Sonic the Hedgehog 2 Retrospective
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- Опубліковано 29 вер 2024
- How does the iconic sequel one-up the original? Let's find out!
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Sources:
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The rest of the footage was gathered by me.
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Sonic the Hedgehog 2. Sonic 2 Review. Retrospective. Critique. HD. Genesis. KingK
to all the oil ocean fans I've offended in the comments
good you have no taste
Haven't played S2 in a while. Ironically how the only zones I remember from Sonic 2 are emerald hill, chemical plant, metropolis and Oil ocean. I remember that I fell in love with Oil ocean zone because of music and color palette used. Amazing how different opinions and feelings can be.
To be honest, it was really surprising to me to start finding out that people dislike Oil Ocean. It's pretty straightforward. If you suck at playing, I can understand how it might be confusing at first, maybe. Other than that, it's pretty simple, so unless you're complaining that it's too simple, you might have a neurological disorder that prevents you from mastering Oil Ocean after two playthroughs. :3
Seahorses: annoying suckage.
Music: rad
I love the music, I love the theme, and playing the stage itself is perfectly fun enough, it's not annoying to me like Metropolis Zone is. All you really need to enjoy a stage. I especially love how in Sonic Mania, they added the effect of the oil catching fire if you have a Fire Shield, very cool. It's insane to imagine an actual ocean comprised entirely of oil and it catching on fire, that would be devastating as hell. Or hell itself.
It's actually rather funny, because I don't hate Oil Ocean, but that's ALWAYS where I stop playing Sonic 2 if I'm just trying to kill time. I think it's partially because the Sonic 2 version of the stage is a bit on the boring side. But I think it's also because I don't find much of the rest of the game fun after that. You pretty much hit on all the points why in this video.
Metropolis Zone might be long, convoluted, and insanely boring to slog through on your thousandth playthrough... but at least it's not Wacky Workbench.
The Geek Critique Just you wait
...Or Marble Zone...
The Geek Critique
It's neither of those. The only problem with Metropolis is the cheap enemy placement. The level design itself is fine.
Hey, wacky workbench isn't that bad! You've just got to get the rhythm down... Then again, if I actually cared about special stages in sonic then it would be pretty awful
To be fair Wacky Workbench has better music
I love your retrospective series...
I honestly like the idea of "hidden stages" or even shortcuts. Just imagining the mania 2 possibility of finding a hidden cannon that lets you skip an act. Or say you find this weird portal that closes after X amount of time in the act, which brings you to a small retro-act. Possibly even having a optional boss fight if you finish on the higher path.
Anyways, great video overall!
Dfr34kz Sonic Rush Adventure already did this in the sense of shortcut that shuts you out, check it out..
While I know this doesn't exactly mean the same, the second act of Mushroom Hill right before the boss has something like that, where sometimes you pass through the ceiling and get a couple shield monitors before moving past the thick vine-looking wall thing that blocks it off as soon as you pass it, but other times you just roll onto the ceiling and back down to the ground.
(Those were my experiences anyway, I have never been able to explain it - Was it a timed thing? Does taking a specific pathway trigger it? Was it only access able for specific characters? Doubt it but my memory isn't the best since I eventually gave up trying to get there...)
And, *also* technically speaking, level skipping already exists... being able to skip levels by "breaking the game" is a reward for studying the level layouts and mastering the sequence of inputs. I don't know if that's what they had in mind when they thought about "speed running" for Sonic games, but I'd say it feels pretty good when you can pull off those moves.
(And really quickly, I'm pretty sure that, from my playthrough of Super Mario Bros. DS, the "cannon to another act" skirts a bit too close to Mario's "cannon to another world")
6:00 Been playing this game for over 20 years, and I had no idea you could bypass the crush blocks in chemical plant zone that way!
me neither, I hated that part so much, lol
You mean 5:50
There's another way around the rising water level part entirely via a secret pathway
Yeah
Sonic 2 was the game that really got me into the Sonic series. I played Sonic 1, 06, and Unleashed, but wasn't impressed with any of those games. When I tried Sonic 2, I got into it quickly, and each time I played, I got further and further until I beat the game. Pair the speed-focused levels, some expansive levels, along with one of my favorite soundtracks in the franchise, and Sonic 2 is a great game IMO. One of my favorite games in the franchise.
Hub Pie You should play 3
Hub Pie not even unleashed?
What an unfortunate series of first Sonic games
LvLupXD right? Sonic 2 is the first game I've ever played and is one of my first memories
Out of curious which Sonic did you start with first? Sonic 2 is my favourite too. In my case I began with Sonic 1 on the Master System which is good but very different to the 16bit.
I got goosebumps when you said "Sonic Mania 2". It's entirely possible at this point, and with the reception the first one got. I do think thought-out analyses like yours are actually helpful in people recognizing what works about 2d sonic and what doesn't.
Duude. I just subscribed to you last night over your Sonic 1 retrospective, then binge-watched your Zelda series when I woke up today... and now that I've just finished the BotW video, I see this one! THE CONTENT, IT NEVER ENDS
This was my first video game I ever played. As I’ve gotten older I’ve realized it isn’t perfect, but it’ll always have a special place in my heart. Great video, man! Keep up the awesome work.
As someone who grew up with the Adventure Games then Gems/Mega Collections (and later the modern era): Sonic 2 was the first classic era that made me really appreciate 2D platformers in general. Growing up first with all 3D games I didn't really want to/ feel the need to play the older 2D games in general. Playing Sonic 1 at the time I couldn't stick with it after Marble & labyrinth zone. But Sonic 2, really sold me on the classic games and 2D 1990s/1980s in general. The music, the flow, the gameplay, not to mention the joy from finally finally unlocking SS was amazing to me
That Slicer at 21:06 is the bane of my Sonic 2 play through. For whatever reason he is sometimes there and sometimes isn't. The most I could find about it was on the Zone 0 website: "Sometimes there is a Slicer in the corridor at the very top. Other times, there isn't. Not really sure why." That thing wasn't there on my very first run of Metropolis Zone but I died at the boss. I enjoyed Metropolis Zone and didn't have too many problems clearing the first two acts despite the cheap enemy placement. However, after that one Slicer showed up and never once went away finishing Act 3 became hell. That Slicer was probably 90% of my deaths in Act 3.
How... how have I never thought to hide zones in other zones...? That is possibly the most fantastic idea I've heard all year!!!
As for the rest of the video, you pretty much hit the nail on the head. I really do enjoy Sonic 2 a lot still. But I think there's a reason that 3&K (and also Mania) have overtaken it as my favorite 2D Sonic title as the years move on. Sonic 2 has a lot to love, but once you get used to the game, the best zones/acts tend to be over far too quickly, with the less great ones being a bit too long. I hate that I can get through nearly every act until Hill Top in less than a minute. And even Hill Top and Mystic Cave just don't last too much longer.
24:12 "...yet i can't shake this feeling that stages only accessible via secret entrances would be killer. Think about how Sonic's levels are often designed (at least the good ones), large, non-linear, and secretive. Imagine if you took the top pathway, found a well-hidden secret path into a completely different zone normally inaccessible on the main progression path."
you know, that sounds just like Castlevania: Rondo of Blood. like your style KingK
"Good.
GREAT! AWESOME! AAAAMMMAZING!" - Sonic Colors Announcer Guy
Sonic 2 is my absolute favorite! I did speed runs as a kid and constantly kept trying to see how much of the levels I could cover and discover faster and faster. The first time Sonic went super I lost my frickin MIND!
Sonic 1 special stages are meant to feel like a merry go round I think.
So many good memories playing sonic as a young lad.
I don't know why but Sonic 2 always had an unfinished look to me compared to the original. While it had better level desing and a bigger emphasis on Sonic's speed, the game had a rushed feel to it. Even if Sonic 1 isn't as good as its sequel, it still felt like the final product.
I heard the multiplayer songs were meant for levels that didn't end in the game.
t was mostly finished but because it had to make a holiday deadline, Genocide/ Cyber City became Metropolis act 3. Hidden palace was cut. Then look at beta level designs closely, compare to finished versions, see those rings in the walls? they did alot of this at the last second. Your kinda right about the unfinished look, had it been released later this would be comparable to that of the late beta.
I feel that Sonic 2 is a more fun game, because it always has a more exhilarating feel. Speed is what it capitalized on, but it didn't leave platforming and exploration behind.
Sometimes Sonic 3 and Knuckles capitalized on platforming and exploration and completely ditched speed. This made zones drag.
Mania does larger zones better because they have way more flow and speed. There are less moments where the game forces you to slow down to do something tedious such as moving a barrel, pushing levers, and watch as light bridges move you across the screen for an obnoxiously long time.
Also, the annoying rising floor sections that Sonic 3 just loves are exempt in Mania and are very short in Sonic 2.
Sonic 3 was really good for scope and story, but fell really flat in the gameplay department.
I was thinking throughout this video that I hoped you would talk about Sonic CD next instead of just jumping to Sonic 3. While I probably just agree with 3/4ths of what you say, it is always interesting to hear your take on these. Sonic CD is my favorite Sonic (at least pre-Mania), so I'm HOPING that you will be able to appreciate it. (I will say right now though, that one of my only problems with it is that the time travel could have been done better, namely there could be far more straight-aways or getting up to time warp could take half the time, as you often lose it before you can warp.)
You kept your promise and looked at Sonic 2. Thanks !
i can hear an upbeat spring yard in casino night when i play the 2 songs at once.
i am also a person that likes whatever my ear finds pleasing
All the bosses with no real exception in sonic 2 are built to be dealt with at speed. Though it may not be immediately clear (especially with the wider totems of the remake that don't allow for the spindash approach of the original game) all bosses have a fast route and a slow methodical route just like how the top and bottom routes of a typical sonic stage works. Usually the faster method is riskier or more precise, but this absolutely plays into the very idea and theme of the game. I'm currently focused on art videos at the moment, but if you'd like if I get some free time I can demonstrate this in detail if this comment alone doesn't satisfy.
Just started watching the channel. Great to hear your perspective on the old nostalgic games. I'm wondering if you ever played Tails Adventure on Game Gear and what your thoughts are on it.
I loved it and even remember when I picked it up in the store. I could pick one game and I saw a game with Tails and no Sonic. I was intrigued and had no clue what I was in for. The worst part is the "saves" where you write down a code to restore the game where you were. It's like any change made the code something different. One bomb less and the code was different. I had a note pad with 100 codes on it as I played along.
My first game. I'll be 34 in a few months and I still love Sonic. Chemical Plant is the best zone!
Worth noting Death Egg robot has an attack if you land behind it.
I’m sorry but spring yard over casino zone any day. That juicy ass bass man. And yes oil ocean zone is high tier. Oil ocean dance baby.
I always forget Metropolis isn't the last zone before the final boss. It's always offputting to go through the entirety of Metropolis, thinking the game's nearly at its end, and then be greeted with an autoscroller and then Wing Fortress.
I also disagree on the notion that forward progress is always apparent in Mystic Cave Zone. While now well acquainted with the level layout, in the past, I've often confused myself and ran past one of those blue hanging levers that open up a bridge/path.
My favorite Sonic game. Ridiculous speed, but still has platforming and exploration. The mobile port is the best version. Great review!
Hello. Do you remember me?
The best Sonic game. I like every level. If it had the music from Flying Battery Zone for Wing Fortress it would be perfect.
Metal Gear retrospective next please?
Metropolis Zone has some good music tho
Great video but you should have talked about tails more. As a kid, tails was awesome especially when you found out you could plug in a second controller and have your friend take over tails! He's essentially invincible so 2 players can destroy any challenging boss fight and it was always cool seeing him fly in, run with his tails propelling him so he can almost reach sonics speed or how he pedals in the water. I feel like tails was a big part of sonic 2, for me at least.
nworder4life Patience, Sonic 3 will have all of that. That's when Tails actually got the ability to fly anyway. That's why I didn't talk about the spindash until this video, even though technically it's in the mobile port of 1.
Actually Sonic 3 is the game where the player can fly as tails, In Sonic 2 the computer always flew back to sonic when you overshot tails or he died, so we knew he could fly in 2.
Looking forward to your sonic 3 retrospective, again just felt like tails didn't get the recognition he deserved for being a big part of sonic 2.
Mystic cave zone music is the one bro, that fucking HOOK 😩
12:44 - I thought I was so cool as a kid for discovering this
I like Oil Ocean song and it's thematic meaning as a zone, it shows the player how little robotnick cares about the planet, and how much he is willing to destroy nature to achieve his goals...other than that it is really forgettable xD
death egg robo has 1 more attack : throws bombs at you(only if you are behind him
I'd really love to see the mobile ports of Sonic 1&2 ported to home consoles. They did that with Sonic CD and with the popularity of Sonic Mania, I'd hate to see these enhanced versions of the games just limited to mobile devises.
... you're tellin me i coulda restarted those horribly-designed trial-and-error special stages this entire time?
OmegaChase1002 Only on the Mobile port.
yes i know.
So far this is the only classic game I've played, got it through ps+ when I got a free month of it because of the ps3 hack, and I didn't really like it. Probably because I was so used to Mario styled platformers, but I had a hard time getting into it. The only zone I had a lot of fun with was Casino Night, I just had a lot of fun goofing of there I got a time out. But other than that it wasn't for me, although that was years ago, I have been interested in giving the classics another shot though was more interested in trying 3 and K before going to 2. But at this point I'm just going to go with Mania.
I will say I'm not really a fan of the Super Sonic in concept, I didn't unlock him when I did play it so I don't know if actually using him would change my mind or not. I think it's good to have a reward for getting all of the emeralds other than a slightly different ending, but for that reward to be god mode? I don't really like the idea that something as broken as Super Sonic can be unlocked that quickly, something like that I think should be a post game unlock. Maybe that wouldn't work for this game in particular given when it was made, but that's just my thought.
Just found my old Sega Genesis (model 1) as well as Sonic 2.
Where Sonic 1, 3 and Sonic and Knuckles, as well as about a dozen other games and all 4 controllers I had (not including the mouse for Wacky Worlds) went, who the fuck knows.
Getting 2 more controllers in the mail this week, then I can also play Kid Chameleon (that came with a Game Genie) and CRAZYBUS that I recently got. Also waiting on Sonic 1, Sonic Lost Worlds and Altered Beast.
Old school Sonic is the shit.
*Still need Toejam and Earl though*
Hill Top Zone song may be trash in Sonic 2.
But it's a MASTAPEACE when the "fly" is replaced with an actual saxophone.
Look up Tee Lopez' version.
I had a lot of trouble with spring yard boss lol.
Use debug mode on your phone in sonic the hedgehog 2 there is a pc that allows you to get the elemental sheilds
as a 10 yo me and my cousin went through all of the hurdles and bosses that you mentioned only thanks to abusing Tails immortality for bosses and hard sections XD
I love Metropolis Zone. It's better than the fucking plane level. I learned all 3 acts of Metropolis Zone and learned how to fly through them.
Spring Yard music > Casino Night music
I love Hill top’s theme
I would go for the mobile ports of classic sonic but classic sonic's neon colors is like crack to my eyes on a crt/pvm at 240p. Maybe in a second playthrough.
Sonic 2 gave us something Sonic 1 was missing.. speed! I love Sonic 1 but always felt slow vs the image that was portrayed.
Ugh...that final boss is only something you would put up with because the game was so immersive at launch. There's no way I'm playing the game all over so I can try to "git gud" enough to beat it without save states in 2020. I guess back in the day, you wouldn't mind playing the game without ever being able to beat the final boss.
While I love the music in a lot of Sonic 2, I just felt like Sonic 1 had a consistently better soundtrack.
Sonic 3 on the other hand...holy shit.
my own retrospective:
emerald hill zone: emerald hill may be a lazy remake of green hill but its at least not a full on copy.
chemical plant: is a scrapped idea for scrap brain remade into a new speed based level.
super sonic: fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
"mobile is the definitive"?
NEVER!!!!!!
My first time revisiting Sonic 2 as an adult I was on my last life and I was trying to explore and fine some secrets so I made a persice jump and made it up to a bunch of yellow bounce pannels that led nowhere and I was just stuck at the top of them unable to get down. I literally just bounced back and forth in pergatory untill the timer slowly ran down. So yeah, not exactly a fan.
To all the guys contradicting king with the "but it's still only on mobile" bullshit, get a fucking OUYA.
(Herp)
Have fun with Wacky Workbench and Metallic Madness fuck those levels
Y'all can sure talk s*** about the ear buzzing thing which is at a low volume but I don't hear anybody talk about Act 2 flying battery
I have gotten to Death Egg zone just using tails by himself. And i could NEVER beat chemical plant zone act 2 in the original game
But nobody cares:(
How are you spindashing in sonic 1?
The mobile app
I would like to point out a small correction if no one else has pointed it out. The Death Egg Robot has three attacks, but most people never see the third one because it's very specific. If you end up behind the robot Eggman/Robotnik tosses out a handful of small bombs shaped like himself which land on the ground and explode after a while. It's not seen often because most people don't try to get behind him, but it is there.
I had to scroll way too far down to see this reply, thank you!
Katzman 79 I was juat about to point that out
As a kid I used always the tactic with getting behind the Death Egg Robot, as it seemed more safe to me to attack him from behind (because I mostly died while attacking him from the front). I always thought this was the right tactic, before I've seen the usual tactic here on UA-cam ^^
Thank you for commenting this
Knuckles
Mystic Cave Zone's music makes it all worth it for me
Splish And it not being in Mania makes it criminal to me
Both you guys are on point. It's even better than chemical plant or hydrocity.
amen
Lol tbh i always loved hilltop zone soundtrack idk y it unpopular
I love oil ocean zones theme
Oil Ocean is forgettable? Check.
Metropolis Zone is stupid? Check.
Yep, accurate retrospective. *thumbs up*
Am I the only one who loves Metropolis Zone ? :( The music there is great, and the level is both challenging and has fun mechanics (only the enemies suck)
All my rage. Oil ocean made it in mania over mystic cave. ;_;
I actually really didn't know OO was forgettable to so many people. I actually like that zone. I was pretty happy to see they brought it back in Sonic Mania
Jordan Harris Despite do liking OO, how cool could that be if they brought back Mystic Cave combined with Hidden Palace as kind of amalgamation of the two?!
Julien NT Only for one enemy (Slicers)
19:18 That was painful to watch
ua-cam.com/video/lfiM0yIJc60/v-deo.htmlsi=CjuwgDbFNZCiZwGi
Sonic 2: How to do a Sequel the Right Way. It improved on nearly everything Sonic 1 did and pretty much put the series on the map. One of my favorite Sonic Games of all time and my first Sonic Game. Still not as good as Sonic 3 & Knuckles, imo, but still greatness nonetheless.
Also, I'm hyped as hell for Sonic 2 HD after that new trailer. 😄
Fuck u, sonic 2 is overrated sonic 1 is better
Elijah Ford Mmm... are you sure about that
Elijah Ford No need to use such language
Monkey D. "Straw Hat" Luffy The Sonic 2 HD trailer was awesome! Really wasn't expecting it. I really hope to see the game finally coming to fruition!
+Monkey D. "Straw Hat" Luffy Sonic 2 hd is looking fantastic
i actually really like the instrumentation of both hill top and labyrinth zone. i guess thats just a personal preference kind of thing but they're among my favorite songs in their respective games
Great video and analysis, I loved the point about hidden zones. That would be incredible if it was possible to stumble into a completely new zone by exploring different pathways, like if it seamlessly transitioned into a new zone aesthetic in the middle of the previous zone. I would love for a potential sequel to sonic mania to stop and think about reworking certain aspects of sonics overall design. One thing I would like to see changed is the time limit. I feel like the levels in mania were huge but the arbitrary time limit discouraged me from exploring the levels because I would be punished for staying around for too long, especially during act 2 of many zones where I came close to timing out during boss fights. One other thing I would consider changing would be to shift away from the pixel art aesthetic and move towards a hand painted look like rayman. A controversial opinion sure but I would love to see sonics colorful and vibrant art direction to its fullest capacity.
22:38 "No matter which path you're on, the way forward is always clear"
*Shows footage of Sonic going backwards :p
I found sky chase to be a relaxing break before getting back to it. The music sounded good and the breeze of a stage was welcomed to me as a kid having just sat in front of my genesis for hours running the gauntlet but I was 6 years old when this came out and far from as good as I became at it later in life.
King K, I've watched almost all your videos, Dark souls and Zelda are by far my favorite games so it makes sense why I watch. But that's not what makes your content so good. Your in depth delivery analyzing what makes gameplay work speaks wonders on how video games at best gives the player an experience unlike book or movie. I think the same way as you and would love to be a Patreon, a tier for a council would be nice where devoted watchers of your channel such as I, can have discussions with you over these games and even talk about future games you could play. Love to hear what you have to say. Thanks,
-Matt
Your idea of Sonic Mania 2 sound like Castlevania Rondo of Blood
Not a bad thing to sound like, honestly.
I'd love to see that. Hell, a full on Metroidvania with Sonic! I'd buy it!
Ghaleonh41 I dunno how a metroidvania with sonic would work, seeing as Sonic is generally not one to turn around and backtrack, and would need uncharacteristically (for a metroidvania) wide open level design, but if it could work, it'd be interesting just to see how Sonic's "moveset" could work in a metroidvania.
Ah, you meant backtracking as in going back to an earlier stage? Good point, but that can easily change, case in point Rondo of Blood & others. But I'd love to see how this can work if done right. The modern games do have something close to a Metroidvania style, I think & I'm including the Adventure games. Going back to stages you've already finished to find an upgrade or take a different route because of the upgrade & such.
Ghaleonh41 It's not even really the going to an earlier stage that's the problem - it's that fact that because Sonic is so focused on momentum, if you were just exploring and for some reason needed to turn around, that slows you down a lot. I can already think of a few ideas that could kind of work to solve this issue, but the thing is that Sonic is focused mainly on going from one end of the screen to the other in a wide open space, and that's antithetical to the design of a metroidvania. I do think it's a cool idea though, and again, if it could work, it'd be really cool.
*plays sonic 2*
"Hey, maybe my previous hate of Sonic was wrong!"
*metropolis zone happens*
"AND I'M BACKIN UP BACKIN UP BACKINUP BACKIN UP"
Aquatic Ruin is one of my favorites, probably because the first time i reached that stage as a kid was after struggling through Chemical Plant Act 2 a million times, I went from HATING water levels to being fine with them within two stages.
also the music for that stage is just glorious.
Mystic Caves tune honestly reminds me more of the first sonic spinball stage.
I am 28. I've played this game since my earliest memories at 3 or 4 years old. I finally beat it without cheats and with an honestly earned super sonic about 2 weeks ago.
It took me over a month of semi daily playing when work didnt have me too drained to be competent. It took that long to just develop the skill to not get hung up on segments of metropolis (or mecha sonic at the end, for some reason i game overed on him like 6 times 😂) and just empty your lives; if not that, those special stages were a bit of a tricky thing to master... Finally getting super sonic transported me back to being 5 years old in 1995 once more, such a rush and what a payoff)
So satisfying to finally whup it. I am now about to try to do the same with sonic 3 and knuckles 😃
Thank you so much for such a great video! It was truly nice to hear your take on this classic, and your editing skills (and sense oc pacing) are absolutely dope. I'll be watching more of your content!
you dissed my favorite zone
Get dunked on m9
There is one problem with the mobile ports, though...it is only on mobile. Playing the game on a smaller screen with your fingers obscuring a bit of the screen is not pretty ideal and the mobile emulators are not perfectly reliable.
I hope SEGA comes to their senses and releases the mobile ports on PC and consoles, it's easy money for them and the mobile ports were developed on PC first.
Why would you ever wanna pull a pristine Sonic 2 cart out of the clamshell, pop it into a real Genesis hooked up via RGB to a PVM and a stereo system with big clear speakers and grab a sleek 6 button controller... when you could play... the mobile version.
mtoad
I don't quite get what point you're trying to make.
Simply playing Sonic 2 is easy, knowing how many times the game has been ported on compilations and all that. Is just that the mobile version fixes a lot of issues that were in the genesis version and it is pretty much the definitive version of the game...except the fact that it's on mobile only, adding to what I said earlier, touching the screen isn't quite as responsive as pushing a button.
My point is that when it comes to the best way to play Sonic 2, it's not even debatable. Every other method (aside from the Saturn disc via the same setup as above) is comparatively a joke.
"joke"
So you're one of those elitist types.
Yes.
The Chemical Plant Zone song has lingered in my memory ever since I started playing this game in '94. What a great song in a great stage. And I never would have imagined that anyone else would be marked by this song as well, especially after all this time. To me, the initial Sonic franchise (the 2D era) was like those movies that have a part 1 and 2, in which the movie needs to be watched from first to last in order to make sense and you can't really mark one as being better than the other since they mutually complete each other: Sonic 1 is the beginning, you don't have as much power as in the other installments, you can't change into Super, etc etc, but it needs to be played, you gotta feel the evolution the next games brought. Then you get Sonic 2, a huuuge improvement and one of the best Sonic games (sorry, I've skipped over the 3D era) but I can't decide if it's better than 3 or if 3 is better than 2. So, Sega always stood out to me as having outdone themselves with Sonic. Oh, and great videos! At first I thought a 30 min review video of Sonic games would be too much, but I found myself finishing one video and starting the next, so keep up the good work!
You know, you could do a video about any IP and I'd probably watch it. It's not so much the topic, it's the way you do it and in such detail and passion, many of us can reflect on.
You know it to be true, when multiple franchises later, you are indeed still listening to the guy. :)
Oil Ocean was such a nothing zone in the original, I'm glad it got such a big upgrade in Sonic Mania though.
Also, the idea of Secret Levels in a Sonic Mania 2 is really really interesting. I for one would love to see that happen.
Alao I love how when KingK corrects himself in a video via text edit he uses a relavent sprite sound (sonic's jump, or young link's grunt)
Heh, UA-cam auto captions translated his sign off phrase as "my name is Ben Kincaid." Just FYI.
Will you do a Sonic 3 retrospective ? I really love your videos ❤👍
TheRambest I mean yeah
With knuckles?
KingK Or even better, a retrospective of Sonic 3 Complete?!
Windows U Yes sure. I just commented as generic name...
Dvir Arazi That's a Game fan mod, it doesn't count...
Rumor has it that whenever someone sees a Slicer or even hears their name, Somecallmejohnny screams in agony and rage.
What would you do to "fix" Sonic today? Imagine a 2d Sonic game with painterly, rayman-origins style visuals with hand-drawn animation. THAT WOULD BE AMAZING.
Edit: IT WOULDN'T BE SONIC MANIA. The main difference is it wouldn't be pixelated, and it would be able to have more zones/ ideas since SEGA would invest more into the project (i.e. bigger team, more resources, marketing, etc.)
pk mach make sonic mania
pk mach Sonic 2 HD
What is there to fix? Modern Sonic is doing fine and Mania is keeping classic fans satisfied
pk mach Like Mania?
It's not hand-drawn but that doesn't matter.
Cezary Dudkiewicz I think it does, personally. That modern art style coupled with hand drawn animation I could totally see replacing modern Sonic.
15:47
That's Silver Sonic. Mecha Sonic appears in Sonic & Knuckles. It's a common misconception
DaveMan1000 thank you for the correction, though in the grand scheme of things I ultimately don't care lol
KingK
Just for future reference.
@@GenesisGreen This is half-correct. They're called Silver Sonic in both versions.
You should never have to wait for the arrows by just standing ontop of the pillars and then jumping on him. It's still similar to other bosses but gives you more options to play with
Also a video critique would be that you let some of the music (notably Chemical Plant) play too long before you got to the analysis of it. I know what Chemical Plant sounds like, and didn't need the whole again song to understand what you were talking about.
kirby krew I will shorten them in the future, even I got annoyed watching it back again. I shouldn't have let it play that long. My idea was to let it finish the loop it was on, but that loop is a lot longer than I think I remembered.
I enjoy the music so much I didn't even mind. I just let the nostalgia sink in
I agree in most aspects. This would be my favorite Sonic ever if its wasnt for Metropolis, and the final boss.
Two bosses in a row with no rings is really pushing it. Save system or not, you are really pushing me expecting me to beat two hard bosses in a row...
I'm been playing Sonic 2 for 25 years, and probably beat it only twice because I quit the game when I get to the final boss.
Its really a shame the mobile port, which fixed a lot of issues, didnt add ONE ring after Mecha Sonic,.
Jose Colella I feel you.
I swear I died 20+ times before finally beating this boss. But now after beating it over 5 times, it really not all that bad. 3 rings at the start would still be plenty welcome
I wish they gave you a ring and when you got hit it you can’t get t due to gravity I think that’s a fair trade off
I literally don't care about sonic I just love your voice and content
Your retrospectives do a fantastic job of flowing together. When you expand on points expressed not super clear, or entirely missed in your sonic 1 retrospective, in this video, and then furthermore use those points for comparison to the actual focus of the video, sonic 2, it just works really well! I also appreciate that you addressed why you didn't feel the need to discuss bosses so much, but still brought attention to the boss you did like as well as the final boss of both games.
Since the mobile port I kinda learned to enjoy Oil Ocean this level is not that bad comparing to Sandopolis Zone fuck this Zone ! But it's not Wacky Workbench
P.S Love your voice King K you should do a bit of ASMR ^^
Why do people hate on Sandopolis so much?
Sad Johnson The sand
Puzzle elements
Some shitty enemy placement
Dark rooms you have to pull on a switch to light the room
Timed doors that require you to move fast
Quicksand
Oh did i mention sand?
Dunno, dude, I like it. Most of it.
Because I don't like sand. It's coarse and rough and irritating and it gets everywhere
+Sad Johnson: I'll add something that LOLSTER239 seems to have forgotten to mention... GHOSTS!
Super Sonic NEEDED FOR METROPOLIS ZONE
Great series! Really excited to see what you have to say about Sonic 3 and Knuckles. Don't knock your review of these games music, you did a great job - looking forward to, again, what you have to say about the tunes in S3&K
Some of this is real nitpicky complaining and someone who wanted an easy side scrolling game.
I think it is fair, f*** death egg
That's kind of the point of a UA-cam review: Someone expressing their own opinions on what they like and don't like. That, as you phrased it, is "nitpicky." This person is entitled to do so. You're entitled to agree or disagree.
I agree 100%. "OMG there's enemy placement that keeps me from mindlessly rushing through the level. How unfair!"
@Raging Bull Except that's not true, Sonic games have always had a lot of platforming which is why the classic Sonic games are the only good games in the series.
Brie Russel *cough* generations *cough* colors *cough* adventure 2 *cough*
Sonic 2 is a fun game to go through every now and then. It's not too long, has one of my least favorite levels (oil ocean), and a little bit of difficulty by the endgame. Still an enjoyable game; more so than Sonic 1. However, I still place Sonic CD as my favorite of the originals, even above S3&K (as unpopular of an opinion as it is).
This was the second game I ever played. I never beat it. I think Sonic games just aren't for me; I enjoyed Chemical Plant Zone, but I was never able to get the feeling of high speed for more than a couple seconds, which always felt like a tease of something fun before I was plodding around a same-y looking environment trying to get to the end while awkwardly hopping on enemies to poof them and free the enemies inside. The boss fights, when I got to them, weren't very engaging (as you point out), and the zones themselves were always cool at the outset, hearing the new music, drinking in the new vibes, but I never got anything out of exploring them. Something I didn't know yet, as I was like 5 and playing a platformer for the first time, was that I actually liked collectithons and am a 100% type of player. I wouldn't go into nooks and crannies to see new things, because the levels all kind of look the same; I just wanted to be sure I had rooted out every coin. And whenever there was something that caused me to lose coins, I was infuriated, and tempted to start the level all over again. The design decision to lock collection completion behind a no-hit challenge was a really bad one.
I picked up Sonic Mania at release, and found that I had all the same issues. There's just nothing about it that I could enjoy besides the visual design and music.
Fantastic retrospective. Finally some youtuber that does not bullshit everything about music composition. Half the time I barely understand when people talks about good music and you make it sound just as simple as I would explain it. Great work.
Maxime Lemieux Funny because I think I'm absolutely terrible at describing music. Glad it worked for so many people.
KingK I agree that you're not great at it but you handled it in a simple and classy way for the layman.
well done. its definitely not the introspective levelness of the other elements so you touched upon it and moved on.
I've been watching your content since the Mother retrospect. And
I want to just say that the way you convey your argument and problems towards games are incredible. That and packed in with your voice too. It just makes it so much professional and really quality.
I honestly don't mind the long videos at all, frankly they're a great time killer. I get to learn and understand what I overlooked. Like, I used to just blatantly hate the Death Egg robot but. I grew to be much more understanding of it.
KingK, my fellow retrospector, keep up what you're doing cause I absolutely love it.
8:10 not even the same genre though
9:30 S2 one uses "the twangy sound" aka slap bass for bass and the other something similar for the lead so obviously it's more up front in the latter, not sure what instrument it's supposed to mimick exactly in LZ though.
11:00 you've obviously upped the volume to where it's clipping, and it sounds better on real hardware.
13:10 Labyrinth does have a couple of significant shortcuts though
17:40 there's one more pattern if you get behind him. It's also a good idea to start off behind him and get a few hits in if you're careful about the hit detection
20:55 maybe you just suck, it can be memorized for sure. It is a bit frustrating at times though
26:10 it's a nice break after MZ and the music is great
While Sonic 2 was an improvement over Sonic 1 in terms of music and level design (at times), I still prefer Sonic 1 and even CD over 2. 2 was where Sonic Team was slowly overdoing it with the speed factor. The stages (except Metropolis I guess) are very easy to breeze through. There's a bit of platforming and exploration, but there's clearly more of a focus on fast-paced set pieces and utilizing momentum based physics to pull off fast-paced gameplay. That's not even counting the inclusion of the spin dash which grants you instant access to speed instead of having the speed be earned through gaining momentum. This is what Yuji Naka was talking about when he wanted to add levels like Marble Zone in Sonic 1 as pace breakers. It's to keep the game from becoming boring and one-note. To me, Sonic 2 overall just seems to be slightly weaker than the first game. Sonic 3 ends up being a massive improvement over 2 though.
KingK, how did you manage to get controller support for your BlueStacks Emulator?
Could be a different emulator, or a virtual machine
It’s pretty interesting to see the sharp divide between people who grew up with the OG Sonic games and those who did not. While I completely agree that Sonic 1 felt a lot more like a development team trying to figure it out as they went, Sonic 2 never felt “in need” of the Whitehead update. Did it help? Of course it did but there’s a reason why Sonic 2 & 3 have been held in high regard for years. Having said that, I do get how people who didn’t play these games on release would go back to them and say “wtf? These games are flawed as hell”.
I don’t think it’s just about nostalgia though. I think that the tolerance of gamers born after 1997 is just very different than those born before. Video games are funny like that. It’s not like music or literature or theater. It’s an interactive medium so we take in a very personal experience into our analysis. In any event, I understand the perspective in this video.