Nvidia GeForce RTX 2080/ RTX 2080 Ti Review: True Next-Gen Graphics Architecture?
Вставка
- Опубліковано 19 вер 2018
- Apologies for the delay on this one! Rich tests out the RTX 2080 and its monstrous Ti counterpart, compares them to GTX 1080 and 1080 Ti, goes in depth into 4K performance and talks about the potential of ray tracing and cool stuff like DLSS. Is RTX worth it? Find out here.
Subscribe for more Digital Foundry: bit.ly/DFSubcribe
Join the DF Patreon, support the team more directly and get pristine quality video downloads: www.digitalfoundry.net - Ігри
Coming back 5 years later and seeing how far DLSS and RT has evolved. So many doubters in the past and now it’s someting here to stay.
DLSS has literally become a game changer. I recently built a pc, and despite Nvidias bullshit with their overpriced 4000 series cards, it was hard for me not to choose a Nvidia card. AMD makes some excellent cards - no doubt - but FSR is just not there yet . Upscaling tech is going to be a big part of gaming for the foreseeable future and Nvidia is simply ahead of the game at the moment. It's great to see FSR 3 turning out to be a really solid competitor to Frame Generation.
The key part of that sentence is the word "evolved" though. DLSS is great NOW, but it wasn't then. The original 1.x version of DLSS was pretty awful and everybody now admits as much (including Digital Foundry). Worse than FSR is today, certainly. Yet this video is full of nothing but praise for it and shilling for its benefits, essentially presenting it as free performance and a reason to buy a Turing card over a 1080 Ti. It's more a sales pitch and regurgitating Nvidia marketing than an objective review.
it took 10 years for nvidia to perfect rtx
it took rich only 10 min to perfect those hand gestures
MrShit hahahaha
it took aprox 3 seconds to see how ignorant you are.
@@woodsy555 What? Why? Seems like you were having a bad day, mate.
It took me 10 seconds to order 2080ti from Amazon.
Based on the clock in the background, dude basically did this whole video in one take...never once stumbled or flubbed a line. We already knew DF is the gold standard of graphics analysis, but damn...who knew they had these production chops? As it turns out, the man is low-key an incredible presenter.
The clock can be changed though, I doubt he changed it but still the possibility exists.
If you watch one of their production vids, you'll see they have teleprompters in the cameras, the lines have already been written, Richard just reads it off the cameras and waves his hands around like a pimp
That’s kind of my point...reading from a teleprompter for 25 minutes straight, never missing a beat, never flubbing a line, never stumbling over words...even professional news anchors and audiobook narrators can’t often pull that off. This was a tour de force of presentation stamina. If he had been speaking extemporaneously, it would be easier to sound natural and to cover your screw ups...reading from a script is hard to do without sounding boring, or without your mistakes being super obvious. I was impressed to see this coming from a guy reviewing a graphics card, lol. Maybe other guys like Hardware Unboxed do it all in one take, too, but they don’t usually have a clock sitting behind them to prove it, so I don’t know. Anyhow, I don’t think I could do it...sure saves on editing time, I guess.
I would rather watch human not automated robot. I hate teleprompters. I want to see proper body language, too see what person is really thinking.
TheDragonfly256
If I had to choose between a teleprompter and improper cutouts via editing for many 'professional reviews'; I'll take the teleprompter.
My 1080ti purchase last year is looking good.
daverhodus
AGREED. ME TOO. EVGA FTW3 $749
under water.. I will wait for 30xx
Yeah, mine too. I'm gonna hold on to my 1080ti for at least another year. A 30-40% gain for a 70% price jump is not my idea of a good deal.
Naaaah you should get the (judging by the price) successor the 2080, virtually no performance gain for only $800! lmao
daverhodus
I also have mine overclocked 2025mhz with a custom water loop 360 mm radiator just for the card stays pegged at 2025 megahertz,1440p ROG SWIFT 27"....I AM GOOD for one more year...... it murders every game I throw it at 1440p. I will not pay to be an early adopter of a technology that hasn't taken off yet although I think that it will. I just would rather wait until Things become more affordable and that we could use these Technologies right now there are no games that support dlss or Ray tracing. FUKOUTTHEAR
Vermillion hahahahahaaa
Oh wow after almost 4 years Assassins creed Unity finally gets 4k 60fps with price of 1400 euros only! amazing!!
Ironically anyone who can afford to do this would be beheaded if the French Revolution happened again.
The sickening thing is they could have had the same performance at half the price if they would have released GTX cards instead of forcing useless RTX features on everyone.
Bad optimisation, the same for Wildlands...that game is crap
Well consoles runs at 900p 25/30 fps with sttutering so.......
2160P(4K) remains a crappy choice for gaming resolution, 1440P continues to offer the best Resolution / Performance balance.
$800 to cure vampirism and see yourself in mirrors again.
sold.
Nice anime lewd face avatar right there. Makes me ask myself "what if zelda was a girl?".
Princess Zorldo looks so good in RTX.
Is LP an abbreviation or accronym for Link Pussy?
@@totty2524 do you mean link? Or is there a joke I am missing?
What about Halo? He's a pretty cool guy.
Best video on this I've seen! Leave it to DF to drop knowledge. Really pumped for DLSS implementation!!
Incredible in-Depth review, thank you for you'r hard work!
Massive congrats on this vid! You can really see the huge amount of work you guys put in.
It's easier when you get ad revenue. And repeat pr talking points.
how can they get away with these prices?
Because AMD aren't competing.
PC gamers eat up everything these days. Just look at the top 10 list on steam. Speaks more than enough.
Because the competition sucks. AMD doesn't put up a fight and Intel doesn't release their GPUs until 2020 or something.
+R W At least PC gamers don't need to pay for online like a bunch of morons.
or you know, most of them that want high performance are buying the 1080ti, which nvidia is actively trying to get rid of the stock of
Because if you're not at 4K, the serie 10XX can already max out everything out there. It's not the GTX 1180 and 1180-ti, it's a new segment with hybrid raytracing and rasterized rendering. If you buy those GPU you are an early adopter like buyers of first generation VR headset.
My favorite channel for video card reviews. I love how much you guys get into the rendering techniques and apply that knowledge to how video cards react to them.
0:00
Loving these ray-traced hand gestures, Rich.
I find myself generally agreeing with Richard but the whole "Look at the phones, theyre going above £1000" argument feels incredibly shallow. Comparing a product to another outlier, a price hike that made headlines and put a lot of people off buying said product feels like passing the buck of justifying a shitty action by saying someone else did it first.
Also....
599 US DOLLARS
How quaint that was when we have defenders of PC screaming 1400 dollars is totally reasonable
Yea he is an idiot saying that. Apple is abusing consumers just like Nvidia and making the tech more about fashion and brands than actual features and performance.
Also it's 800 dollars for the 2080, but if you mean the 2070 that's 600 yes. Nvidia are such slime, they lie about the msrp saying it's 100 dollars less and 200 less for the 2080ti,when they sell the FE cards for more. FE cards are always going to be worse and temp testing show that as well. So when board partners make better coolers, and have higher clocks, why the fuck would they sell them FOR LESS, than what Nvidia does? You cannot find any of these cards for "msrp" all of them are at the real msrp with 100-200 dollars extra. And reviewers should stop eating Nvidia shit and say the truth about that stuff
It's true, they're too expensive for the majority of gamers (myself included), and frankly I don't find them at all 'reasonable', but unfortunately it's logical. I don't think people realize the tremendous investments in R&D that these companies have to make to design new products, not to talk about the fact that an important part of the cost of a graphics card is the manufacturing cost of the GPU itself. In previous generations, Nvidia could take advantage of significantly improved production nodes to shrink the newer chips and lower the cost, but now with Turing the opposite is true: the 12nm node is barely an advance over 16nm, and with Turing's vastly increased transistor count the RTX 2080 is about 16% bigger than the GTX 1080 Ti and 74% bigger than the GTX 1080. It's literally impossible to make bigger chips that sell for the same price as the previous generation without hurting your own profits, so in order to keep them untouched the price needs to go up accordingly.
Again, looking back at my first 'high-end' 3D card bought 20 years ago for about 120€, I find the current prices almost surreal, because we use these things to play, but as an engineer/investor it makes all the sense in the world.
Yeah Richard, look at the phones going above $1000. Specifically, look at how I didn't buy one of those either.
No, people understand that same research process has been used in generations past and made Nvidia a billion dollar company, so they aren't just getting by. We as consumers are well aware of what's reasonable pricing in this industry. This is just greed due to lack of competition.
At the risk of sounding pedantic, no, you don't understand if you think that they're simply using 'the same research' over and over. For Turing that's particularly untrue: this generation has the most important architectural changes that we've seen in more than a decade. And the numbers don't lie: Nvidia spent approx. $120 million in R&D in the first quarter of 2006, and now that cost has gone up to $581 in the quarter ending in July of this year. In other words, at the current pace they're going to spend around 2,4 billion dollars this year alone in R&D, so of course they're going to incorporate those expenses into their prices. Add to that the massive increase in manufacturing cost (2080 is 74% bigger than 1080) and you get the picture. Of course it sucks and I'd love to get an RTX 2080 Ti for half the price, but that's not how this works.
Wow, id Tech 6 engine is insane.
a beacon of hope for vulkan :)
Largely thanks to Vulkan. It looks like the architectural improvements in Turing have closed the gap with AMD.
Doom 2016 was the same. 1080 Ti could almost lock at 165 FPS at ultra in 1440p. Wish every game ran like it did.
That volumetric smoke tho...
DOOM 2016 on gtx 1080ti vulkan api I was locked at 200fps... it's an incredible game fast and nice looking I would take wolf2 for graphics purposes I played in ps4pro so I could tell differences as well
Always appreciate your mature and nuanced reviews, opinions and insights. Keep up the fantastic work!
Awesome job guy! I want to see the in depth analysis of per pixels DLSS on
I wonder how many gigarays per hand movement does Richard have... 🤔
OVER 9000!!!!
He's smacking dem rayz out of da wei.
The technology isn't ready yet to answer that question, come back in 10+ years or so.
Come back when you're a little...mmmm...richer!
God damn I love him
If there was ever a comment section to show that people don't watch the video they comment on, it's this one.
Another great DF video... this is my favorite youtube channel from far.. these guys are the best... love their work.
Did you use a reference version of 1080 series in this tests? It is important, because the reference of 1080 series always throttling to ~1600MHz, while the non-reference cards works with ~1800-1900MHz at full throttle. So it is around 15%-20% difference.
As excited as I was, I canceled my pre-order for the RTX 2080 at $799 when benchmarks got released. Saved $250 and got a GTX 1080ti instead. 7nm is where the 'real' next gen is going to be anyway, but this will get me through until then. (Upgrade from 970, REALLY needed it).
@SKEKMAL which is why I didn't go "all in" last gen. 3000 series, I might be willing to shell out $800 now. Not with the 2000 series though.
I like glitch art, so I really want to see what happens if you apply the DLSS profile from one game to another it was not trained on.
You guys are one of the most reliable hardware reviews channel!!!!
11:17 Interesting. You can see when scenes swap the DLSS doesn't go on instantly, and you can see every time phasma is on screen the edges of her helmet are very obviously aliased, and then conform to the high rest upsample. I would think for most games this wouldn't be an issue outside of cutscenes, and the end result is pretty impressive.
Another part is that it almost looks like it adds a sharpening filter on top. While I'm sure that's not what's actually happening, if you look at details they don't become softer like with normal post-AA, there's actually a lot of contrast added to areas where you'd normally expect nothing but lost detail.
I'm generally optimistic overall, assuming this get standardised and implemented all over the place. I also hope there's some option to enable this for lower resolutions, because the difference is pretty obvious without me having a 4k monitor.
... and here I am comparing the RTX 30XX launch in 2020 to the RTX20XX back in the day 🤓 are you with me? 😁
omg took forever for this one. The only time I seek out digital foundry videos and it's late. And very disappointed you guys spent so much time going over the RTX and DLSS stuff that you've already covered plenty of. I want to see numbers at all resolutions, not just 4K. Users grabbing these cards are likely interested in seeing 1440p performance. I personally want to know if I can take full advantage of my 165hz monitor with a 2080ti.
But thanks for making it! Looking forward to running my own tests when nvidia finally decides I deserve my preorder. I already have my new i7 8700k build sitting here, unplugged waiting for its GPU... was excited to get it booted up this friday so my girlfriend could join in on my current rig and play games with me.
Oh well, one more week to go
4k is more relevant in this testing scenario- comparing raw GPU power with the CPU basically out of the question.
why did NOBODY but you actually point out the HDR tone mapping with the RTX vs GTX now i finally know what card i need to run HDR
How will the DLSS function with ultra-wide resolutions? Any possibility for tests on those?
Gamers did not buy AMD with the 5000 series nor the 6000 nor the 7000 series. They ignored the good cards in the 200 series which were unafected by mining, they ignored the good cards in the 300 series (all of the 300 were superior to Maxwell except Fury which lost to 980 Ti) and they bought GTX 1060 10:1 over RX 480. Gamers deserve these prices, as they voted for them.
I agree with everything, except the 1060 vs 480 part.
People bought the 1060 over the 480 because when they were most relavent the 480 was double the price because of miners.
Hmm. I spent the last 10 years with a Radeon 5850 and then an R9 290. Everything was great until Nvidia had the leg up in the VR department, then I had to get a GTX 1070.
" People bought the 1060 over the 480 because when they were most relavent the 480 was double the price because of miners."
That was not the case for a year. Even when 480 was cheaper it sold less.
AMD made a lot of money because its cards were popular with miners...AMD is focusing on next gen consoles GPU's that is why VEGA graphics card sucked but it still sold a lot cause of miners....SO saying"Gamers deserve these prices, as they voted for them." is irrelevant..
I did the exact same, haha. Except I'm still on the R9 290X for VR.
Nvidia just trying to be the new Apple, I'm passing on this cards.
@Dik dic you are the definition of sheeple
LMAO look at that butthurted fanboy
Difference is nvidia has the undisputed best product on the market so has a reason to charge what they do unlike apple
Exactly Sean.
That's got nothing to do with performance. The 2080s are the most powerful gaming GPUs right now.
Would love to see more VR related testing, I know a lot will say that 4K is where most will be looking with these cards, but for me I don't own 4K and don't have plans for 4K as as I'm far more into VR.
@DigitalFoundry
Would you do a vid about Framepacing?
What is exactly,what are the simptoms,causes,worst known cases,possible solutions etc.?
Who else here after 3080 and 500 dollar 2080ti’s
Too expensive no thanks I'll stay with my 1070
i just got a laptop with a 1070MQ (about 6 months ago) and im definitely ok with it
Especially for 1080p its fine for years to come.
@@andysledge yep, 1080p 144hz so games that run easy can be smooth
Good review! The one thing I want to mention is that the Star Wars demo ran on a $60,000 DGX station in March, and now it runs on a $1,000 card in real time. Based on the negative comments I've been reading, I wonder if any company should even push for technological leaps when the gaming community would be happy with a slightly faster product on a yearly basis. RTX is the true next-generation architecture because it's the first time that we're seeing a combination of dedicated ray tracing and deep learning hardware in one package on the consumer level. It does make me wonder if this reaction will create the turning point in the "consumer" vs professional lines. The entertainment, visualization, and deep learning fields understand the technology and also understand the cost savings of 60:1. Maybe this pushback will create more products that don't utilize any truly new tech. If the gaming community doesn't want any improvements in photo-realism, animation, simulation, resolution, etc then they should be able to buy products that offer marginal gains year after year.
Great big picture review, thanks
And everybody was making fun of consoles for using upscaling techniques to reach 4k, and now the next generation of GPU's are going to utilize upscaling techniques as well. It makes sense. I think there's going to be more of a shift towards using resources more efficiently than just using brute force. Using a good upscaling method the difference between native could be almost indistinguishable. Native might still be clearer when you zoom in 300% but it's just not worth the GPU cost. Those extra resources can be put into better lighting, shading and so on.
As far as I understand, these new cards only upscale for anti aliasing DLSS. It doesn't affect actual game resolution, it's just another, smarter AA type.
@@awesome9174 It does actually drop the native resolution then upscale to your target.
maziarkd checkerboarding is NOT upscaling!
YES! it is. It's a smarter version of upscaling that eliminates MANY of it's disadvantages, but it's still UPSCALING.
+kraenk12 Checkerboarding is upscaling.
We should get the 2080Ti for the 2080 price and call it a decent upgrade. Those prices are not realistic. =(
It is the ray tracing making them so expensive, particuarly since it is new for computer games and soon consoles. Next Gen GPUs may be cheaper, when the much cheaper consoles will do 4K with ray tracing. Right now it is exclusive to PC and one company. When the competition adds it for cheaper, it will go down.
On a side note, they are even saying they will try for 8k on consoles, but I dont know if that is possible on a console. If it is, it is doable on PC then. Id wait for 2020/2021s GPus then anyways.
Quality review. Thanks again.
I'm interested in how RTX cards are going to aid DirectX based rendering in CAD and production applications. For example in addition to the core count will there be a boost in something like Octane.
Will porn be good with ray tracing ?
Lol
If you mean those animated porn. Yea, maybe? I don't know. I would find out for you but I'm too busy watching porn.
"Hey mom! I'm getting over 100fps in my hentai with Ray-Tracing enabled!!"
idk, would be strange to see camera guy in...
Oh hell yeah it'll be amazing.
My GTX 1070 will do just fine on my 1440p moniter for the next few years
Nice video... as always! :)
Great review! Still the most in depth reviews around.
Best time to buy gtx 1070
Or gtx 1060 6gb but agreed!
but still, everyone can't afford that
@@dans6117 gtx1070 for just 359€ here ,amazing price.
DANIEL PLAYER43: Take this from a 1060 6GB user - the card is beginning to show its age. For 1080p it's pretty decent, but everyone is starting to moving over to 1440p and 4K, so my advice is to look at getting a 1070 or over. But it really depends on what games you are playing; if you only play indie games or moba's then the 1060 is going to do you fine. But for the people who want to get into PC gaming and want to play the latest and greatest games like Metro: Exodus, Cyberpunk 2077, and M&B II, you are gonna need something like a 1070 or up.
I'm just waiting for the RTX 2070 to launch. The upgrade from my 1060 is going to be staggering.
Persy 3100 that’s around $400
Massive price hike. No games support RTX / DLSS currently. Conclusion: “Just buy it.”
😂 lol
Out of all the reviews for the new 20 series cards . . Digital Foundry has the most comprehensive and unbiased I've seen(and I've watched alot)
So great job guys . . Even if you aren't interested in buying one of these gpu's this video still has a lot of great information
Cheers for another great review.
So basically, unless you NEED Ray Tracing or the games you play support DLSS, it’s not worth upgrading.
dlss is not a gimmick...
SmashStomp Inc lies. The 2080 ti was doing 4k 58 FPS on the Starwars demo, and the 1080 ti was getting 8 FPS.
Right now 4K is barely achievable in modern titles at ultra settings though. It's pretty clear that a 2080ti is not going to deliver a consistent 4K @60fps in upcoming titles, even if you don't use RTX. So your choices are 4K @ 40-60 FPS, 1440P @60FPS or DLSS @60FPS. If DLSS offers 80%+ of native 4K it starts to look like a pretty good deal.
"Right now 4K is barely achievable in modern titles at ultra settings though."
Ultra settings are by their nature, not optimized. They exist to provide some improvements in graphics quality at a later date. If ultra settings run at 4k 60 FPS then the developers could have pushed harder for improvements in graphical fidelity.
A very high setting vs. ultra is that very high was optimized for a currently available GPU. Ultra is a setting to max something that has a high cost or provides little improvement relative to cost.
DLSS does look like a good deal. 4K for the cost of 1440p with improved image quality over native 4k with TAA. 120hz gamers will greatly appreciate it.
@@abram730 What you say about ultra settings is true right now, but it hasn't always been true and there is no guarantee that it will remain that way in the future. In the late 2000's/early 2010's even mid range cards could achieve Ultra settings at 1080p/1440p @50-60 FPS which were the standard resolutions of the time.
Games at the time we're playing catchup to graphics hardware that had been advancing for 10 years while the games themselves were still limited by consoles that hadn't changed in a decade.
Additionally AMD was much more competitive at the time and offered genuine alternatives to Nvidia's high end hardware, which obviously helped to bring down prices.
The reason Ultra settings are unachievable at 4K 60 fps right now is less to do with the settings themselves being designed to be very demanding and more to do with the state of the industry.
There's no reason for gamers not to push for cards that can achieve 4K ultra @60FPS, but DLSS could be a useful stopgap.
Is the shadow of tomb raider frame rate display lying? at 18:30, the game is saying 60 locked, but DF says 50.
Simply the best gpu/cpu reviews on youtube. thanks.
Finally, been waiting for this from DF
Not until it can penetrate more than the enthusiast market.
It's going to penetrate nothing more than our wallets for a while.
I'm talking about penetration beyond the veil of the flesh! A deep penetrating dive into the plasma pool!
You think your 4am was bad? At 4am, I woke up on the floor next to a puddle of my own vomit. That was fun.
IMHO, DLSS needs to eventually be implemented on the driver-level as a replacement of the current upscaling algorithm. There's no future in yet another Nvidia tech that devs need to implement on a game-by-game basis. We've seen this have meager adoption time and again with PhysX, Hairworks, Gameworks and so on. It's just not adequate IMO. DLSS is in the early stages right now, but my hope is that it'll eventually replace their upscaling solution fully and if they're being honest with their lingo surrounding the technology ("inference"), then it should eventually be so thoroughly trained that it should be wholly context ambivalent and universally applicable.
Meanwhile i'm daydreaming that in 15 years, an evolution of this tech will be used for on-the-fly remastering of games. If the deep-learning ai truly is "inferring" already, then that should be an obvious milestone; Machines starting to imagine things based on a seed.
Anything temporal and dependent on velocity information (so DLSS) can't be implemented generically in a driver.
They should just open-source their training model and package formats so people can build their own models folding@home style
Look at the video here: 22:12
DLSS is clearly lacking any capability in resolving the real problems with sub-4K rendering. At native 4K you have a perfectly crisp and stable image where DLSS does NOTHING to reduce the shimmering and moire of its 1440p image. You're better off just buying a cheaper card and not using DLSS, or better yet Nvidia should release GTX cards that actually target 4K. No game should ever run below 4K ever again.
Realistically, people just can't afford that. I'll take a mid-end and moire patterns over the insanity of 1200€ and still not be hitting the target. For the next few years, upscaling IS gonna be the order of the day. After that, it's still gonna be a patwork solution to get HFR gameplay for people who are competitive, but sitting on a 4k native screen.
I find that reviewers and people discussing this tech really fail to keep this in mind. So does the kind of comment you left. Some people just can't afford the full-fat elite tax. Some people can only do a new build every five years. DLSS can help both in attaining higher resolutions OR extending the life-span of a system that is starting to get past its prime. Scaling to native is better than having to let the monitor handle it and Nvidia have refused to replace their current up-scaling algorithm with something actually good. No matter how you cut it, DLSS at 4k will always be better than a plain upscale of 1440p to 4k.
I wish we'd hear more reviewers discuss this side of the tech. But then, this discussion is moot as long as it's still a per-game implementation.
"I'll take a mid-end and moire patterns over the insanity of 1200€ "
This insanity is entirely artificial. Nvidia has been raising the price per-frame over the last three generations. In fact the "value" of a 900 series card is still the same as what you get buying a 1000 or 2000 series card. Nvidia's profit margins are HUGE, but there is no competition to drive them to dip into any of that margin and offer consumers a better deal.
at 22:12 you can clearly see edge instability and flickering with DLSS compared to TAA, probably caused by the lower base resolution this mode is using. so this puts things in perspective I guess. while this might be accetable at 4k, this is probably not gonna look good at lower resolutions where it becomes more apparent.
It would be cool if dlss would render the image at native resolution, upscale it with its neural network and then downscale it to get some kind of fake ssaa with a fraction of the cost. But I don't know if it is possible.
So about 30 percent faster than a 1080ti. And the 2080 is the same. Wow..
and that's the progress of 2 years
With a die much more bigger than the precedessor = 0 actual progress.
The 2080 is really the 2070 and the 2080 Ti is really the 2080. Considering this, it becomes clear they are way overpriced. DO NOT BUY.
BowGunner yeah that's what i said when i first saw the specs too.
they remarked all of them one model up to try and hide just how fucking overpriced this garbage is. the jump is the same as it would be in that case.
For a low low price of 1300€ you can get a card better than the 1080 ti. Sounds like a great deal.
what a great review, such a deep analysis richard, i saw linus mini review on 2080/ti and we can all agree on the same thing, this is too early but the future is promising
bought a 1080 last month for a fair price and couldnt be happier at 1440p!
We all know ray tracing is the next big thing in rendering, but this is for early adopters. Just like 4k was several years ago.
I still can't even game in 4k... *Cries*
@SmashStomp Inc DLSS will make up the resolution. The Stars Wars demo is running in 4K with DLSS on.
@SmashStomp Inc clearly those of us who bought it are...
I'm still in 900p
"We all know" speak for yourself
I cancelled my 2080ti. 18-28% increase in performance over the 1080ti for $1200+ tax. Its a fools card. There is no software for RTX and it will barely be capable at 1080p. The 2080 is a complete waste. By the time the features are implemented there will be a new generation.
1200 is cheap, stop crying
This right here. Thats the thing. Unless Nvidia will be taking 2 years to launch another gen which would be weird since AMD will be launching new hardware next year and i guess, they will going to take the lead on traditional software at least. I thing that the RTX 2000 series are a bad decision on the long term.
I don't see any tears just common sense.
DogsBark Please don't lie. you never ordered one.
Nima V ha. Yes i did. Knowing the embargo date i knew my rights for canceling. This card is a horrible investment, and i didnt get to this point making bad investments no matter how small. This gen has a year at best.
This channel has become a massive cheerleader for the products it reviews.
Always had this doubt- in DF videos comparing more than one graphics card/CPU configuration, whose gameplay is the one shown?
I'm boycotting these cards and to some extent, Nvidia. The existing RTX 2080 is in reality the RTX 2070. THAT would have made sense when seeing lateral performance against the best of last generations card the 1080Ti. The RTX 2080 should have provided the performance gains found in the 2080Ti at around the same price as the 2080. These cards are a joke, Nvidia is clearly ripping consumers off and they are exploiting the unexpected success of the Titan cards by price gouging the 2080Ti and fiddling with the model numbers.
I dont reccomend this gen since the rtx feature won't be utilized all that well. 1080p is way too low since many of us have upgraded to 1440p and 4k. Even at 1080 resolution, performance isn't where it needs to be. In the next year or 2 we will see AMD and Intel giving us another option. I'm an Nvidia fan for sure but I dont endorse this generation's price point.
So about DLSS: Is this some kind of checkerboard rendering technique, where the image is not a true native 4K? Because otherwise I can't figure out where the performance boost is coming from, because TAA in itself is not a very demanding form of AA, is it?
I was in need of a completely new build and bought the 2080. For $100 getting even incremental gains on the pascal cards with future improvements and support for new tech it was a no brained. Typically don’t preorder but I was waiting for the 20 series to upgrade anyways.
NVIDIA will be happy to clear their existing stock of GTX 10 series cards without having to give any real discount due to the launch of a new series. This is the best of both worlds for NVIDIA the 10 series cards will hold their value. NVIDIA will be able also make a premium for the RTX 2000 series cards with the inflated early adopters tax. Isn't capitalism Grand, come on AMD and maybe Intel, definitely need more competition in this market. PS I'm not against capitalism, Nvidia has an obligation to maximise it's return for shareholders, I just wish there was more competition in the current market.? Please AMD or Intel surprise us with the next generation of 7nm products. One can dream ;-)
I hope amd and intel does what amd did to cpu market and to intel
I'm not against capitalism, Nvidia has an obligation to maximise it's return for shareholders, I just wish there was more competition in the current market. Where are you AMD and Intel? We really need you now ;-(
REA Electric, you're probably right about the stock clearing, but criticising capitalism is incorrect. This has nothing to do with capitalism (we don't have a capitalist market; thinking we do shows a lack of understanding of what capitalism is, or rather was, since the market hasn't operated in that way since the Fed was set up a century ago); what you're actually critiquing here is freedom of choice; we already know the alternative to freedom is disaster. Nobody forces anyone to buy these products, they are not life essential, and although one can argue there's no rational value to a 2080 Ti purchase, or indeed a 2080 in terms of rasterisation performance (and cost/frame) for current games, if someone has the money and can afford to buy one of these cards then that's up to them, it's *their* money, nobody has the right to tell them what to do with it. What you're actually saying is that somehow other people should be able to control how an individual spends their own money, which is nuts. Early adopters' tax? What a daft expression, it's up to each individual whether they want to buy a product; calling a free purchase choice a "tax" is just crazy. Would I buy one of these cards? Heck no, I'd be in the market for a used 1080 Ti instead (used 1070 for those on a lower tier upgrade path, or indeed Vega), and that's what I've been telling friends, but if someone can afford a 2080 Ti and they want the extra speed, that's entirely up to them. If this occurs on a broad enough scale that NVIDIA can sell products for a higher price and make more money, that's up to NVIDIA, especially when they're making so much cash selling the same tech to Enterprise anyway.
So we need competition? Sure, but at the end of the day, marketing funk aside, in the recent past AMD has failed to deliver a better product (both in terms of hw and drivers). This time round they have a chance to get it right, so taking advantage of the opportunity is up to them; however, whatever they release, the success of their products still depends on the free choice of those who buy them, and that can hinge on so many things, including social & peer pressures, how the marketing is done, etc. Even if they achieve necessary performance levels, AMD really needs more stable drivers because that's been their persistent failing for a very long time, and they need to get launch drivers at a decent level in the first instance; Vega showed that releasing a card with subpar performance due to driver issues doesn't work, ie. today Vega is qute a different animal to what it was at launch, but by now it's too late. Someone commented elsewhere that *gamers* are largely responsible for the state of the market now, and they're entirely right, as even when AMD did release competitive products, gamers didn't buy them, for all sorts of reasons.
For reference, Capitalism is property rights, free speech, don't lie and don't steal (keep your word), that's *it*, hence why it's been dead for a hundred years, because the state breaks these notions every day, especially via massive national debt which is stealing from the unborn, and because companies use deceptive practices in their marketing and distribution, like NVIDIA with its 3GB 1060, the changing RAM in the 1030 or somesuch, GPP, etc. (people, especially young people, have been told in their leftist education brainwashing to believe that lying like this is capitalism, when infact capitalism entails the exact opposite of that - a genuine free market cannot operate upon a bedrock of dishonesty, which is why China's economy has real issues despite having imported so many aspects of free enterprise rather than real capitalism).
One can call the corporate exploitation of falsehood and deception something else if desired, call it globalism or corporatism, but it absolutely isn't capitalism. Infact, in large part today how western economies are run is more communist, with huge state intervention and control, but with the connections to corporate power and ties to collectivist politics, hence the new word globalist which is more accurate - a push for no borders, low wages, the death of national identity, ethnic dilution and the loss of personal liberty. I don't think NVIDIA is globalist, they're not in that kind of market, but they're certainly taking advantage of customer gullibility, using really dodgy marketing and hype to encourage people to buy based more on emotion than any rational argument or value proposition, but in the end, the decision to buy is down to the customer, it's their choice. If these cards sell and sell well, blame gamers, not NVIDIA.
Btw, one small side point, but noteable: nobody has commented on why the 2080 Ti doesn't have more RAM than the 1080 Ti (I've read many comments from those doing top-end 4K modded gaming who say 11GB isn't quite enough anymore at times), and likewise why the 2080 has gone down a notch compared to the 1080 Ti (given it's the same speed). I believe the reason is to discourage pro users from using these cards; I've talked to various people about them, the opinion seems to be they have the desired performance but the RAM isn't high enough. Some will buy them anyway, those who can't afford Quadros, but I did think it was odd that for a card which has been hyped as finally offering decent 4K speed, nobody was asking why it still only has 11GB RAM when the top tier pro cards are already at 48GB (Quadro RTX 8000). I wonder if the 2080 Ti had 16GB whether that would have given it at least some differentiation over the 1080 Ti which would be more encouraging to potential buyers. The 2080 though is the really bitter pill to swallow, the same performance at more cost, but a drop in RAM, that really does make no sense, unless that is NVIDIA can show RAM usage is lower when using techniques like DLSS (but I don't recall that being mentioned).
Ian.
I'm not against capitalism, Nvidia has an obligation to maximise it's return for shareholders, I just wish there was more competition in the current market.? Please AMD or Intel surprise us with the next generation of 7nm products. One can dream ;-)
REA Electric That’s what happens when you don’t have any competition
When i pay 1200 USD for the card, i must be sure, that it would beat 60 fps in NATIVE 4k, not checkerboarded. If RTX cannot deliver it, i'm not buying RTX.
I bit the bullet and bought an RTX 2080. Now that 699 models are available at places like microcenter, and I cant find a 1080TI under 1000 in many cases. It just made sense to go with the 2080. Odd how quick the dynamic changed within a matter of months.
Richard and his box stacking and dart throwing hand gestures.
Dlss is interesting, rtx is beta
If it's true that the new Ti is basically a Titan, why didn't they say the same about the 1080Ti when it came out? It had a high perfomance gap from the 980ti. But they didn't hike prices then and try saying it was new Titan. Even the 1070 beat out the 980ti. These new prices are far overpriced no matter how you look at it. People should be boycotting imo. Bet you they will rethink their pricing then.
Well 980ti is in some Games better.
GTX 980ti shows it real power when overclocked,980ti at 1450mhz~1070 at 2100mhz
The 2080Ti should be the 2080, the 2080 should be the 2070 and the 2070 should be the 2060
Best analysis I've seen, without mindless bashing.
8:10 had me giggling like a young lad.
RTX = Rushed & Too Xpensive
PC is progressing so fast and consoles still can't get 1080p at 60fps down.
Console is holding games back in general since most games are made with console in mind and then ported to pc
Because the average consumer doesn't care about shit like 60fps they just want to play the game
@@dddddddddddddddadddddddddddddd so you dont mind playing a headache inducing 15-20 fps as long you can play the game
They do care they just don't know why it feels better to play. For years in the last gen console gamers would prefer COD many times because it just "felt smoother", I know it's because it's the only franchise that gen that targeted 60fps through and through on consoles, but to them, all they knew was it "felt smooth".
just here to say that the xbox one x is leagues faster than the average pc on the steam hardware survey. so is the ps4 pro. so no, it's not just consoles "holding gaming back". it's money. no one wants to invest in tech that only 3% of gamers could use.
and by gaming you mean useless eye candy, because games are doing just fine. botw is one of the best games of all time and it would literally run absolutely fine in the pc i had 10 years ago if it was made for it.
How exactly do I enable DLSS in the Infiltrator Demo?
Will some older games with TAA be patched to offer DLSS support ?
Not worth it.. 1080 ti for 500$ is much wiser
Edit:
1080 ti is 450 to $500 at Ebay (6 months second hand).. so yeah let your wallet decide xD
But how can you go through life without experiencing Ray Tracing?
Except such a thing as 500$ 1080ti doesnt exist, the cheaper ones are about 700$
Yep, my guess before the first released benchmarks. Thanks to this video its clear now.
And if manufacturer don't sell cards for raytracing, developpers will never add this tech to their game, and we're going nowhere. Now , thanks to those cards, it's opening the door to the biggest innovation in real-time rendering in years.
Too bad no ones getting a 1080 ti new for $500 anytime soon
Wanna see how the RTX 2070 does.
DeadPhoenix86: Yeah, i'm expecting 5% faster than GTX 1080.
thinking: 200$ more for same performance and rtx which wont be in games for a few years lol
Daniel Nugent: If the 2070 costs 50% more than the 1080 for only 5% better performance, then it simply is not worth it. DLSS and Ray-Tracing be damned.
I wonder if RTX range will even reach lower than 80-series. As it stands now, it seems that even 2080 Ti is just about powerful enough to run games with ray tracing enabled at some kind of reasonable resolution and frame rate. So it would make sense to 70-series and lower to be sold as GTX cards without the RTX cores.
RTX 2070 has already been confirmed by Nvidia. It will have 2304 Cuda cores, and power 8 Giga Rays/sec. Same as RTX 2080. Not sure on how many tensor cores it will have though.
I was waiting for this!
So with DLSS to get your desired resolution (for example 1440p), do you keep it at that exact resolution and with DLSS on it drops native resolution below that and reconstructs it back to improve performance, or do you drop the resolution below 1440p and it shows you your desired reconstructed target. Like 1080p (outcome 1440p), 1440p (outcome 4k) and so on. You guys need to go into detail the actual in practice of the function and how users turn it on to give us a better perspective on what it does and how it works.
Can't wait for my MSI RTX 2080 Ti Gaming X Trio to arrive. 4K 60fps finally.
@@FounderX9 salty
That card is a beast! I have a 1080 but it struggles with 4k so these new cards are looking real good lol
He's an idiot because he wants 4K/60fps?? There's no card on the market that offers that kind of performance at that resolution. Stop being salty and let people buy what they want with their money.
@UCEButGFOZHx3Vov0_AcBpKw damn right. It's funny to watch.
Animate: Again, if he wants to be an "idiot" by purchasing the single most powerful GPU on the market that can actually do 4K/60fps, let him.
And i'm a bit confused: what tf is up with your profile pic if you hate Nvidia so much? Lol.
the only review that matters
That's a very short-sighted way of looking at things. Never trust a single outlet. That's a dangerous precedent you're setting for yourself.
lol cmon man did i say i didnt watch any other reviews
HOW LONG DO YOU WAIT TO CHANGE THE SMOKE DETECTOR BATTERIES?
What is the comparison of GTX 1080 SLI vs the RTX 2080 TI? Should you sell both to get one RTX 2080 Ti? I've been considering it.
Digital Foundry is one of the few channels that does objective, realistic reviews it seems....So many youtubers seem to jump on the herd mentality...
for sure....would be cool if they did some monitor reviews or analysis once and while too, but still good stuff
Richard is shilling for Nvidia.
Of course he's not getting paid, but most of of these people still hate 4K because they're stuck with the horrible mindset that games should look like movies.
Its also the only channel which doesnt do the
OMG TOO EXPENSIVE THIS IS A BAD CARD throughout the entire video
It is a bad card (half the potential is non-functional, that absolutely makes this worse than Vega) and it is overpriced.
If Nvidia would have had working gameplay at launch then everyone could at least say it does something, RTX just does NOTHING! It's POINTLESS!
These cards will be out of date before Ray Tracing is of any practical value, buying this is the same as sending Nvidia cash in the mail just for LoLs.
Games looking like movies is the dream though. Photorealism, or at least the option to achieve it where appropriate is the holy grail of real time rendering. If games don't look like movies what should they look like? Worse than movies?
Blurry AA is a game changer? No time for tests other than 4k? But maybe that's because there is no significant improvement in 1080p? Shady review.
Your 1080 TI numbers for the Witcher 3 are way below the same benchmark you ran last year on an i7 6700+1080 TI. What's the deal? Also, what is your RAM setup (how much / how fast)? Why was this omitted?
I've heard it before, but I love the music in this vid. 🎶
The thing about DLSS is that there's no reason to care about it if you aren't interested in anti-aliasing with any significant performance impact or you don't use AA at all. I don't care for AA on my 1440p monitor let alone a 4k one, so for people like me there is no performance benefit.
I'm also willing to bet the performance increase won't be anywhere close to the stuff we're seeing in the pre-baked benchmarks. Smells awfully of something concocted to give them a benchmark advantage.
DLSS doesn't even do what it's supposed to do. Low Resolution Rendering just has too many fundamental problems that are impossible to fix in post.
All games need to run 4K native at minimum, and hopefully we'll be getting 8K support in the near future.
Checkerboarding actually does a much better job than DLSS at fixing aliasing. Proper Checkerboard 8K would look absolutely amazing and still only cost twice as much as native 4K. Given that DLSS+RT is consuming half the silicon space on the GPU, we could have easily had an 8K card instead of Ray Tracing.
waking00one I'd be inclined to believe that the performance benefits will be exactly as good as we're seeing. I'm more concerned about the quality and stability of the supersampling when used on actual games.
dlss runs faster than no AA, because it's an upscaler. it probably runs at fake 1440p just as fast as 1080p with no anti aliasing
Oh so you can get a titan-priced card with the performance if a gtx-priced card? WHAT A STEAL!
Great Video as usual but your background music is far too loud and distracting, shame because i do like what your saying.
fwiw those 2080 Ti results in The Witcher 3 are around 20 fps *lower* than you can expect with two 1080s in SLI (non TI) *with* Hair Works enabled. I think this is the most damning review of the new cards I've seen yet.
You are defending the very high price a little too much I think.
80% of this video is just sales pitch.... Many reviewers forget one thing, unless you have absolutely beats of a cpu and 4k monitor when you buy 1200$ 2080ti you will get almost the same performance as 550$ 1080ti. Also you will have to wait till end of the year for Microsoft to update direct X and of course games themselves to have updates. So it all boils down to ...So unless you have powerful Cpu and 4k monitor you will pay 1200$ for technology that is not usable in any way now, and for performance that is from 0-30% The perfect way is to buy 1000 series and skip this, early adopters of new tech always have problems. In 1-2 years games will have this tech matured properly and then next gpu will be fine tuned... oh and dont forget about temps when you hit that thing with dlss, 4k, and ray tracing...
Nobody without a top end CPU is likely to be looking at a top end GPU.
You need to do some reading.
1. You don't need a 4K monitor or the latest CPU to see the benefits of these cards. Any reasonable gaming CPU from the last 3 years or so will be fine, and shockingly enough GPU's aren't resolution dependent. 1440P users will see substantially higher framerates as well, although 1080P users will probably be better off waiting for the 2070 simply because the 2080 plus cards will likely be overkill and deliver higher framerates than they need.
2. The cards don't need DirectX updates to use their increased performance at all. That doesn't even make sense. Why would microsoft need to update a graphics API for new graphics cards? One of the main reasons DirectX exists is so that they don't have to do that.
3. Temps. Yes everyone, don't forget that GPU's can get hot in use!
Actually, playing at a higher resolution tends to shift more of the load to/the bottleneck becomes the GPU vs. CPU. Unless you're using a truly ancient CPU, you shouldn't have any issues in the vast majority of games at 4K due to a less-than-stellar CPU.
You can't give impressions of dlss on fixed view tech demos, they are going to be perfect match for pre processing let's see what happens when the camera can actually be moved and the light changes
Hairworks in Witcher 3 is gorgeous, I keep it on and get a solid 1080p nearly stable 60fps. (turn some settings down bc there's lil to no visual difference) Well as long as u use a mod to turn off Hairworks on Geralt. It doesn't make him look good and having it off saves a good amount of performance.
Overpriced, overhyped, underwhelming, and rushed. It's a shame it will be a few years at best before anything from this will be mainstream if any. I feel bad for anyone who paid a hefty premium on this new and unsupported tech.
It's not the GTX 1180 and 1180-ti, it's a new segment with hybrid raytracing and rasterized rendering. If you buy those GPU you are an early adopter like buyers of first generation VR headset. Raytracing will never be supported by developpers if GPU manufacturer don't sell the appropriate hardware.
The serie 10XX can already max out everything out there if you're not running at 4K, i don't know what people expected.
Let's hope it's more successful than VR, lol.
It should only take three years. The BF developers are already see ways to improve RT performance by 30% with simple changes.
...this isn't rushed. Raytracing is extremely intensive, far more than raster rendering.
I wouldn't buy the card, but I'm surprised they can do raytracing above 30fps.
Also to add, there was a lot of talk about raytracing back in 2007, which was quickly found to be impossible without massive graphical downgrades or low FPS.