These results really do show how "MMR" is insufficient to show the gap between Killers. Despite a diference of only 0.1 kills, Nurse was definitely stronger and more capable of destroying Survivors early on.
You made a point of this, but it's hard to understate how much certain maps help/hinder each side. Nurse on RPD is disgusting, while Trapper in a really grassy map like Backwater is incredibly hard to deal with. Hens getting indoor maps on Nurse? Probably affected his stats greatly. Obviously we're comparing high tier vs low tier killer, but I think it would be cool to repeat this the killers stacked on offerings for a more balanced, "traditional" map, like Yamaoka.
@@lidla2008 This goes to show that one of the most massive things that alters the balance in this game is maps. I think that having some sort of way of banning a certain map (1 for each side) would be nice. Perhaps reworking the offerings to be a sort of reverse offering, which guarantees that you won't be sent to a certain map.
OTZ someone is pretending to be you and sending ppl links saying to click here because they've won something ( i just got one) i know Demi just posted that it's been happening to him, i wasn't sure if you were aware of it
This is the best trapper in the world www.twitch.tv/maou_asada plays since the alpha version (long before the beta) and has like 25k hours or more he has the world record on trapper wins, kills, sacrifices, moris, and triggered traps
@@ottere He's this weird streamer who thinks he's Trapper IRL and is extremely toxic, I've gone against him multiple times with my friends, and most of the time he destroyed us but when we actually managed to make the game slightly harder for him in a couple of games, he got so triggered he slugged us all on the ground to bleed out instead of hooking in BOTH games, and when we asked him why do u take the game hostage like that, he said it's not taking the game hostage, well I know for a fact that it is cuz a streamer I know got banned for doing the same exact thing.
"I happen to be decent at him" My friend I've been watching your videos since you streamed Pig with a Saw mask on. I watched as you counted the seconds until someone stepped on a trap on the other side of the map. I saw you mind game the basement entrance by acting like you came not at the right time. You singlehandedly kept the Trapper's killrate high and made sure innocent killer mains didn't fall to the trap that is playing Trapper. TL;DR: Otz Trapper good
@@haiz768 Either youre a bot or youre sad. You've gone out of your way to reply to so many peoples comments with a tone like this. I just hope you do better one day.
The thing that bothers me about eyrie of crows that I dont hear anyone mention is the random branches that stick out from walls and block movement. Also that some bushes are solid but others aren't even though they're almost identical
@@sergeychistov8162 Honestly, any killer or Survivor main can agree that the inconsistency is annoying. Either make them all transparent or all solid, so that we don't have to guess during chase "wait, can I go through THIS bush, or will I bump into it and get hit/lose the guy I'm chasing?"
@@sergeychistov8162 They can't because of the complain with survivors hiding in bushes, thats why some are transparent, and thats why Garden of Joy has those weird bushes, was a decision to not have survivors hiding in bushes.
He's the poster boy cause he's a barely functioning incompetent clod prone to spectacular failure, but hey, he looks REALLY cool, I mean...what a great concept! The hooks, the strategy....you know? I think he fits the company pretty well. They're getting better though, finally. I....think.
nerf ideas for nurse 1. She no longer has a weapon 2. she blinks backwards 3. if she gets flashlighted she remains blind for the rest of the match 4. getting less than 3 kills results in the lowering of the credit score of the actual player 5. random chance to explode when blinking
Give her 3 blinks base kit, but make the first blink safe. The second one has a 30% chance to overload you, and the third has 50%. Overload meaning stun. Alternatively just remove her from the game.
A good change for trapper might be to always make his traps blend in with the color of the ground based on which map he is sent to. Obviously it wouldn’t be perfect camouflage, having a bit of rust and bloodstains to make it stand out a bit on maps with lighter colored ground, but you’d think the killer who is literally all about knowing his prey and pushing them into a corner where they’ll be caught in his traps would also know the terrain he’s gonna be hunting in.
Or, better yet, make them invisible. Survivors get a pop-up notification of “disable trap” when 3-4 meters away, IF they are walking/crouching. But a running survivor does NOT get any notification whatsoever.
instadown clown with +bottles (post-nerf lol) would completely destroy blank spirit if the clown player is remotely decent at landing direct hits, it's actually a bit mindblowing to think that wouldn't be obvious with 3-nerf spirit
I'd love to see a comparison like this but both players (or the same person twice) wear a heartrate monitor, and we compare how stressful the average game is for each character
So based on these results, everyone is just fine, the game is in a perfectly balanced state...except...you both got quite a few kills, so we better nerf the pig. -Bhvr
I think that they could fix Nurse by adding another minute into the Pig’s RBT timer. If Nurse is still too oppressive, lower Pig’s crouched speed by about 5%
Dredge fun fact: If you teleport to a locker and a survivor is inside, when you come out with the survivor you cannot be blinded. Making the Dead Dog Saloon SWFs very unhappy.
It's funny how Mikey is a "bad" killer yet I literally have an almost 90% 4k winrate more than any other killer I play. Whenever I play Michael it's like an almost guaranteed squash.
@@moz6388 I can get a lot of kills with him too but I would still say he's distinctly not fun because of his inability to close chases down. Smaller maps means the pallets are closer together than ever before, and his window-vault speed buff is inconsequential because he starts from rest after vaulting so he's always slower regardless.
"We at the BHVR balancing team has listened to your concerns, and have balanced The Shape accordingly. Hitting Tier 3 of Evil Within will now no longer expose survivors, and will instead cripple both of Michael's legs, forcing him to use crutches for the rest of the game"
What's the better part of Nurse: How she eats all of the design space for new killer perks; or how new killers keep eating all of the design space for making her fair?
They need to just disable certain perks for her already. I'm not sure if it'd destroy the code, but if you have perks for her you can't use, they could transport them over to another killer or spread them out or something.
@@Klausinator451 that’s the worst bandaid fix I’ve seen proposed in this community full of bandaid fixes. They need to balance her first and foremost. Then they wouldn’t have to worry about balancing perks around her.
@@fart63 She is already unironically balanced. This game should be killer-decided. Killer performs greatly - unless killer matched with 4 survivors of coordinated equivalent performance, killers win. Asymmetric game implies that both sides have equal chance of winning. So, 1 killer’s potential should be not below, but on par to the compound potential of 4 survivors. Nurse power level should be about the expected level of any killer’s power level.
3:45 Yeah, basement trapper is horrifying. I was in super low skill game (cause I myself suck and barely play the game honestly), and I got one person in basement... then quickly after I *just* left after trapping the two doors and the window they started hitting those traps like flies to fly paper. Got the achievement for getting all four survivors in the basement at *once* level flies to fly paper lol.
I actually really appreciate the "negative ranting" about unfairness in the game, or when you post matches where you were very frustrated by stuff. That mirrors my own experiences much more closely, and when you complain about something specific, it helps me to identify things that are very strong that I need to watch out for. Also they're always practical in terms of understanding how you can try to come back from a bad match, the decisions you can make in these terrible situations, makes it feel less bad whenever that stuff happens to me. Otherwise, it's easy to get a bit of that social media selection bias. People typically only post things on social media that they want other people to see. If all the DBD content you watch is always successful or powerful builds working well and securing 4K's, it could build up some not so helpful expectations that make your own matches feel more negative by comparison.
It has been brought to our attention here at bhvr that some people have been complaining about the Trapper being completely uncounterable and unfair in the right hands. Therefore we are nerfing Pig’s movement speed to 4.00001 m/s.
bubba's got weak mobility compared to billy, not having knowledge or slowdown from perks will make his game hell. Honestly i think billy wins. He has that one addon that lets him quietly chainsaw rush, it's fucking terrifying seeing him run from across the map towards you in pure silence
@@KaaneDragonShinobi that is very true do you think it should stay the same if it was a vid or swap were bubba gets addons and perks and billy doesn't?
I'm glad I got to watch these live, you could've definitely had a higher result if that one question in chat didn't distract you from the hatch in shack in garden of joy, your reaction to suddenly remembering it was very funny
Personally with a similar sort of build idea I'd use Jolt instead of Agitation, because while basement is very powerful, Jolt lets you hold 3-gens almost entirely by downing one or two people within your territory. No need to hook for gen progress, plus it can hit multiple gens, which normally isn't a huge deal but when you're playing towards the inevitable 3-gen you get as a trapper, its really nice. Really, trying to hold 3-gens is my strat when playing most of the less-mobile characters.
I mean, she is heavily reliant on add-ons. Sure, her chase is strong. But her map mobility is really not. Distance add-ons are a must because she cannot traverse map with Billy-like speeds anymore (due to CD + slow MS). If you take her and compare against Blight (video was done before), it becomes very clear that despite her immense chase potential, as a killer, she has NOTHING else. She has no hook defense (any hook defense below Bubba’s level does not count as hook defense). She has no Blight-like mobility. She has no areal control/lockdown. She does not benefit from half of game’s perks. She has 0 game stall - speed of kills is not direct game stall, but more so a byproduct. If Nurse has ALL of these (being able to set-up hook defense + her blinks could be charged forever, granting infinite blink distance + could reduce her fatigue with Save The Best For Last perk etc….) - then, and only then, she would be “OP”. As she is now, she is a master of one. Oppressive and impossible to negate - sure. Diverse - absolutely not. Nurse, despite all of the extent of her strength, is a one-dimensional killer. People really misuse the term OP nowadays, as if it is some “cool” catchphrase. In reality, OP does not exist in DBD anymore - most of vile things got patched out. Legion was not OP upon release either. It was foolproof and un-interactive, but not OP in the slightest. Nurse is within same category, so to speak. Strong and OP is a difference between Superman and Plutonian. Not between Punisher and Batman. Even if one is 1000000 stronger than others in one category, they are still nothing but obscenely strong - not “OP”. OP == infinitely strong in EVERY category, without ANY weaknesses (eg. Plutonian).
@@kingol4801 I see where you're coming from, but I disagree with how you define the term overpowered. I feel that overpowered simply means that something is relatively so powerful, it's having negative effects on game balance. Nurse is like this, as even with her weaknesses (which I completely agree with, she's not a perfect killer) she still absolutely dominates the game, with this video showing evidence that even base nurse performs better than a weak killer with a meta setup that would collect kilograms of salt in endgame chat. Because nurse is so powerful, it's more difficult to balance the game (perks like starstruck don't need nerfs, but nurse benefits so much from it that some people will argue the perk is too strong, purely because of a single killer affecting game balance).
Maybe im just a psycho, but i find the games where you are ruthless and playing to win eliminating any fun anyone may have, kind of refreshing. It's cool to see people just play to obliterate a game, specially with how fair you usually/always are (and better if it's on trapper).
These are very interesting results, the "first down timer" and "gens per match" do reflect too stuff mostly for nurse, I wonder as well too, if we could get an average of hooks per match for each killer, seeing how as this trapper strat could lead to people dying on first or second hook, and not sure how slug reliant the nurse was Great info still tho, love the vids
I followed this game as a guide and got my first 4k tonight as Trapper 😈💀💀💀💀 It was only my 4th game as Trapper, 😈13th😈 game as killer overall. Obviously I don't have all those perks, but I made some good compromises I think. My build was Thrill of the Hunt, Agitation, Jolt, Brute Strength. I made setting traps silent too, but I don't know how much of a difference that really made. Love your videos, great content
Oh man imagine being those survivors, probably thought they had it in the bag but when they went to open the gates No Way Out triggered then 2 seconds later Nancy goes down to NOED and they realize they're trapped in there with you
It's just unbelievable that they haven't changed Nurse in such a long time, I remember it was 2019 last time she got nerfed, she got a the blink charge cooldown mechanic and got rid of more than 2 blinks and some other addon changes, but it didn't take long at all for people to get used to the "new" nurse and be op again.
All of these Videos on Nurse have Convinced me that Nurse is Unfair and Unbalanced as Sh*t Nerf Idea for Nurse: Make certain Perks work differently on her This ensures that certain Perks that are fine on other Killers are not completely Busted in Nurse so Nurse can stop Bottlenecking Perks
Hate how no one is actually talking about the video content. Saying Pig needs a nerf gets old after awhile. Point is NURSE needs a little tweaking and Trapper needs a little buff.
Just some constructive criticism here! I would have loved to hear Hens talk a little bit about nurse and his experience of how he was playing the game similar to how you were talking about your mistakes and play style of trapper! If both people are giving an explanation the video feels more objective and less biased towards it being more trapped focuses! Edit: PS love the content OTZ❤️❤️
Nerf idea for nurse She is now a regular movement speed killer She spawns with 2 blinks but blinks are permanently consumed after use To recharge blinks you must injure survivors I don't know exactly how many blinks she should get per hit but this would make it so her extremely powerful power is limited and you can just spam blinks willy nilly for example is a survivor at a god loop time to use a blink The survivor is at a not so great loop don't use a blink best to save it for a good moment
I haven't played this game since before The Ring dlc came out but it's still entertaining watching Otzdarva sometimes.. I think the reason why this game has been unfun for killer for so long is largely because the game puts the killers in a race against the clock situation, imo more so than survivors usually. I'd frequently have more fun playing survivor than killer, I'd normally soloQ too. It's just a lot more chill and if my dumb team dies, it's w/e. It feels like shit being killer and just straight up get bullied/gen rushed all of the time though. Also some of my most fun times in this game have just been playing killer but giving no fks about a 4k or the survivor's rulebook(for killers) and just Bubba basement camp or going HAM with Oni or something. 😁 That's what makes the game interesting to me is the killer actually being the one to call the shots and not just the survivors bringing 30 medkits/brand new parts or w/e and dictating the game for the killer.
Nurse needs to have something like a 50% decreased resistance to stuns. At least pallets could be useful counterplay if you can stun her while blinking (which also seems to be bugged).
as a nurse main, this seems insignificant LOL. Most people dont loop pallets against nurse, and stunning her while blinking isnt a thing -- or it is and its just never happened to me. stunning her while shes holding a blink rarely happens as well, because theres no need to stand in a pallet. IMO, a better nerf would be to shorten her lunge. But even with that, I can't think of any nerfs that could really hurt her without the devs reworking her power entirely.
that purple trapper bag is more like putting a round in your own foot than giving yourself a leg up. If you can't shuffle your traps as they fall for them, you're in a bad spot.
Given his lore, about how the Entity basically tortured him until he agreed to kill, I like to think Trapper is bad because he wants to be bad. Like he's doing his job, but purposely doing it in a less-effective way because it's the only form of protest he can make without the Entity punishing him.
Do you think the solution to trapper is to make trapper the best m1 killer, like to give him a 120 or 125 base movement speed, or to change his addons so that he gets chase or map traversal? Imagine an add on that increases movement speed by 10% for 15-25 seconds after a trap snaps
I don't like making a killer 120, that's broken. I do like the idea of the second addon, though. 10-15% MS when someone steps in a trap, disabled after 10 seconds, or when you start a chase. Alternatively to prevent cheese, make it auto disable within 10 meters of a survivor.
The interesting thing is that even if we add perks and add ons to nurse... the kill ratio doesn't even change that much since is already at almost 4k every game with nothing equipped
I can pretty much confirm the Nurse related Side - I started playing her a few weeks ago for the very first time pretty much and i started playing her with nothing, no perks - no addons - and i needed 3 games for my first 4 k and even the first and second game were 2 and 3ks - after that i consistently got a average of about 3 kills, even vs swfs with a couple thousand hours. Then i started playing her WITH perks and addons - and none - not a single survivor ever escaped through the exit gate and they never completed all gens. Sometimes one escapes through the hatch, but well thats rng who is closer where it spawns. So.... even as an total amateur with Nurse - i was getting extremely good results and i dont think the statement "she is strong but hard to play" works for a reason for her state in the game. I realised that - if i encounter a Nurse as Survivor - there is pretty much already determined that i will not escape, no matter how good we play and no matter how hard we try. If she is half decent - she will kill atleast 3 of us. If i have hatch luck - okay - i escape - but otherwise --- i dont- and i dont think thats healthy for a game. When you can already tell how the match will end no matter what you do. And i feel its similiar with Blight. I don't think thats balanced and it lowers my personal fun at that point with this game
Ya tunneling and strategic camping is the best play just because it puts pressure on the survivors more than anything. Slugging can be unreliable if your not using deer stalker and then you risk unbreakable perk counterplay.
I would hope nurse wins in a cage match, as she shouldnt be stepping in any bear traps because of her floating abilities... wait this isnt that video yet.
Even if nurse could only translate through “normal” areas that other killers could (like windows / over pallets) she’d still be one of the most dominant killers. The ability for her to zip through solid objects is just game-warping.
I commented this on Hens video (whom I follow btw), but if you look at it, Nurse can do just fine without addons and even without perks at all, while the "supposed second best killer" Blight can't as consistently. Regardless of my opinion of Blight and Artist actually being a lot weaker than Nurse (because I understand a killer isn't designed considering perks nor addons, that's why they're called "addons" in the first place), the simplest, most effective and reasonable change you can do to her is just remove one of her charges. That'll incentivize the idea of Nurse being actually a hard killer to use, most problematic addons like range ones won't be that good anymore, and players will be forced to use two specific addons if they want to play as an actual Nurse without any addons (which we've seen it's very strong already). Yes, there's one or two addons which will definitely need a rework, but that is indeed a good idea for them.
I don‘t know if it‘s a valid or good idea, but could you try this trapper with this lovely strategie against a comp team, i really think it would be exciting to see what would happen…
It does seem like amount of kills you get can highly depend how miserable game you're willing to give for one survivor. Difference between 1v4 and 1v3 is just insane and as long as gens is only way out before 1 player is standing, its hard to balance it out.
I think something that is very common knowledge but isn't mentioned enough is how much Nurse just does NOT care about Pallets or normal looping tiles in general. The thing about EVERY other killer regardless of circumstance is that a pallet is something that will prolong your chase, it is a place for survivors to feel some sort of power over the killer. But against Nurse you don't even stop to consider dropping a pallet EVER, you immediately ignore pallets and other places that are usually very safe for you.
Only logical conclusion - every killer should be less like trapper and more like Nurse. Every killer’s power should revolve around avoiding one/multiple design features. EX: Vaults and pallets are useless against Nemesis. Pyramid Head makes walls useless. Slinger makes distance useless etc etc.
@@kingol4801 Not at all the point of my statement. Nurse has been by far the strongest killer in the game for 6 years at this point and it's absurd that she's still operating like this when its nearly 2023. Ranged killers DO have some strengths at pallets/windows because have you have to be smart about when you used them, and artist can completely disable loops with her power, but Nurse has been over performing for 6 years at this point and they haven't made any real attempt at reworking her.
I recently tried perkless and the other kind where it's perkless but with shadowborn and the worst addons. My mmr is decent ig, but as trapper perkless i got 3 kills but all gens got completed. As nurse i got 4 kills and there was 3 gens left. The meme build with perkless (except for shadowborn) i downed 4 survivor with trapper 2 gens left, but the survivors were alot worse. As the nurse i downed 3 last got hatch with1 gens left, albeit better survivors this time. The meme addons was the padded jaws on trapper that doesn't make survivors injured. Two on nurse that made her blink range 20% worse and another that made her an m1 killer for 60 seconds after you get a hit and give u 4.6 m/s speed And i gotta say that the nurse addon gameplay was very unique to usual nurse i had to actually think smart and actually play around loops, pallets, windows as the nurse. So if the devs wanna keep her ability but nerf her then i'd say giving her a disadvantage to using an overpowered ability would be nice. And it can be 30-20 seconds instead as 60 is very harsh. or just nerf the range/cooldown etc
I play trapper in a aggressive way though. I use trapper with trapper gloves an fastening tools add ons, using perks undying, pentimento, corrupt intervention, an hex: plaything. Just to try to slow the game down an make them not notice me as much an set traps alot faster so less down time. Or my other build with tar bottle an honing stone add ons, using perks tinkerer, jolt, save the best for last, an hysteria. This build is for being very aggressive an if people step in my traps I ain't worried right away while in chase an people become oblivious over time with some stealth.
Otz hasn't liked any comments yet is it finally my chance? I better come up with something good to say. But the pressure is getting to me more than the amount of pressure trapper puts on his basement
I don't understand why nurse blink recharges right after she recovers from using it. There is literally 0 time in between to escape if she messes up cause she can just instantly blink again There is no punishment for her to miss it
These results really do show how "MMR" is insufficient to show the gap between Killers. Despite a diference of only 0.1 kills, Nurse was definitely stronger and more capable of destroying Survivors early on.
True that
Facts
You made a point of this, but it's hard to understate how much certain maps help/hinder each side. Nurse on RPD is disgusting, while Trapper in a really grassy map like Backwater is incredibly hard to deal with. Hens getting indoor maps on Nurse? Probably affected his stats greatly.
Obviously we're comparing high tier vs low tier killer, but I think it would be cool to repeat this the killers stacked on offerings for a more balanced, "traditional" map, like Yamaoka.
@@lidla2008 This goes to show that one of the most massive things that alters the balance in this game is maps. I think that having some sort of way of banning a certain map (1 for each side) would be nice. Perhaps reworking the offerings to be a sort of reverse offering, which guarantees that you won't be sent to a certain map.
OTZ someone is pretending to be you and sending ppl links saying to click here because they've won something ( i just got one) i know Demi just posted that it's been happening to him, i wasn't sure if you were aware of it
Nerf idea for Nurse
If she gets stunned she simply dies, and the surivors instantly win
nurse would still be to op lol
nerf idea: she can’t teleport
as if Nurse can be stunned
nerfed nurse already exists
is called Wesker
You could probably integrate that and nurse would still be top of scoreboard lmao
Otz calling himself 'decent' at trapper is the biggest understatement of the year
No one cares
No one cares
I care
I care too
I care too m8
Man had the audacity said that he’s “Decent” at trapper. You literally are the best trapper I’ve ever seen. It’s either you or that left hand guy
Entity's Left Hand you mean... yeah he's decent.
who tf is that left hand guy? I haven't seen otz's content for like six month.
This is the best trapper in the world
www.twitch.tv/maou_asada
plays since the alpha version (long before the beta) and has like 25k hours or more
he has the world record on trapper wins, kills, sacrifices, moris, and triggered traps
@@ottere lol ikr
@@ottere He's this weird streamer who thinks he's Trapper IRL and is extremely toxic, I've gone against him multiple times with my friends, and most of the time he destroyed us but when we actually managed to make the game slightly harder for him in a couple of games, he got so triggered he slugged us all on the ground to bleed out instead of hooking in BOTH games, and when we asked him why do u take the game hostage like that, he said it's not taking the game hostage, well I know for a fact that it is cuz a streamer I know got banned for doing the same exact thing.
Trapper is clearly OP. They should nerf Pig.
god that meme is so tired.
Please become funny.
Very original
I'm tired too. of pig getting nerfed! nerf her again then.
Pig being nerfed? Time to buff Trickster!
Finally. But the most important part of the Video points out, that the Pig needs a nerf again.
Yeah the pig is op when I play them I feel like in cheating
Let's give her one trap basekit, and make her ambush as long as a basic attack and have bigger cooldown
@@ashleystrode7887 her ambush heals surviors and bear traps make you do gens faster
Pig is easy AF to beat
@@JIGSAW941 nah she op
"I happen to be decent at him"
My friend I've been watching your videos since you streamed Pig with a Saw mask on. I watched as you counted the seconds until someone stepped on a trap on the other side of the map. I saw you mind game the basement entrance by acting like you came not at the right time. You singlehandedly kept the Trapper's killrate high and made sure innocent killer mains didn't fall to the trap that is playing Trapper.
TL;DR: Otz Trapper good
You're too kind.
@@haiz768 Either youre a bot or youre sad. You've gone out of your way to reply to so many peoples comments with a tone like this. I just hope you do better one day.
The thing that bothers me about eyrie of crows that I dont hear anyone mention is the random branches that stick out from walls and block movement. Also that some bushes are solid but others aren't even though they're almost identical
As a Billy main, I totally agree with you. BHVR should make all bushes transparent on this map.
@@sergeychistov8162 Honestly, any killer or Survivor main can agree that the inconsistency is annoying. Either make them all transparent or all solid, so that we don't have to guess during chase "wait, can I go through THIS bush, or will I bump into it and get hit/lose the guy I'm chasing?"
My biggest issue with it is the black blobs that when flying upwards make noises similar to survivors healing. It always trips me out.
@@sergeychistov8162 They can't because of the complain with survivors hiding in bushes, thats why some are transparent, and thats why Garden of Joy has those weird bushes, was a decision to not have survivors hiding in bushes.
The biggest issues with this map is everything.
It's ridiculous that Trapper is the weakest killer in the game yet he's the "POSTER" guy of DBD
He's the poster boy cause he's a barely functioning incompetent clod prone to spectacular failure, but hey, he looks REALLY cool, I mean...what a great concept! The hooks, the strategy....you know?
I think he fits the company pretty well. They're getting better though, finally. I....think.
@@Klausinator451 they're getting better at mitigating the gamedesign failures of caving to the majority
I thought onryo was the worst or clown. But in all honesty all of these killers are D tier
Fax
@@jasper.rubyftw gotta be clown unless your killer fundamentals are god-tier
nerf ideas for nurse
1. She no longer has a weapon
2. she blinks backwards
3. if she gets flashlighted she remains blind for the rest of the match
4. getting less than 3 kills results in the lowering of the credit score of the actual player
5. random chance to explode when blinking
Give her 3 blinks base kit, but make the first blink safe. The second one has a 30% chance to overload you, and the third has 50%. Overload meaning stun. Alternatively just remove her from the game.
Developers: We hear you Otz! Trapper is no longer able to place traps near basement.
Ah, yes. My favourite UA-cam series.
A video with Otz's face in it
The Chad Trapper player vs. The Virgin Nurse
Ayo, hens is a goodin too
Exactly what I thought when I saw this thumbnail.
Hens is actually omega chad
@@thecyclope_9643 fair, but most sweat nurses I face are virgins lol
@@poordude2175 agreed
A good change for trapper might be to always make his traps blend in with the color of the ground based on which map he is sent to. Obviously it wouldn’t be perfect camouflage, having a bit of rust and bloodstains to make it stand out a bit on maps with lighter colored ground, but you’d think the killer who is literally all about knowing his prey and pushing them into a corner where they’ll be caught in his traps would also know the terrain he’s gonna be hunting in.
Or, better yet, make them invisible.
Survivors get a pop-up notification of “disable trap” when 3-4 meters away, IF they are walking/crouching.
But a running survivor does NOT get any notification whatsoever.
@@kingol4801 ngl tho, subtle traps working on crouching survivors from the other side of the map make me so happy
Meta Clown vs Perkless Spirit. I’ll gladly wait.
instadown clown with +bottles (post-nerf lol) would completely destroy blank spirit if the clown player is remotely decent at landing direct hits, it's actually a bit mindblowing to think that wouldn't be obvious with 3-nerf spirit
@@Evalora nah, top Clowns use Ether and Flask. Pinky finger is mainly used just for camping
@@frostbackup ........................... lol
just lol
@@Evalora nah, top clowns use confetti bottle only. I have the most hours of all clown mains, about 40 total on him
= every survivour pre dopping pallets which = cancer
I'd love to see a comparison like this but both players (or the same person twice) wear a heartrate monitor, and we compare how stressful the average game is for each character
Nurse so easy, you get a flatline xD
Bubba mains have no heartbeat, explaining why they are so braindead
@@OfficialMaxXimusK that makes literally no sense, you do realise that but haha funny joke
@@doktor7612 Bro it's a joke if you're not smart enough to understand it just say that.
@@WyattOShea it's ok, it is probably a bubba main
So based on these results, everyone is just fine, the game is in a perfectly balanced state...except...you both got quite a few kills, so we better nerf the pig. -Bhvr
@@haiz768 so you’re obviously a troll, I’ve seen you on 5+ comments
@@haiz768 You’re annoying as fuck, so i guess we’ll have to nerf pig as a consequence.
@@haiz768 clearly a bot, everyone press f1
@@rowen616 Instructions unclear: Alt-F4 pressed, pig nerfed, day ruined.
The game is balanced if nurses can't use perks and add ons yes
I think that they could fix Nurse by adding another minute into the Pig’s RBT timer. If Nurse is still too oppressive, lower Pig’s crouched speed by about 5%
Otz out here representing us trapper mains, appreciate you man
(yes we exist)
trapper mains ? You still exist? True chads
Are you okay? Blink twice if BHVR are making you play Trapper against your will.
@@shirokku3279 You could say BHVR... trapped them
You have multiple personalities disorder right? No way there's more than one person maning trapper
I love trapper and until internet told me I never knew he was considered weakest.
Now do meta nurse vs perkless trapper
Meta nurse wins no surprise lol
Then its like how it usually goes. Only new players play Trapper while Veterans spam Nurse
@@jackmatutum7747 I been playing since 2017 and I haven't played nurse even once, dont generalize buddy
@@discoalice ah yes, you haven't done that so that means no one has. this is the perfect situation to generalize because it's true lmfao.
@@jackmatutum7747 I been playing since 2022 and I haven’t played trapper even once, dont generalize buddy
Dredge fun fact: If you teleport to a locker and a survivor is inside, when you come out with the survivor you cannot be blinded. Making the Dead Dog Saloon SWFs very unhappy.
Also lockers are getting changed to give the killer blind stun immunity when taking a survivor out of a locker
You're also blind immune while in a locker :3
Imagine if the Shape could actually do a decent chase and had any realistic way of dealing with pallets.
Well, time to nerf the Pig!
Lol and yet there are far more killers stronger than Trapper
It's funny how Mikey is a "bad" killer yet I literally have an almost 90% 4k winrate more than any other killer I play. Whenever I play Michael it's like an almost guaranteed squash.
@@moz6388 I can get a lot of kills with him too but I would still say he's distinctly not fun because of his inability to close chases down. Smaller maps means the pallets are closer together than ever before, and his window-vault speed buff is inconsequential because he starts from rest after vaulting so he's always slower regardless.
"We at the BHVR balancing team has listened to your concerns, and have balanced The Shape accordingly. Hitting Tier 3 of Evil Within will now no longer expose survivors, and will instead cripple both of Michael's legs, forcing him to use crutches for the rest of the game"
What's the better part of Nurse: How she eats all of the design space for new killer perks; or how new killers keep eating all of the design space for making her fair?
They need to just disable certain perks for her already. I'm not sure if it'd destroy the code, but if you have perks for her you can't use, they could transport them over to another killer or spread them out or something.
@@Klausinator451 that’s the worst bandaid fix I’ve seen proposed in this community full of bandaid fixes. They need to balance her first and foremost. Then they wouldn’t have to worry about balancing perks around her.
@@fart63 but nurse can't be balanced in a way that would make "balanced" she either is shit or godlike
@@fart63 She is already unironically balanced.
This game should be killer-decided. Killer performs greatly - unless killer matched with 4 survivors of coordinated equivalent performance, killers win.
Asymmetric game implies that both sides have equal chance of winning. So, 1 killer’s potential should be not below, but on par to the compound potential of 4 survivors.
Nurse power level should be about the expected level of any killer’s power level.
@@kingol4801 I love how this logic is perfect and noone talks about it
That t-bag after the adrenaline play getting punished by NOED was actual poetry.
Seeing how Nurse performed even with so many handicaps made me realize Pig is too strong and should be nerfed...
3:45
Yeah, basement trapper is horrifying. I was in super low skill game (cause I myself suck and barely play the game honestly), and I got one person in basement... then quickly after I *just* left after trapping the two doors and the window they started hitting those traps like flies to fly paper. Got the achievement for getting all four survivors in the basement at *once* level flies to fly paper lol.
@@haiz768 what are u doing in the comment section then, if that's ur response to every comment dude
@@cinnamonsplash Just report him for spam, thats why i do with people like him
@@cinnamonsplash it’s a bot, ignore
@@fart63 it's a bot, report
I actually really appreciate the "negative ranting" about unfairness in the game, or when you post matches where you were very frustrated by stuff.
That mirrors my own experiences much more closely, and when you complain about something specific, it helps me to identify things that are very strong that I need to watch out for.
Also they're always practical in terms of understanding how you can try to come back from a bad match, the decisions you can make in these terrible situations, makes it feel less bad whenever that stuff happens to me.
Otherwise, it's easy to get a bit of that social media selection bias. People typically only post things on social media that they want other people to see. If all the DBD content you watch is always successful or powerful builds working well and securing 4K's, it could build up some not so helpful expectations that make your own matches feel more negative by comparison.
7:52 Damn Otz, you're really pushing the limits of what the human body is capable of with these challenges! Best of luck!
I saw Hens' video earlier, that was an interesting experiment!
It has been brought to our attention here at bhvr that some people have been complaining about the Trapper being completely uncounterable and unfair in the right hands. Therefore we are nerfing Pig’s movement speed to 4.00001 m/s.
saw hens's video on this the other day, quite an interesting competition. always nice to ya playin' trapper.
best showcase series, bring some more!
Now I need the best bubba no addons, vs the best billy with everything they want
ignore that clown, it'd be great to see Billy go at it
@@austronesiancommando5129 thank you ♥️
bubba's got weak mobility compared to billy, not having knowledge or slowdown from perks will make his game hell. Honestly i think billy wins. He has that one addon that lets him quietly chainsaw rush, it's fucking terrifying seeing him run from across the map towards you in pure silence
@@KaaneDragonShinobi that is very true do you think it should stay the same if it was a vid or swap were bubba gets addons and perks and billy doesn't?
Fantastic match by you. Hilarious ending for Hens
I love the extra content otz! this channel is just what i needed.
I'm glad I got to watch these live, you could've definitely had a higher result if that one question in chat didn't distract you from the hatch in shack in garden of joy, your reaction to suddenly remembering it was very funny
@@haiz768 even funnier that u have your name as "Hex" . So if anyone cares about DBD content,,, It's You.. 🤣
Imagine how little amount of love did child get from his mother, to became nursemainer.
Personally with a similar sort of build idea I'd use Jolt instead of Agitation, because while basement is very powerful, Jolt lets you hold 3-gens almost entirely by downing one or two people within your territory. No need to hook for gen progress, plus it can hit multiple gens, which normally isn't a huge deal but when you're playing towards the inevitable 3-gen you get as a trapper, its really nice. Really, trying to hold 3-gens is my strat when playing most of the less-mobile characters.
What a great challenge, i hope no one forgets to close the hatch near the shack while answering the chat
this one goes out to all the people saying the problem with nurse is her addons, you do not need anything on her to wreck almost everyone
I mean, she is heavily reliant on add-ons.
Sure, her chase is strong. But her map mobility is really not.
Distance add-ons are a must because she cannot traverse map with Billy-like speeds anymore (due to CD + slow MS).
If you take her and compare against Blight (video was done before), it becomes very clear that despite her immense chase potential, as a killer, she has NOTHING else.
She has no hook defense (any hook defense below Bubba’s level does not count as hook defense). She has no Blight-like mobility. She has no areal control/lockdown. She does not benefit from half of game’s perks. She has 0 game stall - speed of kills is not direct game stall, but more so a byproduct.
If Nurse has ALL of these (being able to set-up hook defense + her blinks could be charged forever, granting infinite blink distance + could reduce her fatigue with Save The Best For Last perk etc….) - then, and only then, she would be “OP”.
As she is now, she is a master of one. Oppressive and impossible to negate - sure. Diverse - absolutely not.
Nurse, despite all of the extent of her strength, is a one-dimensional killer.
People really misuse the term OP nowadays, as if it is some “cool” catchphrase. In reality, OP does not exist in DBD anymore - most of vile things got patched out.
Legion was not OP upon release either. It was foolproof and un-interactive, but not OP in the slightest. Nurse is within same category, so to speak.
Strong and OP is a difference between Superman and Plutonian. Not between Punisher and Batman.
Even if one is 1000000 stronger than others in one category, they are still nothing but obscenely strong - not “OP”.
OP == infinitely strong in EVERY category, without ANY weaknesses (eg. Plutonian).
@@kingol4801 I see where you're coming from, but I disagree with how you define the term overpowered. I feel that overpowered simply means that something is relatively so powerful, it's having negative effects on game balance. Nurse is like this, as even with her weaknesses (which I completely agree with, she's not a perfect killer) she still absolutely dominates the game, with this video showing evidence that even base nurse performs better than a weak killer with a meta setup that would collect kilograms of salt in endgame chat. Because nurse is so powerful, it's more difficult to balance the game (perks like starstruck don't need nerfs, but nurse benefits so much from it that some people will argue the perk is too strong, purely because of a single killer affecting game balance).
I love watching Trapper plays. There's something about his sound effects and methods that is almost relaxing? And his design is iconic.
Interesting but legion still needs a gun
It's so true
@@kilzfordays yes
Imagine if trapper could throw the traps and they instantly got set
Maybe im just a psycho, but i find the games where you are ruthless and playing to win eliminating any fun anyone may have, kind of refreshing. It's cool to see people just play to obliterate a game, specially with how fair you usually/always are (and better if it's on trapper).
Hello Otz, this is Friends!
These are very interesting results, the "first down timer" and "gens per match" do reflect too stuff mostly for nurse, I wonder as well too, if we could get an average of hooks per match for each killer, seeing how as this trapper strat could lead to people dying on first or second hook, and not sure how slug reliant the nurse was
Great info still tho, love the vids
first man that has ever begged for a tbag, why am i late to this video its gold
I followed this game as a guide and got my first 4k tonight as Trapper 😈💀💀💀💀
It was only my 4th game as Trapper, 😈13th😈 game as killer overall. Obviously I don't have all those perks, but I made some good compromises I think. My build was Thrill of the Hunt, Agitation, Jolt, Brute Strength. I made setting traps silent too, but I don't know how much of a difference that really made. Love your videos, great content
Oh man imagine being those survivors, probably thought they had it in the bag but when they went to open the gates No Way Out triggered then 2 seconds later Nancy goes down to NOED and they realize they're trapped in there with you
It's just unbelievable that they haven't changed Nurse in such a long time, I remember it was 2019 last time she got nerfed, she got a the blink charge cooldown mechanic and got rid of more than 2 blinks and some other addon changes, but it didn't take long at all for people to get used to the "new" nurse and be op again.
Great video! Really enjoyed that :D
All of these Videos on Nurse have Convinced me that
Nurse is Unfair and Unbalanced as Sh*t
Nerf Idea for Nurse:
Make certain Perks work differently on her
This ensures that certain Perks that are fine on other Killers are not completely Busted in Nurse so Nurse can stop Bottlenecking Perks
Hate how no one is actually talking about the video content. Saying Pig needs a nerf gets old after awhile. Point is NURSE needs a little tweaking and Trapper needs a little buff.
I had a game where I managed to hook everyone on the basement together, not basement trapper, it felt good
Otz, can you now do the same challenge but in reverse? Nurse with best perks and addons and Trapper with nothing?
you can imagine what will happen
There's sadism and then this.
@@kylesimone6140 I felt bad about posting this comment after Otz said in this video how it was already painful doing the perks and addons challenge XD
@Steve Otz gets 10 4ks ofc! :D
I love when Trapper gets rekt by his own traps
You should do something with Myers, oni or spirit I would love to see any of them in this series.
The dc at the end killed me😂 only time dcing is good😂 that was a great teammate❤️
Just some constructive criticism here! I would have loved to hear Hens talk a little bit about nurse and his experience of how he was playing the game similar to how you were talking about your mistakes and play style of trapper! If both people are giving an explanation the video feels more objective and less biased towards it being more trapped focuses!
Edit: PS love the content OTZ❤️❤️
Nerf idea for nurse
She is now a regular movement speed killer
She spawns with 2 blinks but blinks are permanently consumed after use
To recharge blinks you must injure survivors
I don't know exactly how many blinks she should get per hit but this would make it so her extremely powerful power is limited and you can just spam blinks willy nilly for example is a survivor at a god loop time to use a blink
The survivor is at a not so great loop don't use a blink best to save it for a good moment
Do Nurse with full perks and add-ons vs Trapper with nothing, to truly compare the discrepancy!
I just went against a full meta nurse with pain res + DMS and double recharge addons so this video makes me want to die a little less
I'm sure Nurse made you die regardless of your wants, RIP 😔
Super chad, babe magnet, all loved, trap placing Trapper vs maidenless, virgin, talentless, hated Nurse
I haven't played this game since before The Ring dlc came out but it's still entertaining watching Otzdarva sometimes..
I think the reason why this game has been unfun for killer for so long is largely because the game puts the killers in a race against the clock situation, imo more so than survivors usually.
I'd frequently have more fun playing survivor than killer, I'd normally soloQ too. It's just a lot more chill and if my dumb team dies, it's w/e. It feels like shit being killer and just straight up get bullied/gen rushed all of the time though.
Also some of my most fun times in this game have just been playing killer but giving no fks about a 4k or the survivor's rulebook(for killers) and just Bubba basement camp or going HAM with Oni or something. 😁
That's what makes the game interesting to me is the killer actually being the one to call the shots and not just the survivors bringing 30 medkits/brand new parts or w/e and dictating the game for the killer.
Nurse needs to have something like a 50% decreased resistance to stuns. At least pallets could be useful counterplay if you can stun her while blinking (which also seems to be bugged).
as a nurse main, this seems insignificant LOL. Most people dont loop pallets against nurse, and stunning her while blinking isnt a thing -- or it is and its just never happened to me. stunning her while shes holding a blink rarely happens as well, because theres no need to stand in a pallet.
IMO, a better nerf would be to shorten her lunge. But even with that, I can't think of any nerfs that could really hurt her without the devs reworking her power entirely.
When I saw (Myself) under Trapper, I could see right through Otz being humble lol. Otz is the only choice for Trapper!
that purple trapper bag is more like putting a round in your own foot than giving yourself a leg up.
If you can't shuffle your traps as they fall for them, you're in a bad spot.
Given his lore, about how the Entity basically tortured him until he agreed to kill, I like to think Trapper is bad because he wants to be bad. Like he's doing his job, but purposely doing it in a less-effective way because it's the only form of protest he can make without the Entity punishing him.
Do you think the solution to trapper is to make trapper the best m1 killer, like to give him a 120 or 125 base movement speed, or to change his addons so that he gets chase or map traversal? Imagine an add on that increases movement speed by 10% for 15-25 seconds after a trap snaps
I don't like making a killer 120, that's broken. I do like the idea of the second addon, though. 10-15% MS when someone steps in a trap, disabled after 10 seconds, or when you start a chase. Alternatively to prevent cheese, make it auto disable within 10 meters of a survivor.
The interesting thing is that even if we add perks and add ons to nurse... the kill ratio doesn't even change that much since is already at almost 4k every game with nothing equipped
You can make her power work like Nemesis whereas she needs 3 hits to down when using it rather than no-power M1's.
I'm addicted to you otz
I can pretty much confirm the Nurse related Side - I started playing her a few weeks ago for the very first time pretty much and i started playing her with nothing, no perks - no addons - and i needed 3 games for my first 4 k and even the first and second game were 2 and 3ks - after that i consistently got a average of about 3 kills, even vs swfs with a couple thousand hours. Then i started playing her WITH perks and addons - and none - not a single survivor ever escaped through the exit gate and they never completed all gens. Sometimes one escapes through the hatch, but well thats rng who is closer where it spawns. So.... even as an total amateur with Nurse - i was getting extremely good results and i dont think the statement "she is strong but hard to play" works for a reason for her state in the game. I realised that - if i encounter a Nurse as Survivor - there is pretty much already determined that i will not escape, no matter how good we play and no matter how hard we try. If she is half decent - she will kill atleast 3 of us. If i have hatch luck - okay - i escape - but otherwise --- i dont- and i dont think thats healthy for a game. When you can already tell how the match will end no matter what you do. And i feel its similiar with Blight. I don't think thats balanced and it lowers my personal fun at that point with this game
Good to see friendly dbd interactions
This just shows how camping and tunnelling is still the best playstyle any trash killer who say he doesn’t tunnel or camp proves they average 0 kills
Ya tunneling and strategic camping is the best play just because it puts pressure on the survivors more than anything. Slugging can be unreliable if your not using deer stalker and then you risk unbreakable perk counterplay.
In conclusion, pig needs to be nerfed
I would hope nurse wins in a cage match, as she shouldnt be stepping in any bear traps because of her floating abilities... wait this isnt that video yet.
yes they tied, but nurse was basically naked while trapper had to use every single tool in the arsenal, like a John Wick preparing for revenge
Wow, today we have normal Otz and not Otz from another dimension or wanted in all states of USA.
Bro keep playing trappers it fun to watch
Dudes.. Hens is just such a good guy.
so basically nerf trapper and buff nurse
16:55 this is how you know, they are best friends
Even if nurse could only translate through “normal” areas that other killers could (like windows / over pallets) she’d still be one of the most dominant killers. The ability for her to zip through solid objects is just game-warping.
I commented this on Hens video (whom I follow btw), but if you look at it, Nurse can do just fine without addons and even without perks at all, while the "supposed second best killer" Blight can't as consistently. Regardless of my opinion of Blight and Artist actually being a lot weaker than Nurse (because I understand a killer isn't designed considering perks nor addons, that's why they're called "addons" in the first place), the simplest, most effective and reasonable change you can do to her is just remove one of her charges. That'll incentivize the idea of Nurse being actually a hard killer to use, most problematic addons like range ones won't be that good anymore, and players will be forced to use two specific addons if they want to play as an actual Nurse without any addons (which we've seen it's very strong already). Yes, there's one or two addons which will definitely need a rework, but that is indeed a good idea for them.
Love you bro
Am wondering, if you counted hatch escapes as half a kill how would the stats look?
I don‘t know if it‘s a valid or good idea, but could you try this trapper with this lovely strategie against a comp team, i really think it would be exciting to see what would happen…
It does seem like amount of kills you get can highly depend how miserable game you're willing to give for one survivor.
Difference between 1v4 and 1v3 is just insane and as long as gens is only way out before 1 player is standing, its hard to balance it out.
I think something that is very common knowledge but isn't mentioned enough is how much Nurse just does NOT care about Pallets or normal looping tiles in general. The thing about EVERY other killer regardless of circumstance is that a pallet is something that will prolong your chase, it is a place for survivors to feel some sort of power over the killer. But against Nurse you don't even stop to consider dropping a pallet EVER, you immediately ignore pallets and other places that are usually very safe for you.
Only logical conclusion - every killer should be less like trapper and more like Nurse.
Every killer’s power should revolve around avoiding one/multiple design features.
EX: Vaults and pallets are useless against Nemesis. Pyramid Head makes walls useless. Slinger makes distance useless etc etc.
@@kingol4801 Not at all the point of my statement. Nurse has been by far the strongest killer in the game for 6 years at this point and it's absurd that she's still operating like this when its nearly 2023. Ranged killers DO have some strengths at pallets/windows because have you have to be smart about when you used them, and artist can completely disable loops with her power, but Nurse has been over performing for 6 years at this point and they haven't made any real attempt at reworking her.
"im decent at him"
-Otz, who did the 50wins with TRAPPER.
I recently tried perkless and the other kind where it's perkless but with shadowborn and the worst addons.
My mmr is decent ig, but as trapper perkless i got 3 kills but all gens got completed. As nurse i got 4 kills and there was 3 gens left.
The meme build with perkless (except for shadowborn) i downed 4 survivor with trapper 2 gens left, but the survivors were alot worse.
As the nurse i downed 3 last got hatch with1 gens left, albeit better survivors this time.
The meme addons was the padded jaws on trapper that doesn't make survivors injured.
Two on nurse that made her blink range 20% worse and another that made her an m1 killer for 60 seconds after you get a hit and give u 4.6 m/s speed
And i gotta say that the nurse addon gameplay was very unique to usual nurse i had to actually think smart and actually play around loops, pallets, windows as the nurse. So if the devs wanna keep her ability but nerf her then i'd say giving her a disadvantage to using an overpowered ability would be nice. And it can be 30-20 seconds instead as 60 is very harsh. or just nerf the range/cooldown etc
I play trapper in a aggressive way though. I use trapper with trapper gloves an fastening tools add ons, using perks undying, pentimento, corrupt intervention, an hex: plaything. Just to try to slow the game down an make them not notice me as much an set traps alot faster so less down time. Or my other build with tar bottle an honing stone add ons, using perks tinkerer, jolt, save the best for last, an hysteria. This build is for being very aggressive an if people step in my traps I ain't worried right away while in chase an people become oblivious over time with some stealth.
Wasn't the title buffed trapper vs nerfed nurse? I knew it it was otzdarva all along controling not otzdarva
4:33 *looks at video chapters*
Oh no......
Edit: Oh never mind. I thought Hens' last game was literally that long.
"ok, we'll try not to complain every 2 secs"
literally me every 2 secs ^^
Otz hasn't liked any comments yet is it finally my chance? I better come up with something good to say.
But the pressure is getting to me more than the amount of pressure trapper puts on his basement
I don't understand why nurse blink recharges right after she recovers from using it. There is literally 0 time in between to escape if she messes up cause she can just instantly blink again
There is no punishment for her to miss it
Born I swear I've gone against that Nancy not even that long ago
“Ten seconds of waiting later…” 😂😂😂