Goff does have probably the best perfect rating for the regular season ever though against the Vikings. He also has one of the few 0 passer ratings. Man is a god sometimes and a pedestrian others.
the limit on minimum attempts for a game to count in the passer ratings recordbooks is 20 attempts, and Goff went 18/18 so even if he had a perfect passer rating it still wouldn't have counted.
Even if it did net him a perfect rating, it wouldn't appear on Alex's chart because he only threw 18 attempts (which I think is kind of silly because the minimum attempts per game required to place in rate metrics is 14, not 20).
@@GrandDuchessTaco thanks for doing maths for us🎉 thats crazy. I think amount of offensive plays should factor in for that. They ran 50 plays total... seattle had 76 and 17 of those were pass plays. There were 2 pefect qbs for detroit in this game😂😂
@@dfp_01If those 14-19 attempt performances are included, then Fran Tarkenton in Week 6 of the 1970 season would pass the highest Lamar game at 228.9. Also, if we include pre-Super Bowl years, Len Dawson in 1963 vs the Broncos had a perfect passer rating and four touchdowns on only 15 attempts and that’s likely higher than Lamar.
A game so bad it basically by itself slapped an asterisk onto the claim that Manning won two Super Bowls. Like he was declining that season before that point, but that game really just put things into high relief that if/when the Broncos won the Super Bowl that year, it would be because all Manning needed to do with that defense was just not screw up too badly.
@@fanboy50 Yeah, it was startling how bad he was in that game. But in the playoffs, he was oddly impressive. He was throwing dead ducks, to be sure, but they were accurately thrown dead ducks that the Patriots somehow couldn't defend. Maybe it was like Jamie Moyer throwing the slowest fastballs. But I think we can all agree, Denver's defense that season was the true star.
@@johnchedsey1306 That's kind of what I mean, though: they didn't get that Super Bowl win because they had Peyton Manning at QB. They won it because the defense and run game were good enough that having a replacement-level QB was all they needed. He Trent Dilfer'd it.
@@johnchedsey1306 chad pennington made a career out of dead ducks, and despite having a noodle of an arm was pretty good. proved how important accuracy really is, peyton just didn't have the time to adjust to being that physically inept while still mentally capable.
If all of Pastorini's near picks were actual picks his uncapped passer rating would be -158.4. If we exclude the near-INTs on the same drive or near-INTs on drives that would end in real INTs that leaves him with 6 possible INTs for an uncapped rating of -98.9
As a statistician, there are some formulas that are necessarily simplified to ensure they don't convolute the directional answer. Frustratingly, some sports metrics such as quarterback rating should not be one of those. I love that you're dissecting the whole picture, both highs and lows.
@@BENgalFan1369 I think so, very versatile. I would recommend finding an industry that you're passionate about where statistics can be applied and valued.
@@BENgalFan1369Sure, but there just aren't a lot of those jobs available out there. But if you read up on the field, look for relevant jobs (even volunteer) while studying, you might get your dream job one day!
Could the opposite be true, too - that the equation or formula is too complicated that it can't give an accurate answer? I feel like sabermetrics in baseball are like this. I love baseball, but I feel like the "math nerds" (and I say that as someone whose father was a mathematician) have over-complicated it by looking at too many variables at the same time, including many that are largely theoretical.
Pastorini: Gosh, it sure is nice being able to relax and enjoy my autumn years now that everyone has completely forgotten about my infamously bad performance in that one game. Life is good! Secret Base: Um . . .
I was stunned that Ryan Leaf's Sept. 20, 1998 game against the Chiefs didn't come up .... until I realized he only threw 15 passing attempts, and thus didn't qualify. But because it was so terrible, here's his line: 1 compleition in 15 attempts for 4 yards and 2 interceptions. Yikes.
How about the raider trading stabler to get him. Which he breaks his leg and the back up QB is Jim plunkett who was the 1st overall player drafted in the same draft as Pastorini. That draft being the great qb draft before the 1984 draft. 1st Plunkett, 2nd Archie manning, and 3rd Dan.
@@DarklordZagarna when were you allowed to have illegal contact anywhere on the field? I remember the Mel Blount rule which allowed bump and run but that was for 5 yards after that you couldnt contact them. Before that defenders could only run with the receivers. So not sure when you were allowed to make contact outside of the first 5 yard?
@@jasonnelson6624 Your timeline is off. The "Mel Blount rule" PUT IN the 5-yard restriction in 1978. Before that, you could bump receivers anywhere and anytime a pass wasn't literally in the air to them.
"He got a free ticket to that game. He didn't get his money worth" is such a good burn. Also, I remember watching Manning during his last season. He was obviously too old to be playing, but he refused to retire. I'm glad he won the super bowl, but he definitely wasn't the same that year. I'm glad he retired rather than try to hang onto the glory days for one more season.
Steve Tensi I looked at Steve Tensi's Wikipedia page for his two 0.0 official passer ratings within the same season. There was no mention of them. What I did find was that after two years and 52 pass attempts in the AFL after being a 4th round pick (16th round NFL), this remarkable trade happened: "On August 15, 1967, shortly before the 1967 season, new coach and general manager Lou Saban traded Denver's #1 draft picks in the 1968 and 1969 common AFL-NFL draft for Tensi. These proved to be valuable picks for San Diego, becoming the #4 and #9 overall selections respectively."
1967 was his season of two 0.0 official passer rating games. His first had an uncapped rating of -3.125, which is a candidate for the highest uncapped rating for an official 0.0 game. That line was 6/20 for 55 yards with 2 INT. Tensi's second game had a -21.023 uncapped rating, which is more like it (3 INT in 22 attempts being the main difference).
In a slightly different universe, we'd be talking about Dan Pastorini's 9 INT game every time a QB throws 5 or 6. He should thank his lucky stars that he ended up with only 4 in that game.
Dan Pastorini was part of what was seen as the great QB draft (before the 84 draft). 1st Plunkett, 2nd Archie Manning, and 3rd Pastorini. People either dont know or forget Pastorini was a pro bowl QB the raider even traded stabler for him. Just for him to break his leg and back up the former 1st round pick of the same draft Jim plunkett takes and wins them the Super Bowl. Poor Pastorini 😂😂😂
Oof, I was at that Broncos-Chiefs game in 2015. After Manning went 5-20 for 35 yards and 4 INTs, Brock Osweiler came in and went 14-24 for 146 with one TD and another pick. Also, they combined for 5 sacks. Miserable, miserable game.
1:40 Gary Hogeboom, ex-Cowboys quarterback, not to be mistaken for Gary Hawkins, humble landscaper, who happens to be the same age and went to the same college in the same years as Gary Hogeboom, but is definitely NOT Gary Hogeboom
seeing terry bradshow on this list really gives me more perspective on the "That's how much more dire this could have been had Bradshaw slipped up even once. He didn’t." line from Section 1
It's not actually all THAT surprising that the guys with the most negative-rating games were pretty good-- if you're not, on the whole, pretty good, you just aren't going to get that long a leash. Pastorini famously got benched for Jim Plunkett in the 1980 season, for example, and that was pretty much the end of him as a credible NFL talent.
But what is the lowest rating that resulted in a win? Probably from defensive scores and running to a field goal, but still a funny thought. My guess is next video will create a new metric that will eliminate the rating bounds and also include running performance.
In 2010, Todd Collins went 6/16 for 32 yards and 4 INTs in a 23-6 win over the Panthers. This resulted in a capped passer rating of 6.2. Might not be the lowest but it’s definitely a contender
@@dfp_01I looked at that one and it's about a -1. I found a worse one, Norm Snead on November 14, 1976. 14 attempts, 2 picks, 3 completions for 26 yards and of course 0 TD yields a -6.24 true QBR if I mathed right
I remember when you covered that Kim McQuilken disasterpiece in the Falcons series. No passing performance has filled me with more horror than that one.
I was a huge Earl Campbell fan in my youth. In wondering how my beloved Earl Campbell could never beat those Steelers, I apparently, I blocked out how awful Dan Pastorini actually was. The 1970's look pretty wild. Some quarterbacks - Terry Bradshaw included - just liked slinging the ball around without any care.
I think the Basement is pretty obvious why the NFL doesn't want that metric out there in the world. But the literal upper bounds of the QB metric doesn't make any sense. Why not celebrate a QB who has an absolute romp of a game.
He had only 12 attempts in his only 0.0 rated game (week 17 of that 2006 Super Bowl season). He was 2 of 12 for 33 yards and 3 INTs. His uncapped passer rating was -76.7. Grossman's worst game with 20+ attempts had an official rating of 10.2.
Really would be cool to see one of these videos focus specifically on Super Bowl performances. I think the changed QBR statistics could showcase a new angle on how the NFC’s 15+ year straight Super Bowl wins hapoened.
When all the names are shown on the complete graph, I noticed the slight upward trend over time. It looks like NFL quarterbacks overall are slowly increasing in quality. Possibly what he was referring to at the end of the video when he said there was more to explore in another video.
A few fun facts about Bradshaw's five stinkers: [1] The Steelers actually won two of those games, and would have won three had the '71 Bears not managed to score two TDs in the final 4 minutes to squeak by 17-15. [2] In the one game where the opposing QB performed worse than Bradshaw, the Steelers still lost (just 11 attempts kept the Vikings' Bob Lee off the chart). [3] His worst game (-29.2 against Green Bay in 1970) was inflated by an 87 yard TD pass. If that had fallen incomplete his unbounded rating would have been -68.1 [4] Only one of those games - a 7-6 win against the Bengals - was during one of their Super Bowl years (1978).
I wouldn't mind an addendum to this about the lowest QB rating in a game without any minimum qualifier. Feels like there would be some gems there. After all, the true worst games ever QBed would see them benched before they get 20 attempts.
I’m actually sort of surprised there isn’t a bigger increase in the passer rating over the years. There seems to be some increase for sure, but I’d expect more since the standards for passer efficiency are much much higher today. Our friend Dan Pastorini actually made the Pro Bowl one year with more picks than TDs. Generally in the 70s, if you had more TDs than INTs and had a completion percentage above 50, you were a pretty good QB. Obviously you wouldn’t even make the roster with those stats today.
I always laugh a little bit when the formula gives someone a "perfect rating". The only way to get a TRULY perfect rating is if every pass thrown is completed, and completed for a touchdown. Anything less is NOT perfect.
Rewinder: 2006 Orange Bowl 3OTs Beef History: Lindros vs Flyers Organization Overlap: Greatest College Football Coach (Saban) and the Greatest NFL Coach (Belichick) coaching in the same division Beef History: Michael Jordan and Isiah Thomas Beef History: Phil Jackson and Pat Riley Untitled: Reggie Miller Untitled: Barry Sanders Untitled: Carl Yastrzemski Untitled: Ted Williams Untitled: Jim Kelly Collapse: Early 90s Bills Collapse: 1987-2000 Seminoles Collapse: Moneyball (2002) Athletics Rewinder: 2012 Olympic 100m Men’s Final Rewinder: The Catch By Willie Rewinder: Wide Right I, Wide Right II Rewinder: Hank Aaron and Barry Bonds breaking the respective HR record(s) Untitled: Don Nelson
How bad would/could it get if you accounted for sacks and/or fumbles as part of the passer rating formula? After all, a lost strip-sack is roughly as awful as an interception.
Next you should do this but adjust for the average passer rating for the year; passer rating was originally made so that a 66.7 rating would be considered average, but nowadays that rating would be terrible.
Big take away is that inorder to be allowed to have a really bad game is that you have to have been or be really good. Otherwise the coaches will pull you from it.
You're being very generous, but I don't think I could chuck the ball to the popcorn vendor even once, let alone on every snap. I'd stick to spiking it I think. 😅
I remember an episode of Sunday NFL Countdown back in ESPN's glory days where Chris Berman demonstrated passer rating by saying something to the effect of "I could throw a quick five-yard out to Sterling then throw the next 19 passes off the center's butt and I'd still have a better passer rating than so-and-so has this season." I forget who so-and-so was, but notwithstanding the penalties for ineligible receiver in Berman's example, that would indeed produce a passer rating just north of 40.
Passer rating is fine as long as you have a reasonable minimum threshold of games played. If you stack rank qbs by rating it’s very similar to rankings by more “advanced” metrics used now.
Noticed by his metric the highest rated game ever was played by Lamar Jackson. I think that was the 442 passing yards 4 TDs, 86% completion with 62 on the ground for 2 more TDs.
We've GOT to fix how interceptions are recorded. I'm sick of quarterbacks throwing perfect passes, only for receiver's to bumble it and allow it to bounce into a defender's arms. Call it a "Drop-Induced Fumble" out something, and credit it to the receiver, not the QB (although I'd be willing to assign it to the quarterback if it was a particularly errant throw). Aaron Rodgers only threw 6 interceptions in the entire 2014 season, and 5 of those only happened after the ball bounced out of the receiver's hands. Then again, I'd also be interested to see a stat created for "Dropped Interceptions" as well. I'll bet Aaron Rodgers wound be one of the all-time leaders of that stat, too; I've seen so many passes where the DB has him dead-to-rights, but the ball bounces off their hands. I actually think the way that Aaron overinflates his footballs has a lot to do with his low interception numbers, as well as explaining why veteran receivers like Jimmy Graham never really seemed to be able to catch what he threw to them.
I like that in this series, you've actually shown and demonstrated WHY there are artificial boundries for the Passer Rating stat. Take the Staubach game... two of the interceptions were because the RECEIVER dropped/batted the ball and a defender happened to come down with it. How is that the fault of the passer or of the pass? I argue that it's simply unfair to nail the passer for a receiver's poor performance or because of an act of chaos. On the flip side, when Santorini threw a screen pass that got tackled for a 5 yard loss... what would have happened if the receiver had slipped the tackle and taken it to the house? Well, then Santorini would get credit for a 60+ yards passing and a touchdown, when, again, his actual pass had NOTHING to do with the outcome of the play. It would be the runner's great move or a defender's poor tackle that made the play what it was. Why should the QB get credit for a touchdown pass? I think the limits put on the Passer Rating are an effort to reign in some of the nonsense that is the other passing stats. It's all imperfect, and the current calculation takes that into account. If you remove the barriers, the calculation would in many cases resemble GIGO (Garbage In, Garbage Out).
every other qb thats playing a reasonably normal game gets dinged for picks that arent their fault too, why should those who have otherwise been awful enough to be that low not get dinged? that makes no sense...you cant pick and choose the instances where picks that arent the QB's fault get properly incorporated into the formula and other instances of picks that arent the QB's fault dont get properly incorporated...why does an nba player who creates an open look for a teammate get credited with an assist just because his teammate happened to make the shot, whereas another instance of a player demonstrating the same exact skills and abilities in generating an open look for a teammate doesnt get an assist if their teammate happened to miss their open shot? everyone knows not all INTs are the fault of the QB, but that's way too slippery a slope to throw a bone to those who stunk the rest of the game that those who didnt dont get to receive. there's no way a formula can know who was at fault for an INT, and in the same way that its possible that someone threw a bunch of picks in which some werent his fault, its also possible that they all could have indeed been the QB's fault. you cant have a formula that assumes things one way or another
@@SecretBaseSBN That's exactly my point. Many stats don't accurately reflect the true effect of an athletic performance, in football or in other sports, so why should the passer rating be "perfected" when the info going into it is suspect? The boundries in place are an effort to reign in the chaos and restore some semblance of sanity to statistical analysis. Personally, I feel that the official scorer of football games should have some measure of judgment when it comes to INTs or even TD passes, similarly how a baseball scorer can decide between a hit or an error or a fielder's choice. If that were the case, then there would be less of a need for the boundries on Passer Rating.
just because passer rating is by nooooo means perfect even without the artificial boundaries, that doesnt mean they should just make it worse and be deceitful for no reason (and no, baselessly assuming all picks from low-pick games were earned while baselessly assuming not all picks from high-pick games were earned, which is in a way exactly what the formula does, is not a valid reason) in the same way that someone could have a game with 4 or 5 picks in which 1 or 2 werent their fault, someone could have a game with 4 or 5 picks in which all of 'em were indeed their fault in the same way that someone could have a game with 1 pick in which their lone pick wasnt their fault, someone could have a game with 1 pick in which the lone pick was their fault. yet the player with 4 or 5 picks in which 1 wasnt their fault is granted a mercy that the player who throws 1 pick in which the 1 wasnt their fault is not granted again, removing the boundaries would not be some magical answer that would make the passer rating formula some perfect be-all and end-all way to assess QB play, but it would sure as hell mitigate some issues, give it a hell of an improvement, remove the disingenuousness, and make it an even playing field
I knew as soon as the premise was explained that Manning was going to have the highest delta. He's had some of the worst games of all time despite his greatness.
Gotta get a shoutout to Jared Goff for his perfect game that wasn't perfect rating
Goff does have probably the best perfect rating for the regular season ever though against the Vikings. He also has one of the few 0 passer ratings. Man is a god sometimes and a pedestrian others.
@@69belhavenactually Lamar had the top 2 and Johnny unitis the 3rd
@@69belhavenlol Lamar’s were both against the Dolphins too
the limit on minimum attempts for a game to count in the passer ratings recordbooks is 20 attempts, and Goff went 18/18 so even if he had a perfect passer rating it still wouldn't have counted.
@@legochickenguy4938afaik it’s 14
Gotta love this coming right after Jared Goff got a passer rating of 155 despite a 100% completion percentage.
Even if it did net him a perfect rating, it wouldn't appear on Alex's chart because he only threw 18 attempts (which I think is kind of silly because the minimum attempts per game required to place in rate metrics is 14, not 20).
It may not be on the chart, but I did the math, and he was shorted by 35 points by artificial caps, his real rating was 190.
@@GrandDuchessTaco thanks for doing maths for us🎉 thats crazy. I think amount of offensive plays should factor in for that. They ran 50 plays total... seattle had 76 and 17 of those were pass plays. There were 2 pefect qbs for detroit in this game😂😂
If he threw that one touchdown instead of catching it, he would have had a perfect passer rating by a mile. Just shows how stupid of a metric it is.
@@dfp_01If those 14-19 attempt performances are included, then Fran Tarkenton in Week 6 of the 1970 season would pass the highest Lamar game at 228.9.
Also, if we include pre-Super Bowl years, Len Dawson in 1963 vs the Broncos had a perfect passer rating and four touchdowns on only 15 attempts and that’s likely higher than Lamar.
"my uncle scored a free ticket .. he did not get his money's worth" 😂😂😂😂
That is an amazing insult
When you're fresh out of long-form Dorktown sports documentaries but you luckily find a snack-sized version in the fridge.
That Peyton Manning is also notable because it's the game he broke the all-time passing yards record in
It was also the game that kicked off Denver's 16-game losing streak to KC.
A game so bad it basically by itself slapped an asterisk onto the claim that Manning won two Super Bowls. Like he was declining that season before that point, but that game really just put things into high relief that if/when the Broncos won the Super Bowl that year, it would be because all Manning needed to do with that defense was just not screw up too badly.
@@fanboy50 Yeah, it was startling how bad he was in that game. But in the playoffs, he was oddly impressive. He was throwing dead ducks, to be sure, but they were accurately thrown dead ducks that the Patriots somehow couldn't defend. Maybe it was like Jamie Moyer throwing the slowest fastballs. But I think we can all agree, Denver's defense that season was the true star.
@@johnchedsey1306 That's kind of what I mean, though: they didn't get that Super Bowl win because they had Peyton Manning at QB. They won it because the defense and run game were good enough that having a replacement-level QB was all they needed. He Trent Dilfer'd it.
@@johnchedsey1306 chad pennington made a career out of dead ducks, and despite having a noodle of an arm was pretty good. proved how important accuracy really is, peyton just didn't have the time to adjust to being that physically inept while still mentally capable.
If all of Pastorini's near picks were actual picks his uncapped passer rating would be -158.4.
If we exclude the near-INTs on the same drive or near-INTs on drives that would end in real INTs that leaves him with 6 possible INTs for an uncapped rating of -98.9
As a statistician, there are some formulas that are necessarily simplified to ensure they don't convolute the directional answer. Frustratingly, some sports metrics such as quarterback rating should not be one of those. I love that you're dissecting the whole picture, both highs and lows.
I'm in college to be one, is it a good job?
@@BENgalFan1369 I think so, very versatile. I would recommend finding an industry that you're passionate about where statistics can be applied and valued.
@@jtsholtod.79 does sports, specifically football count? Bc I have more passion for football then probably anybody I've ever met in real life
@@BENgalFan1369Sure, but there just aren't a lot of those jobs available out there. But if you read up on the field, look for relevant jobs (even volunteer) while studying, you might get your dream job one day!
Could the opposite be true, too - that the equation or formula is too complicated that it can't give an accurate answer? I feel like sabermetrics in baseball are like this. I love baseball, but I feel like the "math nerds" (and I say that as someone whose father was a mathematician) have over-complicated it by looking at too many variables at the same time, including many that are largely theoretical.
Pastorini: Gosh, it sure is nice being able to relax and enjoy my autumn years now that everyone has completely forgotten about my infamously bad performance in that one game. Life is good!
Secret Base: Um . . .
secret base: two games, dan
Honestly shocked the 2017 Nathan Peterman game with 5 INTs doesn't register that low
not enough passes, but was -91.4
tinyurl.com/5n82jxwp
@@SecretBaseSBN
Dear god.
@@SecretBaseSBN If you remove the -, it becomes an almost reasonable rating😂
Peterman had a 17.9 passer rating in that game as his completion percentage and yards per attempt were above 30% and 3.0 yards/att, respectively.
@@ugosmith7529 Removing the 5 INTs might also help
the episode focusing on how passer rating can hide just how good a players game really was was nice and all, but im glad we all get to be haters now
People forget that, back in the day, it was perfectly normal to have more INTs than TDs.
"Three things can happen when you pass, and two of them are bad."
It wasn't until 84 Dan Marino when that became a thing.
Possibly...but more INTs than completions has always been a rarity.
Hey, Namath, Bradshaw and Stabler threw more picks than TDs over their entire careers and they did alright
@@LordTeaboBagginsbradshaw barely misses out on this 212 to 210
“Tries his hand with his feet … oooh that’s a shame” 😂😂😂
Pastorini's reaction of "Not again" is the perfect punchline to the worst performance ever 😂
I was stunned that Ryan Leaf's Sept. 20, 1998 game against the Chiefs didn't come up .... until I realized he only threw 15 passing attempts, and thus didn't qualify. But because it was so terrible, here's his line: 1 compleition in 15 attempts for 4 yards and 2 interceptions. Yikes.
tinyurl.com/599rjfj9
-46.8, so believe it or not there've been 7 games worse even in a 20-pass threshold
Fun fact: Pastorini was a pro bowler for the 1975 season. He had a 47.7% completion percentage that year, with 14 TDs and 16 INTs.
Which just goes to show how much the NFL was dominated by defense in the 70s.
How about the raider trading stabler to get him. Which he breaks his leg and the back up QB is Jim plunkett who was the 1st overall player drafted in the same draft as Pastorini. That draft being the great qb draft before the 1984 draft. 1st Plunkett, 2nd Archie manning, and 3rd Dan.
Turns out that when you allow what would now be illegal contact anywhere on the field, it's kind of hard to run routes.
@@DarklordZagarna when were you allowed to have illegal contact anywhere on the field? I remember the Mel Blount rule which allowed bump and run but that was for 5 yards after that you couldnt contact them. Before that defenders could only run with the receivers. So not sure when you were allowed to make contact outside of the first 5 yard?
@@jasonnelson6624 Your timeline is off. The "Mel Blount rule" PUT IN the 5-yard restriction in 1978. Before that, you could bump receivers anywhere and anytime a pass wasn't literally in the air to them.
I didn't know I needed this series until it started. Superb work.
"He got a free ticket to that game. He didn't get his money worth" is such a good burn.
Also, I remember watching Manning during his last season. He was obviously too old to be playing, but he refused to retire. I'm glad he won the super bowl, but he definitely wasn't the same that year. I'm glad he retired rather than try to hang onto the glory days for one more season.
Hilarious that Pastorini had that bad of a game then literally was still their QB 7 years later. Different kind of patience in those days
I mean, you saw that offensive line, right? 2008 Tom Brady ain't doing shit behind that O-line
I still remember when Pittsburg wanted to get rid of Bradshaw. They even benched him.
@psymar 08 Brady? If memory serves he played a single game that year.
What's also funny is Pastorini was a pro bowler in 1975 with 14 tds to 16 ints. Looking at other QB stats that year It actually makes no sense how.
Steve Tensi
I looked at Steve Tensi's Wikipedia page for his two 0.0 official passer ratings within the same season. There was no mention of them. What I did find was that after two years and 52 pass attempts in the AFL after being a 4th round pick (16th round NFL), this remarkable trade happened:
"On August 15, 1967, shortly before the 1967 season, new coach and general manager Lou Saban traded Denver's #1 draft picks in the 1968 and 1969 common AFL-NFL draft for Tensi. These proved to be valuable picks for San Diego, becoming the #4 and #9 overall selections respectively."
1967 was his season of two 0.0 official passer rating games. His first had an uncapped rating of -3.125, which is a candidate for the highest uncapped rating for an official 0.0 game. That line was 6/20 for 55 yards with 2 INT.
Tensi's second game had a -21.023 uncapped rating, which is more like it (3 INT in 22 attempts being the main difference).
In a slightly different universe, we'd be talking about Dan Pastorini's 9 INT game every time a QB throws 5 or 6. He should thank his lucky stars that he ended up with only 4 in that game.
That's how bad his play was that day - neither his team nor his opponents could catch his passes 😂
Hi emily
Dan Pastorini was part of what was seen as the great QB draft (before the 84 draft). 1st Plunkett, 2nd Archie Manning, and 3rd Pastorini. People either dont know or forget Pastorini was a pro bowl QB the raider even traded stabler for him. Just for him to break his leg and back up the former 1st round pick of the same draft Jim plunkett takes and wins them the Super Bowl. Poor Pastorini 😂😂😂
Oof, I was at that Broncos-Chiefs game in 2015. After Manning went 5-20 for 35 yards and 4 INTs, Brock Osweiler came in and went 14-24 for 146 with one TD and another pick. Also, they combined for 5 sacks. Miserable, miserable game.
1:40 Gary Hogeboom, ex-Cowboys quarterback, not to be mistaken for Gary Hawkins, humble landscaper, who happens to be the same age and went to the same college in the same years as Gary Hogeboom, but is definitely NOT Gary Hogeboom
Nice Survivor Guatemala reference!
Is this Peridiam's alt account?
@@pandaplayr73 no but I'm a fan of that channel so I probably picked up that way to talk about it unconsciously from him
fun fact: that "Pastrana" down in the 1970-ish Fun Zone is Alan Pastrana - who is, indeed, Travis' dad.
i cant believe this video had 0 mention of nathan peterman
Once again secret base blesses us 🙏
2:20 Lynn Dickey, my boy! Can we get a Prism on this dude? There's a story somewhere.
Perhaps one of the most unusual careers. A very average QB with both historic highs and historic lows.
seeing terry bradshow on this list really gives me more perspective on the "That's how much more dire this could have been had Bradshaw slipped up even once. He didn’t." line from Section 1
It's not actually all THAT surprising that the guys with the most negative-rating games were pretty good-- if you're not, on the whole, pretty good, you just aren't going to get that long a leash. Pastorini famously got benched for Jim Plunkett in the 1980 season, for example, and that was pretty much the end of him as a credible NFL talent.
4:01 - "Ahhhhhhh, that's a shame" had me cackling out loud.
But what is the lowest rating that resulted in a win? Probably from defensive scores and running to a field goal, but still a funny thought.
My guess is next video will create a new metric that will eliminate the rating bounds and also include running performance.
My guess is it would come from the Falcons-Rams game where both QBs finished with a truncated passer rating of 0. But I'm not sure.
In 2010, Todd Collins went 6/16 for 32 yards and 4 INTs in a 23-6 win over the Panthers. This resulted in a capped passer rating of 6.2. Might not be the lowest but it’s definitely a contender
@@daleftuprightatsoldierfieldgood pull
Probably a Bradshaw or Tarketon game. Neither are terrible quarterbacks, but their defenses did most of the work
@@dfp_01I looked at that one and it's about a -1. I found a worse one, Norm Snead on November 14, 1976. 14 attempts, 2 picks, 3 completions for 26 yards and of course 0 TD yields a -6.24 true QBR if I mathed right
I remember when you covered that Kim McQuilken disasterpiece in the Falcons series. No passing performance has filled me with more horror than that one.
I was a huge Earl Campbell fan in my youth. In wondering how my beloved Earl Campbell could never beat those Steelers, I apparently, I blocked out how awful Dan Pastorini actually was. The 1970's look pretty wild. Some quarterbacks - Terry Bradshaw included - just liked slinging the ball around without any care.
I think the Basement is pretty obvious why the NFL doesn't want that metric out there in the world. But the literal upper bounds of the QB metric doesn't make any sense. Why not celebrate a QB who has an absolute romp of a game.
Passer rating has been so stupid and made no sense to me. Glad to see it is actually broken and I wasn't just being dumb.
Both can be true 😊
Shoutout to Lynn Dickey: the hottest of hots, and the coldest of cold
Didnt Rex Grossman have a passer rating of 0 at least once? That season was a wild ride for Bears fans
He had only 12 attempts in his only 0.0 rated game (week 17 of that 2006 Super Bowl season). He was 2 of 12 for 33 yards and 3 INTs. His uncapped passer rating was -76.7.
Grossman's worst game with 20+ attempts had an official rating of 10.2.
The answer, when it comes to individual performances and career in general, is and always will be Nathan Peterman.
Gotta add Jared Goff from the other night onto this list!
Incredible episode.
babe wake up new secret base video just dropped
10:01 I got an ad that started with the word “prime” right before Alex could say it here O_o
I like how his passes to Raiders DBs resulted in more drops and less picks than his passes to Raiders DLs 😂
I love that Dan Pastorini played so bad in this game that he couldn’t complete an interception despite him, throwing it straight in their chest
In conclusion, Lynn Dickey is a land of contrasts. Thank you.
Dan Pastorini has entered the chat.
Screw you guys.
Dan Pastorini has left the chat.
Hearing Grogan's name at the end hurt my heart. I still love ya Steve. Toughest QB ever.
I saw the title and the Oilers logo and thought, "Yeah, that sounds about right."
Really would be cool to see one of these videos focus specifically on Super Bowl performances. I think the changed QBR statistics could showcase a new angle on how the NFC’s 15+ year straight Super Bowl wins hapoened.
So Goff going 19-19 this week won’t make this graphic which is wild.
i'm a Jon Bois lifer but it's refreshing to know that Alex Rubenstein can hold his own without him
Jon bois moved on from simple sports
When all the names are shown on the complete graph, I noticed the slight upward trend over time. It looks like NFL quarterbacks overall are slowly increasing in quality. Possibly what he was referring to at the end of the video when he said there was more to explore in another video.
Most unskippable ads ive seen on a vid in years. Ive seen less on a 5 hour essay on film than this 15 min one 😂
Ah, Nathan Peterman. The Most Negative QB Ratio.
A few fun facts about Bradshaw's five stinkers:
[1] The Steelers actually won two of those games, and would have won three had the '71 Bears not managed to score two TDs in the final 4 minutes to squeak by 17-15.
[2] In the one game where the opposing QB performed worse than Bradshaw, the Steelers still lost (just 11 attempts kept the Vikings' Bob Lee off the chart).
[3] His worst game (-29.2 against Green Bay in 1970) was inflated by an 87 yard TD pass. If that had fallen incomplete his unbounded rating would have been -68.1
[4] Only one of those games - a 7-6 win against the Bengals - was during one of their Super Bowl years (1978).
I did some quick math on Goff’s recent performance. I got about 189.95 real Passer Rating.
tinyurl.com/msn4ca8y
close :)
@@SecretBaseSBNThanks. I figured I was off by a bit given how I was doing the math, but being under by less than a tenth is pretty good.
Gary Hogeboom sightings always make my day.
Now we need "The NFL's most average QB performances are actually more bland than they have us believe"
I wouldn't mind an addendum to this about the lowest QB rating in a game without any minimum qualifier. Feels like there would be some gems there. After all, the true worst games ever QBed would see them benched before they get 20 attempts.
stathead.com/tiny/vGLIt
no minimum qualifier? then it'd be a 679-way tie at -414.58, so hopefully you see the point of the minimum qualifier :)
1:57 as a browns fan, having only one QB on this list shocked me
This is literally just a class on passer rating. They should use this in college algebra classes across the globe
Quote To JG9:
... Which is worse than spiking the ball onto the ground, on every single play.
Those iconic Oilers uniforms,RIP house of pain!
Where's Rex Grossman on the list. He always gave me hope- I always felt that I too could throw a 0.0 QBR.
I’m actually sort of surprised there isn’t a bigger increase in the passer rating over the years. There seems to be some increase for sure, but I’d expect more since the standards for passer efficiency are much much higher today. Our friend Dan Pastorini actually made the Pro Bowl one year with more picks than TDs. Generally in the 70s, if you had more TDs than INTs and had a completion percentage above 50, you were a pretty good QB. Obviously you wouldn’t even make the roster with those stats today.
babe wake up secret base just posted
It’s a wonder how Miami wasn’t shell shocked enough to pick another Dan as their QB after a performance like that🤣
I always laugh a little bit when the formula gives someone a "perfect rating". The only way to get a TRULY perfect rating is if every pass thrown is completed, and completed for a touchdown. Anything less is NOT perfect.
This epic QB suck fest will look familiar to Jets, Bears and Browns fans.
Three of the worst at drafting and training a prospective QB.
Rewinder: 2006 Orange Bowl 3OTs
Beef History: Lindros vs Flyers Organization
Overlap: Greatest College Football Coach (Saban) and the Greatest NFL Coach (Belichick) coaching in the same division
Beef History: Michael Jordan and Isiah Thomas
Beef History: Phil Jackson and Pat Riley
Untitled: Reggie Miller
Untitled: Barry Sanders
Untitled: Carl Yastrzemski
Untitled: Ted Williams
Untitled: Jim Kelly
Collapse: Early 90s Bills
Collapse: 1987-2000 Seminoles
Collapse: Moneyball (2002) Athletics
Rewinder: 2012 Olympic 100m Men’s Final
Rewinder: The Catch By Willie
Rewinder: Wide Right I, Wide Right II
Rewinder: Hank Aaron and Barry Bonds breaking the respective HR record(s)
Untitled: Don Nelson
1972 Jack Tatum was really about not intercepting passes thrown directly at him huh
My biggest takeaway from this series so far is that Alex Does. Not. Like. Lynn Dickey
I need Lynn Dickey to be a guest on the Manningcast at some point, please and thank you.
How bad would/could it get if you accounted for sacks and/or fumbles as part of the passer rating formula? After all, a lost strip-sack is roughly as awful as an interception.
Next you should do this but adjust for the average passer rating for the year; passer rating was originally made so that a 66.7 rating would be considered average, but nowadays that rating would be terrible.
Do an episode on what passing yards would look like if YAC was only applied to the receiver
Big take away is that inorder to be allowed to have a really bad game is that you have to have been or be really good. Otherwise the coaches will pull you from it.
What would Pastorini's passer rating be including those 4 dropped INTs?
I need to see Will Levis throw all his passes at the vender to see what the QB rating will be
You're being very generous, but I don't think I could chuck the ball to the popcorn vendor even once, let alone on every snap. I'd stick to spiking it I think. 😅
I remember an episode of Sunday NFL Countdown back in ESPN's glory days where Chris Berman demonstrated passer rating by saying something to the effect of "I could throw a quick five-yard out to Sterling then throw the next 19 passes off the center's butt and I'd still have a better passer rating than so-and-so has this season." I forget who so-and-so was, but notwithstanding the penalties for ineligible receiver in Berman's example, that would indeed produce a passer rating just north of 40.
I never heard of a football being referred to as a can of corn
Is there a way to see the full actual passer rating list online? Like this video but with stats and dates 😂
All im here for is the 0.0 vs 0.0 game from the falcons doc
RIP Pastorini, you’d love Jackson Arnold
This is wonderful.
10:25 I’m sorry WHO
"I have a passer rating of zero....right now"
We played an 8-on-11 JV game once. 1/7 -2 Passing yards 0 Interceptions. Not ideal.
3:14 Jack Tatum let those passes fall on purpose because they didn't come with an opportunity to paralyze someone
Passer rating is fine as long as you have a reasonable minimum threshold of games played. If you stack rank qbs by rating it’s very similar to rankings by more “advanced” metrics used now.
Noticed by his metric the highest rated game ever was played by Lamar Jackson. I think that was the 442 passing yards 4 TDs, 86% completion with 62 on the ground for 2 more TDs.
Does anyone know why we even have passer rating in the first place? No other position has a grade.
Johnny Football, it’s your time to shine
We've GOT to fix how interceptions are recorded. I'm sick of quarterbacks throwing perfect passes, only for receiver's to bumble it and allow it to bounce into a defender's arms. Call it a "Drop-Induced Fumble" out something, and credit it to the receiver, not the QB (although I'd be willing to assign it to the quarterback if it was a particularly errant throw). Aaron Rodgers only threw 6 interceptions in the entire 2014 season, and 5 of those only happened after the ball bounced out of the receiver's hands.
Then again, I'd also be interested to see a stat created for "Dropped Interceptions" as well. I'll bet Aaron Rodgers wound be one of the all-time leaders of that stat, too; I've seen so many passes where the DB has him dead-to-rights, but the ball bounces off their hands. I actually think the way that Aaron overinflates his footballs has a lot to do with his low interception numbers, as well as explaining why veteran receivers like Jimmy Graham never really seemed to be able to catch what he threw to them.
I like that in this series, you've actually shown and demonstrated WHY there are artificial boundries for the Passer Rating stat.
Take the Staubach game... two of the interceptions were because the RECEIVER dropped/batted the ball and a defender happened to come down with it. How is that the fault of the passer or of the pass? I argue that it's simply unfair to nail the passer for a receiver's poor performance or because of an act of chaos.
On the flip side, when Santorini threw a screen pass that got tackled for a 5 yard loss... what would have happened if the receiver had slipped the tackle and taken it to the house? Well, then Santorini would get credit for a 60+ yards passing and a touchdown, when, again, his actual pass had NOTHING to do with the outcome of the play. It would be the runner's great move or a defender's poor tackle that made the play what it was. Why should the QB get credit for a touchdown pass?
I think the limits put on the Passer Rating are an effort to reign in some of the nonsense that is the other passing stats. It's all imperfect, and the current calculation takes that into account. If you remove the barriers, the calculation would in many cases resemble GIGO (Garbage In, Garbage Out).
every other qb thats playing a reasonably normal game gets dinged for picks that arent their fault too, why should those who have otherwise been awful enough to be that low not get dinged? that makes no sense...you cant pick and choose the instances where picks that arent the QB's fault get properly incorporated into the formula and other instances of picks that arent the QB's fault dont get properly incorporated...why does an nba player who creates an open look for a teammate get credited with an assist just because his teammate happened to make the shot, whereas another instance of a player demonstrating the same exact skills and abilities in generating an open look for a teammate doesnt get an assist if their teammate happened to miss their open shot? everyone knows not all INTs are the fault of the QB, but that's way too slippery a slope to throw a bone to those who stunk the rest of the game that those who didnt dont get to receive. there's no way a formula can know who was at fault for an INT, and in the same way that its possible that someone threw a bunch of picks in which some werent his fault, its also possible that they all could have indeed been the QB's fault. you cant have a formula that assumes things one way or another
@@SecretBaseSBN That's exactly my point. Many stats don't accurately reflect the true effect of an athletic performance, in football or in other sports, so why should the passer rating be "perfected" when the info going into it is suspect? The boundries in place are an effort to reign in the chaos and restore some semblance of sanity to statistical analysis.
Personally, I feel that the official scorer of football games should have some measure of judgment when it comes to INTs or even TD passes, similarly how a baseball scorer can decide between a hit or an error or a fielder's choice. If that were the case, then there would be less of a need for the boundries on Passer Rating.
just because passer rating is by nooooo means perfect even without the artificial boundaries, that doesnt mean they should just make it worse and be deceitful for no reason (and no, baselessly assuming all picks from low-pick games were earned while baselessly assuming not all picks from high-pick games were earned, which is in a way exactly what the formula does, is not a valid reason)
in the same way that someone could have a game with 4 or 5 picks in which 1 or 2 werent their fault, someone could have a game with 4 or 5 picks in which all of 'em were indeed their fault
in the same way that someone could have a game with 1 pick in which their lone pick wasnt their fault, someone could have a game with 1 pick in which the lone pick was their fault.
yet the player with 4 or 5 picks in which 1 wasnt their fault is granted a mercy that the player who throws 1 pick in which the 1 wasnt their fault is not granted
again, removing the boundaries would not be some magical answer that would make the passer rating formula some perfect be-all and end-all way to assess QB play, but it would sure as hell mitigate some issues, give it a hell of an improvement, remove the disingenuousness, and make it an even playing field
I see why they say they were plumbers back then.
I knew as soon as the premise was explained that Manning was going to have the highest delta. He's had some of the worst games of all time despite his greatness.
I was surprised to see that his 2004 AFCCG rating wasn't constrained at all
Poor Dan, tough as nails an nearly killed on field, he tried his heart out with the worst of teams
I'm pretty sure it was never meant to be used for individual games. Still good videos.
2:38 - can we all marvel at the 1970’s era take that scrambling and improvising are *not* skills that are prized in a “well-coached pro quarterback”?
Unless your name was Fran Tarkenton and your coach was Bud Grant, that was a pretty good rule of thumb in the '70s.
@NFL Fix this, 90% of the work is already done for you.