially to Galadriel. He approaches the elves and introduces himself as Annatar, lord of gifts me tries to trick elves into creating the rings. He fails to trick Elrond and Galadriel.
Reminder: Don't attribute to incompetence that which can be adequately explained by malice. They will eviscerate our beloved setting, they will mock and deride fans for hating it, and they will rebrand the world for the lowest common denominator. Never give them the benefit of the doubt for just being hacks- they are malicious hacks and they hate you.
Exactly what I try and tell people. These companies don't make billions by being incompetent. They openly hate us and want to see us demoralized. And losing money in a venture like this is an "acceptable loss" for the glory of their proverbial motherland.
4:11 in the First Age there was a battle against Morgoth where tens of thousands of elves died. The orcs piled the bodies up and made a massive hill. That hill is the only place where grass will grow in the area of the battle. 12:10 between Morgoth and Sauron, there are thousands of years of wars and fighting. Galadriel looses many of her male family members, including several brothers and an uncle I believe. 17:00 the show runner has admitted to compressing the time down, so instead of events taking thousands of years, over the course of multiple Numenorian kings, they've compressed it down to just a few decades in the lifespan of one king. 18:00 Sauron escaped the capture of Morgoth, waited several hundred years, then revealed himself and waged war. There were at least 2 major conflicts before the Numenorians capture him. In between those conflicts, I believe, is when Sauron approached the elves in disguise as the Giver of Gifts. Sauron was a skilled craftsmen that had served under the Smith God, the ability to craft jewelry was entirely his own. He spends 300 years teaching elves how to forge the Rings of Power, and Sauron was there for the forging of all the Rings except for the 3 elven rings.
@@michelecastellotti9172 Are you referring to the Dagor Bragollach, the Battle of Sudden Flame? That happens in the First Age (Years of the Sun) 456 about 1650 years before the forging of the Rings of Power in SA 1500 and 3250 years before Elendil is born SA 3100, 3350 years before Isildur is born SA 3200, and 3550 years before the War of the Last Alliance which kills Gil-Galad and Elendil and where Isildur takes the one ring was a wereguild for the deaths of his father and brothers. So, yes, they are compressing a shit ton. This is traveling more into the "Inspired by" realm rather than "based on" and is quickly moving toward bad fan fiction. EDIT: My math was off on the timeline. Now corrected.
I also thought 4:11 could be the Haudh-en-Nirnaeth/Hill of the Slain, but whats shown in the trailer is a well ordered mound of empty helmets, while the Hill was a pile of corpses thrown together by orcs. So the confusion and logistics issues they point out are still an issue. So, now I'm thinking its been done wrong on purpose. They don't have the rights to the details of that particular series of events in the first age, but they still want to make reference to it.
@@penguycs4593 Galadriel could never have been near Haudh-en-Nirnaeth, not only because she wasn't a warrior princess, but also because the faction she was a part of, the Sindar of Doriath led by Thingol, refused to be a part of the alliance attacking Angband.
The name "sauron" was widely known as a bad guy (right hand of Morgoth) from the first age. Sauron then reappeared in the second age disguised as Annatar in order to trick the numenorians into working for him and to trick the elves of eregion to welcome him to their smithies where he could corrupt the rings given to men and dwarves. Only then did he proclaim himself as the returning dark lord
Sauron was a Maiar beneath Aule, the Smith (as was Saruman, by the way). He was well versed in crafting and ring lore. It was Sauron who instructed others in the forging of the rings of power, eventually making his own. When he instructed the Elves in this craft, it's suggested that he added in his own backdoor, such that when he finally put on the One Ring, the Elves sensed him, and took theirs off. The implication being that the Elven rings are tied to the One Ring. This is also referenced after the One Ring is destroyed, that the Elven rings have - possibly - lost their power. In the Lord of the Rings (IIRC), it is also mentioned that Saruman also experiments with ring lore, crafting his own. But it is not as powerful as the creations of Sauron.
The random dirty man with harfoots in the background convinced me. Meteor man is Gandalf. He's greeted by a harfoot in the crater, so that's likely why he's so fond of hobbits in LotR. A+ logic :D I wouldn't put it past the writers.
16:08 Sauron did disguise himself as an elf though, according to the lore, certainly not as a human, so not sure why they would need to disguise that he's an elf. 12:38 The dead elf could be her brother according to speculation 19:28 who is the kid with the broken sword supposed to be?
Your work has entertained, educated, and inspired me for years. Now, I am finally ready to give you a little something in return. For the last 20 years, I have written roughly 1 million words for friends and family, with the simple purpose of earning adequate skill at storytelling. I honed my writing, and even ultimately benefited from deep, painful personal struggles, so that I could finally tell a specific short story. It complements and builds up one of your favorite films. And, incidentally, it also showcases many examples of genuine, loving masculinity displayed in a variety of ways. Further, I feel it sets a very high bar for what respectful, quality “fanfiction” should strive to be. Upholding a beloved work. Understanding it, valuing it, and forgiving any supposed flaws. Contributing a modest addition to someone else’s great legacy. Underscoring and deepening the arc of an already beloved character. Teaching the same positive lessons with the same noble themes, in a slightly different way. Honoring the work, the creator of that work, and all those who have come to love it for what it is. Your novel proves you don't shy away from facing darkness and tragedy. You have shown us your deep compassion and honest inner strength. You also show love and honor to children. With respect, Shadrach, I my little story will be painful for you. you will come away proud for having forged through to the end. And perhaps, you might come away even stronger than you have already, correctly, seen yourself to be. I strove to keep the story focused, purposeful, limiting it to just 22,000 words. It may not be perfect, but it certainly tries to be. I hope you will consider giving it a read. Based on what you’ve shown everyone of your true self (behind your hilarious outward persona), I believe you will approve of these efforts. You may be uplifted and proud for having put forth the time to read it. And you will then enjoy going back to watch one of your favorite trilogies yet again, perhaps getting even more out of the experience. The tale is humbly posted, amidst countless others, on fanfiction.net, under the title “The Children of Rohan,” by WillDreamer.
Remember the Galadriel in the books and the PJ films? That was the Galadriel that was so kind and benevolent, that when the fellowship was departing from Lothlorien, she gave Gimli three locks of hair when he only asked for one. To think that was just one of many acts of kindness shown by her. Such acts that say so much more than any of the projected five seasons that we are going to get.
An act of kindness towards Gimli... aaand after all these years sticking it to Feanor one last time, who asked her for just one of her hairs to use in his craft (I think in combination with the Silmarils)... three times. And He was denied three times. Love it. 😁
Concerning the opening of the trailer with the giant pile of helmets... Where DAFUCK are the bodies? Did she actually walk miles between the battlefield and the pile? Look carefully, there is not a single corpse in that shot for miles!
The Balrog has a few things wrong with it. 1. Durin's bane is the only Balrog we know to be uncovered after the 1st age and war of the wrath. 2. Durin's bane didnt pop out until the 3rd age after sauron lost his ring. 3. That design is a john howe/ peterjackson design. So by using it they're saying this is canon to the Jackson movies. Actually Balrogs may have looked very human light, albeit demonish and 12 feet tall with fire smoke and ash.
I just watched a video from Nerd of the Rings about Ungoliant. ( ua-cam.com/video/8QmtTd_rdu8/v-deo.html ) He talks about Melkor's Balrogs "who fly on winged speed... to his rescue." Personally I'm just fine with the Balrog's appearance in the Peter Jackson movies. Everything else you said, though, is definitely correct and this trailer/show is, and is going to be, trash.
The Silmarillion states that some balrogs have fled to hide after the first age, there's no reason to believe Durin's Bane is the only survivor. In addition, Sauron itself can probably adopt the appearance of a balrog.
@@wipe3100 Regardless, the trailer definitely refers to it specifically as Durin’s Bane, which it was only named after driving the Dwarves out of Khazad Dum. That didn’t happen until the Third Age, and the show is supposed to take place during the First Age, (or the Second at the very latest).
Galadriel's husband, Celeborn was well and alive throughout the Second Age, heading the remnants of Sindar elves from Doriath. He defended Eregion from Sauron's armies and had to withdraw his forces and unite with Elrond's. There could have also been interesting dinamics between him and Celebrimbor loving the same woman.
I'm pretty sure he and Galadriel have been married since mid-First Age - sometime between her arrival in Beleriand in 52 and the fall of Nargothrond in 495. Which means they've been together 1300-1700 years by the time Sauron appears in Middle Earth in the Second Age. Their daughter Celebrian is about 900 at this time. Galadriel really ought to have settled down a bit by now, she's had a lot of responsibility for a long time.
You should read the comments on that trailer. They are hilarious. People are mocking this thing to pieces. 🤣 The clips are just all over the place with disconnected dialogue that make no sense. You can't possibly have any idea of what the story is. Also there is no way that the Sauron from the books would disguise himself as a human. Galadriel fought in a couple of battles but not with a sword and only in defense. She hated violence. She had enough magical power to blow a hole in the world if she ever fully unleashed it. The "Emonim" dude is supposedly a priest leading a cult of Sauron that's looking for Sauron. They think the meteor man is Sauron and attack the "Harfoots". Meanwhile Saueon has disguised himself as Halbrand..a human.
If that's not Sauron but an elf serving him it would be very lore unfriendly. I read in the nature of middle earth that elves never willingly served Morgoth or Sauron. If they did it was either because they were enslaved or they were serving their own selfish desires.
You literally contradicted yourself buddy. It’s pretty obvious this Adar elf dude will serve his own desires and yet you say in the same comment that it will be lore unfriendly. Sounds to me like you want to complain just for the sake of complaining
Fun fact, in the movie Lancelot with Richard Gere, his mail was just knit yarn spray painted silver. His shield was very crudely formed from aluminum 1" angle for the rim, and roughly ground aluminum forming fleur-de-lis shapes within the rim, all welded together with modern aluminum welding technology, spray painted silver.
Tom Bombadil rescues them from the barrow wight. The swords that they get from the barrow mound were forged by a people that were fighting the Witch King of Angmar. The only reason Merry could hurt the Witch King was because of this sword. This breached the Witch Kings defenses allowing Eowyn to deliver the killing blow. So finding these swords/daggers was critical to their victory over the Witch King later in the story. At least that is what I recall anyway.
BTW , we need a campaing to Chad read the Silmarilion before the shows start. If he read it like a history book it will help him on his critics and reviews, the book itself isent that long. and the annexes are even shorter XD... sometime it hurt seeing him miss the detail errors. XD
Y'all should really read the Silmarillion, it's great, although you need to read it as a history book rather than a novel imo. If you don't want to slog through it (I say slog, but it's not really, there are many memorable and epic sections, it's just dry) at least read through the Children of Hurin novel that came out and the Gondolin & Beren luthien ones as well. Reading some of the background of middle earth would be great for when y'all review this show.
The Silmarillion is a masterpiece, there is nothinf dry about it unless you dont like epic stories and need to rely on dialogue to get your attention. But in any case casuals cant watch fan videos explaining the lore here on YT, there are great dedicated Tolkien channels.
Shad in the beginning: I use the angry eyed thumbnail too much. Me: AGAINST ALL THE WOKENESS THAT HOLLYWOOD CAN CONJURE, ALL THE BLAND CGI THEY CAN CRAM INTO THEIR """"""""CONTENT""""""""", WE WILL SEND ONLY YOU! RIP AND GLARE, UNTIL IT IS DONE, SIR KNIGHTS! Hope all is well with the crew. Much love from Kanukistan!
There's no doubt in my mind this show will be bad considering everything we've seen so far, and sadly I see many people despair at the idea of Tolkien's work being desecrated thusly. However, I'd like to point out that an overwhelming majority of people are disapproving of this crap, and better yet many are pushing back against it. It does not matter one bit what Amazon tries to do in order to sully this amazing universe that Professor Tolkien created, no amount of money can buy the most important thing of all : Love. The love that each of us carries inside of our hearts will keep on living and be passed on long after everyone has forgotten about this aberration of a show. And to put it in the words of the most courageous hobbit of them all. "But in the end, it's only a passing thing, this shadow. Even darkness must pass. A new day will come. And when the sun shines it will shine out the clearer." -Samwise Gamgee Stay awesome.
What it is scientifically, is our brains do not have the same visceral reaction to green screen as our brains due to film and practical effects. So digital and green screen take away from the emotional effect film has on us as people. When you film like that more often than not people will become disconnected from the movies you’re making. No this is scientifically proven. That’s why people loved Maverick so much. All the practical effects being used had people feeling more connected to a film as they have in some time.
10:58 That's Miriel of Numenor. They have her as the Queen-Regent in this, but in Tolkien she was queen, but never actually ruled. Also, in Tolkien, Galadriel never went to Numenor and never met with Miriel (Tar-Miriel) in Tolkien. 12:15 Yes, Galadriel is married to Celeborn who has not yet been mentioned. He was alive in the Lord of the Rings and shown in Lothlorien, "Where is Gandalf, for I'd very much like to see him." There is a rumor Celeborn is dead in this show, but it's only a rumor at this point. Most likely that is one of Galadriel's many brothers who died in battle. 47:58 The Dwarves of Moria did not awaken Durin's Bane till TA 1980. So this show is going to cover events from Dagor Bragollach in Year of the Sun 456 to all the way through the entire second age which ended at SA 3441, up to 1980 of the Third Age. That's roughly 5500 years across three ages.
I remember when I first played Shadow of Mordor, and then the sequel, Shadow of War; I'm no "scholar", but I have read most of Tolkien's works, and there were obviously some things that stood out to me as inaccurate. Yet at no point did I feel like the story was opposed to everything Tolkien had ever written. Even though it was an unwritten insert into a time and place Tolkien didn't really write about, there was enough material that honored the source, and even though at first I didn't like the depiction of Celebrimbor, I've grown rather to like the moody bloke over the years. He lived up to the storied history as the Ringmaker, and even the depictions of Sauron himself were both terrifying (when garbed for war) and understandably deceptive, in pure white robes and long, silver hair in elven style. At the end of the day, the character depictions did not feel insulting, or worse, to be literally spitting in the face of Tolkien. Not so with Rings of Power. The change of Galadriel from a 'dreadful' yet beautiful, ancient elven woman with immense power without even having to pick up a weapon, into some sort of swashbuckling adventurer-type, whose words have changed from cunning and proper into condescension and mockery, is terrible, but hardly the worst in the show. For them to cast someone like Celebrimbor (who was generations younger than Galadriel) as a seemingly far older character is insulting; if anything, he should appear young, lithe and in his prime, while Galadriel should by contrast look like an old woman, if they're really going to take the route of showing 'human', recognizable age in elves. Showing them draped in gold, which elves had no care for (as they loved silver most of all), is another insult. That's just scratching the surface. This show proves, decisively, that they want to bury the past so they can turn this beloved franchise into a propaganda piece for their own social and political agendas. This was never meant to be for fans to enjoy, this was crafted from the start to be propaganda, and the massive fandom of Tolkien's was always intended to be exploited by this message in an effort to sway them to the writers' agendas, just as much of the recent Star Wars materials have tried to do the same with their loyal fans. These people know that they can't just create something of their own, full of their garbage, and reach the masses with it - many of them have tried and failed, because the vast majority of people don't want these woke agendas rammed down their throats; so instead, they are trying to overtake things that already have plenty of fans, hoping they will be ignorant enough to simply lap up anything they're given with their favorite property's title in the name, regardless of the fact that it belongs with the rest of the burnable trash. There's a reason Rings of Power feels almost completely unrecognizable as anything related, however remote, to Tolkien.
Think Shadow of Mordor really went off the rails when it came to the lore..taking events and getting them chronically mixed up...but that didn't annoy me to the point I stopped playing. Good games and stories in their own right. ROP is just about ruining Tolkien, not about making a good product
They nailed the visuals of Sauron/Annatar and Celebrimbor in the games. Shadow of Mordor/War shows how you can break lore and still kind of craft a decent story ... I doubt Amazon will do the same. The only cast I really liked so far from the trailers is Gil Galad, the rest seem meh like Galadriel or awful like Celebrimbor.
Some of this makes sense, some doesn't in the books Galadriel was the first to suspect Sauron. In the first image she was wearing a dress not armour. But I really am apprehensive about the show. Sauron was a boogyman to the Numenoreans but after they defeated him, he infiltrated the Numenorean kings court and became his chief advisor and talked him into worshipping Melkor(aka Morgoth,Sauron's Master) and later invading the west where the elves came from and we're summarily wiped out by Eru Eluvitar(aka God).
By the way, in the Books, the swords from the barrows where made to fight the Witch king and his armies severyal centuries bevore the events in LotR. THAT's how the Witch King was ultimately defeated. Not only because Eowy was a woman, but because Merry stabbed him with that Dagger. Eowyn "just" finished him off, so the prediction was basically fulfilled double (a Hobbit stabbed him (how is technically not a (hu)man), using a weapon that was explicitly made to defeat the witch king, AND a woman stabbed him too. (which is also not a man (most of the times at least these days)). Of course in the movies this was simplified, since the Barrow Swords where just swords Aragorn handed out to the Hobbits on weathertop.
I just rewatched the entire trilogy, and it just made me appreciate how Tolkien saw the world, and how that view is largely gone these days. This show won't have any badass speeches accepting the inevitability of death, while encouraging men to make their life worth something, like Theoden's speech at Pelennor fields. There won't be any grand displays of loyalty and honor, like Boromir's last stand. We're going to have attempts at that, but it's going to fall under its own meager weight. Look at videos showing iconic moments from Peter Jackson trilogy. They have comments from the last couple months, even though the movies came out 20 years ago. This series won't have anywhere near that staying power
I WOULD be careful about comparing the movies to how Tolkien saw the world. The movies are good, I love them, but idk if they really capture the same viewpoint.
@@andrewjazdzyk1215 They do sometimes, I think thematic its close, though Jackson does some changes in this aspect to please casuals, which is understandble.
@@andrewjazdzyk1215 Yup. Even Jackson overplayed Arwen up like they're doing with Galadriel. Glorfindel gets disappeared in the film. *Yes, the character is in a scene standing around but his actual role in the book is completely switched with Arwen for no real reason beyond giving Liv Tyler more screen time.*
@@GryphonIndustrial The comparison is not at all valid. They are basically doing everything they can to make Galadriel like a man, where Arwen still acted like a woman. Sure, she fought, but she was never in the front lines, or constantly trying to say how every man around her was wrong
For any fans of Tolkien's world I highly recommend you read or listen to "The Wanderer." It's an old Anglo-Saxon poem that greatly inspired the professor.
The torch/ sword thing was crazy. Blinding himself with the torch right in front of himself as well. And what is he gonna do with the sword if an enemy actually appears? Thrust and slide it across his arm, crossing his arms in the process ruining his reach as well? Or adopt a proper pose he should have been in from the beginning? Maybe it's just another one of those swords where the blade shoots out. EDIT Ah yes. He changed pose lol
5:39 Maybe an issue of overreliance on CGI. If you did it practically, you would have to necessarily think about how something would be done. If the director just tells the CGI artist to make a thing, the artist can make a thing. No need to think about the practical applications. Maybe what modern movie productions need is a no-man. Someone who will criticize everything they do.
PreVid thing. I just had one of those surveys at the UA-cam homepage asking if the above video (it was your House of Dragons one), was a good recommendation. I 5 starred it and clicked the boxes that matched the type of video. It felt weird to see that say recommendation, when the video has been out.
Just a quick lore: Sauron is not the big bad, he is Darth Vader basically, the true evil was Morgoth one of gods who made middle earth under the true God Iluvatar. Sauron took over after the defeat of Morgoth and is a much lesser being.
He's "the big bad" in Lord of the Rings, and he will be "the big bad" in this show, so, the comment about Morgth is appreciate but doesn't apply at all.
LORE INFO for those interested! (Speculations) - The battle of the First Age at the start is probably the Nirnaeth Arnoediad (battle of Unnumbered Tears) which was crushing for the Elves with many deaths. - The elf that Galadriel is mourning is probably Finrod Felagund (one of her three brothers who died at the hand of a werewolf and/or Sauron in the First Age) - Elrond was not doing the « hard hitting » in the First Age. Him and Elros barely survived after an attack by the Sons of Feanor and they were quite young. - Galadriel mostly didn’t fight like you said but she didn’t trust Annatar so she knew something was up. But true, things did change. - The « corrupted elf » could be the beginning of the Cult of Melkor which is part of the corruption of Numenor or he/she could be a priest of Sauron. - Durin the 3rd is probably talking about Durin’s Bane, yes. Happens much later in the lore, true. - We don’t have the context of the Sauron name dropping yet. Priests of him potentially going around already. Sauron do evil things in the First Age (like Finrod like I wrote above). Him being a servant to Morgoth doesn’t make him non-existant. The kid also has a mark on his arm. Could be linked to the man thinking he’s linked to the Dark Lord in some ways. - The scene where Broonwyn hides and a monster creeps in might be an orc. Showrunners said they want some fight to be more in your face. What happens when an orc enters your house but you never fought one? - The blade that’s reforging seem like a reverse Morgul Blade or could be a new dark weapon. Again, it’s Theo who has the mark on his arm. Link? - The explosion in the harbor is rumored to be done by the Kingsmen, the faction opposite to the Faithful is the politics of Numenor. Explosions could be explained by many reasons but Numenor was very advanced in overall technologies. - The dark figure walking among orcs is Adar (meaning father in elvish) and is probably the season 1 villain. Played by the same actor as Benjin Stark. - The elves with the starry sky is probably the Oath of Feanor, a very important moment before the First Age and after the destruction of the Trees and the theft of the Silmarils - Arondir is supposed to be the Legolas of this series but that first jump wasn’t that bad considering what Legolas did. - Durin the 4th is holding Mithril which IS the beginning of a new era for Khazad-Dum (previous trailer) - The sea monster is intriguing although Tolkien didn’t write much about the dwellers of Balagaer - Arondir seems to be fighting orcs who are covered to evade sunlight. Seems to be in Harad as well. Way south of future Gondor. Also remember that he may not start a slave. He gets captured at the end of the trailer. - The village that “explodes” at the end is probably Broonwyn’s (together we can survive this). Could lead to ashen Galadriel after the disaster. - The person talking about lies of Middle-Earth rumored to be Adar, not the priest blowing ashes. - The Balrog could be Durin’s Bane or another during the First Age prologue entirely.
The monster that creeps in might be a werewolf, not an orc. Orcs have ugly, sharp nails not claws. With claws like that it will be nearly impossible to hold a weapon
@@hobbes1887 and although werewolves weren’t really talked about after the First Age, they have a link to Sauron so we cannot rule them out. Good call!
@@FredThePhoenix Great points, just want to add my perspective on two of those. I think Elros and Elrond did fight on the War of Wrath, after they survived and were raised by their captors. So they did a bit of fighting and even though Galadriel has seen much more, she was in Middle-earth and did not participate in the War of Wrath like Elrond did. I think Arondir jump was too over the top, I dont remember Legolas ever jumping from such high height, his most impressive trick was killing the Oliphant which he did more with balance and skill than superhuman physical ability, though Elves do have more of this supernatural ability, and its implied in the text that the more of a pure lineage the elf is, the biggest will be his supernatural power (since those elves were blessed with direct contact of the Gods). Legolas hasnt seen the light of the trees or come into direct contact with the Valar but his grandfather and father were in the realm of Doriath where the Queen was a Maiar. I think Arondir is supposed to be a low rank elf so it does not make sense he could be so powerful like Legolas for example.
@@aesir1ases64 I was under the impression that Elrond and Elros were refugees in the Havens of Sirion for awhile and haven’t seen any indication that they actually fought in the War of Wrath as that war was mostly fought by the Host of Valinor. My bad
@@FredThePhoenix The Balrog seems to most likely be Durin's Bane given that the previous shot shows off the veins of mithril, plus it looks identical to PJ's depiction of Durin's Bane (could be just for marketing but you'd think they'd make him look a bit different if it weren't the same creature)
Sauron was definitely not the boogeyman of that age. He was bringer of gifts then. Celebrimbor, an elven smith, was manipulated by Sauron into making the rings, then later betrayed him, murdered his family in front of him, and then killed him with the hammer he first gifted to him, so that he can make a ring of his own to take control of all Middle-Earth. He was evil in this age, yes, but only in the shadows. He hid his true intentions until he gained power.
It could be her brother Finrod Felagund, but it could also be Celeborn (her husband) neither of whom die anywhere near this time. Neither do either of them doe in this way. Neither does Galadirel battle anyone.
It's definitely not Celeborn. The show's deal with the Tolkien estate demands that characters who survive the 2nd age can't be killed and those who die can't survive.
Honestly, if they wanted a GoT-esque show, that was set in Middle Earth, which is reportedly what Bezos wanted, then I really think they focused on the wrong events. Instead of compressing all of the Second Age and some of the First, a span of over 5,000 years into just a couple of years or decades, they should've focused on the Fall of Arnor. The events happen over only 10% that time frame (about 5 - 600 years) and focus on the Kingdom of Arnor being split up among three warring princes, all whom claimed their father's crown in Arnor. Arnor is split into three different kingdoms, Arthedain, Rhudan, and Cardolan. The three made war on each other for centuries (very Baratheon bros-esque, no?) and fought two wars against the Witch King of Angmar, the second of which destoryed what was left of Arnor and lost 3 of the Palantir. It involves the Dunedain Rangers, Elrond gets involved at one point and Orcs, Northmen, and I believe even the Easterlings get involved. There are two caveats here. First, there still would've been a lot of changes needed to make this a streaming TV show and the creators would have to be very up front and honest about that. They I think would need to say, this show is inspired by the works of Tolkien, but in order to make a concise show, we've needed to condense these events to decades, rather than centuries. But we promise you, we will do everything to keep it within the spirit, look, and feel of Tolkien's work. Second, I think you would need a showrunner(s) who is more talented and the breadth of his/her experience was more than just being an intern at Bad Reboot on Star Trek Beyond.
If someone ever wants to make a "GOT kind of adaptation" of LOTR, the Fall of Arnor is the best period for it, just imagine how much political intrigue and backstabbing you can have there.
@@debanydoombringer1385 I don't disagree. Hopefully better showrunners would in turn hire better writers. Also, spend less money on flashy CGI and get on the damn phone to Weta Workshop and get better armor and weapons made.
That mound of helmets doesn’t look like a memorial. It looks like a trophy collection Obelix made after he and Asterix had some fun with a bunch of Romans.
The pile that was left after the Romans came at them one by one and were knocked out of the frame leaving just the helmets behind.
Then they'd have a heaps of boots. That's what's usually left when they launch Romans into the atmosphere.
Seems like they either chickened out of creating the hill of bodies that it should have been, the Haudh-en-Ndengin, where the bodies of elves and men were piled up by orcs in the first age, or they wanted to use something similar in the second age for some reason.
Cut in - starting narration about the past war...
Closeup of a person on a past battlefield, kneeling down and picking up spear and helmet of a fallen soldier. Gets up, rams spear into ground, puts helmet onto it does a vague gesture hinting some kind of chant of prayer.
Person moves on a bit onto the next fallen soldier repeating the action. (opportunity for a closeup of the fallen soldiers showing the severety of the battle) BGM kicks in - camera zooms out - flies out - revealing a vast field with thousands of similar 'gravestones' - fade out to black - narration stops - oportunity to fade in title, logo or similar branding.
This might be a rather clichéd framing, but it works basically all the time. It can make use of mostly CGI elements while delivering each and every relevant aspect of what it wants to tell us. It shows scale of the setting while also hinting different things - like the possibility of each and every gravestone being made by the one person (if that's relevant) over a long span of time - it adds to the size and scale and also conveys devotion and grief. Even if the person in the scene isn't relevant per se, they become a framing device and the pov for the viewer. It increases the gravitas of the scene because only someone grieving massively would go to such lengths - depending on how you set it up, it can convey all sorts of emotions and therefore increasing the impact.
Nothing against trying out something different - but I'd say the 'usual' would have been sufficient here and I'd say it would have had more potential to reach the viewer that way...
@@christopherzajonskowski7123 I like that. The idea of someone spending this much time on a battlefield to create graves for all of their fallen comrades/friends/kin is very interesting. Surely that would change a person, even if they are a quasi-immortal elf. Could be a nice starting point for a character who was a bit reckless before and is now more withdrawn etc. Maybe spending this much time surrounded by death would cause them to gain a certain connection to things normally unseen or gain a deeper understanding of some kind of power they already possess. If they really have to go with Galadriel in this situation at least use it for some meaningful character development. Would work for Elrond or a non-canon character too, though.
Also, while it would have used some CGI for the thousands of swords in the background this could still have been done with a real background/location - just put in the swords afterward and keep everything else real.
They are holding their swords like they are aiming with guns. Maybe they are using the same shooting sword the guy in the Dungeons and Dragons movie uses.
I think you mean Sword and the Sorcerer with 'Matt Houston''...he had a 3 blade sword where the 2 outside blades shot off.
@@calibre97 the new DND movie has a snippet in the trailer of a blade launching from a sword leaving a dagger behind. I cringed horribly even though I knew it was a nod to the Sword and the Sorcerer
They shoot sword like Harry Potter or they have interchangeable blade
Link
The worst thing with all this for me(especially with seeing the Balrog) is that the lore of Tolkien’s world has some utterly amazing stories. With a budget like what Amazon has, if they would have been faithful to Tolkien and his vision, I think this show could have been something incredible. Morgoth was such an oppressive and terrifying force. There was a great dragon who blackened the whole sky with his wings. So much epic stuff. Romance, drama, heroism, tragedy. All there and ripe for adaptation! But instead we are getting a modernized fan fiction which seems to go out of its way to ignore Tolkien in order to tell its more current, far inferior narrative.
Yeah, i mean, why the fuck ruin a story you dont have the rights for when you could look for one of the other 20 stories?
1st age yes also true
100% agree, anyone who thinks they can write middle-earth better than tolkien is a maniac. He has more characters than a few legendariums combined and they STILL go out of their way to create new characters and bench the real characters he wrote that have depth and we actually give a shit about!!! infuriating 😡
They didn't have the rights to those stories, so they weren't allowed to. Which probably is a good thing really, those stories are superb, the first stories Tolkien ever wrote about Middle Earth, and these clowns never would be able to do them justice.
The irony is if they pull a small intro at the start of the show that reveals the events of the first age in a historic recap (similar to how the PJ Fellowship did), then that will probably be the best part of the show because it will be Tolkien’s first age. Not whatever they have cooked up to try and pad out the second age with a story that clashes with the lore and characters in so many different ways.
What I can't get over is the dialogue in this series, Tolkien would never have his characters say these things or act in this way. Tolkien himself says it best in letter 210 :
"I do earnestly hope that in the assignment of actual speeches to the characters they will be represented as I have presented them: in style and sentiment. I should resent perversion of the characters (and do resent it, so far as it appears in this sketch) even more than the spoiling of the plot and scenery." -J.R.R. Tolkien
The comically large pile of helmets represents the hopes and dreams of Tolkien fans that were slain by manspreading warrior Galadriel.
Sauron was well known, he was the lieutenant of Morgoth, Lord Of Werewolves, and he’s a master of dark arts. However, Sauron, to trick the Elves, made himself into a being known as Annatar, or the Bringer Of Gifts as Sauron is an incredibly wise and intelligent being, and the Elves hunger for knowledge and so he quickly integrated himself, but avoided certain Elves because they’d know he was Sauron.
He tricked the Elves into forging the rings, for he wanted to control them, he wanted the Elves, Dwarves and Men under his dominion. The final ring, the One Ring, the Master Ring, he forged himself in Mordor. Once he put it on, the Elves immediately knew they were tricked and took them off and hid them away, the Dwarves were too stubborn to succumb but gained a gold lust from the rings, and the Men were corrupted into the Ringwraiths.
Sauron held power over the 3 elven rings but not control so that he could corrupt them because he didn't actually help make them himself.
From my understanding, the elves knew that Annatar was Sauron, but they viewed him as a reformed being. I could be wrong of course, but that's how I remember his story. Of course, now I'll use this as an excuse to reread the whole silmarillion, which is always a good thing.
yet this sauron looks like hes one "reeeeee" away from going full on columbine while heavily nose breathing and telling us that anime is real
He didn't forge the 3 rings of the elves, only Celebrimbor did. Sauron never touched them.
Sauron actually tried to deceive Gil-Galad first, but the High-King was too cautious, and left him out of his door. Galadriel was second, but she quickly almost saw through Annatar guise, and he left before she could figure out his true nature. Celebrimbor was then found and deceived - for some time. Celebrimbor eventually figure out there was something fishy about Annatar.
Totally agree on the male characters and female characters flip. In the stories, it was Elrond and Gil-galad who very early on saw right through the deceits of Sauron, and it was they who sent word to warn against Annatar (one of Sauron's corporeal forms) who appeared fair and wise. Galadriel ALSO saw right through the deceits immediately. But the key thing is, BOTH male and female characters were wise enough to know. There was no "only the men knew things." If they wanted equality, well, it's IN THERE in Tolkien's writing. But looks like they're making it UNequal by giving all the wisdom to just the females here. At least, judging by the teasers and trailer we've seen
Based on what the actor who played Gil-galad has said, he is also wary/suspicious. I highly doubt he and Elrond are going to be portrayed as idiots. My guess is they are just trying to streamline marketing since Galadriel seems to be the mc.
@@benjaminlew1322 Amazon is doing a horrible PR, they are going all in into wokeness marketing and this has led the hardcore fans to turn the whole fanbase against them.
I dont believe the show will be that woke, but I also believe it will be mediocre at best because they decided to break the lore too much (as it seems at least), so when we combine people going in to watch with very low expectations and ready to hate it, with subpar or average quality and you have the formula for a series to flop.
If only they were more cautious and smarter on their marketing strategy they could have limited the damage.
Basically it’s not sexist if the male sucks, but it is the other way around
@@aesir1ases64 What do you think the likelihood of Amazon actually showing the construction of a temple to Morgoth is, or the human sacrifices that the Numenorians were making to him? Do you believe they will give the context of Numemnor sailing to attack Valinor and just what that means in the world of Arda? Do you think they will actually show the Valar laying down their guardianship of Arda and calling upon Eru Illuvatar? I have no faith that Amazon will portray any of the events of the Second Age of Arda with even a modicum of respect to Tolkien's written work. Look how they treat Haudh-en-Nirnaeth in the trailer; Galadriel should have had no ability to get to that hill after the thorough defeat the armies of elves and men took during the Nirnaeth Arnoediad. If its the War of Wrath the pile of helms is not appropriate at all. The elves were fighting with gods and angles against winged dragons and baulrogs. Do not forget that the War of Wrath featured Ancalagon the Black the greatest of all winged dragons. The elves that died went to the Halls of Mandos and were given new bodies to continue living in Valinor.
@@finbarhooley3536 I'm quite positive that was in fact the Mound of Tears.
Average Tolkien fan: "This show is going to devastate Tolkien's legacy."
Shadiversity: "THIS ARMOR IS ATROCIOUS, AND THAT SWORD LOOKS FAKE!"
When I saw the first few seconds of the trailer I was like “hey, that looks like it could be The Battle of Unnumbered tears, even if that happened during the first age” but then I was like “the people in charge probably don’t know what that is”
Bro, I doubt morgoth would have let any elves within a hundred leagues of Angband after the Nirnaeth Arnoediad.
Love you guys. I’m only 6 minutes in, and I need to clear something up. It’s beyond obvious how Galadriel made the helmet pile so high… she used The Force. She is, of course, the first Jedi.
brilliant, i love it :)
that of course will be the sequel to the rings of power
Galadriel and the first temple. this will also be when she crafts the dark saber and gives birth to the first mandalorian, but then her husband leaves her for a ferangi, and she vows to give up all human bonds and instead befriends a lion and teaches him to create a new world.
once she finishes that she will get around to forging Callandor and Excalibur....
You sure she didn't use her kryptonian strength, because after ROTK Middle Earth was renamed to krypton
@@Mert_Yanik yes, after all the magic died, they were free to pursue science, and discovered the power of crystals thanks to someone killing a giant spider and recovering one of the simarils.
I just started reading Silmarillion to refresh my Middle-earth knowledge for when this series are out and I want to encourage everyone to do so. If this series is be good for anything it is to remind about how great Tolkien's world is and to read his works.
The show will likely flop but Amazon will make out like a bandit with people buying more of Tolkien's original works just to get their Middle Earth fix that this show won't grant them
YES! One is not a true LOTR nerd without reading the Silmarillion. It's really fun reading the LOTR again afterward where you can understand all of the songs and references
I recently ordered my own copy of the silmarillian, the children of hurin, the unfinished works and i cant remember the name of the othet one
I just got the e-book.
@@adamlewis6052 You should also get Beren and Luthien. It's my favorite of the independent stories.
I think the guy holding the torch and sword is immitating a modern gun and flashlight (torch) combo.
Source of light under the armed hand, helping aim.
The people making the show may be clueless beyond belief.
Shooting dnd swords
He felt bad for being the only one without a bow so he pretended to hold one. Reminds me of the kid in starship trooper yelling: "Im doing my part!"
He was using that triple bladed sword from 'that other movie'
He's probably using the sword to scare off some evil creatures who hate fire.
"MAY be"...?
Galadriel's real power: endurance, finally revealed in making that pile of helmets. She was definitely there for hours
Indeed... Unless 'they' are going to pull the whole, elves are so light and nimble on their feet (akin to Legolas in the snow) and hence that's why she didn't keep toppling the helms everywhere 🤷🏻♂️
@@lukeblundell5610 that was literally my first thought. Light and nimble elves the size of humans.
@@lukeblundell5610 or, maybe, dozens of folks made the pile. clowns.
@@lukeblundell5610 It still feels odd tho, like yeah Eleves have different biology and all but why the heck would she make an helmet pile? To honor de dead ig? It still feels dumb even tho it technically has a reason why.
Perhaps she picked up a random helmet from a pile that someone else had made... But this is no less strange.
Shad of course the Don Lemon elf can jump higher than Legolas. Everyone knows white elves can’t jump.
@D. K. Meyer I don’t tell you what to do don’t tell me what to do. I made fun of everyone in that joke if you don’t like it that’s fine. This world doesn’t give a crap about anyone (me and you included).
I agree. White elves can jump!
18:10 Sauron's main Gift as Annatar WAS the very Ringlore that was needed to forge the Rings of power, it all came from him first. He had courted various Elven kings before finding an audience in Celebrimbor, the Elf-lord of Lindon. But all the Ringlore came from him and it's actually the reverse; Celebrimbor forged the Three Elven rings without Sauron's knowledge, but when Sauron finally forged the One Ring and put it on, they felt his presence and realized his deception immediately, and took them off until he was slain.
By slain you mean when he was defeated by isildur?
My favorite thing about the 'diversity' being wedged into the first age is that it implies that in all the races 'diversity' was evolved to extinction by the time of LOTR
Or the had a fun'ol race war and the real elves, dwarves, and humans won
Easterlings came to Beleriand though, the ones who served under Morgoth, Bor and Ulfangs groups. Bor stayed loyal to the elves and Ulfang betrayed them at the Nirnaeth Arnoediad.
Amazon already has access to the Hobbit, and their money could get the The Lord of the Rings in the future. It is like the end times for Tolkien fans.
Whats most funny is diversity only means black, not asian, middle eastern, indian, south american.
When you go so woke you accidentally go racism.
I never met a bigger LOTR geek than myself in my life. As a wee boy I read LOTR books religiously before the movies even came out. I've won countless LOTR knowledge contest, have been ever since I was a kid. I've written my own fanfiction follow-ups to Silmarillion and LOTR when I was 10. I've played every single LOTR-themed computer game that came out in the early 2000s without bias. I've given myself my own elvish name using Tolkien's languages when I was 12 and I can even write them down in his runic language. I've been participating in fictional battle forum debates representing LOTR characters for years, and I proved once and for all that Gandalf can beat both Darth Vader and Dumbledore with one hand behind his back. Even though Hobbit disappointed me, I've still seen all of the movies back to back out of my loyalty for Jackson, including extended editions, and till this day I enjoy an occasional re-watch, even though I watch the fan-edits like the "Cardinal Cut" which is a cropped version of the Hobbit that removes most of the stuff that wasn't in the books and cuts it all down to one 4 hour long movie, which it should've been from the start. I must've watched Jackson's LOTR trilogy hundreds of times, and I'm not even kidding. Extended Fellowship loop used to be my background noise throughout the whole middle school. I know every line from those movies.
Rings of Power? Yeah... I will be skipping this one. If some corporation wants to make Tolkien fan fiction from the ROTK footnotes and dance on Tolkien's grave as they do it, they're gonna have to do it *OUT OF MY FUCKING SIGHT.*
Mad respect
So please tell me you love the Rankin Bass Hobbit as much as I do!😍🥰
Bro you have all my respect
How did you do the elven name thing? Sounds like a good password idea lol.
@Nic TheCow Wait what stereotypes? Geniune question i'm confused.
😆did i get blocked? Lolz seriously though how can one not Differentiate between Pj Hobbit, and Rankin Bass Hobbit?
Want to see an authentic, non forced strong female lead?
Ellen Ripley, Alien, 1979.
Adapting a book or parts of the book is to bring the words of the author to the screen. Not changing a rich, detailed fantasy world to your own idea of a mirror of daily life 2022.
If you want a woke fantasy movie, write your own and don't rape a beloved classic novel just because you have the money to spread a message. This is ignorant and racist in its own way.
Want a show featuring mostly black people? Adapt one which hasn't mostly white people in it. Heck, the African lore is so rich, adapt a great story to the screen. Tons of talented black actors out there! Do something fresh!
But please dont force your wokeness on my beloved Middle Earth.
An authentic, non forced strong female lead? Read any novel by Jane Austen. From the Napoleonic era. Or any novel by the Brontë sisters, from the mid 19th century. Or by Agatha Christie, from the Interbellum. This wheel was invented a long ago.
1930's movie, The Mystery of The Wax Museum. Main character is a female reporter, saves the life of a falsely accused man, discovers the real villain, and gets the guy falling for her in the end. 1930's. No one has issues with that Warner Brothers movie.
@@AnnaMarianne I just rewatched Pride and Prejudice last night. It's still beloved after 200 years, so there must be something profoundly enjoyable there
second like👍
Ripley is a really bad example if you're trying to criticize modern Hollywood. The knights watch crew are constantly complaining about female characters who express male characteristics and lack femininity in modern cinema. Ripley is the epitome of this with the part originally being written for a male lead and only being filled by Sigourney Weaver at the last moment. Rewatch Alien with a critical eye and you'll see a lot of the tropes people attack modern Hollywood writing for in the film, including the dreaded, all the men are incompetent and the woman knows best.
I think what pisses me off the most, on the very FIRST pages of the Fellowship of the Ring is a Foreword by Tolkien. In which he states that NO PART of his story is ALLEGORICAL. And remember, this man experienced WW1, and was around for WW2. But he states explicitly that the story he has created does not have any deeper political meaning behind it, because in his eyes Allegory ruined stories and literature. I remember he specifically says he prefers "history" to "allegory". It's the first god damn thing you read in the trilogy. Deciding to use his stories and add your own allegory to it is spitting in the face of that brilliant man. I pray the show isn't as bad as people are presuming it will be, but man I have to say my hopes are not getting any bigger.
You lack critical thinking my friend. As much as he protested that he didn't like allegory, his works are allegorical none the less. Many of his peers, and other writers pointed out how closely the subject matter, symbolisms and general themes of Lord of the Rings mirror the experiences of Tolkien throughout the War and Apartheid in South Africa. Also, his inspirations for the mythology and spirituality of Middle Earth matches his own, and his own spiritual beliefs. It's not just some random mythology, the loss of magic in the world, the fate of the elves, all of that matches his own views on many subjects on the fall of humanity and romance in modernity.
An artist saying their work isn't and shouldn't be read as allegorical, doesn't make it so. Actually, in one of George Orwell's final books, he speaks about this exact phenomenon. Orwell also wanted to write fiction for the sake of fiction, and avoid entering politicisation and allegory. But throughout his life he realised that detaching the art from the artist was impossible, so he leaned into it. After all of his work, his conclusion is that it is impossible for works of fiction to not reflect the biases and political motivations of their writer, no matter how hard they try to run away from doing so.
Art is always allegorical, if you read into the life and beliefs of artists, you can quickly see what their story is about, and how they perceive reality. It is a reality artists cannot escape, whether they like it or not.
There are many lyrcial sections and poems in LotR that reframe poems written by pen palls and friends of his that died at war. And even Tolkien, after a while, started admitting he had inserted parts of him and his experience in the story. C.S. Lewis wrote a bit on how much LotR is an experiential reflection of the War (as in, the feeling and reality of what it meant to be in those trenches), the experience of what it felt like returning home, the lack of female figures in the story, Saruman's obsession with industry (mirroring the state of the War)... honestly... There is TONs of evidence that the LotR is more of a 1 to 1 mirror of Tolkien's lived reality during the War than actual escapist fantasy. He's clearly coming to terms with what he is going through by writing about it, but unable to recognise it as such. Such is the nature of dissociation and trauma.
People who are obsessed with this idea that fiction can be purely escapist are just not thinking about what they consume. The fiction they consume that they consider "escapist" isn't actually devoid of allegory or deeper meaning. It is usually that the themes and ideas being communicated don't challenge them or their views, either because those ideas align, or because the theme is too diluted or subtle to challenge them.
The problem with modern media isn't that it's "too political" or "forcing a message". ALL works of fiction are allegorical and politcal. The problem is that they are actually not doing it through metaphors, allegory or symbolism. It's just there, on the surface. And that's why a lot of right leaning people, who generally lack critical thinking skills, get upset about it: media, literature and art has usually been left leaning in its subtext, but now it isn't even subtext. Because now they finally see what the message is, it has been made painfully obvious for them, without any poetry or artistic subterfuge to it. It's also why a big portion of left leaning people hate it. Because it's virtue signalling garbage with no substance or further commentary / thought behind it. These works are not made for people with strong political motivations of any kind, because they way they present their message is patronising and insulting. It's made for people who lack critical thinking skills, but who don't have a right wing political bias.
@@korsoredeemed4893 on the contrary, though you provide an excellent point, what I said still stands true.
You are right, of course his experiences influenced his story telling and world building. But as you said, they are deep beneath the surface, and are vague metaphors at the most. None of it is right in your face. That's what makes LOTR timeless. It has no clear contemporary political message. But the themes are there. Though, disguised as they are, unless you try over analyzing his works, it's not easy to pick up on them.
And that's the point. Though of course, you are absolutely right, as I said above he couldn't possibly write his stories without his experiences influencing his story, on the surface they do NOT present as allegorical. And that's all that matters. That is my point in my original comment.
In the show they've made it very clear on the surface that they want to include political messages, and the merit of which is irrelevant - they could be good, positive messages, but it doesn't matter. It is still ruining the potential of the show. Taking a timeless story and world, and adding in contemporary messages renders it timeless no longer. Instead of focusing on what most Tolkien fans want, they are choosing to focus on things irrelevant to his works.
That's the issue, bottom line. I pray that it won't be as bad as I hear it may be. But considering all of their marketing has chosen to focus on such political messages.. I don't have much hope.
To say I lack critical thinking implicates you in the same way, as you are only looking at my comment on the surface as well - without even commenting upon the broader implications of my point. Debating semantics is pointless. The point still stands that Tolkien was not a fan of Allegory. Whether you want to call it on the surface allegory or not, it's still a fact that it's one of the very first things written in the LOTR trilogy. And it doesn't change the fact that they are going against his wishes by adding contemporary political messages to his work - which greatly reduces the immersion of what is supposed to be a different, fantastical world, something you can get lost in, something to wonder and marvel at, and completely immerse yourself within. To escape our own world. It ruins the experience, the story, the depth, and the timeless nature of his works.
Nonetheless, I do admit that I should have been a bit more nuanced. Either way though, my point stands. But I do appreciate that you expanded upon such nuances, which are important.
@@devonchin94 "It has no clear contemporary political message." - It does have one. If there is one thing to take out of LotR is the stress, trauma and hardship of that specific era of War, violence and struggle. It is heavily contrasted through the peaceful life of the Hobbits, as they recall their experiences in the Shire amidst the hopeless chaos they face in their journey. The state of idyllic peace contrasted with the industrial engine of war, conquest and needless domination. Which was different to past Wars, and wars today.
"None of it is right in your face." - It isn't explicit. The Hobbit is pretty crazy. You could completely glaze over the Dwarven metaphor of Jews as a nomadic people trying to reclaim their homeland that is the Lonely Mountain.
"And that's all that matters. That is my point in my original comment." - Honestly, it came off as "why can't my media just be escapism, even the writer agrees with me". I'm sorry if I was a bit harsh in what I said.
"Taking a timeless story and world, and adding in contemporary messages renders it timeless no longer" - I don't think it would have been bad for them to explore struggles of today that relate with the themes of Tolkien's work. Subtle metaphors about the war in Ukraine, for example, might have elevated it. I also think George Orwell is timeless, despite his works being explicit and contemporary. It's more about how it's done really.
"Instead of focusing on what most Tolkien fans want" - I disagree. As an artist, I believe it is this exact sentiment that has led us specifically to this point where media has worsened, becoming meaningless, endless franchising. Pandering to audiences is how we got capitalists to suck the life and creativity out of the industry, and consolidate their influence. Now most media is washed out shades of the same stories, repackaged with a new look, safe and unambitious, with tasteless people just profitting off of all of it.
"they are choosing to focus on things irrelevant to his works" - I don't think that is what is happening. I think it's a simple case of "this franchise makes money" - "sequel?" - "no, we'll have to pay too many writers" - "reboot?" - "nah, people will say we're just money grabbing" - "use older material but adapt it in a way for modern audiences" - "yes, brilliant"... and then proceed to vaguely gloss over everything taking two or three notes and make something out of it.
"To say I lack critical thinking implicates you in the same way, as you are only looking at my comment on the surface as well" - Your comment was about allegory and Tolkien's thoughts on it. You implied that you were upset with the show's intention to force a message. It was important to you to claim that LotR doesn't have political meaning. I wasn't looking at your comment on the surface - there was just nothing else to indicate you have a nuanced opinion about this. This is an actual position people hold, that "their media doesn't have deeper meaning, it's just escapism, leave it be". I was addressing that with enough information to make that assumption from what you had written.
"it's still a fact that it's one of the very first things written in the LOTR trilogy. And it doesn't change the fact that they are going against his wishes by adding contemporary political messages to his work" - That was part of my point. Whether he likes it or not, his work was allegorical. And whether he likes it or not, people who will interpret his work are going to insert their own experiences in some way or another. It's just a bit of a "bad take" overall from the writer. Writers are fallible humans with bad opinions too. My issue is that this is a pretty weak arguement against Amazon and corporate interest in media at large. Recycling, never taking risks, only following profit, taking works out of context, pandering to audiences, fan service... These are things they have been doing for ages, and it was so upsetting to see as an artist. But people didn't seem to mind because it wasn't forcing "a message" that upset them. However, tt was always forcing "a message" (not LotR specifically, but this phenomenon isn't exactly new). Many LotR fans argued back in the day that it was unfaithful to the books, and its action glorified something Tolkien was not about, while putting too little focus on the emotional aspect of the story - Tolkien's own son made this point. It's just that it has changed now, and people are catching on.
"what is supposed to be a different, fantastical world, something you can get lost in" - this would be a specific arguement for lack of critical thinking btw. They're not supposed to be something you can get lost in. That's being intentionally ignorant of the impact and connection we have to these stories. These worlds are romantizations of experiences, thoughts, fears, emotions... everything the artist is going through. An artist can't escape that. And we connect with the works through the emotions we feel when we experience them. We connect with it, it isn't "just escapist fantasy" - there is something in there that speaks to us. The loss of magic, the innocence of a simple life, the corruption of the world, there are allegories of traditionalism, moral decay, etc. Whether intentional or not. We connect with his feelings about these subject, conciously or subconciously. Thinking about why we connect with things is important, especially because we are shaped by our experiences. There is no such thing as actual escapism. There is always a specific thing that draws us to the art, and something it awakens in us when we enjoy it.
He put Symbolism in his stories especially Christian Symbolism but he definitely made sure LoTR was no Allegory to anything of his time or other work.
The Orcs piled up the Hill of the Slain. It was a memorial of their victory. If this is supposed to remind us of it, NOT a good idea to have Galadriel fix/build it. I as a reader find it weird.
If you go back to the Song of the Ainur, one point Tolkien emphasized was the forces of good repurposing supposed triumphs of evil to highlight triumphs of good instead. So, rededicating a mound of elven dead raised by orcs as a sign of their victory into a memorial of elven valor would be in keeping with the Legendarium, so of course that can't be what the show runners were trying to do.
@@ernestcline2868 In Short. A Monument of Evil Victory turned into a Memorial of the Fallen.
Referring to Sauron being the bad guy:
Some knew of him only by name, for he was the principle lieutenant of Morgoth. So when Morgoth fell, Sauron took over. He had a form known as Annatar who was the bringer of gifts. Some fell for the ploy while others saw through it. People really recognized Sauron as the true enemy when the rings of power were forged. However, Sauron began corrupting people to his side before the rings were made. Like when Numenor fell into the sea.
Numenor fell long after the rings were made, though - like 1,700+ years after their forging. But you're right, corrupting and deceiving people was Sauron's 'thing' in the First Age already, as well as in the Second Age. The Elves never trusted him again after he forged the One Ring, but mortal men tend to forget things after more than a dozen generations, so Ar-Pharazon was fooled by Sauron's flattery, just like Celebrimbor was 17 centuries earlier.
Sauron was a shape shifter he could also transform himself into terrible beasts such as a were wolf and even a serpent . This is all described in silmirillion
Lore Dump:
Numenor shouldn't encounter Sauron until almost 2,000 years after the rings are made. Galadriel has a husband who was a leader among the elves in the battle against Sauron and a daughter who later marries Elrond.
Numenor is founded right at the beginning of the Second Age (32). The aesthetic is supposed to be the Great Byzantine (as far as I know) with extremely Anglo-Saxon features.
1500 years later, Sauron (In the guise of Annatar) introduced the concept of the rings to Celebrimbor (The greatest of the elf smiths). They crafted most of the rings together, but Celebrimbor became suspicious and forged three in secret (The Elf rings). In the meantime, Sauron forged the one ring. When he put the one ring on, he learned of the presence of the three elven rings.
Sauron goes to war with the elves (1693)
They fight for 1,500 years before Miriel (The Queen of Numenor) is even born... a little later (SA 3261), the Numenoreans actually get involved in the war with Sauron (Which lasted about a week).
It isn't until the Third Age that the Balrog of Moria is even found...
Nicely put together timeline.
@@Ackalan Thank you. If you will excuse me, I need to go rage some more while weeping for the state of modern fantasy.
@@thatguyonthespectrum4894 I've already been through this with WoT. Just ignore it and all the activists masquerading as fans. They want to demoralize you into capitulation. They're the Nazgul and we're the hobbits. Hairy, big footed, vertically challenged blighters that are too dumb to be sad. I can feel a Tom Bombadil song coming on.
While most of the Balrogs were killed in the War of Wrath, some escaped and hid deep underground, there is no mention of Balrogs being active in the second age at all so where they get a Balrog coming into this second age story baffles me. That said it may not necessarily be the the Balrog of Moria.
Correction about the numenorians and the war of elves and sauron: the war lasted for 8 years not 1500, and it was ended by the numenoreans led by minastir who came to middle earth to defeat sauron. Also the war starts about 200 years after the forging of the rings and about 100 years after sauron forges his one ring (the three elven rings are also forged shortly before the one ring)
20:43: I think that guy asked: "how am I supposed to hold these two things?"
And then the showrunners just said "just pretend the torch is a flashlight and the sword is a gun, and you're a cop exploring some dark, dangerous cellar."
I bet that the torches are held that way just to light up the faces so you could properly see the actors, without them needing to put extra work into elaborate lighting. The same way they put light inside the space suit helmets in a lot of sifi movies.
I don't know the exact quote but every time Shad says "eh whatever it's fantasy I guess" I think of when Peter Jackson said he wanted everything to look as though it could have existed in history. So in other words, he and his team literally referenced actual historical armor and weapons and did their best to morph it into a fantasy setting and adapt that to each culture in Middle-Earth without making it look or feel in any way impractical.
Meanwhile this show just be like "eh, I don't know put some fantasy crap all over it the nerds will eat it up"
Little do they understand that Tolkien fans aren't just your typical nerd. ;P
These X-ray-eyes-Shad thumbnails are hilarious, and represent your eagle eye for medieval details quite well. I insta-click when I see them.
Sauron was known in the 2nd age cause he was Morgoths Lieutenant in the first age. He used the guise of Annatar exactly because no one would trust him under his real name. I also think they are setting up some of the nazgul "origin stories".
Would a human know about Sauron though? It was probably too long ago for him to know
It's infuriating, because almost everything that happens in this show should not be happening at the same frigging time!
@@matiashamalainen4574 Tbf, the time frames of the second age would be impossible to portray in a tv show even with the utmost care for the lore. All mortal characters would just die all the time of old age. Sauron spent centuries teaching Celebrimbor and his smiths new stuff, must make for a riveting montage though, as we see generations of peasant hobbits get old and die while they try new fancy ways of ringmaking. 😂
Well his real name is Mairon. But yea no matter which he used he would be found out.
@@yeahjustme3680 The timeline is one of the reasons I would not even trust talented writers to pull off Second Age show. But, instead we have talentless hacks working on it.
One of the funnier parts was an interview with the woman who plays the drawf of colou (lol) claiming that her character is a magic user.
Apparently magic is now as prevalent in Tolkien's works as it is in DnD.
So if I remember correctly, in the Hobbit, the dwarves did actually have a very limited capacity of magic. They use it to hide the gold they get from the trolls or something like that. They are also known for making magic toys in the books. So i guess it really depends on what the definition of magic user is for the show. If she runs around doing magic like a wizard, that would be supremely dumb though
The stance with the torch and the sword actually reminds me of a modern(ish) stance for holding a flashlight with a handgun called a "Harris hold" where you hold the flashlight in your support hand in a reverse grip and put your strong hand with the pistol over the wrist of the support hand so you can have isometric tension to stabilize your shot while holding the light forward.
Thing is, it works for a handgun because you're pointing the gun forward (because that's where the bullets come out of), plus you need that tension in order to help mitigate recoil. Neither of which are relevant for swords, so clearly the directors copied something they learned from modern gunplay and tried applying it to medieval fantasy stuff.
Lindybeige pointed out that the tendency in movies where people draw a bow and hold it there for long periods of time also comes from gunplay, as waiting for the perfect moment to fire is very much a key tactic for gunfighting (both in movies and real life, see "Don't shoot til you see the whites of their eyes" in the Battle of Bunker Hill). You can do that with a gun, because all you have to do to aim a gun is to hold it. You can't do that with bows and arrows because you'd rapidly fatigue if you attempted that.
Alternative is that they stole the pose from The Witcher because they thought it looked cool, at least whatever her name was had the questionable excuse that her enemy clearly (and believably) stated that he didn't want to kill her.
Which is why It works for a Crossbow better.
Heck. Even the movie Trilogy showed this in the Battle of Helmsdeep when that Old man accidentally lost his grip and shot the first arrow of Helmsdeep
I'm not sure what's worse: The actual stuff we've seen so far (and by extension the show itself) or the creators still claiming they are honoring Tolkien, doing this in his vision and so on.
Years of First Age: 1-590 | Second Age: 1-3441
3:53 This is possibly *Dagor Bragollach* - one of the wars at the end of the First Age. Galadriel didn't fight that war and how did she piled up all the helmets of the dead? If this isn't Dagor Bragollach, then it can be many wars and it's too vague to guess which one they mean.
10:44 This is *Tar Miriel*, the queen of Numenor. But she got blackwashed and she's not suppose to be born until toward the end of the Second Age. She is not the queen of Gondor. Gondor kingdom was founded by Isildur and his brother toward the end of the Second Age, after the fall of Numenor.
11:40 This is a *Palantir*. There are few of them and essentially they act like a communication device between the 2 users. This was bad editing by Amazon, making the Palantir as if it can see the future.
11:56 This might be one of her brothers that died during the First Age. It can't be her husband, *Celeborn*, because he's still alive (although Amazon has no problem breaking lore) and we also see him in LotR. Celeborn never dies in Middle-Earth, he sails to Valinor/Aman at the end of Third Age after Sauron's defeat.
---12:50 Eminem cameo.
16:40 Assuming the Balrog we see during the end of the trailer is really *Durin's Bane*, then this is yet another lore breaking done by Amazon. Durin's Bane was in slumber for thousands of years until Third Age 1980 when the dwarves accidentally awaken him. But this could be "just" a Balrog that Amazon decided to shove in for some action.
---17:30 Evil Disney fortress cameo.
17:46 Actually, Sauron was known as the bad guy from early Second Age. He just shapeshifted to an Elf named *Annatar* and disguised himself as master craftsman. People didn't know that Annatar = Sauron, but some elves (Gil-Galad, Galadriel and Elrond) did had suspicion about him and didn't trust him when he came to them as Annatar "bringer of gifts".
18:00 As far as I remember, Sauron didn't steal the idea of forging rings to control people. Sauron was a disciple of *Aule* (god of crafting) so he always had a thing for crafting. Sauron knew he can't beat the elves and men by force, so he planned to corrupt them from within (by crafting magical rings), turning them against each other and perhaps turn them to his side.
---19:02 Freddy Krueger cameo.
---20:00 SHAD RANT! Firing lasers from his eyes. You've been warned.
---20:45 Chinese introduce gunpowder to Middle-Earth.
27:21 This is probably *Oath of Feanor* during the end of Years of the Trees (just before First Age). *Feanor* was the elf that forged the *3 Silmarils*. The elves are his 7 sons that swore to never rest until they return the stolen Silmarils from Morgoth/Melkor (the OG bad guy, the mightest of the gods).
35:25 Amazon don't care about diversity, they just want to corrupt and destroy Tolkien. If they really wanted diversity, they should have introduced the lands of *Harad and Rhun* that are heavily influenced by middle-east and african cultures (and maybe even some middle Asian cultures such as India). I'm sure that every fan of Tolkien would be psyched (myself included) to see those lands, the people and their culture. Amazon could have showed us Harad and Rhun, the *2 blue wizards* and the conflict between Sauron trying to corrupt the peolpe to his side and how the blue wizards undermine him. Amazon can still do it in later seasons but it will be a woke mess as everything else. But one beg the question, if they wanted diversity so much, why not show these lands first?
42:17 There should not be wizards in Middle-Earth Second Age. *The Istari* were 5 "wizards" (Maiar = angels equivalent, messengers of the gods), they were sent to Middle-Earth to help the people against Sauron. They appeared in *Mithlond / Grey Havens* at Third Age 1000 (one of the western city of elves, where in Return of the King the ship sails in the end of the movie).
46:42 Indeed, during Fellowship of the Ring, when the 4 hobbits travel to Bree, they get caught by the barrow-wights and Tom Bombadil comes to save them. (That scene, and Tom Bombadil were not shot unfortunately).
Funny enough there was a period where the numenoreans were essentially white slavers and colonizers like europeans where it was the perfect opportunity for amazon to "woke" showing the lands of southeast but i guess they cant even woke properly lol
Best Waffle I've encountered all day. Thank you.
Only point I’d argue is that the blue wizards were later retconned, by Tolkien himself, to have arrived around 1600 2A
"We thought the war" probably stands for "we fought against Morgoth", not some particular battle, and the pile of helmets is a metaphor of them all or somethong. The dialogue in the trailer is so empty. They should have used something like "We thought the war against the utmost evil. At last Morgoth was defeated, but not all of his deeds could be undone...". Even those who read the books are confused, let alone normies.
@@hyvakoira Yea it is too vague which war Galadriel means and also that helmet pile is just stupid and comically unrealistic.
Sauron looks like Eminem. There, now you can't unsee it.
I already saw this comparison made on Twitter. More people are actually hating the look, including me-but that's obvious since I don't like what they're doing with the show anyway. But it's also the ones who're defending this show that are also put off by it. If that's actually Sauron, boy has the casting director made a mistake.
Ring Shady.
Supposedly the leader of a cult looking for Sauron not Sauron himself. Sauron is supposedly disguised as the human character Halbrand.
@@toodlescae Honestly, for the sake of the viewers who actually want to watch the show but doesn't like Sauron, or Annatar as he should be in this case, that would... be slightly better. I still don't like it but I already made my thoughts on that clear. I'm still wondering why they didn't just have Sauron be Annatar. The dynamic can be a bit like Palpatine in the Prequels: the viewers know he's bad but he's acting so charming and friendly that they get why others wouldn't see it.
@@toodlescae But he was hiding himself as Annatar, the gift bringer, to trick the elves into forging the rings pf power. Where did they get this Halbrand character from?
The pile of helms is a possible reference to a 19th century painting The Apotheosis of War by Vasily Vereshchagin. The scene and the painting have very similar composition.
If you'll show human naked bones on screen, it will be difficult to get a distribution certificate in China. So the reference is needed to show the pile of sculls without showing any sculls at all.
And it’s no stupider than Jackson’s avalanche of skulls in the Paths of the Dead with not a single other bone in sight.
The sword/arrow thing got me too. I was sure at fist he was holding a bow and arrow, but it was dumb as hell to hold the arrow on his wrist. Then I realised it was a sword, and that this shot was a different kind of stupid than I initially thought.
It's like that thing people do with flashlights and handguns, with the flashlight in reverse grip. But with torches and swords, as if that makes any sense or even looks remotely good or cool
@@shacuras8201 Yes.
It makes no sense for the elves to make a big memorial for fallen elves at all. When they die, they go to the Halls of Mandos and are reborn. Every single elf knows this so why pile helmets up when you know you will eventually see your dead friends again. The elves reaction in the Silmarilion when they discover that men die is one of the more impactful moments of the book and their collective reaction to Beren and Luthien shows a degree of grief beyond anything else they ever display for anyone else. Even when they lose Fingolfin there is nothing even close to the degree of mourning shown for Luthien.
True. Only men made burial mounds to elves or men.
Well, when humans die we all go to heaven, why should we care about dying or our loved ones dying? Right? We do go to heaven ? Right? Don’t we?
@@lewiswarburton1224 the elves know what happens when they die as settled fact. While mankind believes in an afterlife they never return to Arda when they die. The separation of the elder children of Illuvatar from the younger children happens regardless of whether or not heaven exists and for men it is not confirmed concretely what happens when they die. Death is referred to as the Gift of Men but there is no elaboration on what this means. This ambiguity led directly to the Downfall of Numenor as Ar Pharazon rebelled against the Valar.
@@josephahner3031 Fair point.
Who says the Elves made it? There was a mound after the Nirnaeth Arnoediad after all. Just because Galadriel is checking out a helmet doesn’t mean she piled them all.
What makes this even more hillarious is that I saw an article by the BBC saying that fans were amazed by the trailers that have been shown.
Who were they refering to? None of what i've seen suggests that fans are excited by this utter rubbush.
They might have been amazed by how terrible they looked? 🤨
Hello Shad and Nathan, hope that you are both having a good day.
Same.
4:13 That pile could be the hill of bodies (maybe it was just heads?) that was left after the Nirnaeth Arnoediad (Battle of Unnumbered Tears) where the combined forces of elves and men were slaughtered before the gates of angband during the first age. The orcs did that after the battle and eventually grass grew over the hill and they stayed away from it.
Kinda sounds like what orks would do for fun in their spare time after eating the bodies.
But as the theme progressed, it came into the heart of Melkor to interweave matters of his own imagining that were not in accord with the theme of Iluvatar; for he saught therein to increase the power and glory of the part assigned to himself.
About the Balrog at the end. It really depends on what they're doing with it. Just because "The Balrog" is not an individual entity but a variant of Maiar (the 5 wizards are also Maiar for example). After the first age the remaining Balrogs fled to underground caverns and hid there. So if this isn't turning out to be the Balrog of Kazhad-Dûm this could actually just be one of the escaped Balrogs hiding away somewhere. Although it would still be weird why the elves didn't make note of such a sighting during the Second Age.... y'know... the appearance of a Balrog, a prime soldier of the great enemy would really kick up some dust.
The shot has Mithril veins. It's very likely to be durins bane.
@@ICaImI It's almost certain it is, but there's no lore reason it couldn't have been some other Balrog, since a lot of them are missing.
it has to be durin's bane, because durin's folk lived in kazad dum, and the name durin itself means that they lived and reclaimed this place if i'm correct (only seven durins throughougt history), so knowing diurin is here, and a balrog too .... yeah ....
Sauron according to Amazon: "I need to trick Elfars... I got it! I'll disguise myself as a doomed meth addict Eminem and Eldars will be enticed by that form, and I'll rap to Eldars and Eldars will forge me some bling-bling that will make me their pimp! I'm a freaking genius!
Sauron is not that discount Eminem character. Sauron is the character called Halbrand just as you know
@@mikkelborchsenius1156 where is that guy shown? Also, who would that be? Saruman? Saruman didn't arrive until the third age, and only after the ue wizards
@@michelecastellotti9172 Halbrand is the white guy who is on the raft with Galadriel and is also seen in the halls of Numenor.
I have no idea what you mean with your saruman reference, so I am just going to ignore it.
gah, this hot mess makes no sense at all. Sauron went to the Elves first. It wasn't until much later that he began to corrupt the men of Numenor.
4:18 Galadriel, herald of Khorne. Blood for the Blood God! Skulls for the Skull Throne!
love your trailer breakdown, the trailer is really a mess to be honest but I like how you add a bit of banter here and there throughout your video, it's hilarious
In The Silmarillion, the pile of helmets is supposed to be a pile of elf bodies stacked by the Orcs of Morgoth's army.
I would hope they haven't killed off Celeborn (Galadriel's husband). I was assuming that was her brother who died that she was crying over....
In regards to Sauron, throughout the Second Age he was viewed in many different ways. Sometimes (mostly) a villain, other times kinda like a villain trying to reform (during his stay at Numenor), and as Annatar the Lord of Gifts (This was when he was with the Elves, not Numenor. Apparently this needed to be edited to clarify to people what I'm saying) he wasn't actually known to be Sauron.
Yes it is her brother finrod who was killed by Sauron in the first age
Ultra MAGA Sauron.
Isn't celeborn by her side in lothlorien? Yes, yes he is, so they cant kill him off, he is no Glordindel, he wont be sent back upon dying.
Celeborn isn’t in it, apparently Galadriel dose have sex with other characters though apparently
He's assumed dead in the first season. They've also decided to ship Galadriel and Sauron on the show - Halbrand is supposed to be Sauron based on the recent leaks.
If I remember correctly, Sauron (then known as Annathar, the bringer of gifts) was presenting himself as a friend to the elves and helped celebrimbor in crafting the rings of power to then use his part in that to be able to forge the one ring. Sauron was known as a Leuitnat of Morgoth but no one guessed that the beautiful, wise and kind Annathar would be Sauron.
When it comes to the helmet pile, it is an interesting looking scene with it's desolate landscape, pile of shiny helms and a lone white gown figure at it's base.
I can image the camera panning to the right where there is probably a large industrial conveyor belt which made that pile of SHAME!
I agree, why would Galadriel who knows that the elves are reembodied in the Halls of Mandos act like a human and create a pile of helmets like that as a symbol of death? Not to mention why would she take the same action that Morgoth used to mock the elves after the Nirnaeth Arnoediad?
33:10
You can see the chain that the block is attached with. It's probably for them to not have it drop and they can put it back easy for another shot
OR
That kicked "stone"block would not fall anywhere and make the kick inconsequential.
but it feels more like a "ups-microphone-in-shot"-moment.
I love you all, and tolkien's world.
As a rough estimation for that pile of helmets. Assuming it is 3 galadriels high (assuming 1 galadriel = 1.7 meters) and 6 galadriels wide at the botton that gives us about 15.5 m³.
In those 15 m³ assuming a helmet has roughly 5 dm³ or 0.005 m€ you could fit a total of 3100 helmets in there. Seems at least reasonable as an amount killed on a large battlefield.
That is way more than 15m3. I have dug up slightly more than 15 cubic meters with a showel and that pile was many times smaller.
If it's 6x1,7m wide then the area it covers at the bottom is about 80m2. 80x1,5 galadriel gives a volume about 10x your 15m3.
So 30 000+ helmets. Looks more accurate
you know its not that those people died its that they collected 3000 helmets
Sauron was one of two lieutenants of Morgoth ( the other one was Gothmog, captain of the Belryg) he was not the boogieman at this point. But he must have been known to the elves, especially to Galadriel. He approaches the elves and introduces himself as Annatar, lord of gifts me tries to trick elves into creating the rings. He fails to trick Elrond and Galadriel.
Reminder: Don't attribute to incompetence that which can be adequately explained by malice.
They will eviscerate our beloved setting, they will mock and deride fans for hating it, and they will rebrand the world for the lowest common denominator.
Never give them the benefit of the doubt for just being hacks- they are malicious hacks and they hate you.
Exactly what I try and tell people. These companies don't make billions by being incompetent. They openly hate us and want to see us demoralized. And losing money in a venture like this is an "acceptable loss" for the glory of their proverbial motherland.
It is the opposite that is true : Don't attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by incompetence.
Malice is rarer than incompetence.
4:11 in the First Age there was a battle against Morgoth where tens of thousands of elves died. The orcs piled the bodies up and made a massive hill. That hill is the only place where grass will grow in the area of the battle.
12:10 between Morgoth and Sauron, there are thousands of years of wars and fighting. Galadriel looses many of her male family members, including several brothers and an uncle I believe.
17:00 the show runner has admitted to compressing the time down, so instead of events taking thousands of years, over the course of multiple Numenorian kings, they've compressed it down to just a few decades in the lifespan of one king.
18:00 Sauron escaped the capture of Morgoth, waited several hundred years, then revealed himself and waged war. There were at least 2 major conflicts before the Numenorians capture him. In between those conflicts, I believe, is when Sauron approached the elves in disguise as the Giver of Gifts. Sauron was a skilled craftsmen that had served under the Smith God, the ability to craft jewelry was entirely his own. He spends 300 years teaching elves how to forge the Rings of Power, and Sauron was there for the forging of all the Rings except for the 3 elven rings.
The battle of seven flames?
@@michelecastellotti9172 I believe so, when Morgoth revealed the dragons for the first time.
@@michelecastellotti9172 Are you referring to the Dagor Bragollach, the Battle of Sudden Flame? That happens in the First Age (Years of the Sun) 456 about 1650 years before the forging of the Rings of Power in SA 1500 and 3250 years before Elendil is born SA 3100, 3350 years before Isildur is born SA 3200, and 3550 years before the War of the Last Alliance which kills Gil-Galad and Elendil and where Isildur takes the one ring was a wereguild for the deaths of his father and brothers. So, yes, they are compressing a shit ton.
This is traveling more into the "Inspired by" realm rather than "based on" and is quickly moving toward bad fan fiction.
EDIT: My math was off on the timeline. Now corrected.
I also thought 4:11 could be the Haudh-en-Nirnaeth/Hill of the Slain, but whats shown in the trailer is a well ordered mound of empty helmets, while the Hill was a pile of corpses thrown together by orcs. So the confusion and logistics issues they point out are still an issue.
So, now I'm thinking its been done wrong on purpose. They don't have the rights to the details of that particular series of events in the first age, but they still want to make reference to it.
@@penguycs4593 Galadriel could never have been near Haudh-en-Nirnaeth, not only because she wasn't a warrior princess, but also because the faction she was a part of, the Sindar of Doriath led by Thingol, refused to be a part of the alliance attacking Angband.
Shad on the Helmet Hill: "I need to have a think."
Amazon: "Go home, Shad, you're thunk."
The name "sauron" was widely known as a bad guy (right hand of Morgoth) from the first age. Sauron then reappeared in the second age disguised as Annatar in order to trick the numenorians into working for him and to trick the elves of eregion to welcome him to their smithies where he could corrupt the rings given to men and dwarves. Only then did he proclaim himself as the returning dark lord
That mountain of skulls is a direct “reference” to The Apotheosis of War painting
The backlash to this show does put a little warmth in my cold dead heart
Sauron was a Maiar beneath Aule, the Smith (as was Saruman, by the way). He was well versed in crafting and ring lore. It was Sauron who instructed others in the forging of the rings of power, eventually making his own. When he instructed the Elves in this craft, it's suggested that he added in his own backdoor, such that when he finally put on the One Ring, the Elves sensed him, and took theirs off. The implication being that the Elven rings are tied to the One Ring. This is also referenced after the One Ring is destroyed, that the Elven rings have - possibly - lost their power.
In the Lord of the Rings (IIRC), it is also mentioned that Saruman also experiments with ring lore, crafting his own. But it is not as powerful as the creations of Sauron.
Aside from stacking up that much helmets into a comically large pile. Imagine how ong it would take to go around the battlefield collecting them.
24:30
Shad: "It triggers me, Nathan."
(Cuts to the movie Gladiator)
Commodus: "It vexes me. I'm terribly vexed."
The random dirty man with harfoots in the background convinced me. Meteor man is Gandalf. He's greeted by a harfoot in the crater, so that's likely why he's so fond of hobbits in LotR. A+ logic :D
I wouldn't put it past the writers.
There was an article a couple of days ago saying Ian Mckellen was asked if he'd play Gandalf again.
16:08 Sauron did disguise himself as an elf though, according to the lore, certainly not as a human, so not sure why they would need to disguise that he's an elf.
12:38 The dead elf could be her brother according to speculation
19:28 who is the kid with the broken sword supposed to be?
Only 1 view? Dang Shad, UA-cam must be retaliating
Your work has entertained, educated, and inspired me for years. Now, I am finally ready to give you a little something in return.
For the last 20 years, I have written roughly 1 million words for friends and family, with the simple purpose of earning adequate skill at storytelling. I honed my writing, and even ultimately benefited from deep, painful personal struggles, so that I could finally tell a specific short story. It complements and builds up one of your favorite films. And, incidentally, it also showcases many examples of genuine, loving masculinity displayed in a variety of ways.
Further, I feel it sets a very high bar for what respectful, quality “fanfiction” should strive to be. Upholding a beloved work. Understanding it, valuing it, and forgiving any supposed flaws. Contributing a modest addition to someone else’s great legacy. Underscoring and deepening the arc of an already beloved character. Teaching the same positive lessons with the same noble themes, in a slightly different way. Honoring the work, the creator of that work, and all those who have come to love it for what it is.
Your novel proves you don't shy away from facing darkness and tragedy. You have shown us your deep compassion and honest inner strength. You also show love and honor to children. With respect, Shadrach, I my little story will be painful for you. you will come away proud for having forged through to the end. And perhaps, you might come away even stronger than you have already, correctly, seen yourself to be.
I strove to keep the story focused, purposeful, limiting it to just 22,000 words. It may not be perfect, but it certainly tries to be. I hope you will consider giving it a read. Based on what you’ve shown everyone of your true self (behind your hilarious outward persona), I believe you will approve of these efforts. You may be uplifted and proud for having put forth the time to read it. And you will then enjoy going back to watch one of your favorite trilogies yet again, perhaps getting even more out of the experience.
The tale is humbly posted, amidst countless others, on fanfiction.net, under the title “The Children of Rohan,” by WillDreamer.
Remember the Galadriel in the books and the PJ films? That was the Galadriel that was so kind and benevolent, that when the fellowship was departing from Lothlorien, she gave Gimli three locks of hair when he only asked for one. To think that was just one of many acts of kindness shown by her. Such acts that say so much more than any of the projected five seasons that we are going to get.
An act of kindness towards Gimli... aaand after all these years sticking it to Feanor one last time, who asked her for just one of her hairs to use in his craft (I think in combination with the Silmarils)... three times. And He was denied three times.
Love it. 😁
Concerning the opening of the trailer with the giant pile of helmets... Where DAFUCK are the bodies? Did she actually walk miles between the battlefield and the pile? Look carefully, there is not a single corpse in that shot for miles!
The bodies despawned to ease memory requirements.
The Balrog has a few things wrong with it.
1. Durin's bane is the only Balrog we know to be uncovered after the 1st age and war of the wrath.
2. Durin's bane didnt pop out until the 3rd age after sauron lost his ring.
3. That design is a john howe/ peterjackson design. So by using it they're saying this is canon to the Jackson movies. Actually Balrogs may have looked very human light, albeit demonish and 12 feet tall with fire smoke and ash.
I just watched a video from Nerd of the Rings about Ungoliant. ( ua-cam.com/video/8QmtTd_rdu8/v-deo.html ) He talks about Melkor's Balrogs "who fly on winged speed... to his rescue." Personally I'm just fine with the Balrog's appearance in the Peter Jackson movies. Everything else you said, though, is definitely correct and this trailer/show is, and is going to be, trash.
The design is clearly legally distinct (the horns look very different), even though John Howe is working on this show as well.
The Silmarillion states that some balrogs have fled to hide after the first age, there's no reason to believe Durin's Bane is the only survivor. In addition, Sauron itself can probably adopt the appearance of a balrog.
@@wipe3100 Regardless, the trailer definitely refers to it specifically as Durin’s Bane, which it was only named after driving the Dwarves out of Khazad Dum. That didn’t happen until the Third Age, and the show is supposed to take place during the First Age, (or the Second at the very latest).
@@austinrestovic "the trailer definitely refers to it specifically as Durin’s Bane" What do you mean ? Where in the trailer is this stated ?
Clicked at “uploaded 1 second ago” 😂
24:58 "Oil doesn't explode like that!" Oh? But does wine?
Galadriel's husband, Celeborn was well and alive throughout the Second Age, heading the remnants of Sindar elves from Doriath. He defended Eregion from Sauron's armies and had to withdraw his forces and unite with Elrond's. There could have also been interesting dinamics between him and Celebrimbor loving the same woman.
I'm pretty sure he and Galadriel have been married since mid-First Age - sometime between her arrival in Beleriand in 52 and the fall of Nargothrond in 495. Which means they've been together 1300-1700 years by the time Sauron appears in Middle Earth in the Second Age. Their daughter Celebrian is about 900 at this time. Galadriel really ought to have settled down a bit by now, she's had a lot of responsibility for a long time.
You should read the comments on that trailer. They are hilarious. People are mocking this thing to pieces. 🤣
The clips are just all over the place with disconnected dialogue that make no sense. You can't possibly have any idea of what the story is. Also there is no way that the Sauron from the books would disguise himself as a human.
Galadriel fought in a couple of battles but not with a sword and only in defense. She hated violence. She had enough magical power to blow a hole in the world if she ever fully unleashed it.
The "Emonim" dude is supposedly a priest leading a cult of Sauron that's looking for Sauron. They think the meteor man is Sauron and attack the "Harfoots". Meanwhile Saueon has disguised himself as Halbrand..a human.
Hooray I'm so excited I love these reaction videos I've been waiting. Thanks for doing these shad it's always entertaining and informative.
If that's not Sauron but an elf serving him it would be very lore unfriendly. I read in the nature of middle earth that elves never willingly served Morgoth or Sauron. If they did it was either because they were enslaved or they were serving their own selfish desires.
Could he not be serving his own selfish desires here?
You literally contradicted yourself buddy. It’s pretty obvious this Adar elf dude will serve his own desires and yet you say in the same comment that it will be lore unfriendly. Sounds to me like you want to complain just for the sake of complaining
Yeah, there are definitely examples of elves serving Sauron, willingly and unwillingly.
Fun fact, in the movie Lancelot with Richard Gere, his mail was just knit yarn spray painted silver.
His shield was very crudely formed from aluminum 1" angle for the rim, and roughly ground aluminum forming fleur-de-lis shapes within the rim, all welded together with modern aluminum welding technology, spray painted silver.
Tom Bombadil rescues them from the barrow wight. The swords that they get from the barrow mound were forged by a people that were fighting the Witch King of Angmar. The only reason Merry could hurt the Witch King was because of this sword. This breached the Witch Kings defenses allowing Eowyn to deliver the killing blow. So finding these swords/daggers was critical to their victory over the Witch King later in the story. At least that is what I recall anyway.
BTW , we need a campaing to Chad read the Silmarilion before the shows start. If he read it like a history book it will help him on his critics and reviews, the book itself isent that long. and the annexes are even shorter XD... sometime it hurt seeing him miss the detail errors. XD
Y'all should really read the Silmarillion, it's great, although you need to read it as a history book rather than a novel imo. If you don't want to slog through it (I say slog, but it's not really, there are many memorable and epic sections, it's just dry) at least read through the Children of Hurin novel that came out and the Gondolin & Beren luthien ones as well. Reading some of the background of middle earth would be great for when y'all review this show.
Not a History book, but a chronicle.
I'd recommend the audiobook for the Silmarillion, the style in which it is written is a perfect match for that format.
Yeah Shad, educate yourself already!!!
The Silmarillion is a masterpiece, there is nothinf dry about it unless you dont like epic stories and need to rely on dialogue to get your attention.
But in any case casuals cant watch fan videos explaining the lore here on YT, there are great dedicated Tolkien channels.
@@stephenyates1415
If you are german, the audiobook is voiced by the same person who voiced Gandalf in the movies, so that is mega awesome.
Shad in the beginning: I use the angry eyed thumbnail too much.
Me: AGAINST ALL THE WOKENESS THAT HOLLYWOOD CAN CONJURE, ALL THE BLAND CGI THEY CAN CRAM INTO THEIR """"""""CONTENT""""""""", WE WILL SEND ONLY YOU! RIP AND GLARE, UNTIL IT IS DONE, SIR KNIGHTS!
Hope all is well with the crew. Much love from Kanukistan!
There's no doubt in my mind this show will be bad considering everything we've seen so far, and sadly I see many people despair at the idea of Tolkien's work being desecrated thusly. However, I'd like to point out that an overwhelming majority of people are disapproving of this crap, and better yet many are pushing back against it.
It does not matter one bit what Amazon tries to do in order to sully this amazing universe that Professor Tolkien created, no amount of money can buy the most important thing of all : Love.
The love that each of us carries inside of our hearts will keep on living and be passed on long after everyone has forgotten about this aberration of a show.
And to put it in the words of the most courageous hobbit of them all.
"But in the end, it's only a passing thing, this shadow. Even darkness must pass. A new day will come. And when the sun shines it will shine out the clearer."
-Samwise Gamgee
Stay awesome.
What it is scientifically, is our brains do not have the same visceral reaction to green screen as our brains due to film and practical effects. So digital and green screen take away from the emotional effect film has on us as people. When you film like that more often than not people will become disconnected from the movies you’re making.
No this is scientifically proven. That’s why people loved Maverick so much. All the practical effects being used had people feeling more connected to a film as they have in some time.
Calling it: the sword they keep showing will become Narsil so it's Galadriel that gives it to Elendil, because wahmen.
10:58 That's Miriel of Numenor. They have her as the Queen-Regent in this, but in Tolkien she was queen, but never actually ruled. Also, in Tolkien, Galadriel never went to Numenor and never met with Miriel (Tar-Miriel) in Tolkien.
12:15 Yes, Galadriel is married to Celeborn who has not yet been mentioned. He was alive in the Lord of the Rings and shown in Lothlorien, "Where is Gandalf, for I'd very much like to see him." There is a rumor Celeborn is dead in this show, but it's only a rumor at this point. Most likely that is one of Galadriel's many brothers who died in battle.
47:58 The Dwarves of Moria did not awaken Durin's Bane till TA 1980. So this show is going to cover events from Dagor Bragollach in Year of the Sun 456 to all the way through the entire second age which ended at SA 3441, up to 1980 of the Third Age. That's roughly 5500 years across three ages.
I remember when I first played Shadow of Mordor, and then the sequel, Shadow of War; I'm no "scholar", but I have read most of Tolkien's works, and there were obviously some things that stood out to me as inaccurate. Yet at no point did I feel like the story was opposed to everything Tolkien had ever written. Even though it was an unwritten insert into a time and place Tolkien didn't really write about, there was enough material that honored the source, and even though at first I didn't like the depiction of Celebrimbor, I've grown rather to like the moody bloke over the years. He lived up to the storied history as the Ringmaker, and even the depictions of Sauron himself were both terrifying (when garbed for war) and understandably deceptive, in pure white robes and long, silver hair in elven style. At the end of the day, the character depictions did not feel insulting, or worse, to be literally spitting in the face of Tolkien.
Not so with Rings of Power. The change of Galadriel from a 'dreadful' yet beautiful, ancient elven woman with immense power without even having to pick up a weapon, into some sort of swashbuckling adventurer-type, whose words have changed from cunning and proper into condescension and mockery, is terrible, but hardly the worst in the show. For them to cast someone like Celebrimbor (who was generations younger than Galadriel) as a seemingly far older character is insulting; if anything, he should appear young, lithe and in his prime, while Galadriel should by contrast look like an old woman, if they're really going to take the route of showing 'human', recognizable age in elves. Showing them draped in gold, which elves had no care for (as they loved silver most of all), is another insult. That's just scratching the surface.
This show proves, decisively, that they want to bury the past so they can turn this beloved franchise into a propaganda piece for their own social and political agendas. This was never meant to be for fans to enjoy, this was crafted from the start to be propaganda, and the massive fandom of Tolkien's was always intended to be exploited by this message in an effort to sway them to the writers' agendas, just as much of the recent Star Wars materials have tried to do the same with their loyal fans.
These people know that they can't just create something of their own, full of their garbage, and reach the masses with it - many of them have tried and failed, because the vast majority of people don't want these woke agendas rammed down their throats; so instead, they are trying to overtake things that already have plenty of fans, hoping they will be ignorant enough to simply lap up anything they're given with their favorite property's title in the name, regardless of the fact that it belongs with the rest of the burnable trash.
There's a reason Rings of Power feels almost completely unrecognizable as anything related, however remote, to Tolkien.
Think Shadow of Mordor really went off the rails when it came to the lore..taking events and getting them chronically mixed up...but that didn't annoy me to the point I stopped playing. Good games and stories in their own right. ROP is just about ruining Tolkien, not about making a good product
They nailed the visuals of Sauron/Annatar and Celebrimbor in the games. Shadow of Mordor/War shows how you can break lore and still kind of craft a decent story ... I doubt Amazon will do the same.
The only cast I really liked so far from the trailers is Gil Galad, the rest seem meh like Galadriel or awful like Celebrimbor.
If I recall the devs said they're not actually following lore but were trying respectful to the source material.
The lore in these games is mostly ass, but with a few good ideas. Fortunately the gameplay is stellar.
This is exactly what happened with the halo tv show
Some of this makes sense, some doesn't in the books Galadriel was the first to suspect Sauron. In the first image she was wearing a dress not armour. But I really am apprehensive about the show. Sauron was a boogyman to the Numenoreans but after they defeated him, he infiltrated the Numenorean kings court and became his chief advisor and talked him into worshipping Melkor(aka Morgoth,Sauron's Master) and later invading the west where the elves came from and we're summarily wiped out by Eru Eluvitar(aka God).
By the way, in the Books, the swords from the barrows where made to fight the Witch king and his armies severyal centuries bevore the events in LotR. THAT's how the Witch King was ultimately defeated.
Not only because Eowy was a woman, but because Merry stabbed him with that Dagger. Eowyn "just" finished him off, so the prediction was basically fulfilled double (a Hobbit stabbed him (how is technically not a (hu)man), using a weapon that was explicitly made to defeat the witch king, AND a woman stabbed him too. (which is also not a man (most of the times at least these days)).
Of course in the movies this was simplified, since the Barrow Swords where just swords Aragorn handed out to the Hobbits on weathertop.
Unless you watched the extended version where Galadriel gives merry and pippin the daggers
@@Mert_Yanik Which sword or dagger was it that Merry stabbed the Witch King with? I don't know.
@@zonefreakman in the films a Dagger from Noldor and in the books i think it was a blade of Arnor
I just rewatched the entire trilogy, and it just made me appreciate how Tolkien saw the world, and how that view is largely gone these days. This show won't have any badass speeches accepting the inevitability of death, while encouraging men to make their life worth something, like Theoden's speech at Pelennor fields. There won't be any grand displays of loyalty and honor, like Boromir's last stand. We're going to have attempts at that, but it's going to fall under its own meager weight. Look at videos showing iconic moments from Peter Jackson trilogy. They have comments from the last couple months, even though the movies came out 20 years ago. This series won't have anywhere near that staying power
I WOULD be careful about comparing the movies to how Tolkien saw the world. The movies are good, I love them, but idk if they really capture the same viewpoint.
@@andrewjazdzyk1215 They do sometimes, I think thematic its close, though Jackson does some changes in this aspect to please casuals, which is understandble.
@@andrewjazdzyk1215 Yup. Even Jackson overplayed Arwen up like they're doing with Galadriel. Glorfindel gets disappeared in the film. *Yes, the character is in a scene standing around but his actual role in the book is completely switched with Arwen for no real reason beyond giving Liv Tyler more screen time.*
@@andrewjazdzyk1215 It wasn't 100% accurate in the events, but the overall tone and feel is very much the same
@@GryphonIndustrial The comparison is not at all valid. They are basically doing everything they can to make Galadriel like a man, where Arwen still acted like a woman. Sure, she fought, but she was never in the front lines, or constantly trying to say how every man around her was wrong
For any fans of Tolkien's world I highly recommend you read or listen to "The Wanderer." It's an old Anglo-Saxon poem that greatly inspired the professor.
The torch/ sword thing was crazy. Blinding himself with the torch right in front of himself as well.
And what is he gonna do with the sword if an enemy actually appears? Thrust and slide it across his arm, crossing his arms in the process ruining his reach as well? Or adopt a proper pose he should have been in from the beginning? Maybe it's just another one of those swords where the blade shoots out.
EDIT
Ah yes. He changed pose lol
Lenny Henry (10:30) is not only a comedian but also a successful actor who had a very well received part as Othello.
5:39 Maybe an issue of overreliance on CGI. If you did it practically, you would have to necessarily think about how something would be done. If the director just tells the CGI artist to make a thing, the artist can make a thing. No need to think about the practical applications.
Maybe what modern movie productions need is a no-man. Someone who will criticize everything they do.
PreVid thing.
I just had one of those surveys at the UA-cam homepage asking if the above video (it was your House of Dragons one), was a good recommendation. I 5 starred it and clicked the boxes that matched the type of video. It felt weird to see that say recommendation, when the video has been out.
Just a quick lore: Sauron is not the big bad, he is Darth Vader basically, the true evil was Morgoth one of gods who made middle earth under the true God Iluvatar.
Sauron took over after the defeat of Morgoth and is a much lesser being.
He's "the big bad" in Lord of the Rings, and he will be "the big bad" in this show, so, the comment about Morgth is appreciate but doesn't apply at all.
@@jpbenavides4969 if the trees are still there then Morgoth is yet to be defeated completely no?
@@AgsNfz The Trees are apparently a flash back.
@@Tar-Elenion I guess that's better then
LORE INFO for those interested! (Speculations)
- The battle of the First Age at the start is probably the Nirnaeth Arnoediad (battle of Unnumbered Tears) which was crushing for the Elves with many deaths.
- The elf that Galadriel is mourning is probably Finrod Felagund (one of her three brothers who died at the hand of a werewolf and/or Sauron in the First Age)
- Elrond was not doing the « hard hitting » in the First Age. Him and Elros barely survived after an attack by the Sons of Feanor and they were quite young.
- Galadriel mostly didn’t fight like you said but she didn’t trust Annatar so she knew something was up. But true, things did change.
- The « corrupted elf » could be the beginning of the Cult of Melkor which is part of the corruption of Numenor or he/she could be a priest of Sauron.
- Durin the 3rd is probably talking about Durin’s Bane, yes. Happens much later in the lore, true.
- We don’t have the context of the Sauron name dropping yet. Priests of him potentially going around already. Sauron do evil things in the First Age (like Finrod like I wrote above). Him being a servant to Morgoth doesn’t make him non-existant. The kid also has a mark on his arm. Could be linked to the man thinking he’s linked to the Dark Lord in some ways.
- The scene where Broonwyn hides and a monster creeps in might be an orc. Showrunners said they want some fight to be more in your face. What happens when an orc enters your house but you never fought one?
- The blade that’s reforging seem like a reverse Morgul Blade or could be a new dark weapon. Again, it’s Theo who has the mark on his arm. Link?
- The explosion in the harbor is rumored to be done by the Kingsmen, the faction opposite to the Faithful is the politics of Numenor. Explosions could be explained by many reasons but Numenor was very advanced in overall technologies.
- The dark figure walking among orcs is Adar (meaning father in elvish) and is probably the season 1 villain. Played by the same actor as Benjin Stark.
- The elves with the starry sky is probably the Oath of Feanor, a very important moment before the First Age and after the destruction of the Trees and the theft of the Silmarils
- Arondir is supposed to be the Legolas of this series but that first jump wasn’t that bad considering what Legolas did.
- Durin the 4th is holding Mithril which IS the beginning of a new era for Khazad-Dum (previous trailer)
- The sea monster is intriguing although Tolkien didn’t write much about the dwellers of Balagaer
- Arondir seems to be fighting orcs who are covered to evade sunlight. Seems to be in Harad as well. Way south of future Gondor. Also remember that he may not start a slave. He gets captured at the end of the trailer.
- The village that “explodes” at the end is probably Broonwyn’s (together we can survive this). Could lead to ashen Galadriel after the disaster.
- The person talking about lies of Middle-Earth rumored to be Adar, not the priest blowing ashes.
- The Balrog could be Durin’s Bane or another during the First Age prologue entirely.
The monster that creeps in might be a werewolf, not an orc. Orcs have ugly, sharp nails not claws. With claws like that it will be nearly impossible to hold a weapon
@@hobbes1887 and although werewolves weren’t really talked about after the First Age, they have a link to Sauron so we cannot rule them out. Good call!
@@FredThePhoenix Great points, just want to add my perspective on two of those.
I think Elros and Elrond did fight on the War of Wrath, after they survived and were raised by their captors. So they did a bit of fighting and even though Galadriel has seen much more, she was in Middle-earth and did not participate in the War of Wrath like Elrond did.
I think Arondir jump was too over the top, I dont remember Legolas ever jumping from such high height, his most impressive trick was killing the Oliphant which he did more with balance and skill than superhuman physical ability, though Elves do have more of this supernatural ability, and its implied in the text that the more of a pure lineage the elf is, the biggest will be his supernatural power (since those elves were blessed with direct contact of the Gods). Legolas hasnt seen the light of the trees or come into direct contact with the Valar but his grandfather and father were in the realm of Doriath where the Queen was a Maiar. I think Arondir is supposed to be a low rank elf so it does not make sense he could be so powerful like Legolas for example.
@@aesir1ases64 I was under the impression that Elrond and Elros were refugees in the Havens of Sirion for awhile and haven’t seen any indication that they actually fought in the War of Wrath as that war was mostly fought by the Host of Valinor. My bad
@@FredThePhoenix The Balrog seems to most likely be Durin's Bane given that the previous shot shows off the veins of mithril, plus it looks identical to PJ's depiction of Durin's Bane (could be just for marketing but you'd think they'd make him look a bit different if it weren't the same creature)
Sauron was definitely not the boogeyman of that age. He was bringer of gifts then. Celebrimbor, an elven smith, was manipulated by Sauron into making the rings, then later betrayed him, murdered his family in front of him, and then killed him with the hammer he first gifted to him, so that he can make a ring of his own to take control of all Middle-Earth. He was evil in this age, yes, but only in the shadows. He hid his true intentions until he gained power.
Lenny Henry, the "sky's are strange" actor has come out of obscurity as the host for the Commonwealth Games.
Nevermind the stacking of the helmet hill....the gathering alone, is allread comical....
It could be her brother Finrod Felagund, but it could also be Celeborn (her husband) neither of whom die anywhere near this time. Neither do either of them doe in this way. Neither does Galadirel battle anyone.
It's definitely not Celeborn. The show's deal with the Tolkien estate demands that characters who survive the 2nd age can't be killed and those who die can't survive.
If it's not a flashback, it's probably her cousin Celebrimbor, who both forged and gave her her own ring of power.
Honestly, if they wanted a GoT-esque show, that was set in Middle Earth, which is reportedly what Bezos wanted, then I really think they focused on the wrong events. Instead of compressing all of the Second Age and some of the First, a span of over 5,000 years into just a couple of years or decades, they should've focused on the Fall of Arnor.
The events happen over only 10% that time frame (about 5 - 600 years) and focus on the Kingdom of Arnor being split up among three warring princes, all whom claimed their father's crown in Arnor. Arnor is split into three different kingdoms, Arthedain, Rhudan, and Cardolan. The three made war on each other for centuries (very Baratheon bros-esque, no?) and fought two wars against the Witch King of Angmar, the second of which destoryed what was left of Arnor and lost 3 of the Palantir. It involves the Dunedain Rangers, Elrond gets involved at one point and Orcs, Northmen, and I believe even the Easterlings get involved.
There are two caveats here. First, there still would've been a lot of changes needed to make this a streaming TV show and the creators would have to be very up front and honest about that. They I think would need to say, this show is inspired by the works of Tolkien, but in order to make a concise show, we've needed to condense these events to decades, rather than centuries. But we promise you, we will do everything to keep it within the spirit, look, and feel of Tolkien's work. Second, I think you would need a showrunner(s) who is more talented and the breadth of his/her experience was more than just being an intern at Bad Reboot on Star Trek Beyond.
If someone ever wants to make a "GOT kind of adaptation" of LOTR, the Fall of Arnor is the best period for it, just imagine how much political intrigue and backstabbing you can have there.
They'd need much better writers too. Nothing in what I've heard them say sounds like Tolkien. It doesn't even flow like good fantasy writing.
@@debanydoombringer1385 I don't disagree. Hopefully better showrunners would in turn hire better writers. Also, spend less money on flashy CGI and get on the damn phone to Weta Workshop and get better armor and weapons made.
@@debanydoombringer1385 The writers are activists. Not fans of LotR or even fantasy as a genre.
The pile of helms scene strongly reminds me of the 19th century "The Apotheosis of War" painting
I'm glad I'm not the only one who immediately wondered about the pile of helmets. :D
You guys deserve a lot more viewers! Great video!