I do find it funny how Chibnall criticised The Show for being routine, running up and down Corridors and silly monsters in 1986 but that’s exactly what he did with The Tsuranga Conundrum
At the time, another person was responsable for episode 5 but abandoned production at the last minute. So, yeah, that was an episode that Chibs had to write in a hurry and - surprise surprise - the Pting was created by the another writter.
I still think the Cybermasters are one of the silliest monsters we’ve seen in doctor who and the whole timeless child story is a mess I just want to forget
The reason I just dislike chibnall is that he hasn’t given us anything for our time. He spent ten weeks building up the timeless child arc but then he spent almost the entire finale telling us that it doesn’t matter and there was no character or story potential in this reveal meaning it only seems to have happened because he wanted a story arc to build up viewing figures. Further still I believe he saw the reaction to series 11 and realised that in ten or twenty years time people will look at his era and barely give it a second thought so he tried everything in order to try and make his era memorable without any sense of care or consideration as to how he was going to do this. At the end of the day I just don’t think chibnall can write Doctor Who but that doesn’t make him a bad writer. Doctor Who is such a large show with a lot to handle and there are people who can love it but just not write it and I think chibnall is only of those people. I personally heavily dislike the reveal because it makes the Doctor less interesting and as I mentioned made the entire series a waste of time but as ma boi channel pup said the next time there is a fresh start with a new showrunner this will be retconned and the Doctor will be just as enigmatic and interesting as before. So when that does happen I will look on his era as having merit in the individual stories which Doctor Who will always be better at doing than story arcs.
chibs was hired to change doctor who so profoundly that the long time fans, some of whom have watched from "an unearthy child", would leave and stop caring. he has executed "the BBC/chinall plan for doctor who" to perfection.
What would you think if doctor who went to the hbo model of longer episodes but fewer of the? For a while i've been thinking about how classic who had only 4-6 stories per year but released them in parts. If doctor who went to an all specials model with one every other month do you think that would work well. I only say this because RT davies reinvented who for what tv had become by the year 2005 and the way people view content these days i think that moving the show to 5 or 6 moviesodes a year might be a good idea post chibnal. Though I do agree with you remarks regarding the quality of his writting.
Jericho Gonzales Personally I don’t think this’ll work out because what happens if an episode is bad? We would have to sit through something like “Love and Monsters,” “The Wedding of River Song,” or “Orphan 55” for 2 hours rather than the standard 45 minutes. My thoughts tho. At the very least the writers need to change because Chibnal only hired political play writers for series 11 and 12.
@Peter D I don’t know. She’s been quite the spectacular actor in other productions, and I don’t know if I’d use a series that made Stephen Fry look like he couldn’t act as a benchmark for her ability to perform.
To make a comparison to Star Wars. Chris Chibnall is cut from the same cloth as Rian Johnson. Both had their ideas for what they wanted both franchises to be and both executed what they wanted while not having a care for what came before. Both can be and are competent enough directors, but in terms of writing, keep them away from scripts and stories.
“Hate is too strong an emotion to waste on something you dont like”, what this does is prove that the people who hate chibnall do love doctor who, which means if they hate it then there really is a problem with the show, because its obvious that they like it, otherwise we wouldn’t be so upset, there is a reason we care, because we love the show.
@@sonnykingcomposer Yes, the show has always been political. I'm not blind to it. I hate "Kill the Moon" too, but series 11 and 12 seem to have made "Kill the Moon" their blueprint. The show has always been political, but never this pointedly political pretty much every episode. Stuff like "Oxygen" warned about the dangers of Capitalism, but it had the decency to be a good story and was one of the few political based episodes in that season. The episode messed around with the characters. Such as Bill's suit malfunctioning and the Doctor becoming blind for a 3 episode arc. Series 11 and 12 don't write good stories inspired by politics, they are just making Doctor Who a political statement. Hence why Chris Chibnall hired people who have only written political plays to write the show. I'm also not against the messages in series 11 and 12, but I am completely against how they are handled. It's a poor representation that doesn't show anybody off in a good light.
@@OrangeAceGaming I'd disagree to an extent, I think there are some good examples of good political messages in the Chibnall era. It isn't more political, it's just less subtle.
I personally just don't like how Jodie Whiticker has been written, she feels too much like a primary school teacher. She had a rocky start as all new doctors do, however, they just ignored the change of the gender in all writing, I understand that they did this to avoid politics and things like that, however, I feel like we needed a bit of a comedic line or something to ease us in. I feel like they tried to make her too relatable yet the childlike tendencies and apparent lack of social skills just made things feel awkward. I feel like they could have done a woman doctor a lot better. The storylines also just feel quite separate and the number of characters made individual connections with the doctor more difficult. This is just how things seemed to me whilst watching and rewatching these episodes.
Other than those aspects though I did enjoy the newer series 12 and agree with other commenters how timeless children didn't change the lore much at all (I actually feel it really fits really well). I also love Jodie Whittaker's acting I just feel her character doesn't fit the doctor's norm (but that's just my opinion). Thanks guys.
Ok, ok. I can see where you're coming from. You brought up that 13 doesn't "feel" like a girl, but isn't that kinda the point? She's still The Doctor, regardless of gender. And as for the story line comment, if Chibs really does have a 5 year plan, then most of season 11 could be seen as just getting to know the characters.
@@CyberController- Nah, I never meant that. I meant there was no acknowledgement from the doctor when he changed gender. There should have been as that was the only time he has ever been female as far as he/she remembered. I totally agree that they shouldn't make her character feel different, but that is what they did anyway with her persona. I get where ur coming from though. I hope Chris' plan is good as so far has been a bit out of the ordinary for Doctor Who and it just doesn't quite sit right with me at the moment. Still enjoying it though. :) Just miss the Eccleston/David Tennant era
I don't hate Chibnall. I liked all his pre-showrunner episodes. I just loathe everything he's done with the show with him on the throne. Apart from Jodie (bc I love her, just not how she's being written)... and Sacha Dhawan. Man, I hope his back pain is improving after carrying Season 12 :(
Mayo Tango131 hahaha you can’t be serious first of all the “pc” stuff was a lot less subtle and in your face secondly the writing in the RTD era was actually well written stories
Mayo Tango131 I’m sorry, what? Are you confusing RTD with Chibnal because I don’t remember a lot of SJW politics from the RTD era (especially nothing as bad as Chibnal’s stupid handling of politics).
i think the character development was/is lacking, and the timeless child just fucked up some of the doctors character arc in my opinion. i really do miss the vibe and energy of the rd era. The episodes in these two seasons are just so forgettable, and the music. oh my god THE MUSIC. or lack there of. i think if the music was there, with special themes like with murray gold Rose, Clara,...it would make the series MUCH better, like just really make it more emotional and amazing, to really pull you in instead of just lo-fi sounds. LOVE the appearance of the tardis though. also yes, definitely, s12 is a giant improvement to s11
You're right about character development and especially the music but I feel like they are both linked. In the past series there was a lot of character drama and the doctor was more or less in conflict with his companions at least at the very beginning, but all the companions were fleshed out off the bat we had something to cling to and understand about them and slowly throughout their stay improve and get more complex so they had music themes because they were important just as much as the doctor. In series 11 & 12 the companions are more like character traits Graham is the widow husband with literally nothing anchoring him to earth - Grace's death is brushed off in favor of adventure time, Ryan has dyspraxia and abandonment issues, has friends anchoring him but doesn't care that much because he is having fun with the doctor and then there's Yasmin a police officer with strong morals, brave and has the most things anchoring her to earth -Mother, father and sister and a job all while aspiring to reach higher and higher in her field. She has more things anchoring her than any other companion yet somehow she feels like the most tag along character of the three. how does Chibnail manage to sounder his own premise of of such high potential character is baffling. It's so silly because in every episode there are those one off characters tagging along the doctor/companions and they get so much screen time that they have to be built up a bit so you can care about the episode but then there's no time to develop the companions so what you end up with is everyone just feeling like a tag along character that's just there so the doctor can talk at. So in conclusion I feel like even if Murry Gold had stayed and these characters had music themes they wouldn't have the same emotional pull when you hear them because the characters themselves are so lacking.
str48forward yes i ABSOLUTELY agree.... the development in the “fam” is abysmal at best and the music can only elevate the episode if you have a good base to work off of
I hated the music in season 11, except 13's theme, that's pretty great. (And practically the only thing I would actually classify as music in the whole season besides the main theme of the show but that's been like that for almost 60 years). Season 12 has a lot more, and it is better, but yeah, nowhere near the quality of what Mr. Gold composed. :(
I think the guy can write Doctor Who, I mean I quite enjoyed his Silurian two parter back in season 5, I just don't think he can write Doctor Who without a showrunner holding his hand.
I found the Silurian ones to be pretty poor episodes, along with the sun one... basically my opinion of his RTD and Moffat era EPs are the same as many critics, minus the exaggerated death threat levels. This includes liking the opening to the cubes with Matt Smith but feeling the payoff wasn't well executed. I just feel he has a different idea about Dr who and it doesn't really work, for I really like his work on Broadchurch, showing I can like his writing.
I genuinely really enjoy his era, I love Thirteen and liked Series 11 overall, but Series 12 kind of blew me away, so much Doctor Who to love this year, I hope it keeps getting better! Really enjoyed the video Crispy! :)
Great video mate. For me... I think he's a good showrunner, not the best writer sure... But as a person, he cares about the show, he takes criticism on board and always clearly wants to improve. To me, that's the perfect showrunner attitude imo
For me personally, Chris Chibnall is not a good writer. He's not good at character development, and he tries way too hard to be introspective and grounded. However, people like Bowlestrek, Nerdotic, Doomcock, Clownfish TV, and John The White are bitter with Chris Chibnall because they believe that both Chris and Jodie are turning Doctor Who into a propaganda show. Similar to how the North Korean propaganda cartoon Squirrel and Hedgehog teaches its viewers to hate Asian and Western culture, the supposed propaganda in Chibnall's Who that these channels try to express awareness of supposedly teaches its young viewers to hate the past and discriminate against straight white males because they are often presented as racist and narcissistic pigs (like the Trump rip off in Arachnids in the UK), with most of the actors playing the good characters in the episode being played by ethnic minorities, thus promoting a 'woke' agenda. I used to believe that this theory was valid, but overtime, it started to become more silly, so I gave up on it.
@@thevfxmancolorizationvfxex4051 There's clearly an agenda, but those channels you mentioned seem to be grooming their viewers into thinking that's a bad thing. There's about as much 'wokeness' as there always was in New Who. Also, big fan of your videos :)
I personally don’t hate Chibnall and his work on who, but I just don’t feel much towards him. At least with Moffat and RTD they had unique styles, whether you liked them or not, at least they had a style. With Chibnall, I can’t pinpoint what his style on who is.
Here’s a question for you guys, what words would you use to describe RTD’s who overall? I’d say: Modern Contemporary Relatable Simple Down to Earth Fun What would you describe Moffat’s Who overall? I’d say: Fairytale Complex Intriguing Fantasy Whimsical What do you describe chibnall’s Who overall? I honestly don’t know.
Chris seems to be going for more substance over style, which is an interesting approach to the show and something we've never seen before, therefore we can't really judge him the same way we judge any other showrunner.
Fun fact about Chris Chibnail : His birthday date was unknown until the official Doctor Who account on Twitter revealed it.Chris also has an instagram account which is for his family and friends and RTD follows him
@dr103 Good thing people don't know his social media accounts and Jodie isn't on social media, they would both get bullied if they had public accounts. I've seen how violent people can get towards Star Wars actors, I don't wish anything like that to Doctor Who actor, not even the worst actors in the world deserve that. There is a difference between constructive criticism and pure hate.
@@jujublue4426 Yeh thank lord that niether of them have social media accounts. The Doctor Who fandom is just as worse as the Star Wars fandom. Even Sacha Dhawan got attacked by someone for being an indian who played the Master.
Series 10 ends with the doctor saying "Never be cruel, never be cowardly" while series 12 ends with the doctor wanting to use the death particle to wipe out both the master and the new cybermasters. ...What happened to "never be cruel" and then the old man shows up ready to sacrifice himself and the doctor just goes with it? "Never be cowardly"? Screw that I guess. The whole theme here is very similar with "The parting of the ways" imagine if that ended similar to the "The Timeless Children" - some person on the satellite just tells the doctor they'll use the delta wave to wipe out humanity and the daleks and the doctor just accepts. I have nothing against Chibnail don't know the man so it's impossible to harbor any kind of feelings for him, but his doctor who writing specifically is very boring very cliche. Like my lord man you say his few episodes during RTD and Mofat tenure didn't grip you, literally all his episodes had countdown timers as drama/suspense culminating in the cube episode. Why was that episode even aired is beyond my understanding the whole conflict gets resolved with the villain just leaving with no rhyme or reason and the doctor waving his sonic fixing everything... *Facepalm* Chibnail had an earth shattering reveal : The doctor is an immortal entity from another dimension ... and he's choice is to lay all that on the table in 30+ minutes of exposition... surprising this is the same person who wrote Broadchurch. I guess at the end of the day he is one of those writers that have many many misses and a few hits and one bullseye.
I dont hate him,just dont like how he wrote show. He dont give old writers like Gatiss,Withouse etc wrote again. He make show more political and boring. He didnt give us scary and good villians ( but i love kassavins from spyfall and master). I hope he will leave soon,cause he just dosent know how to wrote dr who...and Timless child to...and if you read This crispy who you wanna see as a showrunner..😀
reverseriot “pretty good” - not exactly glowing praise ! Yeah they were ok, as was ‘Cold war’ but has anything he’s written blown me away or been groundbreaking in any way? Nah. He always seems like a place-holder writer - a back up in case other writers don’t work out 🤔 . To be honest I don’t really remember much about his episodes (except that one was on a submarine) , they’re a bit unmemorable 😢
I dont hate Chris chibnall but I just don't like his vision of the show, he was a weak writer for doctor who before he became show runner, I never understood why he was chosen to helm the show and two seasons in, I still don't, he's just not a good doctor who writer and his handling of the last story arc was clear evidence of that
I think that's the problem with Chris Chibnall, and the BBC these days: He pushes too much on the political correctness side of the show, that he forgets to put character development, exploring time and space, the doctor and companions friendship (which is is inexistant in these last two seasons), and the most important thing of all: the doctor's great knowledge, and his powerful speeches on peace and pacifism. We have to remember that Doctor Who is a show for entertainment first, not for politics. All I have to say now is that I say Goodbye to this show, it was fun while it lasted.
nathan 〈3 football I think what most people hate is that fact that he turned Doctor Who into a political show first. I mean, he exclusively only hired people who were known for political plays to write for the show in series 11 and kept them as writers for series 12. He’s not a bad writer (I love 42 and Dinos on a Spaceship), if you give him an idea for a story he can write one that would work, but he was WAY too heavy on the political crap.
Yo Crispy, good video man I enjoyed it. I would say though, if you're gonna do about what people think about Chibnall and why, you should definitely talk in-depth about his two biggest decisions to date (The Doctor being a woman and The Timeless Children). I agree with you that I don't think we've seen the whole picture with TTC yet, and I understand you're probably going to go into more detail about these topics in other videos, but they're topics that have largely shaped people's opinions on Chibby. No hate intended, I love your videos and I think Chibnall is doing a fine job so far, but i'd like to have seen your opinion on these topics, even if you just linked another video about them where you went more in detail, especially when they seem to be the two biggest reasons Chibnall is getting hate at the moment. Look forward to the next one man :)
I remember being on board with Chibnall at the beginning. His work on Torchwood was pretty good, and, although I didn't like his work Doctor Who too much, his last episode did seem to touch a lot more of the domestics of Who, and Arthur Williams was a nice character. I even watched Broadchurch and liked it quite a lot. When a female Doctor was announced, I wasn't all that on board, skeptical to say the least, but said I'd always give it ago. He said he didn't cast her for a gimmick so, I trusted him. But, now, I really do not like his Doctor Who. Although it's clear Whittaker wasn't cast just because she's a woman, and she does her best with the role, this writing is pretty abysmal. The amount of changes he has made has given me the impression that he's kinda arrogant, but that's just me, I guess.
Never try to explain why other people feel the way they do - simply ask them. For me, I found the writing (script, subject and character dialogue) to be so bad that I genuinely believe Chibnall doesn't actually like Dr Who and is actively sabotaging it.
If he stays for the 60th anniversary I would want to see Eccleston, Tennant, Smith, Capaldi and Whittaker's doctor face of against Simm, Gomez and Dhawan's master with Captain Jack and River Song in it as companions
I miss the light humor that Moffat and Russel were able to give to Doctor Who, I also miss the special appearances that today have become mere references in the series.
One thing that might have improved it is if Graham wasnt travelling with them and instead they treated him as a Jackie Tyler esc character. Too many in the tardis, but doing this would allow them to build the characters of ryan and yaz.
I don't think Chibnall deserves ALL the hate he gets but there are a lot of things that could be improved... I remember the RTD era being the era when literally everybody was talking about the show, the hype was amazing!!!
I was so excited for the TARDIS Team! *The first retired companion* *The first dyspraxic companion.* *The first police officer companion.* It felt like we were gonna get 4 different perspectives on the TARDIS. To me, it sounded like the dream team. And then we got Yaz, Graham and Ryan. Whilst I think the actors are great (minus Tosin) the characters had so much potential. I think Yaz has the most; so I'm excited for s13. PLEASE MORE CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT FOR YAZ!
@@_MyNameIsAJ_ me too! yaz as a character has sooo much potential, a trainee police officer with a troubled past that needs a get away from her family. its like she was _made_ to travel with the doctor, I just wish they'd array her policing skills more. hopefully with her (probably) being the only companion next series, the writers will focus more on her characterization.
I was very scared to watch season 11 and 12 for the first time because of all the criticism, but your video really helped me be a little hopeful to what’s to come. Thank you!!
Interesting to see what happens with season 13 & how it may have to change given the current situation - I’m sure theyre rewriting as we speak as they’re supposed to start filming in September & with social distancing hanging around for months to come it’ll be interesting to see how they handle it & the problems it causes 🤔. I guess if they are binning some companions in the special then that’ll make things a bit easier
Should have been Toby Whithouse as the show runner instead of Chris Chibnal. I do agree with you that at first I thought he’d be a good show runner following his Torchwood episodes and Broadchurch and a few of his Doctor Who. Oh how I was wrong.....
I agree that series 13 will probably be his best. Series 11 was criticised for not being ambitious enough, and then series 12 went a bit overboard and became too ambitious, so hopefully series 13 will be a perfect balance...
I don’t understand why chibnall’s era has soo little chatter development, is not like he doesn’t know how to do it. He wrote Cyberwoman, countryside, kiss kiss bang bang, end of time and exit wounds torchwood episodes that have a massive character development in my opinion
I honestly don't understand it. Sure, S11 wasn't the best, but it wasn't bad, and S12 was amazing. The timeless children didn't change much lore wise, S11 was a breather season, and Jodie's been amazing imo.
@dr103 Exactly!! Like, I see a lot of nitpicking about the whole infinite regens, but if you think about it, the doctor was going to have enough regens to keep selling Doctor Who, so that was of benefit, and Chibnal wrote it in a way that makes the 1st Doctor still technically the 1st Doctor and minimally impacts anything, if at all. I hope we see Ruth again in fact.
Lex Gaming s12 was better entertainment wise. But the timeless child has ruined so much lore in so many areas eg the other. The timeless child has broken the show.
In my opinion, for most of the doctors in the reboot, with the exception of Matt Smith, their last series is the best and the writing gets progressively better over time. We must hope that this will also be the case for Jodie Whittaker if she stays for series 13.
Matt Smith had amazing writing on his last season. He reinvented himself after losing his friends, became dark and serious, behind a thin layer of fun and whimsical, moved onto a cloud in the sky! Matt had the Name of the Doctor, which asked the question "Doctor Who?" and yet it didn't ruin anything! The Doctor stayed mysterious, and his name is still a secret. He time traveled to his own grave! Day of the Doctor (Movie in 180+ countries. The biggest point in doctor who history) Was amazing, had 3 doctors including the phenominal John Hurt. The Doctors visited eachother, the past, gallifrey, and their riffing off of eachother was fantastic. And Time of the Doctor was an amazing christmas special. 11 died with dignity, and in his last moments, he wasn't vain like 10, or broken like 12, he was strong and optimistic like 9. Not to mention his regeneration was the biggest ever, with the energy wiping out an entire dalek fleet! Matt's Doctor even phoned the future before he changed just to reassure his companion. He cared so much. It was sad, happy, kind, and powerful. Ppl give Matt a bad rap because he came after their favorite doctor. No one gave him a chance, but he was great anyway. Similar to Capaldi. Even Matt himself feels that the fans didn't like him when he was doing the show, but he was amazing.
5:52 I don't think people hate Chibs' political messages of the show just because they're there or because of Whittaker, but more because he delivers them so badly. Particularly in Arachnids in the UK, Orphan 55 and Praxeus (the rest aren't really that bad imo) it's just so in your face and delivered nonsensically.
He takes an already established story and makes it so it suits him. It's like we're the older brother and he's the little sister with our toys playing tea party. *GI JOE DOESN'T WORK WITH A BRATZ DOLL WE ALL KNOW THAT*
Broadchurch was good, but that I think was mostly carried by the actors. When watching it, there was just simply far too much convenience. Characters would do stupid things despite them supposedly knowing better, and he almost always resolved things by the answer just falling into the characters laps.
Seriously what did they think casting him! This man didn't even have any actually good doctor who episode in RTD and Moffat era... His best one was the Silurian 2-parter and it kinda was a less-good reboot of Doctor Who and the Silurian from the 3rd Doctor era . He wrote the god damn CUBES episode for fuck sake He was good in broadchurch but yeah crime dramas and sci-fi aren't exactly the same
Out of his previous dr who episodes the hungry Earth two parter was my favourite chibnall episode, that episode was soo goof and the supporting actors were amazing
Chris Chibnall, for me, broke me by the end of series 12. That’s not me being dramatic but I found series 11 to be incredibly disappointing, for many reasons (under developed characters, simple plots which go no where and a Doctor who did not feel defined to just name a few). Series 12 has me hooked, based on the mystery alone, and the characters did improve but the Timeless Children smashes whatever the show could have done instantly and mistreated the Cybermen, the Master and The Doctor all in one go. I think he can be a good writer but I genuinely want him to leave sooner rather than later.
I don't think we know enough to be able to tell if the timeless child breaks the show or not. It can, it has the potential, but it doesn't have to. It can be that the master lied. It's possible they are not in the same universe as where the Doctor is originally from. (MI6 was never prepared for an Alien invasion? Where were they for the past 38 seasons? Huge clues all over the place that this is a different universe, or huge plotholes, depending on how this all works out). But even if it's all true and the Doctor is the timeless child, it's a long-long story and every episode starts with a mystery that gets unraveled by the end of the episode. The Doctor being more than a mere Time Lord has been a theme often during the show. There were hints in classic who and new who that he might have had more regenerations than what we know of. It's not new. 12 or 11, I don't remember which, but one of them even said once he might have been a woman once, but he doesn't remember.And BTW there was the arc of the Silence and 11 where it was thought for a while that his name was the oldest question of the Universe and at the end it turned out it was transmitted through time by the Time Lords, yet until we knew this I don't remember any uproar that this breaks everything, even though if his name was somehow really and truly the oldest question in the universe that would have made him an integral part of creation, but people instead waited to see how it plays out. It baffles me that so many 'fans' would abandon the show while as of yet we have more questions than answers and for sure I would not leave my favorite show ever and let it die just because it has a few years that are not as great as those that came before. If we let it die it will die with Chibnall, but if we someone else might make it right. If Chibnall really breaks it (the jury is still out on that for me), I would even welcome a Bobby Ewing moment. :D
Man, I was on the side of Moffat, I admittedly wasn't keen on Matt Smith's era, but I loved the Capaldi era and thought Moffat did a great job, I couldn't understand why people thought he was the worst thing ever. It feels really bad to now really dislike the showrunner, because I love this show, I've loved it since before Eccleston, I love the sixth Doctor era, I love the awful sets of the Classics, I love the bad acting in the first couple of Doctor's eras, but this new era... it just ain't for me.
I really, reeeeally gave season 11 a chance. I loved the trailers and the production quality. And I know people have said there's a lot of reasons to hate Chibnal's Doctor, but I only need one. It's NOT EXCITING. It feels empty and dull, it's not thrilling, there's no mystery or charm. I've recently rewatched season 5 and... You know what? This is probably the best season of TV that exists. Doctor Who can be a masterpiece. Where is that now? The Doctor did really rise higher than ever, and so now... Now the Doctor has fallen.
That's because it's a tradition to hate the current showrunner, Moffat was hated during his era but now he is praised like a god. And Chibnall was 16 when he criticized Colin Baker's era, he was still a teenager beginning in criticism. At this age you're not completely mature yet and it's normal to make mistakes and don't always think about your words. He even realized his words were means and apologized a year later. I'm more worried by 30 years old adults who only think about hating and are not capable of doing actual criticism without insulting the team. At this age you should be a minimum mature.
I think Chris Chibnall's best move would be to have season 13 be all returning villians including the weeping angels, sea devils, vashta nerada, sontarans and a multi master finale
i like chibnall even though series 11 was dull apart from a few episodes i liked. series 12 to me is the best series in years and i am excited for the next special and series 13 moffat is the better doctor who writer but his last 3 years in charge almost stopped me watching but chibnall has brought the excitement back for me and i am curious to see the timeless child story and how that finishes
Even with Moffat's comment about the whole 'The show isn't canon' etc... I still think there needs to be SOME sort of respect for previous eras that were written. Even if it's just a nod here and there to at least TRY to connect some pieces together so we still feel like we're in the same show and atmosphere. I can genuinely understand that Chibnall may want to make his era a completely new take and maybe even try to make it stand out from the others, but forgetting majority of the show's past and all of the previous things that have been set up for you isn't the way to do this.
The previously established canon (if there even was one) still holds up to this day. What Chris wrote is merely expanding on what we already know and what has been hinted towards multiple times before.
@@gazda69 I agree it's been hinted at, but I disagree that it still holds... Ruth Doctor shouldn't have had a TARDIS when it was Hartnell's Doctor who was the one that first ran away... even if she happened to have a TARDIS don't get how it's in the shape of a police box? 11th Doctor's regeneration and how it was meant to be the "last one" means nothing now as we know the Doctor clearly had more as they're the original person who had regenerative abilities... so the Time Lords giving him more was also useless. All of the hints towards the Doctor's mother like the mysterious woman in The End of Time (which RTD even said in his head it was the Doctor's mother) and the woman that came in the Barn every now and then in Hell Bent now means nothing, as we know the Doctor's original parents are from wherever the portal thing came from. Clara should've seen all of the previous Doctor reincarnations when she jumped into their timeline but didn't. There are just so many pieces now in the show that don't make sense due to the arc and conclusion of Series 12. I appreciate that Chibnall wanted to build more on the Doctor's character whilst keeping mystery to them like where they really came from... but he's caused more damage than actually trying to fix and build things. It's like trying to fix something that doesn't need to be fixed, and now it's only caused more issues.
@@YourPalSammy You have to remember that the Series 12 finale didn't exactly confirm or deny any of what was shown to the Doctor in the Matrix. The only confirmation we have of anything is what the Master tells us (and he's not exactly the most sane or trustworthy person, now is he?). Then there's also the thing about those fake memories in the Matrix that were a cover up for what actually went down, and how there are still many important memories regarding the Timeless Child locked away. All the incosistencies you mentioned are either misdirections or purposefully yet unexplained. All will be revealed in the following seasons. In conclusion, the S12 finale was merely introducing the idea of the secret origins of the Time Lords, not lore-breaking confirmations. It's way too early to complain or argue about "plot holes" when there's still so much we don't know.
reverseriot I have faith that some of my points will be answered in future Seasons so they’ll make more sense... but I just highly doubt ALL of them will be explained, there are too many for Chibnall to make sure he gets around to all of them. But at the same time he did create those inconsistencies in the first place so... anything he does won’t change the fact that they were inconsistencies, even if he explains them, he waits far too long and drags it out so much that the fandom (including myself) get sick of it and just waits for him to finally piece stuff together he could’ve done the previous Series. In my opinion, Series 11 was a waste. If Series 11 had the arc of Series 12, along with the Ryan & Graham arc of Series 11, and mix & match of the best episodes of both Series that still made sense plot-wise and character-wise, then this era would be off to a brilliant start. But unfortunately this never happened. I’d believe that things will be explained and told to us in the future, but given some of the decisions Chibnall has made since he became show runner, I doubt he’ll actually do what we’re expecting.
Because *Chibnall PLAGIARISED ''Supremacy of the Cybermen''* (2016) comic book frame-by-frame in 17 plot points - for Timeless Children (2020): sta.sh/01rvbzw5n23d - mostly 12th Doctor storyline. Also Lady in the Lake (Big Finish), Cartmel's Masterplan, origins of the comic character Doomsday - as noted by ClownFishTV - (The Crawling Terror by Mike Tucker for the Tesla episode, B-Where did a vid on his ''repeat'' stories ...) In 2017 I was all up for the Chibnall and Whittaker setup! OMG! Wrote a fanfic about it! Now I wholeheartedly despise it: Hartnell's 1st Doctor mellowed through time and found kindness and sympathy in humanity and //added those important traits// to himself - through Big Finish the 6th Doctor amplified them to the peril of his own destruction, 10th died for Wilf and the 12th Doctor even crossed that line and straight up exploded himself to momentarily save those who, in the long term, had no hope of survival. It's called character growth. Courage to do what's right. Especially for another. Chibnall's writing is retrograde and sociopathic: so is acting of everybody (except Walsh) and there is NO character growth, either within the series or looking as a whole: Yaz person tweeted that she doesn't understand why people cry when watching something - she's an actress and //doesn't understand// how to move people's emotions?!! What does she think acting is???!!!! Whittaker is self-centred and ''just talked to Tennant'' in her preparation for the role, fully backed up by Chibnall - that's NOT how you prepare to take on 54 years old mantle. It's UNMOVING and UNCONVINCING, stunted, arrested development, very tiny, empty, feelingless, cold, moronic (as in ''notably stupid or lacking in good judgment''), nasty, insulting, there's no team build up, heck - there's no team to speak of, the stories are badly told, it's like NOTHING - about this character or previous lives or plot points - MATTERS, there's no continuity. It's like she's completely separated, cut off from everything that a known Whoverse makes - therefore the show is now establishing a New one. ... I'm not on board. I won't sing ''wake up'': when watching this I feel depressed, repelled and disgusted - you're not supposed to feel disgusted by Doctor Who! Had Emily Cook not made the brilliantly engaging watchalongs, I'd be completely out of this fandom by now - as is, got reminded that not all is bad and I can just censor last three years as if they never happened and still enjoy the good, brilliant, silly bits. The thing is: they had all the means to make a mark and do something awesome. Wouldn't it be wonderful if instead of Jack being abused to bump up the ratings, two arcs ran simultaneously and Ashad (= joined ''CyberRose'' and ''angry, emotional 10th CyberDoctor'' from the comic book) actually represented clear danger throughout the S12? While ''discovering'' the Masterplan - which was NEVER Cartmel's intent, see his interview on the Traveling Tardis: it was supposed to remain a mystery - revealing it - is UNNECESSARY. It //means// nothing and contradicts 54 years of character development - making it irrelevant and throw away. The Doctor was a relatable, regular oddity, nerdy nosy parker, tinker and meddler, //trying// to beat the odds, risk it and do what's good and right. But now? Who, except those completely delusional, can now relate to a God ... Who can relate to a void of a companion? Who feels elevated and energised by a two-tone ambiance music? I'll keep an eye out on S13, just to document the next plagiarisms under which Chris Chibnall signs his own name, without any credit to the true creators. And then I hope that under new showrunner the series will become lively and happy and thoughtful and moving (possibly referenced but not plagiarised) again. P.S.: Talk to Problembeing: dropped a note in one of The Rabbi From Another Planet (Tzvi Lebetkin) chats that Dinosaurs on a Spaceship were a script sent to the BBC by ''somebody with a blog on the web'' and how bitter they are for Chibnall nicking the script - I can't find that blog, but if you could only pump Problembeing for the information further, I'd appreciate it.
Chris Chibnall's Doctor Who is the tv equivalent of " The Emperor's New Clothes! " Series 11 presented a woman who claimed to be the Doctor but didn't act like the Doctor! The Tardis, once established as a living entity, suddenly became an old car that needed repair! Several episodes hinted that something was medically wrong with the Doctor, but that was forgotten by series end! The only redeeming feature of 11 was the relationship between Graham and his grandson! Series 12 arrived with Graham and his grandson acting as though they were complete strangers! Orphan 55 happened! ( The worst episode of Doctor Who ever recorded! ) Chibnall stole other writers storylines! Paul McGann's stories stopped being cannon! The acting ability of the entire cast deteriorated as each episode passed! Chibnall created another female Doctor, just as a story gimmick! Jodie Whittaker continued to gurn her way through every performance, unable to act at all like the Doctor! Chibnall rewrote the Timeless Child storyline by replacing the Master's name with that of the Doctor!
If CC does not read any comments (good or bad) then he seriously needs to, the fans are his life blood and writing and plotting in isolation isn't the best way to gauge your audience
My problem with the Chibnall era isn't the "SJW political agenda yadda yadda yadda" it's that his whole run so far has been painfully substandard for Doctor Who. From the substandard actors he cast to the substandard writing of episodes and other generally poor choices the whole shebang has been disappointing for me as a long-time fan and I'm looking forward to his departure from the show so we can hopefully get better creatives in charge again.
I think Chris, while definitely being the least good showrunner of new Who so far, knows what he's doing. Some of the criticism he gets is valid, but the hate you see on _some_ corners of the internet is totally blown out of proportion. The backlash he gets for the reveal in the S12 finale is stupid, considering that the episode itself didn't confirm anything and actually went out of its way to remind us that the Doctor is still who she is, no matter her true origins. I myself used to dislike the idea of pre-Hartnell Doctors, but S12 actually really warmed me up to the idea and i can't wait to see where the writers are going with it.
Yeah, I'd say I agree with around 100% of this comment. I feel Series 12 is actually just slightly above standard-quality Doctor Who, and actually has a much more entertaining personality than 11. 11 was just bland and kind of dull imo
People hated it because it kills the mystery of the character and just turns him into a chosen one, probably one of the blandest story telling device clichés
Before I say my piece I will say that you are entitled to your opinion. Yes some of the criticism like purely the fact that the Doctor is female is bloody ridiculous. I adored Missy and a female Doctor could work. But not with Whittaker and Chibnall involved. Missy was played by a brilliant actress who loved the show. She had great writing and an excellent arch. Honestly she's the first revival Master minus Jacobi that I really thought, filled Delgado's shoes. Her character also wasn't centered around her gender. She had other CONSISTENT aspects to her personality and could do more than two facial expressions. Jodie dislikes and disrespects the show and fandom. Her interviews have made that more than clear. I don't think someone who lacks all respect and passion for the show should play the Doctor. She insulted all past era's through her "celebrating white male gaze" comment and refused to watch past Doctor who because "she couldn't get into it" yes that decision was affirmed by chibs the idiot but she originally made it. This both shows a lack of dedication as an actor and makes it even more obvious that she has no understanding of the character she's playing. She didn't originate it yet has the gall to take on a decades-old role without researching the character. This is just my problem with her being the Doctor due to her lackadaisical attitude. (she also complained about doing 11 episodes when other Doctors were paid the same for 13). She only seems to care about what agenda she can push with the role. As for her acting, it is incredibly bland and poor. Yes, she was fine in Broadchurch but she didn't have to carry the show and drama is her strength. She is obviously out of her depth with this scifi show. She lacks charisma, likeability, passion, gravitas, and versatility. Unlike past actor's she can't transfer her abilities over into scifi. She frequently comes off as genuinely incompetent, excessively callous, selfish, and cowardly. Not traits associated with the Doctor. And also appears to only be able to do mildly depressed and hyperactive child. (As well as one or two bad Tennant/Smith impressions) There's no depth to her, something an actor should at least add to the character. (Yes certain aspects are due to the abominable writing but a good actor can elevate bad scripts. Capaldi did it through half his tenure). In short, my issue isn't with a female doctor. It's with JODIE as a female Doctor. The companions are also poorly written. They almost never challenge the Doctor, do everything she says, and has no real connection with her. That last part is one of the most important parts of the show. The speech about Yaz being great actually mad me laugh since she was proactive all of one time. Grahm is the only marginally interesting one. The only arch they had was the Grahm/Ryan relationship and that was patched up last season. Chibs also can't write worth a damn, especially since he no longer has to answer to anybody. He's thrown character arches out the window for the sake of getting a rating bump by bringing in an old villain (ie screwing over Missy). And his stories are poorly constructed. He's actually ripped off a lot of things done by better writers. (the fam are fugitives like in Sound of Drums, Zellin was a rip off of the nightmare man from SJA, and the skithra were racnoss rip offs, the kasavan design also looked suspiciously like the cybermen in army of ghosts). He sets up conflicts and villains that get defeated in less than five minutes leaving almost no stakes. His writing for the Doctor is inconsistent as she seems to have forty-nine different personalities and for all he goes on about how brilliant it is to have a female doctor, the writing hasn't embraced that. Take out all the crummy potshots and lectures towards males in the show (who seem to often be portrayed as the villain or jerks) and place a male in Jodie's role and the plot would largely play out the same. Character and story also take a back seat to agenda-pushing (doctor who has been political which i don't mind but rarely sacrificed story and character development like chibs the idiot has). Chibs can't write good stories and that's that. Even his ones prior to being showrunner were very weak and Cyberwoman is considered the worst torchwood episode by many. As for the timeless child being the Doctor, it is a pointless retcon, there are no consequences which means that there was no point to doing it besides chibs the idiot wanting to do something big to leave his mark on the show (he did a big scorch mark). The timeless child opens up dozens of plotholes that I can happily go into examples being (Clara was in the Doctor's timestream, why doesn't she see the timeless child? How is river a timelady now? Why did neither the Doctor or Master notice this before when both have been in the matrix multiple times? Why do all other galiifreyans have identical biology to the Doctor like two hearts?) All these plotholes were unnecessary as are the other ones I haven't mentioned. The origin of regeneration is now just plain nasty as it comes from child murder/experimentation. Yet Tecte-canon-destroyer is presented as being a strong good female character as opposed to a sadistic homicidal person with no morals. At least Rassilon and Omega's badness was acknowledged. Regeneration coming from the time vortex is also a much more mysterious and enigmatic origin befitting of Doctor Who. Now we don't know where the child is from. Big deal, what's important is what happened on Gallifrey and we know all that now. There's not much mystery left. It also screws the Doctor's character arch which started with Hartnell and developed all the way to Capaldi. Putting in pre-Hartnell Doctor's messes this up. And then there's the fact that the Doctor is now special. Sure they didn't know about these other incarnations but that doesn't change the fact that they are no longer an ordinary timelord who got sick of the stuff society and decided to take off and travel the universe. (The Cartmel Masterplan doesn't defend this as that was never completed and incorporated into the canon and Cartmel himself has stated the Timeless child doesn't complete it) They became special through their actions despite there being nothing special about them. One of the best messages of Doctor who was that anybody could be special due to their choices. Birth didn't matter. By making the Doctor the foundation for regeneration and by extension timelord society takes away that ordinary aspect and lessens the impact of the message. (B-WHERE's channel actually did an excellent and detailed break down of why the timeless child being the Doctor is so bad and I recommend it as it explains it better than I can in one comment) The Timeless child being the Doctor deserves all the hate it gets (if it had been an unknown character it wouldn't be so bad or destructive). Like for many other long-time fans it is also the final straw for us and has entirely killed our love of the current show. (I'll always adore Hartnell-Capaldi) And that actually breaks my heart. Maybe one day the show can regenerate with a good actor and good showrunner but until that time RIP Doctor Who (1963-2017)
1 none of the actors had previous experience or knowledge of the series 2 hes done literally everything he used to complain about the writers lol 3 he writes no depth for any of the companions we've got so many you never get to know them (does anyone else remember yazz is a police woman? I barley did since it was only mentioned once but was referenced to being integral to her character ) 4 Jodie could have been amazing if she had even a smidge of knowledge of the doctor ( I mean hell if she know anything about the doctor she probably would have refused to rewrite the entire show she just had no idea that was as big as it was )
i think more than anything the bbc are stuck for options to replace show runners for dr who, who do you know of is: a life long fan of the show, can write for all ages, interested in sci-fi & has great management skills!!
I think, for me, the main problem with series 11 was the lack of old, classic monsters. I don’t think there were even any new villains that The Doctor had heard of before (correct me if I’m wrong on that). For most of it, The Doctor was just like, lI don’t know anything about this villain, I don’t know what to do.l Although I really loved how Rosa was written. With s11 IMO everything was just too “new”. There wasn’t really anything where The Doctor was like, “I know this villain, I know what to do here, let’s go!” Even with the pting episode, I didn’t mind the creature itself (I actually quite like the little guy), or the characters, but the episode as a whole could have been written a lot better. That’s just my opinion, though.
The most frustrating thing is that everything about this era is either bad or painfully average. This looks like you just fed a computer the scripts for every other episode and asked it to write a new season. The companions aren't annoying they're just there, cardboard cutouts for the doctor to talk to. The doctor doesn't have a personality, she just seems like a combination of rejected dialogue from Smith or Tennant.
Here are my thoughts on Chris Chibnall: he's an ok showrunner and that I expect that the more seasons of his run, the better he gets (what I found with Steven Moffat at the time he was showrunner were that thins were a a little much of a drag with Matt Smith as the 11th Doctor, but things picked up a lot more and made the show enjoyable again (for me, anyway) as soon as Peter Capaldi became the 12th Doctor and had that sense of variety to the show in any aspect of it)
Unfortunately he is hated because he is average and mediocre to the worst writer of the show.............and he was not right for show runner and his only good episode was in the Davies era, tbh, gotta hope that he doesn’t have a future in Doctor Who. Perhaps touchwood, but no more doctor who
I think a major problem with Chibnall’s run is the toxicity from both camps. But as someone who isn’t currently enjoying the show. It is probably the ham fisted attempts at lecturing about social issues where Doctor Who has been so graceful so far. So many of Chibnall’s supporters are unable to separate that problem from those who follow the #notmydoctor weirdity
Just like Moffatt, Chibnall is a very hit and miss writer. I do like most of his episodes before he tuck over, I like Jodie’s Doctor but it is the writing that is the problem.
Channel Pup, but if each Doctor is a new reboot, then it shouldn’t be connected to the past, if this is a Doctor Who reboot then why is it still connected?
I think the problem is one of unreasonable expectations. I don't think any showrunner will ever be able to live up to the internet's expectations about the show. Just think what people would have said about the classic series if the internet was around then, the show wouldn't have lasted! Ending comment now before it turns into a "back in my day" rant.
Anyone else feel that the Rosa episode used a recycled timeless script? The whole episode felt more like a episode of timeless then Doctor who. Also the whole timeless child thing is BS. It could have been a great twist if the master was the timeless child,and would explain a lot,but NOoOo,the doctor was made the timeless child and the whole timeline is F***ed.
The BBC killed the Dr Who legend not Chibnall though he certainly played his part in allowing as a talented writer for those who are so polarised, biased and woke to rubbish what licence fee payers paid for not just production of but the wages of all involved. The true hard grit fans of Dr Who who saw it trashed won't be conned again into watching a future series allowing those who failed them so miserably and pathetically to gain anything except a notoriety for delivering the final exit and exit is where they should be; end of.
I don't hate Chibnall at all. There are certain good elements there, but he's rather short changed the Doctor (not authoritative enough, always questioning herself) and both Ryan and Yaz (they're both pretty much cyphers who bring nothing to the show aside from their ethnicity and gender). The only character that felt like an actual person was Graham: too bad he's leaving the show. In future, I hope he brings in advisors with more experience with Doctor Who to help punch up the scripts.
Dr Who has always dealt with politics of the day, however, the problem with the Chibnal era is that the issue is more important than the story. He even admits that he thinks of an issue that needs to be tackled and tries to shoehorn a story into that.
I clicked onto this video fully expecting to disagree with you to at least some degree, but I'm pleasantly surprised to say that I pretty much agree with all of the points you made.
After RTD and Moffat, Chris Chibnall was always going to have big shoes to fill. For me, his writing lacks heart (which RTD and Moffat provided in spades) and the characters sometimes seem a bit wooden. Which is frustrating, because Broadchurch proves that Chibnall can definitely write scenes will of emotion, and well-developed characters! For some reason, it's just not translating to Doctor Who.
The political agendas flirted with all sides. 11 and 12 are heavily one sided. The whole point of this is to take something away. Maybe the timeless child is a bluff and it’s a way of punishing fans that don’t like Jodie. Either way it’s a pretty shitty thing to do. You can say it’s great, if that’s what you think. Reality it’s not. Fact, there are way more people that are upset, angry and let down at what he has done. The main thing that people don’t like about Chris is. He is not writing the show for you. It’s for him and how he sees the world. The show has never been retconned before. Show me one place where it has been retcon! Not add something that was never confirmed. When did the show say that Clara was never there when he stole the Tardis. History does matter. THATS WHY SO MEAN PEOPLE ARE PISSED! 😂😂😂
#crispyforshowrunner
Yes!!
s0n 0f m4n Make it happen
Better than Chibby
@@ojw8475 calling the BBC now ;)
#chrispychibnall
I do find it funny how Chibnall criticised The Show for being routine, running up and down Corridors and silly monsters in 1986 but that’s exactly what he did with The Tsuranga Conundrum
I mean to be fair, every other season has had that episode. Lazarus Experiment, Journey to the Center of the Earth, Into the Dalek, etc.
At the time, another person was responsable for episode 5 but abandoned production at the last minute. So, yeah, that was an episode that Chibs had to write in a hurry and - surprise surprise - the Pting was created by the another writter.
and every other story he has written.
Pretty much every criticism he came up with in that interview thingy can be applied to his Who
I still think the Cybermasters are one of the silliest monsters we’ve seen in doctor who and the whole timeless child story is a mess I just want to forget
The reason I just dislike chibnall is that he hasn’t given us anything for our time. He spent ten weeks building up the timeless child arc but then he spent almost the entire finale telling us that it doesn’t matter and there was no character or story potential in this reveal meaning it only seems to have happened because he wanted a story arc to build up viewing figures. Further still I believe he saw the reaction to series 11 and realised that in ten or twenty years time people will look at his era and barely give it a second thought so he tried everything in order to try and make his era memorable without any sense of care or consideration as to how he was going to do this.
At the end of the day I just don’t think chibnall can write Doctor Who but that doesn’t make him a bad writer. Doctor Who is such a large show with a lot to handle and there are people who can love it but just not write it and I think chibnall is only of those people. I personally heavily dislike the reveal because it makes the Doctor less interesting and as I mentioned made the entire series a waste of time but as ma boi channel pup said the next time there is a fresh start with a new showrunner this will be retconned and the Doctor will be just as enigmatic and interesting as before. So when that does happen I will look on his era as having merit in the individual stories which Doctor Who will always be better at doing than story arcs.
chibs was hired to change doctor who so profoundly that the long time fans, some of whom have watched from "an unearthy child", would leave and stop caring. he has executed "the BBC/chinall plan for doctor who" to perfection.
I like that, think you're right, brother
James Fraser couldn’t of said it better myself 👏
What would you think if doctor who went to the hbo model of longer episodes but fewer of the? For a while i've been thinking about how classic who had only 4-6 stories per year but released them in parts. If doctor who went to an all specials model with one every other month do you think that would work well. I only say this because RT davies reinvented who for what tv had become by the year 2005 and the way people view content these days i think that moving the show to 5 or 6 moviesodes a year might be a good idea post chibnal. Though I do agree with you remarks regarding the quality of his writting.
Jericho Gonzales Personally I don’t think this’ll work out because what happens if an episode is bad? We would have to sit through something like “Love and Monsters,” “The Wedding of River Song,” or “Orphan 55” for 2 hours rather than the standard 45 minutes. My thoughts tho. At the very least the writers need to change because Chibnal only hired political play writers for series 11 and 12.
I don’t hate Chris. I just don’t like his Doctor Who.
I was going to say the exact same thing.
@@peterd788 true man
@Peter D I don’t know. She’s been quite the spectacular actor in other productions, and I don’t know if I’d use a series that made Stephen Fry look like he couldn’t act as a benchmark for her ability to perform.
To make a comparison to Star Wars. Chris Chibnall is cut from the same cloth as Rian Johnson. Both had their ideas for what they wanted both franchises to be and both executed what they wanted while not having a care for what came before. Both can be and are competent enough directors, but in terms of writing, keep them away from scripts and stories.
InsanityMethods Ah yes, Star Wars, the other major syfy series to crash into the ground. Good comparison by the way.
Am I the only one who feels his episodes play out like unchained fan fiction? And not the good kind...
“Hate is too strong an emotion to waste on something you dont like”, what this does is prove that the people who hate chibnall do love doctor who, which means if they hate it then there really is a problem with the show, because its obvious that they like it, otherwise we wouldn’t be so upset, there is a reason we care, because we love the show.
That’s true. I don’t want to watch a political spin-off of my favorite show, I want to watch my beloved scifi show.
@@OrangeAceGaming Doctor Who has allways been Political
@@sonnykingcomposer Yes, the show has always been political. I'm not blind to it. I hate "Kill the Moon" too, but series 11 and 12 seem to have made "Kill the Moon" their blueprint. The show has always been political, but never this pointedly political pretty much every episode. Stuff like "Oxygen" warned about the dangers of Capitalism, but it had the decency to be a good story and was one of the few political based episodes in that season. The episode messed around with the characters. Such as Bill's suit malfunctioning and the Doctor becoming blind for a 3 episode arc.
Series 11 and 12 don't write good stories inspired by politics, they are just making Doctor Who a political statement. Hence why Chris Chibnall hired people who have only written political plays to write the show.
I'm also not against the messages in series 11 and 12, but I am completely against how they are handled. It's a poor representation that doesn't show anybody off in a good light.
@@OrangeAceGaming I'd disagree to an extent, I think there are some good examples of good political messages in the Chibnall era. It isn't more political, it's just less subtle.
I just really miss the days of how everyone wrote the David Tennant era. Everything made sense and just worked.
I personally just don't like how Jodie Whiticker has been written, she feels too much like a primary school teacher. She had a rocky start as all new doctors do, however, they just ignored the change of the gender in all writing, I understand that they did this to avoid politics and things like that, however, I feel like we needed a bit of a comedic line or something to ease us in. I feel like they tried to make her too relatable yet the childlike tendencies and apparent lack of social skills just made things feel awkward. I feel like they could have done a woman doctor a lot better. The storylines also just feel quite separate and the number of characters made individual connections with the doctor more difficult. This is just how things seemed to me whilst watching and rewatching these episodes.
Other than those aspects though I did enjoy the newer series 12 and agree with other commenters how timeless children didn't change the lore much at all (I actually feel it really fits really well). I also love Jodie Whittaker's acting I just feel her character doesn't fit the doctor's norm (but that's just my opinion). Thanks guys.
Ok, ok. I can see where you're coming from. You brought up that 13 doesn't "feel" like a girl, but isn't that kinda the point? She's still The Doctor, regardless of gender. And as for the story line comment, if Chibs really does have a 5 year plan, then most of season 11 could be seen as just getting to know the characters.
@@CyberController- Nah, I never meant that. I meant there was no acknowledgement from the doctor when he changed gender. There should have been as that was the only time he has ever been female as far as he/she remembered. I totally agree that they shouldn't make her character feel different, but that is what they did anyway with her persona. I get where ur coming from though. I hope Chris' plan is good as so far has been a bit out of the ordinary for Doctor Who and it just doesn't quite sit right with me at the moment. Still enjoying it though. :) Just miss the Eccleston/David Tennant era
The Doctor Jesus-Tinkerbell of Series 3 makes sense for you?
I don't hate Chibnall, I'm just disappointed in him.
WhiteWolf99 are you his mother
@@Momus425 yes
Christopher Chibnall? That sounds so cursed for some reason.
Hahahaa
Stevenna Moffatttt Russelious Daviso
@@Raftors
No, just no. LMAO!
-Russelton Travolta-Davies
-Stevie Moffanson
-Christopher "Chris" "Chibs" Chibnall
If only he stayed as long as the good Christopher.
I don't hate Chibnall. I liked all his pre-showrunner episodes. I just loathe everything he's done with the show with him on the throne.
Apart from Jodie (bc I love her, just not how she's being written)... and Sacha Dhawan. Man, I hope his back pain is improving after carrying Season 12 :(
Its not really hate its just the massive disappointment that comes across as hate sometimes it makes me miss the excitement of the RTD era
Why? The RTD is just SJW and feminist, just like RTD.
Mayo Tango131 hahaha you can’t be serious first of all the “pc” stuff was a lot less subtle and in your face secondly the writing in the RTD era was actually well written stories
Mayo Tango131 says the guy from chile that whole country is a SJW drug lord pandering country
Mayo Tango131 I’m sorry, what? Are you confusing RTD with Chibnal because I don’t remember a lot of SJW politics from the RTD era (especially nothing as bad as Chibnal’s stupid handling of politics).
i think the character development was/is lacking, and the timeless child just fucked up some of the doctors character arc in my opinion. i really do miss the vibe and energy of the rd era. The episodes in these two seasons are just so forgettable, and the music. oh my god THE MUSIC. or lack there of. i think if the music was there, with special themes like with murray gold Rose, Clara,...it would make the series MUCH better, like just really make it more emotional and amazing, to really pull you in instead of just lo-fi sounds. LOVE the appearance of the tardis though.
also yes, definitely, s12 is a giant improvement to s11
You're right about character development and especially the music but I feel like they are both linked. In the past series there was a lot of character drama and the doctor was more or less in conflict with his companions at least at the very beginning, but all the companions were fleshed out off the bat we had something to cling to and understand about them and slowly throughout their stay improve and get more complex so they had music themes because they were important just as much as the doctor.
In series 11 & 12 the companions are more like character traits Graham is the widow husband with literally nothing anchoring him to earth - Grace's death is brushed off in favor of adventure time, Ryan has dyspraxia and abandonment issues, has friends anchoring him but doesn't care that much because he is having fun with the doctor and then there's Yasmin a police officer with strong morals, brave and has the most things anchoring her to earth -Mother, father and sister and a job all while aspiring to reach higher and higher in her field. She has more things anchoring her than any other companion yet somehow she feels like the most tag along character of the three. how does Chibnail manage to sounder his own premise of of such high potential character is baffling.
It's so silly because in every episode there are those one off characters tagging along the doctor/companions and they get so much screen time that they have to be built up a bit so you can care about the episode but then there's no time to develop the companions so what you end up with is everyone just feeling like a tag along character that's just there so the doctor can talk at. So in conclusion I feel like even if Murry Gold had stayed and these characters had music themes they wouldn't have the same emotional pull when you hear them because the characters themselves are so lacking.
str48forward yes i ABSOLUTELY agree.... the development in the “fam” is abysmal at best and the music can only elevate the episode if you have a good base to work off of
I hated the music in season 11, except 13's theme, that's pretty great. (And practically the only thing I would actually classify as music in the whole season besides the main theme of the show but that's been like that for almost 60 years). Season 12 has a lot more, and it is better, but yeah, nowhere near the quality of what Mr. Gold composed. :(
I think the guy can write Doctor Who, I mean I quite enjoyed his Silurian two parter back in season 5, I just don't think he can write Doctor Who without a showrunner holding his hand.
I found the Silurian ones to be pretty poor episodes, along with the sun one... basically my opinion of his RTD and Moffat era EPs are the same as many critics, minus the exaggerated death threat levels. This includes liking the opening to the cubes with Matt Smith but feeling the payoff wasn't well executed. I just feel he has a different idea about Dr who and it doesn't really work, for I really like his work on Broadchurch, showing I can like his writing.
i liked the episode but the mum was just crazy
I genuinely really enjoy his era, I love Thirteen and liked Series 11 overall, but Series 12 kind of blew me away, so much Doctor Who to love this year, I hope it keeps getting better! Really enjoyed the video Crispy! :)
Have you ever seen any other doctor who? This isn't supposed to be a mean comment by the way. GOD bless.
Great video mate. For me... I think he's a good showrunner, not the best writer sure... But as a person, he cares about the show, he takes criticism on board and always clearly wants to improve. To me, that's the perfect showrunner attitude imo
Hello Ace 👋🏻
OMG ACE! Hi big fan! And yes I agree with you...I have high hopes for Series 13! (Not sure if thats a good thing)
@@CrispyPro Not a bad thing to get your hopes up, just make the hopes realistic!
For me personally, Chris Chibnall is not a good writer. He's not good at character development, and he tries way too hard to be introspective and grounded.
However, people like Bowlestrek, Nerdotic, Doomcock, Clownfish TV, and John The White are bitter with Chris Chibnall because they believe that both Chris and Jodie are turning Doctor Who into a propaganda show. Similar to how the North Korean propaganda cartoon Squirrel and Hedgehog teaches its viewers to hate Asian and Western culture, the supposed propaganda in Chibnall's Who that these channels try to express awareness of supposedly teaches its young viewers to hate the past and discriminate against straight white males because they are often presented as racist and narcissistic pigs (like the Trump rip off in Arachnids in the UK), with most of the actors playing the good characters in the episode being played by ethnic minorities, thus promoting a 'woke' agenda.
I used to believe that this theory was valid, but overtime, it started to become more silly, so I gave up on it.
@@thevfxmancolorizationvfxex4051 There's clearly an agenda, but those channels you mentioned seem to be grooming their viewers into thinking that's a bad thing. There's about as much 'wokeness' as there always was in New Who.
Also, big fan of your videos :)
I personally don’t hate Chibnall and his work on who, but I just don’t feel much towards him. At least with Moffat and RTD they had unique styles, whether you liked them or not, at least they had a style. With Chibnall, I can’t pinpoint what his style on who is.
Here’s a question for you guys, what words would you use to describe RTD’s who overall? I’d say:
Modern
Contemporary
Relatable
Simple
Down to Earth
Fun
What would you describe Moffat’s Who overall? I’d say:
Fairytale
Complex
Intriguing
Fantasy
Whimsical
What do you describe chibnall’s Who overall? I honestly don’t know.
Chris seems to be going for more substance over style, which is an interesting approach to the show and something we've never seen before, therefore we can't really judge him the same way we judge any other showrunner.
@@DCSMedia Series 11 was calmer and atmospheric, but I feel like series 12 looks like a RTD series.
Fun fact about Chris Chibnail : His birthday date was unknown until the official Doctor Who account on Twitter revealed it.Chris also has an instagram account which is for his family and friends and RTD follows him
@dr103 Yeah ofcourse he should
@dr103 Good thing people don't know his social media accounts and Jodie isn't on social media, they would both get bullied if they had public accounts. I've seen how violent people can get towards Star Wars actors, I don't wish anything like that to Doctor Who actor, not even the worst actors in the world deserve that. There is a difference between constructive criticism and pure hate.
Scelator is the Legend27 ???
@@jujublue4426 Yeh thank lord that niether of them have social media accounts. The Doctor Who fandom is just as worse as the Star Wars fandom. Even Sacha Dhawan got attacked by someone for being an indian who played the Master.
Series 10 ends with the doctor saying "Never be cruel, never be cowardly" while series 12 ends with the doctor wanting to use the death particle to wipe out both the master and the new cybermasters. ...What happened to "never be cruel" and then the old man shows up ready to sacrifice himself and the doctor just goes with it? "Never be cowardly"? Screw that I guess.
The whole theme here is very similar with "The parting of the ways" imagine if that ended similar to the "The Timeless Children" - some person on the satellite just tells the doctor they'll use the delta wave to wipe out humanity and the daleks and the doctor just accepts.
I have nothing against Chibnail don't know the man so it's impossible to harbor any kind of feelings for him, but his doctor who writing specifically is very boring very cliche. Like my lord man you say his few episodes during RTD and Mofat tenure didn't grip you, literally all his episodes had countdown timers as drama/suspense culminating in the cube episode. Why was that episode even aired is beyond my understanding the whole conflict gets resolved with the villain just leaving with no rhyme or reason and the doctor waving his sonic fixing everything... *Facepalm*
Chibnail had an earth shattering reveal : The doctor is an immortal entity from another dimension ... and he's choice is to lay all that on the table in 30+ minutes of exposition... surprising this is the same person who wrote Broadchurch. I guess at the end of the day he is one of those writers that have many many misses and a few hits and one bullseye.
I dont hate him,just dont like how he wrote show. He dont give old writers like Gatiss,Withouse etc wrote again. He make show more political and boring. He didnt give us scary and good villians ( but i love kassavins from spyfall and master). I hope he will leave soon,cause he just dosent know how to wrote dr who...and Timless child to...and if you read This crispy who you wanna see as a showrunner..😀
Mathew T Mathew hang on , you miss ‘old writers like Gatiss’ ? Did Mark Gatiss write a single decent Doctor Who episode? 🤔
@@nathanthomas5133 'Night Terrors' and 'Empress of Mars' are pretty good, i guess.
reverseriot “pretty good” - not exactly glowing praise ! Yeah they were ok, as was ‘Cold war’ but has anything he’s written blown me away or been groundbreaking in any way? Nah. He always seems like a place-holder writer - a back up in case other writers don’t work out 🤔 . To be honest I don’t really remember much about his episodes (except that one was on a submarine) , they’re a bit unmemorable 😢
@Nathan Thomas While what you say is fair, I think we can all agree all of the Chib’s episodes were Pretty much dumpster fires. 🔥 Like legit not good.
This is why we need Neil Gaiman
I dont hate Chris chibnall but I just don't like his vision of the show, he was a weak writer for doctor who before he became show runner, I never understood why he was chosen to helm the show and two seasons in, I still don't, he's just not a good doctor who writer and his handling of the last story arc was clear evidence of that
I think that's the problem with Chris Chibnall, and the BBC these days: He pushes too much on the political correctness side of the show, that he forgets to put character development, exploring time and space, the doctor and companions friendship (which is is inexistant in these last two seasons), and the most important thing of all: the doctor's great knowledge, and his powerful speeches on peace and pacifism. We have to remember that Doctor Who is a show for entertainment first, not for politics.
All I have to say now is that I say Goodbye to this show, it was fun while it lasted.
Only found your Channel last month IDK WHY IVE ONLY FOUND IT NOW! Love being part of this fandom☺️
I don't hate or think Chris is a bad writter he's just not good for doctor who
nathan 〈3 football I think what most people hate is that fact that he turned Doctor Who into a political show first. I mean, he exclusively only hired people who were known for political plays to write for the show in series 11 and kept them as writers for series 12.
He’s not a bad writer (I love 42 and Dinos on a Spaceship), if you give him an idea for a story he can write one that would work, but he was WAY too heavy on the political crap.
Yo Crispy, good video man I enjoyed it. I would say though, if you're gonna do about what people think about Chibnall and why, you should definitely talk in-depth about his two biggest decisions to date (The Doctor being a woman and The Timeless Children). I agree with you that I don't think we've seen the whole picture with TTC yet, and I understand you're probably going to go into more detail about these topics in other videos, but they're topics that have largely shaped people's opinions on Chibby. No hate intended, I love your videos and I think Chibnall is doing a fine job so far, but i'd like to have seen your opinion on these topics, even if you just linked another video about them where you went more in detail, especially when they seem to be the two biggest reasons Chibnall is getting hate at the moment. Look forward to the next one man :)
Michael Sheen for the 14th Doctor. I just want Doctor Who to be fun and thrilling again and once again strive to tell great stories
I remember being on board with Chibnall at the beginning. His work on Torchwood was pretty good, and, although I didn't like his work Doctor Who too much, his last episode did seem to touch a lot more of the domestics of Who, and Arthur Williams was a nice character. I even watched Broadchurch and liked it quite a lot.
When a female Doctor was announced, I wasn't all that on board, skeptical to say the least, but said I'd always give it ago. He said he didn't cast her for a gimmick so, I trusted him.
But, now, I really do not like his Doctor Who. Although it's clear Whittaker wasn't cast just because she's a woman, and she does her best with the role, this writing is pretty abysmal. The amount of changes he has made has given me the impression that he's kinda arrogant, but that's just me, I guess.
Never try to explain why other people feel the way they do - simply ask them.
For me, I found the writing (script, subject and character dialogue) to be so bad that I genuinely believe Chibnall doesn't actually like Dr Who and is actively sabotaging it.
Ever since 13 I cannot watch a single episode without cringing out.
If he stays for the 60th anniversary I would want to see Eccleston, Tennant, Smith, Capaldi and Whittaker's doctor face of against Simm, Gomez and Dhawan's master with Captain Jack and River Song in it as companions
I miss the light humor that Moffat and Russel were able to give to Doctor Who, I also miss the special appearances that today have become mere references in the series.
It's simple he can't write sci-fi to save his life 😎👍
One thing that might have improved it is if Graham wasnt travelling with them and instead they treated him as a Jackie Tyler esc character. Too many in the tardis, but doing this would allow them to build the characters of ryan and yaz.
I don't think Chibnall deserves ALL the hate he gets but there are a lot of things that could be improved...
I remember the RTD era being the era when literally everybody was talking about the show, the hype was amazing!!!
I was so excited for the TARDIS Team!
*The first retired companion*
*The first dyspraxic companion.*
*The first police officer companion.*
It felt like we were gonna get 4 different perspectives on the TARDIS. To me, it sounded like the dream team. And then we got Yaz, Graham and Ryan. Whilst I think the actors are great (minus Tosin) the characters had so much potential. I think Yaz has the most; so I'm excited for s13. PLEASE MORE CHARACTER DEVELOPMENT FOR YAZ!
@@_MyNameIsAJ_ me too! yaz as a character has sooo much potential, a trainee police officer with a troubled past that needs a get away from her family. its like she was _made_ to travel with the doctor, I just wish they'd array her policing skills more. hopefully with her (probably) being the only companion next series, the writers will focus more on her characterization.
We finally had a police officer in the police box, but it was almost never mentionned in 2 series
I was very scared to watch season 11 and 12 for the first time because of all the criticism, but your video really helped me be a little hopeful to what’s to come. Thank you!!
Interesting to see what happens with season 13 & how it may have to change given the current situation - I’m sure theyre rewriting as we speak as they’re supposed to start filming in September & with social distancing hanging around for months to come it’ll be interesting to see how they handle it & the problems it causes 🤔. I guess if they are binning some companions in the special then that’ll make things a bit easier
I appreciate your balanced outlook crispee. 👍
Should have been Toby Whithouse as the show runner instead of Chris Chibnal. I do agree with you that at first I thought he’d be a good show runner following his Torchwood episodes and Broadchurch and a few of his Doctor Who. Oh how I was wrong.....
Channel Pup was actually the kid who invented the abzorbalof
I agree that series 13 will probably be his best. Series 11 was criticised for not being ambitious enough, and then series 12 went a bit overboard and became too ambitious, so hopefully series 13 will be a perfect balance...
Channel Pup is the Kid who created The Abzorbaloff
Indeed he was!
Channel Pup channel pup...
Now that’s a name I’ve not heard in a long time a long time
Loving the Heart heart the doctor during the transitions, That really takes me back 👌🏻
I don’t understand why chibnall’s era has soo little chatter development, is not like he doesn’t know how to do it. He wrote Cyberwoman, countryside, kiss kiss bang bang, end of time and exit wounds torchwood episodes that have a massive character development in my opinion
And Broadchurch is known for character development. Maybe he could have done that correctly if there weren't that much companions in the Tardis.
Damn this channel's legs! Whoo!!!
I honestly don't understand it. Sure, S11 wasn't the best, but it wasn't bad, and S12 was amazing. The timeless children didn't change much lore wise, S11 was a breather season, and Jodie's been amazing imo.
I very much like this comment. My thoughts exactly
@@CrispyPro Thank you. It makes me happy that I'm not the only one.
@dr103 Exactly!! Like, I see a lot of nitpicking about the whole infinite regens, but if you think about it, the doctor was going to have enough regens to keep selling Doctor Who, so that was of benefit, and Chibnal wrote it in a way that makes the 1st Doctor still technically the 1st Doctor and minimally impacts anything, if at all. I hope we see Ruth again in fact.
Lex Gaming s12 was better entertainment wise. But the timeless child has ruined so much lore in so many areas eg the other. The timeless child has broken the show.
S11 is bad tho
I really like how you put your ideias out... No hate, just opinions.
no the chibs era has been abysmal ending with an episode that is even worse than "the twin dilemma" and "time flight".
Chris was the show runner ish for torchwood series 1 and 2. Russell took over for children of earth.
In my opinion, for most of the doctors in the reboot, with the exception of Matt Smith, their last series is the best and the writing gets progressively better over time. We must hope that this will also be the case for Jodie Whittaker if she stays for series 13.
Matt Smith had amazing writing on his last season.
He reinvented himself after losing his friends, became dark and serious, behind a thin layer of fun and whimsical, moved onto a cloud in the sky!
Matt had the
Name of the Doctor, which asked the question "Doctor Who?" and yet it didn't ruin anything! The Doctor stayed mysterious, and his name is still a secret. He time traveled to his own grave!
Day of the Doctor
(Movie in 180+ countries. The biggest point in doctor who history)
Was amazing, had 3 doctors including the phenominal John Hurt. The Doctors visited eachother, the past, gallifrey, and their riffing off of eachother was fantastic.
And Time of the Doctor was an amazing christmas special.
11 died with dignity, and in his last moments, he wasn't vain like 10, or broken like 12, he was strong and optimistic like 9. Not to mention his regeneration was the biggest ever, with the energy wiping out an entire dalek fleet! Matt's Doctor even phoned the future before he changed just to reassure his companion. He cared so much.
It was sad, happy, kind, and powerful.
Ppl give Matt a bad rap because he came after their favorite doctor. No one gave him a chance, but he was great anyway. Similar to Capaldi. Even Matt himself feels that the fans didn't like him when he was doing the show, but he was amazing.
5:52 I don't think people hate Chibs' political messages of the show just because they're there or because of Whittaker, but more because he delivers them so badly. Particularly in Arachnids in the UK, Orphan 55 and Praxeus (the rest aren't really that bad imo) it's just so in your face and delivered nonsensically.
He takes an already established story and makes it so it suits him. It's like we're the older brother and he's the little sister with our toys playing tea party. *GI JOE DOESN'T WORK WITH A BRATZ DOLL WE ALL KNOW THAT*
Broadchurch was good, but that I think was mostly carried by the actors. When watching it, there was just simply far too much convenience. Characters would do stupid things despite them supposedly knowing better, and he almost always resolved things by the answer just falling into the characters laps.
Seriously what did they think casting him! This man didn't even have any actually good doctor who episode in RTD and Moffat era... His best one was the Silurian 2-parter and it kinda was a less-good reboot of Doctor Who and the Silurian from the 3rd Doctor era . He wrote the god damn CUBES episode for fuck sake
He was good in broadchurch but yeah crime dramas and sci-fi aren't exactly the same
his episodes are like sand there rough and coarse and get everywhere
Out of his previous dr who episodes the hungry Earth two parter was my favourite chibnall episode, that episode was soo goof and the supporting actors were amazing
Chris Chibnall, for me, broke me by the end of series 12. That’s not me being dramatic but I found series 11 to be incredibly disappointing, for many reasons (under developed characters, simple plots which go no where and a Doctor who did not feel defined to just name a few). Series 12 has me hooked, based on the mystery alone, and the characters did improve but the Timeless Children smashes whatever the show could have done instantly and mistreated the Cybermen, the Master and The Doctor all in one go. I think he can be a good writer but I genuinely want him to leave sooner rather than later.
I don't think we know enough to be able to tell if the timeless child breaks the show or not. It can, it has the potential, but it doesn't have to. It can be that the master lied. It's possible they are not in the same universe as where the Doctor is originally from. (MI6 was never prepared for an Alien invasion? Where were they for the past 38 seasons? Huge clues all over the place that this is a different universe, or huge plotholes, depending on how this all works out).
But even if it's all true and the Doctor is the timeless child, it's a long-long story and every episode starts with a mystery that gets unraveled by the end of the episode. The Doctor being more than a mere Time Lord has been a theme often during the show. There were hints in classic who and new who that he might have had more regenerations than what we know of. It's not new. 12 or 11, I don't remember which, but one of them even said once he might have been a woman once, but he doesn't remember.And BTW there was the arc of the Silence and 11 where it was thought for a while that his name was the oldest question of the Universe and at the end it turned out it was transmitted through time by the Time Lords, yet until we knew this I don't remember any uproar that this breaks everything, even though if his name was somehow really and truly the oldest question in the universe that would have made him an integral part of creation, but people instead waited to see how it plays out. It baffles me that so many 'fans' would abandon the show while as of yet we have more questions than answers and for sure I would not leave my favorite show ever and let it die just because it has a few years that are not as great as those that came before. If we let it die it will die with Chibnall, but if we someone else might make it right. If Chibnall really breaks it (the jury is still out on that for me), I would even welcome a Bobby Ewing moment. :D
Man, I was on the side of Moffat, I admittedly wasn't keen on Matt Smith's era, but I loved the Capaldi era and thought Moffat did a great job, I couldn't understand why people thought he was the worst thing ever. It feels really bad to now really dislike the showrunner, because I love this show, I've loved it since before Eccleston, I love the sixth Doctor era, I love the awful sets of the Classics, I love the bad acting in the first couple of Doctor's eras, but this new era... it just ain't for me.
I really, reeeeally gave season 11 a chance. I loved the trailers and the production quality. And I know people have said there's a lot of reasons to hate Chibnal's Doctor, but I only need one. It's NOT EXCITING. It feels empty and dull, it's not thrilling, there's no mystery or charm. I've recently rewatched season 5 and... You know what? This is probably the best season of TV that exists. Doctor Who can be a masterpiece. Where is that now? The Doctor did really rise higher than ever, and so now... Now the Doctor has fallen.
That's because it's a tradition to hate the current showrunner, Moffat was hated during his era but now he is praised like a god.
And Chibnall was 16 when he criticized Colin Baker's era, he was still a teenager beginning in criticism. At this age you're not completely mature yet and it's normal to make mistakes and don't always think about your words. He even realized his words were means and apologized a year later. I'm more worried by 30 years old adults who only think about hating and are not capable of doing actual criticism without insulting the team. At this age you should be a minimum mature.
I think Chris Chibnall's best move would be to have season 13 be all returning villians including the weeping angels, sea devils, vashta nerada, sontarans and a multi master finale
moffat: all 2 parters chibs : no 2 parters
i like chibnall even though series 11 was dull apart from a few episodes i liked. series 12 to me is the best series in years and i am excited for the next special and series 13 moffat is the better doctor who writer but his last 3 years in charge almost stopped me watching but chibnall has brought the excitement back for me and i am curious to see the timeless child story and how that finishes
Even with Moffat's comment about the whole 'The show isn't canon' etc... I still think there needs to be SOME sort of respect for previous eras that were written. Even if it's just a nod here and there to at least TRY to connect some pieces together so we still feel like we're in the same show and atmosphere. I can genuinely understand that Chibnall may want to make his era a completely new take and maybe even try to make it stand out from the others, but forgetting majority of the show's past and all of the previous things that have been set up for you isn't the way to do this.
The previously established canon (if there even was one) still holds up to this day. What Chris wrote is merely expanding on what we already know and what has been hinted towards multiple times before.
@@gazda69 I agree it's been hinted at, but I disagree that it still holds...
Ruth Doctor shouldn't have had a TARDIS when it was Hartnell's Doctor who was the one that first ran away... even if she happened to have a TARDIS don't get how it's in the shape of a police box?
11th Doctor's regeneration and how it was meant to be the "last one" means nothing now as we know the Doctor clearly had more as they're the original person who had regenerative abilities... so the Time Lords giving him more was also useless.
All of the hints towards the Doctor's mother like the mysterious woman in The End of Time (which RTD even said in his head it was the Doctor's mother) and the woman that came in the Barn every now and then in Hell Bent now means nothing, as we know the Doctor's original parents are from wherever the portal thing came from.
Clara should've seen all of the previous Doctor reincarnations when she jumped into their timeline but didn't.
There are just so many pieces now in the show that don't make sense due to the arc and conclusion of Series 12. I appreciate that Chibnall wanted to build more on the Doctor's character whilst keeping mystery to them like where they really came from... but he's caused more damage than actually trying to fix and build things. It's like trying to fix something that doesn't need to be fixed, and now it's only caused more issues.
@@YourPalSammy You have to remember that the Series 12 finale didn't exactly confirm or deny any of what was shown to the Doctor in the Matrix. The only confirmation we have of anything is what the Master tells us (and he's not exactly the most sane or trustworthy person, now is he?). Then there's also the thing about those fake memories in the Matrix that were a cover up for what actually went down, and how there are still many important memories regarding the Timeless Child locked away. All the incosistencies you mentioned are either misdirections or purposefully yet unexplained. All will be revealed in the following seasons.
In conclusion, the S12 finale was merely introducing the idea of the secret origins of the Time Lords, not lore-breaking confirmations. It's way too early to complain or argue about "plot holes" when there's still so much we don't know.
reverseriot I have faith that some of my points will be answered in future Seasons so they’ll make more sense... but I just highly doubt ALL of them will be explained, there are too many for Chibnall to make sure he gets around to all of them. But at the same time he did create those inconsistencies in the first place so... anything he does won’t change the fact that they were inconsistencies, even if he explains them, he waits far too long and drags it out so much that the fandom (including myself) get sick of it and just waits for him to finally piece stuff together he could’ve done the previous Series.
In my opinion, Series 11 was a waste. If Series 11 had the arc of Series 12, along with the Ryan & Graham arc of Series 11, and mix & match of the best episodes of both Series that still made sense plot-wise and character-wise, then this era would be off to a brilliant start. But unfortunately this never happened. I’d believe that things will be explained and told to us in the future, but given some of the decisions Chibnall has made since he became show runner, I doubt he’ll actually do what we’re expecting.
At the moment I am loving Jodie's era, I really hope Chris brings back Omega, Rassilon and the Monk in Series 13
same this is the most i have being excited about doctor who since matt smith series i am excited to see what series 13 will be like
I finale found my people amongst the hate
Because *Chibnall PLAGIARISED ''Supremacy of the Cybermen''* (2016) comic book frame-by-frame in 17 plot points - for Timeless Children (2020): sta.sh/01rvbzw5n23d - mostly 12th Doctor storyline. Also Lady in the Lake (Big Finish), Cartmel's Masterplan, origins of the comic character Doomsday - as noted by ClownFishTV - (The Crawling Terror by Mike Tucker for the Tesla episode, B-Where did a vid on his ''repeat'' stories ...) In 2017 I was all up for the Chibnall and Whittaker setup! OMG! Wrote a fanfic about it! Now I wholeheartedly despise it: Hartnell's 1st Doctor mellowed through time and found kindness and sympathy in humanity and //added those important traits// to himself - through Big Finish the 6th Doctor amplified them to the peril of his own destruction, 10th died for Wilf and the 12th Doctor even crossed that line and straight up exploded himself to momentarily save those who, in the long term, had no hope of survival. It's called character growth. Courage to do what's right. Especially for another. Chibnall's writing is retrograde and sociopathic: so is acting of everybody (except Walsh) and there is NO character growth, either within the series or looking as a whole: Yaz person tweeted that she doesn't understand why people cry when watching something - she's an actress and //doesn't understand// how to move people's emotions?!! What does she think acting is???!!!! Whittaker is self-centred and ''just talked to Tennant'' in her preparation for the role, fully backed up by Chibnall - that's NOT how you prepare to take on 54 years old mantle. It's UNMOVING and UNCONVINCING, stunted, arrested development, very tiny, empty, feelingless, cold, moronic (as in ''notably stupid or lacking in good judgment''), nasty, insulting, there's no team build up, heck - there's no team to speak of, the stories are badly told, it's like NOTHING - about this character or previous lives or plot points - MATTERS, there's no continuity. It's like she's completely separated, cut off from everything that a known Whoverse makes - therefore the show is now establishing a New one. ... I'm not on board. I won't sing ''wake up'': when watching this I feel depressed, repelled and disgusted - you're not supposed to feel disgusted by Doctor Who! Had Emily Cook not made the brilliantly engaging watchalongs, I'd be completely out of this fandom by now - as is, got reminded that not all is bad and I can just censor last three years as if they never happened and still enjoy the good, brilliant, silly bits. The thing is: they had all the means to make a mark and do something awesome. Wouldn't it be wonderful if instead of Jack being abused to bump up the ratings, two arcs ran simultaneously and Ashad (= joined ''CyberRose'' and ''angry, emotional 10th CyberDoctor'' from the comic book) actually represented clear danger throughout the S12? While ''discovering'' the Masterplan - which was NEVER Cartmel's intent, see his interview on the Traveling Tardis: it was supposed to remain a mystery - revealing it - is UNNECESSARY. It //means// nothing and contradicts 54 years of character development - making it irrelevant and throw away. The Doctor was a relatable, regular oddity, nerdy nosy parker, tinker and meddler, //trying// to beat the odds, risk it and do what's good and right. But now? Who, except those completely delusional, can now relate to a God ... Who can relate to a void of a companion? Who feels elevated and energised by a two-tone ambiance music? I'll keep an eye out on S13, just to document the next plagiarisms under which Chris Chibnall signs his own name, without any credit to the true creators. And then I hope that under new showrunner the series will become lively and happy and thoughtful and moving (possibly referenced but not plagiarised) again. P.S.: Talk to Problembeing: dropped a note in one of The Rabbi From Another Planet (Tzvi Lebetkin) chats that Dinosaurs on a Spaceship were a script sent to the BBC by ''somebody with a blog on the web'' and how bitter they are for Chibnall nicking the script - I can't find that blog, but if you could only pump Problembeing for the information further, I'd appreciate it.
Chris Chibnall's Doctor Who is the tv equivalent of " The Emperor's New Clothes! "
Series 11 presented a woman who claimed to be the Doctor but didn't act like the Doctor!
The Tardis, once established as a living entity, suddenly became an old car that needed repair!
Several episodes hinted that something was medically wrong with the Doctor, but that was forgotten by series end! The only redeeming feature of 11 was the relationship between Graham and his grandson! Series 12 arrived with Graham and his grandson acting as though they were complete strangers! Orphan 55 happened! ( The worst episode of Doctor Who ever recorded! ) Chibnall stole other writers storylines! Paul McGann's stories stopped being cannon! The acting ability of the entire cast deteriorated as each episode passed! Chibnall created another female Doctor, just as a story gimmick! Jodie Whittaker continued to gurn her way through every performance, unable to act at all like the Doctor! Chibnall rewrote the Timeless Child storyline by replacing the Master's name with that of the Doctor!
If CC does not read any comments (good or bad) then he seriously needs to, the fans are his life blood and writing and plotting in isolation isn't the best way to gauge your audience
My problem with the Chibnall era isn't the "SJW political agenda yadda yadda yadda" it's that his whole run so far has been painfully substandard for Doctor Who. From the substandard actors he cast to the substandard writing of episodes and other generally poor choices the whole shebang has been disappointing for me as a long-time fan and I'm looking forward to his departure from the show so we can hopefully get better creatives in charge again.
I think Chris, while definitely being the least good showrunner of new Who so far, knows what he's doing. Some of the criticism he gets is valid, but the hate you see on _some_ corners of the internet is totally blown out of proportion.
The backlash he gets for the reveal in the S12 finale is stupid, considering that the episode itself didn't confirm anything and actually went out of its way to remind us that the Doctor is still who she is, no matter her true origins.
I myself used to dislike the idea of pre-Hartnell Doctors, but S12 actually really warmed me up to the idea and i can't wait to see where the writers are going with it.
Yeah, I'd say I agree with around 100% of this comment. I feel Series 12 is actually just slightly above standard-quality Doctor Who, and actually has a much more entertaining personality than 11. 11 was just bland and kind of dull imo
People hated it because it kills the mystery of the character and just turns him into a chosen one, probably one of the blandest story telling device clichés
Before I say my piece I will say that you are entitled to your opinion.
Yes some of the criticism like purely the fact that the Doctor is female is bloody ridiculous. I adored Missy and a female Doctor could work. But not with Whittaker and Chibnall involved. Missy was played by a brilliant actress who loved the show. She had great writing and an excellent arch. Honestly she's the first revival Master minus Jacobi that I really thought, filled Delgado's shoes. Her character also wasn't centered around her gender. She had other CONSISTENT aspects to her personality and could do more than two facial expressions.
Jodie dislikes and disrespects the show and fandom. Her interviews have made that more than clear. I don't think someone who lacks all respect and passion for the show should play the Doctor. She insulted all past era's through her "celebrating white male gaze" comment and refused to watch past Doctor who because "she couldn't get into it" yes that decision was affirmed by chibs the idiot but she originally made it. This both shows a lack of dedication as an actor and makes it even more obvious that she has no understanding of the character she's playing. She didn't originate it yet has the gall to take on a decades-old role without researching the character. This is just my problem with her being the Doctor due to her lackadaisical attitude. (she also complained about doing 11 episodes when other Doctors were paid the same for 13). She only seems to care about what agenda she can push with the role.
As for her acting, it is incredibly bland and poor. Yes, she was fine in Broadchurch but she didn't have to carry the show and drama is her strength. She is obviously out of her depth with this scifi show. She lacks charisma, likeability, passion, gravitas, and versatility. Unlike past actor's she can't transfer her abilities over into scifi. She frequently comes off as genuinely incompetent, excessively callous, selfish, and cowardly. Not traits associated with the Doctor. And also appears to only be able to do mildly depressed and hyperactive child. (As well as one or two bad Tennant/Smith impressions) There's no depth to her, something an actor should at least add to the character. (Yes certain aspects are due to the abominable writing but a good actor can elevate bad scripts. Capaldi did it through half his tenure). In short, my issue isn't with a female doctor. It's with JODIE as a female Doctor.
The companions are also poorly written. They almost never challenge the Doctor, do everything she says, and has no real connection with her. That last part is one of the most important parts of the show. The speech about Yaz being great actually mad me laugh since she was proactive all of one time. Grahm is the only marginally interesting one. The only arch they had was the Grahm/Ryan relationship and that was patched up last season.
Chibs also can't write worth a damn, especially since he no longer has to answer to anybody. He's thrown character arches out the window for the sake of getting a rating bump by bringing in an old villain (ie screwing over Missy). And his stories are poorly constructed. He's actually ripped off a lot of things done by better writers. (the fam are fugitives like in Sound of Drums, Zellin was a rip off of the nightmare man from SJA, and the skithra were racnoss rip offs, the kasavan design also looked suspiciously like the cybermen in army of ghosts). He sets up conflicts and villains that get defeated in less than five minutes leaving almost no stakes. His writing for the Doctor is inconsistent as she seems to have forty-nine different personalities and for all he goes on about how brilliant it is to have a female doctor, the writing hasn't embraced that. Take out all the crummy potshots and lectures towards males in the show (who seem to often be portrayed as the villain or jerks) and place a male in Jodie's role and the plot would largely play out the same. Character and story also take a back seat to agenda-pushing (doctor who has been political which i don't mind but rarely sacrificed story and character development like chibs the idiot has). Chibs can't write good stories and that's that. Even his ones prior to being showrunner were very weak and Cyberwoman is considered the worst torchwood episode by many.
As for the timeless child being the Doctor, it is a pointless retcon, there are no consequences which means that there was no point to doing it besides chibs the idiot wanting to do something big to leave his mark on the show (he did a big scorch mark). The timeless child opens up dozens of plotholes that I can happily go into examples being (Clara was in the Doctor's timestream, why doesn't she see the timeless child? How is river a timelady now? Why did neither the Doctor or Master notice this before when both have been in the matrix multiple times? Why do all other galiifreyans have identical biology to the Doctor like two hearts?) All these plotholes were unnecessary as are the other ones I haven't mentioned. The origin of regeneration is now just plain nasty as it comes from child murder/experimentation. Yet Tecte-canon-destroyer is presented as being a strong good female character as opposed to a sadistic homicidal person with no morals. At least Rassilon and Omega's badness was acknowledged. Regeneration coming from the time vortex is also a much more mysterious and enigmatic origin befitting of Doctor Who.
Now we don't know where the child is from. Big deal, what's important is what happened on Gallifrey and we know all that now. There's not much mystery left. It also screws the Doctor's character arch which started with Hartnell and developed all the way to Capaldi. Putting in pre-Hartnell Doctor's messes this up. And then there's the fact that the Doctor is now special. Sure they didn't know about these other incarnations but that doesn't change the fact that they are no longer an ordinary timelord who got sick of the stuff society and decided to take off and travel the universe. (The Cartmel Masterplan doesn't defend this as that was never completed and incorporated into the canon and Cartmel himself has stated the Timeless child doesn't complete it) They became special through their actions despite there being nothing special about them. One of the best messages of Doctor who was that anybody could be special due to their choices. Birth didn't matter. By making the Doctor the foundation for regeneration and by extension timelord society takes away that ordinary aspect and lessens the impact of the message. (B-WHERE's channel actually did an excellent and detailed break down of why the timeless child being the Doctor is so bad and I recommend it as it explains it better than I can in one comment)
The Timeless child being the Doctor deserves all the hate it gets (if it had been an unknown character it wouldn't be so bad or destructive). Like for many other long-time fans it is also the final straw for us and has entirely killed our love of the current show. (I'll always adore Hartnell-Capaldi) And that actually breaks my heart. Maybe one day the show can regenerate with a good actor and good showrunner but until that time RIP Doctor Who (1963-2017)
1 none of the actors had previous experience or knowledge of the series
2 hes done literally everything he used to complain about the writers lol
3 he writes no depth for any of the companions we've got so many you never get to know them (does anyone else remember yazz is a police woman? I barley did since it was only mentioned once but was referenced to being integral to her character )
4 Jodie could have been amazing if she had even a smidge of knowledge of the doctor ( I mean hell if she know anything about the doctor she probably would have refused to rewrite the entire show she just had no idea that was as big as it was )
just listened to doctor who: Zagreus by big finish, handled regeneration in such a better way with rassilon than chib did
2:43 Chibbers looks unrecognisable tbh - at first I didn't think it was him 😂😂
i think more than anything the bbc are stuck for options to replace show runners for dr who, who do you know of is: a life long fan of the show, can write for all ages, interested in sci-fi & has great management skills!!
I'm theorising that people will get you to get an Absorbaloff tatoo
Series 12 was amazing. Chibnall is doing a great job.
I had forgotten he wrote for Torchwood, now I hope does a good job.
Tbh I agree on dinosaurs on a spaceship being Chris’s best DW episode (before he took over)
I wonder why its such a mystery guess we will never know
I think, for me, the main problem with series 11 was the lack of old, classic monsters. I don’t think there were even any new villains that The Doctor had heard of before (correct me if I’m wrong on that). For most of it, The Doctor was just like, lI don’t know anything about this villain, I don’t know what to do.l Although I really loved how Rosa was written. With s11 IMO everything was just too “new”. There wasn’t really anything where The Doctor was like, “I know this villain, I know what to do here, let’s go!” Even with the pting episode, I didn’t mind the creature itself (I actually quite like the little guy), or the characters, but the episode as a whole could have been written a lot better. That’s just my opinion, though.
I am just disappointed because I don’t think Chibnal is bad he is just ok. I just think that Davies and Moffat set high standards.
I don’t dislike him he just isn’t my favourite writer and definitely not what I expected
About the future of doctor who? The most important thing is I am just really hoping it does'nt get canceled (ever)
You mean canceled again?
Same
It won't
The most frustrating thing is that everything about this era is either bad or painfully average. This looks like you just fed a computer the scripts for every other episode and asked it to write a new season. The companions aren't annoying they're just there, cardboard cutouts for the doctor to talk to. The doctor doesn't have a personality, she just seems like a combination of rejected dialogue from Smith or Tennant.
Here are my thoughts on Chris Chibnall: he's an ok showrunner and that I expect that the more seasons of his run, the better he gets (what I found with Steven Moffat at the time he was showrunner were that thins were a a little much of a drag with Matt Smith as the 11th Doctor, but things picked up a lot more and made the show enjoyable again (for me, anyway) as soon as Peter Capaldi became the 12th Doctor and had that sense of variety to the show in any aspect of it)
Dinosaurs on a Spaceship is amazing
Unfortunately he is hated because he is average and mediocre to the worst writer of the show.............and he was not right for show runner and his only good episode was in the Davies era, tbh, gotta hope that he doesn’t have a future in Doctor Who. Perhaps touchwood, but no more doctor who
I think a major problem with Chibnall’s run is the toxicity from both camps. But as someone who isn’t currently enjoying the show. It is probably the ham fisted attempts at lecturing about social issues where Doctor Who has been so graceful so far. So many of Chibnall’s supporters are unable to separate that problem from those who follow the #notmydoctor weirdity
Hoping series 13 will be wonderful if he keeps on this arc.
Just like Moffatt, Chibnall is a very hit and miss writer. I do like most of his episodes before he tuck over, I like Jodie’s Doctor but it is the writing that is the problem.
Channel Pup, but if each Doctor is a new reboot, then it shouldn’t be connected to the past, if this is a Doctor Who reboot then why is it still connected?
New subscriber here, I vote for a slavin tattoo! ^_^
I think the problem is one of unreasonable expectations. I don't think any showrunner will ever be able to live up to the internet's expectations about the show. Just think what people would have said about the classic series if the internet was around then, the show wouldn't have lasted! Ending comment now before it turns into a "back in my day" rant.
Anyone else feel that the Rosa episode used a recycled timeless script? The whole episode felt more like a episode of timeless then Doctor who. Also the whole timeless child thing is BS. It could have been a great twist if the master was the timeless child,and would explain a lot,but NOoOo,the doctor was made the timeless child and the whole timeline is F***ed.
The BBC killed the Dr Who legend not Chibnall though he certainly played his part in allowing as a talented writer for those who are so polarised, biased and woke to rubbish what licence fee payers paid for not just production of but the wages of all involved. The true hard grit fans of Dr Who who saw it trashed won't be conned again into watching a future series allowing those who failed them so miserably and pathetically to gain anything except a notoriety for delivering the final exit and exit is where they should be; end of.
I don't hate Chibnall at all. There are certain good elements there, but he's rather short changed the Doctor (not authoritative enough, always questioning herself) and both Ryan and Yaz (they're both pretty much cyphers who bring nothing to the show aside from their ethnicity and gender). The only character that felt like an actual person was Graham: too bad he's leaving the show. In future, I hope he brings in advisors with more experience with Doctor Who to help punch up the scripts.
Dr Who has always dealt with politics of the day, however, the problem with the Chibnal era is that the issue is more important than the story. He even admits that he thinks of an issue that needs to be tackled and tries to shoehorn a story into that.
I clicked onto this video fully expecting to disagree with you to at least some degree, but I'm pleasantly surprised to say that I pretty much agree with all of the points you made.
Damn, thank you!
After RTD and Moffat, Chris Chibnall was always going to have big shoes to fill. For me, his writing lacks heart (which RTD and Moffat provided in spades) and the characters sometimes seem a bit wooden. Which is frustrating, because Broadchurch proves that Chibnall can definitely write scenes will of emotion, and well-developed characters! For some reason, it's just not translating to Doctor Who.
The political agendas flirted with all sides. 11 and 12 are heavily one sided. The whole point of this is to take something away. Maybe the timeless child is a bluff and it’s a way of punishing fans that don’t like Jodie. Either way it’s a pretty shitty thing to do.
You can say it’s great, if that’s what you think.
Reality it’s not.
Fact, there are way more people that are upset, angry and let down at what he has done. The main thing that people don’t like about Chris is. He is not writing the show for you.
It’s for him and how he sees the world. The show has never been retconned before. Show me one place where it has been retcon! Not add something that was never confirmed. When did the show say that Clara was never there when he stole the Tardis.
History does matter. THATS WHY SO MEAN PEOPLE ARE PISSED!
😂😂😂
I know everyone is telling they miss russel but i miss moffat to me 11th and 12th are best doctors
shd1 Certainly the best of the modern era.