More Pop Top Design Ideas
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- Опубліковано 5 лип 2024
- After working through all your comments and suggestions, I talk about each option and the pros and cons before talking about the solution I'm going with
00:00 Introduction
00:36 The Flip Over
02:37 Linear Actuators
07:14 Bungee Cords For the Canvas
08:32 Bi-Fold Bed Platform
10:24 So, What's the Solution?
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#Overland #Camper #PopTop - Авто та транспорт
I think your solution will work really well. I love the practical and pragmatic approach you're using thinking about options, yet also being realistic based on your own experience, preferences, and expectations. I think far too many people get caught up in the "tricks" and "gimmicks" but lack the real world experience to know how badly some of those things can fail. Less nodes means less potential failures. Keep it simple!
I say keep with the triangular clamshell. Having the rigidity of a hinged side will make for more cozy nights in windy weather.
Imitation is the best form of flattery...simple works for a reason! Looking forward to seeing the final version but agree with the option you are going for the best utilization of your space.
For air flow under the mattress The Froli Systems gives you air flow and is more comfortable then just a foam mattress.
We recently rented a van in Baja that had a Maxair fan. It is something we have contemplated installing on our own van at home. I was surprised how much electricity it used. Whenever we used it, the house battery in the rental was down below 11 volts by morning and the fridge wouldn't work until the solar panels had a few hours to bump the battery back up. Granted, the battery was probably AGM, where a lithium battery wouldn't have dropped volts the way it did. When we didn't use the maxair fan, all else being equal, the battery volts stayed in the mid to upper 12v range all night long. Something to consider.
Earthroamer did the flip over system back around 2006/7, based on the Jeep JKU platform, and yes, all of the drawbacks you mention were indeed problems! We owned No5 from them until last year, which was the only RHD one they made. I totally agree on keeping the canvas element to a minimum.
Agree on the mattress, I did 2 mattresses before putting a "dry mat" which is a 10mm breathing gap product for boats/campers. It reduces condensation by 95% and are under $100. I've a bed over the cab, honestly they are awesome.
You do such a great job walking us through all the possible solutions on this build!
We’re on the road in our van in Colombia and I just wanted to say thanks for the good ideas. They made us think even if we didn’t adopt them all! My wife said we needed more room but here we are… whatever it takes !
Two things: One is although you are right about putting the Habitat away wet (they do leak around the zippers), you're not really right about them leaking. I woke up one morning after a storm with my arm against the side where a pool of water had collected basically ON TOP of my arm. Yet my arm was completely dry! I was amazed! That Nemo tent is amazing!
Secondly, the hinged bed that Overland Explorer Vehicles used to make had holes punched in it like mollé which made it lighter and breathable.
The flip version is great in warm and dry climates. Hard to keep warm with body heat and you need to put away a wet canvas top.
I love the wedge as I harvest the Ursa Minor and it’s perfect for the wrangler.
I also have the pop up on the FWC, which if great because there is the area that overhangs the truck, which becomes a loft and is totally usable space when in day use…. Without the overhang it does not help.
Good luck with the decision. I found a vent mat for under the mattress. Forgot there I got it.
Wind performance for the FWC and Ursa Minor are pretty close. Ursa wins if you are oriented towards wind, but the FWC canvas flaps less and is less noisy given it isn’t as tall. In bad wind and rain, I just drop one side of the room and make it a wedge.
Thanks for the tips!
Dan, Check out a Hypervent. It's a plastic mesh you slide under your mattress. The mesh allows air flow under the mattress which allows the condensation to evaporate. Another pop-up manufacturer is OVRLND Campers in Flagstaff, AZ. Jay, the owner, might be able to give you some suggestions. Best of luck, Tim
Can't wait to see the final product and can't wait to see the next video! I definitely have enjoyed following along with this build. Its been one of my favorite vehicle builds on UA-cam.
Awesome! Thank you!
Man, your videos bring SO MUCH great information to us. I'm looking to build a pop-top camper for my Tacoma, and I probably learned as much in your one video as I did in countless hours of my own research. I'm really enjoying your channel - keep up the great work!!
Glad to help!
Minor nitpick, you're describing an Atlas not a Summit. The Summit is the wedge. And that commenter about gale force winds was me. :) Good luck!
Thanks for the info !
There is a mesh that is used on sailboats under the matress to allow airflow.
Dan if your not aware of them, Hiatus Campers have a nice solution with no canvas, no complicated mechanisms. They seem to have ramped up production and are cranking them out. I'd wager they can help with a custom solution.
On your second book by the way. Love your material. (Africa)
Awesome to hear, thanks for the support! Please leave a review on Amazon when you're finished, I'd love to know what you think.
Copying the AT Atlas (full pop up) is a good idea. Its a proven design. I have a Summit (the wedge pop) and its good but doesn't give the inside living space you want. Overall I'd say you chose well.
We have the AT Overland Atlas. It is great in the wind .
Great to know, thanks!
We ran a Four Wheel Camper from 2004 to 2014, all over western US and had zero issues with the top.
I would sew a pocket into the canvas to hold some shock cord. I wouldn't sew the shock cord into it. I would make it so you can easily replace the shock cord from the inside of the camper. Like the draw string on a sweatshirt hood. You can release tension when you want to and it will keep the cord out of the sun. The rubber inside the shock cord doesn't last long. You should consider it a disposable item.
Our 1969 Ford Econoline, TEC pop top camper also used a rubber band around the center of the canvas to tuck it in when you lower the top. This was technically pre-Bunge cord error, but they were a rubber band. If you Google 1969 to 1972 Econoline pop top by TEC you’ll probably find many pictures of them.
Dan is 200% correct on the slats under the mattress idea . My wife is very heavy smoker , I went to flip the mattress over the other day , and as Dan said a mattress needs to breath , sadly this mattress has been breathing so much so the area between the slats is yellow . Yes this is gross , but it shows how much a mattress needs to breathe . I live in Florida where it is very Humid but not as bad as the places Dan will be traveling, and in these types of climates all a mattress has to do is lay against a hard surface for just a little to long and black mold will form . Another thought about lineal actuators , when one of these things dies , one when it’s when you and in the middle of nowhere in the middle a monsoon rain storm trying to get the top up , you have really low batterie power for days of said storms and your solar system is not charging hardly at all Also where do you get parts . Well you could take extra parts with , Would like to be standing out in a monsoon rain storm changing out a accuator . When doing the type of traveling Dan & his wife the K.I.S.S. principal is the best way forward . Oh a tip I got from a pro who runs a business fighting mold ,use a ammonia based solution for mold removal , because ammonia will kill the molds roots ,bleach only takes the color away . Safe travels
I knew it! I was first to suggest this last time
Thanks for the idea!
I’ve seen a base that allows air flow to place your bed on that’s commonly used on boats. Maybe look into some yacht or sailboat products for that sort of thing you can still have a solid bed platform with that woven section between the platform and your mattress. Sounds like it’s going to be a cool build.
Pop up wedge on a 6' truck bed... life changing experience for me
Another well thought out informative video. Thank you for continuing to share your journey! As an owner of an Atlas on a gladiator, coined the GladiAtlas. I’ll point out that what you’re referring to as a Summit in your video is the Atlas. Thanks again for sharing and best wishes For your continued build.
Extremely good ideas and logic. I'm looking at different top tents for my wrangler. I live in the northwest and the problem we have is bears and they are curious and sweet little bounders. You dont want them climbing your ladder and saying hi during the night. So your thoughts and ideas have helped a lot.
Have a look at the froli system for below the mattress. Light weight, adds comfort and allows airflow. Used on lots of camper vans.
bifold bed seems worth further thought. You could definitely still have slats or another way to ventilate. The additional weight needn't be huge.
Instead of a roof fan, check out the MaxxFan Dome. You can mount it on one of the sides of your box instead of the roof.
In australia there are air bag roof raising systems, light weight just need on board compressor.
Hey Dan, makes sense. In our four wheel camper we've never worried about the wind. As you mentioned the material you use and how tight you can get it are definitely the keys. Also, I would suggest for the batteries nothing less than 400ah of lithium. 👍
In regard to interior corner linear actuators, I grew up in a 1969 Ford Econoline camper van with a TEC pop top, this used 4 spring loaded lifts one in each corner. they were never in the way in the 30+ years we use that vehicle never even thought about them even being there; only one that we really even ever even notice and that was the one next to the passenger side door because when you open the doors you could see it they took neatly up into the corners.
Hi Dan, I’ve experienced this same design conundrum while building my pop top. I started with a very old chinook fiberglass (non-pop) slide-in and cut the roof off and made it into a wedge style pop. After failing to find a used westfalia H-bar I decided to build my own out of the SS tubing they use for “canvas boat Biminis” it ended up rattling and just kinda sucked. Then I added gas struts from a distributor who helped me with selecting the size struts. It was good after that till I got into -15 deg c and the roof came down (struts didn’t like the cold). Then I decided to use the Bimini tubing to simply have a straight pipe on a pivot (all Bimini fittings sold at boat shops). The pipe pivot is fixed to the rear end roof and the other end is mounted to the roof. So it’s parallel to roof when popped down. Then struts lift the roof up and you remove the Bimini “pin” (currently parallel to roof) and drop the pipe down to its vertical position and connect the bottom of pipe to the base of camper. Hope that illustrates it for you haha. It works so friggin good! Simple is best. The folding thing can be difficult to manufacture but if you go that route I look forward to your final product. Happy to share an image of my system if you think it would be helpful.
Still like the vertical pop.
That internal canvas bungie to pull the sides in rather than an external "belt" is a pretty neat solution too. I imagine its sometimes hard to get up to release it from the ground and you have to do it in the weather.
I think you have made the right choice. For a breathable fabric/mattress support I have looked a little into using the same fabric that is used for trampolines. A challenge would be to tension it. Slats are most likely the simplest and easiest to do. They could also be made out of a host of different materials. Wood, carbon, aluminum extrusion are just some of the obvious choices.
Nice this Will be great! Well Done!
There are multiple products for mattress condensation. Mesh mat type items. Do a search and many will pop up.
Great info! Look forward to seeing it! I think I like the Oru Designs popup the best, their hybrid hard/canvas Bruin camper seems to solve the need for the big locking hinge mechanism on each end, and no need for bungee cords when closing. I want to make one like that
So, what about the bed? How do you get it out of the way? The bi-fold bed I had suggested previously was just that....a bi-fold bed. Totally independent from the vertical pop-up design. So, my suggestion was actually to do a standard vertical pop-up with struts, just like you have chosen. The only thing I was suggesting design wise was to make the bed bi-fold, to get it out of the way when not in use, not at all for holding the top up. That bi-fold bed platform could be slatted for ventilation. Perhaps, I wasn't clear enough.
Great idea, I'm in the middle of building my pop top for my gladiator chassis build. Great job researching/planning. You should post your calculations too. As a fellow numbers nerd
I have them all over on Patreon if you want to take a look
For moisture mitigation under the mattress, my rooftop tent came with a mesh layer which sits between the solid floor of the tent and the mattress. I've had a lot of condensation build-up inside the tent in cold/freezing conditions and have had zero moisture/mold problems under the mattress. I think that would work for that bi-fold bed option you talked about, but, like you said that option adds weight and complexity, just though I'd share in case anyone else was looking for a solution.
Love the straight up popup with struts. Need to think about an insulation layer. AT Overland has that option on their Atlas.
The whole video I was looking at the picture in the background and wondering if Ursa Minor would be able to provide a solid solution but I think what you have in mind is the right idea.
They can absolutely provide me with their scissor hinges, but I don't see any advantage.
I get all the difficulties of the bed platform, but hardly more headroom than the wedge.
Hey Dan, thanks for the update. So what is your plan for getting the bed out of the way then?... oh and great video and comparison once again 😁👍
Kyle at RRBuildings uses a product called Cedar Breather to provide air circulation between roofing underlayment and metal roofing panels. You might it perfect for air circulation under your new camper mattress.
I’m building a roof top pop up with a truck camper shell and a bed topper the topper came with the hardware to lift it. I’m mounting it on the roof of a 144 Sprinter. Total cost $125. Needed 2 bedrooms and didn’t want bunks. The shell will be upside down and backwards with most of the roof removed it’s even got windows with screens.
Woah, that sounds really cool and very affordable!
In regards to shipping containers, they do make 20 foot high tops, and they are very common in the overseas shipping industry.
I head what you are saying about actuators, and I've noticed the same issues with them that you have. I've always thought there was an option that would work. Maybe I'm wrong. I'd think you could put the actuators in the corners, as you described, but then put the canvas inside of that's it still folded properly. Yes, the canvas would be a few inches further inside than ideal, but it would be of no significant consequence. You could even make the corners of the canvas a 45° corner "cutting inside of the actuators and maintain the canvas on the outside edge yet.
Absolutely I think it's possible. You would have to design the top of the camper, the roof and the canvas attachment points for that from the very beginning.
Simple and non mechanical means you can probably fix any issues if something goes wrong when far from services.
Where will you put the solar panels? On top of this? And the wiring? Nice talk, I wish you well on your search.
My plan it to cut about one square meter out of the floor of a XL Bundutec (Bundutop) tent. And keep the bed I already have "downstairs" for use in extreme weather/cold. Old G wagon army ambulance.
still like cab high shell on a 6'.5' box did see one with a lift for head room , was thinking of a lumber rack with a canvas sides and a ply wood for roof / roof top deck to watch off road races . now if a pop up roof top could be mounted to the front than id have the 6.5' pu box to work out of ,6.5 benches counter top , to bad single cab -8' boxes are not that popular 8' box can do lot with it but are full size trucks
tacoma xtra cab and Nissan frontier king cab still offer 6' box only mid size id buy now if the 4 dr wrangler was made into a mini pickup with a 6 ' behind the front seats
occasional use of Habitat over six+ years. agree dry climate use is best.
Hey just seen you driving down in California!
haha, yep, that was me!
@@TheRoadChoseMe safe travels!
Hi Dan, I watch your videos about your vehicle choices and your experience speaks a huge volume. Is FORD RANGER a good international platform since it's everywhere and recently brought back to the State too?
Smart well thought out build! Who makes the new version of the Downtomob scissor lift?
This is the company www.antuatorlinear.com/pop_top_roof
Ive been in the snow and rain in my Jeep JK Habitat and folding away all that canvas sucks.
That looks like a great decision, but how long is the living space? Will you have much open area to access the bed?
You tube channel van city van life has a video on what he put under his bed for the mold and moisture problem
Hi Dan, I love your wheel choice. What wheels/offsets are those? Sorry if this question has been answered but I can’t find it. Thanks, and I love this camper!
They are 18 inch steel Mopar wheels off a Grand Cherokee
Brother have you tried a indoor hammock
Sadly hammocks are murder on my back. I wanted to love them all through Central America and I could just never make it work.
My only question about a square pop up is how does the water run off the roof? is there a slight angle to it so water doesn't collect on it?
You posted the link for the $900 Chinese scissor actuator, but who makes the entire hardsided roof assembly that you show? That looks like the perfect solution for the camper I would like to build for my Chevy Colorado.
I don't know who makes that, here's the reel facebook.com/reel/390121800374106?fs=e&mibextid=xCPwDs&fs=e&s=TIeQ9V
But what about raising the bed?
Did you consider Accuair (Full airbag suspension) for leveling at camp, offroading and lowering to fit into a container?
No, never did. I don't want to add complexity to the suspension
Laser Bed: DIY or BUY?
Could you share the source info on the linear actuator scissor kit you showed at the 4:10 mark? I'd really like to research this!
This is the company that makes it - scroll down to see all the different options and dimensions, etc.
www.antuatorlinear.com/pop_top_roof
How do you get out of the vehicle after pulling it into a shipping container?
I put a similar width 4x4 in a shipping container, I can't remember if I was skinny/ flexible enough to go out the driver's door or window or whether I existed via the back doors or not 😅
Why not getting one camper off road trailer you can tow?
For global travel trailers don't make sense. Here's the rationale: ua-cam.com/video/GRr8AJYXyu4/v-deo.html
Talk to AT Overland about what wall mounted exhaust fan they use on their Aterra camper. It could be a good solution for your camper without adding any height.
ua-cam.com/video/k6zSYmVFDJ0/v-deo.html
I checked the video you linked. My experience with that style of vent fan is they move very little air, they're also very noisey. Just a pretty useless product all round. That said the 14" Maxxfan Plus is amazing. Shifts a good amount of air, great as a cooking extractor fan. Almost silent on 30% speed (great for sleeping in hot weather) ... I would happily wall mount one if the situation required it... like high on the rear wall of Dans camper if his cooker was at the back near it.
Use a hammock 😂
1:57 Why did the radio in my head just start playing Toto?
Haha, mine does that multiple times a day!
Can you link to that $900 Chinese pop top?
I don't think the unit is $900, I think one scissor assembly is $900, and that unit contains two plus the likely more expensive panels and roof.
The scissor assembly is from this company: www.antuatorlinear.com/pop_top_roof
Scroll down, checkout all the different options
12:14
looks cool - doenst make sense:
IF the gas strud has that much power to hold additional 100kg. You can calculate yourself with how much kg force you need to pull the roof DOWN.
Incorrect, in the vertical pop photo with dude standing on top his weight is supported by the large hinge mechanisms at the front and rear of the roof.
IF so - and I dought that - the canvas wil NOT be extremely strong against wind flattering, as mentioned a few seconds later!
That was the part of why a canvas vertical roof can be still nice.
You cannot have both! All people I know of with a vertical lifting roof are NOT doing it the way you describe.
I know 3 people who build it themselves (all are perfect mechanics!), all different. And all do strongly want pressure on their canvas! None has ever made a stupid photo standing on the roof for no reason.@@sharpsticksnz4112
Keep it Simple Silly….
It's been so long I forgot all about you
Another reason to bail on these systems is that it's just another complicated mechanism that could fail in the field.
Idk Dan. I think by the time you get this contraption done you're gonna you're gonna be to old to travel.
The reality is it takes me a long time to save up the money I to pay for my global trips.
So even if I had a vehicle ready to go right now, I don't have the funds.
This is the situation when you're self-funded, and it's what I have to live with.
Why are people still using canvas? Spectra fiber fabric is lighter, stronger, highly UV resistant, anti microbial and waterproof. The only downside is price.
Huh, I've never heard of that stuff, I'll do some research, thanks!
How about if you start identifying as a dwarf? That would make you much smaller, and you could probably get by with no pop up roof at all! Or, you could keep the pop up and make it a two story! Gotta get hip with the new "outside of the box" thinking!
From this video, why should anyone make any suggestions. You used this type of platform through the last two builds you did. You take the comments of your viewers go over them and than you shred them to pieces.
I'm not shredding anything, I'm adding perspective and discussing why for my needs, certain things won't work, or won't work as well as other ideas.
For other people, they may be a much better solution.
My solutions are not "the perfect overland rig". (hint: there is no such thing).
My solutions and vehicles are what work well for me and my trips - my goal is to talk through the reasoning so others can learn from it and decide what they need for themselves and their trips.
@@TheRoadChoseMe ok, thank you.
This entire build is a joke to be honest. You trying to build a camper out of a Jeep which is one of the worst vehicles for reliability, payload capacity and fuel consumption. You are making videos and money off of a build, fine, but when do you plan on actually traveling? So much energy and money wasted, but your Jeep you used through Africa was fine and should have kept using it.
Buying a truck and putting the Alu Cab canopy camper on would be a better choice.
This will be going in a shipping container this summer to a new part of the world.