Smalljon got some of the worst treatment from books to show. Died honorably at the Red Wedding defending his king, and the show turned him into one of the worst of Ramsey's supporters.
Ever heard of Wyman mandley. He rejected the call from jon and sansa in the show. Can you imagine. And look at stannis. The show runners should make another show on how to butcher characters. All they have to do is copy paste. And they are incapable of doing that much.
@@ranfan1820 Hes not disgusting for it lol and its not unforgivable at all, Roy died aged 94 and lived as full a life as anyone can hope to. GRRM himself is an old man and met and talked with Roy whenever he could, they were friends, he couldn't have predicted his death.
Just looking at it again... god, it's just so horrible. Everything about it... it really is just hard to get through. No wonder GRRM found it such a difficult thing to write. And the ending, where she thinks of what she's lost and goes mad before getting killed... easily one of the most devastating things I've ever read.
Stannis is gonna take out the Boltons but the Freys? They’re gonna wish it was Stannis coming to kill them when Lady Stoneheart crashes Daven’s wedding.
@@7yep4336dfgvvh nope, he's alive. He has gathered the mountain clans of the north, a few Stark loyal houses, wildlings, and even has Asha greyjoy captive as he prepares to attack winterfell.
I think the red wedding 2.0 theory may be where the riverlands story goes in The Winds of Winter. Lady Stoneheart and the brotherhood will take out the freys at the Frey/lannister wedding, or something along those lines. Ugh, I just finished rereading the entire series over the last few months… what I’d give to have TWOW in my hand right now haha
@@aegonthedragon7303 Well, he will kill some of the Freys at the Battle of the Ice. But yes, Stoneheart will inflict a terrible fate on the Freys that she catches.
@@marktastic86 nah, I will say it definitely isn’t as good as book 3. And has the hard task of setting up another act 1 after SoS clearly is the climax of the first three books. FfC was much more enjoyable on reread. But I agree it’s a tough one to love initially
@@DongusMcBongus I saw an interview with GRRM that said 4 and 5 were originally one book, so he split them up to make both easier to digest. It makes sense that it doesn't flow like the previous three for that reason. But when half the book is Cersei walking around KL being a bitch to everyone plus the High Sparrow storyline, and the other is Brienne (the best part admittedly) walking back and forth over the same terrain looking for Arya and Sansa, it's easily the worst in the series thus far. I did enjoy the ending, though.
@@marktastic86 It’s funny, almost had the exact same reaction, but when you reread it knowing where it’s gonna go, it does get a lot better. You just know Cersei is gonna get one heck of a rude awakening etc. No, it’s totally fair to say a book should be good on its first read, but I do think it kind of ages like a wine
Robb was dumb to just break his oath, and then have the nerve to think Lord Walder would tolerate such a slight and not do anything about it. Really? They already establish Walder Frey as a prideful, envious spiteful man, and they for real thought he would forgive Robb breaking his oath. SMH. Catlyn mentions time and time how Angry and spit full Walder Frey is, and all of a sudden, they think he would eat Robb's crap and join the losing cause again. honestly asking for a new deal(Edmure and a Frey) after breaking the first(Robb and a Frey) is an even bigger insult. That's like making a deal to pay 3,000 dollars later for a service, then breaking said deal, then trying to say "I already gave 3,000 dollars away, but anyways, lets start the deal all over, you do the same service, but I pay you 1,000 dollars upfront." I'm sorry, Red Wedding should have been seen coming from a mile away. The Northmen had smooth brains to trust Frey.
@@Morfe02 The bad food was initially seen as Walder just being petty, as was expected lol. But I do agree, they were fools not to notice. The only thing in the north favour for thinking their safe is Roose Boltons declaration that he holds two Frey grandsons.
@@picklejarmonsterfanboy9367 because, this is a wedding, not a battlefield, no one is expecting to die in a wedding! It is scandelous to murder your guests! Your guests who disarmed themselves, trusting that you will protect them, and then you kill them! Who will trust you ever again ? Who let you out of their eyes ? You will be the most untrustworthy human in Westeros!
Theres 0 chance it happens like in the show. We either have the Great Northern Conspiracy, or Brotherhood without banners reformed under Jaime and Brienne destroying the Freys.
The Frey Civil War is gonna be crazy. It's not enough that all the different factions of Freys are gonna be at eachothers throats but everyone is gonna be looking to take their lands and titles thanks to Cersei wanting to screw them over.
@@Argos-xb8ek yeah post book 5 Westeros looks hectic. Freys inner civil war, Faith Militant growing in strength, Riverlands are still in chaos and you have the Northern kingdom in chaos. Not to mention Iron Born reeving and Young Griff at Storms End
@@Argos-xb8ek If there is even a Frey Civil War, it will be the most pathetic display of military power in the entire series. 50+ Claimants with a dozen soldiers each.
Robb was a usurper. Broke vows left and right. Didn't deserve this though. I hope Davos finds rickon. Hopefully the book comes out in the next few years
Robb never attempted to claim a throne that wasnt his. (such as Renly trying to claim the Iron Throne) Him rebelling and claiming the North as an independent Kingdom isnt the same as usurping a throne.
This is why screen adaptations can improve on a book. It all kicks off so much faster in the book, no time to react. In the HBO you have a few moments to sit there and wonder what’s coming when the music starts. And you can shift between Cat and Arya.
this is only the second half of the chapter, the first half is what really builds up that uncertainty and creeping sense of dread, if anything I'd say it happens even slower than in the show
I would have had Greatjon Umber be in that scene and fill the role of Smalljon defending Robb. And then have Smalljon carry on as the traitor picking what he thinks is the right side in the Battle of the Bastards.
Smalljon got some of the worst treatment from books to show. Died honorably at the Red Wedding defending his king, and the show turned him into one of the worst of Ramsey's supporters.
Don’t remind me of that awful show.
@@estevesfilmandgaming3115 fan fiction
Lets not even discuss what they did to Manderly jeez
Show Stark Bannermen: least loyalty to their lord
Books: most loyalty
It was a strange plot point in the show
Ever heard of Wyman mandley. He rejected the call from jon and sansa in the show.
Can you imagine.
And look at stannis.
The show runners should make another show on how to butcher characters.
All they have to do is copy paste. And they are incapable of doing that much.
No, no! Don’t cut my hair. Ned loves my hair. 😢
Roy dotrice has such an amazing voice
it just grips my attention
Shame he won’t be narrating Winds of Winter :(
@@germaner3254 I won't be buying the Winds audio book because hes not reading it, it just won't be the same.
@@CheeseCrumbs00George is disgusting for not finishing the series before Roy died. Unforgivable.
@@ranfan1820 Hes not disgusting for it lol and its not unforgivable at all, Roy died aged 94 and lived as full a life as anyone can hope to. GRRM himself is an old man and met and talked with Roy whenever he could, they were friends, he couldn't have predicted his death.
Easily one of the most devastating chapters in the series
Just looking at it again... god, it's just so horrible. Everything about it... it really is just hard to get through. No wonder GRRM found it such a difficult thing to write. And the ending, where she thinks of what she's lost and goes mad before getting killed... easily one of the most devastating things I've ever read.
Good thing she is alive in the books.
@ishanparbhakar7150 in a manner of speaking. And decorating the trees.
Really hoping Stannis wipes these worms from existence in the Winds of Winter.
Stannis is gonna take out the Boltons but the Freys? They’re gonna wish it was Stannis coming to kill them when Lady Stoneheart crashes Daven’s wedding.
Hold on, stannis is not dead in the books?
@@7yep4336dfgvvh nope, he's alive. He has gathered the mountain clans of the north, a few Stark loyal houses, wildlings, and even has Asha greyjoy captive as he prepares to attack winterfell.
I think the red wedding 2.0 theory may be where the riverlands story goes in The Winds of Winter. Lady Stoneheart and the brotherhood will take out the freys at the Frey/lannister wedding, or something along those lines. Ugh, I just finished rereading the entire series over the last few months… what I’d give to have TWOW in my hand right now haha
@@aegonthedragon7303 Well, he will kill some of the Freys at the Battle of the Ice. But yes, Stoneheart will inflict a terrible fate on the Freys that she catches.
wow very few books made me cry like A song of ice and fire series, 1st nerd then his son, then Jon. honorable men dont live long in the series
That's because the bad guys know how dangerous they are. And even if they do kill them the people they aided will take up the cause in their place.
I'm sorry, but I broke out laughing at "1st nerd." Good ol Nerd Stark 😂
Jon is coming back
@@schoudh the honorable "Nerd Stark"
Ned's death was so sad :( in the dungeon reminiscing his decisions :(
Hearing Roy Dotrice reading these brings back memories. I will miss his contribution to this book series.
I hear the quality and now I truly regret not reading the book. I made the same mistake with Harry Potter.
Well the first three books are really similar, but book 4 and 5 are becoming totally different stories.
@@DongusMcBongus
Book 4 was awful, let's be honest.
@@marktastic86 nah, I will say it definitely isn’t as good as book 3. And has the hard task of setting up another act 1 after SoS clearly is the climax of the first three books.
FfC was much more enjoyable on reread. But I agree it’s a tough one to love initially
@@DongusMcBongus
I saw an interview with GRRM that said 4 and 5 were originally one book, so he split them up to make both easier to digest. It makes sense that it doesn't flow like the previous three for that reason. But when half the book is Cersei walking around KL being a bitch to everyone plus the High Sparrow storyline, and the other is Brienne (the best part admittedly) walking back and forth over the same terrain looking for Arya and Sansa, it's easily the worst in the series thus far. I did enjoy the ending, though.
@@marktastic86
It’s funny, almost had the exact same reaction, but when you reread it knowing where it’s gonna go, it does get a lot better.
You just know Cersei is gonna get one heck of a rude awakening etc.
No, it’s totally fair to say a book should be good on its first read, but I do think it kind of ages like a wine
Robb was dumb to just break his oath, and then have the nerve to think Lord Walder would tolerate such a slight and not do anything about it. Really? They already establish Walder Frey as a prideful, envious spiteful man, and they for real thought he would forgive Robb breaking his oath. SMH. Catlyn mentions time and time how Angry and spit full Walder Frey is, and all of a sudden, they think he would eat Robb's crap and join the losing cause again.
honestly asking for a new deal(Edmure and a Frey) after breaking the first(Robb and a Frey) is an even bigger insult. That's like making a deal to pay 3,000 dollars later for a service, then breaking said deal, then trying to say "I already gave 3,000 dollars away, but anyways, lets start the deal all over, you do the same service, but I pay you 1,000 dollars upfront."
I'm sorry, Red Wedding should have been seen coming from a mile away. The Northmen had smooth brains to trust Frey.
All the details makes the scene more obvious
The bad musicians and the cheap dinner
@@Morfe02 The bad food was initially seen as Walder just being petty, as was expected lol. But I do agree, they were fools not to notice.
The only thing in the north favour for thinking their safe is Roose Boltons declaration that he holds two Frey grandsons.
This is wonderful. Great job making this
I hate this,,, I hate this 😖!!!!
Please let justice be served to these traitors
"Explain to me why it is more noble to kill ten thousand men in battle than just a dozen at dinner."
- Tywin Lannister (A Storm of Swords)
"NOOOOOOOOOOO, TENS OF THOUSANDS OF PEASANTS MUST DIE BECAUSE NED TRIED TO USURP THE THRONE"
the "honorable" house stark
@@picklejarmonsterfanboy9367 because, this is a wedding, not a battlefield, no one is expecting to die in a wedding! It is scandelous to murder your guests! Your guests who disarmed themselves, trusting that you will protect them, and then you kill them!
Who will trust you ever again ? Who let you out of their eyes ? You will be the most untrustworthy human in Westeros!
People who unironically think Tywin is a good guy or what he did here was right or smart are stupid.
@@picklejarmonsterfanboy9367Silence Tywin simp
@@Timo11042 Tywin never started a war
Anybody else had to say damn.. after listening sheesh I loves this stuff 😂
The freys got what was coming to them.
No offense but that tv show nonsense won’t happen to them. I’m sorry
Theres 0 chance it happens like in the show. We either have the Great Northern Conspiracy, or Brotherhood without banners reformed under Jaime and Brienne destroying the Freys.
The Frey Civil War is gonna be crazy. It's not enough that all the different factions of Freys are gonna be at eachothers throats but everyone is gonna be looking to take their lands and titles thanks to Cersei wanting to screw them over.
@@Argos-xb8ek yeah post book 5 Westeros looks hectic. Freys inner civil war, Faith Militant growing in strength, Riverlands are still in chaos and you have the Northern kingdom in chaos. Not to mention Iron Born reeving and Young Griff at Storms End
@@Argos-xb8ek If there is even a Frey Civil War, it will be the most pathetic display of military power in the entire series. 50+ Claimants with a dozen soldiers each.
The music is too loud
I can’t do it, only made it 30 seconds.
That's what happens when you have adhd
Robb was a usurper. Broke vows left and right. Didn't deserve this though. I hope Davos finds rickon. Hopefully the book comes out in the next few years
Me too, brother. Davos is probably my favorite character.
Robb never attempted to claim a throne that wasnt his. (such as Renly trying to claim the Iron Throne) Him rebelling and claiming the North as an independent Kingdom isnt the same as usurping a throne.
@@slimjoneslfc9695 Yeah, a rebel and a traitor, not a usurper.
His Walter Frey was spot on ! I 🥰Roy dotrice n was thinking now w ai he can complete the rest .i hope it happens!
Walder*
Feels wrong
This is why screen adaptations can improve on a book.
It all kicks off so much faster in the book, no time to react.
In the HBO you have a few moments to sit there and wonder what’s coming when the music starts.
And you can shift between Cat and Arya.
Yeah, but here you get to realize that Catelyn has gone mad and hear her inner thoughts.
No, in fact the show is quickly
The book show people fighting and hidden behind tables
In the tv is just people dying no even a fight
@@Morfe02people try to fight back in the show
It is much better in the book actually, much more ominous too with all the foreshadowing and back and forth between Arya and Cat chapters.
this is only the second half of the chapter, the first half is what really builds up that uncertainty and creeping sense of dread, if anything I'd say it happens even slower than in the show
boom DOOM boom DOOM
I'm definitely looking forward to the chapter in wins in winter where the freys finish off the Starks
definitely
😧 Frey fans when Stannis stackwipes the Boltons and Frey’s and BwoB finish the job
How do you break someone’s lip? That of all things took me out of the moment.
you've never heard of a split lip?
@@LukeFitzgerald-bh1zt when I heard “broke”, I thought of a broken bone. Now I feel really dumb.
@@EverImmortal1 nah you're fine lol
💔
I would have had Greatjon Umber be in that scene and fill the role of Smalljon defending Robb.
And then have Smalljon carry on as the traitor picking what he thinks is the right side in the Battle of the Bastards.
I was in love with Catelyn
the drums thing is too similar to the drums in moria and are a needless distraction from the scene. no shit, there's doom all about
It's a pretty obvious homage to Tolkien, but it's also a reference to The Black Dinner, the real life massacre that this was inspired by.
That’s what you get Mrs stark for being a lame