Please consider doing some work on which TV's are best for use with a gaming PC. For example TVs with real 10bit panels and not 8 with frc, what settings to use in the PC with nvidia colour modes RGB, 444, 422 etc and if any TV's support adaptive sync that is compatible with gsync or any smart tvs with display ports. There is such a lack of info out there. Thanks for your great content.
Thanks for the review, I am thinking of upgrading from my X700 as well after getting a QN90B since Sony doesn't process HDR10+. With most 4k movies with Dolby Vision only, I think the HDR Optimizer could be very valuable with a Samsung display.
Just revisiting this excellent video after playing with the settings on my LG CX and the UB820. It's true that the Panasonic optimizer even now in 2021 has better handling of tone mapping on HDR10 than the LG CX in my experience. I turned off the dynamic tone mapping on the CX and enabled the optimizer on the UB820 and got fantastic results. Thanks Vincent for an excellent video.
I love the optimizer, and i am using cinema home hdr pre-set on my cx, but i find it looks better with dynamic tone mapping on, on my cx, when i disable it, the whole scene darkens, or is that how it should be ?
The colors are dull and washed out when I turn the HDR on . Why is this happening ? Panasonic DP-UB420 connected to a Philips 436M6 hdr monitor . Can someone please help me ?
Thanks so much for this video! I have an Optoma projector and a Sony X700 player and had been contemplating on buying the 420 or 820 only because of the optimizer. You saved me a few headaches by indicating that those options for projectors are only on the 9000.
This is why I subscribe to this guy 12:15, look at the difference in the flames. I was about to buy a Sony UBP 700 yesterday as I have a Sony AG8 tv and StrDn 1080 receiver only to switch last minute to the Panasonic DP-UB820EBK. I can't wait for it to come now.
Thanks for another informative video, Vincent! The auto dynamic tonemapping done by the player is indeed awesome, it's really amazing how it manages to analyze the picture and tonemap only what needs to be tonemapped from each frame without touching the overall APL. Panasonic strikes again! Now comes the million dollar question: will we see this killer feature within the Panasonic OLED's menu? I'm mainly interested in the 2019 range but I'm sure others will like to know if previous models may receive a software update including this feature.
A brilliant explanation of how the Panasonic works and the benefits of tweaking settings on both the TV and the player to get the best experience Please keep posting, very informative
This video is 4 years old, but now OLED TV's (MLA and QD OLED) have higher than 1k peak brightness. Mine in particular has around 1200-1250, so I'm not sure what TV type to choose on the player settings, since OLED will cap it to 1000, and super high luminance LCD is 1500 which is too high and causes clipping. I wish the setting would just let me manually put a nit value in.
In your situation there is little requirement to use this feature, as this feature was created by Panasonic to bring the brightest imagery in cinema into ranges that TVs/Projectors can actually project. A. There isn't much content in cinema that exceeds 1000 nits. B. Your TV is able to display above 1000 nits imagery. This feature is most useful for TVs and Projectors that have low peak brightness. The lower, the more useful/practical this feature.
Another question: Does this function do anything on Panasonic OLEDs? Theoretically player and TV should apply Panasonic tonemapping and there shouldn‘t be a difference, right?
Great video, thanks. Question: if you enable HDR Optimiser will it remain on at all times, even when changing disc? Or do I need to enable it each time I watch a disc?
I saw a few people ask whether to use the HDR Optimiser along with the TV's HDR Dynamic Tone Mapping and from my experience with a LG C9 the answer is yes. Took the time to test using Fury Road with the Dynamic Tone Mapping on/off and on scenes that have brightness that exceeded the OLED limit (1000 nits), the Optimiser reigned it in to the 1000 nits and brought out more details in those bright areas. It did not affect the rest of the tones whether the rest of the scene was bright or dark. With the Optimiser off, the Dynamic Tone Mapping would darken the entire scene including the shadows to try and achieve this and still not bring as much detail as the Optimiser in the bright area. However with the Optimiser on bring the brights to the set limit (1000 nits in my case) and the Dynamic Tone Mapping set to on, it will map the rest of the scene, lightening as needed giving a brighter picture with more shadow detail since it reads that the scene is within the 1000 nits (so no darkening needed for the highlights) and it does a good job doing so IMO. I am using the UB-820. A great player because of this feature IMO. HTH and a BIG thank you for this video. Really helped me get the most out of my setup.
I also have both the Dynamic Tone Mapping function on my C9 and my Panasonic 820's Optimizer set to "On". However, I have set it to Super High Luminance. This is due to the fact that I think the LG C9's tone mapping is very good and can tone map up to 1500 nits and sometimes higher. Sadly, the Panasonic's Optimizer is limited to 1500. I would love for them to update it so we can set it to as close to what the TV set can do as possible. I think the C9 is capable of tone mapping close to 2,000 nits.
@@PUsokrJosh305 that hasn't been my experience. C9 tone mapping does very well at giving a bright overall image, not so when it has to deal with brights above its nit limit. It tends to dim the entire scene. If you are setting the 820 to 1500 nits, then there really is no benefit to have the optimizer on. The C9 tone mapping will be doing all the work. Should look no different if you switch the optimizer off.
@@marcevans6913: I would take a look at it again. The Optimizer is still doing work, even set at 1500 nits. Just because the OLED setting is at 1,000 nits doesn’t mean that the LG C9 can tone map above that. In fact, I find it tone mapping really well up till you get between 1,500-2,000 nits. Look at The Shining for example. When I set the Optimizer to 1,000 nits, I feel like the movie is overall too bright, especially for the Shining. But when I set it to 1,500 nits, the movie seems to look much better and much more like it should. Same thing with Harry Potter. The 5th movie has a battle between Voldemort and Dumbledore. When I set the optimizer to OLED (1,000 nits), the spells seem to have gradiation of color that seems very uneven. But, when set to Super High Luminance (1,500), the spells seem more smoothed out and much more even. Now for Disney films, you won’t see any change no matter if you set it at 1,000 nits or 1,500 because the movies are graded at or below 1,000 nits. Meaning, the TV does all of the work.
@@PUsokrJosh305 the shinning has Dolby vision though, so the optimizer wouldn't have any effect unless you disabled Dolby vision on the 820. I'll give the 1500 nits a try, to see Iif I see a difference and if I do, if I like it.
@@marcevans6913: Yeah, I have Dolby Vision disabled, which allows me to look at The Shining in HDR with the Optimizer. Again, if you have HP 5 on 4K, that scene is a great one to look at the difference between 1,000 nits and 1,500 nits. The Max LL is at 1,135 nits on HP 5. I just feel as though the center "core" of the spells that Voldemort and Dumbledore are casting are way too blown out of proportion when set to 1,000 nits (OLED) vs. 1,500 nits.
Hello Vincent, Thanks for the excellent video. How do you compare the Panasonic ub9000 to the Magnetar 900 and Reavon 200 in 2023? Thans in advance for your input !
Cool video. I own the sony x950g. I believe the peak luminance of my tv is about 1250 nits. Should I set the player's "TV Type" setting to "Medium to High Luminance (1000 nits)" or "Super High Luminance (1500 nits)"?
I love your videos! I have a Calman Calibrated LG C9 and the UB820, should I be using HDR Optimiser on top of Dynamic Tone Mapping (included in the calibration)?
I would be interessted in some recommended settings with this player combined with LG OLED CX or C1. What must be turned off in the TV to not work against the player features? Thanks!
So is it recommended to use the dynamic tone mapping setting on an OLED with the Panasonic hdr optimizer on or turn off the setting on the tv and just let the Panasonic take care of the mapping?
Finally Vincent. Goin' up next level. I dont think so Lg was good panel choice to show the real magic. Would love to see GZ 2000 plus silver cable from Audio Quest plus UB9000 and then go straight to year 3000. Oppo cant match up Panasonic ,light years dfference,, We all learnin 'at the end.Have a good day everyone.
Thank you for this very interesting video. Would you recommend to activate the Tone mapping option on a LG C9 when watching TV or Netflix directly from the TV (it is clear that it must be disabled when watching bluray with the UB9000 or UB820). Thanks for your help !
Thank you so much for this video.I have a 77 inch Sony a80j and just got the panny 820 yesterday.I think following your guidance here will give me a great viewing experience with my 4k uhd movies.Appreciate your videos and I just subscribed.
Excellent (and fun) explanation of a, indeed, killer feature. Actually, as the owner of an Epson EH-TW9300W, this was the final nudge I needed to buy this player. Cheers! :^)
If I have a TV capable of a peak brightness of close to 3,000 nuts would it make any sense to cap the peak brightness to 1500 in this case for the ultra high luminance panel? I think it would be better just to turn this feature off. or just get a player that costs less because it doesn't have this feature? like I have the Vizio p series quantum x which at least advertises a peak brightness of 3,000 nits
How does this feature work with the LG C7 active HDR? It’s my understanding that the C7 active HDR was a different approach than the current dynamic tone mapping found on the C8/C9. Would it be best to use both the hdr optimizer on the player and the active hdr setting on the C7?
Hello, one more question about video projectors and HDR optimizer please : is the “basic luminance lcd” option on the ub 820 (500 nits) is that much different from the “Basic luminance projector” (350 nits) on the 9000 ? Or will it be very subtle? Thanks again for your work and for your answer.
@@blurayffan66 If I may ask.. I just bought the Samsung Q900R 8k TV and am looking at the DP-UB820.. what is the downside of it from the UB9000? I don't know the difference.. also the 8k has peak brightness of 3k Nits
Very helpful Vincent. Great video. One comment - I found the youtube picture quality less brighter and slightly less enjoyable than other typical videos you've done. I dont know whether thats a function of your Blacklight camera trial. Pete
I have the UB820 and the LG C3 and I have no idea if I should use the TV dynamic tone mapping or the ub820’s. Obviously I want the tv’s one on for other content but for 4k Blu-ray Discs what would actually be better?
Hi. I'm using an Epson 2250 projector (2700 lumens, 1080P resolution). When playing a 4k movie, which Panasonic (ub420) setting do you think would look better: 1. Panasonic set to 1080P output (let the Panasonic process the picture) 2. Panasonic set to 4k (4:4:4) output (the Epson would have to downconvert the 4k to 1080P). I would think the first option looks the best.
I have a Samsung Q80r. It's rated for 1500 nits but according to Tech Radar it does "1200 cd/m (aka nits), using a 10 per cent HDR window.". Based on this should I use the High Luminance or Super High Luminance setting?
So isn’t HDR tone mapping, simply put, a peak luminance limiter? Or is it doing other things as well? And so if you’re limiting the dynamic range of the picture, then what’s the difference between that and watching SDR? Even though SDR is supposed to be capped at 100 nits. Everything I watch seems to be brighter overall than any 4K disc I put in even with tone mapping on the brightest setting. (I have the UB 9000 and the Epson 5050UB on a 135” 16:9 screen at 12 foot throw distance) HTPC is very bright. PS5, PS4 and PS3 are very bright. Apple TV is very bright. Regular Blu-rays are all very bright. It just seems like all the settings are taking an HDR image and turning it into an SDR image by limiting the peak brightness and then turning up the overall image brightness with the optimizer level, effectively compressing the entire dynamic range back down to SDR. Am I crazy? Maybe. But I don’t remember having any of these issues with Blu-ray. Or even more importantly, ever even thinking about it and just enjoying my Wagyu beef.
Just bought one of these players after finding this review and blu-rays definitely look fantastic (thanks)! Not sure what to choose on the HDR Optimiser though, I have a Samsung Q90T which reviews mention has a high peak brightness. Can't figure out if that would come under Middle/High Luminance or if it's bright enough to pick Super High Luminance! Anyone know? Thanks again for the great and helpful reviews.
I've only just discovered this for my player and Q90t. I find it blows out the APL and makes the whole scene much brighter. Not good imo. That's the opposite of what he describes the intent to be. Samsung is famous for juiced up aggressive tone mapping so I feel it's not playing nice. I don't see any additional highlight details. Just brighter APL and over saturated color. So far I prefer it off.
I have a Panasonic UB420 and just bought a sony x900h 75". What would you set the hdr optimizer to. I have it at its lowest setting 500nit. Ive seen that the sony can produce 730nit. Should I have it on the next setting up 1000nit? Thanks For any help.
So would this apply to a tv like the a80j? On the a80j gradation preferred is used by default for HDR. Can the Panasonic HDR optimizer be used with the gradation preferred?
Is the hdr optmiser utilized during usb playback? And also is there much difference in playback between the 3.0 and 2.0 usb ports? I have the Panasonic dp-ub420p thanks
Fantastic video. Very thorough and well-explained. I wonder, for TVs like the Sony X950H which only has player-led Dolby Vision, is the HDR optimizer on the Panasonic players the answer to get the very best DV possible out of discs? I currently have the Sony X800M2 player and I don’t think it has this type of feature.
@@losservatore2405 yep. The difference is HUGE with shadow detail on Netflix hdr programs. The built in tv apps will crush dark scene hdr really bad on Netflix. Although the Panny doesnt have Vudu.
@@losservatore2405 as a matter of fact, someone on avs had their Q9FN calibrated by Chad B a few weeks ago and he had Chad try out +5 on the dynamic range slider and Chad was very surprised with the improvement it made to the picture.
ray H jr That's great to know. I probably get this player and skip for now to buy a whole new set. I'm waiting for a much higher peak oled. The new Qled looks really nice, you think is a worth upgrade from yours?
@@losservatore2405 supposedly Panasonics top new oled has some special tech to allow higher peak brightness, curious to see what that measures at. I think the 2019 sets are probably better, and I need to keep an eye on them because I have to have warranty work done to my 75Q9, it needs a panel replacement and there's always a chance they just offer a new model or ask me to pay the difference to upgrade which in my case would only be about $1000. if they offer me to upgrade I would probably take it. newer is always better usually.
* * * I'm trying to decide between the Samsung Q70R and the Sony X950G. As per your Reviews The Sony has a "Blooming Issue" which a scene with a dark back ground and a bright object will Bloom sometime even into the Black Bars and the Samsung does not do this but instead has a "Blach Crush Issue" where where there is a dark background and a bright object there is no "Blooming" and the Black Bars stay Black but it loses some Shadow Detail. Question: are there any Setting on the Panasonic that can Help either TV with their Issues or in the Sony TV Menu (to darken the Black Bars or on the Samsung Menu to Brighten the Picture just a touch ?
Ok, so I have 75Q9FN calibrated by Maciej Koper from HDTVPolska, I see in my calibration report that measured nits on tv is 1890,5cd/m2. Super high luminance on panasonic is 1500 nits, also Q9FN has his own eotf curve which overblowns a little bit hdr. Should I be still interested in UB9000's?
Most movies don't put out more then 1000 or 1500 but if u put in sicaro that outputs 4000 and u turn optimizer on you will see it will optimize the image to 1500 whatever u tv can display and it will take away the blooming or overexposure that 4000 can produce if ur tv doesn't display
Thanks for sharing this video Vincent,i have the Panasonic UB820,do you remember the Sony DVP S735 dvd Player i really loved this dvd Player have you ever seen one before.
@HDTVTest So Vincent, you're saying the tone mapping on the Panasonic is better than LGs own tone mapping on their OLED TVs and I should turn dynamic tone mapping off on the tv and just use the hdr optimizer on the ub820 for best picture quality? Thanks.
@HDTVTest Are you sure that the picture looks more realistic? I've tried this feature myself, and I'm not convinced. If you stare into a spotlight, do you really see that much details in the light, or are you blinded (i.e. are the details blown out?)? I am worried that the HDR optimizer takes away the punch of explosions, lights etc. How would the sane content be represented on a Dolby Pulsar? What are your thoughts?
Another shout out for MadVR here and the authors future project Envy which will be a stand alone box. The Panasonic UB700 did a good job on my JVC x500 for tone mapping to SDR when it was first out. Frustratingly, Panasonic players cannot bit stream audio from network sources though. Since then I've finally setup MadVR and it does everything the UB9000 does and even more. The author is currently working on generating scene-by-scene live meta-data which is optimal for projection displays.
Love your videos!!! I especially love the wagyu beef analogy. I remember the first time I had wagyu, it was Miyazaki. After eating that, I started comparing everything to the beef. “If I don’t buy this amp, how much wagyu could I get‽” 😂
Great video Vincent. Would you think it is better to set the player to output SDR BT2020 rather than HDR BT2020 when paired with a projector like the Epson HC5040UB? I keep hearing that SDR BT2020 is better for projectors since they can’t get close to the nits needed for HDR even with the player set to low light output projectors in the settings.
I had posted this below based on my experience. Hope it helps: "I saw a few people ask whether to use the HDR Optimiser along with the TV's HDR Dynamic Tone Mapping. Took the time to test using Fury Road with the Dynamic Tone Mapping on/off and on scenes that have brightness that exceeded the OLED limit (1000 nits), the Optimiser reigned it in to the 1000 nits and brought out more details in those bright areas. It did not affect the rest of the tones whether the rest of the scene was bright or dark. With the Optimiser off, the Dynamic Tone Mapping would darken the entire scene including the shadows to try and achieve this and still not bring as much detail as the Optimiser in the bright area. However with the Optimiser on bring the brights to the set limit (1000 nits in my case) and the Dynamic Tone Mapping set to on, it will map the rest of the scene, lightening as it thinks it's needed giving a brighter picture with more shadow detail since it reads that the scene is within the 1000 nits (so no darkening needed for the highlights) and it does a good job doing so IMO. However, using this feature will likely depart from the original film maker intent. It may brighten when that was not how it was intended for instance. I am using the UB-820. A great player because of this feature IMO. HTH and a BIG thank you for this video. Really helped me get the most out of my setup."
I’ve noticed that the UB-9000 has a high luminance projector option and the UB-820 does not, is this significant for people that own an HDR projector, or will the existing settings on the 820 serve?
This doesnt work. When i turn tone mapping off on lg oled, the picture gets darker. I turn on the hdr optimizer in the Panasonic player and no difference occurs
thanks! I Must say After Hours of Testing. Oled is limited as 1000 nits and lcd to 1500 Nits thats it. So new oled gets much brighter. So with Harry potter it Looks so much better with the lg Dynamic Tone Mapping. If i use the optimierter i cant See Details Specially in bright scenes. So Strong recommondation for all with a new oled- dont use the optimizer. This is a 6 years Old Software. My 2 Cents
It sounds like it's only a killer feature for TVs with less than ideal tone mapping. Because in reality the TV itself should be able to do all of this and even better since it knows the exact limits of itself and you don't end up double tone mapping.
Hi Vincent, I have a Sony AF9 and the Panasonic UB820. You can't turn off the tone mapping of the AF9. Should I use the Panasonic HDR Optimiser on top or should I just stay with the Sony tone mapping?
Is the HDR Optimizer on the 9000 better or different in any way from the UB820? As far as I can tell the 9000 is better for audio but is just as good as the 820 for picture quality
It's 2022 when I write this and wish you could have done a video about the DP-Ub820 going in depth about its features as you have done here, is the HDR optimizer, exactly the same on all three $K DVD players?
I'm looking to get a new 4k player. I'm using a UBD 8500 Samsung player . I want to get the ub 9000. Should I wait for new stuff to come out or get the ub 9000 ? I have LG Cx 65" with LG SN11RG
So if i have a 4k projector with 2400 ansi lumen, how many nits is that and what setting do i choose on the panasonic for the correct hdr optimiser setting?
Great video! We have the Panasonic UB820 and a Sony A9F Master series TV. Would you recommend using the HDR Optimiser on the UB820 with this combo of TV/Player? As far as I can tell you can't seem to turn off tone mapping on the A9F? Thanks!
Yes you are suppose to turn off the dynamic tone mapping on TV in order use the HDR optimizer however it only works with HDR 10 content. The HDR Optimizer will not work with HDR 10 Plus Or Dolby Vision. The HDR Optimizer is just a feature used for tone mapping HDR 10 to enhance the HDR.
Can you just reduce the contrast on your TV to get the same results? On my Z9D, Brightness and Contrast are Automatically set to 100% for HDR. I dropped it down to 90% and I get more detail.
Reducing the TV's [Brightness] and [Contrast] will also lower the overall brightness, as well as darken the shadow detail and midtones, which is not advisable.
Why is the LG not picking up Dolby Vision playback when the disc is started? It goes to regular HDR? I've had this problem, when I load Netflix on the panasonic the LG automatically changes to Dolby Vision HDR yet I play Bladerunner 2049 and LG reckons it's playing back in standard HDR
I doubt you'll have time to answer this, but is the HDR Optimizer still useful for 2021 TVs? I just bought an A80J and find it hard to believe that the chip in Panasonic's 2018 / 2019 Blu-ray players would be better at frame-by-frame optimizations than the chip in a 2021 flagship OLED...
The Panasonic HDR Optimizer is still the best solution for tone-mapping HDR10 content because it preserves specular highlight detail while APL remains largely unaffected. However, the Sony A80J and A90J tone-mapping implementation is undefeatable, so you would get undesirable double tone-mapping with the HDR Optimizer engaged. Therefore the HDR Optimizer will work best on OLED displays where tone-mapping can be turned off completely.
They really need to start getting some standards for HDR content, it really is hit or miss for me; and pretty complicated to get it exactly the way I like it to look.
Note: [HDR Optimiser] can only be applied to HDR10 & HLG content, and not to HDR10+ & Dolby Vision discs which already benefit from dynamic metadata.
HDTVTest
And Oppo udp 203 vs Panasonic UB9000 ??
Please consider doing some work on which TV's are best for use with a gaming PC. For example TVs with real 10bit panels and not 8 with frc, what settings to use in the PC with nvidia colour modes RGB, 444, 422 etc and if any TV's support adaptive sync that is compatible with gsync or any smart tvs with display ports. There is such a lack of info out there. Thanks for your great content.
So the Optimiser has no effect on regular Blu ray or sd dvds? Does it have any use with a Netflix app on the UB 9000 if it is displaying 4K material?
Dy-namic meta-data
Can they update the xbox one x to do the same?
I know this is an old video but I just got myself an 820 and the difference between it and the X700 and PS5 I was using is staggering.
Thanks for the review, I am thinking of upgrading from my X700 as well after getting a QN90B since Sony doesn't process HDR10+. With most 4k movies with Dolby Vision only, I think the HDR Optimizer could be very valuable with a Samsung display.
same as well
@@dj_houdini7766 Keep in mind HDR Optimizer does not support Dolby Vision, so you will need the TV to do the tone mapping.
I recently got an 820 also and it's great.
Just revisiting this excellent video after playing with the settings on my LG CX and the UB820.
It's true that the Panasonic optimizer even now in 2021 has better handling of tone mapping on HDR10 than the LG CX in my experience. I turned off the dynamic tone mapping on the CX and enabled the optimizer on the UB820 and got fantastic results.
Thanks Vincent for an excellent video.
I love the optimizer, and i am using cinema home hdr pre-set on my cx, but i find it looks better with dynamic tone mapping on, on my cx, when i disable it, the whole scene darkens, or is that how it should be ?
Um, we love shenanigans. Please do not deprive us of such ongoings in the future.
He made his entire house into a dungeon except for the wall he films this. Sex dungeon.
Shenanigans is an underused word. I approve of it’s use here
@@reggietelly like when I was working in India, they kept saying 'no Hankey pankey' which had me in stitches.
@@Androidonator Dweeb.
Absolutely criminal that you don't have more subs and views especially on vids like this! Great job as always!
The colors are dull and washed out when I turn the HDR on . Why is this happening ? Panasonic DP-UB420 connected to a Philips 436M6 hdr monitor . Can someone please help me ?
I am playing around with this and to be honest this tone mapping looks better than DV. Will continue to play around with it.
Thanks so much for this video! I have an Optoma projector and a Sony X700 player and had been contemplating on buying the 420 or 820 only because of the optimizer. You saved me a few headaches by indicating that those options for projectors are only on the 9000.
This is why I subscribe to this guy 12:15, look at the difference in the flames. I was about to buy a Sony UBP 700 yesterday as I have a Sony AG8 tv and StrDn 1080 receiver only to switch last minute to the Panasonic DP-UB820EBK. I can't wait for it to come now.
Thanks for another informative video, Vincent!
The auto dynamic tonemapping done by the player is indeed awesome, it's really amazing how it manages to analyze the picture and tonemap only what needs to be tonemapped from each frame without touching the overall APL. Panasonic strikes again!
Now comes the million dollar question: will we see this killer feature within the Panasonic OLED's menu? I'm mainly interested in the 2019 range but I'm sure others will like to know if previous models may receive a software update including this feature.
A brilliant explanation of how the Panasonic works and the benefits of tweaking settings on both the TV and the player to get the best experience
Please keep posting, very informative
This video is 4 years old, but now OLED TV's (MLA and QD OLED) have higher than 1k peak brightness. Mine in particular has around 1200-1250, so I'm not sure what TV type to choose on the player settings, since OLED will cap it to 1000, and super high luminance LCD is 1500 which is too high and causes clipping.
I wish the setting would just let me manually put a nit value in.
In your situation there is little requirement to use this feature, as this feature was created by Panasonic to bring the brightest imagery in cinema into ranges that TVs/Projectors can actually project.
A. There isn't much content in cinema that exceeds 1000 nits.
B. Your TV is able to display above 1000 nits imagery.
This feature is most useful for TVs and Projectors that have low peak brightness. The lower, the more useful/practical this feature.
Another question:
Does this function do anything on Panasonic OLEDs? Theoretically player and TV should apply Panasonic tonemapping and there shouldn‘t be a difference, right?
This was so helpful. Ordered 820 today. Thanks for the video.
Great video, thanks. Question: if you enable HDR Optimiser will it remain on at all times, even when changing disc? Or do I need to enable it each time I watch a disc?
I saw a few people ask whether to use the HDR Optimiser along with the TV's HDR Dynamic Tone Mapping and from my experience with a LG C9 the answer is yes. Took the time to test using Fury Road with the Dynamic Tone Mapping on/off and on scenes that have brightness that exceeded the OLED limit (1000 nits), the Optimiser reigned it in to the 1000 nits and brought out more details in those bright areas. It did not affect the rest of the tones whether the rest of the scene was bright or dark. With the Optimiser off, the Dynamic Tone Mapping would darken the entire scene including the shadows to try and achieve this and still not bring as much detail as the Optimiser in the bright area. However with the Optimiser on bring the brights to the set limit (1000 nits in my case) and the Dynamic Tone Mapping set to on, it will map the rest of the scene, lightening as needed giving a brighter picture with more shadow detail since it reads that the scene is within the 1000 nits (so no darkening needed for the highlights) and it does a good job doing so IMO.
I am using the UB-820. A great player because of this feature IMO.
HTH and a BIG thank you for this video. Really helped me get the most out of my setup.
I also have both the Dynamic Tone Mapping function on my C9 and my Panasonic 820's Optimizer set to "On". However, I have set it to Super High Luminance. This is due to the fact that I think the LG C9's tone mapping is very good and can tone map up to 1500 nits and sometimes higher. Sadly, the Panasonic's Optimizer is limited to 1500. I would love for them to update it so we can set it to as close to what the TV set can do as possible. I think the C9 is capable of tone mapping close to 2,000 nits.
@@PUsokrJosh305 that hasn't been my experience. C9 tone mapping does very well at giving a bright overall image, not so when it has to deal with brights above its nit limit. It tends to dim the entire scene. If you are setting the 820 to 1500 nits, then there really is no benefit to have the optimizer on. The C9 tone mapping will be doing all the work. Should look no different if you switch the optimizer off.
@@marcevans6913: I would take a look at it again. The Optimizer is still doing work, even set at 1500 nits. Just because the OLED setting is at 1,000 nits doesn’t mean that the LG C9 can tone map above that. In fact, I find it tone mapping really well up till you get between 1,500-2,000 nits. Look at The Shining for example. When I set the Optimizer to 1,000 nits, I feel like the movie is overall too bright, especially for the Shining. But when I set it to 1,500 nits, the movie seems to look much better and much more like it should. Same thing with Harry Potter. The 5th movie has a battle between Voldemort and Dumbledore. When I set the optimizer to OLED (1,000 nits), the spells seem to have gradiation of color that seems very uneven. But, when set to Super High Luminance (1,500), the spells seem more smoothed out and much more even. Now for Disney films, you won’t see any change no matter if you set it at 1,000 nits or 1,500 because the movies are graded at or below 1,000 nits. Meaning, the TV does all of the work.
@@PUsokrJosh305 the shinning has Dolby vision though, so the optimizer wouldn't have any effect unless you disabled Dolby vision on the 820.
I'll give the 1500 nits a try, to see Iif I see a difference and if I do, if I like it.
@@marcevans6913: Yeah, I have Dolby Vision disabled, which allows me to look at The Shining in HDR with the Optimizer. Again, if you have HP 5 on 4K, that scene is a great one to look at the difference between 1,000 nits and 1,500 nits. The Max LL is at 1,135 nits on HP 5. I just feel as though the center "core" of the spells that Voldemort and Dumbledore are casting are way too blown out of proportion when set to 1,000 nits (OLED) vs. 1,500 nits.
I use the Optimizer on my 75q9fn, and yes there's a difference with 4000 nit content.
Nicely explained. It makes a change for a feature to just work with the press of a button without degrading something else.
Hello Vincent,
Thanks for the excellent video. How do you compare the Panasonic ub9000 to the Magnetar 900 and Reavon 200 in 2023? Thans in advance for your input !
Cool video. I own the sony x950g. I believe the peak luminance of my tv is about 1250 nits. Should I set the player's "TV Type" setting to "Medium to High Luminance (1000 nits)" or "Super High Luminance (1500 nits)"?
I love your videos! I have a Calman Calibrated LG C9 and the UB820, should I be using HDR Optimiser on top of Dynamic Tone Mapping (included in the calibration)?
I would be interessted in some recommended settings with this player combined with LG OLED CX or C1. What must be turned off in the TV to not work against the player features? Thanks!
would like to know this to.
Amazing explanation. Thank you!
Awesome, competent and straightforward demo and explanation!
Thanks so much my panasonic 820 can now feed my new LG 810 projector 500 nits and now HDR is sorted really useful information thanks Vincent:)
So is it recommended to use the dynamic tone mapping setting on an OLED with the Panasonic hdr optimizer on or turn off the setting on the tv and just let the Panasonic take care of the mapping?
Have the same dilemma
Finally Vincent. Goin' up next level. I dont think so Lg was good panel choice to show the real magic.
Would love to see GZ 2000 plus silver cable from Audio Quest plus UB9000 and then go straight to year 3000.
Oppo cant match up Panasonic ,light years dfference,,
We all learnin 'at the end.Have a good day everyone.
Thank you for this very interesting video. Would you recommend to activate the Tone mapping option on a LG C9 when watching TV or Netflix directly from the TV (it is clear that it must be disabled when watching bluray with the UB9000 or UB820). Thanks for your help !
There is soo much to learn, you are explaining well... just wonder how your demos are in person
Will the optimizer work if being passthrough a receiver like the Denon 6500? Or does it need to be wired directly to the tv.
Thank you so much for this video.I have a 77 inch Sony a80j and just got the panny 820 yesterday.I think following your guidance here will give me a great viewing experience with my 4k uhd movies.Appreciate your videos and I just subscribed.
Hi HDTVTest under HDR Display Type on the Panasonic DP-820 I have a Samsung Q90R TV which would I select for my Qled tv?
Excellent (and fun) explanation of a, indeed, killer feature. Actually, as the owner of an Epson EH-TW9300W, this was the final nudge I needed to buy this player. Cheers! :^)
Do I turn off HDR tone mapping on my LGC1 when using this player ? Since it tone maps itself
I learned a lot, this was a great video thank you!
If I have a TV capable of a peak brightness of close to 3,000 nuts
would it make any sense to cap the peak brightness to 1500 in this case for the ultra high luminance panel?
I think it would be better just to turn this feature off. or just get a player that costs less because it doesn't have this feature?
like I have the Vizio p series quantum x which at least advertises a peak brightness of 3,000 nits
Wow! This is impressive! Hopefully other manufacturers will follow process!
How does this feature work with the LG C7 active HDR? It’s my understanding that the C7 active HDR was a different approach than the current dynamic tone mapping found on the C8/C9. Would it be best to use both the hdr optimizer on the player and the active hdr setting on the C7?
Hello, one more question about video projectors and HDR optimizer please : is the “basic luminance lcd” option on the ub 820 (500 nits) is that much different from the “Basic luminance projector” (350 nits) on the 9000 ? Or will it be very subtle? Thanks again for your work and for your answer.
Looks great. I hope Panasonic returns to the US market.
afaik this Panasonic player is available from Value Electronics in the US and BestBuy (Magnolia) carries the step down 820 model.
@@blurayffan66 If I may ask.. I just bought the Samsung Q900R 8k TV and am looking at the DP-UB820.. what is the downside of it from the UB9000? I don't know the difference.. also the 8k has peak brightness of 3k Nits
@@M1H4D I don't actually own either player I am afraid so unable to answer your question.
The Panasonic 450 is available in the us
@@DawgPound86 holy necropost Batman!
Very helpful Vincent. Great video. One comment - I found the youtube picture quality less brighter and slightly less enjoyable than other typical videos you've done. I dont know whether thats a function of your Blacklight camera trial.
Pete
Thanks for your feedback... yes we were getting to grips with the Blackmagic camera.
I have the UB820 and the LG C3 and I have no idea if I should use the TV dynamic tone mapping or the ub820’s. Obviously I want the tv’s one on for other content but for 4k Blu-ray Discs what would actually be better?
Hi.
I'm using an Epson 2250 projector (2700 lumens, 1080P resolution).
When playing a 4k movie, which Panasonic (ub420) setting do you think would look better:
1. Panasonic set to 1080P output (let the Panasonic process the picture)
2. Panasonic set to 4k (4:4:4) output (the Epson would have to downconvert the 4k to 1080P).
I would think the first option looks the best.
I have a Samsung Q80r. It's rated for 1500 nits but according to Tech Radar it does "1200 cd/m (aka nits), using a 10 per cent HDR window.". Based on this should I use the High Luminance or Super High Luminance setting?
Would definitely get a Panasonic OLED and player if they still sold in the US 😩
Why don't they?
Would it have this added value when used with a JVC NP5 (RS1100) projector With JVC’s great HDR?
So isn’t HDR tone mapping, simply put, a peak luminance limiter? Or is it doing other things as well? And so if you’re limiting the dynamic range of the picture, then what’s the difference between that and watching SDR? Even though SDR is supposed to be capped at 100 nits. Everything I watch seems to be brighter overall than any 4K disc I put in even with tone mapping on the brightest setting. (I have the UB 9000 and the Epson 5050UB on a 135” 16:9 screen at 12 foot throw distance) HTPC is very bright. PS5, PS4 and PS3 are very bright. Apple TV is very bright. Regular Blu-rays are all very bright. It just seems like all the settings are taking an HDR image and turning it into an SDR image by limiting the peak brightness and then turning up the overall image brightness with the optimizer level, effectively compressing the entire dynamic range back down to SDR. Am I crazy? Maybe. But I don’t remember having any of these issues with Blu-ray. Or even more importantly, ever even thinking about it and just enjoying my Wagyu beef.
Hi there, great video. I just got an LG G3, should this setting be off or should it be set to Super High Luminance? Thx
Just bought one of these players after finding this review and blu-rays definitely look fantastic (thanks)! Not sure what to choose on the HDR Optimiser though, I have a Samsung Q90T which reviews mention has a high peak brightness. Can't figure out if that would come under Middle/High Luminance or if it's bright enough to pick Super High Luminance! Anyone know? Thanks again for the great and helpful reviews.
Super High Luminance
I've only just discovered this for my player and Q90t. I find it blows out the APL and makes the whole scene much brighter. Not good imo. That's the opposite of what he describes the intent to be. Samsung is famous for juiced up aggressive tone mapping so I feel it's not playing nice. I don't see any additional highlight details. Just brighter APL and over saturated color. So far I prefer it off.
I have a Panasonic UB420 and just bought a sony x900h 75". What would you set the hdr optimizer to. I have it at its lowest setting 500nit. Ive seen that the sony can produce 730nit. Should I have it on the next setting up 1000nit? Thanks For any help.
Wow... Thank you very much for this useful informations. You are the best !
So would this apply to a tv like the a80j? On the a80j gradation preferred is used by default for HDR. Can the Panasonic HDR optimizer be used with the gradation preferred?
Should this be set on a 2024 Lg 65” C3 OLED?
Is the hdr optmiser utilized during usb playback? And also is there much difference in playback between the 3.0 and 2.0 usb ports? I have the Panasonic dp-ub420p thanks
Fantastic video. Very thorough and well-explained. I wonder, for TVs like the Sony X950H which only has player-led Dolby Vision, is the HDR optimizer on the Panasonic players the answer to get the very best DV possible out of discs? I currently have the Sony X800M2 player and I don’t think it has this type of feature.
The Panny 4k BD players are life savers for me. I can defeat the shadow crush on my Q9FN using the Panny slider. It's a huge difference.
Can the adjustment be done from their apps? Like vudu, Amazon and Netflix?
@@losservatore2405 yep. The difference is HUGE with shadow detail on Netflix hdr programs. The built in tv apps will crush dark scene hdr really bad on Netflix. Although the Panny doesnt have Vudu.
@@losservatore2405 as a matter of fact, someone on avs had their Q9FN calibrated by Chad B a few weeks ago and he had Chad try out +5 on the dynamic range slider and Chad was very surprised with the improvement it made to the picture.
ray H jr That's great to know. I probably get this player and skip for now to buy a whole new set. I'm waiting for a much higher peak oled. The new Qled looks really nice, you think is a worth upgrade from yours?
@@losservatore2405 supposedly Panasonics top new oled has some special tech to allow higher peak brightness, curious to see what that measures at.
I think the 2019 sets are probably better, and I need to keep an eye on them because I have to have warranty work done to my 75Q9, it needs a panel replacement and there's always a chance they just offer a new model or ask me to pay the difference to upgrade which in my case would only be about $1000. if they offer me to upgrade I would probably take it. newer is always better usually.
* * * I'm trying to decide between the Samsung Q70R and the Sony X950G. As per your Reviews The Sony has a "Blooming Issue" which a scene with a dark back ground and a bright object will Bloom sometime even into the Black Bars and the Samsung does not do this but instead has a "Blach Crush Issue" where where there is a dark background and a bright object there is no "Blooming" and the Black Bars stay Black but it loses some Shadow Detail. Question: are there any Setting on the Panasonic that can Help either TV with their Issues or in the Sony TV Menu (to darken the Black Bars or on the Samsung Menu to Brighten the Picture just a touch ?
what would you recommend
sony oled or panasonic oled?
Panasonic!
@@V8RacerGT any reasons for this i've always prefered sony but never seen a panasonic oled
Panasonic Oled
@@myronhayes187 even if i prefer vibrant strong colors rather than accurate ones?
@@V8RacerGT i also hate washed out colors and thats exactly what the c8 had compared to the af8
Ok, so I have 75Q9FN calibrated by Maciej Koper from HDTVPolska, I see in my calibration report that measured nits on tv is 1890,5cd/m2. Super high luminance on panasonic is 1500 nits, also Q9FN has his own eotf curve which overblowns a little bit hdr. Should I be still interested in UB9000's?
I'd like to see some tests with this on a 1500nit display as I suspect the benefits there will be far more subtle.
Most movies don't put out more then 1000 or 1500 but if u put in sicaro that outputs 4000 and u turn optimizer on you will see it will optimize the image to 1500 whatever u tv can display and it will take away the blooming or overexposure that 4000 can produce if ur tv doesn't display
I got this player and i love it so much.
Thanks for sharing this video Vincent,i have the Panasonic UB820,do you remember the Sony DVP S735 dvd Player i really loved this dvd Player have you ever seen one before.
@HDTVTest So Vincent, you're saying the tone mapping on the Panasonic is better than LGs own tone mapping on their OLED TVs and I should turn dynamic tone mapping off on the tv and just use the hdr optimizer on the ub820 for best picture quality? Thanks.
Yes.
@@hdtvtest What about "HDR Tone Mapping" (separate from Dynamic TM) on LG Cx? Some movies look really really dark without it "on".
Hello, please post a video with the best settings in the Blu-ray player settings for the best possible picture! Thanks! (optimize)
Got to respect a man who prefers to keep his "shenanigans" on the down low.
Can you do a video on the proper use of RGY and B buttons on the remote? Thanks
@HDTVTest Are you sure that the picture looks more realistic? I've tried this feature myself, and I'm not convinced. If you stare into a spotlight, do you really see that much details in the light, or are you blinded (i.e. are the details blown out?)? I am worried that the HDR optimizer takes away the punch of explosions, lights etc. How would the sane content be represented on a Dolby Pulsar? What are your thoughts?
Another shout out for MadVR here and the authors future project Envy which will be a stand alone box. The Panasonic UB700 did a good job on my JVC x500 for tone mapping to SDR when it was first out. Frustratingly, Panasonic players cannot bit stream audio from network sources though.
Since then I've finally setup MadVR and it does everything the UB9000 does and even more. The author is currently working on generating scene-by-scene live meta-data which is optimal for projection displays.
Love my ub820, great player
Me too!
What if your LCD has Max Nits of 750? Should you choose the 1000 setting (MIddle or High) or the 500 setting (Basic)? My TV is a TCL 55P605
Love your videos!!! I especially love the wagyu beef analogy. I remember the first time I had wagyu, it was Miyazaki. After eating that, I started comparing everything to the beef. “If I don’t buy this amp, how much wagyu could I get‽” 😂
Great video Vincent. Would you think it is better to set the player to output SDR BT2020 rather than HDR BT2020 when paired with a projector like the Epson HC5040UB? I keep hearing that SDR BT2020 is better for projectors since they can’t get close to the nits needed for HDR even with the player set to low light output projectors in the settings.
What about if I have JVC N7. Will this help more ? Cause option already has it on jVC ? Thanks
I've just bought a Panasonic UB820 for my LG C9; should I use HDR optimizer by Panasnic, dynamic tone mapping by LG or both?
I have the same TV, LG C9 and the Panasonic UB820, should the LG optimizer turn on or off when using the optimizer in the UB820
Turn dynamic tone mapping off for the LG and HDR Optimizer on for the Panasonic
I had posted this below based on my experience. Hope it helps:
"I saw a few people ask whether to use the HDR Optimiser along with the TV's HDR Dynamic Tone Mapping. Took the time to test using Fury Road with the Dynamic Tone Mapping on/off and on scenes that have brightness that exceeded the OLED limit (1000 nits), the Optimiser reigned it in to the 1000 nits and brought out more details in those bright areas. It did not affect the rest of the tones whether the rest of the scene was bright or dark. With the Optimiser off, the Dynamic Tone Mapping would darken the entire scene including the shadows to try and achieve this and still not bring as much detail as the Optimiser in the bright area. However with the Optimiser on bring the brights to the set limit (1000 nits in my case) and the Dynamic Tone Mapping set to on, it will map the rest of the scene, lightening as it thinks it's needed giving a brighter picture with more shadow detail since it reads that the scene is within the 1000 nits (so no darkening needed for the highlights) and it does a good job doing so IMO. However, using this feature will likely depart from the original film maker intent. It may brighten when that was not how it was intended for instance.
I am using the UB-820. A great player because of this feature IMO.
HTH and a BIG thank you for this video. Really helped me get the most out of my setup."
I’ve noticed that the UB-9000 has a high luminance projector option and the UB-820 does not, is this significant for people that own an HDR projector, or will the existing settings on the 820 serve?
This doesnt work. When i turn tone mapping off on lg oled, the picture gets darker. I turn on the hdr optimizer in the Panasonic player and no difference occurs
thanks! I Must say After Hours of Testing. Oled is limited as 1000 nits and lcd to 1500 Nits thats it. So new oled gets much brighter. So with Harry potter it Looks so much better with the lg Dynamic Tone Mapping. If i use the optimierter i cant See Details Specially in bright scenes. So Strong recommondation for all with a new oled- dont use the optimizer. This is a 6 years Old Software. My 2 Cents
@HDTVTest Does "Dynamic HDR Effect" on a Panasonic OLED essentially do the same thing?
My TCL 8 series LCD has a peak brightness of 1379. Should I use Super High or Middle High Luminance.
It sounds like it's only a killer feature for TVs with less than ideal tone mapping. Because in reality the TV itself should be able to do all of this and even better since it knows the exact limits of itself and you don't end up double tone mapping.
Very true ... and you have a point here with the double tone mapping...
So Vincent, is the Panasonic UB9000 a better pick over the Oppo 203?
Both have their strengths and weaknesses depending on your needs.
HDTVTest I see a future for you in politics. 😂
So if I have a 2019 qled tv which is better?
There are some who says the Panasonic is the better choice. It’s a matter of choice, IMO. Also, Oppo is no longer so you only have one choice now.
So if I understand correctly...with my LG B9 I would be better to use the Basic luminance LCD setting rather than OLED setting?
What are the best settings on this for the Q90R
Hi Vincent,
I have a Sony AF9 and the Panasonic UB820. You can't turn off the tone mapping of the AF9. Should I use the Panasonic HDR Optimiser on top or should I just stay with the Sony tone mapping?
Hi..did u every get an answer for ur question..I have the same one thanks
Is the HDR Optimizer on the 9000 better or different in any way from the UB820?
As far as I can tell the 9000 is better for audio but is just as good as the 820 for picture quality
Which is the best hdr picture mode on a tv set eg LG C line with this player? Filmmaker mode? With Dtm off.
It's 2022 when I write this and wish you could have done a video about the DP-Ub820 going in depth about its features as you have done here, is the HDR optimizer, exactly the same on all three $K DVD players?
I'm looking to get a new 4k player. I'm using a UBD 8500 Samsung player . I want to get the ub 9000. Should I wait for new stuff to come out or get the ub 9000 ? I have LG Cx 65" with LG SN11RG
So if you have a 2009 plasma tv like me you must choose Basic Luminance LCD??
So if i have a 4k projector with 2400 ansi lumen, how many nits is that and what setting do i choose on the panasonic for the correct hdr optimiser setting?
The 2019 model DP-UB450 doesn't feature the HDR optimiser.
Did you try a firmware update ?
Great video! We have the Panasonic UB820 and a Sony A9F Master series TV. Would you recommend using the HDR Optimiser on the UB820 with this combo of TV/Player? As far as I can tell you can't seem to turn off tone mapping on the A9F? Thanks!
Yes you are suppose to turn off the dynamic tone mapping on TV in order use the HDR optimizer however it only works with HDR 10 content. The HDR Optimizer will not work with HDR 10 Plus Or Dolby Vision. The HDR Optimizer is just a feature used for tone mapping HDR 10 to enhance the HDR.
Do you recommend the DP-UB420 for a basic luminance projector? does it have those same options?
Can you just reduce the contrast on your TV to get the same results? On my Z9D, Brightness and Contrast are Automatically set to 100% for HDR. I dropped it down to 90% and I get more detail.
Reducing the TV's [Brightness] and [Contrast] will also lower the overall brightness, as well as darken the shadow detail and midtones, which is not advisable.
But I, for one, want to see all the shenanigans in your room
Would this feature be beneficial when used in conjunction with jvc nx9 auto tone mapping? Or is that redundant and detrimental?
Why is the LG not picking up Dolby Vision playback when the disc is started? It goes to regular HDR? I've had this problem, when I load Netflix on the panasonic the LG automatically changes to Dolby Vision HDR yet I play Bladerunner 2049 and LG reckons it's playing back in standard HDR
Can you help me select the right Display type for Sony X93L? Would it be super high luminance?
Brilliant. Thank you Vincent. Mine is sitting in a box waiting to be plugged in. Lots of love from Sprinkles, Chris and Crystal xx
I doubt you'll have time to answer this, but is the HDR Optimizer still useful for 2021 TVs? I just bought an A80J and find it hard to believe that the chip in Panasonic's 2018 / 2019 Blu-ray players would be better at frame-by-frame optimizations than the chip in a 2021 flagship OLED...
Would also love to know what you think about this! I just bought the same tv!
The Panasonic HDR Optimizer is still the best solution for tone-mapping HDR10 content because it preserves specular highlight detail while APL remains largely unaffected. However, the Sony A80J and A90J tone-mapping implementation is undefeatable, so you would get undesirable double tone-mapping with the HDR Optimizer engaged. Therefore the HDR Optimizer will work best on OLED displays where tone-mapping can be turned off completely.
They really need to start getting some standards for HDR content, it really is hit or miss for me; and pretty complicated to get it exactly the way I like it to look.