Azor Ahai explained - livestream
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- Опубліковано 12 вер 2024
- In Deep Geek - Insight and intelligent discussion on Lord of the Rings, Game of Thrones, Westworld and more.
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I'm so sorry I missed this experience. I was out later than intended celebrating my 21st bday!!! What I intended to request was an explanation of the difference between the last hero and azor ahai... I've heard/seen a few different options/takes but would be very interested to hear how you might take it..(on my bday please...😘😘😘😘)
Great stream and topic. It's amazing how little is provided about this prophecy but so many characters think they know the answer
Thanks Robert! A very enjoyable stream!
Just after finishing this one at work, so thank you for entertaining through my shifts.
Hi! It’s the bloodline that magic is attached to and that continues. STARK is a bloodline not just a name. If Sansa has a child, that child will carry her bloodline. The blood of stark. As Jon is also Stark because of the blood of Leanna. Ned said to him “you have my blood. You are a stark”. Same for Sansa’s potential progeny. He is also blood of a dragon because of his father. So carries the magical ancestry combo of two bloodlines.
Oh man I love your videos your voice is so smooth and the content is great 🤓 thanks
The reason there are flood stories is because civilization grew up near rivers and rivers flood. It's not necessarily a story travelling, but a common experience leading to similar stories.
You can't know for certain what happened thousands years ago...
@@constantinetranos2225 No, but it's far more likely that similar, fairly common events happened at different times and places than there being one huge worldwide event. People simply aren't that different. We know civilizations grew up near rivers and annual flooding due to snow melting in the mountains is a regular occurrence. In fact, it's necessary for farming as it replenishes the soil. However, we also know some years can have much worse flooding than others.
It's only natural that cultures where flooding is a huge part of their lives would develop myths and legends surrounding them.
We need some “When in doubt, blame blood raven” merch. I’d spend all the money on it 😊
Robert! Did Howland Reed warg Arthur Dayne at ToJ? i can’t imagine Ned actually defeating all three kingsguard without magic from Howland or someone else.
Dayne allowed Ned to kill him.
@@Jennifer-di4nl but why?
@@stoffelstrange5215 Watch In Deep Geek Tower of Joy videos. It explains all.
I couldn’t stay for the whole stream glad i was able to be there in the beginning :)
I am just the absolute worst for missing these
Azor Ahai being a monomyth: on the one hand, the maesters want to push this idea, but we've seen that the maesters are often wrong. On the other hand GRRM in his writing seems to be pointing to several different characters that COULD be "Azor Ahai Reborn" so maybe there were also several different people in the past that filled that Azor Ahai role in their various countries / cultures.
Is a savior myth! I think there were two major ice ages. Once the White Walkers appear and the other where they attack.
Most interesting 🔥🐉
I think GRRM creates several possible AZOR ahai, but Jon is the son of Rhaegar, who was obsessed with that prophecy, a war occurs, the Targaryen dynasty is over, so that the R + L = J Bloodraven is behind Jon. for complying with Ice / Fire. Dany is also important, they are the 2 who fulfill that role. GRRM creates false leads, but Jon / Dany is the key. Dany is Nissa Nissa at the end.
If Bran is the Last Hero is Hodor the Horse, Jojen the dog and Meera the Sword that shatters?
Brilliant as usual
In Deep!!!
I always preferred the idea that Sansa marries the Hound and lives a peasant life
Nah; I don't think she'll be queen or lady of Winterfell. But I do think she'll battle Jon Resurrected for control of Winterfell.
"When Bran comes into his powers"
And my mind instantly goes to:
"Bran has got his hat on, hip hip hip hooray."
A thought or theory I have just come up with watching this video (but I'm probably not the first to have this idea):
Two extreme forces in the world:
- ICE -> white walkers
- FIRE -> dragons
-> both can destroy the world
-> Azor Ahai is the character to (re-)establish the balance between these two forces
Azor Ahai: both ice and fire -> Jon Snow
One part of the story: Jon has to kill the night king and his army to fight back ICE (with the help of Danys dragons: FIRE)
The other part of the story: Jon has to kill Dany to prevent further damage caused by her dragon(s) to fight FIRE (Maybe with one part of the Sword Ice -> ICE; or with the sword Dawn which is "pale as milkglass"-> ICE)
---> Jon as Azor Ahai might have to use ICE to fight FIRE and FIRE to fight ICE
Maybe Jon killing Dany happens before Jon fighting the whites to forge Lightbringer
Jon Snow is NOT a Targaryen! He is Stark and Dayne!.
it's so funny to me cause Azor is the most common name for dogs in Poland
Ghost is the Prince who was Promised: Confirmed
Love ya bobbie!!
How long?
I always miss the livestreams! My question is how does the Azor Azhai prophecy connect with the children of the forest? If they created the Others, who would have decided to create their antagonist Azoor azhai?? Especially considering he exists in so many different cultures. How far does the actions of the children of the forest impact across Planetos? Maybe he is multiple individuals that have been combined over the ages?
Azor Ahai is Coldhands!
39:16 The Great Flood myth is quite easy to understand in some respects. For most of human history our settlements have been on or at least very near water, usually navigable water, since before major road construction the best ways of moving about were either on foot or by some form of boat. If you live by any major body of water for long enough and you will get flooded, mostly small annoying floods, but sooner or later you will have at least one major flood, a flood so big you tell the story again and again throughout your tribal history.
Overtime as more and more tribes band together to form early nations or trading further afield, they share their stories, and those stories begin to merge, especially when they sound like the same event just seen from different places. Without a firm fixed record of when and where each flood happened, it's very easy to connect all the individual floods into one massive flood that happened everywhere, simply because almost everyone you speak to has heard of a 'great' flood. Add in the finding of fossilised remains of sea creatures even on mountain tops (thanks to tectonic uplift), it becomes very believable.
Of course that's not to say all great myths are necessarily wrong. There have always been massive events affecting huge areas, for example here in Northern Europe you have the flooding of Doggerland which now lies under the North Sea, which some theories suggest could have happened in as little as two years (at least the final flood). Doggerland slid beneath the waves many thousands of years ago in the stone age, probably pre-settlement, but no doubt would have been remembered by any survivors who fled to Britain and the Northern European countries, all of whom would have been suffering because of the rising sea levels (and several major tsunamis thanks to the Storegga Slides).
Legends exist and grow because they contain a grain of truth, something that makes them believable. Sometimes that truth is merely a grain, other times it's a massive great boulder...
Look into the Comet Research Group. There is a large body of physical impact evidence that indicates that a series of comets hit earth ~11-12k years ago, directly impacting and flash-melting the 2-mile thick polar ice cap, raising sea level nearly 400 feet in the span of days. Anyone living anywhere near the coast would have been obliterated, and it also explains much of the geography of northern North America, as well as the mass-extinction of most large mammals in North America ~11,600 years ago, which was previously blamed on human expansion. There are multiple physical lines of evidence, from evaluations of ice-cores indicating massive temperature spikes at the time of impact, impact-generated ejecta in a multiple-thousand-mile-radius from the impact area, a newly discovered impact crater in greenland which matches the proposed impact location, whole herds of dead mammoths whose legs were simultaneously snapped with no other sign of injury or predation, apparently from the initial impact shockwave....etc. There's a lot.
There's now dozens of peer reviewed, published scientific articles on the subject. It seems likely that there WAS actually a disastrous worldwide flood and it actually did pretty much reset human civilization, destroying all coastal-based cultures in the blink of an eye. There's a reason why so many cultures have a flood story...
Love your stuff as always, also can’t wait for that Witcher video!!!
You're my hero
I enjoyed the I Am Legend movie, but it sounds quite different than the book you described. The monsters in the movie are more zombie-like and were created in the modern day by a vaccine gone wrong.
Another movie that explores the idea of "Are the humans or monsters really the good guys?" is The Girl With All the Gifts.
Azor Ahai is not a person…he is the union between Jon,Dany,Tyrion,Jamie,Arya….only united as one they can defeat the Others .Azor Ahai = abstract concept of one army
Hey deep geek. Why hasn't anyone looked into arias warging abilities? She can wolf dreams from bravos. That's kinda far. Also she KNEW that she couldn't eat her mother's corpse when she pulled it from.the river. Bran doesn't know that. Kinda doubt John knows that. She is a powerful warg and I expect a teacher may arrive befor.long. what do u think of my pitch. Please make a video.
But how do we know that the Others want to come south of the wall?
I believe in the "Ser Cold heart" theory, the one where Melisandre will try to resurrect Stannis by sacrificing his daughter and will also burn Jon's body , a sortha burial and resurrection ceremony, I instead of Stannis it would Jon resurrected (duh) , but the twist is, his time in Ghost changed him , I believe Bran would try to reach out to Jon and see he's already warged into Ghost, I believe Bran would try to keep Jon in check, keep his humanity by showing him that Rickon is fine , but he to his surprise , he'll also show him Arya and Sansa , healthy and alive,I believe Bran would have tried to keep his humanity in check, to force him to remember who he is but instead it backfired.
I believe Jon would be colder and angrier cuz of what Bran showed him in his time in Ghost, I believe Bran would have shown him what their siblings were up to and what they went through all these years , I believe Jon would be afraid that the people who almost destroyed his family might do so again, now that he knows they're alive, perhaps his fear would drive him to becoming more brutal towards his enemies, I believe Jon would capture Roose Bolton and feed him to the wilding corpses (that I hope would turn to wights soon) mirroring the brutality of the Night king of legend , I believe he'll go on to brutally murder every one of the Bolton's banner men , keeping the north in check until one of his siblings takes over , I believe his infamy would rise throughout westoros , making him the boogie man of the north.
Side theory: I think the magical horn that Binds Dragons might instead drive them mad, and when it's used things would take a dark turn for the iron fleet , we might see Rhagel and Viserion been driven to westoros , one might go to the North and another to the south, Rhagel to Jon and Viserion to Young Griff, giving both of them more credence to their cause.
Very interesting! Mel's reaction when Stannis burns and JON raises from the cairn would be incredible... If Jon goes feral would Sansa's presence be able to calm him? We get hints she might calm violence, but there hasn't been a payoff.
Something I just thought of: With the prophecy of Azor Ahai coming from Asshi (spelling?) and considering the very odd surroundings and condition of that city, could it be possible that humanity used great magics to create or empower Azor Ahai (or possibly a small team of heroes, hence the different names?) by sacrificing the entirety of the largest city seemingly ever built? If it took hundreds or thousands of sacrifices to cause the long night and the empowering of the Others, perhaps a similar sacrifice was required to defeat them.
I always wondered why GRRM had Melisandre choose Stannis. She had a vision, but she freely admits that all visions must be interpreted. Somehow she ended up with Stannis but I just can't see how. Writing-wise, I know GRRM had to choose SOMEONE for Melisandre to back but that whole situation just seems so off.
I bet he did it because he needed something special for Stannis and needed a fake-out guy he could kill at any time. Lets face it, as much as he does like to kill main chracters, he still loves to tell a story. He could never just kill Jon or Daenarys and Characters like them. They are too important to just kill. Arya as well, his wife seems to prevent her death XD.
Stannis is the worst possible person to place on a throne, thst isn't insane. Joffrey and Ramsay might be way worse, but those are psychopaths. Stannis, is a great warrior and even better general. But he is so stubborn and so absolutely uncharismatic, that he would never fit the role of a king. Giving that guy a mad priestess to hype him up, is kinda the only thing that makes his claim somewhat viable. Sure, Renley has the charisma, but thats it. The people like him, but they dont worship him. By giving Stannis the thing he doesn't have, in the form of a person he cant trust, makes him a more interesting character. Without her, he'd never have come that far. Without her, his claim is kinda null and void. Sure, he is the only rightful heir, but Robert also just stole that throne, so is he really? He is just the older brother, not the one qualified for the position, so should he even be king? His men might be loyal, but the bulk of his army where people who preferred Renly.
Basicly, Stannis wouldn't be able to do anything without something that makes him have a great claim and GRRM saw that as the perfect opportunity to write him as a false Azor Ahai. It is a great way to introduce the faith of R'hllor, it serves as the purpose if fleshing out the profecy and gives GRRM an opportunity to show us from a PoV perspective, how a proffercies misinterpretation guides the action of very powerful people, leading to tragedy. Also, he disliked the Idea of Aragorn in lord of the Rings, so making Stannis a fake Aragorn with a fake Anduril (the flame of the west) fits that critique. Aragorns only claim was being the rightful heir, his only proof is people knowing that and his only sign is a reforged sword. What if everyone was wrong? What annoyed GRRM about him was that we are supposed to accept that he rules well, but dont get a single reason why he would be a good king (something I heavily disagree with by the way). Giving Stannis this role, the role of a "rightful king", who is seemingly profecised by the gods, weilding a magic weapon, but with absolutely no actual qualifications for being such a king, is his way of showing us this.
❤
dang robert this is such a good stream, mate. what if “dragonsteel” or valyrian steel requires valyrian blood? could this be how jon will kill dany and possibly create a new valyrian steel sword to kill some Others?
Imma copy a comment from another video so apologies for the length (I agree with you btw)
This is something I've also speculated on. So the sword Lightbringer by Azor Ahai in one tale is speculated to be dragonsteel or aka Valyrian steel, and was made via plunging it into the chest of the wife who he greatly loved. What if Valyrian steel is made with unknown magic spells and a special ore (it does have a different coloration to regular steel but I have no real evidence for this besides my own speculation) or forging process that involves dragon fire and human sacrifice (probably a loved one of the smith)? For the special ore part I'd imagine something from the mines under the Fourteen Flames (because they mined substances like gold and silver under there, so why not some special metal, as Valyrian steel is inspired by Damascus real name wootz steel which was not found naturally outside of India I believe). So then maybe dragons melted it down with their flame breath and then magic was done on it somehow via lost practices (it's said spells were worked into the metal somehow) and for the final part the smith or maker of the sword had to kill someone they loved with it to make it compete? We know in this world death pays for great magical things, so maybe the fire in Valyrian steel is a human soul like in the one Azor Ahai tale. So a Valyrian steel sword was really rare and expensive and not something mass produced (at least that we know of) because it had to be someone special to the smith they had to to kill (or maybe it just was expensive to non-Valyrians because discrimination and they loved wealth and gold). Thus Valyrian steel swords are essentially a blade of pure fire: fire from the volcanic-only ore, fire from the dragon fire, fire from the spells, and the fire from the life/soul of the person who was sacrificed to make it. That's my whole theory on how it was made and why Valyrian steel was so rare even in the olden times when the Valyrians where still around. It being a blade of pure fire (and magic) is why I believe it could hold its own and not shatter against a White Walker's ice weapon in the TV show (which isn't canon to the books I know, but I think is a good representation of the magic in it even if that doesn't happen in the books) in the fight between Jon Snow using Longclaw against one of those high ranking White Walkers at Hardhome.
Maybe House Targaryen did know how to make Valyrian steel, given their House motto seems too grand for what was deemed a lesser house amongst the dragonlords of Old Valyria (then again maybe the other dragonlords had longer or different house names, but we'll never know). Maybe they knew how to make it, but the sacrifice of their family (and probable mates because inbreeding) was too much for them so they swore it off and became lesser in status, though you'd think they'd remember how to make it? Maybe their House motto was switched to a basic formula of how to make Valyrian steel and eventually they just kinda forgot (haha see what I did there) about the Valyrian steel and just focused on their family pre and post Doom.
Anyways that's my whole nonsensical theory based on nothing more than anecdotal stories and speculation, thanks for coming to my TED talk.
EDIT: I also don't have an explanation for Valyrian steel armor like the one Euron has in the books or the Valyrian links in the chains of the maesters or the rods some have, maybe they melted down swords just because they could and it would look cool in another form and maybe practical in the case of Euron's armor.
What if Jaime is azura hai when he kills cersei??
It's Theon Greyjoy and nobody can tell me different
Azor Ahai is Frodo Baggins.
1:03:00
"Question frrrrrrrrrrom...."
0:00:00 all was black until you wake up tied to a chair and a man explains to you the esoteric end times prophecy of a fantasy tale
Is he a ham?
That the problem with George. Any really useful information he offers is always incomplete or vague.
He is struggling and it’s apparent.
IDG !!!
:D
I always enjoy your videos, but I always disagree with you. Irl flood myths don't descend from one event. They are common because *flooding* is common. Which, personally, the idea that all the azor ahai figures are a response to a commonly occurring event is more interesting than the idea that they responded to one event.
Also personally I hate the Dany being fridged by Jon theory. It's boring, misogynistic storytelling and, frankly, I feel it's below GRRMs skill level. There are hints that it might happen, but I think they're red herrings. The character arcs and lives of women do not exist just to enable a man (especially one that loves them) to take their achievements and go save the world. I'm so tired of seeing heroines being sacrificed for the advancement of the heroes story.
@Insignatious idk if you're referring to the first part of my comment or the second, but the first part is bc my education is in anthropology so that's just where my brain goes. And if it's the second part like...I think it's pretty clear that that's an opinion. Like you can disagree with me but ultimately we're both interpreting someone else's work. And like...even if grrm DOES fridge Dany I'm still free to not like that conclusion.
T,l am