How Some Straight Men Capitalize on Gay Loneliness
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- Опубліковано 18 жов 2023
- This is a difficult topic to discuss but it's necessary. Troye Sivan's new music video, "One of the Girls," inspired me to discuss how some straight men capitalize on gay loneliness. Please share your thoughts, subscribe, and hit like!
To Find My Stuff: linktr.ee/donnywinter
#lgbtq #mentalhealth #relationships - Розваги
We teach others how to treat us. You said it yourself. "There were periods in my life when I let straight men treat me this way." Operable phrase: 'I let them"
But when a person is young, vulnerable, and unknowing, they may not have the capacity to do the teaching. That was my point. Others taking advantage of a person's vulnerability doesn't give them that justification. 🤷♂️
@@DonnyWinter The vulnerability you describe is present in people of all ages. Further, others failing to fully account for the vulnerabilities of others has, does and always will be a reality. There's no stopping people hurting vulnerable people - accidentally and intentionally. Crying about only guarantees one will remain vulnerable. Recognizing that no one is responsible for other's happiness. We all are responsible for our own happiness. 100% that is where the focus should be. Strengthening people. Not running around being a scold tsk tsk tsking because some meany made someone else cry
@@BelleOmbreGrey I really don't believe in the "pull yourself up by the bootstraps" mentality you're conveying. I get where you're coming from though, but at the end of the day, this absolutely does not justify a person capitalizing on/making jest of/taking advantage of another. Holding people accountable about their behavior is far more impactful than telling someone that they're "not strong" because they are a human being.
@@DonnyWinter Its stronger to make yourself acountable for your own actions then the other. Its better to change your own actions then the actions of someone els. It seems to me, you are a not lissening to the suggestions of other, and jou are just trying to push your own flawd theorie.
@@BelleOmbreGreyyou get it
"Traumatizing" at a straight guy touching or kissing you, as if straight men don't do that to each other all the time. The only difference is that 1.) You have feelings for these men and you entertains those feelings, 2.) You don't seem to understand that straight men are capable of platonic intimacy with each other, and 3.) You think that men are "toxic" because they accept you for your orientation but will not outright reject you as a trusted friend.
I'm gay and work in a masculine environment. Most straight men are ok with you hanging out with them so long as you understand each others' boundaries. And as trust and friendships develop, those boundaries expand. But you don't expect relationships with these men, and simply learn how to become another man who can have male friends who won't push beyond what they are comfortable with. Trust me: when men trust you, most of them don't care about your orientation. And a lot of straight men are really deficient on expressing affection. But what they're inherently capable of doing with another straight man will not be different from the affection they'll show you if they trust you. And a lot of trust develops when you come out to other men.
And I've seen it with other gay men too. They see a straight man, joking around with me and trying to wrestle me, and these gay men get a bit excited because they think something is developing between me and my friend of 5-6-7 years. And then I realize that for them, they don't show affection or get intimate with guys because to them, it's sexual interest. It's difficult to define affection as platonic.
This is the realest comment I’ve read
I feel like this is also true for lesbian relations. Women are very affectionate with one another so I feel like often times for lesbians, these platonic gestures can be viewed as romantic interest.
My life sounds like yours, I have gay friends who are convinced I’m sleeping with all my straight friends coz they are attractive, but the reason I get on with them so well is coz there’s no sexual tension so I can be comfortable around them and some gay people can’t realise that coz they only think about sex
Exactly! My long time best friend (since first grade) is straight and we know that the hugs and arms over the shoulder things are completely platonic (hey, I’m also friends with wife).
Highschool came and all my male classmates know I like men, they allow me to sit on their laps when there is no more chairs and stuff because they know I view them as friends and will not take advantage.
Then in college I started training in martial arts and me and my male classmates all know that the grapples, grabs, and after practice rough plays are not sexual.
The “loneliness” comes from assuming there could be feelings developing from these physical closeness. We know they’re straight from the get go so we should not assume that they will fall in love with us one day. Yes, sexuality is fluid and they may turn bi, gay, asexual, or whatever color of the rainbow but never assume that it will always happen.
"Hi I'm gay, but i'm also one of the boys because I just 'get it.' I know how to be around men. My sexuality isn't a problem for them, and isn't a problem for me. Your issues are all your fault blah blah blah blah"
Yeah thanks, mate. No wonder so may men kill themselves.
Omg. I experienced almost exactly what you said in this video. It's a sad situation, but I'm glad that im not the only one. Unfortunately, most people don't get that, just experiencing it to know how it is to be in this condition
We're all in this together ❤️
How did all these "straight guys" know you had a crush on them? It's all very vague to me.
If he was pure gay man, at some point they probably just asked. Anyway there is also nothing wrong expressing the sympathies, that you like someone. Accordingly after that the person has to decide what to do with that.
@@VonRix “pure gay”?
The valley gurl accent
It's a stupid thing to be confused about.
@@AL2VAR no it's not
I’m genuinely confused with the video to quite frank with you. I just troubling that a lot of gay men will use the argument that straight men use gay men’s sexuality has a masking troupe when the gay men allows that behavior to pass through. If a person states to you (not you specifically) that they are straight, what give you a reason to pursue anything further? The damaging aspect of “he used my sexuality against me” seems misleading. I’m just going to leave off with this: leave straight men alone, seriously. They are not romantically attracted to you, nor should you try to persuade them otherwise.
I think you missed the point of my video entirely, unfortunately. I'm referring mostly to LGBTQ+ prior or at the coming out stage being vulnerable in the sense that they are susceptible to people making jest or entertainment of them at a critical developmental juncture.
@@DonnyWinter so my statement still stands - you are allowing this behavior to pass through. It’s the inability to set boundaries for yourself, so the problem falls on the other person to make them. I will admit that it’s sad to hear that straight people are manipulating your behavior, but it’s also the will of the gay person to understand that if a straight person says that they are straight, then you must move on and avoid them romantically and sexually.
One reason Gay men pursue the straight & narrow is that the straight guy often comes around. Feels so good going down. Right, Butch?
@@PatricenotPatrick So, Patrice, why do you keep coming back for more? What's in you for it?
@@sayaki2I would love to see straight men stop pursuing lesbians.
i heavily related to everything you're saying, only to read the comments and find out that most people either don't understand this experience, or don't relate to it at all. no wonder we feel so lonely sometimes.
I think the majority of them didn't watch the video in its entirety. I appreciate your kind, understanding comment. ❤
If you allow someone to play on your emotions that is your fault. It is human nature to want something we can't have. When you are young and stupid it is understandable, you get some life experience and learn not to fall into that trap.
Indeed, especially about the young part. Granted, if one of these straight dudes are willfully aware that they are capitalizing on said inexperienced gay person, does it make it right for them to do so?
@@DonnyWinter Playing with someone's emotions is not right, period. That being said, if you as a gay man try to entertain the idea of romancing a guy you know is straight, you are being extremely foolish and setting yourself up for disaster. There are plenty of young attractive gay men who prey on older lonely and wealthy gay men knowing they are just using them for their money. In fact I'd say there are way more predatory gay hustlers than cock-tease straight men. And that's worse because they are hurting people in their own "community".
No. It's not. It's such an evil thing to say... Do you blame the r*pe victims for what happened to them?
You look really good, I love your hair!
Thank you! ♥️
How are you grown and chasing straight men and blaming them for your feelings? And why do some of y’all like to make your issues a “community” issue? Gay loneliness? That’s just you. Most of us aren’t stuck on guys who aren’t into us and playing victim.
I agree with you on the idea of taking responsibility for your own feelings - however, your politics are abhorrent at this point. Be well.
the gay loneliness is real
@@judygarland7186sure is. Male loneliness in general has gone up
I totaly agree with you. Take responsibility for your own actions instead of blaming the other guy.
@@radagast25a I dont see a politic statements in his reply
A good subject for discussion.
Thanks!
He. Let me get my head around this. You hook up with a straight man and you are surprised it doesnt work out? Just dont do that girl. Its your own fault at this point.
A man who once in a while hooks up with another man is not "straight."
@@t.e.burgos3263 No. Plenty of men I hooked up with where straight, they just wanted to explore a bit. If you ask me sexuality is more on a spectrum. Men just dont talk about it that much. In my experience woman are more open about it. But then again in the western world Men dont judge woman who experiment with woman less then men who experiment with men.
That's true I think. We tend to think of orientation as a strict binary, and it is for some people, but there's a whole lot of complexity in between. The conventional wisdom is that there is no such thing as a straight guy who hooks up with other guys. They had to be gay guys in denial or bisexual guys who liked men and women about equally but maybe hadn't come around to acknowledging that. I've seen far too much in the real world that contradicts all of that.
The thing to keep in mind about men though,is that sex is not in any way hard linked to emotional intimacy or to identity/orientation. It can be, but as often as not it isn't. Men need and want to f*ck. That has nothing to do with who they want to make a home and life with or who they form romantic attachments to.
There's a spa about 20 minutes from me which has saunas and hot tubs and the like, and it's not a gay spa, it's a regular community Korean style one. The bath area is segregated by gender, and all that bathing is done nude. But man, before they changed the design of the steam room, I used to see a TON of guy on guy action in there.
Some of it was gay guys who came out from the city, but on any given night, half to 80% were straight guys. I don't mean guys living a lie with a wife as social cover. Guys who considered themselves straight but not homophobic. They weren't looking for guys to take home or see outside of the place, but they liked the raw, bestial unemotional kind of sex that only happens when men get together for that purpose. I think a lot of them got off on that and just the deviancy of doing it in a semi-public place. Sometimes it was guys going down on each other, but many times it was just a big circle jerk.
I think the gay guys who went there understood that too. They weren't thinking or hoping to find emotional support or real intimacy there.
Why are you calling him "girl"?
@@renan27023 Its slang. Girl!:)
How can you hook up with straight men? Unless they're a paid escort or something I just don't see how it's possible, if a man wants to have sex with another man he's not straight no matter what he wants to tell himself. Troye Sivan is giving James Charles vibes and I'm not here for it.
Gay men have sex with women. Gay men have sex with men they're not attracted to. Sometimes, people are drunk, or high, or just lonely. Human sexuality is not a fixed point on a line. And it's like he said, some guys, straight or gay, get off on just being sexually desired, regardless of who's doing the desiring.
@@draco1811 I am gay. Even drunk or high or lonely I WONT have sex with a woman. What are you talking about?
Could also at minimum be straight but momentarily curious (not to support the myth of sexuality being a phase of course). You'd also be surprised as to how many self-labelled straight men are fairly ok with receiving oral sex from a gay male obviously with no reciprocation. (The age old idea that certain things are only "really" gay if you do so and so or have a reciprocated romantic feeling, etc.) Sexual urges don't always have a strict context, many people are also dishonest about the nature of the sexual encounters they actually have had which can distort the actual reality of things sometimes. When you combine this with societal expectations of what such encounters or experiences "should" look like or otherwise imply, things get messy and quite inconsistent very quickly.
@@jeremywright9511 you are right. Most of the sexual encounters I had recently were men who just wanted a hole to empty their urges. Quickly, without a word or a look. I dont know if they were straight, bi or gay, but they could have done the same thing with anything with a mouth or a hole.
It was never about desire, only about releaving some sexual pressure.
Men would absolutely put their d*ck in anything. I am one of this thing.
I am ok with that, it is better than nothing for me, at least I am somehow helpful.
Troy Sivan putting on a wig in his new video screams gay self loathing and desperation. It’s SO cringe. Tossing on a wig so a guy with a blank Grindr profile let’s u go down on him is not empowering. Gays need to get over the masculinity obsession and just go fem for fem! Everyone wants to break gender roles and be flamboyant and camp yet won’t date someone who does the same! 🤷♀️
I am a heterosexual african woman who is very supportive of gay couples and I always hope that they are always happy and the same goes for you, I hope that you find the partner who will love you, take care of you and always value you 😊🙏🏾
Thank you for the empowering and kind comment! I have found my person (finally) after many years. Now, I just want to impart my reflections/experiences because I didn't piece these things together when I was at my most vulnerable moments. Thank you for your allyship, by the way! 💕
I think a part of this whole conversation is really dumb and straightforward shouldn't be discussed at all. And that is the "falling in love" with a straight guy. There is no such thing as falling in love with someone who doesn't love you back. Gays know that themselves and their friends tell them so. Such relationship will ALWAYS end up hurting and damaging one side. What I don't understand is why gay men keep doing this when the already know the outcome and worst how can they call that "love" when is not. If they don't grow pass that childish stage it means they are not mature emotionally and they need therapy or something. To join a discourse in which one gets offended by this but oneself is not able to break the circle is childish and shouldn't be supported by other gay man. It shouldn't get romanticized.
Agreed. The way some chase and obsess over straight men is so foul on so many levels. Then people wonder why we get stereotyped smh
Yeah, because there is no such thing as unrequited love. Jesus.
Please explain how you DON’T fall for someone. If you are regular proximity to someone like work or school etc, and you interact with them on a daily basis, developing feelings is a real possibility. Idk about you, I have about as much control over my feelings as I do the man in the moon.
@@nickmather2132 With a dude you know is straight and never loved you? No. That’s infatuation and obsession. Grow up.
Yeah, because that is always what happens. Get an imagination because there are more scenarios than the one you assume to be true. You don't know every person's experience, so you grow the fuck up.@@kaymillerfromTX
One time a straight man told me "gay men are so easy." This is how some men think because to them it can be easy access to attention, validation, praise, and sexual favors. The truth is that many gay men rarely had positive interactions with straight men growing up, so it can feel really nice to finally receive it as an adult. But you find out it was just so they could feel something in that moment and you're left disappointed and heartbroken - then they enter happy, long relationships while you continue to struggle to find love.
Every straight man I ever had, I used simply for my own pleasure, and afterwards I cared nothing about. They were just an object.
This seems to be getting a lot of criticism in the comments, and I'm a first time viewer so maybe they know better, but I think I get what you're saying and I believe you. Most of us don't get to grow up around other gay kids, which makes us a little desperate by the time we reach a certain age, not to mention underdeveloped socially and emotionally and sexually. And yes there's people who take advantage, and some of them are straight, I'm not sure how common it is, but it's a thing. Reasons are not hard to imagine, sometimes they get you to say great things about them which results in them getting girls, connections, job opportunities... other times they get you to lend them money, get them presents, all kinds of favors... or it can merely be a way to feel good about themselves, build confidence, when their ego takes a blow they can come to you and be adored for a while, and put very little thought in you suffering over the fact that they'll never return your feelings.
A lot of the criticism stems from those commentors not watching the video in its entirety. I appreciate your kind words, by the way. You make some excellent points!
There are so many things regarding the topic that you fail to address, so it leads me to believe that you are just completely unaware of your social surroundings. You fail to mention that there are men that are so lonely in their lives whether they are married or not, that are not getting that kind of nurturing attention elsewhere in their lives. By usually being softer and more in tune with our feminine perspective and we are way more likely to validate their feelings of loneliness and vulnerability probably more than anyone else they know. You forget to mention that sometimes men are so lonely in that the attention from another man is better than the virtually non-existent attention they are already getting, and yes this often includes men that are in relationships where there is no love or affection. You forget to mention the men that have grown up in cultures where being openly homosexual could result in possibly dangerous consequences for them. They may now live in a society that is accepting of it, but they still have a deeply internernalized homophobia that they are often putting themselves in in to existential crises because they are in a constant battle between how they must act vs how they truly feel on the inside. Because as a gay man, you know that there is no changing these feelings. Some men just simply are not ready or willing to live authentically for whatever personal reason. Yes some of these guys may get off on having that "chase" of someone liking them and being able to bread crumb. But in this video you are solely talking about your feelings and your experience that you completely negate the fact that maybe some of these men are genuinely wanting to explore that side of their sexuality and then backing out at the very last second due to fear. You are a very presenting gay man, there is no secret about it. So naturally men that are curious are going to want to experiment with you, versus someone that is seemingly straight and could kick their asses. You're just the safer option. It doesn't make it right because at the end of the day, you are also a human being with feelings. And I am so sorry that your longing for someone to love you, have put you in these kinds of situations. I was there, I share a lot of your experiences - believe me I get it. No judgement, all love. But remember, while you are going through your crap, everyone else is going through theirs as well.
Were you able to watch the video in its entirety? Appreciate your comment, though keep in mind, this is one entry in a series of videos. I touch on some of the things you note in the other entries.
Most of my friends that are left,are straight,and really never came across,what you're talking about,I'd stay away from these people, Easier said then done,But at 68,I'm sorta lonely,after 21 years
I'm going to be completely honest, it sounds like you are doing a fair bit of projecting here. You spent quite a bit of the video explaining what the straight guys thought, how do you know, did you ask them? They might have saw the situation completely different.
I'm going out on a limb and believing that your question is coming from a good place, because I typically don't respond to people who minimize and gaslight via the projection route. These guys relished and even stated they enjoyed witnessing my awkward reactions whenever they'd grope, caress, or touch me in general. And sometimes, they'd even spew the slurs within minutes of the exchanges. It was definitely toxic behavior and not a projection in my head.
@@DonnyWinter calling them toxic sounds like the gaslighting, like I said, they might have seen the situation differently. You calling it toxic seems like your own personal prospective of the situation because of your sexual immaturity at the time. But that's okay, not everyone has everything figured out at 19/20 years old.
@@DonnyWinteryou out here preying on straight men, YOU are what is toxic madam
@Jambara So, them forcibly touching me and making advances was my fault because I'm projecting what I think their intentions were. That doesnt add up, friend. 🤣
@@DonnyWinterThat is funny because I experienced the same treatment from both males and females. You are not projecting this happens to a lot of gay men.
Story of my life. TBH, most gay men can only fall in love into a straight men. I personally have never been sexually attracted to any gay man. Whenever I tried it, it would be a disappointment. As soon as they speak, all attraction disappears. We can be something like girlfriends and that's all. I was always afraid to take the first step towards straights because I didn't want to spoil anyone's life just for my own pleasure. For me, it's a question of morality and respect. If he would make the first move, that would be another matter. But it never happened. And that's why I'm alone. This does not mean that I am totally dissatisfied with my life. But to convince myself that I like other gay men would be a betrayal of myself. I saw many male gay couples and they all just fought, and they would have sex twice a year for the sake of order. No, thanks.
So it sounds more like the straight/gay toxic dynamic is a symptom of gay loneliness where gay men don’t have their own communities to devote their attention to. For a big group of people the solution is simply to find your tribe. I often find myself telling gay men that they should make sure they have the right balance of gay friends because otherwise, self-hatred / self-judgment starts to creep in. Craving intimacy exclusively from straight men shouldn’t be in our vocabularies.
Like... we shouldn't be craving intimacy from straight men at all😭 we need to love our fellow gays and thats that. Not always in a romantic way, but as friends as well.
I had a platonic best friendship with a gay man. Our friendship lasted 29 years until he passed away at the age of 64. We helped each other as friends doo. There is a lot that younger men can learn about platonic gay friendships.
As they say 'lovers come and go, but friends are always there. My best gay friend was always there in the best of times and the worse of times.
This is an excellent point here.
@@stanguy4491 Wow, friends for life. Sweet to hear.
"Vast expanse of emptiness" LOL What rubbish.
Your opinion. 🤷♂️ Let's not dismiss what others have experienced simply because you likely haven't.
@DonnyWinter Hyperbolic expressions of victimhood (loneliness) for entertainment and titillation are shameful, exploitative, and unproductive. Your assumption that I've never experienced loneliness is once again indicative of superficial thinking.
I've found many former sexual partners to identify as "straight" and marry women, have girlfriends while maintaining a secret sexual relationship with me (the gay man) experience has taught me not to become romanticlally attached to closeted "straight" men. I more lonely not having "straight" sexual partners than having no male sexual partners. 😮
As a gay guy that also grew up in a rural area but got through it quite well I have to say I’m very against the idea of the desperate need for a gay community to get one through it. It’s not the homosexuality itself that makes people lonely in my experience. One has to form one’s own community of people. All sort of people are experiencing loneliness it’s not a gay thing.
Fair, but there's already considerable research out there corroborrating the causes of this. Considering the discrimination the community still faces, it's very much a thing concentrated in the LGBTQ+ community.
I'm gay and I have never felt lonely.
I'm glad you've never felt that way!
Why blame straight men,the gays are knowing what they are getting into.gay loneliness usually is with unattractive gay men,i dont have to chase straight guys,idk thats wierd to me
You're missing the entire point here. I'm talking about gays who are either in the closet or JUST out with zero experience. If a straight guy willfully makes a joke of their isolation or capitalizes on it, that's the problem. This has nothing to do with straight chasing.
They used to say in program: the reason I go for un-available people is that "I" myself am un-available. As an "ex" in a 16 yr relationship now on my own, my last three lovers (fuck buddies) all picked me up. They were all straight. Okay. They pretended to be straight, and I pretended to believe them. No love lost, and I got exactly what I wanted......a big dick. No screams attached.
some straight men lead gay men on as a practical joke
It's sadly true
I think it is worth noting that this behavior isn't exclusive to straight men. Gay men very much also do this to one another.
You do make an excellent point about this.
I am a straight man, and: I have deeply appreciated being attractive to gay men. The first and really only love letter I have ever received in my life, I received from a gay man, who is dear to me in my heart. I have always been very clear: "I am sorry, but I cannot reciprocate this sexual attraction." But I have felt loved and appreciated, -- in a way that is extremely rare to feel, as a straight man. I'm sorry if I have inadvertently harmed a man who liked me, but I know that I have never deliberately done so, because I don't have the feeling for that. I don't think it's really about "having power over someone"; For myself, it's about: It's just such a radically different experience than I have with women, where I am ugly by default, or if I am attractive to a woman, it's for a facade I put on, rather than for who I really am. To be attractive to a woman, I have to step through a bunch of hoops and restrictions. Women have a lot of rules. But I have felt really deeply seen by gay men, and especially seen for my sexual nature. Women, on the whole, are terrorized by straight men's sexual nature, and don't want to see it.
I am friends with a number of gay men; They belong to the radical faeries, and they are called "the puppies." They are not furries, it's more about how they "dog pile." They don't seem lonely to me at all. But I can imagine that there are a lot of lonely gay men out there, I am sad to hear.
Women repress their sexuality for the most part, unless they're watching Chippendales, Justin Biever, or whatever makes them scream like banshees. It's also true that a lot of women can survive without men. Ironically, I think a lot of straight men are learning how to survive without women. The Men Going Alone movement is growing. With porn, sex robots, and just shifting one's focus to video games, books, etc, one can find fulfillment.
I'm an introvert, so being alone is pretty much my default, it took me years to get used to it, now I love it. While I would love to be in a relationship, I don't want to sacrifice my standards or date someone I don't like just to have somebody. Also, there's no greater hell than being alone together.
LK thankU sweet to read. You can be at peace, the friendly apology you offer is loving in itself, & the best you can do.
I like men, yep. But if i learn they are straight, it's an automatic deterrent. I have enuf to worry about. But isn't loneliness umm universal, "the human condition". I resigned in abject failure from having a love/sex life. I'm blessed in friendships though
I think what you felt is being adored for your beauty and physical attractiveness, and this includes a full acceptance of your true sexual nature. I'm a gay man and even I see all these expectations women have towards their potential partners, even going as far as to financial expectations; gay man on the other hand love men for their pure physical appearance. Gay and straight men have one crucial thing in common: we all love beauty. You love and adore beautiful women, and we love beautiful men. We don't care so much about status, money, or even education in our potential partners. I sometimes even feel sorry for you straight guys because you are not adored as much as you deserve by your female partners for being so stunning. Thanks for being an ally, btw.
Nice sentiments from a straight man, but perhaps there is one mayor flaw in your comment/feelings! True love have nothing to do with appreciating ones own or another person's physical beauty! what you want have nothing to do with love. Sexual attraction or sexual feelings is a physiological need you can have and get from anyone, regardless of their sexual identity. I as a gay man find women extremely sexually attractive, but my emotional and spiritual bond is strongest with other gay men.
Flexing your sexuality is a normal part of growing up. Late teens and early 20s is often prime time for this exploration. I find the framing in this discussion to be a bit overwrought. Str8 guys are not some ideal or enemy.
bu abinin sıkıntısı ne şimdi
You are so beautiful wow
Aw, thank you!
The REAL cause for loneliness with a lot of y’all is the lack of self awareness or accountability, honestly. As if this man had ill intent or any power at all in YOU somehow catching feelings and not handling them maturely. It’s sad how many men in our community deflect and cling to this “ma trauma, woe is me” persona. When you have 2 people like that in a relationship, what can one expect?
So, before you begin to judge someone's situation and another person's intent, maybe ask for context first. I was literally abused by one of these people before, so no, this isn't a "oh woe is me trauma BS." This is something I've had to work through for years in therapy. I hope you enjoy your day and reflect a bit on that.
@@DonnyWinter I didn’t judge you though. And I was speaking in a very general sense when I said THE COMMUNITY. Obviously we all have different stories but the common denominator is not dealing and healing unresolved issues and blaming anything else. Like how you just tried to do now twisting my comment as one personally directed to you. I meant no malice in my original comment. I want to see more happy couples than guys making “loneliness epidemic” videos dating back years as you are, maybe reflect on that
@@MiguelitoD770 Oh, you were speaking generally. I see where you're coming from. Apologies for the direct confrontation - I've been navigating some other ridiculous comments.
Patronize us more! We love it! (Not)
Reads like a confused response.
Gay loneliness is the result of reach. If it’s directly around you then it’s not special or appealing. It’s a man thing and the fuel for every 80s romantic comedy about a tomboy who finally takes her glasses off and puts on a bow. Her guy friend all of sudden sees the same person he already looked at everyday differently.
Relationships aren’t hard to get either. It’s about the reach…. grabbing something special but that special is a structure created in your head. The ultimate reach is something you wanted but couldn’t have growing up…. a straight boy. Look at all of your female friends and family members. Do you see any scrutiny or standards in the partners they choose? Lol no. On occasion there’s an amazing guy but for the most part they just kind of deal with someone.. anyone and that’s life. If your life needs to be a novel to be interesting then you’ll have to make the novel interesting and nobody remembers a happy ending.
There’s gay men around you but they are invisible to you. Change your prescription and squint a little harder and the straightboy fantasy will disappear.
You must have lived in an unusual place but in the midwest, the Twin Cities area, straight men do not want any associations with gay men. They avoid them totally and seem to dislike them.
It's possible my area was rural and peculiar! Idk haha
Why is that? Is it because of religion, stereotypes, or gays and straights having few shared interests over there?
Most of my friends are straight but I have never been interested in pursuing straight men. Straight men are great friends but I have way to much love for myself to fall for someone who would never want me.
That's fair! Unfortunately, when people are early in their coming out process, they may not fully love/accept themselves at that level.
Or perhaps, grow up. 😐
Speaking with utmost respect here: how is it not grown up to have serious conversations about LGBTQ+ experiences central to many prior to coming out? The world is challenging enough as it is. It's easy to be kind to others.
Bit ironic that someone as emotionally immature as you can tell someone else to ''grow up.'' I guess listening isn't in your skillset.
@@CynthiaNotG Right back at you. What could possibly motivate you to comment on someone's' video with such an entitled, arrogant and excessive tone if it isn't simply due to your own insecurities? Pack it up yourself, and spread some positivity for a change. Have a nice day. 😉
@@CynthiaNotGOh please. You’re allowed to whine about getting the same BM over and over and it’s fine. So let him go about his business.
@@a.m.308Lmao says the dude waiting tables stuck on the times straight customers were nice to him. 💀 It’s obvious why you straight chasing kweens alone and upset. (Especially you yt racist ones who tell on yourselves )
I haven't had any straight men in my life that tried to capitalize on me in that sense that they would befriend me and then play me. But I have observed it a couple of times when I was younger. And I found it to be sad.
This set aside, the gay lonrliness issue is true. I have read about it in relationships books for gay men from the 70s and 80s as well in books that appeared in the 2010s and later. It certainly had been an issue then and it certainly is a relatable issue for many gay men today.
This is why I avoid going into areas where gay men meet. At clubs and bars, I see so many lonely and unhappy gay men.
Some acquaintances I know I have tried to bring together, just realizing that it didn't work because the standards of each were unreasonably high and more often than not about the wrong things.
It doesn't surprise me though. It is hard to find, form and maintain a healthy relationship, if men (most that I know - straight and gay alike) can't seem to look past looks and status. Superficialities basically. One can't build on superficialities and for me, personally, open relationships are superficial ones as they highlight superficialities. Anyway. The gay men keep picking the wrong guys and gals and often I think: Well, 😅, here we go again for the next round of drama. Nothing was learnt and nothing has been learnt.
But I don't blame them completely for it either. Wherever I turn, it is hard to encounter straight or gay men who could be role models. Instead toxic behavior is celebrated and worn as trophies.
No wonder then that the situation isn't satisfactory. But it certainly isn't hopeless. I keep my hopes up sending best wishes and reminding everyone: good guys are around. They are just harder to find. Keep going brave souls: Learn from your mistakes, make a real effort to change unhealthy behavior to better behavior and then love and intimacy will find you.
😢 Well, that hit me right in the feels tonight. I grew up in a big city, but having come of age at the start of AIDS crisis, that didn’t exactly make life fun. For seven years now I've been in rural America - Red State rural America.
My "gay loneliness" could best be defined as a life-long experience of being alone in a crowded room.
As for crushing on straight guys... I've done it (still do), and I feel as if it's a mix between self-preservation and self-sabotage. Straight men are safe. Zero chance of them becoming boyfriends, so zero chance of heartache when they dump us for someone hotter or less "clingy". On the other hand, there's a 100% (ok, a 99.9999%) chance of rejection by them, fueling our self-belief that we are unworthy of love and happiness. (Yeah religious guilt!). There might even be a heaping serving of self-loathing mixed in for good measure.
2023 is very different from 1983, and I wish I was coming of age today because, maybe, I would have something closer to the life young me hoped to have by now, rather than the one old me has. Then again, who knows what the future hold for today's kids? I could end up just as [censored] and not in the fun way. 😢
There's not a 100% chance of rejection. A lot of guys are into it if they feel safe. It's mostly just society that maintains everything as hetero (except when they feel like some girl on girl, that is)
Well said, and sorry for your pain. Any chance you can move to a place where you could experience more queer solidarity?
There are some great catches in those Red States. They often can’t deal with the Left wing gays that dominate the cities. Have an open mind.
😂😂😂 Please, I can't take it! AT GMHC, LGBTQ+ do have worse voice speach magazine at front desk.
This just shows when someone on the outside is looking in, they have no clue what's going in person's world.
Absolutely true, my friend.
That is why you should never assume or jump to conclusions until you know what the guy is going through.
Noticing a lot of negative comments… just want to say I understand the sentiment you are trying to convey. The young gay adult who doesn’t have access to community… it’s not his fault. The straight guys… should be equally sensitive to anyone who could have feelings for them, whether gay guy or straight girl. Furthermore, people in general should be more aware of that. Like you said, this is from the Gay perspective, and I share similar experiences ❤
Thank you. I really appreciate your kindness ♥️
@DonnyWinter I too am very surprised to see all of these negative, and quite frankly rude, comments here. Please correct me if I'm wrong, but it sounds like these straight "friends" of yours basically bullied you by interacting with you and touching you inappropriately. And I don't blame you for sticking with these toxic people for a while, especially if these were the only friends you really had at the time. Like I can imagine being in that situation and not appreciating what these toxic friends do, but would likely think it's better than having no actual friends at all, trying to rationalize the situation with thoughts like "well it could be worse" or "maybe this is just their way of showing that they like me as a friend" or something. Honestly pisses me off that people are victim blaming you for situations that are out of your control, like it's the other person's fault for not interacting with you appropriately, not yours. And how are you supposed to know what the other guy actually means when they do things like caress you or pretend to kiss you, like I would think maybe they might like me back but aren't confident enough to be serious about it. What do these other commentors think we have, mind reading superpowers to know exactly what other people mean when they interact with us?? Sorry for a bit of a rant here, in the end I just want you to know you have every right to talk about this and to label it as a personal trauma you had to spend years trying to unwrap and heal from. Hope the best for you in the present and future, and I hope these other rude comments aren't tearing you down too much.
@@DonnyWinter Also looking at the channel of the one negative commenter on this thread, WakandaleezaRazz, they seem to be some kind of anti-lgbt troll of some sort. Wonder if many of these negative comments are some kind of anti-lgbt trolls tbh. I'm sure you don't need to be told this but I'll say it anyway since it's important regardless, don't listen to them and keep doing what you're doing. Your life experiences and how they have affected you are valid and deserved to be discussed in a kind and respectful manner. And fuck the trolls lol.
"The straight guys… should be equally sensitive to anyone who could have feelings for them, whether gay guy or straight girl." That's La La Land. That would be nice but that's not reality.
@@Not-Ap truth, unfortunately
I don’t think they are conscious of the fact that gay men are starved of intimacy or lonely. In other words their actions are innocent and not malicious (most of the time). As gay men we have to develop boundaries that do not allow these interactions to happen because 9/10 times they do not benefit us.
Yes, developing boundaries are very important and the most important one is self-respect. Chasing after straight men is undermining of that. If they are genuinely straight then they will never love you in the way that you need. And if they are playing games that's even worse. Do yourself a favour and stick to gay men, who can give you what you need.. x
My mom, who has been supportive of me years before i even began to realize what my sexual orientation was (as compared to my dad who is abusively homophobic...) and has been supportive through all my breakups, misfired relationships, etc etc ad nauseum. She said to me a few years ago, "Kody, Love knows no Gender..." I often wonder about that statement. For someone who not only didn't go to college, but didn't graduate from high school (I was born when she was 17) i found that to be a particularly compelling idea. I think Love finds a way if it is meant to be. but I don't think it is supposed to be a struggle, (like in the movies or romance novels) it is supposed to come naturally like many good things in one's life do.
I agree. Love should come naturally
VERY compelling topic. It just kicked me in the gut and helped me realize that my experience with this, is actually more common than I would have thought.
Straight men, who are hungry for validation, dominance, relevance, or even flattery, who also are very comfortable with their sexuality, will 💯 gravitate towards gay men, for they will provide what they seek, using their heterosexuality as a shield to not be accountable for the impact of their selfish solicitations.
Thank you for sharing your story and for bringing the conversation about Gay Loneliness to light. It is for this reason I follow lots of Gay Couples on UA-cam. There is something intimate, almost like a family you have never met before, about watching these gay couples and dreaming up the possibility of safety, comfort, respect, and love in a queer-accepting world.
Interesting. I never in my life thought that a particular man was the be all and end all of being male. I've always had straight friends, and none of them ever cared if I was attracted to them. You know very different people than I did, even in the 70s. I am truly sorry. EDIT: I will grant you, I have never had very many female friends, nearly all of my friends have always been guys. I always joked back, but I also never lacked for people who wanted to be intimate with me. I just never saw the "power dynamic" you are talking about. There were a few who ran away, but most stayed, and many of them are still friends to this day. I think you had more internal issues than you are allowing for. Some of it is social class (not economic) but some of it, I think, is that you never had a good, positive, forward going self-image and sense of self. That is just my opinion. Kind thoughts to you, and blessed be.
I appreciate you sharing your inter-generational perspective on this! (Also, I love your username - Radagast is my fave Tolkien character)
Hearing your perspective on how some straight dudes use the power of attraction against gay dudes reminds me of the same dinamic between women and straight dudes. I think it has to do with how anyone/everyone uses that attraction. Not too many ppl are wise, nice or brave enough to just be straight forward with someone they know is attractrd to them and stay out of their way without using that influence. If we add the teenager state of mind to the equation it gets worse xd. I feel its a bit more about personality issues than sexual orientation. Hope it gets better for everyone.
it is more cruel in the case he mentions
Many people gay/straight male/female enjoy the attention from another person. They will act ambivalent about it and often lead people on, unwittingly or not. They do this because they too are lonely. I’m not trying to make an excuse for shitty behavior. There is an epidemic of loneliness and it can be particularly painful for young people just discovering themselves. Straight men can capitalize on it, gay men do the same. I think it’s even worse when the abuse comes from another gay man.
The whole capitalizing thing you brought up reminds me of something I saw in the Amazon Prime series of The Boys, where one of the superheroes of the group known as the Seven was outed as Gay (but was actually Bi), and when corrected on it, the people the group works for Vought, disregarded that, saying Gay is more profitable. Sorry if this is off topic, but it reminded me of that scene.
Classic gay-baiting. Not everything as to be gay
Strictly No straight man for me.. can celibate but no straight man.
I definitely understand haha.
Over the years l’ve known and continue to know beautiful men; some straight. Many have became individuals who’ve opened up to me. I keep these individuals platonic in my mind because if they don’t share that sex is about deeper openness and intimacy then we’re not on equal footing; and if we’re not equals in that regard then there’s no balance and I’m not interested in that anymore.
The comment section seems to be missing the nuances of this discussion.
I see you though, and I appreciate your insight, Donny.
Thank you. I appreciate you saying this. Many of the comments were people who didn't watch the video in it's entirety.
Very relatable.
❤
@@muratmane2600 Hello Mr I'm very well thank you x
I'm Italian-Brazilian and, in South America, gays doing certain sexual acts on straight-identified men is a big thing and results in a lot of bad emotional states for the gays. Eventually, the woman lover will always settle down with a woman and have kids. Only a gay man can love another as a significant other.
Same could be said for younger gays capitalizing on older gays, this was good content 👏
Definitely true! Thank you! ♥️
Thanks for taking about this and sharing your personal experience. Discussions about healthy relationships are very much needed for everyone, including straight people. Your are a strong person with emotional intelligence, you're already winning. Keep up the great work👍🌈🙏
Thank you!
Very insightful commentary on the issue. My best friends have always been straight men, and this fact probably accounts for my poor relationships with gay men.
Thank you.
Thank you for this discussion
Thank you. I'm glad to Discover you and your channel :) . 37 years old here (i started coming out when I was 16) seems like there was a hard and fast edge between "Gay" and "Straight" - "Back in my day." --- i'm starting to wonder if we are evolving into a post sexual orientation world...Regardless, I have definitely experienced what you are talking about (and still do several times a year). there is often unwanted attention from other so called "Straight" men and definitely not solicited. to my credit, I joke about usually most of those men come out as gay 1o years later and try to sidle back into my life well after I've moved on (the guys I catch feelings for, the ones that weren't openly gay every one of them without exception has eventually come out, after all the self doubt and questioning over them has long passed) .. It's a fine line between arguing for one's limitations / being realistic, while also expanding into opportunities and self actualization. I definitely feel in my case, that even all these decades later I am chiseling away at childhood abuse, family dynamics, and the chronic complex ptsd of being a gay person in this country that in consequence has led to the Journey that I, and perhaps many other gay men are on...I don't believe that is holding me back from fully growing into my best life and best self. but it can be a long drawn out process, and there are often 1o leaps forward and 7 back slides back in that Process...*HUGS*
I think that if all of us could stop treating eachother like shit, we wouldnt be so lonely, and therefore, in a position to be exploited by ill intended STR8S.
I mean, you do make a fair point. I do think our community could benefit from treating one another with more respect.
What an eye opening video, highly appreciate u creating this content 👏
I totally get it. Thanks for your video x
Thank you ❤️
"The epidemic of gay loneliness."
Is there such a thing?
What about the epidemic of straight loneliness?
Straight people, I believe, often feel alone, and, use the gays for validation and sexual relief.
Hi Donny! Definitely can relate! Glad you're in a better place emotionally
Nailed it. They do the same with women who like them, to feed their own egos.
Yep! Absolutely.
No! It's the reverse. Women do it to men.
Excellent, and clear description of something as a gay man I toohave experienced. Thank you for taking the time to talk about these trauma causing situations.
I know your video is about some straight men but do you think about some guys who label them as bicurious on apps?
Please elaborate!
@@DonnyWinter I am sure you may of seen some guys on apps such as Grindr or Fabguys as Bi-curious? The point is do you think those guys are really straight too and just like to manipulate gay guys? I generally avoid them as don't go anywhere near a man who isn't comfortable with being gay. I hope that makes sense.
It's true!
I can relate greatly
I'm not understanding all this condemnation in the comments? For what? For someone who was expressing his feelings and his experience? Whether you agree with them or not, his experiences are his experiences and to say he's wrong to feel the way he feels is wrong. That's gas lighting and anyone who does such things should be ashamed of themselves.
As a straight man I don't have the exact experiences as you Donny, however unrequited love is universal. So on that level I can appreciate your pain. It's unfortunate when someone knows you like them, doesn't return the interest and still decides to play games with you anyway. I'm sorry you had to go through that and am happy you have learned your lessons.
Thank you for your kind response. ♥️♥️
Ok I’m straight & fascinated. Are these guys run if he mill dudes or really masculine? I’m thinking macho because of their ego. It’s a power trip/bullying? I’m trying to understand this, knowing straight guys.
Are these the highly manipulative type? Because they do this to women too. The girl who isn’t attractive enough for them. But if it’s solely abusive, maybe gender doesn’t matter. It’s power over others.
One thing we learn you guys don’t, we see them coming, and we warn each other. You didn’t have that growing up. And when does this happen, I’m assume someone you’re alone with them? I’m becoming a therapist, it’s helpful. I might come across this.
Hi Lindsey! Thank you so much for commenting and asking, especially from the perspective of becoming a therapist. Speaking for only my experiences of course, most of these guys were hyper-masculine or individuals who were insecure with their own masculinity. They would often find a male exhibiting feminine characteristics either appalling or interesting. Some of these guys would bully me, others would attempt to appeal to my sexuality, which I found it be a peculiar thing at the time.
As we grow older and develop experience, I think a lot of LGBTQ+ also learn to warn others when navigating these sorts of things in the dating world. I think that's one reason I wanted to make this video. Now that I've had the chance to examine my trauma in therapy, it's given me the tools to have conversations about these incredibly underdiscussed things which impact gay men.
They don't do it to women. Women do it to us straight men.
Having both straight and gay buds, my straight friends are low maintenance, and are as generous with their time as having a family will allow. They're all good people, sometimes inquisitive of the gay lifestyle, but it's never more than a simple inquiry. My gay friends are mostly partnered. They're all about getting together at the better restaurants and visiting. We don't go too deep in our friendships, but we know what's happening that is important to them.
Raised in a rural setting I totally with the 1:03 observations there were few gay "role models" growing up. If you were going to have friends, they were most likely straight men.
I feel the same way. Straight men just use you.
I’m a queer man of color, and I have Crohn’s Disease and daily chronic pain symptoms. I’ve never been in a relationship, yet I’ve found myself with feelings for one straight guy who’s a dear friend of mine I’ve known for about 6-7years now. I haven’t pursued dating anyone cuz I still have feelings for him, and it wouldn’t be fair to any party. I’m gonna be 23 in 2 days, and I just feel like shit cuz I haven’t experienced much romantically/intimately yet, so I’ve nothing to compare these feelings to, to know if they’re real or just a crush.
I graduated from undergrad school last Spring and most of my time at uni was spent commuting to and from school, not really living on campus or meeting anyone. I’m trying to work on myself, and I know nobody is entitled to a relationship, but it just hurts a lot and makes me wonder if I’ll ever be fortunate to find the right person. Craving intimacy is a bitch. 😞😭
I appreciate you sharing your story. What matters most is that you're trying to work on yourself and that you're analyzing these feelings. Sometimes that's one of the most important steps. If you don't mind me asking (you don't need to answer this if you don't feel comfortable), but have you had a conversation with this straight friend about your feelings? I have no doubt you'll find that right person
Significant
This is exactly how I feel about only fans models and instagram/tiktok influencers
Losing the bar culture may have had some pluses, but it isolated us too.
This right here!!
Yeah you liking men who don’t like men isn’t a culture. It’s a red flag you and this content creator refuse to acknowledge. Ew
I’ve had A LOT of straight guys pay attention to me because of MONEY I’d stupidly spend on them. Hopefully gay guys will learn over time the straight guy’s attention is only because of the $$$. 🤔🤷🏼♂️
There's another name for guys like that: USERS!
@@Inflec Gold diggers and sugar babies also exist but Users ate a very nice term for them
Your describing a narcissist. They just want to have there ego fed. They don't care where it comes from man or woman even if they have a greater preference for one more than the other.
Yes. A lot of the time when I hear stories of these so called "straight" down low men who put on a facade of macho straight man with wives and girlfriends but have multiple affairs with gay men, a lot of the time they sound like they are narcissists. A lot of the gay men make excuses for them blaiming society and stigma for why these men are on the down low, where these men show very little empathy and consideration for the gay person's feelings and is quite willing to use and string them along for their own ends. I think some of these guys wouldn't want to date men openly even if their family and friends accepted it because they like their lifestyle of being able to play the "straight guy" and the thrill of doing something taboo in secret. They like leading double lives and I think as narcissists it makes them feel smart and superior to trick and fool other people around them.
Narcissists like having a hareem of sources of narcissistic supply that don't know about each other so they can have their cake and eat it and to help fill that empty void inside them. Narcissistis also cannot create, regulate or sustain their own self-worth. Without a constant supply of validation and attention from others, the narcissist's self-worth cannot be regulated and will drain away. Because they can create no self-worth of their own and cannot sustain whatever they receive from others, it does not last long and they are soon teetering on the brink of collapse again.The behavior and needs of narcissists usually coincide with how they receive and process this narcissistic supply. This is the supply of admiration, sympathy, attention, sex, power or whatever it is they need to validate themselves as worthy human beings.Sex (and anything else) only matters to narcissists if it is how they receive various forms of validation/narcissistic supply.
These people exist in the narcissist's life solely for what they can give. There is no true interest in them as people or what they need., and not only is there no healthy give and take, there is no true give and take at all, because even when the narcissist appears to be giving, they are taking because of what is called mirroring. Through the process of mirroring, the narcissist presents a "good" image of themselves to someone and receives approval, admiration, sympathy or whatever from the other person in return. It is done only so that the other person "reflects" positive feelings about the narcissist back to them like a mirror - which they then process into temporary self-worth. It's the only way they have to create any, because they cannot create their own "positive feedback" or
Supply the narcissist is seeking from others doesn't always mean things that feel good to the other person. It means things which feel good to the narcissist, and these may not be the same thing. It can be things like admiration and approval, but it can also be things like pity, fear, anger or anything else. In the same way, the "good" image they are presenting of themselves doesn't necessarily mean what we think of as a "good person," though it often is. It just means something that will create the reaction they are looking for from others.. The life of the pathologically narcissistic person is a performance of one for one by one, and other people are the props narcissists use to make the fiction more believable to themselves. If others believe it, that makes it more real. And when it's more real, they can believe it and convert it into self-worth - at least for a time.
This is the function of the narcissistic harem. They are kept and farmed like a herd, to be milked for whatever it is they can give the narcissist and left out to graze when they are not needed. Because pathologically narcissistic people require - literally require - the input and cooperation of others to function, keeping a harem is not just a vanity move or their way of flexing their proverbial muscles. In a very real way, it is resource management, or even hoarding, that is in many ways no different than stocking your pantry with dry goods. If you understood your pantry to be as bottomless as the narcissist's needs are, then you will understand how much it would take to fill it.
Narcissists exist in survival mode all the time. This creates a deep-seated, pervasive insecurity about their own ability to survive and because of that, they endeavor to manipulate and control people in order to make sure their needs will be met.
The fact that narcissists are dependent on others means that other people are actually resources for narcissists, like food and water. Objects, in other words - but necessary ones. If survival depends on others, then others must be controlled to ensure that they will do their part. This is one reason triangulation between resources can happen. It's not just about wanting to get away with lies or continue on with bad behavior. It's deeper than that. The narcissist wants to be sure to control the situation as much as possible and prevent exposure of things about them that would disrupt the flow of validation they need from these people. For example, if Jimmy knows something about Bobby that Bobby thinks makes him look bad, Bobby will do what he can to keep Jimmy away from his other resources so that Jimmy doesn't contaminate them with this "bad image" of him and cause that flow of validation that he needs - that supply - to change or dry up. This is actually very similar to the behavior of young children on the playground and can include keeping people separate or compartmentalizing them away from each other, turning them against each other, playing them off each other, smearing and discrediting Jimmy behind his back in the hope that this causes people to distrust him or not listen to him, discarding Jimmy totally and more.
If it is a group of people who are known to each other, Bobby will do what he can to control the information they receive about him. For example, if the group is people at his job, he may make sure to never bring his partner around the group. He may tell members of the harem that they cannot be friends with his partner or family or he will no longer deal with them. He may demonize people outside the group who know things about him that he doesn't want people in the group to find out. This is all about securing resources for survival.
Trangulation can show up in all different forms with narcissists because there is nothng that feeds their ego more than people fighting over them and it kind of places more value on them to other people. puts them into a power position, controlling the other people involved and the situation in general. It helps to feed them esteem and self-worth as well, because they have taken a position of confidante of both parties, creating the illusion that they are important. Triangulation, just like everything else the pathologically narcissistic person does, is about them and them only. They are manipulating and moving people around like pawns on a chess board, arranging them in the way that best serves the narcissist's needs.
There's an old rule of thumb in marketing which states that if you can make something appear to be in high demand, you will create a sense of urgency in people and they will feel more desire for it. That's why you see those graphics on commercials and things like that which say "Only this many more of this item left!" or "Get it while it lasts!" They are trying to create a sense of urgency in you, to make you believe that if you don't act right now, you will lose out. They are making the item appear more attractive by making it appear that many people want it. This is the basis of romantic triangulation. You will always want something more when you are afraid you will lose it, or when you believe that you have won it. It's just human nature.
This is the way pathologically narcissistic people artificially inflate their value. They may intentionally manufacture a love or relationship triangle - either real or implied - in order to create the idea that they have more value. We often see narcissistic partners doing this with their ex partners or friends. Other people are thrown into the mix in order to make the narcissist appear to be in demand. This creates competition between people for the narcissist's attention. The narcissist then becomes what they dearly want to be: an object worthy of fighting over. People are vying for their attention. People are jealous and envious because of them. People are being controlled and dominated and manipulated by the narcissist. Nothing feeds their ego more. Their self-worth skyrockets and they will do everything they can to prolong and protect the situation. Once a pathologically narcissistic person experiences being the coveted love object, they may create this situation again and again.
Narcissists don't expend effort on something unless it really matters to them within their limited scope, and survival definitely does. It's the entire focus of their existence.
Perhaps the worst part of this is, most of them don't realize any of these things are true, or why they do the things they do. They are just doing what they have always done in the way they've always done it. This is how they survive. The crocodile doesn't look like a floating log because it wants to. It looks like a floating log because that's what it does. This doesn't excuse the abusive behavior of pathologically narcissistic people in any way, but it does shed some light on whether or not it can be changed. If their defense mechanisms could be penetrated and they could somehow be made aware that this is what they were doing, they probably still wouldn't be able to understand emotionally that it's wrong. The crocodile doesn't feel bad for tricking the zebras with his appearance. He doesn't feel anything except hungry. This is how he survives.
@@janx8695 I'll admit I only got about half way through that lol but I agree with you more or less. The fact they exist in the gay communities and our online social networks (ie the apps since they've more or less replaced bars and social clubs) to umpteenth degree explains quite a bit of why most gay men are unhappy. We are swimming in a sea of sharks and wondering why we always get bit.
So he’s describing you? Because Imagine thinking a man who isn’t into men is obsessed with you and trying to play with your emotions lmfao. In what world?
@@cjthompson420 I agree that most of the time gay men are looking into it much more than a straight men and projecting their feelings onto the other person r situation. Even if there is some straight men who do it because they are narcissistic or whatever, it's gay men who need to take responsibilty for their own emotions and make sure they don't get used and taken advantage of. The same thing applies to everyone when they know better..for example when they know there are narcissists out there who will play with peoples emotions, either to boost their own ego or sometimes just for the fun of it because they like like that sort of thing. A narcissist lacks empathy and has no morality so yes they will do that and there is nothing anyone can do to make them stop being that way or to care about another person feelings..all we can do is make sure we are controlling ourselves, our own reactions and emotions so we don;'t get preyed on. If we don't take responsibilty for these things we will just keep getting preyed on by these type of people and ignorance can only be used as an excuse once.
Gay men also have to accept that a heterosexual man is never going to suddenly wake up and turn homosexual. The same way they aren't going to suddenly become straight. Just ask any gay man who come out gay later in life after being married to women and trying to force themselves straight, being married to women did not change who they were sexually attracted to on a funamental level. A straight man is never going to feel the same attraction that a gay man feels for them and it's only a gay mans ego telling them it's possible and reading into things that arent really there. It's not only gay men either I know of a few situations where a straight man thought he could make a lesbian attracted to him.
Yes there is closeted homosexual or bisexual men but they are not the majority. Most men who say they are straight and only attracted to women really are straight and only attracted to women.
@@cjthompson420 You can mock me all you want but the fact is there many men who are bi or just love the attention who do toy with the emotions of men they know are gay and use them get egoic validation. I am fully gay so this does not apply to me and I certainly don't need my ego validated by anyone but me. In example though would be the type of straight guy to go a gay bar and to hit on the straight women who go there to get away from them. They might enjoy the attention they get from gay men in those spaces and even flirt back but never go beyond that. Some might even engage in friendship with gay men they know is interested in them and continue to string them along before dropping at some point.
In college I had women throw themselves at me while I pined after straight friends-- and paid a huge price for the latter
the comments do noootttt pass the vibe check. i think its a cool and interesting discourse to have.
They've been interesting haven't they?
@DonnyWinter absolutely! I think a majority of people, currently at least, are very stuck in this "fix everything yourself" and "everything is your own fault" mindset. It's quite alarming.
while self accountability is super important, it's also important to know that for most people, it takes others input to help out and iron out certain issues that are present. I think everyone is a lot more comfortable in believing that they have the power to fix everything, and that all people have this innate ability.
Lmao imagine playing victim because you chase straight men in your 30’s. Queen please.
Love is gay!!!🏳️🌈🏳️🌈😏✌️👍🌞✨🏳️🌈
Interesting and sad. ❤️
Great topic and the dialgoue is transparent. Maybe you could also include some of those other people that have had similar experiences in a discussion too. 👍
One of the main reasons I live in s city is the wealth of other gay men. There can be plenty of loneliness in same sex relationships as well, but I never waist my time thinking about cute straight guys.
I agree with you one hundred percent, many of them take advantage of us in this way, bit we let them because we too want their attention, and sometimes we will hook up with them. What is a dream come true for us tgey, them usually regret. Or do they?...
These comments are way too harsh. Willing to reckon most of us have had developed crushes on straight guys at some point in time. The important thing is moving on, and recognizing how it is ultimately a destructive cycle.
It is. That's why I made this video.
Yes, sometimes (in most cases?) it's capitalizing on it, but sometimes it can be just need for some sort of very close relation, but not "too close" (again, for many reasons: sometimes because social or internalized homophobia doesn't allow this, sometimes it's just comfortable to have a "pet guy" around because it's cheep and non-risky for those fearing any long-term commitment).
You do make an excellent point.
donny: I let people mistreat me because I was vulnerable, but they still shouldn't have mistreated me.
Everyone else: no. you are to blame and won't take accountability.
.....did we watch the same video?? like duh obviously he coulda, shoulda said no
but let's not all act holier than thou and just pretend that Mr. Donny here is the only gay person on the face of the earth who has allowed some straight man to run some foolishness on him
and you can't have someone run foolishness on you...if there aren't people willing to do the foolishness???
like...let's not pretend that straight guys are complete angels who do no wrong and have never in the history of the world done anything or do anything to mess with gay people
I feel like the entire point was missed
and a completely conspiracy theory: that attitude y'all have towards mr donny is more of a projection of your frustration with yourselves for allowing it to happen to y'all's selves cuz aint no way y'all non-empathetic judgmental gays have all steered away from romance/sex with straight men...
Thanks for sharing ..and most of all thank u for sharing u vulnerability with us .That takes a lot of courage man ...Hugz ❤
Thank you for your kindness. It means a lot. ♥️♥️♥️
Thank god, I like my men very gay.
🤣
Great points
Ugh, been there. So many times. I’m glad I’m married now and don’t have to worry about it affecting me as deeply as it did in the past. It still happens though, and it really sucks because I’m not even looking for romance and really just want someone I could go do things with that my husband doesn’t particularly like to do. I’ve pretty much given up on that at this point though. I’ll be my own damned running buddy.
This is the same f$@ing thing that happend to me two days ago. He acted and I fell for it 😞
I'm sorry this happened to you :(
@@DonnyWinter Thank you ❤️
I’m so glad that I grew up back in the 90s in SoCal. I came out when I was 19 and found community soon after as well as my first boyfriend. I’ve heard so many stories from the younger generation about their first experiences being traumatic etc. I’m so sorry that happened to you my friend. I remember falling for straight guys a lot, but back in those days it wasn’t as open as it is these days. We also didn’t have apps so we had to wash our ass and go out to the clubs. I recently came out as a trans woman and am now experiencing a lot of loneliness. My loneliness comes from the fact that I’m in transition and just not really comfortable going out as much as I used to when I was younger. I feel very fortunate that my first experience was with someone that I knew and cared about. ❤❤❤
I appreciate your kind words, and thank you for sharing your experiences/story. I think it's important to see these sorts of things. ❤
I feel like this guy read my diary, because I go through this shit a lot, and not even that but when a straight man gets too close I usually cut off all contact because it's all fun and games till someone falls in love. :/
I know what you mean pal. I have fallen for straight guys before but you can only get so close then you build a wall between you and them. You tend to realize he is pulling at your heart strings and he does not even know he is doing it. Ultimately than have to cut it off to save yourself from internal struggles.
@mikelangley3919 not even that but you don't wanna risk losing the friendship. I cannot tell you how many times I've ruined "close" friendships because the dude was getting too comfortable. Now it's come to the point where I put boundaries even before they start to get close. It's harsh but I have to do it. I feel bad at the same time I don't because I come first and so do my feelings.
I hadn’t heard of this. It’s worrying. But I can understand your craving and behaviour.
How do you think your fake concern for an invented “epidemic” helps?
@@Anahi1991 Fake concern? I was a very lonely gay man when I first came out. There are lonely gay men everywhere, especially in communities that either entirely or commonly reject homosexuality, and in countries where homosexuality is illegal.
“I can understand your craving” is a weird sentence. You can understand he chases men who are into women and paint him as a victim? Grow up
@@kaymillerfromTX “I can understand your craving” has all the syntax of a complete sentence. I can understand his attraction to the men. I said nothing about the painting of him and a victim.
Wow. Reading the comments here is eye-opening. There is a term for when a man explains something to a woman in a condescending manner.--mansplaining. What we need now is a term for straight men who do the same thing to gay men. Straightsplaing? Queersplaining?
Imagine lying about the comments being from straight men so you won’t have to look inward.
It may have been an error on part thinking that many of the comments were from straight men,--a few were--but that doesn' mean I was lying or that you know anything about me and whether or not I have looked inward. You know nothing about me. Nothing. @@cjthompson420
Just pick and choose your friends ❤😊
Wise words ❤
@@DonnyWinter Sometimes it's good to have a mix of friends it's ok
I've never heard of this but it's definitely sad and needs to be talked about. Also I might miss RTT today.