I used to play D&D back in the late 80's and early 90's, (BECMI primarily). And a couple of years ago I started getting interested in the game again. I didn’t know much about Forgotten Realms, back then I had all the Gazeteers of Mystara - so of course I looked for new stuff about Mystara! Was very disappointed that WotC hadn’t continued expanding knowledge of Mystara. But in my search for stuff about Mystara I crossed paths with your maps - and I’m VERY impressed! You’ve done some really great work!
Technically both Blackmoor and Greyhawk come before Mystara but I think it was the most fleshed out early. Mystara is my favorite setting though so that's why I'm here.
Excellent review, for the most part, of what I consider a well-conceived and evocative fantasy world. Such great art on those Gazeteers. However, where I differ from you - there’s nothing at all wrong with writing as if a place is foreign. Adds to the sense of mystery and discovery. I miss Mystara. Grand Duchy of Karameikos forever!
I’m just kinda saying, “this probably wouldn’t fly in today’s climate,” *but* that’s also an opportunity for improvement and putting a best foot forward. The kind of angry that people get over this sort of thing isn’t a blocker, it can be transformative even though I’m not 💯 percent in agreement with them.
@@The_CGA Ahh, I see. Yes, I agree that much of it wouldn't fly in today's climate. But then, I view that statement more as a badge of honor than disparagement. I tend not to want to give in to mobs, so I personally wouldn't change a thing If I were writing it, but I think you offer an interesting perspective as to viewing it as an opportunity for transformation. I believe we should always be looking to improve, but what many label improvement these days is anything but, as far as I'm concerned. Transformation can certainly be a positive, but isn't necessarily so, and for me, there are serious flaws in the basic premises of the people seeking to "cancel" those who don't conform to their worldview. I suppose there was opportunity for transformation in many countries under totalitarianism post-WWII as well. I don't view Mystara as needing to be transformed though. Added depth, breadth and color? Sure. But it was pretty great just as it was. Personally, I don't need a trigger warning for The Muppets or Dr. Seuss or Dumbo or old Dungeons & Dragons. But I'm veering off topic here, so I'll bring it back around to thank you for this video and shining light on a great fantasy setting of yore.
Eh, life goes on. There are many hills I will die on (other videos on the channel outline a few), this hill seems fine to give a bit of ground and save some peace of mind and goodwill.
Honestly it would be amazing to see mystara brought back in some fashion I know Mr.Welch is currently making content on the setting though he isn’t able to release any of it on DMsguild because Wotc hasn’t released the 3rd party legal stuff that lets people make content for mystara yet
Aside for a few points I made in other comments - I just wanna say great video. I played a lot of BECMI and owned all the Gazetteers back then - and it’s always nice to see others having the same love for the setting like I had…
The magnifying glass 🔍 “telephoto lens” I used for the second webcam ended up gathering the soft box diffuse light into a little point which wasn’t visible...until someone put their face directly in that spot...which I did
Ohh when I talk about the panic, I mean I was a small human and the adults responsible for Me would say whoa whoa whoa dungeons and dragons? We’ll get in trouble with other parents! They’ll call The cops on us if they find out you’re teaching their kids D&D! You can’t bring that book on our trip to Ohio, the family down there watches the 700 club. I was born in 1983. I wasn’t there for the panic, I just awoke in the after-times which were desolate for young people. The assumption was that D&D was okay, but radioactive. And also, keep it in the closet, the religious people might get you in trouble with the authorities or your books taken away.
That is because it is yet another lie in the long line of lies this person likes to tell. Using phrases and keywords that are like codewords to get attention, without having any knowledge of what they mean. Its like that guy played by Steve Buscemi "Hello fellow kids", saying whatever it takes to look important to try to gain attention.
Hello here’s the citation You are the king of moving goal posts Make your own videos of you think you can do better while also enhancing viewers and providing value www.blackgate.com/the-known-world-dd-setting-a-secret-history/
It wasn’t the Normans who became bodyguards in Constantinople - it was the Varangians! Normans was the descendants of Norse and French people from Normandy! Varangians was Norse that travelled the Baltic Sea, and Rivers of Eastern Europe - also played a huge role in forming the Garðaríki. aka the Kyivan Rus Kingdom.
Im pretty sure there were explanations to why some Forrest, Jungle, or Desert are where it maybe seems weird or unexpected! Below earth heat sources and such…
Unfortunately the Known World had a very cool map, similar to Conan the Barbarian's ancient Earth with recognizable continents, but the mish mash of cultures adjacent made absolutely no sense. American Indians, Byzantine Romans, Harry Potter-like wizard nation, etc with no forethought of why. The Hollow World, with Aztec style people really pushed the blatant unrealistic setting. Yes, it's fantasy, but at least Tolkien and Greenwood's Forgotten Realms were believable. Blackmoor was tied to the Known World via the Inn Between the Worlds series of modules. That said, I once owned all of the gazetteers, almanacs, etc. I now own, and hope to play, HackMaster 5e, when I soon retire and have time again.
I did not attempt a huge apology for that particular critique in this video, besides to point indirectly at Golarion and to say, “it’s not holding back this other things, either.” I prefer in my own world building a much more cause and effect approach. I think there’s a longevity that comes from answering why something happened because of the previous thing because of the previous thing and so on. Hârn is my favorite setting for that reason. But I also have to recognize, it barely ever matters to players. Most campaigns live out their lives in blissful ignorance of these flaws in in the world around them. Sometimes a hamburger will do even when filet mignon is on the menu too.
That it was camp turn me off. I did a campaign loosely based on Tolkien, LeGuin, and a "magical isle" one which laid "Khâzuum." (with references to Forbidden Planet, because even then fantasy and sci-fi were being merged. I had a friend who ran "Synsyndade" e.g. Cincinnati) It is the obsessions that hook us.
hmm nice video, nice compilation and explanation of the setting yet so many minor yet significant flaws...for example the source of magic is not an orb, but the remains of a spaceship engine, or the Aplhatians originate from another dimensional Plane instead planet. The gazetteers brought the timelines, not the almanacs, those just continued the given time line, with great inout by AnnDupius among others. Just to mention. There is soooo much more on Mystara that brings it much more life. it is one of the reasons I make 1 mile hexmaps of the same said regions; www.deviantart.com/6inchnails I also feel you have some difficulty with discussing the today negativity as to some cultural opinions, proprotiation and humanoids. And this is totally understandable, yet should not be. Thanx for sharing.
I don’t find any difficulty in discussing the “present day topics,” I just did not care to make the video entirely about that. It might be noted that I began the video with a declaration that I didn’t go back and get every detail “just so,” because the intent was instead to demonstrate that after decades, so much of it is fresh in the mind. It is flawed, and that’s on purpose. I also make precise videos, that was not the goal here, in this case. In any case, thank you for the feedback
I don't think Mystara, or most settings reduce/simplify the Ylaruam or Atruaghin parts any more or less than it reduces and simplifies the other areas. D&D itself reduces, simplifies and mixes basically all of its cultures. I think, going forward, they need to be a lot more original and imaginative across the board, and Ylaruam and Karameikos are equally socially problematic, and overplayed in a modern context. I can't tell anyone NOT to be offended by the Atruaghin material, but I don't see them doing a worse job at that section than they did anywhere else in the setting.
Ohh, yeah those Gazeteers aren’t really any more reductionist/pastichey as the rest of the setting. The truth is the whole gimmick is that same reductionism and pastiche. I’m not sure if adding nuance is the way to redeem settings built on this gimmick: that would make them alike to more developed settings like 3.5 era Forgotten Realms or Hârn or Kalamar. The Stone soup 🥣/kitchen sink identity would be lost, at which point the value in the original might be disproven as well. I think the better course of action is to recruit authors and artists that represent the cultures and mythologies being pastiched to do the pastiche-big, which avoids accusations of orientalism or some extent. Add in an editorial team that’s excited to use a pastiche setting as a vehicle for a lot of “diversity” within easy reach of play. (It’s all well and good to have a well researched Africa-alike attached to a setting, but if it never sees play because it’s too far removed, at a certain point there’s a free-falling-in-the-forest conundrum. I could be convinced to do a follow up video talking about possible ways forward for something like Mystara but I would need some panelists from the representative groups to do it in good faith according to modern sensibilities.
@@The_CGA I don't think adding nuance, or revising the old settings for sensitivity is the way to go. Leave that old stuff there as a product of its time, and work on new things that contain original ideas, rather than evaluating how to tastefully reskin a real world culture. Edit -> Even if we apply a modern sensitivity to these cultures, those sensitivity will continue to evolve, and what we identify as tasteful and unproblematic today might be unacceptable 50 years from now. I once used Codex Seraphinianus, and the absurd images there as the basis for "odd" cultures in a campaign i was running. It tended to add a layer of humor to things, so I'm more likely to try to describe things in such a way that culture and ethnicity aren't concretely defined, so players are free to imagine whatever works for them.
The Atruaghin Gazetteer wasn't particularly good. It was a rush job and you can see that a mile away. Thankfully, an associate of mine, Mr. Welch, DID revise the Atruaghin Gazetteer, and it's pretty good. I can link it if you'd like?
Here's the deal : as a kid in the 80's, I loved the Gazetteer series. Ylaruam was a beautiful and well presented "Arabian Nights" setting , with a Mohammed type character (Al-Kalim) presented as the prophet whom unites his people and helps to give structure to their society. As a player, I get tired of the same tired Western European settings and having different cultures and societies is something players should be encouraged to explore. For example, in Ylaruam mages are discouraged and Clerics run the show -- so your typical murder hobo might suddenly have some trouble tossing fireballs around when the enforcers of the Faith show up to keep the peace...meanwhile, the Principalities of Glantri are a Magiocracy where being a Cleric is an automatic death penalty, and make no mistake those two nations are absolutely at odds with each other. Things like that lend some interesting interplay and metaplot. I have to say I can't stand this accusation of "Orientalism" , as if wanting to explore and understand other cultures thru gaming is somehow 'offensive' -- in your own broadcast you noted later the desire to see less "Eurocentric" settings. Well "Europe" is a big continent. You can have Russian steppe nomads, moorish Spain, Vikings, Tectonic Knights, Turkish strongholds, Huns, Scythians, Mercantile city states and pirate empires (gee, not unlike the Known World!) My point being that it can be beneficial to explore and look at other civilizations thru the game rather than just presenting everything as Western Europe. I play a ~lot~ ( and I do mean a lot) of Crusader Kings 2, and one thing that game presents is how society and culture come about from the interplay of different peoples in a melting pot. (This guy might come from steppe nomads but his wife prays to the blood tree, and the neighboring king will give me a pile of gold of I let him build a temple but my brother now claims he has a new faith from his recent pilgrimage.)..all these elements blending into a new society and culture, etc is an important aspect of that game, it should be part of D&D as well.
People like you are what's ruining this hobby. Claiming that fantasy cultures represent real cultures is racist, but I'm guessing that's completely escaped you.
Immortals are not weaker than Gods. Ao props up the Gods, immortals on their home plane are way stronger than even greater gods. Also Blackmoor belongs to Mystara. Sorry dude.
Blackmoor, the home campaign of Dave Arneson’s Braunstein early 70s wargame (the apocryphal “chai mail days”) is syncretized in latter-day Mystara materials to be part of the world’s Protohistory, but the two have an entirely different Genesis. Here’s some “citation”: www.blackgate.com/2015/02/07/the-known-world-dd-setting-a-secret-history/ As for immortals the assertion is not that they are “weaker,” but that they are more distant, and their personality and distinct characteristics do not figure prominently in the world’s unfolding tale. Consider this especially vs. the likes of Mystra, Shar, and Selune in Forgotten realms. Does anybody know or care what the names of the immortals are in the known world? Are there visible churches ⛪️? Are the schemes of gods/immortals driving events in the meta plot or do the gods merely react to it (like the rescue of alphatia?) Sorry dude
The lies spread by people trying to look important on the internet... Greyhawk, Second Printing July 1975 Blackmoor, Second Printing July 1976 oh look, BOTH settings came out *BEFORE* Holmes edition which came out in 1977, or Moldvay/Cook which came out in 1980. GAZ1 "The Grand Duchy of Karameikos" published 1987. *Dawn of the Emperors - Thyatis and Alphatia* Boxed set released 1989 just as AD&D 2nd edition came out. Bloodstone Pass published in 1985, Bloodstone Wars in 1987 along with its setting boxed set Forgotten Realms, even predates Mystara. Doesn't matter if this troll is talking about DragonLance or anything else, they fail to do any research, and just spread misinformation about everything, while making clickbait titles to their video for clout chasing. When people make a video for UA-cam, don't trust them to have done any research. Anyone can buy a book on eBay and claim they have had it for 30 years, and give all sorts of misinformation for clout. Always do your own research so you arent spreading lies made by clout chasers.
Maybe if you watched the video, *idiot* you would know “first official” is the claim, it was a joke, the Known World Map was in B/X, and the archaeology around the Known World as an entity goes back to 1976 and is basically contemporaneous with Blackmoor in its inception. In print the isle of dread module and even palace of the silver princess have place-names that would eventually become part of Mystara. . Also, It was a joke made by way of splitting hairs between Basic D&D and Advanced. “This video is not a history lesson” but I’ll give you one if you like First, the dates of publication you give for greyhawk and Blackmoor are for the white box booklets. The greyhawk booklet has zero setting content. It’s just what might be called a “zine” in today’s language. A lot of prototype rules that would get rolled into AD&D. The original ideas of greyhawk come from the Great kingdom map, which was in a newsletter of a pre-D&D Wargaming group Gygax and Arenson belonged to. However it was not until the publication of greyhawk adventures much later that the setting was rolled out as a schema or venue for play. The known world project dates to 1974, created by Schick and moldvay. With moldvay basic the authors requested to bundle the campaign as a prototype or schema, a request that was granted. The expert set map 🗺 sets the founding date in this chronology, and it is considerably more “bundled” and “official” to Basic D&D than Greyhawk was in a similar period. The development of the setting precedes the gazeteers in adventure modules, the isle of Dread being the most notable. I’ve owned the Poor Wizards Almanac since it was in the Waldenbooks bin in whatever year of the 90s that was. Since you’ve made it so personal and gotten so many things wrong, I’m going to make a video demonstrating my research, which clearly you haven’t done much of (given the Greyhawk citation which is specious)
Sorry, comments are not time stamped...nobody knows what you’re talking about since you didn’t tell us...so whatever clever j’accuse you intend will be lost upon whatever future audiences you wish to share the laughter with
What a wonderful video! Your passion for Mystara is a joy to hear. And I’m thrilled to see my maps put to such good use. Thanks for making this.
I used to play D&D back in the late 80's and early 90's, (BECMI primarily).
And a couple of years ago I started getting interested in the game again.
I didn’t know much about Forgotten Realms, back then I had all the Gazeteers of Mystara - so of course I looked for new stuff about Mystara!
Was very disappointed that WotC hadn’t continued expanding knowledge of Mystara.
But in my search for stuff about Mystara I crossed paths with your maps - and I’m VERY impressed!
You’ve done some really great work!
Technically both Blackmoor and Greyhawk come before Mystara but I think it was the most fleshed out early. Mystara is my favorite setting though so that's why I'm here.
Excellent review, for the most part, of what I consider a well-conceived and evocative fantasy world. Such great art on those Gazeteers.
However, where I differ from you - there’s nothing at all wrong with writing as if a place is foreign. Adds to the sense of mystery and discovery.
I miss Mystara. Grand Duchy of Karameikos forever!
I’m just kinda saying, “this probably wouldn’t fly in today’s climate,” *but* that’s also an opportunity for improvement and putting a best foot forward. The kind of angry that people get over this sort of thing isn’t a blocker, it can be transformative even though I’m not 💯 percent in agreement with them.
@@The_CGA Ahh, I see. Yes, I agree that much of it wouldn't fly in today's climate. But then, I view that statement more as a badge of honor than disparagement.
I tend not to want to give in to mobs, so I personally wouldn't change a thing If I were writing it, but I think you offer an interesting perspective as to viewing it as an opportunity for transformation.
I believe we should always be looking to improve, but what many label improvement these days is anything but, as far as I'm concerned. Transformation can certainly be a positive, but isn't necessarily so, and for me, there are serious flaws in the basic premises of the people seeking to "cancel" those who don't conform to their worldview. I suppose there was opportunity for transformation in many countries under totalitarianism post-WWII as well. I don't view Mystara as needing to be transformed though. Added depth, breadth and color? Sure. But it was pretty great just as it was.
Personally, I don't need a trigger warning for The Muppets or Dr. Seuss or Dumbo or old Dungeons & Dragons. But I'm veering off topic here, so I'll bring it back around to thank you for this video and shining light on a great fantasy setting of yore.
Eh, life goes on.
There are many hills I will die on (other videos on the channel outline a few), this hill seems fine to give a bit of ground and save some peace of mind and goodwill.
I never heard of Mystara before. Seems to be a campaign setting that totally escaped my notice. Now I want to play in it.
Same!
Those Crown Royal bags were the first true bags of holding.
Fantastic video, CGA! Mystara is still my favorite DnD setting-out-of the-tin and has been since the Gazetteers came out.
There's even a dinosaur immortal. You can't top that!
For god so loved Dinosaurs...
Honestly it would be amazing to see mystara brought back in some fashion I know Mr.Welch is currently making content on the setting though he isn’t able to release any of it on DMsguild because Wotc hasn’t released the 3rd party legal stuff that lets people make content for mystara yet
I remember Mystarra. Now I mainly play Forgotten Realms.
Aside for a few points I made in other comments - I just wanna say great video.
I played a lot of BECMI and owned all the Gazetteers back then - and it’s always nice to see others having the same love for the setting like I had…
The light on the tip on your nose makes it look as if you've been using MAGICAL means to power your late night game sessions 😊🤣😉jk
The magnifying glass 🔍 “telephoto lens” I used for the second webcam ended up gathering the soft box diffuse light into a little point which wasn’t visible...until someone put their face directly in that spot...which I did
This video was awesome! I like these kind of setting overview videos
41:47 "There's a skyship passing over my house" :-D
Good overview and great push to let the new gen use some innovations like Mystara used, good vid!
Ah.. Basic D&D, I loved that Rules Cyclopedia. I moved to it from AD&D while in my teen years.I loved those Gazetters.
Sooo, I was like 8 when the whole SP thing happened, when James Egbert disappeared in 1979. I didn't think we were even close in age.
Ohh when I talk about the panic, I mean I was a small human and the adults responsible for
Me would say whoa whoa whoa dungeons and dragons? We’ll get in trouble with other parents! They’ll call The cops on us if they find out you’re teaching their kids D&D! You can’t bring that book on our trip to Ohio, the family down there watches the 700 club.
I was born in 1983. I wasn’t there for the panic, I just awoke in the after-times which were desolate for young people. The assumption was that D&D was okay, but radioactive. And also, keep it in the closet, the religious people might get you in trouble with the authorities or your books taken away.
That is because it is yet another lie in the long line of lies this person likes to tell. Using phrases and keywords that are like codewords to get attention, without having any knowledge of what they mean. Its like that guy played by Steve Buscemi "Hello fellow kids", saying whatever it takes to look important to try to gain attention.
Hello here’s the citation
You are the king of moving goal posts
Make your own videos of you think you can do better while also enhancing viewers and providing value
www.blackgate.com/the-known-world-dd-setting-a-secret-history/
It wasn’t the Normans who became bodyguards in Constantinople - it was the Varangians!
Normans was the descendants of Norse and French people from Normandy!
Varangians was Norse that travelled the Baltic Sea, and Rivers of Eastern Europe - also played a huge role in forming the Garðaríki. aka the Kyivan Rus Kingdom.
Im pretty sure there were explanations to why some Forrest, Jungle, or Desert are where it maybe seems weird or unexpected!
Below earth heat sources and such…
32:12 Someone's been running Hackmaster recently ;)
Unfortunately the Known World had a very cool map, similar to Conan the Barbarian's ancient Earth with recognizable continents, but the mish mash of cultures adjacent made absolutely no sense. American Indians, Byzantine Romans, Harry Potter-like wizard nation, etc with no forethought of why. The Hollow World, with Aztec style people really pushed the blatant unrealistic setting. Yes, it's fantasy, but at least Tolkien and Greenwood's Forgotten Realms were believable. Blackmoor was tied to the Known World via the Inn Between the Worlds series of modules. That said, I once owned all of the gazetteers, almanacs, etc. I now own, and hope to play, HackMaster 5e, when I soon retire and have time again.
I did not attempt a huge apology for that particular critique in this video, besides to point indirectly at Golarion and to say, “it’s not holding back this other things, either.”
I prefer in my own world building a much more cause and effect approach. I think there’s a longevity that comes from answering why something happened because of the previous thing because of the previous thing and so on. Hârn is my favorite setting for that reason.
But I also have to recognize, it barely ever matters to players. Most campaigns live out their lives in blissful ignorance of these flaws in in the world around them. Sometimes a hamburger will do even when filet mignon is on the menu too.
You are very right in that most players don't care about world history.
But I did get the 5e version of The Isle of Dread.
Watching this video is kind of like watching a catholic priest give a detailed lecture on the use of medicinal cannabis.
Eating up every bit of that vibe, maybe I’ll do a few videos in some kind of priestly frock
That it was camp turn me off. I did a campaign loosely based on Tolkien, LeGuin, and a "magical isle" one which laid "Khâzuum." (with references to Forbidden Planet, because even then fantasy and sci-fi were being merged. I had a friend who ran "Synsyndade" e.g. Cincinnati) It is the obsessions that hook us.
hmm nice video, nice compilation and explanation of the setting yet so many minor yet significant flaws...for example the source of magic is not an orb, but the remains of a spaceship engine, or the Aplhatians originate from another dimensional Plane instead planet. The gazetteers brought the timelines, not the almanacs, those just continued the given time line, with great inout by AnnDupius among others. Just to mention.
There is soooo much more on Mystara that brings it much more life. it is one of the reasons I make 1 mile hexmaps of the same said regions; www.deviantart.com/6inchnails
I also feel you have some difficulty with discussing the today negativity as to some cultural opinions, proprotiation and humanoids. And this is totally understandable, yet should not be.
Thanx for sharing.
I don’t find any difficulty in discussing the “present day topics,” I just did not care to make the video entirely about that.
It might be noted that I began the video with a declaration that I didn’t go back and get every detail “just so,” because the intent was instead to demonstrate that after decades, so much of it is fresh in the mind. It is flawed, and that’s on purpose. I also make precise videos, that was not the goal here, in this case. In any case, thank you for the feedback
Yeah, mom threw my dice away too. :(
I don't think Mystara, or most settings reduce/simplify the Ylaruam or Atruaghin parts any more or less than it reduces and simplifies the other areas. D&D itself reduces, simplifies and mixes basically all of its cultures. I think, going forward, they need to be a lot more original and imaginative across the board, and Ylaruam and Karameikos are equally socially problematic, and overplayed in a modern context. I can't tell anyone NOT to be offended by the Atruaghin material, but I don't see them doing a worse job at that section than they did anywhere else in the setting.
Ohh, yeah those Gazeteers aren’t really any more reductionist/pastichey as the rest of the setting. The truth is the whole gimmick is that same reductionism and pastiche.
I’m not sure if adding nuance is the way to redeem settings built on this gimmick: that would make them alike to more developed settings like 3.5 era Forgotten Realms or Hârn or Kalamar. The Stone soup 🥣/kitchen sink identity would be lost, at which point the value in the original might be disproven as well.
I think the better course of action is to recruit authors and artists that represent the cultures and mythologies being pastiched to do the pastiche-big, which avoids accusations of orientalism or some extent. Add in an editorial team that’s excited to use a pastiche setting as a vehicle for a lot of “diversity” within easy reach of play. (It’s all well and good to have a well researched Africa-alike attached to a setting, but if it never sees play because it’s too far removed, at a certain point there’s a free-falling-in-the-forest conundrum.
I could be convinced to do a follow up video talking about possible ways forward for something like Mystara but I would need some panelists from the representative groups to do it in good faith according to modern sensibilities.
@@The_CGA I don't think adding nuance, or revising the old settings for sensitivity is the way to go. Leave that old stuff there as a product of its time, and work on new things that contain original ideas, rather than evaluating how to tastefully reskin a real world culture.
Edit -> Even if we apply a modern sensitivity to these cultures, those sensitivity will continue to evolve, and what we identify as tasteful and unproblematic today might be unacceptable 50 years from now.
I once used Codex Seraphinianus, and the absurd images there as the basis for "odd" cultures in a campaign i was running. It tended to add a layer of humor to things, so I'm more likely to try to describe things in such a way that culture and ethnicity aren't concretely defined, so players are free to imagine whatever works for them.
The Atruaghin Gazetteer wasn't particularly good. It was a rush job and you can see that a mile away. Thankfully, an associate of mine, Mr. Welch, DID revise the Atruaghin Gazetteer, and it's pretty good. I can link it if you'd like?
Here's the deal : as a kid in the 80's, I loved the Gazetteer series.
Ylaruam was a beautiful and well presented "Arabian Nights" setting , with a Mohammed type character (Al-Kalim) presented as the prophet whom unites his people and helps to give structure to their society. As a player, I get tired of the same tired Western European settings and having different cultures and societies is something players should be encouraged to explore.
For example, in Ylaruam mages are discouraged and Clerics run the show -- so your typical murder hobo might suddenly have some trouble tossing fireballs around when the enforcers of the Faith show up to keep the peace...meanwhile, the Principalities of Glantri are a Magiocracy where being a Cleric is an automatic death penalty, and make no mistake those two nations are absolutely at odds with each other. Things like that lend some interesting interplay and metaplot.
I have to say I can't stand this accusation of "Orientalism" , as if wanting to explore and understand other cultures thru gaming is somehow 'offensive' -- in your own broadcast you noted later the desire to see less "Eurocentric" settings. Well "Europe" is a big continent. You can have Russian steppe nomads, moorish Spain, Vikings, Tectonic Knights, Turkish strongholds, Huns, Scythians, Mercantile city states and pirate empires (gee, not unlike the Known World!) My point being that it can be beneficial to explore and look at other civilizations thru the game rather than just presenting everything as Western Europe.
I play a ~lot~ ( and I do mean a lot) of Crusader Kings 2, and one thing that game presents is how society and culture come about from the interplay of different peoples in a melting pot. (This guy might come from steppe nomads but his wife prays to the blood tree, and the neighboring king will give me a pile of gold of I let him build a temple but my brother now claims he has a new faith from his recent pilgrimage.)..all these elements blending into a new society and culture, etc is an important aspect of that game, it should be part of D&D as well.
People like you are what's ruining this hobby. Claiming that fantasy cultures represent real cultures is racist, but I'm guessing that's completely escaped you.
Immortals are not weaker than Gods. Ao props up the Gods, immortals on their home plane are way stronger than even greater gods. Also Blackmoor belongs to Mystara. Sorry dude.
Blackmoor, the home campaign of Dave Arneson’s Braunstein early 70s wargame (the apocryphal “chai mail days”) is syncretized in latter-day Mystara materials to be part of the world’s Protohistory, but the two have an entirely different Genesis. Here’s some “citation”: www.blackgate.com/2015/02/07/the-known-world-dd-setting-a-secret-history/
As for immortals the assertion is not that they are “weaker,” but that they are more distant, and their personality and distinct characteristics do not figure prominently in the world’s unfolding tale. Consider this especially vs. the likes of Mystra, Shar, and Selune in Forgotten realms. Does anybody know or care what the names of the immortals are in the known world? Are there visible churches ⛪️? Are the schemes of gods/immortals driving events in the meta plot or do the gods merely react to it (like the rescue of alphatia?)
Sorry dude
Blackmoor was its own thing but later retconned into Mystara and Greyhawk actually.
The lies spread by people trying to look important on the internet...
Greyhawk, Second Printing July 1975
Blackmoor, Second Printing July 1976
oh look, BOTH settings came out *BEFORE* Holmes edition which came out in 1977, or Moldvay/Cook which came out in 1980.
GAZ1 "The Grand Duchy of Karameikos" published 1987.
*Dawn of the Emperors - Thyatis and Alphatia* Boxed set released 1989 just as AD&D 2nd edition came out.
Bloodstone Pass published in 1985, Bloodstone Wars in 1987 along with its setting boxed set Forgotten Realms, even predates Mystara.
Doesn't matter if this troll is talking about DragonLance or anything else, they fail to do any research, and just spread misinformation about everything, while making clickbait titles to their video for clout chasing.
When people make a video for UA-cam, don't trust them to have done any research. Anyone can buy a book on eBay and claim they have had it for 30 years, and give all sorts of misinformation for clout. Always do your own research so you arent spreading lies made by clout chasers.
Maybe if you watched the video, *idiot* you would know “first official” is the claim, it was a joke, the Known World Map was in B/X, and the archaeology around the Known World as an entity goes back to 1976 and is basically contemporaneous with Blackmoor in its inception. In print the isle of dread module and even palace of the silver princess have place-names that would eventually become part of Mystara. . Also, It was a joke made by way of splitting hairs between Basic D&D and Advanced. “This video is not a history lesson” but I’ll give you one if you like
First, the dates of publication you give for greyhawk and Blackmoor are for the white box booklets. The greyhawk booklet has zero setting content. It’s just what might be called a “zine” in today’s language. A lot of prototype rules that would get rolled into AD&D.
The original ideas of greyhawk come from the Great kingdom map, which was in a newsletter of a pre-D&D Wargaming group Gygax and Arenson belonged to. However it was not until the publication of greyhawk adventures much later that the setting was rolled out as a schema or venue for play.
The known world project dates to 1974, created by Schick and moldvay. With moldvay basic the authors requested to bundle the campaign as a prototype or schema, a request that was granted. The expert set map 🗺 sets the founding date in this chronology, and it is considerably more “bundled” and “official” to Basic D&D than Greyhawk was in a similar period. The development of the setting precedes the gazeteers in adventure modules, the isle of Dread being the most notable.
I’ve owned the Poor Wizards Almanac since it was in the Waldenbooks bin in whatever year of the 90s that was.
Since you’ve made it so personal and gotten so many things wrong, I’m going to make a video demonstrating my research, which clearly you haven’t done much of (given the Greyhawk citation which is specious)
LOL... You keep using that word, I do not think it means what you think it means...
Sorry, comments are not time stamped...nobody knows what you’re talking about since you didn’t tell us...so whatever clever j’accuse you intend will be lost upon whatever future audiences you wish to share the laughter with
You gotta stop smacking your lips so much man
Maybe I’ll move away from the mic to breathe in