Children don't ask to be born so parents need to assume full responsibility for their actions and accept that if a child has issues, those issues began at home. Every child is a blank slate, full stop, needing unconditional love and support to achieve their potential. I don't accept the excuses and manipulations in this video for a narcissist parent, mother or father. Sure ultimately only we can change ourselves but we should never be required to carry on the burden of our parents trauma.
But these are not children doing the work, these are adults. If an adult is carrying childhood trauma then this is the only way to release that. By stopping projecting onto their parents (abusive or not) spouses, friends etc and realising that it’s only about us...we are the only people we can work on. When you understand that we are a product of the story our ego tells us, and how easily manipulated we are by that...when you finally get that you can step away and observe these divisive, illusory thoughts that cause negative feelings, and chose not to believe that story then the house of cards collapses and you have an incredible feeling of empowerment and freedom. No longer a victim to anyone, ever ❤️
@szt1964 that is because most psychologists are ego-identified. They are asleep. They live in a bubble. That bubble IS the ego-identified state. They feel separate so they can only project separateness. They will indulge a patient in their story because they themselves believe their own story and also feel victimized.
Byron tells people not to concern themselves with how others think and or to suggest to people that they might do things any differently whatsoever... While she makes her living by [u]doing that very thing[/u]. Questioning the hypocrisy of that behavior is healthy. Keeping to legitimate clinical treatments for clients is the ethical and fair thing to do. The above is just one person's thinking, and it should not be confused with well-founded clinical practices or psychology.
hello katie, my mother is ignorant of me because i'm selfish controlling and manipulative. is that really true? no. turn it around! i'm ignorant of my mother because she's selfish controlling and manipulative. yes... Now THAT is true. she really is selfish and controlling, is she not. hello katie, i think i need to respect my values better. can that be true? no. turn it around! my mother needs to respect my values better. yes, because that's really her job. makes sense?
So the daughter had to take the active role and not rely on her mother. The Mother is demoted if she is stunting growth. Mother has limitations and she is no longer authority on Self matters. She is demoted to child so Self can grow & especially if her power is causing harm.
@szt1964 I have had cognitive therapy with two psychologists. One was useless after 4 months, and we agreed to stop therapy. The other was so brutal and rude I had to report her. And I only saw her 3 times! When I fired her, she insisted I come in to talk about why. I declined. I had to work through my experience with her with my next therapist, before we could get on with it. So I have to say...no. Therapists do not automatically have a more respectful style.
@julclay To understand the work, you need to do it. It's a story that can never be told, it has to be lived. once you have experienced the magic of the work (and it HAS TO BE on paper or it won't work), because you want to change the situation you are in, only then you will understand the work.
@trappedsoul7 This is why Katie asks people to start the statements as judging another person. You fill out a Judge Your Neighbor worksheet, not judge yourself. You can't control your ignorant, selfish mother. You can't change her thoughts. You can't make her believe new thoughts. No matter how crazy, ignorant, or selfish her thoughts are, there's absolutely nothing you can do about them. If your mother is toxic, best that you clean up your thoughts, instead of wishing to clean up hers.
@whoopsiedoop So try doing the work on that thought: "My mother finds me unacceptable and that means I am truly unacceptable." Is it true? Is your mother always right? Is her opinion the only one that counts? Can you really know that your mother's opinion of you is true? How do you live your life when you believe that you are unacceptable? Who would you be without that thought?
@TadRapidly I'm not sure clinical psychologists should be using her technique. When I go to a psychologist, I expect them to use the techniques they learned when they earned their doctorate, not the techniques they learned in a week-long workshop.
I love how people elevate their harsh opinions to a psychological diagnosis. I have a whole section in my comedy show about that. The unhappy truth is that if there isn't love and affinity PRESENT in every relationship I have, I can let go of something. Not them. We get real comfy pointing the finger over there.
Yeah, I wanted to watch this to maybe get some insights, and was shocked within the first minute. Everything is turned around and made to be the daughter's responsibility. I don't see how this 'work' with BK has helped this girl. If nothing else she must feel even worse now, like she's the wrong do-er. She's even told that SHE is manipulative, not her mother?! How nice is that. Not just manipulated by her mother, but by this woman too. I'm not impressed.
Fiona Jansen I think perhaps it’s this: we are not/cannot be responsible for what goes on in other people’s minds, only our own. BK is guiding her to see through the fog to see that because that is the only way to find healing since we only have direct access to our own mind, others have to do the work on their own mind, that’s their job.
As a Mother I can see where I went wrong in life and how our Western Culture made me feel very insecure and unloved because of the way so many men treat women. At 16 my boyfriend told his mother I was not pretty. So I ended up looking like a Monster High Doll by wearing too much make-up. I followed the sheep and wished that I had just been myself. Now I want to make sure my little girl follows a better and happier path where she will be respected as a human being and not a piece of meat.
@whoopsiedoop There's nothing to "admit" -- my mom's abusiveness is not something I'm ashamed of. It is her business if she wants to continue to be abusive or not. It has nothing to do with me! :)
I usually find BK Work quite insight. But this could be a much better session if the participant didn't just nervously smile and go along with everything BK says. I don't really trust that this session is having any significant impact on her.
@IslandForYou i read one of byron katie's books, and i agree with many of the things she said, i.e. that thoughts usually don't reflect reality and usually don't have any relevance regarding truth. my point is, if thoughts are generally not true, how can their opposites all of a sudden be? if my mother doesn't have to respect my values, why should i all of a sudden have to? it doesn't make any sense. i am not trying to be disrespectful, it's just my opinion. please don't turn this around now ;)
@TadRapidly There are two clinical psychologists at The University of Washington student health center who have gone to Byron Katie's school and teach her method to their patients. I have mixed feelings about this. One of them is the director of mental health.
@eneffe I dont know any psychologist who would subscribe to this. Obviously effectiveness means short term effectiveness. Means "instant effect". Well done, BK. Therefore you got a point, not all of what BK presenting is "bad" as it is anyway rooted in cognitive theory. The main critic is the black/white dualisms (one type of thought vs emotions) and the persuavive style which cuts off clients autonomy. If you do not know what I am talking about there is no point to continue the discussion.
@whoopsiedoop right, so now you know how pointless it is to try to "change" somebody else. They don't need changing just like you didn't need any. Right? ;-) beautiful, baby! Thats the work.
I find this "counselling" style partly funny and provocative, however, to a bigger part I find it disrespectful and suasive. To my understanding any cognitive therapist has a more respectful style.
@julclay YES! I have a very abusive mother. I could make myself crazy wanting her to understand me. It's 100% unrealistic, and 100% never going to happen. So should I carry a cross all my life crying about it, or just accept that I don't have a mother who can understand me? I can understand my mother --- that's my choice. I can stop wanting her to understand me -- that's my choice. But I can never, ever, make my mother understand me.
@MsSonya273 I got more out of your reply to julcay, where you at least admit yr mom was abusive. I just read about the Judge Your Neighbor sheet & have no idea what that's about but if this "work" includes being very clear about her effects, then it could be a lot more useful than it looks from what then must be the very "end" of it, and all the stuff about "just accept it" means the opposite of what it seems in that you really you DON'T accept the issue/problem, you process & understand it.
Good old fashioned family values are lost in a world where women are making us into a laughing stock by the way they act and dress. Acting worse than men! In the UK their are no team players when it comes to Mothers groups, is it different in the USA? Does compassion exist any more where we all try and make a better future for our children. And have better role models than Kate Middleton!
Byron tells people not to concern themselves with how others think and or to suggest to people that they might do things any differently whatsoever... While she makes her living by doing that very thing. Questioning the hypocrisy of that behavior is healthy. Keeping to legitimate clinical treatments for clients is the ethical and fair thing to do. The above is just one person's thinking, and it should not be confused with well-founded clinical practices or psychology.
I find Byron Katie arrogant and condescending. How can she know that girls mother is sweet, did she ever meet her? And ist Byron Katie's tactic of turning things around and putting the blame on the girl a phenomenon called projection, something abusers do a lot? And isn't it also gaslighting do deny that girl's reality and say outright that she's got it wrong and needs to change? Byron Katie doesn't come over as nice or credible to me.
what the FUCK is THIS? turning a crazy mother's antics back on a daughter....?! all you can do is wait it out, then RUN away from that woman as fast as you can....this woman is poisonous.....
This is exactly what I was thinking. My mother is controlling and manipulative, not me. I don't want to change my mother, I just want her to stop belittling me and knocking me. That's not wanting to change her, that's about (finally) standing up for myself and not putting up with someone's crap anymore. It's about me (finally) creating healthy boundaries. That's not about changing her, that's about protecting myself.
@trappedsoul7 The question is if it´s really her job to respect your values when the evidence of your reality says she´s not? Maybe it´s your job to respect the reality? You will have a lot mor difficulties changing her, don´t you think?
@MsSonya273 Whatever technique you use, the truth remains the truth and everything is leading us in that direction. One can speak about techniques all one wants to but the core answer is simply true forgiveness. There are a million ways to discover it.
@presentlightoftruth Sorry,my mum was on my account. Far as I'm concerned from what I've seen of Byron Katie, it's mostly crap. I haven't even seen this video. However, could all Spirit-of-Christ-destroy-you- type comments please go to her- she's called naughtyreg ? Oh, and kudos to ya for a) sticking up for what ya believe in and b) being in one of the most underrated religions of all time in my opinion. I'm not a Christian but there's a lot of fantastic teachings in the bible.
"Respect" tends to exist for tip-toeing around others' emotional/feeling reactions. Can you see why she might not bow down to emotions people have, in reaction to blunt common sense? Could that be where the effectiveness is?
Children don't ask to be born so parents need to assume full responsibility for their actions and accept that if a child has issues, those issues began at home. Every child is a blank slate, full stop, needing unconditional love and support to achieve their potential. I don't accept the excuses and manipulations in this video for a narcissist parent, mother or father. Sure ultimately only we can change ourselves but we should never be required to carry on the burden of our parents trauma.
Exactly. ⚛
Yeah I agree, found this painful to watch
But these are not children doing the work, these are adults. If an adult is carrying childhood trauma then this is the only way to release that. By stopping projecting onto their parents (abusive or not) spouses, friends etc and realising that it’s only about us...we are the only people we can work on. When you understand that we are a product of the story our ego tells us, and how easily manipulated we are by that...when you finally get that you can step away and observe these divisive, illusory thoughts that cause negative feelings, and chose not to believe that story then the house of cards collapses and you have an incredible feeling of empowerment and freedom. No longer a victim to anyone, ever ❤️
I agree. This video is pure evil. It resembles brainwashing and extreme gaslighting.
@szt1964 that is because most psychologists are ego-identified. They are asleep. They live in a bubble. That bubble IS the ego-identified state. They feel separate so they can only project separateness. They will indulge a patient in their story because they themselves believe their own story and also feel victimized.
This is so amazing
@trappedsoul7 The work addresses stressful thoughts. If you enjoy your stressful thoughts then there is no problem. Honestly.
Byron tells people not to concern themselves with how others think and or to suggest to people that they might do things any differently whatsoever...
While she makes her living by [u]doing that very thing[/u].
Questioning the hypocrisy of that behavior is healthy.
Keeping to legitimate clinical treatments for clients is the ethical and fair thing to do. The above is just one person's thinking, and it should not be confused with well-founded clinical practices or psychology.
hello katie,
my mother is ignorant of me because i'm selfish controlling and manipulative.
is that really true?
no. turn it around!
i'm ignorant of my mother because she's selfish controlling and manipulative.
yes... Now THAT is true. she really is selfish and controlling, is she not.
hello katie,
i think i need to respect my values better.
can that be true? no. turn it around!
my mother needs to respect my values better.
yes, because that's really her job.
makes sense?
😂❤. This video is pure evil. It resembles brainwashing and extreme gaslighting. Scary watching someone be brainwashed like that
So the daughter had to take the active role and not rely on her mother. The Mother is demoted if she is stunting growth. Mother has limitations and she is no longer authority on Self matters. She is demoted to child so Self can grow & especially if her power is causing harm.
@szt1964 I have had cognitive therapy with two psychologists. One was useless after 4 months, and we agreed to stop therapy. The other was so brutal and rude I had to report her. And I only saw her 3 times! When I fired her, she insisted I come in to talk about why. I declined. I had to work through my experience with her with my next therapist, before we could get on with it. So I have to say...no. Therapists do not automatically have a more respectful style.
@julclay To understand the work, you need to do it. It's a story that can never be told, it has to be lived. once you have experienced the magic of the work (and it HAS TO BE on paper or it won't work), because you want to change the situation you are in, only then you will understand the work.
this is so deep
@trappedsoul7 This is why Katie asks people to start the statements as judging another person. You fill out a Judge Your Neighbor worksheet, not judge yourself.
You can't control your ignorant, selfish mother. You can't change her thoughts. You can't make her believe new thoughts. No matter how crazy, ignorant, or selfish her thoughts are, there's absolutely nothing you can do about them. If your mother is toxic, best that you clean up your thoughts, instead of wishing to clean up hers.
@whoopsiedoop So try doing the work on that thought: "My mother finds me unacceptable and that means I am truly unacceptable." Is it true? Is your mother always right? Is her opinion the only one that counts? Can you really know that your mother's opinion of you is true? How do you live your life when you believe that you are unacceptable? Who would you be without that thought?
@TadRapidly I'm not sure clinical psychologists should be using her technique. When I go to a psychologist, I expect them to use the techniques they learned when they earned their doctorate, not the techniques they learned in a week-long workshop.
@sauerteigforscher - Consistently, the point seems to be delivered effectively, despite Byron Katie having never been under your counsel. Fascinating.
I love how people elevate their harsh opinions to a psychological diagnosis. I have a whole section in my comedy show about that. The unhappy truth is that if there isn't love and affinity PRESENT in every relationship I have, I can let go of something. Not them. We get real comfy pointing the finger over there.
Blessings, Lesley!! D
you can actually see the young girls soul being crushed
Yeah, I wanted to watch this to maybe get some insights, and was shocked within the first minute. Everything is turned around and made to be the daughter's responsibility. I don't see how this 'work' with BK has helped this girl. If nothing else she must feel even worse now, like she's the wrong do-er. She's even told that SHE is manipulative, not her mother?! How nice is that. Not just manipulated by her mother, but by this woman too. I'm not impressed.
Fiona Jansen I think perhaps it’s this: we are not/cannot be responsible for what goes on in other people’s minds, only our own. BK is guiding her to see through the fog to see that because that is the only way to find healing since we only have direct access to our own mind, others have to do the work on their own mind, that’s their job.
Traci K - “It’s none of my business what other people think about me.”
Taking full responsibility for one’s own Mind is Freedom. Total Freedom. Not of this world. And it is deeply humbling.
🙏❤️
“ well that’s her job “
Free from the need for mom to change.
Wooo!!!!! 🕊✨
looks like you are right! (:
This is what gaslighting looks like.
I agree
As a Mother I can see where I went wrong in life and how our Western Culture made me feel very insecure and unloved because of the way so many men treat women. At 16 my boyfriend told his mother I was not pretty. So I ended up looking like a Monster High Doll by wearing too much make-up. I followed the sheep and wished that I had just been myself. Now I want to make sure my little girl follows a better and happier path where she will be respected as a human being and not a piece of meat.
Females will ALWAYS be treated like meat ✔
@whoopsiedoop There's nothing to "admit" -- my mom's abusiveness is not something I'm ashamed of. It is her business if she wants to continue to be abusive or not. It has nothing to do with me! :)
I usually find BK Work quite insight. But this could be a much better session if the participant didn't just nervously smile and go along with everything BK says. I don't really trust that this session is having any significant impact on her.
Exactly.
@IslandForYou i read one of byron katie's books, and i agree with many of the things she said, i.e. that thoughts usually don't reflect reality and usually don't have any relevance regarding truth. my point is, if thoughts are generally not true, how can their opposites all of a sudden be?
if my mother doesn't have to respect my values, why should i all of a sudden have to? it doesn't make any sense. i am not trying to be disrespectful, it's just my opinion. please don't turn this around now ;)
@presentlightoftruth Why thankyou :) You just really made my day, I'd been really stressed :D
@TadRapidly There are two clinical psychologists at The University of Washington student health center who have gone to Byron Katie's school and teach her method to their patients. I have mixed feelings about this. One of them is the director of mental health.
@whoopsiedoop Yep, that was their job. It's your job to love yourself anyway. :)
@eneffe I dont know any psychologist who would subscribe to this.
Obviously effectiveness means short term effectiveness. Means "instant effect". Well done, BK. Therefore you got a point, not all of what BK presenting is "bad" as it is anyway rooted in cognitive theory. The main critic is the black/white dualisms (one type of thought vs emotions) and the persuavive style which cuts off clients autonomy. If you do not know what I am talking about there is no point to continue the discussion.
@whoopsiedoop right, so now you know how pointless it is to try to "change" somebody else. They don't need changing just like you didn't need any. Right? ;-) beautiful, baby! Thats the work.
I find this "counselling" style partly funny and provocative, however, to a bigger part I find it disrespectful and suasive. To my understanding any cognitive therapist has a more respectful style.
She’s volunteering to be there. And to look at things from this perspective.
❤️🕊✨
@julclay YES! I have a very abusive mother. I could make myself crazy wanting her to understand me. It's 100% unrealistic, and 100% never going to happen. So should I carry a cross all my life crying about it, or just accept that I don't have a mother who can understand me? I can understand my mother --- that's my choice. I can stop wanting her to understand me -- that's my choice. But I can never, ever, make my mother understand me.
@MsSonya273 I got more out of your reply to julcay, where you at least admit yr mom was abusive. I just read about the Judge Your Neighbor sheet & have no idea what that's about but if this "work" includes being very clear about her effects, then it could be a lot more useful than it looks from what then must be the very "end" of it, and all the stuff about "just accept it" means the opposite of what it seems in that you really you DON'T accept the issue/problem, you process & understand it.
Good old fashioned family values are lost in a world where women are making us into a laughing stock by the way they act and dress. Acting worse than men! In the UK their are no team players when it comes to Mothers groups, is it different in the USA? Does compassion exist any more where we all try and make a better future for our children. And have better role models than Kate Middleton!
❤
Byron tells people not to concern themselves with how others think and or to suggest to people that they might do things any differently whatsoever...
While she makes her living by doing that very thing.
Questioning the hypocrisy of that behavior is healthy.
Keeping to legitimate clinical treatments for clients is the ethical and fair thing to do. The above is just one person's thinking, and it should not be confused with well-founded clinical practices or psychology.
I find Byron Katie arrogant and condescending. How can she know that girls mother is sweet, did she ever meet her? And ist Byron Katie's tactic of turning things around and putting the blame on the girl a phenomenon called projection, something abusers do a lot? And isn't it also gaslighting do deny that girl's reality and say outright that she's got it wrong and needs to change? Byron Katie doesn't come over as nice or credible to me.
This video is pure evil. It resembles brainwashing and extreme gaslighting.
what the FUCK is THIS? turning a crazy mother's antics back on a daughter....?! all you can do is wait it out, then RUN away from that woman as fast as you can....this woman is poisonous.....
This is exactly what I was thinking. My mother is controlling and manipulative, not me. I don't want to change my mother, I just want her to stop belittling me and knocking me. That's not wanting to change her, that's about (finally) standing up for myself and not putting up with someone's crap anymore. It's about me (finally) creating healthy boundaries. That's not about changing her, that's about protecting myself.
Lol you bisses missed the whole point💅🏽
@@fionajansen4615 yes🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉🎉❤❤❤❤❤❤❤❤
@MsSonya273 I can't get away from the conclusion that if my own mother doesn't find me acceptable, it must be true.
Love to you, Heather!! D
My mother sent me here.
of course she would, because she's a narcissist and she's projecting her own pain onto you and will do so till she dies.
Which effectiveness?
What are the site effects of her "style"? Any research on that?
❤🙏🏼❤
It's time to go home, L. This truth is home. Welcome home. :o)
@trappedsoul7 The question is if it´s really her job to respect your values when the evidence of your reality says she´s not? Maybe it´s your job to respect the reality? You will have a lot mor difficulties changing her, don´t you think?
@MsSonya273 Whatever technique you use, the truth remains the truth and everything is leading us in that direction. One can speak about techniques all one wants to but the core answer is simply true forgiveness. There are a million ways to discover it.
@MsSonya273 what are the mixed feelings? You don't like BK's approach, you mean?
"The Work" is Western Zen.... Just drop your story shit. The End. Amazing.
@presentlightoftruth Sorry,my mum was on my account. Far as I'm concerned from what I've seen of Byron Katie, it's mostly crap. I haven't even seen this video. However, could all Spirit-of-Christ-destroy-you- type comments please go to her- she's called naughtyreg ? Oh, and kudos to ya for a) sticking up for what ya believe in and b) being in one of the most underrated religions of all time in my opinion. I'm not a Christian but there's a lot of fantastic teachings in the bible.
❤
"Respect" tends to exist for tip-toeing around others' emotional/feeling reactions. Can you see why she might not bow down to emotions people have, in reaction to blunt common sense? Could that be where the effectiveness is?
I just don't like her at all......I don't like you much either.