The Insane Tumblr Scandal of Hivliving
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- Опубліковано 27 вер 2024
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One important detail: Years before "Israa" started writing Hamilton fics, she was writing fics for Hetalia and posting them on AO3. And according to the timeline of her life story, she wrote all of these Hetalia fics... while stuck in the Indian brothel.
Well a lot of Hetalia fics read as if they where written by someone trapped in a foreign brothel
@@emiliobustamante2401☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️☠️
😭😭
“she wrote hetalia fanfiction while stuck in an Indian brothel” might genuinely be one of the funniest sentences I’ve ever read
The brothel had good wifi
So like, I think the moral of the story is that there's only a total of twelve real people on the Internet, and they're all fighting with each other with dozens of sock puppets.
The entire internet is made up exclusively of Toby, MsScribe, and HIVLiving. Every person is at least one of them. The three genders, if you will.
At this point I forget who I am. Are you one of my sock puppets? Am I yours? What is happening
i'm the 13th person. Just kidding, i'm a bot. As a large language model
everybody is Toby and we’re all Bible fanfic
@@IsaacMayerCreativeWorksA+ reference there
12:03 absolutely losing it at the caption "sleepy hijabi" with a photo of someone who has clearly just tossed a blanket over their head
I clocked the twist of the story right there LMFAO
Alix, throwing a blanket over her head: is this a hijab?
I'm a Muslim, not a hijabi myself but some of my friends are and oh my God they go into so much effort. There are a lot of different wrapping styles and techniques meanwhile Alix just threw a blanket on like she's emperor fucking Palpatine
@@janjanbinks1710 I'm the opposite of you lol. Hijabi but not Muslim and I will say sometimes we throw something quick to cover ourselves if we don't feel like searching for a scarf and need a quick picture/video/or need to answer the door. Out of all the crap she's done, I think this little bit of criticism isn't really fair.
@@blueismylove3128 Ah, I understand. You can't really do a complex warp just to answer the door and cover up quickly.
the whole ursula/alix exchange truly reads like a cross-examination in ace attorney it's insane
get the ace attorney bot!
literally the first thing that comes to mind thinking about how ursula connects the dots between alix's school email and her twitter and just goes "alix, thats you" is just the mental image of alix having an ace attorney-style breakdown animation 💀
Omg someone lol.exe this I'm begging
@@glassphoenix9095 I can see the characters nervous animation as the psyche locks break
😊
"They were beefing hard; they were debating the morality of daddy-kink jokes" is the most Tumblr sentence ever spoken aloud.
How the goddamn fuck does that happen
@@WTFisTingispingishow did I misread "goddamn" as "hard"?
Being known by a Tumblr mistake IRL is a fate worse than death.
“Mistake” is… putting it extremely lightly. Mostly because it wasn’t an accident that she literally lied about having aids, even when people came to confide in her about their/a relative’s diagnosis. That’s not a mistake
@@VultureSkinsIt’s not a mistake in the accident sense, but it’s definitely a mistake in the “holy fuck what was I thinking, I’ll regret that for a long time” sense
@@VultureSkins "mistake" ≠ "accident." mistakes can be accidental but they don't have to be.
@@VultureSkins Fujos are a mistake in on itself to be honest and I'm so happy that lesbian spheres finally start to talk about how toxic and homophobic the community at large is tbh.
@@VultureSkinsIt was definitely a mistake, as in she miscalculated the impact of her actions and fucked up in a MASSIVE way.
What’s wild about this is that Alex would have gotten into infinitely less trouble if she just wrote the fanfic as a just white hiv negative weirdo lol
This was when "SJW Culture" was in full swing. Alix was concerned that, if she wrote her fic and was honest about her identity, people would come for her for appropriation.
@@Kintsugi23 calling writing fiction “appropriative” is only applicable in a few select instances anyway, but writing about an experience you haven’t had is way better than uuuh lying about being a sex trafficking victim
@@milkteamachine 100000%
Exactly! I think she got so far into the fandom morality police mentality that when she realized she wanted to write the kind of fiction that she condemned other people for writing, she had to concoct a whole web of lies to justify the cognitive dissonance of it all. She knew first-hand what kind of harassment writing "problematic" fic could get you in certain fandom circles around that era - because she was the one doing the harassing.
@@beek.4860 Absolutely. I think this is also why Alix freaked out so bad about the prospect of being doxed, getting cancelled, having her chances of getting into grad school ruined. She knew that, if the shoe had been on the other foot, she would have done everything in her power to destroy someone else who had done what she did.
Telling this story to a founding father would kill them.
Showing vanilla Hamilton to a founding father would kill them
I think Ben Franklin would have a good chuckle.
@orkleth nah he definitely would 😭😭
I'd kill to see them see this
Good
The apparent "real photo of Israa" is something else to behold. It literally looks like someone threw a blanket over her head pretending to be hijab and cranked down the gamma, it is not a selfie I think anyone could be proud of unless they were intentionally trying to hide their identity
How in the hell did people not pick on the fact that she was racefaking when she posted that oh my god
I honestly didn't process it as remotely hijab-adjacent, I just thought of _The Ring._
@@Eloraurora "You have to reblog this post or you'll die in seven days" energy
literally the SECOND i saw the selfies i knew immediately none of it was real
@@det-onator5270 Not necessarily the face. The hair, chest, and outline of the body are required, with some debate on what that should mean. Some people opt to cover their faces, sometimes also obscuring their eyes with mesh.
as an actual Indian lesbian named Izra this was WILD
Oof girl they were cosplaying as you
HELP ME@@janjanbinks1710
god tumblr is something else
Oof that must be sureal
.. or are you? Heyyyy Tumblr, Ursula here!
I saw someone on tumblr call out a "pedo ship" where the younger person was 30.
Yeah, I’ve seen that a lot in the OUAT Fandom.
Did the 30 year old at least look young or was this another "im a 20 year old minor" situation . . . again
It must be teenagers, right? Like, I can't imagine this being anything other than a child's lack of perspective. Y'know, like when a 16 year old stays that 26 is "old?" My brain can't rationalize it any other way
@@noinfo4789 it was Entrapta. She's kind of drawn in anime style so I guess her age is a bit ambiguous from appearances, but she's like a scientist and she definitely doesn't sound like a child. She's the mad scientist archetype.
@@JaylukKhan wait entrapta from she-ra? Was the ship entrapdak (entrapta/hordak) because if so that straight up doesn't make any sense in the slightest
(its obvious that shes not a child and their both consenting adults also isn't it a cannon ship?)
Ursula was acting like she was L in desth note with that interrogation 😭
I heard THE music playing in my head the whole time
Da na, da na, na, da na na na na na na na
issra adding new plot points to her backstory to win arguments is hilarious
its like when you add more stuff to your backstory in dnd for more proficiencies.
"I attack and kill you with exposure lasers-"
"NUH-UH! ACTUALLY I HAVE MY QUEER SHIELDS ACTIVATED AND YOUR LASERBEAMS EXPLODE!"
All is fair in love and fake war
my dad is the CEO of Marginalization and he can get your account deleted 💯
I think my "favorite" part was when people started questioning how "Israa" could be pregnant if she had a wife, so she started claiming her wife had actually been a trans woman this whole time
i don't agree with ursula on a moral level but "I have been [the Hamilton cannibal mermaid freak] for years" is a POWERFUL statement
as a tumblr user since 2014, i've seen a lot of bullshit, but reading "Alexander Hamilton is George Washington's sugar baby" felt like getting hit by a sniper
Black Senator George Washington kicked me in the face right before that
The spinaimbot kind
Im sorry but as a tumblr user since 2014 I've seen stuff like this so many times I'm completely desensitized, like the girls are writing Mehmed The Second x Dracula's Real Life Brother fanfic and putting in my tags
Actually he kinda was irl tho, I'm not sure how much I like it as a fanfic concept but it would be a fire insult to throw in the real guy's face if you ever got the chance
@@CFpandemic Luckily burr dealt with that problem long ago
Even after all this time, the line "I am not here to give you absolution, I am not the arbiter of morals" fucking slaps so hard and should be remembered forever.
literally sounds like Lucy Dacus wrote it
+
Kind of takes something away from it knowing that she believed she _was,_ in fact, the arbiter of morals, and proceeded to attempt to set Alix's entire life alight because _a teenager lied on the internet._
Kinda like the guy who said “you are a coward wearing the facade of a revolutionary” but he was talking about how people were horny for the robots in atomic heart
@@jacksyoutubechannel4045 Alix wasn't a teenager, she was 24 at the time. I'm not defending doxxing by any means, but alix was an adult who should've known better than to lie to such an extent and keep said lie going for multiple years, especially because she lied about being from multiple minority groups to harass people and gave medical advice when she was neither a doctor nor someone who lived with aids. Alix did far more than just lie, she led people on about serious medical issues and led harassment campaigns against people based on her fake identities.
Calling real-life history "source material" is both accurate and awful
it's a canon event, i can't interfere
What’s worse is that I think they were actually referencing the _musical_ as the “source material” and not, you know, the actual history 🫠
you know, I can't even work out if that's correct or not.
I assumed they were referring to the book Hamilton is based on
I'm gonna refer to every bit of history as source material from now on. Sounds fancy. 😂
Ursula was absolutely 100% in the wrong for doxxing Alix, but god that initial confrontation was wild. The fact Alix's initial response to being accused of faking multiple identities online was "nonono, they're real people, I just *stole/mimicked the identities of people I know IRL* to fake multiple identities online" is BONKERS
Didn't one of Ms Scribe's alts say the same thing?
honestly I think doxxing scammers is fine. she wasn't a child, she was in college. and she should have real life consequences for the shit she did
@@nunyabusiness164You're wrong.
@@nunyabusiness164 it isn't
@@nunyabusiness164should she face consequences? absolutely. Should she have been doxxed? Absolutely fucking not.
Absolutely screaming at the fact that Ursula repeatedly assured Alix that they weren't going to dox her because it was wrong, and then going back on their word and doxxing not only Alix, but their parents as well by revealing their full names. Like Alix isn't a good person, but Ursula sure ain't winning the moral high ground
The only use for the moral high ground in this world is to determine terminal velocity when you swan dive of it.
Right. Alix is a horrible person but to doxx her so thoroughly that they found her PARENTS?? wild
@@cemeterygxtes disagree here. Ursula had the power to threaten her and told her "don't delete".
It was an implicit threat that Alix took as a questionable situation, and Alix's repeated asks of "but will you dox me?" were very explicitly just a way to assure their safety.
As a pathological liar, Alix had trust on the other person's words and didn't read the fine print. She had already made her plan to escape long ago, and Ursula wasn't having any of it.
Dox the doxxer back, I call that karma. It's on her parents to have raised that little shit so badly.
@@nhaedzwero43 ok but was it necessary to doxx her parents, people who weren't involved.
@nhaedzwero43 friend when you are a) encouraging *doxxing* of all things--including the doxxing of her parents, b) blaming the stupid behavior of someone *entirely* on the parents while knowing nothing of the home situation, and c) psycologically analyzing the situation while being an outsider, you are not ok. yes, parent behaviors can influence children. yes, alix deserved to be reprimanded for her behavior. yes, alix does have some mental issues undoubtedly. but bro. you saw this entire video and those were your takes
Listen, i can see Israa's story being real... If she wasn't a teenager...
It reads off like an 80 year olds recounting of her life throughout the years, not something a 17 year old would say happened in 2 or 3 (?) Years.
honestly she couldve put her age as like. 27 and id believe the flowery language lmao
@@iwakeupandboomimaratthe flowery language was just standard on tumblr back then lol
this is EXACTLY what i was thinking
if she had just said that she was like...30? EXTREMELY believable for Tumblr back then
"Israa was a 19 year-old Chinese-Pakistani Muslim, with a wife named Mukta who was an 18 year-old (part?) Somali trans-lesbian Catholic raised in America"
Me, a history/world religions researcher with a girlfriend from north India, and thus very interested in the complex history between China/India/Pakistan: 𝗢𝗵 𝘁𝗵𝗶𝘀 𝗶𝘀 𝗴𝗼𝗻𝗻𝗮 𝗯𝗲 𝙜𝙤𝙤𝙙.
I was waiting for Israa to post about how hard it is being Pakistani in India but it just never came
@@QabimIt seems like Alix thought opposing difficulty for marginalised people means presenting a very marginalised person existing without facing any difficulty. Which isn't really surprising, their main interest was a musical that has slaveholder politicians played by black actors singing hip-hop songs
How could anyone read this and not instantly go "hey this totally bullshit".
what's the beef between China/India/Pakistan? I'm interested in country drama
@@idk_a_plantthe partition of india into india and pakistan was utterly brutal, with up to 2 million people being killed. Pakistan and india have basically been in their own cold war ever since, with multiple conflicts, paramilitary funding, and nuclear weapons construction. China and india also have multiple disputed territories, and have fought a war over it in 1967, with border clashes still going on to this day. Safe to say that being half Chinese, half pakistani in india isnt a recipe for a good time
i genuinely laugh every time i think about the fact that thomas jefferson helped to establish this country and "fought for the freedoms of it's citizens" (excluding anyone that wasn't white men) just for, over 200 years later, someone to make the miku binder thomas jefferson art. i think that is incredible
Miku binder Thomas Jefferson art where Thomas Jefferson himself was black, to be precise 😂😂
@@anastasiazellner47 THATS LITERALLY THE BEST PART like i know thomas jefferson is rolling in his grave at being portrayed as a black trans man
Fun fact. He didn't even want to enfranchise all white male protestants. He hated the Germans of all people. In the 1790s, Jefferson wrote that Germans would be the downfall of America.
i need anyone reading these comments to know i knew the artist who drew miku binder jefferson LMFAO they were in the roleplay community on deviantart. aside from drawing thomas jefferson miku binder they also roleplayed danny from game grumps as a trans man & kurt cobain overdosing iirc. roleplayed kurt at the very least tho and i remember it was sketchy. but from my personal experiences with them up until that point they were very chill & fun to write with
I like to think that before he died Jefferson found the monkey’s paw and wished to be famous and remembered. And 200 later we got Hamilton followed shortly after by miku binder Jefferson.
hearing Ursula ended up doxxing her KILLED me. After all that, after all that "i would NEVER EVER DO THAT unlike YOU" and "I am not an arbiter of morals", they ended up doxxing Alix still. This is truly the "everyone sucks in their own way" tumblr story.
This story is the very embodiment of "I hope to God I never meet ANY of you fucking people in Real Life"
Ursula is also a TERF and started bullying Eldena Doubleca5t (the last person who covered this story) because she wouldn't back her up in some drama with Sarah Z, who called attention to the fact that one of Ursula's friends reblogged TERF-y stuff. Alix was bad, but so was Ursula. There are no good people in this story.
LITERALLY THIS What Ursula did was a genuinely good thing, I’m never going to deny that, but the way they acted like a martyr during the whole thing really put a bitter taste in my mouth. For someone who claimed not to be the abrader of morals, reading the language they used really made them seem like they thought of themself like a moral savior. Really, the doxxing and how they seemed so determined to make Alix suffer after this was the nail in the coffin for how I feel about this person
Yeah, I was in their corner up until that part (and, while Alix was in the wrong, she did have good reason to be worried about a stranger grilling her- I'm just curious on why she didn't just block Ursula. Maybe she felt the need to justify herself?)
@@sunettas9738I feel she was too afraid to block because she DID dig up her personal info, and wanted to try and cover her tracks as much as she could while also trying to placate this person on the internet
Ngl tho Ursa was really weirdly obsessive about Alix's reactions, I would've been scared too
It is kind of funny that she lied about literally every aspect of her identity, yet apparently she was above using someone else's pictures
Probably because those could be reverse image searched
@@entrancedsnow7076 you can easily prevent it by flipping the image and editing it slightly like strategic cropping, slight color edits, general filter, grayscale. its pretty easy
So between this, MsScribe, Sarah Z’s Toby video, and Hbomb’s Tommy Tallarico video, I think “video essay unraveling someone’s years of lies” is a new favorite UA-cam genre for me
my mothers very proud.
Thomas Jefferson was the first American Sonic
I wonder how many Guinness World records Israa held
@@noodlespook6689nowhere near tommy tallarico, i'm sure. his mother's very proud
Ms. Scribe worked hand-in-hand with Clarabella for five years
ursula telling alix that "tumblr isn't as a big of a deal as you think it is" and then going off to email alix's university about tumblr drama expecting them to give a shit is some insane energy like what
THIS LMAO
I mean, to be fair. Alix was in the governing body of a social justice group in her university. That is the sort of thing that gets you a strong reprimand because of racism. Also, depending on the degree, this is the sort of thing that really, really doesn't fly.
imagine if alix actually fessed well enough that ursula never doxxed her... anyone up to write an RPF on this alt timeline?
I mean, the person is a cereal liar and completely untrustworthy. They're also a threat to themselves and others, so it kind fits with what one should do.
@@obyone878cereal lmao (and yeah it's fucked up)
I'm beyond floored that anyone thought Alix would like,,, be publicly reprimanded by their college over this? Especially in 2020. Like, yeah, what they did was shitty, but the idea of a REAL ASS UNIVERSITY publicly speaking out against Hamilton fandom drama is INCREDIBLY silly to me.
I'm honestly surprised if they didn't face _any_ consequences for the fraud (I'm guessing they decided it just wasn't worth it), but yeah, expecting anything publicly to come of it is pretty unrealistic. Sometimes if something is public enough, schools may end up asking someone to leave if their presence is causing problems for the school or other students, but this was such a niche internet thing that they were probably more baffled than anything else.
My guess is that the fraud was both small enough in scale and, presumably, undone, so it wasn't worth the efforts of any DA to bother following up on.
And, I probably don't have to say it, but nobody who was willing to donate to Israa is going to have the money to chase this thing down in civil court at extreme loss to themself just to recover a bit of face over the ordeal.
I can't imagine anyone in administration at the college I went to even being able to make sense of this. They were all like 50+, you'd need to sit down and explain what Tumblr was, what fanfics were, a good bit of internet culture for them to half-way get what everyone was so upset about
If the majority of colleges wont even go after students or teacher sexual predators, i would be astounded they woupd care about a white girl racefaking and committing fraud on tumblr.
yeah it very much reflects the community that was involved at the time- like only a teenagers understanding of reality could make them think that a university would take action on one of their students over things they did on tumblr.
"Not all stories have a point to them. Sometimes they're just sad and disgusting from beginning to end." I feel like that summarises this pretty well tbh
Sam O'nella quotes really do hit the hardest for me these days. In these trying times.😭
And this story didn't even have a dude who could eat an entire eel whole.
I was nodding along, completely on Ursula's side as they dug all this up and confronted Alix, right up until they went back on their word and *actually* doxxed her. That just tainted the whole thing.
"I am not the arbiter of morals", Ursula says right before doxxing another human being for morality reasons
Yeah thats pretty fucked up
@@kaitlin9288i am not the arbiter of morals" said Ursula, acting all moral and uppity for what seems to be several days while hounding a literal teenager who did something very stupid but ultimately mostly harmless in the grand scheme of things
I thought I was weird for seeing what they did was wrong because generally they’re portrayed as being “the good guy”. I’m glad that I’m not just being weird even if Alix DEFINITELY wasn’t in the right.
@@thehermit8618 While I wouldn't argue that Alix's actions were *entirely* harmless (she did lie to a lot of people who were in more vulnerable positions than she was), the moment Ursula doxxed her it stopped being about trying to help people and more about performing an act of retribution. Before, I could at least interpret their action of calling Alix out as well-meaning but very misguided. With the doxxing though, the only person Ursula was serving by doing that was Ursula
My 46 year old mother overheard me watching this and I tried to explain it to her but it required so much context that I think it just made her more confused 😭 like no mom I can’t explain miku binder Jefferson to you I’m sorry
Parents just don't understand.
I was asked what homestuck was by my mom and she wouldn’t just take “it’s an old web comic with too much bs going on to explain” for an answer since “it couldn’t possibly be that complicated 😒” so I spent 20 minutes trying to tell her about it until she finally gave up lmao.
@@supotter377(it could possibly be that complicated)
thankfully my mom and aunt are tumblr connoisseurs so it's a lot easier to explain them fandom drama than other members of my family
Well now I feel old (43)
Maybe a controversial opinion but most people are boring, and that's ok. You really don't need to come up with an elaborate backstory or fake minority status for Tumblr cred.
Indeed. I personally take great comfort in the belief that I'm not special.
But to contrast. The absolute calamity that results from when people do this to a degree that mirrors some Manichaean real life power struggles between hierarchy and nobility is a level of messiness that I am always in awe of.
unfortunately, teens kind of lack the perspective to understand that until it's hindsight
literally their story was soo insane like how did people even believe that ☠️
Back in my day we just made fandom insert ocs...this is why the trollsonas need to make a comeback.
While obviously Alix is the main villain here, there's also something really unseemly about the way Ursula acted in response. She can say whatever she wants about her intentions and interests; there is BARELY concealed glee at having her nemesis so thoroughly over a barrel on display, both in the chat log and in her subsequent posts.
yeah no ursula came off as a huge prick to me, too. i also dont think someone who doesnt care for identity politics would care that much about someone who, for the most part, provided helpful information had they not been an annoying nemesis.
@@coatimundi69 she has this 'tumblr isnt relevant' whatever thing going on and is acting like this as a full adult like definitely some kind of power trip lol
Yeah, the constant repeating by Ursula that she just wants an apology and won't dox Alix just made me more suspicious of Ursula's intentions. I think it was messed up to dox Alix after repeatedly assuring Alix that she wouldn't. I could maybe understand Ursula telling her college and her parents? But to share all her details with tumblr as a whole legit put Alix in danger.
As a wise Neopets player once said, "wow this place is a freakshow. I don't respect literally any of you people."
Yeah man Ursula gives me the creeps. The little bit where she's complaining about everyone (besides her bc she's oh so smart) being too dumb to see the lies is so teenaged to me. It's not that nobody else could have caught on, it's because only she was unstable enough to spend real life time piecing together tumblr drama for the vindication of getting back at someone over Hamilton fanfic. What Alix did was gross and wrong... But getting her school involved, posting addresses and family's names, and dragging her real identity out into the online fandom space was DANGEROUS. What if someone had been so upset about it they'd opted to irl stalk or hurt Alix or her family? Real blood could have come from this.
"participated in ace discourse" I knew at that point shit was gonna go wild
hitting my head against a wall
now I want a fight between Alix "im going to make up trauma and exploit it" and Onision "here's my actual traumatic childhood and how im VERY NOT TRAUMATISED AT ALL BY IT"
Alix would 100% adopt Onision's backstory into her own.
Onion boy would be more focused on alix being way younger than him
@@Meleedroit "If only we'd met just 5 years ago. You could have come stay with me, after your escape from the brothel"
@@victorloefThat is so onion
Who’s this Onision?
If I had a dollar for every time a fanfiction author used an array of sockpuppet accounts to generate a cult of personality among a fandom's it-crowd and harass users that produce content they find objectionable and then got exposed by an early victim, I'd be quite wealthy, because it keeps on happening because nobody ever learns anything.
Wait, does it? Who, besides this Alix girl, and to a lesser extent MsScribe, has done it?
@@neckpeck2738There’s another similar story from the Old Guard (comic book and then movie adaptation) fandom about a white-ish power user faking PoC status to validate fandom opinions. The callout post (insofar as those can be trusted) dates from 2021, so there’s your evidence that this keeps happening
@@neckpeck2738 you could also prolly add toby from My Immortal, although Toby just harrasses different accounts to harrass himself
"but enough about Lily Orchard"
i knkw of at least 3 one direction fanfic writers who made fake accounts to be their fan club, their haters, and their closest friends. they all got caught and all happened years apart
I misread the title as "Hiveliving" and I was hoping for a funny video into people who pretend to be ants or other insects blogging about what its like to live in a hive but instead I got hit in the face with a story that is absurd, infuriating, kinda sad and kinda funny all at the same time
Have you heard of the Facebook group where people pretend to be ants
Honestly that sounds kinda fun
L I F T
I can't believe that Alix kept going to the same school until graduation. If I got outed as having faked every single minority identity at once, to PEOPLE I SEE EVERY DAY. I would simply leave forever
I'm sure 99% of her classmates wouldn't have any idea about any of this, but I get it- I would definitely consider getting out of here in case this all got out and the like
If I was her and got "outed" I wouldnt just leave school, I would leave the country and live as a hermit in Lappland
I would simply pass away 🙃
For me it's the fact that she was in a SOCIAL JUSTICE GROUP in university. Like girl, how do you even show your face.
@@emiliobustamante2401not sure if it’s offensive to call Sapmi that, but don’t use the derivative for Sami, “lapp” is offensive. It’s not on the Wikipedia slurs list yet but it’s still not something you should say
I actually listened to a podcast about fandom drama and one of their episodes was about HIVliving and the scandal and they actually read "To Scale a Blue Sky" and apparently it was A) was FAR MORE explicit than tagged/rated on AO3, B) had some weeeeeeeeeird portrayals of race C) was NOT accurate to the queer/poc experience in the 1980s at all and D) was generally mid af
Alix doing literally exactly what she harassed and abused a bunch of other people for while also larping as an impoverished minority. Color me shocked
OMG are you talkimg about the SUPER niche Authors Note Pod, I listen to that episode too!
^^^ omg i miss author’s note (don’t like don’t listen) every day
i listened to that one too! knowing how bizarre the fic itself was makes this whole thing even funnier
@lischneider3701 by any chance do you have any links? Thanks
I think I'm a little too conditioned for horrific twists in these stories, because I genuinely expected the next part of the story to be that Ursula *was also Alix and "found herself out" so she could get out of this scott-free and continue online as a hero as Ursula* before they ended up doxxing her
Plot twist: Both of them are actually Toby.
@@bubblegum1366and also, somehow, Ms.Scribe
omg now i really wish this was true
Genuinely in awe that this wasn't the case.
holy fuck i got that vibe too during their conversation, it all felt so SCRIPTED almost??
Lying about doing humanitarian work in Gaza is vile on so many levels
My disgust for the actions Alix took aside, it's absolutely mind-boggling to me that she was in *college* while doing all this. I feel like this is the kind of thing someone should grow out of by the time they're 15. To continue doing it until your late teens/early twenties is absolutely wild to me, I can't even begin to wrap my head around the mentality behind it.
@@CindersSpot honestly yeah but i think a solid amount of this can be chalked up to immaturity. as OP said this is the kind of thing people do when they're 15 and stupid and i know people in their early 20s who have not quite grown out of the stupid-15-year-old phase yet. though mental illness probably helped here lol
@@CindersSpot oh yeah alix very very obviously had some underlying issues that needed help, but honestly you'd be surprised what people will do when they think they're anonymous and don't realize the potential consequences of their actions. it's a classic "web of lies gets too big to control and ends up controlling you" plot
literally how did they find the time to do this in college
Sheltered rich white kid who doesn't know how the real world works syndrome
According to one of Ursula’s posts, she started the whole charade when she was in her last couple years of high school, around 16-17, as this had been going on go at least a year or two before she was exposed, which was literally in her first semester of college
I think that last post hit one particular nail on the head- it isn’t that an HIV positive queer Muslim sex trafficking victim couldn’t exist, go to college, and meet a trans lesbian they want to have kids with all while living or planning to live in places that actively would love to see them dead. It is absolutely possible for a pair of human beings to check that many “marginalized group” boxes. But those people would NEVER spend their internet time writing that much Hamilton fan fiction or publicly talking about the intimate details of their lives, ESPECIALLY back then.
When I read a story, especially a Tumblr one, where someone checks 26 of those boxes and also talks about it constantly my BS alarm does go off, just because it does feel like thats not what someone would do if they were. I hit a few boxes myself, and I do discuss them sometimes, but it’s not like every message, post, and story I write ties back to one of them and I tend to downplay them.
People who tick those boxes (including me) also wouldn't forget massive central parts of our lives/identities until it was convenient to own the haters 💀 especially not if your whole personality is _constantly talking about yourself._
also, people can write and discuss things without having to live them. they just need to educate themselves. though a genuine experience is always more authentic
Agreed, like doctors, historians, psychologists, etc don’t need to live/have lived what they studied to know about particular subjects.
The emotional process of living those specific circumstances, however, are up to individuals who deal with it personally.
An example that comes to mind rn is Fullmetal Alchemist and how Hiromu Arakawa handled war veterans and their trauma. She studied a fuck ton about war and its effects on society but went and interviewed those who lived it first hand in order to grasp whatever she could of the emotional history and scarring it left on those individuals. That’s how you respectfully handle experiences that are foreign to you in works of fiction, imo.
And also when someone lies about being any identity... they _will_ fuck up. It's a question of when, not if. If I lied about... I don't know, being some ethnicity other than white, from somewhere else (let's say Philadelphia) I would inevitably get tripped up by someone saying "oh hey, what about X! You'd know about X, right?" or a little insignificant fact I wouldn't know enough to fact check, like mentioning a grocery store or brand that's not common in Philly.
It's almost like they're writing a... fanfiction project
If we tried explaining this to a founding father it would kill them a second time
I’d be down for that
pog
good
let's do it 😊
hell yeah
this isn’t related to the drama, but lizdexia (the author of the hamilton/washington fic) made fun of supernatural last year, and a fan exposed how she wrote explicit RPF about harry enten & nate silver (of 538 fame) before she went after and dated harry enten. she continued to write RPF about him even after getting with him and even had a reddit account where she talked about fantasizing about harry enten and nate silver together, along with a a lot of other details about their sexual relationship. so yeah, not a single normal person in this story 💀
Screenshotting this comment b/c what the fuck
No i refuse to believe anything you just said. On a fundemental basis i refuse to believe this could be true. I must. For my own sake
Okay I need to know more
@@sebastianissocool Why have you reminded me of this Sebastian I had nearly forgotten this
@@theMyRadiowasTaken I needed someone else to feel exactly as I felt at this exact moment.
Alix was in the wrong and there’s no doubt about that, but saying you’re not going to dox someone because it’s a crime and reassuring them repeatedly that their identity is safe and then proceeding to dox that person anyway just makes me really uncomfortable with portraying Ursula as if they’re in the right. Exposing Alix WAS something that had to be done as their lies obviously hurt people but they really didn’t have to commit a crime to do that.
Yeah. Also the fact that Ursula doxxed Alix because she deleted the blog feels crazy. I would rather the blog be deleted than continue to live in tags with the idea that the posts are still valid.
Yeah honestly it felt like she was lowkey blackmailing her. They both seem awful and out for blood
Yeah, what Alix did was horrible and so was what Ursula did, it just sounds like the first one wanted pity and to justify their awful fanfic/s as well as their opinions on some serious topics and the second felt all high and mighty and wanted to have the moral high ground over the first person despite themselves also being a terrible person. We can only hope they both have since learned from their mistakes, became better people and are doing well now despite all the terrible things they did some years ago, since it's difficult to prove whether that has happened or not.
To play the Devil's advocate, I suppose Ursula was sincere but got fed up with Alix's trying to weasel her way out of consequences and responsibilities. She kept lying and lying, and deflecting, and dodging, and at some point Ursula considered that the only way for her to actually deal with her shit was for her to be publicly unmasked.
Doesn't make it legal, doesn't make it moral, but I do think it can be considered mitigating circumstance.
@@WolfeurUrsula asked for it to be sent from alix's uni email so she could get personally identifying info. It was calculated. She likely was always going to
If you want to play devils advocate sure, but Ursulas conversation with Alix shows they were given final say on drafting the confession and that Alix was complying, plus that prior to Doxxing Ursula had the evidence of what Alix did that she could have posted herself to "bring out the truth" along with her conversation with personal info removed.
Ursula may have said she didn't want to make callouts but well she said the same thing about doxxing but she was apparently able to change her mind on that one.
Ursula didn't need to doxx to achieve what she was claiming to do and seems takes a vindictive glee in it after the fact so a devils advocate should probably take a slightly different angle
The fact that Ursula was chased off of the internet not for fully doxxing a teenager WHICH IS VERY MUCH MORE ILLEGAL THAN WHAT HIVLIVING DID, but for writing problematic fanfiction will never not be peak fandom tumblr to me tbh
p sure scamming people out of money is more illegal than doxxing actually
@@DoomCabbitIt definitely varies from state to state at least
True, when I first heard the story on Eldena Doubleca5t's channel, I felt bad for them since their efforts to help were being dumped on because of their strange fanfiction... but then the doxxing came up and I was like okay nevermind 😶
@@sunettas9738Yeah I’m pretty sure the doxxing is why Minerva took down her video.
Was izreel raised and lives in poor black neighbor hoods? Adopted and trained up in the same viewpoints, rights of passage and mentality? Otherwise isn't it just white guilt over stuff dead and buried decades ago only used by guilty white people and race baiters using both sides typically for financial gain(rarely power grabs) which just so happens to look like the possible motive behind the whole Hiv thing (attention confused for power) . As far as issues to discuss there's prison reform non racist (every side has people in prison family, family of friends, and basic human decency towards even the worst of the worst is something we as humans living howmany centuries after the Romans slaughtered each other in the colosseums for fun would want as character traits.
This is a solid example of why the line is “listen to people of color” and not “never question what a person who calls themselves poc says”. Listening to poc means giving value to undervalued voices where you can, not just blindly accepting any old stranger on the internet. Also, this is deeply crazy and I feel less stable for watching this video, and I believe that a goblin may yet climb out of my phone.
It sucks so bad that even genuinely very good norms that were put in place for a reason can and have been abused and misunderstood like this. "Listen to poc/women/victims etc" okay but which ones? Cause they don't all agree. Like at all. As most groups of humans don't. But it's a good thought, pushing back on how often they're dismissed as overreactive even when they have good points. But people started using these slogans as weapons not as tools to remind themselves and others to be more understanding generally and open their minds and do more research. Nothing good was gonna come from that shift.
It's like people who think that being urged to read/watch more books and movies written by women/nonwhite people is something that's going to automatically make you more enlightened if you check enough boxes off the to do list and then they're shocked when they find a surprising diversity of thought and quality. What it should be, what it was meant to be, is just encouraging people to actually *think* for the first time about how many works by these authors they actually engage with and trying to broaden your horizons as a whole. Plus, its pushing back against the general trend with women and minorities HAVING no choice but to hear the pov of white male writers all the time, meanwhile the opposite level of engagement and respect is never or rarely granted (boys not liking Books for Girls meanwhile girls basically have to read Books for Men...or books that are considered universal or default being one example)
If Alix's profile was correct and she was 24 at the time of her being exposed... Idk, there's an extra layer of creepiness of this 22+ year old manipulating a bunch of teenagers. I feel like a lot of people missed that detail lol.
yeah lots of people are saying that ursula doxxing alix was specially terrible bc she was a teen when that's... clearly not the case lol don't get me wrong doxxing in general is awful but alix was clearly not a teen
i kinda get the vibe that that was a lie, was she still living on campus at age 24? idrk how college works i’m australian lol
also named alex so i’m so sorry on behalf of those with the same name
@@choccy_bagel dang that’s insane!!! i also experienced the majority of university through covid so i think my perception is HELLA warped
@@choccy_bagel I dont think thats super common. Gap years are fairly normal. but most people out of high school do a 4 year bachelors degree. A 24 year living at college is not super crazy, but I would think uncommon.
@@alexandrafrenchin my British uni most undergrad first years range from 17-27 and there are (considerably less but some) other students who are much older adults referred to as mature students but they’re not usually active participants in the same societies and social circles, people’s degrees are usually 3-4 years and there are also masters students who have already done their undergraduate degree so there’s a good chance she could be 24 at university
heartwarming; the worst people you know are fighting each other
Better they fight each other than bully innocent people I guess ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
whenever ai art discourse comes up i bring up thomas jefferson miku binder bc no machine could ever create something like that. truly the pinnacle of human creativity
incredibly ready to watch this considering disability twitter had a similarly insane situation happen just recently, where it came out a white able-bodied woman had been pretending to be a black deaf amputee wheelchair user, including using photos of a person they knew who they claimed was their wife. she was not her wife, just a random person she knew irl. deleted everything and left us all with whiplash
omg something similar recently happened on the german side of twitter... someone lied about being a doctor who was also a wheelchair user and foster mom to a random (also disabled) teen girl she met at a lake years ago. what is up with people honestly??
Wait holy shit what
Why is it that when people do this they always give themselves like, the MAXIMUM number of disabilities/minority statuses??? Like if they just picked one or two people would probably be so much less suspicious of them.
@@bubblegum1366Maximum clout and maximum greed, maximum victim identity shield. They're bad liars and can't help but go overboard with their lies. Also because ironically, people will defend them because of the sheer absurdity of their claims, i.e. "it must be true, who would/could make something like that up?"
Reminds me of something that happened on tiktok a while ago, where someone who claimed to have Huntington's and early onset dementia (along with potentially other things, it was a while ago so I don't remember all the details) claimed that some people she had hosted in an air BnB in her house were suing her for being traumatized by the presence of medical equipment, so she was trying to raise money for legal fees. When it all (thankfully pretty quickly) came out that she was lying about it all, she claimed to be her own twin sister to apologize on her behalf while also sticking to the claims?? It was a mess
Edit: found a video talking about the situation ua-cam.com/video/JTC1JtZ-mRM/v-deo.html
as someone who went through a very long hamilton phase, i will say that thomas jefferson miku binder honestly felt not that far off from the musical. some of the songs slap, but i can’t say that i love its take on history now that im older and understand more. it did get me into musical theatre which saved my life though, so it will always have a special place in my heart.
yes. hamilton helped introduce me to other historical fiction musicals (great comet, les mis, falsettos) so i love it for that, but hamilton is. objectively strange.
The best thing about Hamilton is that it got me to watch better musicals
I feel like Hamilton’s take on US history was an interesting subversion, but that subversion only really worked if you already knew the actual history. When the musical got popular with a younger crowd who had maybe taken a single high school US history class; that audience wasn’t well-served by the way the show assumes you recognize why all of its character depictions are so subversive. (Also, LMM’s crusty-ass flows would get him laughed out of any cypher happening after 1983,)
@@RLanceHunterI think that’s giving the american education system too much credit. I graduated without managing to take a single US history class of any sort (im not totally ignorant, but all my US history knowledge is from independent study).
@@TheElf_Online That is a good point. It just seems from my experience that the people who initially really liked Hamilton and then grew disillusioned with it tended to be folks who didn’t know much of the actual history, and only learned it later (souring their view of the show). That’s probably also why the biggest waves of both Hamilton enthusiasm and Hamilton backlash came from younger people.
Something which I remember from this... event... was that Alix as Israa had been active in other fandoms before Hamilton. But she fucked up the timeline of her "life" and thus if you go back far enough it appeared she was posting fic (Hetalia fic, of all things) while still trapped in the brothel
maybe it was just a very permissive brothel 💀
being in the hetalia fandom would have been more traumatizing than being in the brothel
As a Hetalian, I say: "Not all hetalians, but always a hetalian."
I feel like a lot of the bizarre Tumblr fandom discourse of this era ended up serving as fuel for early incarnations of the reactionary "anti-SJW" movement, which is both a shame and fundamentally misses the point of what actually made these sorts of sagas so crazy. These sort of sagas don't come about because of some ideological flaw in identity politics or social justice or whatever, they're the result of weird, overzealous fandom types discovering those concepts and immediately trying to use them as a cudgel to win arguments about who Severus Snape was fucking.
Absolutely, usually it’s all boiled down to shipping wars with extra step
no, it definitely existed before this moment. tumblr was known as the “weird queer freak site” in anti sjw circles for years before this.
EXACTLY it's the fakeness and performativity and misuse of serious issues and concepts for petty reasons. That's not a phenomenon that the left has any kind of monopoly on lol
I am absolutely loving this series of “Internet Drama for People who have never even seen grass” videos as someone who falls into that category
You know, when the When Posting Goes Wrong version of this story went up, there were a lot of commenters (myself included, regrettably) that painted Ursula as some kind of hero for their efforts. Looking at the situation now, I'm glad the comments section is willing to re-evaluate that stance in a more balanced light. Obviously I think what Alix did was supremely fucked up, but I don't agree with Ursula's decision to doxx her
I believe she even took down the video. I think she too had a change of heart
@@starbird3939 Apparently eldena got into a fight with ursula over another separate discourse
I *believe* Elena (WPGW) took down the vid cause she got herself into a fight with Ursula after she (Ursula) expressed transphobic opinions - even though theres a screenshots of Ursula saying pro trans thing? - and she felt unconfortable with the vid, perhaps because it lionized Ursula, perhaps she didnt want to bring up old ghosts and gettig Alix AND Ursula more unwanted attention
It's not just that Ursula went back on their promise not to doxx Alix, it's that they went out of their way to doxx her as THOROUGHLY as possible, potentially ruining her life. Ursula said they went through a similar thing when they were 15 and grew from it, but it looks like they didn't learn much at all. Both of these people are awful, and I hope Ursula gets their comeuppance somehow
Edit: If the acquaintance of Alix is to be believed then she's absolutely fine, so ig Ursula didn't actually cause that much damage, but certainly they could have and tried to
@@buhguh-r8gyeah it wouldve been one thing to be like “im the person who confronted her here’s a very brief rundown of how I figured it out” and a VERY different thing to go “AND HERES HER PARENTS FULL NAMES AND THE VALUE OF THEIR HOME” like whaaa. so basically alix’s fear of other ppl facing consequences for her actions WAS founded bc u wanted to be petty and drag her family into it?? alix was shitty but ursula very much isn’t a hero either
ursula: are you sure that you have hiv, are a poc victim, and 3 different people?
alix: im not just sure, im HIV positive.
Seeing Ursula snap and doxx Alix was like seeing your favorite character turn evil and commit the worst atrocities, like Cmon I was rooting for you! You are the chosen one! You were supposed to destroy the toxic, not join them!
I dunno, I can get the rage for sure...
I don't think Ursula ever snapped. I think that was always their intention.
In hindsight, Ursula came off as pretty creepy in that convo even before the doxxing.
@@Sylocat the fucking Edward 'say it out loud' moment. That was personal.
@@urbanarmory Oh of course the rage is understandable, but the action was horrible nonetheless
oh boy! thanks strange for providing a video to watch in the background about a strange tumblr account that pretended to have hiv while i draw cute girls!!
Spoilers!!!!!!
haha the perfect thing to watch while I sew some outdoor pillowcases
AYYY im doing the exact same thing!! lets gooo!!!!
realest comment ever
lmao same!!
I thought this was going to be a scandal about tumblr users who were living with HIV. But no it's a Hamilton HIV story scandal. 😭
which somehow makes it 10x more tumblr. like, a scandal involving actual HIV-positive people would be fucking wild, but this? this makes sense.
Yeah that's what everyone thought it was while it was happening too
I'm a queer nonbinary person who is survivor of a form of sex trafficking, and happily married to a trans woman. I am not hiv positive or a person of color so I cant imagine how those people feel but this whole story made me so annoyed. Like Alix honey if you want the trauma that bad you can have it. Its not fun, it's not interesting. It actually sucks.
literally she was using these marginalised identities and trauma like sex trafficking and miscarriages in order to win tumblr arguments??? girl go outside 😭
What form? if ur ready
@@Lincolnlogsoffdo you need to know?
Priveleged kids want to be oppressed so bad
@@Lincolnlogsoffgirl
I’ve been on tumblr a long time and it still amazes me that I’ve managed to be completely separated from every single major drama. I am a vampire who misses every major historical event by being stuck in a well.
Same here, I just curate my dashboard really heavily. My blocked tags and phrases list is probably a mile long
Ursula really came in with goofy fanfics and ended fully prepared to commit social murder
She really went "never let em know your next move"
This was Ursula's villain arc.
@@galactic-hamster7043 truly flabbergasted by the doxxing. A plot twist I did not expect in her arc
She worked so hard to get someone to do the right thing, then immediately went and did the wrong thing after finally succeeding.
The phrase 'Alexander Hamilton/John Laurens high school AU set in the 80s during the AIDS crisis' killed me. I'm dead
Maybe it's because I don't read fanfiction but this wild type of AU never made any sense to me, like just write original fiction at that point lmao
As someone who's survived trafficking, most trauma survivors don't post extensively about it online, ESPECIALLY IF THOSE WHO TRAFFICKED YOU COULD POSSIBLY FIND YOU FROM IT. WTFFF.
man i was so on ursulas side throughout that whole ace attorney-style conversation with alix and then she just took a giant dive off the moral high ground by doxxing alix. like she said one million times she wouldn’t do that??
Alix definitely shouldn't have given her any information. Just made an apology and left it.
I would not be surprised if Ursula wanted to dox her from the start and intentionally pressured her into giving the info she needed.
@@hiimcrazyfordrwho I mean that's definitely how it reads to me. If she didn't want information from Naj to be able to doxx her i genuinely have no idea why she went as far as she did. Finding out that she's Alix did essentially nothing except make the story more insane when the apology and leaving of social media should have been enough. If she really wanted Alix to believe that she wasn't going to doxx her then why on Earth was she constantly digging up information on her??
I don't know. It's weird and definitely suuuper not cool, especially since Ursula herself admitted that Alix was very young, like 19 at the most. Weird.
edit: just a side note, it's odd that no one apparently knows how old Alix is, apparently there's photos out there saying she was 24? but Ursula herself said in one of her posts that she was 16-17 when she started and about 18 when the confrontation went down? honestly who can say, but doxxing is just as bad no matter what your age is. That shit could potentially not only put your life at risk but also the lives of your friends and family. Not cool, unlike many things there's actually a reason why it's illegal.
I think the "reason" she doxxed alix is that she made alix promise not to delete the HIV Living blog, but she did.
Ursula absolutely wasn't justified, though. I don't agree with the poster who said Ursula was only doing this because of the fandom drama, but it's pretty clear from reading the exchange and the later posts that she was at least partially on a moral power trip.
Which is something, I think, that lurks within everyone: Part of us just wants to bully people, for whatever awful reason. Feel like we're better than others. And that's why you see exactly the kind of holier-than-thou crap that Alix (or basically everyone in this story?) was doing all the time in online communities. We kid ourselves into thinking that if someone is bad enough, then suddenly cruelty is GOOD, and it's actually moral to be awful to them! It's important to watch yourself, to make sure you're actually trying to help people, and not just give in to that instinct.
I still see Ursula around tumblr sometimes (on a different URL that I won't reveal) and while I think they have a lot of good insights on a number of topics, it's clear that they often let their anger get the better of them and react very strongly, often innappropriately so. I think that's what happened in the Alix situation. I think Ursula is still very obsessed with the idea that Alix might do this again, or have done this again. At some point you have to let that go. I'm sure Ursula has good reasons to be angry at their life and the state of the world, but that was always one of the problems with tumblr- people who have really good and genuine reasons to be angry would use that anger to harm people to make themselves feel better, and present their anger as some kind of righteous crusade or social justice....no, it's just being cruel. It was never tone policing to ask that people not do this. But I wish Ursula well. And I wish Alix to have a life fulfilling enough that she doesn't ever do this again, and to never forget how being exposed as a liar felt (sans the doxxing which should never have happened).
@@glocrowhurst like the stanford prison experiment, i understand what you mean. it’s hard to stop yourself from putting yourself above other people when you have a reason that may, in your mind, justify doing so.
i remember the hamilton ppl speaking out in history class and generally being wrong it was insane
I enjoy Hamilton as a history nerd but kids who ONLY knew Hamilton filled me with indescribable rage
omg you just unlocked so many memories of middle school lmfao
Damn now I'm grateful it came out in my senior year of high school, sounds like I dodged a bullet
@@luthientinuviel3883 yup!!! i barely knew what it was about but i remember kids literally saying “i know this from/bc of hamilton!” and being so utterly confused lmfao
lmao I'm astounded I was able to keep my mouth shut in class during my hetalia AND hamilton days (helps that hamilton is much less relevant for canadian high schools lol)
If Ursula puts as much detail in her fanfics are as her investigative work, I can imagine them being really well written.
Similar to how Ms Scribe might actually have been a decent fanfic writer of she was so good at writting "characters"
They were. As I said in another comment, I'm still bitter that we lost all of their writing over this. Their writing was beautifully evocative and certain lines are still seared into my brain as something I aspire to in my own writing
@@dragonfire160 Could you give us some examples, please?
...i've never read any but why would you expect a crackfic to be well written?
@@LittleSirBoy There's a lot of beautiful, well-written crackfic out there. Just because the premise is crack doesn't mean the writing is trash. In fact, good writing can elevate the absurdity of the premise and make for even better entertainment on the long run. Especially since the common writing style of short crackfics can be tiring to read which impacts longer crackfics negatively
Not in the hamilton fandom so this was very new to me.
Honestly.. i went from being angry and appalled at hivliving to feeling somewhat bad for her. Like was she a terrible person? Yes. But at the end, she was grovelling and begging not to be doxxed. She returned the money (i think?) and from how she responded to ursula, it was very obvious she's a teenager.
Ursula had good questions and cyberstalking skills that eventually exposed hivliving. Good on her. BUT she went from "you need to apologise to those you've hurt" and "i wont dox you if you just do (this)", to "let's dox her everything". Name, school, major, sent parents emails, sent the school emails etc. That's CRAZY. And Ursula cant seem to see past her growing giant ego and "i told you so" mentality. To the point she patronisingly called hivliving's followers "fucking stupid" for not noticing irregularities about her story. The followers are probably 13 y/os. The high horse she put herself on after cracking this case wide open, and by that I mean, doxxing someone (yes, an incredibly shitty person) online despite promising not to, and getting off on a power trip, makes her and hivliving BOTH terrible people in this drama.
yeah i agree. it's clear that all this really went to Ursula's head and by the end of it she was acting like she thought it was her divine right to demand hivlivings actions, expose her, decide how she should be "punished", etc... like at the end of the day you can tell someone what they did was wrong, you can tell them they should apologize, make them understand how they've hurt others... but you can't control them. seemed like she got so frustrated that she couldn't control hivliving that she took some control by doxxing her. then even started making up lies about what happened after. she was completely obsessed.
hivliving was in university. they were a grown adult doing that
@@CindersSpot highly unlikely but okay
@@CindersSpot im not amercan but its very uncommon for teenagers to attend university there, especially to complete a degree
Hamilton fandom is a fandom around an inaccurate RPF. Of course it would be like this. Good luck on your lung surgery.
NOT THE ACE DISCOURSE....... as an ace person i literally lose years off my lifespan every time i remember this
I used to nanny two kids (7 and 9 years old) who loved Hamilton and thought it was all true and their parents didn’t correct them AND they went and visited Alexander Hamilton’s grave to pay respects 😬 so just that alone makes me VERY wary of the Hamilton musical LMAO
And yes they were white
I mean. Visiting a historical site or grave doesn’t mean you approve of that person. I’ve visited battle sites, concentration camps and plantations. I get what you’re going for and obviously you have to tell your kids about historical inaccuracies in an age appropriate way, but like………. I just want you to feel like you can visit a historical location without being a bad person or being attacked lmfao
@@maddieb.4282 bro didn't read the "loved Hamilton" and "pay respects" part
@@maddieb.4282the fact that they were kids makes it hilarious to me 💀 like that's genuine child shenanigans
@@maddieb.4282yeah no going somewhere doesn’t mean you approve of it, but going there to pay respects does
The thing I don't understand is why Alix when that far. Like... She could have just claimed to be HIV positive to avoid criticism for her fanfic and that would have most certainly worked, and it would be very hard to dispute such a claim.
She wanted to be able to avoid criticism by as many facets as once- so she could claim to be an expert on those things without actually having to be.
look up stolen valor sometime, the same thing happens with dudes that pretend they’re war heroes, they always end up having like, 500 medals of honor or whatever, i’m not a military nerd but there’s pictures of these guys that get caught doing it in their “dress uniforms” and they’re just absolute christmas trees of medals. Whatever this mental illness/personality disorder is, one of its hallmarks is the inability to fucking stop.
Sadly I wouldn't be surprised if it had something to do with ace discourse. I remember how gross it got, both sides were trying to claim that all the people with marginilised identities were on their side. HIVliving was vocally on the anti side, so I don't think it's far fetched to say Alix probably enjoyed the clout pretending to be several people of colour gave her in slanging matches. I wish the HIVliving blog was still available because I remember it being far more about ace discourse than you'd think for what was supposedly primarily an HIV resource blog. Mind you ace discourse got into everything back then. Truly a dark time. :(
@@chexfan2000screenshotting that last line rq
@@aeddiefarmer ace discourse was absolutely mind boggling considering that it was almost entirely people who had a completely hypothetical stake in what they were arguing about. It was entirely theory-based speculative “what if” scenarios and it managed to pop up in pretty much all queer online spaces and utterly saturate them, and while i can’t prove it i strongly suspect that quite a few of the most prolific offenders did not belong to the communities they claimed to represent, and were in fact just the old live journal dramamongers, regenerated into new startling forms, using the queer community as their own personal playground for their insane manipulation games
Revisiting this now that I exist outside pro/anti-ship talk I cannot help but feel like Ursula was less interested in getting Alix to admit what was wrong and more interested in some kind of fandom justice. The chatlogs really rub me wrong.
Alix is disgusting, sure, but like. Girl you need to touch grass too
oh most definitely. like. girl log off
At BEST Ursula started off or had good intentions in there *as well* but this obviously wasn't just about the Justice of it all or 1) they wouldn't have DOXXED HER AFTER PROMISING NOT TO, for all the good it did 2) they wouldn't have been enjoying it so much lol like be serious bestie you were SO happy you finally got to take one of the Fandom Morality Police who'd attacked you down a peg
having heard about all this after being in the hamilton fandom at the time is like learning you were inches away from being hit by an intercontinental ballistic missle
SAME!! thank god i was very very far away from the discourse side of the fandom so i only remember laughing at that one reblog of the confession post that was like "1. wtf 2. why is this tagged hamilton" and totally forgetting about the whole thing for YEARS?? it's like finding out that time you thought you had a bad flu you had actually just barely survived brain-eating amoebas
i joined tumblr right around the time this was all going down AND was in the peak of my hamilton phase. knowing how i was only a few degrees of separation from all this makes me so glad that i never managed to get into the fandom itself (instead i was in the wings of fire tumblr fandom, which also has some batshit stories. though nothing on the level of this)
Same, especially grateful since I was a sapphic Indian living in a very politically tense state at the time. So glad I never learned about this while being a baby queer.
I went to school with her and she was my TA. Some of her friends say she used their names for her accounts and I think some of them didn’t even know bc we all found out from the When Posting Goes Wrong video. A lot of people were pissed bc she had a full ride in school and was doing all of this. Most people didn’t know. It was just wild to find out from a video.
Do you know how she’s doing now, like employment wise? Has this being out there impacted her at all?
This makes her legit so much worse oh my god
The fact that she was smart enough to get a full ride scholarship but not smart enough to know not to pretend to be an HIV positive Muslim human trafficking survivor on the internet
Not a super important detail, but what’s TA stand for?
@@Jay-cy8zv Teaching Assistant or Teacher's Aide
Compulsive liars are such a strange phenomenon. About a decade ago, such a person infiltrated my circle of friends. I was reminded of them recently when I noticed their tumblr was still on my follow list. They had blocked me long ago when their house of cards collapsed, but I hadn't blocked them because at the time I was still considering legal action.
In retrospect, we all felt pretty stupid for having bought her stories. I certainly "get" Ursula's final rant about "how did none of you realize?!?!" and like, the thing is: People are trusting, and when the lies are big, awful, and personal, most of us don't even consider the possibility of it being a lie, because who would lie about something so horrible?
The person (Let's call them X) who suckered me, I met at a housewarming party. She was the roommate of my friend, and they had just moved into this townhouse. The house warming party was also a "X is in remission" party, because (and here was the first big lie) X had convinced everyone that she had terminal cancer. Legitimately, who would ever accuse someone of faking that?
There's far too many details to go further into it, but as a sampler tray, X also told us:
She had several PhDs (her genius was such a burden for her)
Was a high school teacher (she actually worked at a bakery)
Her parents were divorced and her father had had a mental breakdown because of it and now lived alone off-grid in a cabin in the Yukon (her parents were not divorced and lived together in town)
Her "ex" (who for a good while was unaware he was her ex) was also terminally ill and had 6 months to live
etc, etc.
When I discovered that not only was she still on tumblr, but had remained active this whole time, I was almost curious enough to go look and see if she ever got her shit together and took responsibility for her lies, but I just did not have the patience for that. Hopefully she's a better person now :p
The story of the compulsive liar reads like the blurb of a John Green book
Why is it that they always feel the need to give their fake significant others an improbably similar backstory to their own?
That sounds both exhausting to deal with and terrifying to realize, I’m sorry you went through that and I hope you’re in a better place now
@@Painocus their stories are all the more compelling, i suppose
Yeah, I think it's because most of us keep our lies at least somewhat plausible and we lie for a reason. Like, if somebody oversleeps and is late for work, they usually go for 'had some car problems' or 'there was an awful traffic' or something, not 'my 100-year-old neighbour fell down on the stairs, had an open fracture, a heart attack and a stroke and I had to call an ambulance for her'. Often, the bigger the lie is, the more we believe it because why would somebody make up something that ridiculous? It must be true...
I love that we live in an area where we have Tumblr historians less than a generation after the start of Tumblr
Every drama channel is doing real time archiving, they're all historians, and will act as historical source for future generations
I'm honestly confused what Ursula expected Alix's school to do about the situation. Lying about your identity on the internet isn't illegal. What Alix did was super shitty, but she didn't break any actual laws except possible financial fraud, and that would be well outside the jurisdiction of the university police force (and from what I understand, the amount of money she actually gained from it was too small to qualify as a felony). The most the university could say was that Alix broke the code of conduct somehow, but this whole situation was so bizarre that I doubt a university acceptable internet use policy would cover it.
I guess get her booted from the racism groups? I'm not sure if that was Ursula's intention but it sounds like that documentedly did happen. I really don't think Alix should be in those but other than that I don't know either.
@@aeddiefarmer IIRC, part of the conversation (that was in Eldena's video but not this one) was Ursula telling Alix she needed to resign as the anti-racism club's president, though I don't know if Alix followed through with that. And even if that was the intent, they could have just contacted the advisor for that club and not the university admin.
I get where you're coming from but since Alix is supposedly part of a anti-racism group in her school, I think it's fair she gets some form of consequence for being a white woman pretending to be a person of color online. Like being kicked out of the group or something.
Imagine the school staff meeting to discuss this.
stop i just laughed so unbelievably hard at this @@genericname2747
Saying "Thomas Jefferson miku binder" to someone in 2014 would've been enough to kill them
It's enough in 2023 still
can confirm i got serious whiplash from reading that series of words for the first time in 2023
my ex housemate (was my housemate at the time) used to send me anon abuse on tumblr and then i installed one of those IP trackers into my tumblr code and found it the anon harassment was coming from inside the house
GET OUT OF THERE! THEY'RE INSIDE THE HOUSE!
Tumblr drama is so fascinating to me because it always goes down exactly like a “Big Lie” episode on a children’s TV show.
as someone who had a MASSIVE hamilton phase as a young teenager, i can confirm i was a weird little guy enjoying weird things (without being very aware of it!). now that i have aged and think back, yeah it was kinda strange (pun intended) for some canadian kid to be so invested with (debatably) controversially rewritten american history but the music and production value drew me in. it got me into theatre, which got me into film production, which is soon to be my career :) so definitely got the good ending, but made some… interesting choices to get here. please educate me on this niche tumblr story, oh great and knowledgable strange
Same for me, and I'm European. Hamilton def got me into theater more and I too am graduating film school, I also think as a play and production quality it still stands and I like to just view it like that, a play that is also a product of its time
@@spntageous5249 ayyy film bros!! and yeah i completely agree, super high quality production- i still think the songs, choreography, and technical aspects are incredible, and i enjoy those specific things. it’s the subject matter itself and its intended and perceived ethics/morals/messages/etc. that i think are very debatable and nuanced
for how much you say evidence is limited, the story makes as much sense as it can. your dedication is revered and appreciated!
The entire interaction between Ursula and Alix is so weird when I really start to think about it. Like Alix completely drops her entire persona so fast, before she admits to any lies she just bends and folds. Because she was a very young person very scary of being doxxed, because these tumblr identities were really really important to her, so having them in jeopardy must have really crippled her ability to come back and defend herself with her usual snarky tumblr girl bullshit. It’s just SO weird to see her go from a character who’s hyper fixated on discourse and dialogue on identity politics, and then as soon as the veil of those identities comes under scrutiny, she just completely flops, either unable to understand the severity of her situation or purposefully playing dumb and making herself seem small and vulnerable and like “someone who didn’t know any better uwu” and honestly I feel like… that’s probably intentional. I think people like this are serial liars and don’t know who they are or what they actually stand for, so they’ll take whatever approach they think is going to get them the best outcome.
And on that note, Ursula is honestly not that different in the sense that she claims continuously to be staunchly against doxxing on PRINCIPLE so for her to then turn around and doxx her…. So unnecessarily… I fail to see that as anything other than her initial private interactions with Alix all being very “reading from the tumblr script”, painting a picture of someone desperate and pinned against a wall with no other choice but to doxx this person. Like, she knew she was going to doxx Alix when she had enough information. She wanted to. She just said that she didn’t over and over again so that when she finally did, she would (theoretically) look like less of an asshole. I’ll be honest, her messages don’t read like she’s writing with the intention of posting the conversations publicly, so I don’t know if that was always the plan or if she even had a plan. But either way, she couldn’t at any point threaten to doxx Alix, lest Alix take a screen shot and use it against her.
Basically, both these people are fucking weirdos and I think the overall weirdness of these interactions comes from those big obnoxious contrarian tumblr personalities clashing in the dumbest way possible, and weird and manipulative people who learn to use the language of their victims in order to blend in always makes for WEIRD content.
I think Alix was 24 at the time. There was talk of her going to grad school, so she'd have to have been around that age. I think the confusion probably lies in "Israa" being 19 years old, a lot of people seem to think that Alix and Israa were the same age, but she lied about that as well.
I agree with pretty much everything else you said, but I wouldn't call Alix a "very young person", especially when she was in a group chat with actual teenagers and possibly bullying them
thats also very possible, but seeing as how the lying spanned across multiple years, i would still say that she was young when she started this. it wouldnt surprise me if part of the whole scheme was to convince everyone that she was younger and therefore less culpable for her actions. it definitely wouldnt be the first time someone who's old enough to know better led a group of annoying teenagers on tumblr into bullying people who didn't agree with their ships and im sure it wont be the last. @@violet7773
The pregnancy part is the most immediate red flag to me.
I guess I don't know too many traffiked transfem sapphics to know for certain, but I think you add the fact that they "had" HIV into the mix and it's just not fesable that a couple in that situation would want to keep kids if they got pregnant. That's the kind of dramatic plot twist you'd get from, say, a fanfiction, but never in real life.
For me, it was the fact a diplomat's daughter was kidnapped and trafficked. It doesn't matter what country they're from, that just doesn't happen. It would make headlines all over the world.
@@error-try-again-later especially the somali christian daughter of an american diplomat. first of all 99.99% of somalis are muslim and also how would that even happen lmao
@@ussinussinongawd516 somehow I'm actually shocked that she got Somalia's main religion wrong, that seems like the one and only thing she'd research 💀
@@error-try-again-later Since Alix liked to collect as many marginalized identities for her online personas as possible, there’s no way she didn’t know that Somalia’s main religion is Islam. She definitely picked Catholicism on purpose because there’s a really small Catholic population in Somalia. I guess she was really fascinated by the idea of being a religious minority because she had another persona where she claimed to be Jewish and from Lebanon, even though the Jewish population of Lebanon is really small.
@@someirrelevant that's a very good point lol, she really collected those labels like Pokémon cards. In hindsight it's she was padding out her OC's overly tragic backstories 💀
"Smut,... lemons if you will,"
Put me in stitches.
I THOUGHT I WAS PAST THAT IN FANFICTION TRAUMA. WTH STRANGE.
I’m just confused on why people thought the university would do something?? Like try explaining this mess to administrators, they will have no idea what any of it means or how they would even punish her. Also why would they have any authority to punish her??? She didn’t use school accounts to do any of it so it has nothing to do with the university. I agree what she did was totally fucked up and maybe in a fair world she would have experienced more impactful consequences but this is the real world the school has too many students to worry about one doing, admittedly horrible and disgusting, things on the internet. I don’t know I was just shocked that people thought she would receive punishment from her school 🤷
Yeah, in the most simple of terms, completely removing the Hamilton and suckpuppeting context, what Alix was beign accused of by Ursula was harrasing people online but not as herself, which would refelect badly on the school. I dont really known what even the school was supposed to do regarding a students questionanble but ultimately not illegal activities. She wanst sending death threads, revenge porn or running a large scale profitable scam which harmed people
She was the head of some anti-racism group(s), yet was pretending to be a POC. The school should have been made aware of this. Plus as a student, you represent the school. The school would not want somebody with such a bad reputation being associated with them. The school had no idea how big or small the scandal would be, so they may have wanted to address the problem head on.
I mean... "they have defrauded people out of money using interstate communication which is a federal felony carrying a maximal sentencing of 20 years" is a probably everything the University need to know.
@@alisaishere Colleges and universities should not and generally do not discipline students for "having a bad reputation". This would be way worse for basically all marginalized people, just in the name of getting some kind of psychic satisfaction over a bad thing happening to somebody who was awful on the internet once. You do realize that, right? There is no workable version of this as a policy where schools only go after the people we don't like.
The university probably has dozens, maybe hundreds of worse students to deal with first. Lying about your identity for tumblr cred is shitty, but it's not like irl harrassment, SA, or drug dealing. Even if this scandal was big for the tumblr space, the vast majority of people at that university don't care. Most of them will hear about it, have a chuckle, then move on
I used to be in a Hamilton Facebook page. I asked if a line in a song was meant to be a fat joke. I got absolutely crucified that LMM would never make a fat joke, that he was too wholesome. I said he didn’t, the character did. Someone said LMM would never write about something he didn’t support, like fat shaming. I mentioned in the same song he writes about stealing a horse and buggy and plays its off as a joke. Someone tried to argue back that making a bad fat joke was worse than basically stealing a car. That vehicle theft was a normal teenage milestone but a fat joke was absolutely unacceptable at any line and I was an awful person for even interpreting it that way. That’s when I left the fandom.
Do you remember what line? i havent listened to hamilton since my Hamitlon phase in 2017.
@@L3mXn this is genuinely a shot in the dark but it could be "it's hard to have intercourse over four sets of corsets" from Aaron Burr Sir. in that song Mulligan also talks about stealing horses. It never occurred to me that it could be a fat joke but if that's the line I do see it. Happy to be corrected if I'm wrong though!!
@@annaparry4384 It's an immature sex joke, made by someone who is obviously very drunk and he gets immediately shut down after, so I don't think Lin actually wanted to be offensive.
@@annaparry4384 the 'four sets of corsets' (they would be stays in that time period but that doesn't flow I guess) is about having sex with four seperate women, not one thicc girl in four corsets for some reason. The fat shaming 'joke' is 'sit down, John, you fat motherfucker-' if I remember correctly- it's in the second half, most likely in one of the Cabinet Rap Battles, but I couldn't tell you which one off the top of my head.
@@annaparry4384 I thought that meant he had sex with four women at the same time? Seemed in character. But there's also "sit down John you fat-"...that one's kinda blatant.
This is very much an Everyone's Shit Here situation. Alix is obviously awful, but honestly, so is Ursula. Doxxing is almost always wrong, and this is certainly not a case where that thorough of a doxx was ever needed. Plus the fact that the reason Eldena DoubleCa5t took down her video on this is because she didn't want to be associated with Ursula after Ursula tried to get her to distance herself from her friend Sarah Z. because Sarah criticized Ursula's TERF friends.
I was wondering what happened to that video! Of course Ursula hangs out with TERFs
That last sentence was a wild ride. Of COURSE, the drama never ends.
@@glocrowhurst It never does, and the longer drama goes on, the more likely it is that one or more or all of the people involved will turn out to be horrific bigots. Especially TERFs with Tumblr.
@@SpandyandZepperluvr2000szoomer I know what Ursula's current URL is and they are vocally anti-TERF (and trans) so I'm confused by this. Also I don't think we have any proof of Alix making a particularly large amount of money and I'm not sure the lies were illegal, just immoral. So I don't think this would be a police matter, not sure proper authorities could really go beyond contacting her college.
My impression of Ursula is someone who struggles with anger and I would imagine that's the reason why they see things in black and white (Sarah Z is bad, Alix is really bad so it's ok for me to doxx, etc) in situations of conflict. That doesn't make it ok, obviously. But it also doesn't mean that Sarah Z had Ursula bang to rights about being a secret TERF or anything. The internet just causes everyone to have to take these massive black and white stances whenever there is a conflict.
I think SZ has run into trouble in the past due to having a large tumblr following (partially from youtube) but behaving like a regular tumblr user, and then when SZ's legions of followers harrass someone Sarah criticised Sarah has been like ':O??' I sympathise because I have a tiny tumblr and if I had a fraction of SZ's following I would fall into these kinds of traps all the time. And SZ has noticeably scaled back her tumblr interraction, presumably because of this kind of thing, which I respect.
holy shit i never knew that was the reason it was deleted…damn i really wanted to be on ursula’s side but doxxing AND defending terfs?? insane
My personal favourite piece of Hamilton drama (that I got to watch unfold in real time) was an Instagram fan account getting dogpiled because they made a post on 9/11 talking about how they didn't feel personally connected to/affected by it because they weren't alive when it happened. Strange and dark times
I feel bad for that person who was just being honest. I'm older than most of the audience here and I was almost an adult when 9/11 happened. As much as it affected me as a US citizen and being wary of airplane travel for awhile, I still don't feel connected to it. I can only imagine that if you weren't born yet, it must feel like it was just something in history class to learn.
Reminds me of a time in middle school when I showed up in the morning and someone asked me why I was smiling, because it was 9/11. To this day I am baffled
not the same thing but i've gotten called out for saying i didn't care about 9/11. i was born in 2002 and I'M NOT FROM THE US BUT FROM EASTERN EUROPE ?? the internet is wild
@@tallemajasthat's stupid of them. Why would you, or necessarily should you care about it? It was a tragedy, granted, but still...
@@thegrimharvest exactly! of course any event like this is a horrible, horrible tragedy and it makes me sad to think about the victims and families, as it would any empathetic person, but i'm no more attached to 9/11 than i am to the sinking of the titanic. american-centric thinking can be a little crazy sometimes i guess!
Ursula feels like she had one moment to really hold power over someone and just absolutely relished in it. Wild to hear about
Ursula: “Doxxing people is illegal and immoral”
…
Ursula moments later: “I doxxed her.”
well she never said she wasn't immoral lmao
@@dududuliai mean she did say repeatedly that she would’t dox alix and yet here we are
What she did was awful but I think doxing her was a bit overboard. People make really dumb mistakes when theyre young and are capable of larning and growing. She seemed capable of that and in my opinion didnt deserve to have her safety jeopardized over it. Im not trying to justify any of her actions though
Yeah, seems like an example of someone trying to take justice into their own hands and going too far with it. There are times where doxxing can be okay imo, but this just wasn't it. The point in which it became about punishing her it stopped being justice, and it became revenge
@saudade7842 is doxxing ever ok? I feel like no-one can ever be in possession of the facts.
@joedavies9621 there are literally people on the internet who post photos of themselves sexually/physically abusing animals and children. That’s definitely dox worthy.
@@Lolo50000I mean, it depends. The definition of doxxing is honestly pretty loose, so IMO it depends on the circumstances and how much information is revealed. Like I never think it's okay to release information about someone's family, friends, or colleagues who have nothing to do with a situation, and I think posting someone's address is dangerous. But I think if someone is taking advantage of or harming someone based on lying about who they are, their credentials, or their experiences, revealing their real information may be justified in preventing them from committing further harm.
I think someone's safety should always be considered and more often than not I find doxxing used in situations where it's absolutely not an appropriate response and/or reveals way too much information. But given that, again, the definition is pretty loose as it technically applies to any private or identitying information, I don't think it's never a reasonable action to take.
In this case I think revealing who alix really was and maybe their socials wouldn't have been out of line, but the rest of the information to me was unnecessary and shouldn't have been posted.
I think faking HIV, bullying rape survivors and scamming people out of money goes beyond the pale of normal "young dumb mistakes." And Alix should have faced consequences. I'm glad someone found her real information. That's not something you should be able to quietly move on from.
as someone who was in memeufacturings friend group when all that happened and in the subsequent discord servers created to fill its place i can say that this is actually a pretty average mid 10s tumblr experience. white people being in the group chat does not surprise me in the slightest i got invited to a smaller discord server that was supposedly for poc and i was like "i appreciate the invite but im white and i feel like im kind of invading a space i shouldnt be in?" and they were like "but youre jewish" and i was like "im still white tho?" and the other white jew in there got really, REALLY mad at me.
OH MY GOD, I get that! I'm Jewish and Israeli, and I'm like,,, 75% Ashkenazi. So, I'm white. But I've still been asked for my opinion on POC issues because... I live in the Middle East? I appreciate the notion of asking Middle Easterns for their opinions on these topics, but I'm a white Jew living in Tel Aviv. I can talk about anti-semitism and the complicated idea of Zionism and what it means to Israelis today vs. Jews of the past, but I know jack-shit about Afghanistan. So maybe. Ask someone who actually. Isn't me lol.
Good on you for staying honest ahahha
The opposite happened to me. I, an Arab Syrian woman, born and raised in Syria , STILL LIVING IN SYRIA, got kicked out of a server because "I'm not middle eastern/brown enough" because I, apparently: 1. Am pale
2. Have a good grasp on American slang terms
IT'S BECAUSE I'M TERMINALLY ONLINE AND NEVER GO OUTSIDE, KAREN.
@@janjanbinks1710 i... what? what is their logic???? you're?? syrian?? so you're middle eastern???? i???????????
@@queertearss The reasoning is: "skin too pale, English too good" lmao
About five or so years ago i took a really cool biology class about HIV. One of our assignments was to write a fictional journal entry where we are diagnosed with HIV and what our questions might be. I decided it would be easier to write it from the perspective of a character i already knew, so i did. Since it was about a character living with Hiv, i naturally titled it Hiv Living
It was only a year ago i was made aware of... this
"our school has never publicly acknowledged this" YEAH? WHY WOULD THEY 💀💀💀
The werewolves in HP really were a metaphor for AIDS and it's quite a fucking trip to remember how we ate it up back then.
To be fair, for a few years Lupin was the only werewolf character we saw, that was before the evil werewolf killer who actively wanted to turn as many people as possible into werewolves.
I feel like a lot of the things Joanne writes start out as just general tropes and then she realizes how she could weaponize it against disenfranchised people later
@@Romanticoutlaw JKR must have thought she was doing something virtuous or unique there. She thinks enough about the general tropes to add something for dressing, but does not seem to think further about the necessary implications. We end up with enslaved elves to reinforce the impression of the Super Bad Evil Guys alongside Hermione condemned for caring about their emancipation, and Lupin as a tragic figure alongside a heinous caricature who hunts children.
Bigotry is something she claims to hate more than anything, which has created one enormous blindspot! We are not beyond what we hate in others. We only make it invisible to ourselves.
Probably because it was one of the first big mainstream allegories we became aware of as kids. If you have good intentions and nothing to compare it to, then it seems like a good idea.
Tbh I don't think the allegorical nature _itself_ is the problem, but you really have to commit to an idea like that from the start. Sensitive topics need research and compassion even if it's not a 1:1 mirror to real life. Instead, it feels like normal werewolf angst with an allegory slapped on top, which indirectly leads to some batshit implications.
*the evil werewolf character who SPECIFICALLY TARGETS KIDS. YOU KNOW, ONE OF THE WORST AND MOST ENDURING EXAMPLES OF DELIBERATE PROPAGANDA AGAINST QUEER FOLKS SINCE THE MID 20th CENTURY
@@fruitygarlic3601 Impossible. As a liberal online, I have an objectively perfect worldview, and anyone straying even an inch out of line is actually worse than hitler.
A friend of mine was in the GCOC and hoo boy do they have Trauma from it, great coverage and good luck on the surgery!