Take the ceiling tiles out and removed the ceiling grit under the air handler. Rent a 12ft material lift and replace the whole air handler. I have learned so much from watching your vids. My hats off to you.
Yes that’s what I would do too, there’s too much rust on that evaporator and now is a good time to do it with the Covid 19 shutting lots of places down.
Thank you for making your followers apart of your day to day project. You truly have a passion for HVACR and a passion to share your wisdom to the HVACR community.
Eso es un verdadero laberinto, no me arriesgaría a cambiar evaporadores, sólo reparar y dejar que soporte el mayor tiempo posible... Gracias por compartir todas las observaciones y razonamientos en un escenario tan complejo y lleno de detalles... Gracias por el contenido!!
Bite the bullet and change the air handler. Spring isolators work better than rubber. Check for proper grounding. Anything with a VFD needs a really good ground. Good work Chris. Welcome to my world.
All the leaks of the world in one single video... All the dificult in the world to change a coil in one single video... This is for sure: The HVAC UNABEATABLE video. Good one!
I would love to have the opportunity to just ride along for one day. Unpaid time and just shadow you.. in one day I'd walk away with so much. Keep up the phenomenal work sir
Man be thankful that has an attic to walk on. I almost got sunk into a job to replace an 15ton evap coil in the ceiling accessed by only ladders. There was a lift though, but I was reassigned to run a few service calls, lmao, hope this job goes well for you, be safe!
Hello from Philadelphia. I'm in the bakery equipment industry for over 34 years at one company. I enjoy your videos, you are a true troubleshooting technician. You do a great job of explaining why & what happening. Kudos to you.
Personally I would not recommend the leak repair. Just too many opportunities for things to go south. Miss one leak on the bottom or in a hard/impossible to reach spot you'll never pull a vacuum and you be replacing the coil or the AHU altogether anyway wasting a whole lot of time and money. Depending on site conditions and the layout of the kitchen, if possible remove the tiles and ceiling grid and use either a material lift or 2. You could also use a genie hoist to lift the AHU on top of a small scissor lift to get it up there. You right, looks like a beauty.... Seems like a pain but beats playing a guessing game chasing leaks around. Really enjoy the content so please keep it up. Corey in Vancouver.
I agree I would say hey we can try and fix as many leaks as we can but ultimately that coil will need to be replaced so the choice is yours. I look forward to an update about this job looks big brother but you got this !
One thing I've done with success when equipment is super far apart is hook up probes and leave a device by it, then teamview into that device from wherever you want to see it. I've also done it to help people troubleshoot. You could have your tech call you, teamview into his device, and see what he sees. Plus you have control of his device to swipe wherever you want. Across the county doesn't even matter.
just saved a big electrical mess when you decided to open up the other system , at 480 v and 600 volts there is no room for bad or loose connections , it arcs and burn quite hard !!
I will discuss this on my livestream this evening 4/6/20 @ 5:PM (pacific) come on over and check it out if you can, if you can’t catch it live it will post as a normal video afterwards.. ua-cam.com/video/ghTZnyid98k/v-deo.html
With the amount of leaks and repairs that will be done to the evap as it is, better off paying a bit extra for a new one. The obstacles aren't your fault, it is what it is. Good work Chris as always 👍
Just a thought. About 25 years ago, we had multiple compressors with either the 90 or the straight pipe just after, rip open. Installed vibe eliminators but it did not solve the problem. Engineers from Weather King met me on site. After extensive testing, they determined the problem was compressor harmonics. I know its probably not related, but with so many leaks, and a VFD changing frequency, could there be an issue? Again, probably not related, but just throwing that out there.
Man those compressor modules can be a pain in the ass. Lots of nuisance calls over the years from those things. I've had to pull a few out here and there. Man that coil looks like a pain. I think you'll save yourself a headache if you can manage to swap the coil rather than repair. Great job as always
I had a condenser with this problem on a rooftop unit, the customer didn’t want to change it and said to just go ahead and do what I could and bring him the bill. Just like you said, as I would fix one two others would pop up and I literally just silver soldered almost the entire side and stopped cutting away the metal, it took about 6 hours, two tanks of nitrogen and a tank of oxy and acetylene, pulled a really long vacuum and recharged with NU22B since it was an old R22 unit and that was actually 5 years ago this month, he actually was selling the building and had already negotiated the price based on the existing kitchen and hvac equipment. I really didn’t expect it to last that long, but I guess it’s what you put into that kind of repair as to how long it last.
Remove the coils and indoor blower then you remove the air handler frame. Alot lighter than removing everything at once. Also cut the frame once its off the struts. Then you can take the frame down in sections. Then if possible use a man lift (rental)for the new airhandler if not a lot of man power....
With the cost of changing just the coil including all the man hours. you would probably be on par with just changing the whole air handler. Remove the grid right under the handler use a scissor lift to pull it down replace it and make sure you put the right supports in it to suppress vibration. They thing is rattling itself apart hence all the fractures. The building doesn't look that old. Seems like the original installer took a lot of short cuts and your having to clean up the mess.
looked like it was just in front or beside the boxes in a hallway or over kitchen, looked like a light, lots of conduit and other wiring directly underneath the unit also.
@@joeshearer1247 i think the wire rope on 45 degrees from the hanging strut makes the unit to ridgid. It wants to vibrate but can't, that could cause extreme overload in these tiny corner brasings as well
Wow. I agree that vibration is the cause of the leaks. That evap coil replacement is going to be a bear. I know that it's up to the customer but, I would try to repair the leaks with the customer knowing that a coil replacement is in the future. As far as the replacement they probable would have to have the ceiling opened up for you to do this safely.
Those Emerson modules are a pain in the ass. You need to check the cycle rate of the EMS. If it’s more than 6 times an hour that can cause the module to trip the “short cycle” fault. This being a new EMS leads me to think that is a problem.
Give them a price to replace the Air Handler. Its going to take ingenuity. You probably already know that the fan coil will cost close to the coil. Thanks for sharing.
if you go for a new coil would you pre-install braze over all these little pipes to make them have more strength in them? Or would that make them just more stiff and susseptical (sorry if spelled wrong) to cracking under vibration? And not talking about warranty issues going out the door after you do more to it then braze a lineset to it.
I would have the owner take down the ceiling to make enough room to completely change the coil or better yet the entire blower/coil unit. That is a really tough place to work. Good luck and thanks for the video.
stuff is getting rough out here. My company has done 36,000 worth of work for Old Chicago and Rock Bottom and they just declared bankruptcy last month, and other places cancelling PM's, and putting stuff off cause they're at half capacity. Next few months are gonna be rough. Keep up the good everybody it'll get better!!!
Cracks me up your saying do not wear headphones, they won’t even let us as a work standard much less OSHA regs. In the past I framed in the underside with more strut and ell brackets to create a solid base under the unit. Then we were able to disassemble the coil and replace it. That was a fun one working 30’ up in a canning facility with a food safe environment. We had to hang tarps below the unit to prevent any dust or debris from falling while wearing hair and beard nets.
lol as iff dust doesn't flow anywhere on the airmovements inside the building. They should have just shut down and make it fast instead of making it look good (taking hours) and stil risk the food :( management crap, bah.
What are they using for low ambient head pressure control for cooling operation? That could be the problem. The head pressure might be getting too low if they don't have any control of it, causing low suction pressure. It looks like it has an economizer you might want to make sure that works too. I think you should offer repairing the coil on areas that you can access that you found already, that would greatly improve the situation. If there's anything in the loops then they have to get a new evaporator. You can take out a ceiling light to try to get a new coil up into that area. I've had to use temporary hanger in one corner to make repairs on equipment when I have to take out a corner post. You can even hang it by the return duct that's attached to the air handler hanging that with a temporary strap if you have to take out a corner post to change out that coil. It looks like the only way I could come out through the top I don't think you have enough room from the side
it seemed for sure the condensers were running without indoor fans on, but possibly they kept banging them from heat to cool mode setting up thermostats or before they set them up.
Just a recommendation on your hook on the rope. Put a clip on it so that whatever is on the hook does not come off. Saw a guy hauling up some stuff and something caught and actually tipped the hook and everything came off and crashed to the ground. So i normally hate hooks without clips. Man, those leaks looked big when combined. Surprised it hadnt lost more unless it had just started. And that looks unusual. Read someone mentioned the vibration of the unit. Not good. Great diagnostics again !
11:06 I literally just said out loud oh s*** the moment you said 480 when you showed that contactor. Yes I believe you will see a nice fireworks show! from that
If you solder over the brazes one would choose a solder with a plastic phase -- in order to do some fillet or build-up. The style of joints don't look like they would presently handle the stresses of vibration to well -- the angle of transition is to sharp. One might want to avoid high temperatures if nitrogen can not clear the oil film on the inside of the tubes. Maybe something can be done to reduce vibration. The manufacture cut corners to sharp. I don't want to say epoxy, cause there are to many variables.
probably should have powered it off with lockout tag, because that will be a big fireball and meltdown when it lets go the rest of the way. possibly bad enough to destroy the whole unit permanently
I think that thing might of vibrated itself to bits. I would say no matter how many leaks you fix there will always be more. What is directly under the AHU? Is it floor tiles or the walkins etc? I almost think it might be easier for you to lower the whole AHU down and change the coil in it on the ground rather than up in the roof space.
I’m looking into get the field piece probes and a tablet for using measure quick. Is your tablet connected to like a phone company or are you only using Bluetooth to use the measure quick app?
Yesterday I bought myself a Copeland scroll compressor and I’m using it to pump fog for a fog machine! Can you use a Copeland scroll compressor to pump water vapor?
10:58 looks like a loose connection (or not using wire end ferrules) caused that terminal there to burn up. Good thing you saw that - that's basically a cable fire waiting to happen.
Looks like the return is a big 90 piece. If I remember right the coil can be pulled out from the back, so perhaps you could rent a lift and a couple tall ladders, get the ceiling removed, pull the 90 off the return and pull the coil out the back.
That sucks, It wouldn’t surprise me if the filters didn’t get changed in the winter causing higher head pressure on the evaporator coil, that’s a crazy amount of leaks, I would try to patch the leaks on the headers maybe not the U turns idk that a big job
i have no clue what you mean, but i have watched enough of his videos to know he is working for large restaurant groups long enough. He knows how to and has been billing them the right way else these videos would be nowhere so abundant.
Subscribed, Love your videos, and appreciate all the work you do to bring these videos to us, it cant be easy to do your job, while recording it for us. Looking forward to the follow up to this video. Kym
the thing with troubleshooting with sound is like guess work and pure intuition. I once had a german and a japanese engineer for a supervisor they both said that they want definitive proof and troubleshooting with sound is not the proper way to do it. so went back to the electric motor with a power logger, electrostatic discharge bearing tester, vibration tester, megger, tachometer and thermal camera just to troubleshoot the speed of the compressor drive. and remember clearly mr. german engineer told me "intuition is not a troubleshooting tool its only a guide how to proceed and instrument is there to produce digestable data. I had the same trouble just like that, cramped ceiling and large evaporator coil(30 TR). cant replace the whole evaporator without destroying the concrete slab of mezzanine. this is what I did: 1. cut the old evaporator to size of the egress/digress opening. 2. order 6 units of evaporator(5 TR each) 3. paired 2 evaporator with 1 unit of 10 TR expansion valve. 4. connect all liquid line feeding to expansion valve in parallel (3 units of 10 TR in one common liquid line header) and same with suction line but with the consideration for connection of internal pressure/suction super heat and sensing bulb of TX valve. I have read something like, soft soldering a R-410a is a big no no. it will leak eventually and copper pipe must be rated for R-410a. why all the rubber insulation there has no polyethylene tape?
Do you send the bill to installer or manufacturer of this unit? That thing going out on all those joints in the same spot are either bad install, letting the thing vibrate itself to chambles or it was a mondaymorning job in the factory when someone bodged the pipes together and QC was not sharp either!! Either way i would suggest the customer to make sure they don´t pick up the (entire) bill themselves.
Is that vibrating electrical line related? Could it be resonating and messing with hanging items? The coil is mounted to maximize surface area in a diag. format. I feel like that makes vibrations worse. Could you possibly shift weight on the handler lower or higher, (or just the mounts), so vibration is minimized?
Well, if your hypothesis is correct about the energy management short cycling those units, I can see how the other unit was crispy, just spit balling here but maybe that terminal was lose so starting AMP's much higher. just my 2 pcs of CU
Given the number of things wrong with the install, and that the two roof condensing units are identical, I'd say you could blame a bad install. Loose connectors get hot, even with "safe" amp draws. All it takes is someone not torquing the connector down, and you get burnt terminals.
Well dang, that's a disaster of a job! I'm guessing it's a split system because of the ground floor location? Whatever you decided, I hope to see a followup on this one!
What do you think caused so many leaks? Was it vibrations or Is it just a poor quality product? If it is vibrations what could you do to eliminate the vibrations? I would not think of trying to do anything less than replace the entire air handler. If you try to repair it you'll be back facing more leaks in no time. Do you ever look at a repair like this one and just decide it is not worth the time and possible danger to even do the job?
I would like to ask you about the reasons for the liquid line Excessive temperature around 200 f or more in top roof ac units? Thanks for all you Great Videos..
Not going to I subscribed to this channel along time ago just bc it interests me..... ok just for reference I have no clue how hvac or really anything hvac and how it works and what has to be where and what is that and this and that and yatta yatta yatta my point is I find it interesting on how hvac works like mechanical behind it.... and every little working item..... anyways I enjoy these videos very and much love from the US.
What a problem what a pain..i am not comfortable having a heat pump unit in a ceiling void.. ,,Yes i agree what some people said here,, the cause of the problem is vibration causing all these leaks, and perhaps the easiest way is to lift the AHU out and lower down a new one....,,,i would like to know how you will eventually tackle this problem..
I’ve worked on this units a lot they always end up getting leaks on the coil and sometimes with long line sets with a solenoid the coil gets moisture pulled in and then starts causing oil logged evaporator issues and havoc 🤯
11:00 doubling up on lugs barely big enough to hold the feed. Some of those contactors have extra spade connectors on them or u can get them or install auxiliary contacts if equipped. I used to carry a bunch of NO and NC auxiliary contacts on me. Sounds like sketch management company you mentioned.
Good video, but the gamble may have caused you to put the wrong refrigerant in the system. I see a 410a can and both labels on evap coil and powerhead say r22
I would add service port at Airbender and recovery charge, and repair leak then check vacuum till you holding mic. That will less trip between cond unit and air hander.. Goodluck
I probably would have gave them quote to replace the Air handler and one to replace The coil and one for if they can’t afford it and just want to try and fix as many leaks as possible it with no guarantees. Let them decide.
Take the ceiling tiles out and removed the ceiling grit under the air handler. Rent a 12ft material lift and replace the whole air handler.
I have learned so much from watching your vids.
My hats off to you.
Roberto Garcia or at least get a new coil assembly for it
Yes that’s what I would do too, there’s too much rust on that evaporator and now is a good time to do it with the Covid 19 shutting lots of places down.
Thank you for making your followers apart of your day to day project. You truly have a passion for HVACR and a passion to share your wisdom to the HVACR community.
i have absolutely no clue of HVACs, but i enjoy every single video from you, keep them coming! greetings from germany!
same, but i'm electrian so i get at least the electrical parts. Also from germany =)
Deutscher 😜
Compressor = Verdichter, auf Deutsch 😉
Eso es un verdadero laberinto, no me arriesgaría a cambiar evaporadores, sólo reparar y dejar que soporte el mayor tiempo posible... Gracias por compartir todas las observaciones y razonamientos en un escenario tan complejo y lleno de detalles... Gracias por el contenido!!
Bite the bullet and change the air handler. Spring isolators work better than rubber. Check for proper grounding. Anything with a VFD needs a really good ground. Good work Chris. Welcome to my world.
All the leaks of the world in one single video... All the dificult in the world to change a coil in one single video...
This is for sure: The HVAC UNABEATABLE video. Good one!
I would love to have the opportunity to just ride along for one day. Unpaid time and just shadow you.. in one day I'd walk away with so much. Keep up the phenomenal work sir
Man be thankful that has an attic to walk on. I almost got sunk into a job to replace an 15ton evap coil in the ceiling accessed by only ladders. There was a lift though, but I was reassigned to run a few service calls, lmao, hope this job goes well for you, be safe!
Hello from Philadelphia. I'm in the bakery equipment industry for over 34 years at one company. I enjoy your videos, you are a true troubleshooting technician. You do a great job of explaining why & what happening. Kudos to you.
Personally I would not recommend the leak repair. Just too many opportunities for things to go south. Miss one leak on the bottom or in a hard/impossible to reach spot you'll never pull a vacuum and you be replacing the coil or the AHU altogether anyway wasting a whole lot of time and money.
Depending on site conditions and the layout of the kitchen, if possible remove the tiles and ceiling grid and use either a material lift or 2. You could also use a genie hoist to lift the AHU on top of a small scissor lift to get it up there. You right, looks like a beauty....
Seems like a pain but beats playing a guessing game chasing leaks around.
Really enjoy the content so please keep it up.
Corey in Vancouver.
I agree I would say hey we can try and fix as many leaks as we can but ultimately that coil will need to be replaced so the choice is yours. I look forward to an update about this job looks big brother but you got this !
One thing I've done with success when equipment is super far apart is hook up probes and leave a device by it, then teamview into that device from wherever you want to see it. I've also done it to help people troubleshoot. You could have your tech call you, teamview into his device, and see what he sees. Plus you have control of his device to swipe wherever you want. Across the county doesn't even matter.
I suppose there is some moral dilemma with it, but it's an option.
just saved a big electrical mess when you decided to open up the other system , at 480 v and 600 volts there is no room for bad or loose connections , it arcs and burn quite hard !!
Hence the black terminal screws...
Vibrations. Poor install. That coil vibrates and the joints gave way.
I just was thinking that too... vibration dampening mounts should be a thing.
I will discuss this on my livestream this evening 4/6/20 @ 5:PM (pacific) come on over and check it out if you can, if you can’t catch it live it will post as a normal video afterwards.. ua-cam.com/video/ghTZnyid98k/v-deo.html
With the amount of leaks and repairs that will be done to the evap as it is, better off paying a bit extra for a new one. The obstacles aren't your fault, it is what it is. Good work Chris as always 👍
Just a thought. About 25 years ago, we had multiple compressors with either the 90 or the straight pipe just after, rip open. Installed vibe eliminators but it did not solve the problem. Engineers from Weather King met me on site. After extensive testing, they determined the problem was compressor harmonics. I know its probably not related, but with so many leaks, and a VFD changing frequency, could there be an issue? Again, probably not related, but just throwing that out there.
Man those compressor modules can be a pain in the ass. Lots of nuisance calls over the years from those things. I've had to pull a few out here and there. Man that coil looks like a pain. I think you'll save yourself a headache if you can manage to swap the coil rather than repair. Great job as always
You're a teacher man. Mega kudos.
Thanks bud
I had a condenser with this problem on a rooftop unit, the customer didn’t want to change it and said to just go ahead and do what I could and bring him the bill. Just like you said, as I would fix one two others would pop up and I literally just silver soldered almost the entire side and stopped cutting away the metal, it took about 6 hours, two tanks of nitrogen and a tank of oxy and acetylene, pulled a really long vacuum and recharged with NU22B since it was an old R22 unit and that was actually 5 years ago this month, he actually was selling the building and had already negotiated the price based on the existing kitchen and hvac equipment. I really didn’t expect it to last that long, but I guess it’s what you put into that kind of repair as to how long it last.
I'll stick with my refrigerated trailer units. All that climbing you did made me out of breath and sore. Good job my friend
Remove the coils and indoor blower then you remove the air handler frame. Alot lighter than removing everything at once. Also cut the frame once its off the struts. Then you can take the frame down in sections. Then if possible use a man lift (rental)for the new airhandler if not a lot of man power....
With the cost of changing just the coil including all the man hours. you would probably be on par with just changing the whole air handler. Remove the grid right under the handler use a scissor lift to pull it down replace it and make sure you put the right supports in it to suppress vibration. They thing is rattling itself apart hence all the fractures. The building doesn't look that old. Seems like the original installer took a lot of short cuts and your having to clean up the mess.
looked like it was just in front or beside the boxes in a hallway or over kitchen, looked like a light, lots of conduit and other wiring directly underneath the unit also.
Mathew Russell vibration dampers would limit the transmission into building but wouldn’t the internal parts vibrate the same ?
@@joeshearer1247 i think the wire rope on 45 degrees from the hanging strut makes the unit to ridgid. It wants to vibrate but can't, that could cause extreme overload in these tiny corner brasings as well
sits here and waits patiently for coil replacement video!
Wow. I agree that vibration is the cause of the leaks. That evap coil replacement is going to be a bear. I know that it's up to the customer but, I would try to repair the leaks with the customer knowing that a coil replacement is in the future. As far as the replacement they probable would have to have the ceiling opened up for you to do this safely.
Those Emerson modules are a pain in the ass. You need to check the cycle rate of the EMS. If it’s more than 6 times an hour that can cause the module to trip the “short cycle” fault. This being a new EMS leads me to think that is a problem.
Give them a price to replace the Air Handler. Its going to take ingenuity. You probably already know that the fan coil will cost close to the coil. Thanks for sharing.
if you go for a new coil would you pre-install braze over all these little pipes to make them have more strength in them? Or would that make them just more stiff and susseptical (sorry if spelled wrong) to cracking under vibration?
And not talking about warranty issues going out the door after you do more to it then braze a lineset to it.
I see this job as a good opportunity for your company to make a little money. Because you checked out everything. Even if it is hard.
I would have the owner take down the ceiling to make enough room to completely change the coil or better yet the entire blower/coil unit. That is a really tough place to work. Good luck and thanks for the video.
Look for vibration solutions such as installing vibration dampers on the airhandler, I bet the vibrations are causing the leakes on the evap coil
or in the line set
the other curve ball here is with covid19, its a gamble if that business is going to around long enough to pay your bill.
stuff is getting rough out here. My company has done 36,000 worth of work for Old Chicago and Rock Bottom and they just declared bankruptcy last month, and other places cancelling PM's, and putting stuff off cause they're at half capacity. Next few months are gonna be rough. Keep up the good everybody it'll get better!!!
“Hey you know I liked this” couldn’t help it
Slowly back up, turn around start running never look back!
Excellent video looking forward for part two 👍👍👍
Cracks me up your saying do not wear headphones, they won’t even let us as a work standard much less OSHA regs. In the past I framed in the underside with more strut and ell brackets to create a solid base under the unit. Then we were able to disassemble the coil and replace it. That was a fun one working 30’ up in a canning facility with a food safe environment. We had to hang tarps below the unit to prevent any dust or debris from falling while wearing hair and beard nets.
I really love those jobs....NOT
lol as iff dust doesn't flow anywhere on the airmovements inside the building. They should have just shut down and make it fast instead of making it look good (taking hours) and stil risk the food :( management crap, bah.
Hey Chris i hope we get an update on this one!! Either repair or replace would be a great and probably long video!! That would be awsome.
I very rarely offer to braze up an evap coil. You know new leaks will pop up as soon as you leave.
What are they using for low ambient head pressure control for cooling operation? That could be the problem. The head pressure might be getting too low if they don't have any control of it, causing low suction pressure. It looks like it has an economizer you might want to make sure that works too. I think you should offer repairing the coil on areas that you can access that you found already, that would greatly improve the situation. If there's anything in the loops then they have to get a new evaporator. You can take out a ceiling light to try to get a new coil up into that area. I've had to use temporary hanger in one corner to make repairs on equipment when I have to take out a corner post. You can even hang it by the return duct that's attached to the air handler hanging that with a temporary strap if you have to take out a corner post to change out that coil. It looks like the only way I could come out through the top I don't think you have enough room from the side
it seemed for sure the condensers were running without indoor fans on, but possibly they kept banging them from heat to cool mode setting up thermostats or before they set them up.
Just a recommendation on your hook on the rope. Put a clip on it so that whatever is on the hook does not come off. Saw a guy hauling up some stuff and something caught and actually tipped the hook and everything came off and crashed to the ground. So i normally hate hooks without clips. Man, those leaks looked big when combined. Surprised it hadnt lost more unless it had just started. And that looks unusual. Read someone mentioned the vibration of the unit. Not good. Great diagnostics again !
11:06 I literally just said out loud oh s*** the moment you said 480 when you showed that contactor. Yes I believe you will see a nice fireworks show! from that
I have been shocked once before by 480 and it hurt like a son of a b****
If you solder over the brazes one would choose a solder with a plastic phase -- in order to do some fillet or build-up. The style of joints don't look like they would presently handle the stresses of vibration to well -- the angle of transition is to sharp. One might want to avoid high temperatures if nitrogen can not clear the oil film on the inside of the tubes. Maybe something can be done to reduce vibration. The manufacture cut corners to sharp. I don't want to say epoxy, cause there are to many variables.
You and me had the same reaction when you found that melted wire
probably should have powered it off with lockout tag, because that will be a big fireball and meltdown when it lets go the rest of the way. possibly bad enough to destroy the whole unit permanently
You are great I learn a lot from you keep on posting
Great new videos. Thanks Chris. Keep up the good work.
great video new one has to installed big picture diagnosis
Wow. That coil change is gonna be a nightmare no matter what. Good luck.
Great video! Good luck with this one.
I think that thing might of vibrated itself to bits. I would say no matter how many leaks you fix there will always be more. What is directly under the AHU? Is it floor tiles or the walkins etc? I almost think it might be easier for you to lower the whole AHU down and change the coil in it on the ground rather than up in the roof space.
rent a lift, drop the air handler out of the ceiling, and replace the whole thing
Great video as always!
I’d change the air handler , but it would be a bear to change out , good luck Chris
Keep Up The Good Work!!
That reminds me of my luck👍👍 scissor lift time 🤣.
I’m looking into get the field piece probes and a tablet for using measure quick. Is your tablet connected to like a phone company or are you only using Bluetooth to use the measure quick app?
rework the hanging on the air handler so it won't fall and change out the coils plus put flex connectors on line sets
What a job !
Informative. A guide line 4 beginner,s
Yesterday I bought myself a Copeland scroll compressor and I’m using it to pump fog for a fog machine! Can you use a Copeland scroll compressor to pump water vapor?
10:58 looks like a loose connection (or not using wire end ferrules) caused that terminal there to burn up. Good thing you saw that - that's basically a cable fire waiting to happen.
Reminds me of back when i used to service the refrigeration equipment at LaGuardia airport and had to go ontop of the walk in boxes to work on stuff
Looks like the return is a big 90 piece. If I remember right the coil can be pulled out from the back, so perhaps you could rent a lift and a couple tall ladders, get the ceiling removed, pull the 90 off the return and pull the coil out the back.
Another great videos
That's at the galleria in riverside off tyler. i sure do miss riverside.
That sucks, It wouldn’t surprise me if the filters didn’t get changed in the winter causing higher head pressure on the evaporator coil, that’s a crazy amount of leaks, I would try to patch the leaks on the headers maybe not the U turns idk that a big job
Best hvac poster on u tube!
Thanks for the vid's i have found myself addicted haha.
Just a warning, you should go Net 0 on your labor and parts with resturants, especially if they are owned by a large restaurant group.
What does net 0 mean
PNEUMATIQ yeah what does it mean
i have no clue what you mean, but i have watched enough of his videos to know he is working for large restaurant groups long enough.
He knows how to and has been billing them the right way else these videos would be nowhere so abundant.
Subscribed, Love your videos, and appreciate all the work you do to bring these videos to us, it cant be easy to do your job, while recording it for us.
Looking forward to the follow up to this video.
Kym
the thing with troubleshooting with sound is like guess work and pure intuition. I once had a german and a japanese engineer for a supervisor they both said that they want definitive proof and troubleshooting with sound is not the proper way to do it. so went back to the electric motor with a power logger, electrostatic discharge bearing tester, vibration tester, megger, tachometer and thermal camera just to troubleshoot the speed of the compressor drive. and remember clearly mr. german engineer told me "intuition is not a troubleshooting tool its only a guide how to proceed and instrument is there to produce digestable data.
I had the same trouble just like that, cramped ceiling and large evaporator coil(30 TR). cant replace the whole evaporator without destroying the concrete slab of mezzanine. this is what I did:
1. cut the old evaporator to size of the egress/digress opening.
2. order 6 units of evaporator(5 TR each)
3. paired 2 evaporator with 1 unit of 10 TR expansion valve.
4. connect all liquid line feeding to expansion valve in parallel (3 units of 10 TR in one common liquid line header) and same with suction line but with the consideration for connection of internal pressure/suction super heat and sensing bulb of TX valve.
I have read something like, soft soldering a R-410a is a big no no. it will leak eventually and copper pipe must be rated for R-410a. why all the rubber insulation there has no polyethylene tape?
Do you send the bill to installer or manufacturer of this unit? That thing going out on all those joints in the same spot are either bad install, letting the thing vibrate itself to chambles or it was a mondaymorning job in the factory when someone bodged the pipes together and QC was not sharp either!!
Either way i would suggest the customer to make sure they don´t pick up the (entire) bill themselves.
Is that vibrating electrical line related? Could it be resonating and messing with hanging items? The coil is mounted to maximize surface area in a diag. format. I feel like that makes vibrations worse.
Could you possibly shift weight on the handler lower or higher, (or just the mounts), so vibration is minimized?
Well, if your hypothesis is correct about the energy management short cycling those units, I can see how the other unit was crispy, just spit balling here but maybe that terminal was lose so starting AMP's much higher. just my 2 pcs of CU
Given the number of things wrong with the install, and that the two roof condensing units are identical, I'd say you could blame a bad install. Loose connectors get hot, even with "safe" amp draws. All it takes is someone not torquing the connector down, and you get burnt terminals.
Chris, what would you fo if you saw serviced a new restaurant that had an 170 ton unit
Well dang, that's a disaster of a job! I'm guessing it's a split system because of the ground floor location? Whatever you decided, I hope to see a followup on this one!
What do you think caused so many leaks? Was it vibrations or Is it just a poor quality product? If it is vibrations what could you do to eliminate the vibrations? I would not think of trying to do anything less than replace the entire air handler. If you try to repair it you'll be back facing more leaks in no time. Do you ever look at a repair like this one and just decide it is not worth the time and possible danger to even do the job?
Great content as usual.
So im guessing the next video is going to be changing out that big ass evaporator🤣🤣
Ceiling grid is very easy to take apart brother.. demo unit support with straps..
I would like to ask you about the reasons for the liquid line Excessive temperature around 200 f or more in top roof ac units? Thanks for all you Great Videos..
Good content!!! 👍
Not going to I subscribed to this channel along time ago just bc it interests me..... ok just for reference I have no clue how hvac or really anything hvac and how it works and what has to be where and what is that and this and that and yatta yatta yatta my point is I find it interesting on how hvac works like mechanical behind it.... and every little working item..... anyways I enjoy these videos very and much love from the US.
What a problem what a pain..i am not comfortable having a heat pump unit in a ceiling void.. ,,Yes i agree what some people said here,, the cause of the problem is vibration causing all these leaks, and perhaps the easiest way is to lift the AHU out and lower down a new one....,,,i would like to know how you will eventually tackle this problem..
Seeing lots of new commenters. What a pain. Hope you catch follow up work on video.
That sure needs to be replaced. Even the contacts
What time did you release this video it is a nice day
So it’s a transformative system or should be so if it’s cold it goes into heat mode and if it’s worm it goes into cool mode ?
That thing done vibrated itself apart. All that conduit rattling when you first entered was your first clue.
That sucks! Why so many leaks? Poor quality manufacturing? 😱or just corrosion?
I’ve worked on this units a lot they always end up getting leaks on the coil and sometimes with long line sets with a solenoid the coil gets moisture pulled in and then starts causing oil logged evaporator issues and havoc 🤯
11:00 doubling up on lugs barely big enough to hold the feed. Some of those contactors have extra spade connectors on them or u can get them or install auxiliary contacts if equipped. I used to carry a bunch of NO and NC auxiliary contacts on me. Sounds like sketch management company you mentioned.
Is there any capacity control since it’s on a VFD?
electrical shorts would be pretty convenient if you owned a restaurant right now
Cool is the oil green
Good video, but the gamble may have caused you to put the wrong refrigerant in the system. I see a 410a can and both labels on evap coil and powerhead say r22
Or possibly on the wrong condenser
Those ladder rungs kill the arches of my feet. Partly why I quit.
safety shoes have steel shanks in them.
How much refrigerant does one of those tanks hold?
How do you know which roof unit is the one with the problem or for that air handler?
I will discuss this on my livestream tonight on UA-cam 1/25/21 @ 5:PM (pacific) come on over and check it out ua-cam.com/video/nkXfDPT0zWc/v-deo.html
I would add service port at Airbender and recovery charge, and repair leak then check vacuum till you holding mic. That will less trip between cond unit and air hander.. Goodluck
I probably would have gave them quote to replace the Air handler and one to replace The coil and one for if they can’t afford it and just want to try and fix as many leaks as possible it with no guarantees. Let them decide.
what`s the reason for the leaks?