@@jonboy9734 yeah overpenetration is not an issue with 5.56, a lot of 5.56 rounds actually underpenetrate, most cheap hollow points in 5.56 or .223 penetrate less than 10 inches in gel. bonded soft points, all copper hollow points, heavyweight OTMs, and FMJ is all I'll trust my life to out of an AR.
You can be the most intelligent person in the world and still be unable to get the things you need. It's never what you know, it's always about who you know and whom you chose to befriend that can support you and you them.
Well, I never stole from the Army but if I was in now and we were qualifying, I'd be sure to "pocket" a couple hundred rounds these days. Used to find alot of unfired but not misfired rounds around the shooting positions from double feeds, rounds not going into the chamber right, clearing rifles, etc. When "policing" the brass we would find most of the brass and always live rounds. Some were misfires but most not.
The military version has a crimped primer, like the one that hornady uses on their match ammo. It looks like another circle around the primer. Hard to see if you dont expect it, sometimes it gets me on reloading, won't catch it until I go to prime.
Thank's 1SHOT I have been loading 77gr. Sierra Matchking hp, Lake City brass, Hodgdon CFE powder and CCI primers to get a good load. My loads are running 2669 give or take. I'm pretty sure I can go with a little hotter load. When speed fails just add weight!? From 55gr to 77gr. But hey?! Those old slower heavy cartridges are a thing of the past? I'd be interested in the same two watermelons and your AK with a good hollow point ammo equivalent to or as close as possible Black Hills Sierra Matchking hp bullet for comparison at suburban combat ranges. Excellent work! Keep'em coming!
Cfe 223 or blk? And what kind of barrel length? What kind of powder weights? I have a limited supply of the 77 grains to play around with 20 round load tests lol
Do you ever watch Johnny's Reloading bench? He works up to the same velocity as the Black Hills load with several different powders. I went with the top load he worked up with AR Comp. He was clocking his at 2,750 which is what the Factory Load produced. AR Comp was one of the few powders available in my area so I went with that. I also bought a bunch of the IMI 262 Mod 1 from Midway express when they had it. Quite a bit of their green tip and over a case of the plain old Standard 55 grain stuff. Both of my AR'S are 1 in 7 twist and shoot all of it very accurately. To my understanding there is no Civilian load and Military load It's all Black Hills 77 gr OTM. I was a bit confused there at the front too. Civilian ammo can have crimped primer pockets but usually don't but Military ammo Always does. I think he was seeing one that was staked in and one that was crimped in, there is a difference. Or he got them switched somehow. One thing is for sure if your a reloader, crimped primer pockets of any kind are a great big pain in the ass and must be removed before they will accept a new primer. I want to say I've duplicated that load with Bench Mark powder too. He gives the charge weights on his videos. Happy Shooting.
@@Freakingstang CFE223 25gr.( all weapons are different what's not too hot in one, may be way hot in another. Start out low and work up in your rifle. I bear no responsibility for this information. It is for educational purposes only. Follow your loading manuals recommendations and procedure's. There is a difference in 5.56 and .223 loadings.)18" Rock River ATH v2 heavy stainless barrel, Lake City 5.56 brass, CCI small rifle primers. I think a good search of reputable site's would help you. As stated by another, AR Comp was used by Johnny's Reloading Bench to get better velocities without pressure signs in *his rifle*. As times are Hodgdon CFE223 is what I had, so it's what i used. Be careful working loads in cold weather. Why i stopped back on research. What doesn't show pressure signs in cold weather, may be extreme in hot. Also ball powder as a general rule is less temperature stable. Sorry for the long comment. Shooting and reloading should be safe and fun. Hope this help's.
The burn marks are from cavitation, not the bullets. When the cavity collapses it compresses the air so fast it combusts burning the gell. I'd guess the more burn marks the larger the cavity was.
I was blessed to be able to use the mk262 my last 13 years in the ARMY and I still use it till this day. I reload and I've been able to almost duplicate the mk262 mod 1 and let's just say I will never be short of ammo. LOL
The channel Jonnys reloading bench had a nice 262 clone for anyone trying from scratch. You've probably already got something sweet going for your rifle but if starting from scratch its a good load.
I've always thought a towel would be a good idea and maybe keep the block in place better. You're the first I've seen to do it though. Just tape it across the underside of the table.
Yeah i have considered that but i actually like to see how much it throws the block around. Kinda gives me another reference on how much energy its putting down
Someone else stated this I'll also post it. It would be neat to have the gel targets, chrono, and such be at 50 yards or 100 yards. More typical combat engagements. Plus, if things function at those distances, it sure would be even more so the closer one is. Positive vibes.
I run the BH 77grn OTM as my primary defense ammo in a 14.5" pinned and welded, I was super excited to see you cover this ballistically! I also run the BH 77grn tipped match in my precision AR. I love the accuracy, your video demonstrated it nicely, I get 1.25"-1.75" 5 & 10 round groups consistently. That is with a DD 18" barrel running a Geissele SSA trigger and A2 stock with rifle length gas. I have a strike industries break and recoil is like a BB gun
Very good work! Thank you. You provide practical information and you get to the point! Articulate. So many of your UA-cam peers are wordy, repetitious and slow. You don't waste your audience's time with a lot of talk. I just subscribed. Keep up the good work!
I believe that you got the primer information backwards, it's the military that stakes it's primers to prevent popped primers from disabling their weapon's in battle or any other time. I've yet to see any commercially sold civilian ammo with staked primers. Other than this, you have a fine video. Thank you.
The 262 he has there is using a crimped primer, like the type hornady uses on most of their stuff. It looks like a light circle around the primer. He probably just didn't notice it, hard to see if you don't know its there. It does the same job. Ive seen it both ways crimped or staked, not sure why. Probably just depends on what tooling the people had that got the contract * edit there's a good amount of staked stuff out there on the civilian market too. Just another step, some places are set up for it already making military ammo, finish their contract and run the civilian stuff the same way until they take down or set up for another loading.
There is actually a crimp on the primer and on the neck of the MK 262. The crimp is circular all the way around the primer and the 77 grain bullet has a cannulure for the neck crimp. out of a 20" service rifle the Mk 262 comes out around 2830 fps.
Mod1 doesn’t have a cannular but mod2 does. That’s the primary difference. The cannular was originally experimental , the intension was to minimize the possibility of bullet setback. But what was found is the cannular caused the round to break up in soft targets which reduced over penetration and improved terminal ballistics.
@@michaeljacques7336 I think your confusing mod 1 and 2 with 0 and 1. There is no mod 2. There was a change in powder between the two as they went to a slower burning powder for better performance. We issue the mod 1 at the Navy matches and it does indeed perform well.
I dont understand how this particular military round could be more powerful when it weighs less and it travels the same speed....i don't consider 30 to 40 fps any difference when comparing 2 rifle rounds
They both are a 77 Sierra match king. So they weigh the same. They military mark 262 is made by black hills. Was made for the mark 12. The mark 262 comes off same assembly line as the “civilian” made black hills.
Congratulations on the ballistics jell sponsorship, can't wait to see what you do with a constant supply. If you get a chance could you do a comparison of the Black Hills HoneyBadger round vs. Underwood Xtreme Defence round. I wish we had ammo here in georgia so I could send you some to test lol.
So Is a .22lr just as good as 30mm? lol jk when I read that I could hear Brandon Herrera in my head “just as good.” Anyway I know what you meant just thought that was funny so I shared.
Mk262 Mod 1 (5.56) (77gr Sierra Match King) and M118LR (7.62) (175gr Sierra Match King) are both hollow points and allowed for combat use. The hollow points on these two rounds are not expanding hollow points, which are banned per the Law of Armed Conflict.
I've debated with several civilians who didn't believe that there was a difference between Military and civilian ammo. They also didn't believe an M16A2 couldn't hit targets out to 1000yds either. As a combat veteran who trained and qualified on just about every small arms weapon platform and was DM with an M14, I can atest to the facts that not only are there differences between ammo, but also twist rates and barrels are glaringly different and for good reasons. Civilian hardware, no matter how Gucci it may be, is not on par with that of our armed forces. Enjoy your plinking and continue to train with them no matter what. Carry On!!
The annealing, crimped primers and head stamps make me very strongly believe you got your wires crossed while presenting these. 100% convinced. I love your channel and the informative videos, just putting in my 2 cents.
Very interesting to me. This video came up as a reccomend after watching a different video. So,new subscriber here. Tge results were actually closer than I thought they would be.
Correct. You can see the uniform crimp all the way around the primer on the military version. Military stuff also uses a primer sealant that is usually colored. The civilian version has 4 crimps at 12/3/6/9.
@@mikehh8020 yep, these used to get me all the time reloading 5.56 brass. I wouldn't swage or ream primer pockets that weren't staked and then I'd run one while priming and mess me all up on the progressive. I know better now of course but it was a pain when I was less experienced.
was that not a badass test though, Zips a freaking 2 inch hole though the first and literally disintegrates the second one, imagine youre hit and your buddy's head disappears next to you
I've been subbed since you had under 5k and I will say you deserve waay more!! Those are nasty rounds and I see why our military uses them. Have you ever tried 77gr (TMK) Tipped match king? Some say they are better...they are also loaded by Black Hills. Also Hornady Frontier 75gr T2 w/ cantelure are very similar to 262 in performance. Thanks brother and God bless!👍🇺🇸✌
I enjoy your videos very informative. With my ADHD it wont allow me to not pick a little bit ha. That ammunition was technically development and optimized for an 18" style SPR so you may not get true and accurate readings to a small degree. The twist rate and barrel length matter to optimize this specific cartridge. I like that BCM setup!
What year were those military cartridges manufactured. The civil cartridges didnt used to be staked either that rolled out a few years ago. I know the 2016 and 2017 stamped rounds were not staked.
Damn you, I been wanting to purchase a 1:7 twist barrel for my Smith & Wesson for awhile now, but after seeing how impressive this ammo is im definitely buying a new barrel now
So Johnny's reloading bench did some research on this round and it has had changes over the years. It started with 77gr sierra matchking bullet. And for what ever reason the military switch to nosler 77gr match bullet and then switch back to sierra matchking. no knows why but there have been a number of changes over the years to that bullet even in its short run.
I bet it has something to do with contracts and timelines, Sierra probably had a chance and then they gave Nosler a chance and settled on one. It's the government.....Take it as you will
Awesome video! I like the towel set up but maybe anchor down the towel under the first gel block and leave the towel under the second gel block loose in order to aid in catching any bullet fragments. Great video!!
In the future, I would like to see your penetration tests done at 100 yards or at least 50 yards. Shooting a rifle at pistol engagement range only shows excessive expansion and is not, IMO, a real world example.
I agree i would like to try longer range gel tests. I would guess at 50 yds there would be very little difference because the velocity hasnt changed much at that point. 100 would be a bit less. But i think 5-7 yds is realistic for home defense, etc
I love how he uses Black hills ammo as a civilian reference. I love those guys over there. But anyways black hills alctualky gives about a third of their inventory to the military. So that kinda influenced the discussion here
You are correct, the military always stakes their primers. You don't want a popped primer locking up your weapon in a fire fight, a very bad situation.
@@gjsilvano is that a common thing? I’m a young fella yet but, I have shot my share of a lot of different guns. Never even heard tell of such. I have heard warnings of bullets scooting forward especially in revolvers.
Military requires staked, sealed primers, and annealed case necks. Civilian ammo will generally not include these, unless they are selling surplus lots or trying to capitalize on the popularity of "mil-spec" ammo. There's a lot of 'civilian' ammo sold that was intended for military use but for whatever reason never made it there. As far as the difference between these two. 10-20 fps between loads going over 2600 is zero difference in practice. Any difference in the melons and jell are far to small to be considered without a large sampling. You should pull a couple bullets and check the powder. Military customers require a specific powder, often the difference will be in the powder type or even just the way the pellets are cut.
The case necks are annealed on civilian ammo too, but there's a final case polishing that erases the surface coloring. The military brass is also polished before final anneal, then skips the final polishing so that there's visual evidence of the annealed case neck.
As far as my M-1 goes, there's a big difference. Factory 30-06 is designed for bolt action rifles, not semi automatic. Learned I was in danger of either bending or breaking my operating rod. I now reload to gov't specs for this rifle and it performs beautifully
the biggest difference is the quality control on the black hills 262 the case when shipped out comes with data on everything from velocity to shot groups of their pulled test rounds for that batch of ammo. The civilian version I doubt they do that with also as it is an unnecessary cost, I believe that small arms channel did a good history of the round.
You should try to get and test the 5.56 NATO 66grain SS109 it has a steel penetrator tip inside the round it would be very interesting to see the same test again I no from experience it’s what we in the British army used not sure if it is still the case I’ve been out of the military for some years now 🇬🇧
Military ammo is made using a strict code.Theoretically one thousand rounds will be exactly the same round after round with less chance of ftf unlike civilian ammo which can vary greatly.And it is higher pressure than store bought ammo.I feel confident using military ammo that it will work when needed time after time.
the military crimps the primers so they don’t come loose under extreme conditions, or in full auto firing. Has nothing to do with them trying to fuck over the troops lmao.
@@djpd6499 Ya, definetely not trying to screw over the troops, it's more of a "mil-spec" if you will. Those could have came from anywhere, so the source of that ammo is up for debate, but that's not to say it wasn't genuine military ammo, maybe just older lots or wasn't crimped so it was sold off to civilians. This is all speculation of course, but I've seen crazier things happen!
I don't think anyone hit by it would notice a difference.
but the target behind the first target will
@@caldwellrepaircentercaldwe9065 5.56 ain’t making it through 2 people. It’s meant to tumble and fragment once it hits its target.
@@jonboy9734 yeah overpenetration is not an issue with 5.56, a lot of 5.56 rounds actually underpenetrate, most cheap hollow points in 5.56 or .223 penetrate less than 10 inches in gel. bonded soft points, all copper hollow points, heavyweight OTMs, and FMJ is all I'll trust my life to out of an AR.
I would say that the military round would deal more damage to the vital organs.
Definitely not the 99.99% of rounds that don't hit anything but dirt.
Yes there is a difference. They can get ammo and civilians can't..😆
its sad but true 🤣🥲
Bingo!
Lol!
You can be the most intelligent person in the world and still be unable to get the things you need. It's never what you know, it's always about who you know and whom you chose to befriend that can support you and you them.
Well, I never stole from the Army but if I was in now and we were qualifying, I'd be sure to "pocket" a couple hundred rounds these days. Used to find alot of unfired but not misfired rounds around the shooting positions from double feeds, rounds not going into the chamber right, clearing rifles, etc. When "policing" the brass we would find most of the brass and always live rounds. Some were misfires but most not.
Who knows? Haven't seen much of either in months. Couldn't afford to compare it if I had. Lol
Q
It’s like trying to ask if one dead is deader than the other dead....
Great stuff. I hope you get more sponsors that will benefit you. Ammo. Targets. Guns. Great personality. Clear mind. Love the vids bud.
Thank you
Thanks bud
@@1ShotTV you do realize you can make your own ballistic gel for about a dollar...
@@1ShotTV what sweater are you wearing? Really like it.
keep up the good work
The military version has a crimped primer, like the one that hornady uses on their match ammo. It looks like another circle around the primer. Hard to see if you dont expect it, sometimes it gets me on reloading, won't catch it until I go to prime.
Repriming those military casings are a real pain in the ass. I ended up using a deburring tool to remove the crimping.
You're a brave man shooting your good ammo/ specialty ammo. I'm not shooting any of my mod2
“I crossed out the lot number for obvious reasons”
Me: 👀 I don’t know what the reason is
@Mike H I’ve seen it for sale legally
@@shanek6582 ...?!
You can buy them.
@Jake Stockton not even, 20,000 is rookie numbers
@Mike H
Thanks for the reply!
Nice test. Looks like either would do the trick.
the paint can shot was spectacular!
Thank's 1SHOT I have been loading 77gr. Sierra Matchking hp, Lake City brass, Hodgdon CFE powder and CCI primers to get a good load. My loads are running 2669 give or take. I'm pretty sure I can go with a little hotter load.
When speed fails just add weight!? From 55gr to 77gr.
But hey?! Those old slower heavy cartridges are a thing of the past? I'd be interested in the same two watermelons and your AK with a good hollow point ammo equivalent to or as close as possible Black Hills Sierra Matchking hp bullet for comparison at suburban combat ranges.
Excellent work!
Keep'em coming!
You should of put up a sheet or posterboard and sold the painting.
Cfe 223 or blk? And what kind of barrel length? What kind of powder weights? I have a limited supply of the 77 grains to play around with 20 round load tests lol
Do you ever watch Johnny's Reloading bench? He works up to the same velocity as the Black Hills load with several different powders. I went with the top load he worked up with AR Comp. He was clocking his at 2,750 which is what the Factory Load produced. AR Comp was one of the few powders available in my area so I went with that. I also bought a bunch of the IMI 262 Mod 1 from Midway express when they had it. Quite a bit of their green tip and over a case of the plain old Standard 55 grain stuff. Both of my AR'S are 1 in 7 twist and shoot all of it very accurately. To my understanding there is no Civilian load and Military load It's all Black Hills 77 gr OTM. I was a bit confused there at the front too. Civilian ammo can have crimped primer pockets but usually don't but Military ammo Always does. I think he was seeing one that was staked in and one that was crimped in, there is a difference. Or he got them switched somehow. One thing is for sure if your a reloader, crimped primer pockets of any kind are a great big pain in the ass and must be removed before they will accept a new primer. I want to say I've duplicated that load with Bench Mark powder too. He gives the charge weights on his videos. Happy Shooting.
@@kennyd6388 should’ve or should have. Not should of.
@@Freakingstang CFE223 25gr.( all weapons are different what's not too hot in one, may be way hot in another. Start out low and work up in your rifle. I bear no responsibility for this information. It is for educational purposes only. Follow your loading manuals recommendations and procedure's. There is a difference in 5.56 and .223 loadings.)18" Rock River ATH v2 heavy stainless barrel, Lake City 5.56 brass, CCI small rifle primers.
I think a good search of reputable site's would help you. As stated by another, AR Comp was used by Johnny's Reloading Bench to get better velocities without pressure signs in *his rifle*. As times are Hodgdon CFE223 is what I had, so it's what i used. Be careful working loads in cold weather. Why i stopped back on research. What doesn't show pressure signs in cold weather, may be extreme in hot. Also ball powder as a general rule is less temperature stable.
Sorry for the long comment.
Shooting and reloading should be safe and fun.
Hope this help's.
The burn marks are from cavitation, not the bullets. When the cavity collapses it compresses the air so fast it combusts burning the gell. I'd guess the more burn marks the larger the cavity was.
It is gel*
I was blessed to be able to use the mk262 my last 13 years in the ARMY and I still use it till this day. I reload and I've been able to almost duplicate the mk262 mod 1 and let's just say I will never be short of ammo. LOL
The channel Jonnys reloading bench had a nice 262 clone for anyone trying from scratch. You've probably already got something sweet going for your rifle but if starting from scratch its a good load.
I've always thought a towel would be a good idea and maybe keep the block in place better. You're the first I've seen to do it though. Just tape it across the underside of the table.
Yeah i have considered that but i actually like to see how much it throws the block around. Kinda gives me another reference on how much energy its putting down
@@1ShotTV that's contributing to variability though. You want the block as fixed as it reasonably can be for accurate comparisons
Someone else stated this I'll also post it.
It would be neat to have the gel targets, chrono, and such be at 50 yards or 100 yards. More typical combat engagements. Plus, if things function at those distances, it sure would be even more so the closer one is. Positive vibes.
I was thinking the same thing but he probably didn't want to miss or do a bad shot because he only had one clean gel and only like 20 seeds.
I run the BH 77grn OTM as my primary defense ammo in a 14.5" pinned and welded, I was super excited to see you cover this ballistically! I also run the BH 77grn tipped match in my precision AR. I love the accuracy, your video demonstrated it nicely, I get 1.25"-1.75" 5 & 10 round groups consistently. That is with a DD 18" barrel running a Geissele SSA trigger and A2 stock with rifle length gas. I have a strike industries break and recoil is like a BB gun
Looks like you could get identical results if the Black Hills was shot out of a longer barrel.
Awesome video. Thank you to clear ballistics for the gel we appreciate it.
Very good work! Thank you.
You provide practical information and you get to the point! Articulate. So many of your UA-cam peers are wordy, repetitious and slow. You don't waste your audience's time with a lot of talk. I just subscribed. Keep up the good work!
I believe that you got the primer information backwards, it's the military that stakes it's primers to prevent popped primers from disabling their weapon's in battle or any other time.
I've yet to see any commercially sold civilian ammo with staked primers.
Other than this, you have a fine video. Thank you.
The 262 he has there is using a crimped primer, like the type hornady uses on most of their stuff. It looks like a light circle around the primer. He probably just didn't notice it, hard to see if you don't know its there. It does the same job. Ive seen it both ways crimped or staked, not sure why. Probably just depends on what tooling the people had that got the contract * edit there's a good amount of staked stuff out there on the civilian market too. Just another step, some places are set up for it already making military ammo, finish their contract and run the civilian stuff the same way until they take down or set up for another loading.
EXACTLY..people are confusing the 2 types
There is actually a crimp on the primer and on the neck of the MK 262. The crimp is circular all the way around the primer and the 77 grain bullet has a cannulure for the neck crimp. out of a 20" service rifle the Mk 262 comes out around 2830 fps.
Yes! I hate running into those reloading. It used to get me all the time lol.
Mod1 doesn’t have a cannular but mod2 does. That’s the primary difference. The cannular was originally experimental , the intension was to minimize the possibility of bullet setback. But what was found is the cannular caused the round to break up in soft targets which reduced over penetration and improved terminal ballistics.
@@michaeljacques7336 I think your confusing mod 1 and 2 with 0 and 1. There is no mod 2. There was a change in powder between the two as they went to a slower burning powder for better performance. We issue the mod 1 at the Navy matches and it does indeed perform well.
Holy crap, I didnt even know I bought military ammo, I just thought the packaging was super cheap 😳
I love your channel !!! Honestly you're one of the best ones, It's all real life and practical with some WATERMELON TIME and SPRAYPAINT TIME!!!!!!!!
I dont understand how this particular military round could be more powerful when it weighs less and it travels the same speed....i don't consider 30 to 40 fps any difference when comparing 2 rifle rounds
I’ve seen bigger differences from lot to lot of the same ammo.
They both are a 77 Sierra match king. So they weigh the same. They military mark 262 is made by black hills. Was made for the mark 12. The mark 262 comes off same assembly line as the “civilian” made black hills.
@@tylerbennett3565 So why do they have different staking?
@@dwaneanderson8039 you mean primer crimp? It's just the crimp that was used, non factor.
@@skm9420 My point was, tyler bennett said that they were made on the same assembly line. So why don't they look identical?
Congratulations on the ballistics jell sponsorship, can't wait to see what you do with a constant supply. If you get a chance could you do a comparison of the Black Hills HoneyBadger round vs. Underwood Xtreme Defence round. I wish we had ammo here in georgia so I could send you some to test lol.
A guy killed by a 22lr is just as dead as a guy killed by a 30mm tank cannon.
So Is a .22lr just as good as 30mm? lol jk when I read that I could hear Brandon Herrera in my head “just as good.” Anyway I know what you meant just thought that was funny so I shared.
But the dead body won't
Nicely done. And you're a regular "Picasso of Projectiles" with the paint! That was fun!😀
Haha thank you!
Your AR set up is sick! Can you post links to the attachments you have on your rifle please?
Mk262 Mod 1 (5.56) (77gr Sierra Match King) and M118LR (7.62) (175gr Sierra Match King) are both hollow points and allowed for combat use. The hollow points on these two rounds are not expanding hollow points, which are banned per the Law of Armed Conflict.
Thanks for the great content and congrats on the new sponsor! You have my ammo loader brain working with this one! Love the tie die :)
I've debated with several civilians who didn't believe that there was a difference between Military and civilian ammo. They also didn't believe an M16A2 couldn't hit targets out to 1000yds either. As a combat veteran who trained and qualified on just about every small arms weapon platform and was DM with an M14, I can atest to the facts that not only are there differences between ammo, but also twist rates and barrels are glaringly different and for good reasons. Civilian hardware, no matter how Gucci it may be, is not on par with that of our armed forces.
Enjoy your plinking and continue to train with them no matter what.
Carry On!!
The annealing, crimped primers and head stamps make me very strongly believe you got your wires crossed while presenting these. 100% convinced. I love your channel and the informative videos, just putting in my 2 cents.
If possible, I'm curious to see the case heads sectioned, as milspec cases are thicker than civvy in the base area.
Negative. I bought the black hills about a month ago and made a video on them. They are definitely the only ones with crimped primers
Awesome video!!
Very interesting to me. This video came up as a reccomend after watching a different video. So,new subscriber here.
Tge results were actually closer than I thought they would be.
All US military ammo is “staked” or crimped primer pockets. They just used a different more obvious process on the Blackhills.
Correct. You can see the uniform crimp all the way around the primer on the military version. Military stuff also uses a primer sealant that is usually colored. The civilian version has 4 crimps at 12/3/6/9.
@@mikehh8020 yep, these used to get me all the time reloading 5.56 brass. I wouldn't swage or ream primer pockets that weren't staked and then I'd run one while priming and mess me all up on the progressive. I know better now of course but it was a pain when I was less experienced.
Your rifle is one of the nicest civilian weapon systems I’ve ever seen online. Please never sell it.
Conclusion, you wasted 4 perfectly good watermelons 😎
was that not a badass test though, Zips a freaking 2 inch hole though the first and literally disintegrates the second one, imagine youre hit and your buddy's head disappears next to you
Thank you for your videos, I enjoy them a lot.
You are top drawer and deserve serious sponsor support!!
I've been subbed since you had under 5k and I will say you deserve waay more!! Those are nasty rounds and I see why our military uses them. Have you ever tried 77gr (TMK) Tipped match king? Some say they are better...they are also loaded by Black Hills. Also Hornady Frontier 75gr T2 w/ cantelure are very similar to 262 in performance. Thanks brother and God bless!👍🇺🇸✌
"Absolute blast," I see what you did there :P
Great video as a fan of Black Hills myself. I liked and subscribed. Keep up the good work!!!
this is the first video i watched on your channel. i wonder why you only have 52k subs. video quality and provided info is great.
First time viewer. Thanks for sharing. This is a good reason to use 6.8 SPC. Same chrono reading in a 110 gr OTM.
The difference is we pay for military ammo and don't get any of it. ;)
Man..... your dam right. Underrated comment
2018: which is better civilian ammo or military ammo
2021: AMMO IS AMMO SAVE WHATEVER YOU HAVE!!!
I enjoy your videos very informative. With my ADHD it wont allow me to not pick a little bit ha. That ammunition was technically development and optimized for an 18" style SPR so you may not get true and accurate readings to a small degree. The twist rate and barrel length matter to optimize this specific cartridge. I like that BCM setup!
Great comparison video!!!Definitely learned a little something here.Loved the spray can show😄👍👍
Thank you!
What year were those military cartridges manufactured. The civil cartridges didnt used to be staked either that rolled out a few years ago. I know the 2016 and 2017 stamped rounds were not staked.
Great idea. Very interesting stuff. Thanks for sharing
Damn you, I been wanting to purchase a 1:7 twist barrel for my Smith & Wesson for awhile now, but after seeing how impressive this ammo is im definitely buying a new barrel now
a lot of military cases have thicker walls .weigh the cases and se if there is a difference.you could also mike the case walls.
Not in 556
The difference here is gonna be in powder mixture.
Looks like a Bob Ross painting. Happy clouds and rainbows.
Awesome video! Love how scientific your approach to the comparison was. You got yourself a new subscriber!
I’d like to see that Ballistics Gel test done at 100m. Awesome video bro.
SCIENCE!!!! I love the spray paint science the best 😁
That was the best paint shot I've ever seen.
Either would be severe life changing/life ending when shot to center body mass.
The only difference is in the powder load. Military has slightly more powder not for ballistic reasons but to ensure overgassing for BCG cycling.
Like the sweater you got, looks warm and comfortable to wear
So Johnny's reloading bench did some research on this round and it has had changes over the years. It started with 77gr sierra matchking bullet. And for what ever reason the military switch to nosler 77gr match bullet and then switch back to sierra matchking. no knows why but there have been a number of changes over the years to that bullet even in its short run.
I bet it has something to do with contracts and timelines, Sierra probably had a chance and then they gave Nosler a chance and settled on one. It's the government.....Take it as you will
Very impressive. Would love to see that round vs m193 & m855
Awesome video! I like the towel set up but maybe anchor down the towel under the first gel block and leave the towel under the second gel block loose in order to aid in catching any bullet fragments. Great video!!
In the future, I would like to see your penetration tests done at 100 yards or at least 50 yards. Shooting a rifle at pistol engagement range only shows excessive expansion and is not, IMO, a real world example.
I would like to see that too. For now we can see how the bullet might perform at room clearing distance.
I'd like to see this too.
it would be nice to see, but it sure is a real world example, you should not be shooting people at 100 yards lol that would most defiantly be murder .
@@creepingdeath4life359 Combat engagement distance.
I agree i would like to try longer range gel tests. I would guess at 50 yds there would be very little difference because the velocity hasnt changed much at that point. 100 would be a bit less. But i think 5-7 yds is realistic for home defense, etc
Excellent work as usual young man. 👍🏻👍🏻
Thank you
So this is where demo ranch got the idea of the spray paint art! 😃
I love how he uses Black hills ammo as a civilian reference. I love those guys over there. But anyways black hills alctualky gives about a third of their inventory to the military. So that kinda influenced the discussion here
Military ammo is always going to be a hotter load, hence machinegun ammo. The Federal Tactical LE .223 55gr. soft point is a devastating round.
I'm only 15 hours late!
It's been a long week...
You bein' outside seems to indicate ya ain't feelin' so crappy now.
That's dope!
Keep rockin'!
I'm kind of a fan of the bright rainbow art work 🤔 I may need to pick up some paints 🤯😂🤷🏼♂️🇺🇸🤠
I think the militarily use different powders, that what I was told you CO years ago.
I have never seen uncrimped/unstaked ammo in my time in the military, interesting.
You are correct, the military always stakes their primers.
You don't want a popped primer locking up your weapon in a fire fight, a very bad situation.
@@gjsilvano is that a common thing? I’m a young fella yet but, I have shot my share of a lot of different guns. Never even heard tell of such. I have heard warnings of bullets scooting forward especially in revolvers.
They are both crimped, just that the ring crimp is not as obvious in the video as is the staked crimp.
@William Yeager LR stands for "long range".
Don’t think there was any real difference. Both are loaded with a 77gr SMK and velocity was also basically the same.
Yeah 15 to 20 fps is within margin of error.
A while back before it got crazy I bought a case of MK262. It came in the black and red 50 round boxes and was marked as MK262.
Military requires staked, sealed primers, and annealed case necks. Civilian ammo will generally not include these, unless they are selling surplus lots or trying to capitalize on the popularity of "mil-spec" ammo. There's a lot of 'civilian' ammo sold that was intended for military use but for whatever reason never made it there.
As far as the difference between these two. 10-20 fps between loads going over 2600 is zero difference in practice. Any difference in the melons and jell are far to small to be considered without a large sampling. You should pull a couple bullets and check the powder. Military customers require a specific powder, often the difference will be in the powder type or even just the way the pellets are cut.
The case necks are annealed on civilian ammo too, but there's a final case polishing that erases the surface coloring. The military brass is also polished before final anneal, then skips the final polishing so that there's visual evidence of the annealed case neck.
8 years in the army and was never issued what he has... I was given the M855 green tip. 62 grain.
Right lol
We dont use the green tip anymore
@@handle--729 it indeed did sir. Thanks for your service
The Mk 262 was issued to the Mk12 SPR and people running short carbines.
As far as my M-1 goes, there's a big difference. Factory 30-06 is designed for bolt action rifles, not semi automatic. Learned I was in danger of either bending or breaking my operating rod. I now reload to gov't specs for this rifle and it performs beautifully
I gotta get me some of these to load up!
the biggest difference is the quality control on the black hills 262 the case when shipped out comes with data on everything from velocity to shot groups of their pulled test rounds for that batch of ammo. The civilian version I doubt they do that with also as it is an unnecessary cost, I believe that small arms channel did a good history of the round.
You should try to get and test the 5.56 NATO 66grain SS109 it has a steel penetrator tip inside the round it would be very interesting to see the same test again I no from experience it’s what we in the British army used not sure if it is still the case I’ve been out of the military for some years now 🇬🇧
Best vid you've posted so far keep up the good work big dog
Shoot some tracer rounds into the gel blocks and get slo-mo of it. Great videos, brother!
I never got the chance to shoot hollowpoints through the M16. When I served, the ammunition was a full metal jacketed bullet, I believe 55gr.
Would love to see some of the other ‘bigger’ guntubers invite you to join them for a video on their and your channel.
Military ammo is made using a strict code.Theoretically one thousand rounds will be exactly the same round after round with less chance of ftf unlike civilian ammo which can vary greatly.And it is higher pressure than store bought ammo.I feel confident using military ammo that it will work when needed time after time.
When I was in the Army, ALL of our ammo had crimped primers, and I'm pretty sure that's the standard for military ammo.
Looks like government is cutting corners, bet that money is in someone's pocket, at the expense of our troops, disgusting
Absolutely.
the military crimps the primers so they don’t come loose under extreme conditions, or in full auto firing. Has nothing to do with them trying to fuck over the troops lmao.
@@djpd6499 Ya, definetely not trying to screw over the troops, it's more of a "mil-spec" if you will. Those could have came from anywhere, so the source of that ammo is up for debate, but that's not to say it wasn't genuine military ammo, maybe just older lots or wasn't crimped so it was sold off to civilians. This is all speculation of course, but I've seen crazier things happen!
shojus hahaha I don’t doubt it, appreciate your service sir. Stay safe!
Keep the videos up love em
Keep the videos coming. I enjoyed your test theories.
New sub bro! I’d love to run into some of those to test in my S&W M&P sport 2 👌🏼
Rainbow Clouds. That Was Pretty Cool.
Military ammo is generally hotter than civilian.
7.62x51 isn't as hot as 308
False
Government usually down loads commercial cartridges. The exception is 5.56 vs .223
But even that, I mean, they have different designations for a reason
@@SilenceDoGood4th 7.62x51 IS a lower pressure load than 308, I've loaded enough and shot enough to know
Good stuff! Thank you!
Pretty awesome, now some of our arm forces are using the 6.8 Western which could reach out to a mile and get you!!!
That round is also amazing against armor.
Thank you for this info! Do you do any OLD SCHOOL ammo? ie: Mosin Nagant 7.62x54r? compared to 7.62x51 (308)?
Great video, really cool. Good job
All my reloads are the 77gr . Unreal results!
Great video man.
Dropped a few bucks with another brand 77gr btw. Good stuff!
Most military brass cases are a little thicker, they use better powder, military primers are lacquered and crimped
Rob from Ireland we don't have your firearms but I love your videos.