Years ago I was on a farm forum and we got into swapping stories about things we did port work to. I mentioned that I did the ports on a N9 Ford tractor engine one time. I got teased for that it maybe gave it 3 to 5 more HP. To which I replied, "Yea, I know. When I started with it made maybe 25 HP. Now it makes 28 to 30! which is a huge improvement!" The fact is, yes those old engines did in fact gain a good deal of power with porting work due to how absurdly choked down and undersized the stock intake passages were compared to the valve ports and inlet ports relative sizes. Going from a cross-section the size of a nickel feeding each intake valve to that of a quarter is a huge flow gain that is even noticeable at the low RPMs those old engines ran at.
if i get the same sort of increase on my fzr250, ill be more than happy! lil i4, hiroshima screamer 20k redline thing. pulled it down cus the valves are leaking...oh my. absolutss insidegot a reb and they left the alves all coked up and seating on carbon? ffs! but! noone can do a valve job at this size... so ive made a toolpost grinder, ground my own arbors, as noone makes 3.5mm one, my own cutters... and thats as far as ive got. gotta braze up the cutters and grind them. 15mm exhaust valve. not much room. Neway was not an option, dammit. considering these things are like a F1 engine, i feel they deserve a proper 3 angle valve job, along with a light cleanup of the ports... even more critical that things are perfect at this size when air starts getting "syrupy"... 1mm aint much in a 28mm port... its a hella big difference on a 12mm port! just like 5hp doesnt sound like much... until its expressed as a percentage gain... 20-25% increase in power aint anything to sneeze at. like the turbo on my lil kubota b6100. doesnt do much most of the time but hell you notice it when it starts loading down... and yeah, i cant help myself on old engines, always pull out the die grinder and chase out some of those weird parts with right angle turns and the like... they all seem to love a bit of better breathing. modern manufacturing has one thing in its favour, it got more consistent and more... flowy. remember all them ports had to be carved out of timber and rammed in sand... as cheaply as possible. still do, but the modelling got a lot better.
Hence the reason I WILL NEVER port my Alfa. I can't find anything to improve on! The factory did an amazing job and I feel I'd wreck the head instead of improving it. Those older engines have so much potential I think it's pretty hard NOT to be able improve them. I'm never sure of what the purpose was with those designs.. Did they do it for longevity? Did they do it for production costs? Did they not really care about the ultimate power and efficiency? Maybe it was because they just didn't have advanced engineering design skills. Who knows.
frankly never understood why people do NOT treat tractor engines just as a high performance engine. hear me out. let's take a nowdays smallish 80-100 hp tractor, allrighty ? IF you can improve it, to make it work more efficient, saving say.. 1% fuel -not a lot, i know- in tractor terms that can absolutely amount to a dayli 10 liter with ease. I belive, that if you rebuild a tractor engine, and imrpoove it, it has a lot more value than rebuilding a car engine. a tractor makes money. a car rarely. and frankly, tractors are made crude. just a proper intake and exhaust header - consider they usually are kept int he 1800-2200 rpm range, very narrow, easy to work with- they can be improved by a lot more, than just a whipy 1% in effcieincy. account some head porting too, and you got a business.
So happy I chose you guys to do my Subaru heads. Customers need to realize when shopping for head work, the race to the bottom is one that nobody wins. We made over 800whp and were able to run more timing than usual bc of the work you did.
Lot of shops are all over the place. Hit and miss best stuff I’ve seen is by guys not doing it to keep the lights on, but love doing it. Devil is in the details! Nice vid guys!
Nice video. Very classy not mentioning the name of the shop who did the work. Personally, I stay away from shops that badmouth others. I would rather spend my time hearing from happy customers and leave the shop personal to talk about what they do, not what others did wrong. As a machinist (not a head porter) I enforce this rule strictly. Just found the channel now subbed.
Fellow NJian I salute you ❤ I need to go to sleep soon but... I actually thought my Subaru needed new heads 😮Amazing, I know! So I bought two new "reconditioned" heads from a dealer that were supposedly done by Subaru with milling work and three angle valve grind etc stuff like that... if you wanted to inspect them for a video or content... oh wow I never thought I'd see a shop like this in NJ. I'm by Jersey Shore I basically drive hundreds of miles on a virtually daily basis. Goodnight and I check UA-cam *frequently*
Wow, showing off your ports comparing to the goofed job really shows how insane that first port job was. I was watching thinking eh, that's pretty lame but if the proportions were better it'd be fine. Then I saw yours and WOW.
Well done!!! Great example of Good port vs bad port jobs!!! As a buyer I would never know. You were very professional and kind on the keeping the criticism constructive. Hopefully the owner didn't pay too much for that job.
I would actually like to see a valve job done on those heads and then put them up against your ported heads.... I have a feeling the main issue was just the valves not sealing.... I have seen some horrible heads with trenches dug in them and they did great... Not saying I wouldn't rather have the head game heads though lol
I ported my mopar 5.9l Magnum v8 heads back in the day ..... Looked similar to this ... All smooth ect .... My engine shop said i destroyed the short side radius and they heads were garbage.... (I didjt realize i had cracked heads so that was ok in the end ..... But i was proud nof my porting and they said never polish the inside/ short side like this I left the replacement heads untouched
I may have to send my Nissan heads from a z31 to you I don't have anybody who does good work down here it's not easy thank you for sharing this video with me and it was really excellent I'd like to learn about porting heads and valves and stuff like that
I liked the ending! I probably made all the same mistakes as the mechanic when I just wung it putting together my first motor (SBF). I don't think I touched the heads but I went to town on the lower intake manifold. Probably made it worse but I enjoyed doing it haha
About half a century ago some drag racers used a product called BlokRok (I’m not sure of the spelling) to reinforce blocks that had been bored out so much the cylinders wouldn’t stand the pressures of whatever they were burning (gas, alcohol, nitromethane). Of course there was no cooling system. If you don’t need cooling, and if BlokRok is still made, there’s an option!
There is nothing wrong with showing “How not to do a project” as long as names aren’t called out. Visual aids are a lot more help when learning than verbal descriptions are.
I do alot of diy porting. I find the biggest issue is that people start hogging the ports out for cfm vs flow efficiency or velocity. Without some serious specialty equipment I don't go past a few millimeters. Trenches are ok in some situations but if you have a trench here and a trench there it's just makes turbulence instead of velocity. Usually I Port atv head's so it's single port intake and exhaust so I'm not overly worried about matching ports or really blending bowls etc. I purely aim to remove large casting marks and big steps that are clearly hindering the flow.
Thank you for this info, The e7s may be bad for drag racing but I feel they will be perfect for cj7 jeep so I am porting them myself because I trust my work over paying anyone in my area out in the middle of nowhere.
As I understand basic port layout and shapes , I have always believed that the actual looks of a port are merely “ cosmetic “ verses whatever the flow bench readings for that particular port may show. A set of “ flow balanced” ugly ports are vastly superior than a bunch of “ Pretty ports” that flow like crap compared to one another or head to head when used on a “ Vee” type engine . Some port length & built in constraints ( head bolt locations or water jackets ,etc) or overall length between where the ports are actually cast from the factory can make the sizes and finish work needed to “ match flow “ the various ports look entirely different from one another. As long as overall flow numbers are reasonable, the cylinders should “ in theory “ work as a balanced set while in operation. Just some food for thought ……
I would trade the balance for maximum power from every cylinder and tune accordingly. Anything that can push on the piston a little bit stronger is a friend. Also a flow bench is not a tool that can verify the conditions in the running engine.
Just did a pocket port on my wrx heads to get rid of the giant step from the bowl to seat. Wanted to knife edge that divider l, but i decided to leave it alone because I didn't want it to end up like yours
for the devider as i see it knife edge is not so good for air flow, have you seen an airplane wing with the sharp end going first? no the wing is rounded to help air flow round it. Headgames correct me if im wrong in my statement.
Got it, if your new to head porting don't use them carbide burs. I would personally use cartridge rolls instead. Takes alot longer to do a port job but gives you head room for error correction. And constant measurement is 🔑
@@headgameswhen you have casting flash everywhere in your cylinder head, yes even a polish and sanding will give you measurable gains even if it’s only 1 hp, everything counts when making an efficient engine
Listen im a simple man , I had 4 things cylinder head , die grinder and my fathers old cutting burr bit that i found laying around in the corner of the garage under a dead rat and lots of time on hands and I simply made my runnes into a moon surface and it still made more power than stock so its a win in my book lol)))
99% of head porters show huge flow numbers ..but you would need to use a cam so large it doesnt exist to use them.they buy stock heads for pennies put em in a cnc stamp their logo and sell em for thousands .id rather spend my money anywhere else.clean n blend your bowls yourself..
Good cylinder head porting requires many years of experience and be prepared to pay the big bucks good head work delivers around 4 HP per cylinder if the cam and manifold and headers are right.simple get them dune by a professional
Even with you pointing it out, most of the time I can't see the difference.... which scares me as someone who may be in the market to get a head ported in the near future.
There are great and not so great porting guys out there. It's good for a comparison of what's available. I was just wondering if you guys work on any 4 valve heads?. Thanks and good luck to you all. James
The hours it takes to complete a proper port job put it out of most people's grasp. That's just a 4 cyl. Start on your mower or something to see what you are getting yourself into.
Hogging out material and just using flow bench numbers isn't indicative of real world performance, the intake, exhaust manifold and turbo are restrictions. cam timing, intake runner length, and exhaust manifold affects reversion as well. A good cylinderhead shop knows how to maximize your setup without dropping off too much torque and for what rev range you want to make power in. You already heard that the Tunner couldn't make good power with the head package, who cares if it has higher peak flow numbers than compared to stock, its an overall poor performing cylinderhead.
@@CP110 Absolutely. I'm quite aware of all the various factors, but having the flow numbers would have been an excellent way to demonstrate that numbers on a flow bench are NOT the whole story! 😁
we didn't flow it, till today. And there will be a vid coming out about it soon. This vid was really about the workmanship and not flow numbers. But many asked about the flow so we will show it in the next couple of weeks.
I have a 94 Mercedes M119 5.0 engine and would like a modest port job + Valve job. This engine is rated at about 325hp or 65hp/liter. With stock cams, can head porting be the solution to increase power for another 50-75hp? My goal is 400hp.
most of those heads are so good, it would hurt power to port them. But, also not very sure on that head, we have never messed with it. Only the boosted versions. And, with those we didn't port till 900whp
@@headgames first, thank you for the reply. I really appreciate it. As far as this engine, they never had any boosted versions, they were all N/A except some early 90’s LeMan cars that were turbo charged from the factory race teams. The engines are as reliable as the Lexus LS engines. I was googling the combustion chambers, and they look like a low hp SBC truck head. It looks very disappointing 😔
One looks hand ported and one looks like a CNC machine or robot did it. You have developed a steady hand and eagle eyes. The calipers are a nice tool to use and check uniformity. I used smaller valves to keep things round and uniform before I sent it out to a machine shop for a valve job and new guides. The difference is experience, trying something intimidating like head work takes some balls or stupidity. And time...a lot of time. If someone attempts it themselves, there must be a point where you can fix or touch up their work without a head being destroyed. I've seen a few better and worse and the cars still ran, it was not a death sentence but maybe came up short on potential. The tuner could not tune it because airflow to each cylinder was that much different? My work sucked the more I watch your videos and learn but did not seem to hurt performance and was fun to try. Sanding out the casting marks, smoothing or opening up the chambers a little bit I would assume is an improvement from stock. I ported out my exhaust port to match the header and gasket...did that cause harm? I figured smoother and faster out the better. I also added some dimples on the intake to help mix up the air/fuel mix...I wonder if that did anything helpful or hurtful. Runs and is fun...wish I did a before and after test but oh well. Kind of want to send them in to you at the next teardown and rebuild but now I'm afraid I'll end up on your next what not to do video lol
Not sure what head it is, but almost no head likes it to be opened up to the header. That is huge! Depending on the gasket it will also be too big. It slows the air down by making it to large. The issue here was the valve job, that is why the tuner couldn't do his thing. The porting we were showing because we show how to port heads and this is an example on what not to do. It would still work, not optimum but it would work.
@@headgames I try to watch all your videos and learn, it was just a one time experience for me I think (hope). I'd like to email you some pictures and get some feedback but I'm sure you are too busy. It's an EJ207 (JDM STI) feeding into a Killer B Holy Header. The header holes where ~1.5-2mm smaller than the exhaust port, basically like hitting a wall/ridge if it was the other way around I'd of probably left it alone but I basically just used the gasket and carbon buildup as a line to port and smooth the exhaust ports into the header so it was even between them ...but it did increase the volume by that ~2mm. I have +1mm intake and exhaust valves and an FP Blue shoving in air in the low 20psi range. I did my damage and then had the machine shop CC the chambers/head to make sure they all matched, I was close they shaved a tad more to keep them even but said not bad for an eyeball job and not using cnc... valve job and the usual stuff on a rebuild is what I'm waiting on now. I wish I could test mine against stock and see the help/harm in the end. With 8k RPM I hope a little more breathing room helps. More just about the experience...and savings I suppose. Not sure what you'd of charged but I think I was only into it for the bits, sanding stuff...used a Dremel and foot pedal and went real slow.
I learned the hard way that shops may straight lie about their experience and later show their ignorance, but you are already screwed... I had a shop tell me that they had decades of experience on race engines and have done quality port jobs, later they told me that the bronze manganese valve guides I sent me were wrong and were unable to install them and that I shouldn't swap from the OEM steel guides to those because they could cause binding of the valves, that was a red flag, they kept on insisting until I decided to take my head back, but when I looked at the horrendous port job that they did, I felt very sad, because even a newbie like me knew there was no way to fix such a disaster, anyway I had another more reputable shop finish the valve jobs and its in my car but I will have to look for another head in the future...
How do people go to sleep at night doing this kind of shady work 😢 and I’m over here giving my friends and customers extra care and love to keep them coming back this Shit is not cool
Doubling the diameter of a tube increases gas flow by 16x. A 2mm difference doesn’t sound much However a simplistic calc shoes that 26mm could flow 1.5x as much air as 24mm. It won’t have “that” effect all over the ports but the flow differential would be big.
@@headgames come to say that bigger isent better as flow is better then stagnent air in a hoged out port. porting twostrokers for fun for some years i come to learn quick that bigg is bad most of the time and short radious stall the airflow.
The first heads I ever ported (Ford SB iron GT40) probably didn't *work* any better than those...but they sure looked a lot nicer. And furthermore, porting iron heads sux @$$
I personnaly have ruined a few cylinder heads because I started porting very aggresively the first port and did not port all duplicated the the shape of the port to the rest. You cannot rush the process, take your time and if you do not know where to remove metal, don't do it. Better leave it stock.
@@headgames They wont be around for long. Bet Im not the only one who called and said they took heads I did to a nationally known builder and flowed them. lol
The heads really weren't that horrible tbh. They were way better than 90% of DIY port jobs. And it really doesn't matter much anyway unless it's a high performance application. I've seen way, way worse than this.
Where the ports uneven and gasket surface area ruined, yes. However i have seen real shitty ports make power. Funny thing is when guys start making mega power on stock casting heads on most imports at places like world cup finals they just run a clean up port to avoid cracking.
That doesn't look like a shop did that it looks like a backyard mechanic did it hell the first head I ever did look like that. And I didn't know anything but some videos on youtube. This is an art it requires patients.
Naw, what I think happened here is Stevie had a late night conversation with Ray Charles and Stevie missed a couple of things in the late night barrage of info. Js
You have to port with the light, lol. Not too much, you'll wash your eyes out, not too little it needs to cast shadows, and you need a basic understanding of how to read light and shadow.
Nope.....no yall to quick to judge now see. That there I seent before. The technique(don't mind the big words) is called "The Multi-V"! "V" for venturi. You gots to tune in the negative void of the VE table to proportionally gain from the losses in the positive VE table. Imagine you're standing at the edge of a lake.....
There is a difference in crapping on somebody else's work, and teaching people what to be aware of when getting some one to do your porting.
Did you see how shitty that work was? Get over yourself
Exactly
If the work deserves to get shit on then what's the problem? Supposed to protect their feelings or something?
Sounds like you worked on those heads the way you’re belly aching 😂
Showing how not to port heads is interesting and useful info.
Years ago I was on a farm forum and we got into swapping stories about things we did port work to. I mentioned that I did the ports on a N9 Ford tractor engine one time.
I got teased for that it maybe gave it 3 to 5 more HP. To which I replied, "Yea, I know. When I started with it made maybe 25 HP. Now it makes 28 to 30! which is a huge improvement!"
The fact is, yes those old engines did in fact gain a good deal of power with porting work due to how absurdly choked down and undersized the stock intake passages were compared to the valve ports and inlet ports relative sizes. Going from a cross-section the size of a nickel feeding each intake valve to that of a quarter is a huge flow gain that is even noticeable at the low RPMs those old engines ran at.
if i get the same sort of increase on my fzr250, ill be more than happy!
lil i4, hiroshima screamer 20k redline thing.
pulled it down cus the valves are leaking...oh my. absolutss insidegot a reb and they left the alves all coked up and seating on carbon? ffs!
but!
noone can do a valve job at this size... so ive made a toolpost grinder, ground my own arbors, as noone makes 3.5mm one, my own cutters...
and thats as far as ive got. gotta braze up the cutters and grind them.
15mm exhaust valve. not much room. Neway was not an option, dammit.
considering these things are like a F1 engine, i feel they deserve a proper 3 angle valve job, along with a light cleanup of the ports... even more critical that things are perfect at this size when air starts getting "syrupy"... 1mm aint much in a 28mm port... its a hella big difference on a 12mm port!
just like 5hp doesnt sound like much... until its expressed as a percentage gain... 20-25% increase in power aint anything to sneeze at. like the turbo on my lil kubota b6100. doesnt do much most of the time but hell you notice it when it starts loading down...
and yeah, i cant help myself on old engines, always pull out the die grinder and chase out some of those weird parts with right angle turns and the like... they all seem to love a bit of better breathing. modern manufacturing has one thing in its favour, it got more consistent and more... flowy. remember all them ports had to be carved out of timber and rammed in sand... as cheaply as possible. still do, but the modelling got a lot better.
Hence the reason I WILL NEVER port my Alfa. I can't find anything to improve on! The factory did an amazing job and I feel I'd wreck the head instead of improving it. Those older engines have so much potential I think it's pretty hard NOT to be able improve them. I'm never sure of what the purpose was with those designs.. Did they do it for longevity? Did they do it for production costs? Did they not really care about the ultimate power and efficiency? Maybe it was because they just didn't have advanced engineering design skills. Who knows.
frankly never understood why people do NOT treat tractor engines just as a high performance engine. hear me out. let's take a nowdays smallish 80-100 hp tractor, allrighty ? IF you can improve it, to make it work more efficient, saving say.. 1% fuel -not a lot, i know- in tractor terms that can absolutely amount to a dayli 10 liter with ease. I belive, that if you rebuild a tractor engine, and imrpoove it, it has a lot more value than rebuilding a car engine. a tractor makes money. a car rarely. and frankly, tractors are made crude. just a proper intake and exhaust header - consider they usually are kept int he 1800-2200 rpm range, very narrow, easy to work with- they can be improved by a lot more, than just a whipy 1% in effcieincy. account some head porting too, and you got a business.
It is nice to see the difference between bad work and really nice work for us rookies when we decide to have the heads done. Thanks.
exactly why we did it! Try to make people aware.
So happy I chose you guys to do my Subaru heads. Customers need to realize when shopping for head work, the race to the bottom is one that nobody wins. We made over 800whp and were able to run more timing than usual bc of the work you did.
thanks for choosing HeadGames Corey!
Lot of shops are all over the place. Hit and miss best stuff I’ve seen is by guys not doing it to keep the lights on, but love doing it. Devil is in the details! Nice vid guys!
Nice video. Very classy not mentioning the name of the shop who did the work. Personally, I stay away from shops that badmouth others. I would rather spend my time hearing from happy customers and leave the shop personal to talk about what they do, not what others did wrong. As a machinist (not a head porter) I enforce this rule strictly. Just found the channel now subbed.
thanks and agreed!
I agree. No need to run other shops down. I have found they are usually doing a good job of that on their own.
When uncle Tony says he knows how to Port heads 😂😆
Fellow NJian I salute you ❤ I need to go to sleep soon but... I actually thought my Subaru needed new heads 😮Amazing, I know! So I bought two new "reconditioned" heads from a dealer that were supposedly done by Subaru with milling work and three angle valve grind etc stuff like that... if you wanted to inspect them for a video or content... oh wow I never thought I'd see a shop like this in NJ. I'm by Jersey Shore I basically drive hundreds of miles on a virtually daily basis. Goodnight and I check UA-cam *frequently*
"He had the guts to do it." I mean, I wouldn't have done it on a customer's head, but that's a really good point.
Superb vid again. Really helps to see a head done wrong so as not to make the same errors.
Wow, showing off your ports comparing to the goofed job really shows how insane that first port job was. I was watching thinking eh, that's pretty lame but if the proportions were better it'd be fine. Then I saw yours and WOW.
"Just hog 'em out, dude, there's no science to that."
as a person who just started to learn and trial and error head poring junk heads , this is really good info
Any of the how to porting vids we post have some good techniques.
Well done!!! Great example of Good port vs bad port jobs!!! As a buyer I would never know. You were very professional and kind on the keeping the criticism constructive. Hopefully the owner didn't pay too much for that job.
Thanks for the feedback!
I would actually like to see a valve job done on those heads and then put them up against your ported heads.... I have a feeling the main issue was just the valves not sealing.... I have seen some horrible heads with trenches dug in them and they did great... Not saying I wouldn't rather have the head game heads though lol
that meme with steve buchemis eyes pointing in two different directions and "looks fine to me" comes to mind here.
lol
Thanks for all the valuable information. Greetings from Puerto Rico 🇵🇷…
thanks Omar !
You just roasted that dude. I’m porting some heads now. It’s a task to do it properly. I may take too much time. But it’s nice when I’m done
I ported my mopar 5.9l Magnum v8 heads back in the day ..... Looked similar to this ... All smooth ect .... My engine shop said i destroyed the short side radius and they heads were garbage.... (I didjt realize i had cracked heads so that was ok in the end ..... But i was proud nof my porting and they said never polish the inside/ short side like this
I left the replacement heads untouched
Excellent information. Thank you very much.
I'd love it if you could do a video on Mitsubishi 6G72 cylinder heads comparing the turbo 3T heads to the non turbo 3N heads and the later 3A heads
ive done a few heads its 3 parts grinding 1 part measuring my calipers and verniers were always on the job take your time check your work
I have never done headwork but that is scarey looking.
Was a great vid to point out how bad things can end up.
I may have to send my Nissan heads from a z31 to you I don't have anybody who does good work down here it's not easy thank you for sharing this video with me and it was really excellent I'd like to learn about porting heads and valves and stuff like that
Thanks for the kind words! But, sorry we don’t work on VG heads
After looking at those frankenports seeing the headgames port is like 🙌
I liked the ending! I probably made all the same mistakes as the mechanic when I just wung it putting together my first motor (SBF). I don't think I touched the heads but I went to town on the lower intake manifold. Probably made it worse but I enjoyed doing it haha
About half a century ago some drag racers used a product called BlokRok (I’m not sure of the spelling) to reinforce blocks that had been bored out so much the cylinders wouldn’t stand the pressures of whatever they were burning (gas, alcohol, nitromethane). Of course there was no cooling system. If you don’t need cooling, and if BlokRok is still made, there’s an option!
I don't think that is the problem here and its a street car so need the cooling.
There is nothing wrong with showing “How not to do a project” as long as names aren’t called out. Visual aids are a lot more help when learning than verbal descriptions are.
Big difference when properly done 👍
I do alot of diy porting. I find the biggest issue is that people start hogging the ports out for cfm vs flow efficiency or velocity. Without some serious specialty equipment I don't go past a few millimeters. Trenches are ok in some situations but if you have a trench here and a trench there it's just makes turbulence instead of velocity.
Usually I Port atv head's so it's single port intake and exhaust so I'm not overly worried about matching ports or really blending bowls etc.
I purely aim to remove large casting marks and big steps that are clearly hindering the flow.
I see the same problems. They go big because of the illusion it is better. Lack of experience is what I think it is. Good on you for not!
Thank you for this info, The e7s may be bad for drag racing but I feel they will be perfect for cj7 jeep so I am porting them myself because I trust my work over paying anyone in my area out in the middle of nowhere.
good luck!
I think I will be ok as I'm only doing a few things just to improve the exhaust side of things.
Very helpful, thank you sir
love your videos wish you guys worked on m8 harley heads
As I understand basic port layout and shapes , I have always believed that the actual looks of a port are merely “ cosmetic “ verses whatever the flow bench readings for that particular port may show. A set of “ flow balanced” ugly ports are vastly superior than a bunch of “ Pretty ports” that flow like crap compared to one another or head to head when used on a “ Vee” type engine . Some port length & built in constraints ( head bolt locations or water jackets ,etc) or overall length between where the ports are actually cast from the factory can make the sizes and finish work needed to “ match flow “ the various ports look entirely different from one another. As long as overall flow numbers are reasonable, the cylinders should “ in theory “ work as a balanced set while in operation. Just some food for thought ……
I would trade the balance for maximum power from every cylinder and tune accordingly. Anything that can push on the piston a little bit stronger is a friend. Also a flow bench is not a tool that can verify the conditions in the running engine.
Nice video...hey badcamaro, interesting comment...bad mouthing is 1 thing...telling the Truth is honest and helpful for all...
glad it was taken as honest
I imagine there are a lot of people who know what they are trying to do but don’t have the skill and control with their grinding technique.
Truth
Subaru guy here. Subbed
Just did a pocket port on my wrx heads to get rid of the giant step from the bowl to seat. Wanted to knife edge that divider l, but i decided to leave it alone because I didn't want it to end up like yours
We did not port this.
for the devider as i see it knife edge is not so good for air flow, have you seen an airplane wing with the sharp end going first?
no the wing is rounded to help air flow round it.
Headgames correct me if im wrong in my statement.
I would love to see video how u guys remove and install valve guides
ua-cam.com/video/-H6FsOb9-ws/v-deo.html
Got it, if your new to head porting don't use them carbide burs. I would personally use cartridge rolls instead. Takes alot longer to do a port job but gives you head room for error correction. And constant measurement is 🔑
Cartridge rolls are not going to get you any gains. They don’t move enough material. It’s a waste of time and effort really.
@@headgameswhen you have casting flash everywhere in your cylinder head, yes even a polish and sanding will give you measurable gains even if it’s only 1 hp, everything counts when making an efficient engine
that second head was ported by hand?
Sadly, most viewers won't get the Stevie Wonder joke!
Listen im a simple man , I had 4 things cylinder head , die grinder and my fathers old cutting burr bit that i found laying around in the corner of the garage under a dead rat and lots of time on hands and I simply made my runnes into a moon surface and it still made more power than stock so its a win in my book lol)))
Were you able to save these? Because if so. You worked a damn miracle.
Jesus Christ could come back and he wouldn’t be able to save these
I've been a tech for 37years and know a few things. I've told people that there are things to be learned from everyone. How to & how not do things.
Show us some flow bench numbers.
not going through all that effort on these
@@headgames aww you can't tell us the heads are bad then not show us some numbers...that's not cool...
99% of head porters show huge flow numbers ..but you would need to use a cam so large it doesnt exist to use them.they buy stock heads for pennies put em in a cnc stamp their logo and sell em for thousands .id rather spend my money anywhere else.clean n blend your bowls yourself..
@@bentboybbz
Just look at it lol it’s terrible. What does a flow chart say about it that the work on it doesn’t show.
@@moonship1946 that’s not true. Head porters such as us don’t let you get into a head or a cam that is to big.
Good cylinder head porting requires many years of experience and be prepared to pay the big bucks good head work delivers around 4 HP per cylinder if the cam and manifold and headers are right.simple get them dune by a professional
Your very nice thanks for the info
Even with you pointing it out, most of the time I can't see the difference.... which scares me as someone who may be in the market to get a head ported in the near future.
Instant subscribe 👍
i got vw bug heads like that and i made it better using round one inch stone it made beatifull round ports.i was then 20yo.
There are great and not so great porting guys out there. It's good for a comparison of what's available. I was just wondering if you guys work on any 4 valve heads?. Thanks and good luck to you all. James
🤔. I don’t think you know what 4 valve heads are. All the ports he was showing were 4 valve heads. All of them😅
If I send you a an effed up 2jz head, will you make a video of it? Its got a very interesting valve job and some half assed porting.
we see enough of them here and don't make vids of them. Thanks for the offer though.
that might work on a briggs single cylinder engine.where cylinder consistancy isnt an issue.
The hours it takes to complete a proper port job put it out of most people's grasp. That's just a 4 cyl. Start on your mower or something to see what you are getting yourself into.
Do u use a pitot tube to try to get the air speeds where u want them? What is a good air speed to shoot for on d.i. heads?
I hear you brother
I know it looks like crap, but what did it flow compared to a stock head?
Hogging out material and just using flow bench numbers isn't indicative of real world performance, the intake, exhaust manifold and turbo are restrictions. cam timing, intake runner length, and exhaust manifold affects reversion as well. A good cylinderhead shop knows how to maximize your setup without dropping off too much torque and for what rev range you want to make power in. You already heard that the Tunner couldn't make good power with the head package, who cares if it has higher peak flow numbers than compared to stock, its an overall poor performing cylinderhead.
@@CP110 Absolutely. I'm quite aware of all the various factors, but having the flow numbers would have been an excellent way to demonstrate that numbers on a flow bench are NOT the whole story! 😁
we didn't flow it, till today. And there will be a vid coming out about it soon. This vid was really about the workmanship and not flow numbers. But many asked about the flow so we will show it in the next couple of weeks.
IT'S WWII, TRENCH WARFARE. MIGHT HAVE USED A DREMMEL, YIKES! AT LEAST HE DIDN'T GO INTO A WATER JACKET!
Can you flow the crap ones and the nice looking ones?
So im curious. Just knocking down casting flash and doing a heavy grit polish, how much could you really fuck a head up?
That ain’t Ray Charles quality, definitely Stevie 😆
hahaha
Friday after lunch port grind
Its good to see what not to do.
I have a 94 Mercedes M119 5.0 engine and would like a modest port job + Valve job. This engine is rated at about 325hp or 65hp/liter. With stock cams, can head porting be the solution to increase power for another 50-75hp? My goal is 400hp.
most of those heads are so good, it would hurt power to port them. But, also not very sure on that head, we have never messed with it. Only the boosted versions. And, with those we didn't port till 900whp
@@headgames first, thank you for the reply. I really appreciate it. As far as this engine, they never had any boosted versions, they were all N/A except some early 90’s LeMan cars that were turbo charged from the factory race teams. The engines are as reliable as the Lexus LS engines. I was googling the combustion chambers, and they look like a low hp SBC truck head. It looks very disappointing 😔
Still not the worst I’ve seen, I’ll dig out pictures
One looks hand ported and one looks like a CNC machine or robot did it. You have developed a steady hand and eagle eyes. The calipers are a nice tool to use and check uniformity. I used smaller valves to keep things round and uniform before I sent it out to a machine shop for a valve job and new guides. The difference is experience, trying something intimidating like head work takes some balls or stupidity. And time...a lot of time. If someone attempts it themselves, there must be a point where you can fix or touch up their work without a head being destroyed. I've seen a few better and worse and the cars still ran, it was not a death sentence but maybe came up short on potential. The tuner could not tune it because airflow to each cylinder was that much different? My work sucked the more I watch your videos and learn but did not seem to hurt performance and was fun to try. Sanding out the casting marks, smoothing or opening up the chambers a little bit I would assume is an improvement from stock. I ported out my exhaust port to match the header and gasket...did that cause harm? I figured smoother and faster out the better. I also added some dimples on the intake to help mix up the air/fuel mix...I wonder if that did anything helpful or hurtful. Runs and is fun...wish I did a before and after test but oh well. Kind of want to send them in to you at the next teardown and rebuild but now I'm afraid I'll end up on your next what not to do video lol
Not sure what head it is, but almost no head likes it to be opened up to the header. That is huge! Depending on the gasket it will also be too big. It slows the air down by making it to large. The issue here was the valve job, that is why the tuner couldn't do his thing. The porting we were showing because we show how to port heads and this is an example on what not to do. It would still work, not optimum but it would work.
@@headgames I try to watch all your videos and learn, it was just a one time experience for me I think (hope). I'd like to email you some pictures and get some feedback but I'm sure you are too busy. It's an EJ207 (JDM STI) feeding into a Killer B Holy Header. The header holes where ~1.5-2mm smaller than the exhaust port, basically like hitting a wall/ridge if it was the other way around I'd of probably left it alone but I basically just used the gasket and carbon buildup as a line to port and smooth the exhaust ports into the header so it was even between them ...but it did increase the volume by that ~2mm. I have +1mm intake and exhaust valves and an FP Blue shoving in air in the low 20psi range. I did my damage and then had the machine shop CC the chambers/head to make sure they all matched, I was close they shaved a tad more to keep them even but said not bad for an eyeball job and not using cnc... valve job and the usual stuff on a rebuild is what I'm waiting on now. I wish I could test mine against stock and see the help/harm in the end. With 8k RPM I hope a little more breathing room helps. More just about the experience...and savings I suppose. Not sure what you'd of charged but I think I was only into it for the bits, sanding stuff...used a Dremel and foot pedal and went real slow.
Wow. I did my first porting job on a car when I was 17, and that looked way better then that.
They have cnc ported heads now. The machines never stuff up.
Can you do a Gsxr1000r head port job?
I seen the cover photo and said WTF and had to watch.
I learned the hard way that shops may straight lie about their experience and later show their ignorance, but you are already screwed...
I had a shop tell me that they had decades of experience on race engines and have done quality port jobs, later they told me that the bronze manganese valve guides I sent me were wrong and were unable to install them and that I shouldn't swap from the OEM steel guides to those because they could cause binding of the valves, that was a red flag, they kept on insisting until I decided to take my head back, but when I looked at the horrendous port job that they did, I felt very sad, because even a newbie like me knew there was no way to fix such a disaster, anyway I had another more reputable shop finish the valve jobs and its in my car but I will have to look for another head in the future...
I thought something more like sandpaper was used unless it’s a continually lubricating cnc machine or something. Wow
You look familiar. Was you in tv show called pinks
"the divider is air speed"
-How so?
How do people go to sleep at night doing this kind of shady work 😢 and I’m over here giving my friends and customers extra care and love to keep them coming back this Shit is not cool
Doubling the diameter of a tube increases gas flow by 16x. A 2mm difference doesn’t sound much However a simplistic calc shoes that 26mm could flow 1.5x as much air as 24mm. It won’t have “that” effect all over the ports but the flow differential would be big.
it’s not always about how much it flows but what range it flows better. bigger isn’t always better
@@headgames come to say that bigger isent better as flow is better then stagnent air in a hoged out port.
porting twostrokers for fun for some years i come to learn quick that bigg is bad most of the time and short radious stall the airflow.
Ray Charles inspired head porting
Why are trenches bad? They are still too smooth to cause any air turbulences. I know it's not pretty, but does it affect performance?
you can hear the difference in the airspeed on the flow bench
So could they be saved?
Stevie could atleast feel all those valleys and craters….. 😮
Haha
The first heads I ever ported (Ford SB iron GT40) probably didn't *work* any better than those...but they sure looked a lot nicer.
And furthermore, porting iron heads sux @$$
lol porting on iron is the worst. Won't ever do that again.
I just did one, mild porting, not a full pro job. I used carbide burrs, that takes the metal out pretty fast while leaving a decent finish.
Would there be any benefit to minor porting on the dog leg for a bone stock SOHC engine?
There is zero benefit or reason to do that.
The silly buggers only gone and made the ports bigger than the gaskets😂
Just starting video so excuse if incorrect. Why not show flow on bench? Im assume you have one?
I personnaly have ruined a few cylinder heads because I started porting very aggresively the first port and did not port all duplicated the the shape of the port to the rest.
You cannot rush the process, take your time and if you do not know where to remove metal, don't do it.
Better leave it stock.
agreed
I'd also like to know where you are located? No I am not the guy who ported the heads l o l. Just someone interested in getting his heads done.
lol we are in Princeton Junction, NJ. check out the website www.headgamesmotorworks.com
flow them after the valve seats are cut. prove it i think the valves weren't seating was the major problem.
like shining a turd!
It probably was try ported by car owner himself with a drill
no this was a shop
I ported my heads with a drill for the first time and came out way better than this.
@@headgames They wont be around for long. Bet Im not the only one who called and said they took heads I did to a nationally known builder and flowed them. lol
The heads really weren't that horrible tbh. They were way better than 90% of DIY port jobs. And it really doesn't matter much anyway unless it's a high performance application. I've seen way, way worse than this.
Interesting opinion
Where the ports uneven and gasket surface area ruined, yes. However i have seen real shitty ports make power. Funny thing is when guys start making mega power on stock casting heads on most imports at places like world cup finals they just run a clean up port to avoid cracking.
That doesn't look like a shop did that it looks like a backyard mechanic did it hell the first head I ever did look like that. And I didn't know anything but some videos on youtube. This is an art it requires patients.
What engine do these come off of?
2JZ heads?
Speaking of power let's see compression cam timing type camshaft turbo non turbo exhaust system and everything else needed to make power.
what?
Naw, what I think happened here is Stevie had a late night conversation with Ray Charles and Stevie missed a couple of things in the late night barrage of info. Js
Hahaha
You have to port with the light, lol. Not too much, you'll wash your eyes out, not too little it needs to cast shadows, and you need a basic understanding of how to read light and shadow.
your saying people with visual impairments cant do anything good?
Nope.....no yall to quick to judge now see. That there I seent before. The technique(don't mind the big words) is called "The Multi-V"! "V" for venturi. You gots to tune in the negative void of the VE table to proportionally gain from the losses in the positive VE table. Imagine you're standing at the edge of a lake.....
He learned how from helen keller.
it’s like an all star shop of sorts
Answer to your question no Stevie is now doing a internet welding school!