The question is so simple, and so is the answer. It's warhammerer. Perhaps even warhammerest. It smashes, bashes, splashes and looks absolutely fire on a book cover. The thing could be rocking a rocket launcher 6, two medium lasers, and a slew of light mgs and I'd still want to own the model!
With an endo-steel chassis, 13 tons of ferro-fibrous armor for maximum protrection, and a 320 standard fusion engine, a custom Warhammer IIC could fit 2 ER PPCs, 2 Medium Pulse Lasers, 1 Small Pulse Laser, a Streak SRM-6 with 1 ton of ammo and a CASE II, a targeting computer, and 18 double heat sinks, which would make it an exceptionally powerful 'Mech and arguably better than the original.
I've loved the Warhammer IIc, for a while now, I've made one the commander of my Mercenary company (battalion) the Asphalt Angels. I really fell in love when I saw that it had a standard engine, because I had some bad experiences with xl engines. But when I put this on the table for the first time you should have seen the look on my friend's face when he realized that my Warhammer can max out it's best to deal 8 damage in alpha strike. It was glorious. We're going to do a classic game either this week or next, and my Warhammer will destroy his King Crab. When we start doing ilclan battles, I might swap my standard for the 13 because dang, all the firepower of the original plus two lrms? For only the cost of a clan xl? Sounds like a good deal.
@@MechanicalFrog The IIC-13 is amazing, and one of my favorite mechs. If your dice cooperate in the slightest, you are in for a fun evening of laying waste to your opponents.
I know there is a very passionate community of Rotary Autocannon fans out there. I don't know what your arguments are because I cannot hear anything over the dakka dakka.
@@MechanicalFrog It's the whole idea of a mech that has one or two of the A-10 Thunderbolt II's gatling tankbusters mounted on it. That's enough to give a big gun fan a hard-on for days right there! 😄
Can't say I feel the same, had a Hunchback IIC4 in my Clan Wolf Command Trinery, the RAC 5's kept jamming two shots into an Alpha Strike. No I run it as a IIC5, it actually pairs quite well with its Warhammer IIC and Marauder IIC9 Star mates.
Probably one of my favorite Clan adaptations of a chassis that always has a spot reserved for it on my roster. As for imitating the Rifleman IIC, I'd prefer to have a Rifleman IIC instead. Warhammers are cool as all get-go, but they don't have the happiest of happy hats.
Simple, we love it because it´s a WARHAMMER, just better! The artwork certainly did its part, it´s such a nice frog-perspective shot of the mech. The LRM variant is in my opinion meant to be used together wit hthe regular one, so the pulse lasers would still be there, just on the other mech. After all support mechs are meant to go with others, not alone, that would be what brawlers and flankers do. Variant 7 seems nice, but how often do you need such a niché build? The ATM is a nice touch though. Tactically so flexible.
I loved the Warhammer IIC. Personally, my favourite is the 3, the Heavy Larges do work! In my first use of it, the IIC 3 got into a duel with an IS Warhammer, and both slowly walked into each other, firing the whole time. Eventually, it became a kick fight. The IS Warhammer kicked the IIC's leg off, but the IIC kicked the IS so hard, it caused a torso to blow off, leading to engine death. The IIC spent the rest of the game on his side, firing shots like a turret. Got two more kills like that, too. Another funny time, it was "sniping" with its heavy laser, in so far as one can, when my friend sent in a light Mech to harass the IIC and make it stop. The look on his face when I said "Five Medium Pulse Lasers" was priceless! Great video, and thanks for letting me know that Targeting Computers do aid Pulse Lasers!
Hard to pass up the primary as that combo of 2 Clan ER PPCs & 5 MPLs is just so versatile & reliable. I can see a roke for the II & XIII if you can take advantage of indirect fire, but besides that just give me ol' reliable. Thanks Frog as I needed some WHM In my day today.
It's funny, I like the standard Marauder more than the standard Warhammer but I prefer the Warhammer IIC to the Marauder IIC. Solid Mech, one of my picks if the Highlander IIC is in the shop or I need the Warhammer's fire support abilities.
Whenever I run Ghost Bear, I almost always run my Stars as second-line with IICs making up the main force and a single omni pulling up the command slot. The exact population changes from iteration to iteration, but there is always, ***ALWAYS*** a Warhammer IIC. It's just such a reliable machine.
You just cant beat the OG Warhammer IIC. Its a true assault mech that, like its predecessor, is just a solid design. I think the MWDA clix model of the Warhammer IIC (from the Falcon’s Prey expansion) is made to represent the loadout of the X variant, though I am not sure if the X was developed for BT yet. I love both the old VMI/RP sculpt and the new CGL one. The Phoenix version isn’t bad either, and might be the best looking “reseen” mech of the whole batch.
My favorite mech of all time is the Warhammer. The IIC version is just the pinnacle for me. Nothing it can't do, and for about 1/3 the price (from a resource perspective) of a fancy ass omni-mech it's likely to stomp into the ground.
this is the way, take 2 warhammer iics, take 2 highlanders iic and a vapor eagle. 52 odd million cbills, and watch whole companies of inner sphere mechs just evaporate. and that is star 1 out of 9 the Overlord C carries... good times.
First time I fielded a IIC on regular tabletop (not alpha strike) walked it into a city and ran into a Hunchback with an AC20. Fired both the PPCs and was lucky with the dice rolls that day. Scored three critical hits to the engine and it exploded magnificently. Haven't been able to recreate that since...
Ahhh...My favorite 'Mech. From running one in Mechwarrior 2, to the sweet sweet beautiful artwork done by Victor Musical Industries, Inc. for the unrevised version of BattleTech Technical Readout 3055(look at that chad 'Mechspreading stance!), to the PGI and CGL models(we do not talk about the Project Phoenix abominations in my house), if you want a brawler that will keep coming for the enemy, go with the Warhammer IIC. I love this 'Mech so much, one of my prized possessions is a T-shirt with the VMI version of the Warhammer IIC. Everything about it warrants a justifiably fearsome reputation. Durability with the standard engine in stock loadout combined with a generous amount of ferro fibrous armor, a full weapons loadout that is not affected by minimum range, very good heatsinking, two decapitator weapons, and a damage output that outstrips pretty much everything but the Dire Wolf line of 'Mechs. Whilst most Clan players want the flashy sports car vibe of an Omnimech, I will happily, lovingly and faithfully stay with the classic "muscle car" romance of my Warhammer IIC. Thank you, MechFrog, for being one of only two youtubers I have found to give this burly beauty the shine in the spotlight she deserves(Death From Above Wargaming is the other, with the Battlytics video on the Warhammer IIC). Looking forward to watching all your videos on the Clan IIC Battlemechs.
When in doubt, send in the Warhammer. If the mission is critical, send in the Warhammer. When you must not only survive but WIN, send in the Warhammer. The IIC rebuild of the Warhammer only drives this point home that much harder when you consider that it is still in production centuries later, and is still a desired and preferred mech for Clan warriors who have access to newer designs with newer weapons. Sometimes you simply can not beat an old proven warhorse, and nothing says warhorse like the Warhammer. I love to use my Mercenary's 13's from behind cover only to surprise the lights when they come in expecting dedicated fire support mechs, only to find Warhammer 13's waiting for them. The look on your opponent's face is worth the C-bills for admission. Mind the ammo bins tho, they could be bit larger if you use the LRMs as primary offensive weapons, and an ECM, JJs, or DHS could be added at the cost of the SRM6 in my opinion without any real detriment to the design.
Back in the day when my buddies and i used to play the MechWarrior RPG, i once rolled a Warhammer IIC on one of the few times we played Clan characters. Took that beast into the Grand Melee for a Blood Name, and WHOOBOY! I felt like a God. I usually played Comstar characters, so wasn't used to that level of technological efficiency. What a design.
@@MechanicalFrog it's telling that I remember playing the character, rolling the mech, and EXACTLY how well that battle went with the mech ... But I can't for the life of me, remember what Blood Name that character earned. I'm a Comstar zealot.
I see all these upgraded dirty clan mechs, and I wonder where is my Crab IIc. The Crab was a wonderful star league mech. Loved by both its pilots and mechanics. Many left with the exodus. What do we get!? Abominations like the great wyrm and jenner IIc! Both based on mechs from the nasty dracs! This perfectly illustrates the flaws inherent in clan society and the need to eliminate them at every opportunity.
@@andersalbertsson215 The Supernova is essentially a King Crab IIC designed to eliminate the AC20 ammo and ranged combat concerns. The Turkina is more like the Jade Falcons' answer to the Dire Wolf imo. Also, the Crab got the Omnimech treatment by Clan Coyote in a mech called the Night Chanter. It's... okay, but even the Clans knew the Crab didn't really need tinkered with lol
@@MechanicalFrog Putting my Jade Falcon hat on, I can see a Crab IIC with a large pulse laser in each arm, 2 ER medium lasers and a small pulse laser in the torso, and jump jets, along with those Clan double heat sinks and an endo-steel frame. Maybe a targeting computer to make those lasers extra accurate if there's still room
i run custom IS versions. don't remember the speed unfortunately, but it does carry 2 heavy PPC's with those jacket things. And just enough heat sinks to review your life insurance policy.
Only problem i have with the Warhammer are those low-swept arms; they are easy to exploit via terrain, while the Warhammer itself is a tall target. (this is a non-issue in the tabletop but I primarily play MechWarrior over BattleTech) Apart from that, it fills most roles well and lends itself exceptionally well to modification. The IIC Prime is essentially the Warhammer brought to its fullest potential; an all-range direct-fire attacker where nothing is truly safe from its assault; especially with Clan ER-PPCs being some of the deadliest weapons for their tonnage at ludicrous ranges.
Agreed. It's always interesting to get the MWO/MW5 player perspective on mechs. Things a tabletop player doesn't necessarily have to deal with like mech height.
The TT versions presume that unlike MW0/MW5 the pilot has working shoulder actuators he can use, which can lift the PPC arms sideways to shoulder height to clear obstacles. And which also allows the PPCs to be used to clothesline charging Medium and Light mechs too!
@@observationsfromthebunker9639 I mean, those would still be really hard to aim since you'd still lack the second and third degree of freedom that wrists and elbows provide.
@@atmosdwagon4656 The Warhammer 2C does have rudimentary elbows in the form of the joints that move the cannon "forearms", as does the original Warhammer. At a horizontal level, the PPC s will readily move and aim inwards instead of upwards, allowing for an excellent amount of converging fire. Any foe that somehow manages to move inward through the arcs of the PPCs there will be in easy range of the missiles and torso guns.
@@observationsfromthebunker9639 The problem there is when you rotate the arms at the shoulders 90 degrees upward to elevate them above cover, you've now also rotated the lower swivel-joint elbows 90 degrees, which means they are longer traversing along their original horizontal axis, but the vertical axis. And it's pretty easy to see that they would struggle to aim precisely from such an awkward position. I find it hard to believe they would be able to shoot above cover with any degree of accuracy unless their targets were completely immobile. The original rules seem to assume this degree of freedom for a lot of mechs that frankly shouldn't have that ability at all for the simplicity of facilitating an otherwise minor aspect of gameplay. And that's perfectly acceptable for a tabletop game since those already run on high degrees of abstraction anyway. Funnily enough, the MWO Warhammer model has ball joint elbows instead of swivel-joints, which WOULD allow for that degree of freedom when the arms are elevated...except the MWO Warhammer's shoulders are also fully-armor-cowled at the top, which would prevent them from elevating the arms in that manner to begin with.
Your comment about the Warhammer IIC 10 inspired my Warhammer IIC ISM, just so you know. Not sure if you'll like it, but I took the IIC 10 and dropped all of the weapons in favor of 4 Large Pulse Lasers, an Active Probe, a Laser AMS, and bringing the armor up to 18.5 tons of Heat-Resistant Armor. It is also the 100th design I've made in the Mech Factory App.
OUTSTANDING, Frog!!! Ever since you did the vid about my beloved Marauder 2C I've been chomping at the bit for you to do it's battle-brother the Warhammer 2C...and you did NOT disappoint! I had no idea that there were that many variants. The original is still my mech of choice after the M2c; but, the 13 is certainly giving me pause on that selection. Any chance we'll be seeing a vid on the Phoenix Hawk 2C sometime soon...?
I'm not going to leave any silly comment here or nothing, it's a Warhammer that is built with clan tech. Genuinely it's just a good all-around thing as long as you don't try and punch someone in the face with it
I did run a custom build once long ago with the 4 Large pulses I remember it being a scary thing to deal with at any range but fitting in other weapons while keeping the thing cool is the issue. The full build was 4 Large pulses, 4 ER small lasers, and a SRM6 cooled with 22 double heatsinks and one coolant pod encase of emergencies. I forget what the engine size was but I am pretty sure it was an XL at least.
I love the Warhammer IIC as well as the original Whammie. I think my favorite campaign "moment" was when I got VERY luck on a salvage roll and picked up a couple of intact clan-tech ER-PPCs, which I installed on my traditional Warhammer. My buddy called it a "II-C wannabe". Tore it up on the field. Love that twin ER-PPC combo. If you want to run this beast, don't mess around, just take the original. Its a handful!
Heat-dissipating armor is kinda terrible, it's some of the heaviest and bulkiest available for niche benefits compared to using regular armor and adding extra heat sinks.
Interesting show that you put on here, quarks there are and there of....I was waging a war Solaris style with 5 vs 5 battle. Two heavier mechs ganged up on me, bcoz I was the Star. Short of the story, I alphastriked one heavy mech, went Crit and exploded next to the other ganger mech that took some collateral damage. He got mad and wanted to take me down. Almost did but he was just laserated my armor thru structure without Crit, still standing and 6rack gone. I had no armor left and everytime he tries, he fails to Crit. So yeah, my mech was a meatless stick, but I again alphastriked the last other dude and he went down bcoz he lost his leg, fell and almost blew up, but I was the last standing, all the while, no armor, just exo and only 6rack gone. 2ppc, 4med lasers still online! After I shed my weight in gold I just simply walked away enough to default me a 2for1 win. Lol
I love the Warhammer. I've never used the Warhammer IIC, but I recently got the CGL sculpt for it, and plan on building a lance or two with nothing but Warhammer's.
Under the KISS doctrine... base IIC, drop Ferro, go XL, drop 1 MPLaser, add L-AMS & ECM, increase to 15.5t Armor, upgrade to Streak6 (1t A), increase to 22DHS, add targeting computer. (BV2 3095)
Of all the varients i like the 13 the most. Having goid long range with mid and close combat capabilities is nice for almost all situations. I know pulse lasers get that bonus to accuracy, but i would like to see a varient of the XIII that drops the pulses for regular mediums, giving 5 tons to play around with. Maybe an extra ton of armour and extra heat sinks and then a defensive system like a LAMS to allow you to negate return missle fire when engaging at long range with your lrm 15s and er ppcs.
@MechanicalFrog understandable. I know people love them. i just can never justify the extra ton of armor over the standard mediums. But that is just my bias against them. I know they have their reason for being and so many people are using them. Otherwise, they woulda phased out long ago
I know the answer to the quest for 4 large pulse lasers , you'll even get a targeting computer , 2 ER mediums and 2 heavy mediums that you'll only fire for lols
I need to use a Warhammer IIC more. Only ran it once so far and I messed up my deployment bad. Never really got in the fight. As a Ravens Alliance player, I need to use the 13.
I've run both the Awesome -11M (8x lppcs & 4 caps) and the Battlemaster Calvin(RAC 5 , 2x lppc, 6 medium lasers and SRM 6) in megamek. Both are great for crit seeking, but neither one has a good can opener that can expose those crits. Variant 9 suffers from the same problem.
i dunno how many free slots are in the original build has, but i feel like 2 small pulse lasers would have kept it even closer to the IS warhammer, with the ability to shredd inf. but since the clans have elementals i can see why they went with MPLs exclusive.
The 2C 13 is my favorite. All the versatility of the original, but you can swap out the LRMs for SRM6s, and that gives it weight savings for extra heat sinks or gear, a nasty long range punch plus a devastating short-range sandblast, and even after the SRM's are out of ammo you have the 5 med pulses to be a serious deterrent. Why the fuck they even bothered with the LRM15's at all, I have no idea.
Just getting into the lore because of MW5 Mercs, any chance you could do some more faction guides and history? There’s an insane amount lore to dive into and you seem to have that aspect down more than most.
Rewatching tonight; the Warhammer IIC 2 is super widespread in the MUL in a way the original is not; if you use the MUL, its the difference between having one, or not in many eras for IS houses.
It's strange that there's no Archer IIC. Easy fix tho. 70 Tons. Endosteel. 4x cLRM20, 3x Er ML ( minus a rear facing ML ). 8 tons of ammo. Case. 10 DHS.
I..don't actually. For me its a basic issue in that the Warhammer IIC is designed to be "fair" with the Inner Sphere. It could easily carry around 40 LRMs. I used the Warhammer IIC all the time Mechwarrior IV Mercenaries when it went Freeware. The Original Warhammer IIC is well armed for a mech and easily curbstomps Inner Sphere mechs from 3025, and challenges 3050 ones quite well. The Warhammer IIC would be very good if it was 75ton Heavy unit. It would be a solid budget unit with a low price-tag and a solid brawler. It was Warhammer IIC 2 and Warhammer IIC 4 were the first miniatures of the Warhammer IIC in the Dark Age game. They had dual shoulder missile pods. That colored my perception of what a Warhammer IIC should be. The flaws of the Warhammer IIC make sense when you look at it internally. It uses a powerful engine for an 80ton unit, and its a standard not an Extralight. This means Its actually fairly light in actual weaponry. The Warhammer IIC is oddly enough a modern Battlemaster, only missing some machine guns. I would probably take a Stone Rhino instead. Its designed to be heavily armed and armored, with Jump jets to boot. It also uses a standard engine making it quite cheap.
@Pestolents neither, unfortunately. I was 12 in 1986 and fell in love with the F-14 Tomcat. They were all retired in 2006 :( Also I've gone by Straycat since 1993
Correct, no minimum range. However, compared to medium pulse lasers, you're going to be doing less damage on average due to the to-hit roll differences and the missile hit table.
Hi not that table top, but mech warrior 5, try dual heavy rifles, dual binary lasers, 3 er m clan lasers, with dual clan lrm 20. it rocks. have fun leona.
@@MechanicalFrog The other LRM variants interest me, but I think I will stick with the more flexible IIC4. Just wish the ER Small Laser was a flamer instead.
Pulse Lasers are not compatible with Targeting Computers, so there is no +3 to-hit bonus. that's a mistake in the design, and wasted tonnage. The only ways you can get a +3 are the Actuator Enhancement System and the Accurate Weapon Quirk.
yeeep walking up a hill in a torny menny years ago in my nicely pained warhammer to be greated by 3 Er PPCs from a massa and 2 of them hit the head not a bloody strach on it that was gong con for you about 23 years ago
@@MechanicalFrog Never used one because I was an anti-clanner guy when I started in BattleTech & MechWarrior. But now. I want to get my PC fixed, game table out and play the mech in both mediums. The thing sounds great. And a redo. 👍 You got me there friend.
Too bad you did the IIC line of mechs before you started including the mechfrog variants. I''d have loved to have seen what you did with the Warhammer IIC.
The problem with XXL engines isn't the vulnerability to side torso destruction, it's making the price tag look like it was confused with a DropShip.
Hah!
It's crazy that the base 2C is still really viable in the ilclan era. The dang thing is still kicking butt after 300 years!
Antiques for the win!
@@MechanicalFrogas a clan blood spirit collector I second this
If the IS can use the same mechs foe 500 years, the Clan Second Line can keep going for 200+.
The question is so simple, and so is the answer. It's warhammerer. Perhaps even warhammerest. It smashes, bashes, splashes and looks absolutely fire on a book cover.
The thing could be rocking a rocket launcher 6, two medium lasers, and a slew of light mgs and I'd still want to own the model!
Hah! That's fair reasoning. :D
I.... in spite of myself, I want this monstrosity you've described...
With an endo-steel chassis, 13 tons of ferro-fibrous armor for maximum protrection, and a 320 standard fusion engine, a custom Warhammer IIC could fit 2 ER PPCs, 2 Medium Pulse Lasers, 1 Small Pulse Laser, a Streak SRM-6 with 1 ton of ammo and a CASE II, a targeting computer, and 18 double heat sinks, which would make it an exceptionally powerful 'Mech and arguably better than the original.
Quite nice.
Oh. I am SO stealing that loadout...
Arguably better. Just a nice tweak to keep with the times.
I've loved the Warhammer IIc, for a while now, I've made one the commander of my Mercenary company (battalion) the Asphalt Angels. I really fell in love when I saw that it had a standard engine, because I had some bad experiences with xl engines. But when I put this on the table for the first time you should have seen the look on my friend's face when he realized that my Warhammer can max out it's best to deal 8 damage in alpha strike. It was glorious. We're going to do a classic game either this week or next, and my Warhammer will destroy his King Crab. When we start doing ilclan battles, I might swap my standard for the 13 because dang, all the firepower of the original plus two lrms? For only the cost of a clan xl? Sounds like a good deal.
I definitely want to try the IIC-13 out and see if it's worth the XL risk over a few games.
@@MechanicalFrog The IIC-13 is amazing, and one of my favorite mechs. If your dice cooperate in the slightest, you are in for a fun evening of laying waste to your opponents.
I can see that.@@Dang_Near_Fed_Up
"Unless you are really into RAC 5s..." Say less my guy, I'll take your whole stock!
I know there is a very passionate community of Rotary Autocannon fans out there. I don't know what your arguments are because I cannot hear anything over the dakka dakka.
@@MechanicalFrog It's the whole idea of a mech that has one or two of the A-10 Thunderbolt II's gatling tankbusters mounted on it. That's enough to give a big gun fan a hard-on for days right there! 😄
Can't say I feel the same, had a Hunchback IIC4 in my Clan Wolf Command Trinery, the RAC 5's kept jamming two shots into an Alpha Strike. No I run it as a IIC5, it actually pairs quite well with its Warhammer IIC and Marauder IIC9 Star mates.
Rac hammer is a rich man's rifleman
Hahaha aircraft go *pop*
I suppose if you have the money to spend...
Probably one of my favorite Clan adaptations of a chassis that always has a spot reserved for it on my roster.
As for imitating the Rifleman IIC, I'd prefer to have a Rifleman IIC instead. Warhammers are cool as all get-go, but they don't have the happiest of happy hats.
Hats do make mechs 15.7% cooler... it's just science.
Simple, we love it because it´s a WARHAMMER, just better! The artwork certainly did its part, it´s such a nice frog-perspective shot of the mech.
The LRM variant is in my opinion meant to be used together wit hthe regular one, so the pulse lasers would still be there, just on the other mech.
After all support mechs are meant to go with others, not alone, that would be what brawlers and flankers do.
Variant 7 seems nice, but how often do you need such a niché build? The ATM is a nice touch though. Tactically so flexible.
So in short, "It's good but better!" :D
@@MechanicalFrog Or even shorter, It´s gooder!
The math checks out.@@sim.frischh9781
I loved the Warhammer IIC. Personally, my favourite is the 3, the Heavy Larges do work! In my first use of it, the IIC 3 got into a duel with an IS Warhammer, and both slowly walked into each other, firing the whole time. Eventually, it became a kick fight. The IS Warhammer kicked the IIC's leg off, but the IIC kicked the IS so hard, it caused a torso to blow off, leading to engine death. The IIC spent the rest of the game on his side, firing shots like a turret. Got two more kills like that, too.
Another funny time, it was "sniping" with its heavy laser, in so far as one can, when my friend sent in a light Mech to harass the IIC and make it stop. The look on his face when I said "Five Medium Pulse Lasers" was priceless!
Great video, and thanks for letting me know that Targeting Computers do aid Pulse Lasers!
Warhammer IIC - Easy to punch, hard to kill.
@@MechanicalFrog A wonderous, beautiful, miraculous battleship on legs
These things are terrifying. They are very tough and can deal out a lot of damage.
Fighting them builds character.
Hard to pass up the primary as that combo of 2 Clan ER PPCs & 5 MPLs is just so versatile & reliable. I can see a roke for the II & XIII if you can take advantage of indirect fire, but besides that just give me ol' reliable. Thanks Frog as I needed some WHM In my day today.
Right on. Have a great day!
It's funny, I like the standard Marauder more than the standard Warhammer but I prefer the Warhammer IIC to the Marauder IIC. Solid Mech, one of my picks if the Highlander IIC is in the shop or I need the Warhammer's fire support abilities.
It's nice to have the option. :D
I used the ATM variant to brawl down an executioner. My Warhamster did lose most if it’s armor in the duel but it, and I, did win.
It just works.
Whenever I run Ghost Bear, I almost always run my Stars as second-line with IICs making up the main force and a single omni pulling up the command slot. The exact population changes from iteration to iteration, but there is always, ***ALWAYS*** a Warhammer IIC. It's just such a reliable machine.
I just played a match with my son where my Warhammer IIC took out a Warhawk and an OG Warhammer. It is a beast.
You just cant beat the OG Warhammer IIC. Its a true assault mech that, like its predecessor, is just a solid design. I think the MWDA clix model of the Warhammer IIC (from the Falcon’s Prey expansion) is made to represent the loadout of the X variant, though I am not sure if the X was developed for BT yet. I love both the old VMI/RP sculpt and the new CGL one. The Phoenix version isn’t bad either, and might be the best looking “reseen” mech of the whole batch.
The project phoenix design is fine, it just doesn't scream Warhammer to me.
My favorite mech of all time is the Warhammer. The IIC version is just the pinnacle for me. Nothing it can't do, and for about 1/3 the price (from a resource perspective) of a fancy ass omni-mech it's likely to stomp into the ground.
Both the OG and IIC are just fun machines. That counts a lot for building a lance/star.
this is the way, take 2 warhammer iics, take 2 highlanders iic and a vapor eagle. 52 odd million cbills, and watch whole companies of inner sphere mechs just evaporate. and that is star 1 out of 9 the Overlord C carries... good times.
Everyone goes home happy!
@@MechanicalFrog Well... Everyone who's piloting a Warhammer IIc that is
The XIII resembles the version from Macross (Robotech), one of my favorites.
Excellent crossover potential then. :D
as a child of the 80s who grew up watching Macross/Robotech it's difficult not to recognize an iconic design
@@brothersgt.grauwolff6716 Same. Watched when I got home from high school.
First time I fielded a IIC on regular tabletop (not alpha strike) walked it into a city and ran into a Hunchback with an AC20. Fired both the PPCs and was lucky with the dice rolls that day. Scored three critical hits to the engine and it exploded magnificently. Haven't been able to recreate that since...
Must have been a fun moment.
It's a tale of TT heroism for the ages!
Ahhh...My favorite 'Mech. From running one in Mechwarrior 2, to the sweet sweet beautiful artwork done by Victor Musical Industries, Inc. for the unrevised version of BattleTech Technical Readout 3055(look at that chad 'Mechspreading stance!), to the PGI and CGL models(we do not talk about the Project Phoenix abominations in my house), if you want a brawler that will keep coming for the enemy, go with the Warhammer IIC. I love this 'Mech so much, one of my prized possessions is a T-shirt with the VMI version of the Warhammer IIC. Everything about it warrants a justifiably fearsome reputation. Durability with the standard engine in stock loadout combined with a generous amount of ferro fibrous armor, a full weapons loadout that is not affected by minimum range, very good heatsinking, two decapitator weapons, and a damage output that outstrips pretty much everything but the Dire Wolf line of 'Mechs. Whilst most Clan players want the flashy sports car vibe of an Omnimech, I will happily, lovingly and faithfully stay with the classic "muscle car" romance of my Warhammer IIC.
Thank you, MechFrog, for being one of only two youtubers I have found to give this burly beauty the shine in the spotlight she deserves(Death From Above Wargaming is the other, with the Battlytics video on the Warhammer IIC). Looking forward to watching all your videos on the Clan IIC Battlemechs.
Glad you gave it a go. The Warhammer IIC is what a teacher would call, "a quality producer." It just works well.
When in doubt, send in the Warhammer. If the mission is critical, send in the Warhammer. When you must not only survive but WIN, send in the Warhammer. The IIC rebuild of the Warhammer only drives this point home that much harder when you consider that it is still in production centuries later, and is still a desired and preferred mech for Clan warriors who have access to newer designs with newer weapons. Sometimes you simply can not beat an old proven warhorse, and nothing says warhorse like the Warhammer.
I love to use my Mercenary's 13's from behind cover only to surprise the lights when they come in expecting dedicated fire support mechs, only to find Warhammer 13's waiting for them. The look on your opponent's face is worth the C-bills for admission.
Mind the ammo bins tho, they could be bit larger if you use the LRMs as primary offensive weapons, and an ECM, JJs, or DHS could be added at the cost of the SRM6 in my opinion without any real detriment to the design.
It's a quality producer. Won't let you down.
Back in the day when my buddies and i used to play the MechWarrior RPG, i once rolled a Warhammer IIC on one of the few times we played Clan characters.
Took that beast into the Grand Melee for a Blood Name, and WHOOBOY! I felt like a God.
I usually played Comstar characters, so wasn't used to that level of technological efficiency. What a design.
It's a fun one, for sure.
@@MechanicalFrog it's telling that I remember playing the character, rolling the mech, and EXACTLY how well that battle went with the mech ... But I can't for the life of me, remember what Blood Name that character earned. I'm a Comstar zealot.
Hrm...
My favourites here are the base model and the 13. One for endurance, the other for firepower. A spear and a shield, if you will.
Fair.
My favorite mech after the Marauder IIC.
It's a solid and fun one, for sure.
I see all these upgraded dirty clan mechs, and I wonder where is my Crab IIc.
The Crab was a wonderful star league mech. Loved by both its pilots and mechanics. Many left with the exodus. What do we get!?
Abominations like the great wyrm and jenner IIc! Both based on mechs from the nasty dracs!
This perfectly illustrates the flaws inherent in clan society and the need to eliminate them at every opportunity.
Turkina is almost a King Crab IIC
@@andersalbertsson215 The Supernova is essentially a King Crab IIC designed to eliminate the AC20 ammo and ranged combat concerns. The Turkina is more like the Jade Falcons' answer to the Dire Wolf imo.
Also, the Crab got the Omnimech treatment by Clan Coyote in a mech called the Night Chanter. It's... okay, but even the Clans knew the Crab didn't really need tinkered with lol
I can see a Crab IIC rocking double heat sinks and a bevy of medium pulse lasers that just melt faces.
@@MechanicalFrog Putting my Jade Falcon hat on, I can see a Crab IIC with a large pulse laser in each arm, 2 ER medium lasers and a small pulse laser in the torso, and jump jets, along with those Clan double heat sinks and an endo-steel frame. Maybe a targeting computer to make those lasers extra accurate if there's still room
Yeah I could see that.@@JadeHarpy
i run custom IS versions. don't remember the speed unfortunately, but it does carry 2 heavy PPC's with those jacket things. And just enough heat sinks to review your life insurance policy.
A couple of Heavy PPCs can ruin someone's whole day... :D
Only problem i have with the Warhammer are those low-swept arms; they are easy to exploit via terrain, while the Warhammer itself is a tall target. (this is a non-issue in the tabletop but I primarily play MechWarrior over BattleTech)
Apart from that, it fills most roles well and lends itself exceptionally well to modification.
The IIC Prime is essentially the Warhammer brought to its fullest potential; an all-range direct-fire attacker where nothing is truly safe from its assault; especially with Clan ER-PPCs being some of the deadliest weapons for their tonnage at ludicrous ranges.
Agreed. It's always interesting to get the MWO/MW5 player perspective on mechs. Things a tabletop player doesn't necessarily have to deal with like mech height.
The TT versions presume that unlike MW0/MW5 the pilot has working shoulder actuators he can use, which can lift the PPC arms sideways to shoulder height to clear obstacles. And which also allows the PPCs to be used to clothesline charging Medium and Light mechs too!
@@observationsfromthebunker9639 I mean, those would still be really hard to aim since you'd still lack the second and third degree of freedom that wrists and elbows provide.
@@atmosdwagon4656 The Warhammer 2C does have rudimentary elbows in the form of the joints that move the cannon "forearms", as does the original Warhammer. At a horizontal level, the PPC s will readily move and aim inwards instead of upwards, allowing for an excellent amount of converging fire. Any foe that somehow manages to move inward through the arcs of the PPCs there will be in easy range of the missiles and torso guns.
@@observationsfromthebunker9639 The problem there is when you rotate the arms at the shoulders 90 degrees upward to elevate them above cover, you've now also rotated the lower swivel-joint elbows 90 degrees, which means they are longer traversing along their original horizontal axis, but the vertical axis.
And it's pretty easy to see that they would struggle to aim precisely from such an awkward position. I find it hard to believe they would be able to shoot above cover with any degree of accuracy unless their targets were completely immobile.
The original rules seem to assume this degree of freedom for a lot of mechs that frankly shouldn't have that ability at all for the simplicity of facilitating an otherwise minor aspect of gameplay. And that's perfectly acceptable for a tabletop game since those already run on high degrees of abstraction anyway.
Funnily enough, the MWO Warhammer model has ball joint elbows instead of swivel-joints, which WOULD allow for that degree of freedom when the arms are elevated...except the MWO Warhammer's shoulders are also fully-armor-cowled at the top, which would prevent them from elevating the arms in that manner to begin with.
Your comment about the Warhammer IIC 10 inspired my Warhammer IIC ISM, just so you know. Not sure if you'll like it, but I took the IIC 10 and dropped all of the weapons in favor of 4 Large Pulse Lasers, an Active Probe, a Laser AMS, and bringing the armor up to 18.5 tons of Heat-Resistant Armor. It is also the 100th design I've made in the Mech Factory App.
It's everything the Warhammer was and more, and it's everything the Hellbringer wishes it could be.
Cool new background!
The old TV was taking up a lot of real estate on the screen without providing much purpose, so we upgraded.
OUTSTANDING, Frog!!! Ever since you did the vid about my beloved Marauder 2C I've been chomping at the bit for you to do it's battle-brother the Warhammer 2C...and you did NOT disappoint! I had no idea that there were that many variants. The original is still my mech of choice after the M2c; but, the 13 is certainly giving me pause on that selection. Any chance we'll be seeing a vid on the Phoenix Hawk 2C sometime soon...?
I think we're all champing at the bit for the Phoenix Hawk IIC video... #Soon
@@MechanicalFrog AWESOME!!! HIT ME!!!
I'm not going to leave any silly comment here or nothing, it's a Warhammer that is built with clan tech. Genuinely it's just a good all-around thing as long as you don't try and punch someone in the face with it
I did run a custom build once long ago with the 4 Large pulses I remember it being a scary thing to deal with at any range but fitting in other weapons while keeping the thing cool is the issue. The full build was 4 Large pulses, 4 ER small lasers, and a SRM6 cooled with 22 double heatsinks and one coolant pod encase of emergencies. I forget what the engine size was but I am pretty sure it was an XL at least.
I love the Warhammer IIC as well as the original Whammie. I think my favorite campaign "moment" was when I got VERY luck on a salvage roll and picked up a couple of intact clan-tech ER-PPCs, which I installed on my traditional Warhammer. My buddy called it a "II-C wannabe". Tore it up on the field. Love that twin ER-PPC combo. If you want to run this beast, don't mess around, just take the original. Its a handful!
Quite the find on that salvage roll.
loving the law videos mate please keep them coming
Will do!
It's a thing of beauty and wonder
Seylah!
Heat-dissipating armor is kinda terrible, it's some of the heaviest and bulkiest available for niche benefits compared to using regular armor and adding extra heat sinks.
Very very niche.
Interesting show that you put on here, quarks there are and there of....I was waging a war Solaris style with 5 vs 5 battle. Two heavier mechs ganged up on me, bcoz I was the Star. Short of the story, I alphastriked one heavy mech, went Crit and exploded next to the other ganger mech that took some collateral damage. He got mad and wanted to take me down. Almost did but he was just laserated my armor thru structure without Crit, still standing and 6rack gone. I had no armor left and everytime he tries, he fails to Crit. So yeah, my mech was a meatless stick, but I again alphastriked the last other dude and he went down bcoz he lost his leg, fell and almost blew up, but I was the last standing, all the while, no armor, just exo and only 6rack gone. 2ppc, 4med lasers still online! After I shed my weight in gold I just simply walked away enough to default me a 2for1 win. Lol
Everyone loves the warhammer cause it's Japanese and used by the SDF and survived Earth being destroyed.
O_o
@@MechanicalFrog You should see the upgrades to the warhammer in the movie Macross 2 but I prefer Macross DYRL version better. :-P
Destroid Tomahawk IIC
*Gasping in crossover art*
Spot on, "because it's a Warhammer"!
Could have been a very short video...
@@MechanicalFrogThat wouldn't have been nearly as fun.
I love the Warhammer. I've never used the Warhammer IIC, but I recently got the CGL sculpt for it, and plan on building a lance or two with nothing but Warhammer's.
It's definitely one of the more powerful mechs of its time. It'll perform well for you.
It's a Wammy, but chonky-er. Love it
Well put.
Under the KISS doctrine... base IIC, drop Ferro, go XL, drop 1 MPLaser, add L-AMS & ECM, increase to 15.5t Armor, upgrade to Streak6 (1t A), increase to 22DHS, add targeting computer. (BV2 3095)
Accurate, and horrifying. The total package.
Of all the varients i like the 13 the most. Having goid long range with mid and close combat capabilities is nice for almost all situations. I know pulse lasers get that bonus to accuracy, but i would like to see a varient of the XIII that drops the pulses for regular mediums, giving 5 tons to play around with. Maybe an extra ton of armour and extra heat sinks and then a defensive system like a LAMS to allow you to negate return missle fire when engaging at long range with your lrm 15s and er ppcs.
Would be interesting. I just love pulse lasers too much to give them up unless it's for something really really nice.
@MechanicalFrog understandable. I know people love them. i just can never justify the extra ton of armor over the standard mediums. But that is just my bias against them. I know they have their reason for being and so many people are using them. Otherwise, they woulda phased out long ago
We loved/hated him. The design, however is gorgeous. 😍
Agreed!
I know the answer to the quest for 4 large pulse lasers , you'll even get a targeting computer , 2 ER mediums and 2 heavy mediums that you'll only fire for lols
"We call this one, The Jade Falcon Light Show." Buckle up.
@@MechanicalFrog the Supernova it's deserves its own why do we love
I need to use a Warhammer IIC more. Only ran it once so far and I messed up my deployment bad. Never really got in the fight. As a Ravens Alliance player, I need to use the 13.
A moral imperative.
I've run both the Awesome -11M (8x lppcs & 4 caps) and the Battlemaster Calvin(RAC 5 , 2x lppc, 6 medium lasers and SRM 6) in megamek. Both are great for crit seeking, but neither one has a good can opener that can expose those crits. Variant 9 suffers from the same problem.
I can see that.
In MW-5-M run this with 2 ER PPC in each arm complete with capacitors. Too much power!
Stomping around shooting lightning like nobody's business.
Might be a dumb question, but how is it -3 to hit with the MPLs around 6:08?
-1 for PL, -1 for Targeting Computer... where's the other coming from?
Pulse lasers are -2.
The XIII is basically the OG Macross loadout.
i dunno how many free slots are in the original build has, but i feel like 2 small pulse lasers would have kept it even closer to the IS warhammer, with the ability to shredd inf. but since the clans have elementals i can see why they went with MPLs exclusive.
The clan MPL is just a monster. Hard to turn it down.
Because it's a Warhammer, but even better😊 Another great vid Frog.
Thanks!
A personal favorite on my table.
Never a mech you can ignore.
The 2C 13 is my favorite. All the versatility of the original, but you can swap out the LRMs for SRM6s, and that gives it weight savings for extra heat sinks or gear, a nasty long range punch plus a devastating short-range sandblast, and even after the SRM's are out of ammo you have the 5 med pulses to be a serious deterrent. Why the fuck they even bothered with the LRM15's at all, I have no idea.
I suppose it would boil down to how you intend to use it.
Gotta hand it to Clan Star Adder, they knew what they were doing when they designed their mechs.
Yeah the Warhammer IIC is pretty darn close to a perfect battlemech.
Just getting into the lore because of MW5 Mercs, any chance you could do some more faction guides and history? There’s an insane amount lore to dive into and you seem to have that aspect down more than most.
Do you mean a video on each of the great houses?
Rewatching tonight; the Warhammer IIC 2 is super widespread in the MUL in a way the original is not; if you use the MUL, its the difference between having one, or not in many eras for IS houses.
Because the head doesn't look like a surprised duck with machine guns on top! #Duckhammer
Clan Rubber Ducky is the true IlClan.
Because it’s significantly cheaper and less likely to swap rules than the other Warhammer?
Oops, broke the 4th wall!😂
More seriously, to me, the original is just the coolest.
Upgrading it is just sprinkles on top.
More of a good thing, simple as that. This video could have been 10 seconds long.
It's strange that there's no Archer IIC.
Easy fix tho.
70 Tons.
Endosteel.
4x cLRM20,
3x Er ML ( minus a rear facing ML ).
8 tons of ammo.
Case.
10 DHS.
Is there any mech that uses 2 ac10s and 2 large lasers spread across the arms
While I'm not sure, the DVS-2 Devastator has a Gauss Rifle in each arm and a PPC in each side torso.
This is one of the only mechs that people would pick over an Atlas and thats saying something!
Now that would be a fun fight.
I..don't actually. For me its a basic issue in that the Warhammer IIC is designed to be "fair" with the Inner Sphere. It could easily carry around 40 LRMs. I used the Warhammer IIC all the time Mechwarrior IV Mercenaries when it went Freeware.
The Original Warhammer IIC is well armed for a mech and easily curbstomps Inner Sphere mechs from 3025, and challenges 3050 ones quite well. The Warhammer IIC would be very good if it was 75ton Heavy unit. It would be a solid budget unit with a low price-tag and a solid brawler.
It was Warhammer IIC 2 and Warhammer IIC 4 were the first miniatures of the Warhammer IIC in the Dark Age game. They had dual shoulder missile pods. That colored my perception of what a Warhammer IIC should be.
The flaws of the Warhammer IIC make sense when you look at it internally. It uses a powerful engine for an 80ton unit, and its a standard not an Extralight. This means Its actually fairly light in actual weaponry. The Warhammer IIC is oddly enough a modern Battlemaster, only missing some machine guns.
I would probably take a Stone Rhino instead. Its designed to be heavily armed and armored, with Jump jets to boot. It also uses a standard engine making it quite cheap.
"Fair" designs plague the Clan mechs... A bit of a, "Oops we made these guys way too good and have to compensate."
A warhammer iic with 4 large pulse would look like a rufleman IIC lol :-) great overview of a nasty mech that ive seen eaten by a kraken :-)
Thank ya much!
Any day that Froggy posts a mech video is a Good Day
I guess I better get started on the next one then. :D
I know that patch. VF-31 and VF-2 myself. You?
@Pestolents neither, unfortunately. I was 12 in 1986 and fell in love with the F-14 Tomcat. They were all retired in 2006 :(
Also I've gone by Straycat since 1993
And the OG Gunslinger program top gun ..
It'll leave a mark.
In draconis combine, warhammer loves you 😊
With ppcs
Toasty warm blue lightning hugs.
The Warhammer IIC 2: because you know what the real problem with the OG Warhammer was? It wasn't faithful enough to the Macross canon
Fair point.
What not to love Warhammer when it can be uptonned to become better?
Seylah!
As much as I like ATMs, I can't justify giving up the cMPL for it.
It's a big ask.
It can actually make use of its weapons compliment without simply melting down into a heap of slag . .
A tall order for some mechs.
QUERY: IIc II - clan LRMs have no minimum range, correct? So how do those two LRM 15s at point blank...
Correct, no minimum range. However, compared to medium pulse lasers, you're going to be doing less damage on average due to the to-hit roll differences and the missile hit table.
@@MechanicalFrog true true, on the LRM side [ sand blast for crits?
I love hearing peoples logic behind their builds - application etc
I wonder how many IS Warhammers it would take to take down one Warhammer IIC?
Would boil down to rolls but, I could easily see the IIC being able to take down 2-3.
@@MechanicalFrog 3 for sure. 2 would come down to rolls like you say. Video idea 🙂.
"Lift up those who had suffered," and then subject them to an eternity of serfdom and abuse. Go clowns go!
"My brand of feudalism is cheeky and fun. Your brand of feudalism is tragic and sad."
Hi not that table top, but mech warrior 5, try dual heavy rifles, dual binary lasers, 3 er m clan lasers, with dual clan lrm 20. it rocks. have fun leona.
Sounds scary.
I have a bit of a soft spot for this one. I have one from a game store that is no longer around and sadly won't be coming back.
The tragedy of the lost FLGS...
@@MechanicalFrog And the tragedy of lost family.
Finally.
Indeed...
@@MechanicalFrog The other LRM variants interest me, but I think I will stick with the more flexible IIC4. Just wish the ER Small Laser was a flamer instead.
I still find the first 2C to be the overall nastiest...
It's quite good.
Pulse Lasers are not compatible with Targeting Computers, so there is no +3 to-hit bonus. that's a mistake in the design, and wasted tonnage. The only ways you can get a +3 are the Actuator Enhancement System and the Accurate Weapon Quirk.
Total Warfare, page 113 states that pulse weaponry can use a targeting computer however not for aimed shots.
yeeep walking up a hill in a torny menny years ago in my nicely pained warhammer to be greated
by 3 Er PPCs from a massa and 2 of them hit the head
not a bloody strach on it
that was gong con for you about 23 years ago
Such is life... those double sixes eventually come for us all.
Shucks. I'm annoyed this video slipped by me. I love Warhammers. And a Clan Star Adder mech as well.
It's on my short list to redo early next year now that I have a more consistent style and method. Great mech.
@@MechanicalFrog Never used one because I was an anti-clanner guy when I started in BattleTech & MechWarrior. But now. I want to get my PC fixed, game table out and play the mech in both mediums. The thing sounds great.
And a redo. 👍
You got me there friend.
:)
There is no Why Do We Love video for the classic Warhammer?!
Especially for the 6D?!
Call the inquisition... oh wait, wrong universe...
Some day...
Too bad you did the IIC line of mechs before you started including the mechfrog variants. I''d have loved to have seen what you did with the Warhammer IIC.
Yeah I plan on re-doing the IIC videos at some point with the updated format/quality.
yaay \o/
Seylah!
Whammy iic.....aka Thug iic
Hmm... I suppose you can call it what you like, but not to its face.
@@MechanicalFrog lol true