Suzuki Forenza Timing Belt Replacement - Part 2
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- Опубліковано 12 вер 2024
- In this video, the components on the front of the engine are removed to replace the timing belt and other accessories. This includes the timing belt, water pump, timing belt idlers and the front engine mount bracket. It's not necessary to remove the engine mount bracket, but it will make it easier to remove and install the water pump. Thanks for watching the video!
Very informational video and well put together. A couple tips I might ad is once you remove the upper motor mount you can raise or lower the engine to access the crankshaft bolt and by raising the engine the water pump comes right out. Also it helps for replacing the crankshaft seal in the lowered position.
Thanks for the info Rich! I believe in one of the later videos, I do move the engine up and down to gain access to some of the bolts.
@@stuzman52 Great video's though.
Thank you very much Rich!
@@stuzman52 I'll tell ya I can't understand why suzuki uses so much locktite. When my tech was removing the idler pulleys, the left side one with the stud spun out pulley and stud. So he clamped it tight on the lower portion of the stud in a vise. When he hit it with air to remove the nut he wasn't aware the stud was spinning in the vise. So it damaged the threads and still didnt relieve the nut. We had to order that double sided stud from a suzuki parts dist in springfield, mo. as there are no more active dealers. I went to the chev dealers thinking it would speed up the slow boat from the suzuki warehouse in Calif. That 2.0 dohc was never run in a GM car in the US so we were back to a week for a 22.00 bolt. We had to heat several bolts on this due to excessive use of locktite. But yet they can't build a motor that can go 100,000 miles on a timing belt. With a little cushion like some of the imports. 122,000 miles on second belt, bent 3 valves. :(
@@ComoRacingEnterprise Although the job has been awhile now, I do remember locktite being used in the timing belt area. I remember that stud and it did have locktite on it, and fortunately for me, I didn't run into the issues that you're having. Hopefully, everything else to the end should be smooth sailing. Have a good one Rick and don't work too hard! :)
One thing I did that might be helpful to others? I took a 6mm bolt from the junk box to the grinder and put a taper on the first half inch. With the help of a wrench on the cam(s), I was able to align both cams to the timing marks and shove this bolt into the center between the cogs, effectively acting as a 'cam lock' This made it easier to put on the timing belt. Thanks again Stuzman
You're welcome George and thanks for the tip as others may find it useful!
Terry,
I was able to remove the water pump without removing the engine mount. I rotated the pump around with the pulley up and the tang that sticks out on the side to about the 7 o'clock position. I slid the tang under the steel tube on the lower left. It then clears. Pure luck discovering it.
Thank you Dennis and your information should help others out there who may need to change the water pump!
But you can't remove the timing belt without removing the motor mount.
How tightly are you putting the vice grips on the 2 cam sprockets? I am concerned about bending or warping the sprockets or shaft. Is there another easy way to hold the sprockets from moving? I know they sell a tool to do this but would prefer not to buy it.
Bill J Bill, the vise grips are not putting that much pressure on them. Just find the spot on the pliers where they will just hold the sprockets from moving. it's not going to take a lot of pressure once you get in there and try it. The sprockets and shaft are not going to break, warp or bend the shafts.
I am all for removing things to make it easier nice work
Thank you very much! for excellent videos. I enjoyed and learn a lot from them. God bless you
Well Antegas, you made my day by saying that you learned a lot from the videos. The entire purpose for all of the videos is for people like yourself to learn how to work on and understand your vehicle, and to save some money in the process. Thanks for watching the videos and for your comment!
Terry, just to check it out, I performed a compression test today. I could not believe the results. It registered 168 across the board. Been driving the car for two days now and it really runs fantastic. I am extremely lucky .. This is my son's car and I did all the work to try and save him $$, which I did with your help. I thought of another question. Before I give it back to him, do I have to check the timing belt and tensioner again? I would say I have driven about 60 miles so far and I haven't had an issue.
The only problem I have now is that there is no fluid going to the rear brakes. Took out fitting and got nothing. I checked for any broken lines, there were none. I am pretty sure it is the master cylinder. i have an extra one which i am going to install. hopefully it will fix the problem. this car has 115,000 miles, maybe he can get another 115,000 miles.
+Vincent Gulisano Vincent, do you know what this means? It means that you're too good for your own good! Fantastic news you've got there and glad to hear that you didn't have any valve issues. As for the tensioner, once you get it set and the pointer is in the notch and after you turn the crank a few times and the pointer stay in the notch, you're good to go. So, no need to go back and recheck it. Yeah, sounds like you've got a master cylinder issue going on most likely. Hopefully, that will take care of your issue. And good to hear that you saved yourself some money along the way. Always glad to help and good to hear that the videos helped you out. Take care Vincent...
Terr, once again I am reaching out for your advice. If you remember I was not getting any fluid to the rear brakes. Front bleed fine. I had 2 mechanics look at it and they both said that even though the ABS light did not come on, the ABS module is bad. I picked up a use one from a car with 56000.miles on it and was running until it was T boned on passenger side. The unit took all of 5 minutes to disconnect, 6 fuel lines and one electrical connector and 2 bolts. It would be logical to say it would be just as easy to install.. The forenza ABS module has to be auto bleed. The mechanic said that he could install my part and bleed it for 200.00 , but makes no guarantee. If it works fine, if not pay the 200.00. Personally, I don't think either of these mechanics have the scanner to auto bleed. One wants 200.00 my part. the other 500 he supplies part. I have been doing a lot of research on this and I have seen several old school/shadetree mechanics say " bleed brakes normally and then take the car out and slam on the brakes several times to get the ABS module to work and then rebleed normally". My questions are, if fluid wasn't getting to the rear brakes before, and both mechanics said it was due to to the module, if I installed the part, would it make sense that the fluid should flow to all four brakes.? What do you think of the old school method? Do you think old school will work? seems like an excessive amount of money to have them done. Dealers want even more. I saved a lot of money doing all the repairs on this car with the help of your videos and it would seem like I am defeated when doing this will cost so much. What do you think? Vinnie
+Vincent Gulisano Sorry to hear Vinnie that you haven't got your bleeding issue resolved. From what I've researched, it does appear that a dedicated scanner is needed to cycle the pistons, motor, etc. to get the air out of this part of the system. Since you've already bled the master cylinder and its upstream of the ABS modulator then air surely entered this system. I have heard of this old school method also, but I have never tried it for myself and I'm not sure if it will work. But the theory does sound reasonable provided that there isn't any problem with the ABS modulator or its control module. At this point, I would say what do you have to lose. Go ahead and give it a try and see what happens. If everything is working, then the unit should move the pistons and hopefully move the air down the into the base system of the brake system where it can be bleed in the usual manner.
And what you mentioned about the two different mechanics is no surprise to me. I've experienced this in the past and realized I knew more than a lot of the techs out there. Which brings up my next point. I decided years ago to do all of my servicing on my vehicles which means, I'll need some test equipment. So, over the years, I've collected scopes, scanners, and whatever I needed to fully test vehicles.
I'm not saying to buy a scanner now, but you may want to consider one down the road. One that I like and it's reasonably priced and can scan over 50 cars and has bi-directional control is Autel MaxiDAS DS708. The only thing that I don't like is its graphing capability. Down the road, I was thinking of using its data files and import them into Excel and write a program to scroll the data like the tool does. Another day....I don't know if I gave you a link to a free service manual, but you may can get some good info from here. Take a look in the section that says "Service Manual' and you'll get all the info you'll want. The manual says its for a different model, but the info should apply for the Forenza also. Maybe it can help and here is the link lacetti.com.ua/chevy-man/EN/documents/Nubira-Lacetti/start_Nubira-Lacetti.html Let me know if the old school method works and I do wish you all the success in getting it repaired.
Terry
Terry, completed the timing belt installation . The only problem I had was the tensioner moved a couple a times. When I did 4 rotation and it stayed put, I figured I was good. Finished it all up and started right up. The engine idles smoothly, accelerates perfectly, no noises or knocking. I might have been lucky it sounds like I may not have any valve problems. I will do the leak down cylinder test to make sure.Your videos have been very helpfully and has saved me a lot of money.
Just one question. These cars are famous for the airbag light staying on. Many people believe Suzuki should have recalled vehicles. Do you have any idea or know a way to turn off light without bringing it to dealer to do. I hear they charge between 50-75 dollars just to reset.
+Vincent Gulisano Hey Vincent, I would consider yourself VERY lucky to not have any issues. If the car runs good, has a lot of pickup then I would say that you don't have any valve damage. So, no need to do the leak-down test. As for the air bag light, I read on a Suzuki forum that it's sometimes a connector issue under the passenger seat. I'm not saying that's your problem, just a possibility. You could do a search on this forum or even create a post and see what they come up with. www.suzuki-forums.com/suzuki-forenza-reno-forum/
Terry, need your opinion /help on something. The suzuki runs like a charm, I scanned it and got no reading, brought it to the auto store and had them scan it with their tool and again no errors. My problem is that the rear brakes will not bleed. I changed the master cylinder, still nothing, I changed the metering valve, still nothing. Frustrated, I brought it to a mechanic and he scanned it with top notch scanner, and still no error. He tried to bleed the brakes for me and no fluid still. He said that he did get a little to come out of one wheel then heard a little sound in the engine compartment. He says he believes that it is a faulty ABS modular. The ABS light never came on and I know that it does come on and goes off as it should when I start the engine. He said it would be very expensive to repair it. My question is " is it possible for there to be a problem with the ABS and for the light not to come on? or can there be a problem and not be picked up by the most elaborate scanner? Needless to say I told him not to do anything with it. Sorry to be so lengthy, but I could use your input. I can go to the Salvage yard and pull out the ABS system from a wrecked car. I have a manual and it does not look to difficult to remove/install. Do you think that the problem could be the ABS? and the only other thing I would like to know is that the manual tells you not to let air get into the modulator. When I take it off the car, I can actually cit the line and cap rather than unscrewing it. this should prevent air from entering . The manual also said that if air gets into it, you have to use a scanner and do an auto bleed. You cannot bleed normally unless there was no air .
Like I said car runs like a charm, interior is mint and exterior has a few dings but still shines like new. I wouldn't have the mechanic do it, he we charge me more than the car is worth. I am sure I can do it by myself. I can get the ABS system for $80.00. . Terry, I really would appreciate your input and help.. I have learned a lot from you so far, you are like my mentor.. Thanks, Vinnie
Thank you VERY much for your detailed video.
You're very welcome George!
Your attention to the fasteners really saved me, especially when I had it all taken apart for a while and forgot a few things about what went where. This was the first time I used these one time head bolts, and you gave me the confidence to twist them 270 degrees, that was a little scary for a first-timer. You put a lot of effort into this work, and again I say thank you for making the job so easy...
I'm glad that you liked the video series George. And now for the question; did everything work fine when you started the engine? :))
I have a thread repair to do where the EGR is mounted to the head, waiting on the kit, once that's done' I'll test it all. One thing I noted, my 2004, and your 2006 have an unused sensor next to the water temp sensor, or at least I think it is unused, do you know why it's there? Thank in advance.
George Breckenridge I’m sorry George as I sold the car years ago. I wouldn’t have a clue what that sensor location would’ve been full. 😀
Hi... The Forenza engine is interference or non interference engine. Thank you
It is an interference engine!
I replaced my alternator recently and its grinding against that entire black plastic cover of the timing belt any advice on how to properly align it so it is not rubbing?
My first question would be did the original alternator have the same issue? If so, then you probably have a bracket that's bent and would require replacement or bending if that's possible. If you didn't have this issue originally, then your replacement alternator is the wrong one. Good luck Nasrullah on what you find!
@@stuzman52 thank you for replying my original alternator I would say i dont know. Its funny I drove the car used, the same day I got it from S. Carolina to Maryland to see my mom in the hospital. And back without any issues. No squeeking or grinding nothing. I get back home and the belt had came off as I noticed in the morning when my steering went out. The belt was about 4 sizes too big which was extremely weird and made me think I should imvest in cameras. But trusting the word of a mechanic I had the alternator changed. It is very possible that it could be the wrong one. How would I go about getting a bend?
car was running okay before i started to do the belt. Timing was only slightly off. exhaust cam was okay. intake cam sprocket was 2 tooth off. crank was about 10 degrees off.. I'll let you know the outcome
+Vincent Gulisano I don't know how your car ran okay being that far out. Hopefully, all will go well.
Really appreciate your videos.
You're quite welcomed smitty and hope they help you out!
i am changing the timing belt. when i took off cover i saw there was little tension on belt. i also noticed that it is out of timing. the belt is off. My exhaust camshaft sprocket is on target. the other one is a little off and so is the crankshaft. If I adjust the one sprocket and clamp them as you suggest than if I line up the crankshaft with timing mark will it be properly in time?
+Vincent Gulisano Yes, you can do that to get it in time. But you need to worry about if there was any valve damage since it did get out of time. Do a leak-down cylinder test to confirm that you have no valve damage. Otherwise, if you put it back in time and it doesn't start or runs very poorly, don't be surprised.
What should I do if I didn't mark where the crankshaft pulley was before I took It off!!?? Also does it matter which way I turn the two cam shafts at the top as long as the notches are lined up?
Hi Brandon. As far as the crankshaft pulley, it doesn't matter how you put it back on. So with the four bolts securing it, any position should be fine. As for the camshafts, that shouldn't be a problem either since your sprockets are still attached. Just make sure that the timing marks on the sprockets for the camshafts align with the markings on the camshaft cover. And as I'm sure you know, make sure that the cutout on the crankshaft sprocket aligns with the V-notch on the back timing belt cover. If you don't get all of these timing marks aligned (three of them) you'll be looking at bent valves when you crank it up. Good luck on your repair.
My belt was broken too how do I align the camshaft? 2.4 l dodge stratus I was told I couldn't turn the camshaft cuz the engine is an interference engine do I put the belt then align the Mark's remove the belt and replaced the tensioner water.pump ect?
If your engine is an interference engine, you'll probably going to have bent valves. At this point, aligning marks and putting the belt back on is wasting your time. You'll more than likely will have to pull the head to fix bent valves.
I have a 2007 Forenza & it wouldn't start just kept clicking rapidly. Was told it was the battery. Went and got a new battery, still rapid clicking on the dashboard with lights flashing. Told it was the battery cables went and replaced those. Then had someone replace my belt but it was put on wrong. When I took it to be redid car still did the same thing. I was then told that because I kept trying to start the car that a tiny hole was blew from a piston in the engine and I needed a new engine. Not really sure what to do now or if the information was reliable because the noise stayed the same and there's no fluid leaking from underneath.
I'm very sorry to hear that you had all these issues Lishy and your car wasn't diagnosed properly. It could be that you had an issue with the starter motor. You didn't say if the timing belt broke and if so, the valves were probably bent and could when the valve(s) hit the pistons, it's possible a piston or others could be damaged. A compression and/or leakage test could verify if you have internal damage. Again, sorry to hear about your issues...
I have bracket that I am trying to find where it goes.its not the bracket in the video you show under the intake manifold but it's another one that goes to the intake manifold as a brace.if you can help me out that would be great.i can email a pic of it as we'll.it has a bent in the bracket as we'll.thanks
It's one of two brackets where both go to the alternator and bolts to the intake manifold. I don't know which one you're talking about, but take a look at this video of where I show both of them. Start looking at timeline 11:25 and you'll see the first bracket and then once I remove this bracket, you'll see the removal of the second bracket (it's probably this one). Suzuki Forenza Head Removal - Part 3 (Camshaft Cover Removal)
thank you a ton for that video!! i got the bracket back on! thanks!
Dane Doremus No problem Dane, glad to help!
I have a question for you where did you get the repair manual at did you get it online or some where
I got the factory service manual from Ebay years ago. When I sold the car, I let the guy have it since I didn't need it anymore.
@@stuzman52 do you know anything about alldata.com/diy
@@youcantstopme5136 Yes, I have used their service several times over the years for different vehicles. Pretty good service.
@@stuzman52 ok thank you going to give them a try I need to change my throttle body but before I buy I need to know if it need to be reprogram
@@youcantstopme5136 Are you working on a Suzuki Forenza Randall? And if not, what vehicle? Make, Model and Year...
My belt broke. I am having trouble getting the cams on there mark. They seem to spring forward after turning it a little bit. Is this normal? Thank you
Yes Michael, it's normal for the camshafts to spring back. On this vehicle, the exhaust cam will move and that's why I put the vise grips on the two sprockets to hold them in place so they wouldn't move. I assume that when the belt broke, that you checked to ensure that you don't have bent valves. This is an interference engine so it's a good chance that the valves are bent which requires removal of the cylinder head.
No I didn't check. I am not an auto Mechanic. lol I was hoping just to try it out. The car is not worth a new engine. But I can't get the 4 bolts out of the crank shaft pulley. Even put a impact wrench on them. Is there a quick way to check the valves. But the way your videos are great.
I have this exact same car . The two wheeles for the timing belt to go on top off they won't move what does that mean plz answer , thank you
Are you referring to the camshaft sprockets? And what are you doing, timing belt break, replacing head gasket etc.?
stuzman I'm trying to replace my timing belt I bought this car a week ago off a guy & it broke like 3days ago spent 1800$ , also I took my car too Walmart for an oil change & they for got to put the cap back on I drove around with no cap on & oil was going everywhere that was before the timing belt broke could that oil be the reason the timing belt broke & the two wheels that the timing belt go on do you need a tool to put in time or you can turn it with your hands
Doubtful that the oil coming out of the oil cap hole caused the belt to break as the belt is covered pretty well with the timing belt cover. Maybe all of the timing belt components weren't replaced and there was a bad bearing in an idler; just guessing as I don't know. The crank be turned with a ratchet and pulley and the camshafts can be turned with if I remember correctly a torx fitting. The last question would be covered more in the videos of this series.
Were is camshaft sensor located
.
Hi Fernando. The camshaft sensor is located at the bottom of the camshaft sprockets and it's located behind these sprockets.
How do I find TDC?
I assume you're changing your timing belt. Take a look at the impression on the crankshaft sprocket. Take this and align it with the v-notch on the back of the timing belt cover. You're now at TDC.
Terry, Sorry but your response did not come through, can you please resend.
+Vincent Gulisano You may have already done this, but take the hoses off the rear calipers. At least you'll know there isn't an issue with the zerk fittings or inside the calipers itself. If you still can't get any fluid, then there isn't anything else left since you changed the metering valve and master cylinder. If you had a bi-directional scanner, you could activate the ABS unit to move the pistons to see if that would help, although I can't see why fluid wouldn't pass through it. Since you can get one for $80, go ahead and try that as I can't think of anything else that would cause this issue. Strange that the ABS is working and there isn't a light for it. Good luck on what you find and let me know if that fixes it.
an GM engine in a Japanese?????
thinx for haed marks and you so bad in evre thinc owse .....