1.Yes,they were infected before, but they weren't completely overrun by the infection. 2.The Vessel itself does grow, however it begs the question why the knight isn't growing himself. 3.Nosk is in the creepiest place in the map, do you expect him to be normal? 4.when you get voidheart, one of the texts says "no will to break" which just means that the will has to be unbreakable, but it doesn't mean that you don't have one. Also, the reason the knight exists is to contain the Infection.
For the Hollow Knight one, it was probably because it was ‘trained to prime form’. Could a 18 year old who’s never been to the gym be the size of a body builder of the same age?
Not exactly. A lot of people have the misconception about question 4. The pale king says those things in the ascent sequence. As we know, this was a massive assumption for him, one which turned out to be false, as seen in the Hollow Knight. The knight (the PC) is similar to the Hollow Knight in almost every way. It is evident that we have a Will of our own within the game. We cannot hold the infection within ourselves forever, that is evident through the hollow knight
@@Phantasmans That's probably the most probably option. It's kinda weird though because the hollow knight gets 10 times taller, and you don't really get taller by lifting. Trust me, I know from experience XD
1. Yes. 2. It takes a very long time. Remember, HK’s events mainly take place over the course of a day-a week. 3. My headcanon is that Nosk is a spider that combines the all-seeing power of the radiance with its own vast intellect to see the memories of its victims. For you, it comes up blank, so it just uses your face. As for shapeshifting, I think it’s the radiance morphing the creature’s body against its will. 4. Another headcanon, but I think that you are the void keeping the Knight together, and are the autonomous force interacting with the world through a vessel.
The thing is, the vessels arent hollow. Thats why they were thrown in the abyss, thats why the hollow knight failed, thats why the knight is able to deviate from his "purpose" to contain the infection abd go against the queen's wishes and fight radience, thats why the siblings stand with you and fond solace afterwards, its because the vessels were never hollow. Which makes the king even more cruel because all the void creatures in the mass grave he made were there because they could feel
The vessels weren't thrown in the void because they had wills, they were born in the void and forced to climb out, either the first one to make it to the top was chosen, or the pale king waited at the top for a vessel that he saw fit, casting the ones that weren't back down. After they finished they sealed them in there to his what actually happened down there, they were ashamed of what they did but they saw it as the only option.
The vessel you play as does jave a will. It has the same kind of will that the hollow Knight has. This is why the easiest ending is "bad". It means that the player containing the infection will ultimately fail just like it did with the hollow knight
This is false. We can see the infection completely eradicate inside the knight. They are truly hollow - however we control them, we have a will, and we do the decision they make.
I believe that the knight was born with the instinct to do whatever it takes to stop the infection, which is why it does things that would normally require it to have a will, he only does these things because it helps them get closer to sealing/stopping the infection.
WRONG The hollow Knight has an imprinted will from the time it soent with the pale king. They developped a bond and as a result created impurities. Our knight is free from those impurities because it lost all memory of its past and thus has no bonds to inprint upon. This, however, changes if you go to the abyss and discover the truth
@@funtimegamer8733buying items from the shop, speaking to characters, upgrading your nail, and simply thinking is an example of having a "will". And the knight does all those things
The knight we play as was a rejected vessel, meaning he wasn’t as pure as the hollow knight, who had no will at all (allegedly). The hollow knight stabs himself during the fight so it’s reasonable to assume he has some shred of free will as well, meaning all the vessels are imperfect.
@@ferak10 the knights were created to be beings without thought or soul, in order to remain uncorrupted. Rejected vessels were impure because they weren't fully uncorruptable.
For the fourth one, I always believed that that is because the vessels do have a will. We hear "no will to break" not from an objective source, but from a quote from the Pale King. He believed them to have no will, but as we know the Hollow Knight did have a mind and a will which was why it both got infected and could fight the infection. I believe the contradiction is to create discussion, "is the knight a truly hollow vessel, or because of his actions, can we assume he has a mind and will?" this dilemma is at the center of the question on what ending you believe is the best.
1. more infection is being released out of the temple because of the seals breaking so the infection gets more potent i guess 2. The journal entry for pure vessel says it is "raised and trained to prime form" so it could have to do with that or the nursery in the white palace 3. Nosk is Nosk 4. I don't really remember where, but I think it is alluded to somewhere that no vessel is truly hollow, either that or just because it is a game
@@Nyx.260Observe Nosk is a heavily warped corpse creeper that can mimic people you love. If you search up "What kind of bug is nosk" it will tell you that nosk is a heavily warped corpse creeper. That's what nosk is
All vessels that where thrown in the void, had possibility some kind of emotion. Little Ghost could be one of them. It could also imply that the Hollow Knight didn't have any emotions at start.
@@slippyfruit8538 I think the pale king didn't want emotions to overwhelm his child, so I don't know why the pale kind would choose his "perfect vessel" to have emotions, even tho he threw possible thousands of vessels in the void because of this reason.
I think the best thing that explains the knight's decision making skills is that it simply heard the hollow knights call, and everything in the game is just him following that call.
Nosk reads the minds of its victims and then transforms into their loved ones to lure them deep into its layer. But since the knight has no feelings about anybody, Nosk gets confused and tries to mimic the knight itself. How does it do that? I have no clue.
1. They got more infection, after we get double jump or the dreamer. 2. As I remember, in Pure vessel journal entry, it's said to be trained by royalty, so probably that's the case here. 3. Most likely he is just evolutionary stronger version of mimicking spiders, we saw earlier in the deepnest. He never was a bug. 4. Vessels are supposed to not have will, but all of shown Vessels have it. Broken Vessel bows to us, Hollow knight gets infected (so, he has thoughts, dreams and so on), mc does various things, that prove having will.
Maybe the vessel grew simply because he's been placed in the black temple? Hornet mentions its energies sustain your kind (something along those lines), so there's something to support it at least
@@austinmiller2170 Both of you are completely wrong, the game isn't undertale; the player isn't canon. Higher beings refer to gods like the Pale King, White Lady and the Radiance. Kingsoul even has a description where it says it marks the union between two higher beings, where do people get that the game is being meta?
@@austinmiller2170 In addition, others can read those tablets, they start with saying 'Higher beings, these words are for you alone' to butter up people who are visiting Hallownest. This is obvious from the fact that it's propaganda, especially when one claims Hallownest is the one and only true kingdom.
1. They were slightly infected but they infection was them them being reverted to creatures who act only upon instinct, not upon their own volition. After the radiance's call starts leaking out she physically takes control of the the bugs, with a sort of hive mind. 2. He was trained to prime form and suddenly had a growth spurt because of the intense training 3. Dunno, hes a weirdo. 4. (This one is a personal theory but lots of lore tablets and character dialogue back this up, at least from my perspective) The vessels 𝘥𝘰 have a will, thats why they were unsuccessful. The hollow knight failed because of a "idea instilled". This is suggested to be the love for his father, the pale king. If they can climb out of the void, escape the void randomly sometimes, be trained, and have love they clearly do have a "will" but what the pale king seemed to mean was a something that doesn't have desire (however he likely just didn't know if it was will or desire that the radiance abused, or maybe it was an oversight on his part, i can only assume), only acting apon what it must do. And in addition to this when the knight is revealed to be the lord of shades the hunter (i believe) says that the void binded to the knights will, as he had fully accepted himself for what he was, this happens after dream nailing the egg. The vessels have wills, just no desire. The knight had an extremely strong and powerful will and was able to bind with the void because of it. The hollow knight had a will but he also had desire because of the love for his father. His desire was to he with his father instead of being chained up and the Radiance was able to bind with it. This is a theory but it makes sense in my opinion
1º they are actually dominated by an entity called radiance, at first it only dominates them by having them controlled, but then radiance gives them even more strength just to stop our character. 2º it is assumed that the vessels are the children of the pale king and white lady that they were supposed to be perfect and have no aspirations to be able to contain Radiance, but an aspiration or feeling that made radiance take advantage was appreciation for his father the pale king, that's why the hollow knight didn't work either. Enough to retain radiance, the king imagined this, which is why he created more protection with the black egg and the dreamers, but in response to your question, it was simply radiance himself who gave the hollow knight more power and who uses his own Void inside it to get bigger. As an interesting fact, Hollow knight himself recovers his sanity when you fight against him, so he tries to hurt himself and help you kill him. 3rd Nosk is an experiment of the pale king created by the forces of emptiness, if he knows the thoughts of our character or other vessels , it is because we are part of that same void. 4º in reality it does not have will because we are the ones who manage it, that is why it is the perfect vessel. As a last piece of information, the pale king is actually the metamorphosis of a wyrm, which were like super powerful beings that lived for millennia, when he transformed he was looking for a place to dominate and he arrived at hollownest, and he tried to free them from the manipulation of radiance and he succeeded. for a time, from there the city of tears and all the infrastructures of the game arose. All the information is from a channel in Spanish called Fedelobo, and sorry for my English, I have used the google translator
The knight you play as isn’t guaranteed to be lacking a will, I mean, the Hollow Knight and Sealed Siblings are both considered “bad endings” for a reason, which is why the “good ending” involves you using your will, the will do shunned by the Pale King, to defeat the Radiance. The entire point of the Pale King is that despite his prescient nature, perhaps even IN spite of it, he still made wrong decisions at every turn. His choice to create a Hollow Vessel: Wrong. (Morally challenged to just condemn and seal away the hundreds of his spawn not deemed “perfect”) His method of raising that “perfect” Vessel: Wrong. (He should not have been present, as it developed pride from his affection) His backup plan once the knight contained the infection: wrong. (He thought he could escape into the dreams of his guard and outlast the infection) His entire approach to Radiance: Wrong. (Had he simply created a vessel capable of challenging it rather than containing it indefinitely, that would have rid him of any risk in a scenario where the knight failed to contain) The Knight you play as is a defiant example of everything he did wrong, and what he could have accomplished if not for his cowardice.
1. It says in the journal you showed that that they are totally overrun by the infection It first infected only their minds, bending their will but then there was so much that it overflowed into those blobs that make them explode and the fully orange eyes shows that their mind isn’t just warped but completely deranged, hence those guys committing suicide. 2. I believe that to properly grow a vessel has to be fully nurtured and trained by the pale king, and that happened to the hollow knight since he was chosen 3. He’s a different breed He seems to store the infection in his belly pouch or maybe radiance saw that he was so good at killing potential vessels that could lead to his demise that he decided warping his mind would make him less useful And he transforms for the creeps 4. He has only one will - it end or contain the radiance. This stems his choices during the game that lead to the end of the game, and once the radiance is contained within him, he has accomplished his will and thus has none. Or he kills the radiance and in that case it’s not a problem anymore
About 4th question I think the concept of void is different from what we think, it's not complete lack of anything, it's more like it's the lack of dream because that is the whole point of creating vessels, to be able to contain the radiance without getting controlled by her through dreams like every other bug If this is what the devs meant they clearly didn't communicate it correctly
1.when you get a dreamer and get rid of 1 of the dreamers protection from the radience,its influance increases 2.they dont grow,but as he was trained and became more profound at fighting he grew like his skill 3.nosk is a beast who kills beasts and uses their bodys as bait to lure in prey 4.OH NY GOD MY BRAIN IS KABOOM
#1 the infected crossroads enemies change because the hollow nights seals have been broken and the radiance's infection is able to manifest in greater power than before. #2 the vessels like the knight we play as are purely empty so they probably do not grow because of that. The hollownight however, is not truly hollow like the knight, instead it is believed that because of the pale king being able to give sentience to bugs, his power probably gave the hollowknight a mind and it therefore, was not truly "hollow" #3 not so sure how bosk has his ability, it's probably just a trait he got from his species upbringing but he is able to change shape because he turns into the thing you desire most to lure you away. #4 this is purely speculation but because of the dialogue the radiance gives when dreamnailed: "ANCIENT ENEMY" leads me to think that the vessel is being controlled more by the void than anything with its wish to destroy that angry god Some of this is probably incorrect but it's just what I remember from watching mossbags videos
Remember when you get void heart. That’s when you become the radiances enemy you become the patron of the void the radiances ancient enemy. Radiance = reflections of light and heat. Void=pure black and emptiness. Pure black can’t result in a radiance as it absorbs the light.
the crossroads can get infected even without opening the seal actually. on my 2nd playthrough i haven't killed any dreamers and the crossroads are already infected.
#1: Like any disease, the Infection gets worse the longer the victim has it. Also, throughout the game you're weakening the seal on the Black Egg Temple, which is likely releasing more Infection as you go on. #2: Remember that the Vessels are actually biological creatures. They were sired by the Pale King, and their eggs were laid by the White Lady. They only became vessels because their eggs were incubated in the Abyss. As for why some are more grown up than others, it's implied that Void has time-slowing or even halting properties, so the Vessels trapped in the Abyss after the Pale King sealed it off didn't grow up because they were in a place where time doesn't flow. The Hollow Knight/Pure Vessel grew up because they were able to develop outside of the Abyss. The Vessel we play as likely only escape the Abyss very recently, which is why they're still a baby when we play as them. #3: This is more in the realm of headcanon, but I think that Nosk is, to at least some degree, psychic. As an apex predator, it likely evolved psychic powers to read the minds of prey, and use the information gained to disguise itself using illusions. #4: This is the big flaw in the Pale King's plans; he meant for the Vessels to not have wills, yet they obviously do. The Knight goes out of their way to help others even when it takes them away from their main goal and the Broken Vessel reaches out to you when they die and even leave behind a lingering ghost. Even the Hollow Knight/Pure Vessel probably had a will, as while they are deleted so how canon they are is debatable, there were lines in the code in earlier versions that showed their thoughts about who they are that suggest that they were worried about their possible failure, as well as them thinking about the Pale King.
vessels do not grown because they are undead. there is natural size variety in them though. THK was artificially grown by PK. vessels were intended to have a will. PK did not intend for vessels to lack a will.
For no.4, I've always had the personal headcannon that the vessels can and will do anything to achieve their end goal. (such as marking a map, or buying a charm) So they don't have a mind, just super highly advanced instincts. Hornet even mentions this - you can see vessel corpses all over hallownest - her job is to defeat the unworthy vessels trying to contain the infection, so the vessels gravitate towards the black egg to try and replace the hollow knight. Once the player defeats hornet twice, she realises that they may be the vessel that can change hallownest's stasis and actually defeat the radiance. The knight's goal is to defeat the radiance - by containing it, killing it, or killing it in godhome, it's just that its instincts are so advanced that it almost functions as a mind.
Yet the knight is able to make choices irrelevant to stopping the infection, like giving people delicate flowers. Steel Soul Jinn who knows about the void says the knight has a will of it's own if it refuses to trade (which in of itself requires a will). Hornet herself at the abyss says The Knight has a choice. The description of the void heart says it unifies the void under the bearer's WILL.
my theory about the will of vessels is that pure vessel had no will, hollow knight (like most of them) had a just enough to get infected and the player is a vessel with so strong will, that it overcomed the infection
The Vessel one is my favourite question out of these, since there's so many little contradictions that make it confusing. You could just say "The infection makes them grow" and the evidence is that Broken Vessel is larger than other vessels, along with THK. But that's easily disproved as BV is only infected after the Knight enters the room. Before it's just a dead Vessel. And as for THK, Pure Vessel proves it grew that large without infection. So then, what if it's natural growth? Birthplace destroys this theory, since the Knight and THK are the same size, yet the Knight hasn't grown at all since then. So why do they grow? My personal belief is thst it might be to do with training. But as usual, there's a contradiction! Broken Vessel has no proof and being trained, and no reason either. And if it's to do with power, the Knight easily disproves that from its feats. So yeah, it's just one of those mysteries we'll probably never know, similar to the death of the King.
The hollow knight was likely trained to that size afterall baby’s start out tiny and can get huge and it would make sense for it to be trained incase the seal breaks it would need to fend off the infection and the reason the hollow knight loses to us is because it’s impure and gets infected essentially weakening it because it now has emotion and is being leached on by the infection.
The best guess I can come up with after reading more comments is that vessels can grow through the actions of or maybe just being around the White Lady or Pale King, or maybe exposure to void. It could even be some of all of them. Broken Vessel is found not too far away from both the Abyss and the old location of the White Palace, which could explain its size just by being close to either. And THK being the largest known vessel could be modified by the Pale King in a process similar to the creation of kingsmolds, or something given in some way by the White Lady. The vessel found dead in Greenpath is on the other side of Hallownest and looks about the same size as other vessel
My guess is vessels do grow on their own like any other creature but we don't get to see that in-game, like how the grimmchild is implied to grow into another full-sized Troupe master but it's still a youngling in the game
I think the knight has a will, since its controlled by the llayer. It makes the sealed ending even more tragic than it already is, since your efforts will be undone eventually anyways
My guess for question #4 is that the vessel creatures are naturally programmed to do whatever they can to defeat the radiance, or at least keep the infection sealed away.
Honestly I Always thought that the PC was actually without will and thats why it is the only one able to actually contain the infection. In the finaly cutscene of the standart ending and the sealed siblings ending you can see the infection in the eyes of the knight be destroyed or absorbed by its void
2. I think that the vessels hatched from the eggs in the abyss and the one to climb up was the hollow knight so because it didn't fall it didn't break it's skull, there by it was still alive and was able to grow
The god-seeker expansion talks about void being given focus, a pin-hole dedication towards which to aim it's will, the pale king tried to make a *being with no will,* probably unaware that such a thing is an oxymoron, you can't possibly have a mind to funnel the radiance into without there being a way for the radiance to interact with it because the radiance would only ever interact with things she could infect, you can't beat her at her own game, the hollow knight, I believe, is the result of this attempt at creating a mindless mind, meanwhile, us in the dream-no-more and god-seeker endings rather achieve a "focus" through which to orchestrate the power of the void, I say that our vessel is very much capable of creating attachments and having thoughts, at least through us, but it's their/our ability to focus which makes them capable of resisting and even defeating the radiance.
1, Infection is at like stage 3/5 at that point. 2, Vessels can grow, but most died. Given how Vessels are "born of Wyrm and Root", they likely grow similar to how the White Lady, a sentient plant, grows. They require light, which can't happen in the Abyss. Sidenote: Broken Vessel did grow, as it was noticeably larger than the Knight. The Knight doesn't grow for an unknown reason. Maybe because he left the Pale King's beacon? 3, Nosk can "read minds" but it's actually probably just that Nosk can pickup on the thoughts and memories of other creatures. The Knight has no thoughts though, so it just imitates the Knight. 4. Though no Vessel has the ability to think, they do have a purpose that was ingrained in them at birth. A core instinct, which is to seal the Radiance. In other words, the Knight isn't thinking, it is just taking the actions it "feels" are correct. Like how when you get hungry, you go looking for food. You aren't actually thinking about it, but you are doing it. gaminkill said it's because Vessels have "No will to break" and said this means their will just has to be unbreakable. This is blatantly contradictory and wrong. They also said this happens because they get the Voidheart, but the Voidheart is an optional item, therefor, not important. I will correct them by saying: Vessels do not have the ability to think, that would be a weakness the Radiance can and does exploit. The Vessels do not require the Voidheart, otherwise the Hollow Knight would be sealing the Radiance already. Heck, the whole reason the story happens is because the Knight gets called back to Hallownest by the Radiance's cry. And the cry escapes the Hollow Knight because it has just 1 single thought in it.
Yet the knight is able to make choices irrelevant to stopping the infection, like giving people delicate flowers. Steel Soul Jinn who knows about the void says the knight has a will of it's own if it refuses to trade (which in of itself requires a will). Hornet herself at the abyss says The Knight has a choice. The description of the void heart says it unifies the void under the bearer's WILL. Also lost kin bows to the knight when you beat it.
@@stuffstuff3455 On the contrary, isn't the Knight simply doing what others tell it to? Grey Mourner tells it to take the flower. Where it ends up is the player's choice, but in-world, it would simply be making mistakes, because it's not thinking about where the flower is intended to go. Jinn says it has a will of its own if it refuses to trade because Jinn is pretty much telling you to trade, as does Jiji. Give us eggs and we'll give you treasure, basically. Hornet says the Knight has a choice, but again, it's acting on instinct. Would its job be better done if it seals the Radiance, or attacks it in the Dream Realm? It follows its only instinct to decide which path it takes. Which leads to 2 different endings, making both choices canon. Voidheart does unify the Void under the bearer's will, but does the Knight have will in the first place? Nope. So the Void will follow the knight, but the Knight's head is still empty. Lost Kin doesn't bow to the Knight, nor does Broken Vessel. They both lift their head and reach out to the Knight when they die. Furthermore, it was infected, so it clearly had a will, which is why it died.
@@MorganSaph The Knight wasn't doing what it was told. Jinn's dialogue is only triggered by doing THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF WHAT IT WAS TOLD TO DO. The knight wasn't told to give flowers to OTHER NPCS. Both I made clear in my initial comment. "player choice" can't change what characters already know. Jinn KNOWS about the void and said the knight has a will of it's own. Also delicate flower ending. Team cherry said all endings are canon, so giving flowers what the knight's choice, as no one told it to give a flower to godseeker. How can the void unify under a will that doesn't exist? why put that in the description in the first place if a will is not needed? The lost kin does bow you dirty liar. Once you wake up after beating it, it's spirit appears and you use the "accept" prompt it bows. ua-cam.com/video/nGK8SVghqF0/v-deo.html look at 2:54 of this video. Your blatant lie about lost kin and you ignoring how the knight did the opposite of what it was told to do, completely misrepresenting my argument, it's clear your just a dirty liar.
"though no vessel has the ability to think" then why are they all thrown to the abyss? the point of vessels in the game is that they all have a mind and emotion unlike the pale king wanted, which is why a lot of them are thrown to the abyss. the hollow knight is special because he's the one with the least emotion so the pale king took him out of the abyss to contain radiance, but when he trained the hollow knight, the hollow knight formed some kind of bond with him and made him fail to contain the radiance which led to hallownest going into shit.
This is the plot's big point. The hollow knight has will. This is why the vessel was possessed. The hollow knights were supposed to have no will but they have, just a little but this is enough. The king didn't notice it. And this is why the game exists at all. The king wanted to stop the infection and he couldn't. He needed someone without will and he thought he created one but he actually didn't. And you are supposed to prolong the time of the infection being captured(2 endings), or to destroy the infection(the only good ending).
There is a broken egg in the white palace, my theory is that, similar to the eggs in their birthplace, it was sort of a specialized incubator for the HK to reach its final form
Im not sure if that exists, but if it's in the White Palace instead of the Abyss, it's probably Hornet's egg as they wouldn't be certain before they hatch.
1. yes it's just the hopeless stage of infection ( even if the Radians is dead they won't be cured but they will die) 2. the hollow knight has feeling and mind ( because of the bale king) so he grew up 3. nosk is some kind of a parasite that can access mind of its bray, but the knight doesn't have a mind, so it accessed some memories, that's why the knight defeated nosk but other vessels couldn't. 4. yes the knight is actually controlled by a higher being, and it's the shade lord( the huge shade monster in the god home ending) and the player is actually the shade lord that controls the knight, so that it can be awaken, which is why the god home ending is the best because the shade lord (the player) achieved his real goal, and is awake now to rule what was left of hallonest.
Ok, self proclaimed somewhat expert on HK lore here 1. Yeah, you kinda get it right. Like, Myla is a bit infected at the start, loosing sanity, but still speaking and not atacking, and then just becoming mindless husk attacking everyone in sight. 2. I kinda.. don't know for sure myself. My theory is that he was either trained to grow, or that either King or Queen has influenced his growth with their power. But there is The Broken Vessel for example, that is partially grown. Maybe, it's under infections influence, maybe, vessels just grow naturally, outside of the abyss, who knows. 3. He has always been like that, i think. These are his methods to hunt, achieved evolutionary , no different from claws or tooth. Its just that deep nest is messed up with how dangerous predators there are. 4. They aren't supposed to have a will of their own, that's right, but the Pale King haven't achieved that, so they have a will, and can make decisions.
The knight/ghost/vessel that you play as makes conscious, logical decisions. Like a robot. He has no free will, but does as he needs to in order to complete his task.
1. Yes, they get more infected. 2. The vessels do grow but it was likely that THE Hollow Knight has lived for a long time and has been raised by the Pale King in a specific way. 3. Nosk is likely another failed Vessel which wasn't successfully discarded or escaped to Deepnest which explains its great power. Its sinister behaviour may be learned. 4. A vessel's lack of will is the problem with the whole game, but it's narratively brilliant. The Hollow Knight is failing to contain the infection despite being the 'perfect vessel', so we take over. But who's to say we don't fail as well? Unless we defeat Radiance, we fail as far as I see. This begs the question: Can life exist without free will? Also, we probably just point at things we want to buy.
1 yes they are just more infected now, 2 the vessels grow and he was trained to prime form, 3 nosk is a bug similar to the other corpse things down there that is using vessel bodies, he is just a really good mimicking spider, and 4 the knight may or may not be 100% hollow, void heart suggests it has a will and void itself can be given form mind focus etc, so it is likely in some way alive/sentient enough to do those things
1. Yes, but it's in a significantly more advanced stage. 2. Vessels are children. Most die or get killed, so they don't have the chance to grow. As for why our vessel (who is the same age as THK) doesn't grow, it's probably due to being away from the Void and/or the Pale King's influence. 3. Nobody knows anything about Nosk, other than he's creepy as hell. My best guess is he's a fragment of void substance that somehow got infected. 4. We have a will. The plan of using Vessels was flawed from the start because they all had minds and wills, that's why we have to either become the new Vessel and restart the cycle or confront the Radiance and end the infection for good.
Once you take the monarch wings the winds stop. This somehow allowed the infection to spread harder overcharging the enemies All vessels had wills except the hollow knight he was perfectly hollow but the kings affection gave the hollow knight will,emotions and personality Since the player character learns amazing nail skills and good magic skills but stays the same the hollow knight prolly got empowered in some way possibly drinking more void to enhanche its size like eating a fuck ton of protein so your muscles grow faster Nosk judging from his behaviors was some transforming predatory bug and the infection just juiced him
1.they were already infected, but as you release the dreamers the seal on the black egg temple door weakens which causes it to spill out more. Crossroads is that area in the map which is why the infection is greatest there. 4.the hollow knight and the vessel both have will, they just have no desires. The radiance infects bugs through their desires promising them what they want. The hollow knight had no desires and was willing to be sealed, but right before he was he wanted to earn his father's respect/love(pale king). The radiance fed on that weakening the seal right as it was made. The hollow knight does make choices, but never seems to want anything or to make connections with others. So when you replace the hollow knight, the radiance is consumed within you and your hollow soul.
Since I’m on my first playthrough I’m not the best person to try to take a gander at the lore, but from all I know and a little interpretation, at least for the very first one, once you beat broken vessel or your first dreamer, the infection plaguing all bugs in the crossroads, which is where the black egg is located, goes from mild to massively increased by the radiance as most likely something of a defense mechanism, especially if it happens after beating your first dreamer, it knows that that’s one seal out of three broken, and it’s only a matter of time before either you come to take THK’s place, starting the cycle over and either trapping it for another long period of time or possibly for good, or ending the radiance yourself rather then becoming yet another “succeeded” vessel. In short, I think the infected crossroads is a defense mechanism because it knows “oh shit, one dreamer down, two more and I’m stuck here for even longer/over with for good”. Edit: as for the knight, I wasn’t aware that, although it should’ve been obvious, it was thrown into the abyss with the others for a reason, that being it does have some sort of will, therefore there can’t be holding the radiance for good, only restarting the cycle for longer.
Not necessarily, the pale king and white lady didn't discriminate their children, they cast them into the abyss in order to fill them with void. Then they waited for the first one to climb up, that being the hollow knight, as shown in the birthplace cutscene.
To answer the question of how the hollow knight grew so much, the vessels are all spans of the pale king and white lady combined with void making them mostly higher beings so most likely the combination of void with a higher being leaf to the growth that happened to the knoghty
1. More infected. If you have a cold and are not trying to heal yourself or can't, you get more sick 2. The vessels do grow, some of the vessels in nosk's arena are taller than you'd expect, also the broken vessel/lost kin are as tal as us, but they are hunched forward, if they were straight they'd be taller than us 3. Maybe nosk made a copy of our knight from the discarded vessels and he was just walking in the ground, similar to how he jumps to the top 4. We (the knight) have (has) a will. The "hollow" knight was corrupted by an idea instilled (most likely the scene at the end of path of pain. Also the "idea" might be love or compassion to his father). The infection also can only take hold of you if you dream, not if you have a will. (The knight doesn't dream, he goes into other people's dream). This is why the white lady says the hollow knight had an idea instilled, not a will to break
I’m pretty sure that the vessels cannot grow on their own, and they must be trained to do so. Which explains why the hollow knight is the only one who is big, because somewhere in the game (I don’t remember where) it says that the hollow knight was trained while the others werent
1. The infected bugs are now fully bloated and overrun even though they were infected. 2.there is nothing really stating that vessels can’t grow. You could be confused because the player doesn’t but that has no real answer and is most likely something that the king did 3.nose is predator that reads the mind of bugs and disguises itself as the loved ones to lure and kill prey. 4.the knight is not fully hollow until obtaining the void heart and then they operate purely like a machine rather than a creature
1) you kill a dreamer ->black egg opens a bit -> gives radiance more room for influence -> more plague. That is also the reason why it’s only the crossroads, it’s the closest to black egg 2) both the knight and hollow knight are basically the same age but the difference is that one vessel spent his time in abyss and outside the kingdom while other was trained in the palace. I think the one that grew in palace was not only trained but also upgraded in a way that led to his growth. We have charms that extend the length of a nail, why can’t there be some magical artefact that vastly increases growth 3) nosk doesn’t transform, he compresses himself into a disguise. But I raise a question why does he has the same mask as the knight since each vessel is unique 4) I don’t think it’s a part of the lore but the knight doesn’t have will, it’s just we as a player guide him. We are the higher being that controls him while he still is hollow and perfect for sealing the plague
Yet the knight is able to make choices irrelevant to stopping the infection, like giving people delicate flowers. Steel Soul Jinn who knows about the void says the knight has a will of it's own if it refuses to trade (which in of itself requires a will). Hornet herself at the abyss says The Knight has a choice. The description of the void heart says it unifies the void under the bearer's WILL.
@@stuffstuff3455 the choices are made by the player. The knight is as hollow as he can be, if we don’t interfere, he would not move or do anything at all. Rejecting trade or giving flower is a will of a player. The choices made by the player Besides the opening cutscene, there isn’t a point in the game where the knight does something without our input the last one is probably the only problem with my theory, I can’t really disprove it
The npcs directly respond to the player's choices, so it was intended to be the knight's choices. The double down, the delicate flower ending. The devs definitely intended on the knight giving flowers to be a choice on the knight's part, otherwise they wouldn't make a whole new ending. Also you ignored my point about Hornet directly telling the knight it has a choice in the abyss.
@@thatlittlemonstrositythe "player" is not a canon entity, the knight DOES decisions nobody tells it to, implying it has a will. You said "if we didn't interfere at all it wouldn't even move" that's just wrong, all the other vessel could and definetly moved without any exterior interference.
@@thatlittlemonstrosity higher beings doesn't refer to the player, it's referring to things like Grimm, Pale King, Radiance, etc. we the player isn't canon, it's our knight's journey, not ours.
"Call of the void" indeed. Void seems to become a hivemind like the Godseekers once you obtain Voidheart and "Unite the void under the bearers will". Which is funny cause Radiance also has a hivemind thing going on...
From my perspective. The reason the Ghost can make decisions is because he's not perfect. Deciding shows that he has a will, something he shouldn't and the clue that indicates that the infection will return because Radiance will control him like his brother.
about number one as u progress through the game the infection gets so bad it becomes physic, that can be seen in the enemies and in those stupid blocked passages at last that’s what i think
you do have a will, it would've not be a problem that the king sacrificed thousands of your kind if it wasn't the case but the game clearly wants to make it clear that the action of the king where ruthless seeing how much of a gloomy and sad place is the abyss. and remember that you are void and it is said that the void had/has a will of his own in the void tendrils journal entry, sorry for my bad english
It says you have no will to break which means you have no will or an unbreakable will but your character knows its purpose and most likely acts on that like an AI told to do a task. So it would make sense for the character to not have a will but act the way it does because a higher being which is you, told it to do what it does.
that line from PK's speech is not literal. TK is explicitly said to have a will many times, and you can see this through its actions as well. it seems like youre suggesting the player is a canon entity and that is not true either. purely baseless and unprecedented
My theory about the vessels having a will when they aren't supposed to is that it's a paradox. So they do have a will and mind, but at the same time they don't. Or at least they don't have a will and mind in a way that the radiance can infect it
There are a lot of theories about Nosk. The one I think is the most reasonable is the one that says that is an infected-warped Corpse Creeper. I don't remember all the points, but there are a lot.
@@kitpaovm8537pretty heavily implied that the only reason the hollow knight wasn't truly hollow was because it had a connection to the pale king, a connection that the knight lacks. This is further proven by the white lady telling the knight that it is unblemished while the hollow knight isn't. Perhaps it is purpose that drives the vessels, because the knight returned to the kingdom to seal the infection
@@epicmenace1303 but the king and queen were wrong one time, they could be wrong again. Also, through the game you do some decisions (and achievements) that imply a conection with the others (saving zote, killing/not killing Mila, staying with quirrel for a while after his master's death, not killing the nail blacksmith, fighting oniric zote for no reason, wanting to do the path of pain for no reason, completing the hunters diary, fighting oniric Warriors, etc) the game enables paths that demonstrate the knight feels something, (when you die, your Shadow Is referred to as a regret, a feeling) so It also enables endings where "not feeling" is not the only solution, and not the optimal one. Wouldn't you rather attack the source if you can? You are given the dream nail for a reason, and the solution from a long time ago is not always the best solution to today's problem
If you answer every question to a story, things will get over complicated, and fans will get bored when their curiosity is abruptly satisfied. Lore is lore, but fun game mechanics don’t always have to follow the rules.
The reason the hollow knight is bigger is because he was fed royal jelly or something like that. thats how bees become queens or get different jobs they get fed beebread or honey
The vessel has a will, voidheart says your will needs to be unbreakable so in my mind that explains purchases too because the knights will to contain the radiance is pure and buying things is a step on that path
about number 2, this has to have samething to do with the time it spend with the king, since that’s what’s different between him and the other vessels, besides it been hollow, wich i don’t think had anything to do with it
1. Yes. The infection gets stronger as more of it is seeping out of the Black Egg 2. Unanswered, but I assume its because only the Hollow Knight had proper nurturing and training from birth. The other vessels were deprived and their growth stunted. 3. Nosk is just Nosk (yeah no answer). 4. The obvious answer is that The Knight isn't hollow. No vessels were. They were just exceptionally strong willed due to the void within them. To elaborate on that, The Radiance and Void clearly have a storied history of conflict we arent fully aware of - for example, she refers to The Void as an "ancient enemy". The Godseekers "tune" gods. This power isnt elaborated on too much, but it is seemingly able to commune with strong creatures at their peak strength, regardless of time. Pure Vessel, White Defender, Grimm, etc. They must have inadvertently tuned the original Shade Lord too (the giant void entity that kills The Radiance in Embrace the Void). The Godseekers accidentally unified the void again themselves, causing it to run rampant in Hallownest. The Void is weak to (and hates) light (see the lighthouse in The Abyss). Maybe a shared instinct among even the disordered void is to quell any and all light. This is backed up by the fact The Void very likely also killed the Pale King, a being that radiated his own pale light. So when any light bringing god arrives, the void unifies to see it be snuffed out. It isnt always successful however, especially if the being is outwith its reach (the radiance's shrine is atop the crystal peaks) TL;DR: Void hates light, light beats Void. The Pale King inadvertently made void beings that are not only independent of the void hive mind while in their bodies, but are also of higher, godly birth. They can reach and defeat The Radiance with their godlike strength and support of the void hivemind, or contain it within themselves for a time due to their iron wills.
The vessels were meant to have no will, but the vessel plan failed, as if the hollow knight had no will then they would have contained the infection forever without issue, the reason its cracking and the infection has returned to hallownest is because the hollow knight had a will but it concealed it to make its father proud, and that love for its father is what the radiance used to break it.
My headcanon is that the knight actually has feelings and a will cuz we've seen the hollow knight who was tought to be the perfect vessel starting to have emotions so I think that every vessels can feel things
The reason we have a will is because there ISN’T a “perfect” vessel They said the same thing about the hollow knight and look what happened to them The only thing they could do before the knight came along is prolong the infection by throwing vessels at the problem and buy time
for #4, the character definitely has a will. The radiance infects a person's soul, so the Pale King made hundreds or maybe thousands of children out of the void in hopes that at least one of them would have absolutely no soul. No will to break, no mind to think, no voice to cry suffering. The King chose the Hollow Knight as the vessel because he thought it truly had no soul. Obviously though, he was wrong. The radiance infects the soul of the Hollow Knight and through it starts to leak back out into hallownest. If the Hollow Knight had a soul, and therefore a will, and the player character is supposedly less hollow that the hollow knight, then it makes sense that the Knight has a will too.
Not sure about 1 and 3 but my take on 2 and 4 are that for 4 the knight is a defective vessel and obtained a will after being cast aside. For 2 It is stated that after being taken he grew a substantial amount and I think it might be because he did not remain in the void as long making his vessel a more pure form of the knights. Kind of like how big hornets crown is a lot bigger because she did not spend time in the void
The vessels do have wills and minds, the Pale King just made an incorrect assumption. A popular idea is that the Knight has an indomitable will compared to HK
1. They become *completely overrun* by their infection, due to their proximity to the black egg 2. The Hollow Knight vessel is different, as he had an idea instilled and grew to his goals 3. Nosk is a fucking weirdo 4. The hollow Knight has no will or emotions, so its best to think of him as going through the motions for his goal of defeating the infection
1. Yes. They were infected before and now become even more infected as more infection is spread. 2. The Vessels do grow but not simply by aging as the Hollow Knight isn’t any older than the other Vessels. It is unknown what is the trigger for them to grow. 3. Nosk is a mystery. It is not even clear if he really has been infected but we have seen some bugs retain higher amount of intelligence once infected like the Moss Prophet. 4. The Knight (like all Vessels) does have a will. That is the Pale King’s biggest mistake and what allowed the Radiance to take over the Hollow Knight. The Knight went out of its way to defy its original purpose in the Dream No More ending.
That last part actually makes a lot of sense. The fact that you have the decision to conquer the Radiance boss, which technically wasn't the job of the vessels. It was just to withhold the infection to allow Hallownest to last eternal.
1. The bugs are attempting to resist the infection, thus they become more infected. 2. The training that the vessel goes through makes him grow. 3. Nosk is most likely one of the escaped vessels, infected, seeing as there is void which probably allows him to shape shift. 4. The knight most likely does have a will, as making something "hollow" isn't possible. This is backed up by the void hearts charm description as it says it unites the void under the wearers will.
I liked the Nosk theory. I've also heard many people say the pure vessel grew because of training. It's not 100% proven though, which is why it's in this video.
@@WyvrnOnYT Personally, the pure vessel theory makes the most sense to me because it explains why the knight/other vessels didn't grow. Another piece of proof for it is the soul scholars. They "mastered" soul usage and they became swollen, thus they grew. And we know that the Pure Vessel at least knows how to use soul because of his fight in the Hall of Gods, in which the files calls one of his attacks a "focus" attack. Seeing as focus is often used when talking about soul, (see the soul sanctum lore tablets and the kings pass lore tablets) it's safe to say the Pure Vessel's Training including mastering soul in a safe way, causing them to grow.
@@noahclendenon It definitely makes the most sense compared to any other theory. Although I'm not sure that the real bugs in the soul sanctum area would grow using soul the same way that the Hollow Knight would.
@@WyvrnOnYT You're most likely correct, seeing as the bugs in the soul sanctum swell, while the Pure Vessel, with more high quality knowledge of soul, grew. They also would most likely have better resistance to the adverse effects of soul, being a higher being (see the knight).Though, this is all just a theory, so who knows?
1: The infection has different stages, for examplel, in the first stage the infected have no symptoms. In the second stage they start having violet thoughts and visions of the radiance. In the third stage they start loosing their intelligence and identity, and also start to see the infection as a "blessing'. In the fourth stage their eyes become orange and they basically become the enemies you early-game. And lastly, in the final stage (at least of the stages we've seen), the infection takes a physical toll on the host, like we see in the infected crossroads(also, this is not the official explanation, just me trying to make one that fits what we know about the lore and tone of the game). 2: The hollow knight got trained to reach a vessel's true potential. 3: Nosk is probably the bug version of a skinwalker. 4: We are actually not playing as a vessel, but instead, as Asriel Dreemour from undertale, just like Kris!
Lost kin is infected (caused by the radiance) and is bigger the knight so if the hollow knight absorbed the radiance then it grew so it’s probably something to do with the infection and the radiance
Translate it: 1.Los insectos de cruces olvidados ya estaban infectados lo que pasa es que como avanzas en el juego , al mismo tiempo avanza la infección. 2. El Hollow knight si crecio ya que fue "entrenado" por el rey pálido y no fue desechado como las demás vessels y el caballero no sé tal vez el nació después del Hollow knight al igual que Hornet . 3.Nosk es de una raza unica porque en el salon de los dioses dice que es el "Dios" de las criatura cambia-caras. 4. El caballero si tiene voluntad(emociones) y por eso fué desechado como las demás vessels.
I just wanted to mention that in kings pass the tutorial plaques that say “higher beings these words are for you alone” show the game controls so you could infer that we are a higher being that makes all of the decisions for the night
Even J.R.R. Tolkien, the master of lore himself, said that mysteries are fundamental for believable worldbuilding
Never heard that before but I dig it. Wise words indeed.
1.Yes,they were infected before, but they weren't completely overrun by the infection.
2.The Vessel itself does grow, however it begs the question why the knight isn't growing himself.
3.Nosk is in the creepiest place in the map, do you expect him to be normal?
4.when you get voidheart, one of the texts says "no will to break" which just means that the will has to be unbreakable, but it doesn't mean that you don't have one. Also, the reason the knight exists is to contain the Infection.
For the Hollow Knight one, it was probably because it was ‘trained to prime form’.
Could a 18 year old who’s never been to the gym be the size of a body builder of the same age?
Not exactly. A lot of people have the misconception about question 4.
The pale king says those things in the ascent sequence. As we know, this was a massive assumption for him, one which turned out to be false, as seen in the Hollow Knight.
The knight (the PC) is similar to the Hollow Knight in almost every way. It is evident that we have a Will of our own within the game.
We cannot hold the infection within ourselves forever, that is evident through the hollow knight
I mean, doesn't "no will to break" inherently mean that you don't have a will? They can't break it because there's nothing there to break.
@@Phantasmans That's probably the most probably option. It's kinda weird though because the hollow knight gets 10 times taller, and you don't really get taller by lifting. Trust me, I know from experience XD
@@SushiTrap313 doesn’t the white lady directly say that it doesn’t have the same flaw as the hollow knight (a will to break)?
My biggest question is why were primal aspids created. Just why.
I love the collective hatred for Primal Aspids
Fun fact! Team cherry enjoys every moment of suffering they've inflicted on the collective hollow knight community!
If we assume Aspid's are something created by the Radiance (it seemingly being byproduct of the infection) its probably her own vengeance lmao
I think they born of the same infection,they are a very big inconvenience exacly like the infection
ONG
1. Yes.
2. It takes a very long time. Remember, HK’s events mainly take place over the course of a day-a week.
3. My headcanon is that Nosk is a spider that combines the all-seeing power of the radiance with its own vast intellect to see the memories of its victims. For you, it comes up blank, so it just uses your face. As for shapeshifting, I think it’s the radiance morphing the creature’s body against its will.
4. Another headcanon, but I think that you are the void keeping the Knight together, and are the autonomous force interacting with the world through a vessel.
The thing is, the vessels arent hollow. Thats why they were thrown in the abyss, thats why the hollow knight failed, thats why the knight is able to deviate from his "purpose" to contain the infection abd go against the queen's wishes and fight radience, thats why the siblings stand with you and fond solace afterwards, its because the vessels were never hollow. Which makes the king even more cruel because all the void creatures in the mass grave he made were there because they could feel
They are also sealed in the abyss, because they attack everything. The void isn't a friendly power
The vessels weren't thrown in the void because they had wills, they were born in the void and forced to climb out, either the first one to make it to the top was chosen, or the pale king waited at the top for a vessel that he saw fit, casting the ones that weren't back down. After they finished they sealed them in there to his what actually happened down there, they were ashamed of what they did but they saw it as the only option.
The vessel you play as does jave a will. It has the same kind of will that the hollow Knight has. This is why the easiest ending is "bad". It means that the player containing the infection will ultimately fail just like it did with the hollow knight
This is false. We can see the infection completely eradicate inside the knight. They are truly hollow - however we control them, we have a will, and we do the decision they make.
I believe that the knight was born with the instinct to do whatever it takes to stop the infection, which is why it does things that would normally require it to have a will, he only does these things because it helps them get closer to sealing/stopping the infection.
@@massivebeefjerkyThe Hollow Knight actually called the knight we control, the dreamers say it in the second cutscene
WRONG
The hollow Knight has an imprinted will from the time it soent with the pale king. They developped a bond and as a result created impurities. Our knight is free from those impurities because it lost all memory of its past and thus has no bonds to inprint upon. This, however, changes if you go to the abyss and discover the truth
@@funtimegamer8733buying items from the shop, speaking to characters, upgrading your nail, and simply thinking is an example of having a "will". And the knight does all those things
The knight we play as was a rejected vessel, meaning he wasn’t as pure as the hollow knight, who had no will at all (allegedly). The hollow knight stabs himself during the fight so it’s reasonable to assume he has some shred of free will as well, meaning all the vessels are imperfect.
What do you mean the knight isnt pure?
@@ferak10 the knights were created to be beings without thought or soul, in order to remain uncorrupted. Rejected vessels were impure because they weren't fully uncorruptable.
@@brendopls But the knight we play as is the perfect vessel.
@@ferak10 wrong. In the endings were you only kill the hollow knight we still become infected
@@daredevil2_074 Ah ah ah, you contain the infection, not get infected.
a perfect vessel is supposed to have no will, but a perfect vessel does not yet exist.
For the fourth one, I always believed that that is because the vessels do have a will. We hear "no will to break" not from an objective source, but from a quote from the Pale King. He believed them to have no will, but as we know the Hollow Knight did have a mind and a will which was why it both got infected and could fight the infection. I believe the contradiction is to create discussion, "is the knight a truly hollow vessel, or because of his actions, can we assume he has a mind and will?" this dilemma is at the center of the question on what ending you believe is the best.
1. more infection is being released out of the temple because of the seals breaking so the infection gets more potent i guess
2. The journal entry for pure vessel says it is "raised and trained to prime form" so it could have to do with that or the nursery in the white palace
3. Nosk is Nosk
4. I don't really remember where, but I think it is alluded to somewhere that no vessel is truly hollow, either that or just because it is a game
"Nosk is Nosk" lmao, i love how nobody can explain Nosk 😂
@@Nyx.260Observe
Nosk is a heavily warped corpse creeper that can mimic people you love. If you search up "What kind of bug is nosk" it will tell you that nosk is a heavily warped corpse creeper. That's what nosk is
All vessels that where thrown in the void, had possibility some kind of emotion. Little Ghost could be one of them. It could also imply that the Hollow Knight didn't have any emotions at start.
@@ProbNotCrosshe probably didn’t have any at start but pale king unknowingly instilled them in him
@@slippyfruit8538 I think the pale king didn't want emotions to overwhelm his child, so I don't know why the pale kind would choose his "perfect vessel" to have emotions, even tho he threw possible thousands of vessels in the void because of this reason.
I think the best thing that explains the knight's decision making skills is that it simply heard the hollow knights call, and everything in the game is just him following that call.
Nosk reads the minds of its victims and then transforms into their loved ones to lure them deep into its layer. But since the knight has no feelings about anybody, Nosk gets confused and tries to mimic the knight itself.
How does it do that? I have no clue.
Man its a game about a bug swordsmen fighting and infection moth, surely a bug shapeshifting and imitating isnt a stretch
@@stinkymonke3622 fair point
I mean Nosk’s luring tactic definitely worked in me, I was just confused and curious on what that other knight was
1. They got more infection, after we get double jump or the dreamer.
2. As I remember, in Pure vessel journal entry, it's said to be trained by royalty, so probably that's the case here.
3. Most likely he is just evolutionary stronger version of mimicking spiders, we saw earlier in the deepnest. He never was a bug.
4. Vessels are supposed to not have will, but all of shown Vessels have it. Broken Vessel bows to us, Hollow knight gets infected (so, he has thoughts, dreams and so on), mc does various things, that prove having will.
Maybe the vessel grew simply because he's been placed in the black temple? Hornet mentions its energies sustain your kind (something along those lines), so there's something to support it at least
“Is he being controlled by a higher being?”
Yes, the player.
(Edit): Yall this is satire chill T^T
Exactly. Any time the game says "Higher beings, these words are for you," it tells you something about game mechanics.
@@austinmiller2170 i mean admittedly the knight is also a higher being
True
@@austinmiller2170 Both of you are completely wrong, the game isn't undertale; the player isn't canon. Higher beings refer to gods like the Pale King, White Lady and the Radiance. Kingsoul even has a description where it says it marks the union between two higher beings, where do people get that the game is being meta?
@@austinmiller2170 In addition, others can read those tablets, they start with saying 'Higher beings, these words are for you alone' to butter up people who are visiting Hallownest. This is obvious from the fact that it's propaganda, especially when one claims Hallownest is the one and only true kingdom.
1. They were slightly infected but they infection was them them being reverted to creatures who act only upon instinct, not upon their own volition. After the radiance's call starts leaking out she physically takes control of the the bugs, with a sort of hive mind.
2. He was trained to prime form and suddenly had a growth spurt because of the intense training
3. Dunno, hes a weirdo.
4. (This one is a personal theory but lots of lore tablets and character dialogue back this up, at least from my perspective) The vessels 𝘥𝘰 have a will, thats why they were unsuccessful. The hollow knight failed because of a "idea instilled". This is suggested to be the love for his father, the pale king. If they can climb out of the void, escape the void randomly sometimes, be trained, and have love they clearly do have a "will" but what the pale king seemed to mean was a something that doesn't have desire (however he likely just didn't know if it was will or desire that the radiance abused, or maybe it was an oversight on his part, i can only assume), only acting apon what it must do. And in addition to this when the knight is revealed to be the lord of shades the hunter (i believe) says that the void binded to the knights will, as he had fully accepted himself for what he was, this happens after dream nailing the egg. The vessels have wills, just no desire. The knight had an extremely strong and powerful will and was able to bind with the void because of it. The hollow knight had a will but he also had desire because of the love for his father. His desire was to he with his father instead of being chained up and the Radiance was able to bind with it. This is a theory but it makes sense in my opinion
If you think about it "ghost" was shown to be discarded along with the other failed knights so him having something like a will might be possible
1º they are actually dominated by an entity called radiance, at first it only dominates them by having them controlled, but then radiance gives them even more strength just to stop our character.
2º it is assumed that the vessels are the children of the pale king and white lady that they were supposed to be perfect and have no aspirations to be able to contain Radiance, but an aspiration or feeling that made radiance take advantage was appreciation for his father the pale king, that's why the hollow knight didn't work either. Enough to retain radiance, the king imagined this, which is why he created more protection with the black egg and the dreamers, but in response to your question, it was simply radiance himself who gave the hollow knight more power and who uses his own Void inside it to get bigger. As an interesting fact, Hollow knight himself recovers his sanity when you fight against him, so he tries to hurt himself and help you kill him.
3rd Nosk is an experiment of the pale king created by the forces of emptiness, if he knows the thoughts of our character or other vessels , it is because we are part of that same void.
4º in reality it does not have will because we are the ones who manage it, that is why it is the perfect vessel. As a last piece of information, the pale king is actually the metamorphosis of a wyrm, which were like super powerful beings that lived for millennia, when he transformed he was looking for a place to dominate and he arrived at hollownest, and he tried to free them from the manipulation of radiance and he succeeded. for a time, from there the city of tears and all the infrastructures of the game arose. All the information is from a channel in Spanish called Fedelobo, and sorry for my English, I have used the google translator
The knight you play as isn’t guaranteed to be lacking a will, I mean, the Hollow Knight and Sealed Siblings are both considered “bad endings” for a reason, which is why the “good ending” involves you using your will, the will do shunned by the Pale King, to defeat the Radiance. The entire point of the Pale King is that despite his prescient nature, perhaps even IN spite of it, he still made wrong decisions at every turn.
His choice to create a Hollow Vessel: Wrong. (Morally challenged to just condemn and seal away the hundreds of his spawn not deemed “perfect”)
His method of raising that “perfect” Vessel: Wrong. (He should not have been present, as it developed pride from his affection)
His backup plan once the knight contained the infection: wrong. (He thought he could escape into the dreams of his guard and outlast the infection)
His entire approach to Radiance: Wrong. (Had he simply created a vessel capable of challenging it rather than containing it indefinitely, that would have rid him of any risk in a scenario where the knight failed to contain)
The Knight you play as is a defiant example of everything he did wrong, and what he could have accomplished if not for his cowardice.
1. It says in the journal you showed that that they are totally overrun by the infection
It first infected only their minds, bending their will but then there was so much that it overflowed into those blobs that make them explode and the fully orange eyes shows that their mind isn’t just warped but completely deranged, hence those guys committing suicide.
2. I believe that to properly grow a vessel has to be fully nurtured and trained by the pale king, and that happened to the hollow knight since he was chosen
3. He’s a different breed
He seems to store the infection in his belly pouch or maybe radiance saw that he was so good at killing potential vessels that could lead to his demise that he decided warping his mind would make him less useful
And he transforms for the creeps
4. He has only one will - it end or contain the radiance. This stems his choices during the game that lead to the end of the game, and once the radiance is contained within him, he has accomplished his will and thus has none.
Or he kills the radiance and in that case it’s not a problem anymore
About 4th question I think the concept of void is different from what we think, it's not complete lack of anything, it's more like it's the lack of dream because that is the whole point of creating vessels, to be able to contain the radiance without getting controlled by her through dreams like every other bug
If this is what the devs meant they clearly didn't communicate it correctly
Zote was right all along
1.when you get a dreamer and get rid of 1 of the dreamers protection from the radience,its influance increases
2.they dont grow,but as he was trained and became more profound at fighting he grew like his skill
3.nosk is a beast who kills beasts and uses their bodys as bait to lure in prey
4.OH NY GOD MY BRAIN IS KABOOM
#1 the infected crossroads enemies change because the hollow nights seals have been broken and the radiance's infection is able to manifest in greater power than before.
#2 the vessels like the knight we play as are purely empty so they probably do not grow because of that. The hollownight however, is not truly hollow like the knight, instead it is believed that because of the pale king being able to give sentience to bugs, his power probably gave the hollowknight a mind and it therefore, was not truly "hollow"
#3 not so sure how bosk has his ability, it's probably just a trait he got from his species upbringing but he is able to change shape because he turns into the thing you desire most to lure you away.
#4 this is purely speculation but because of the dialogue the radiance gives when dreamnailed: "ANCIENT ENEMY" leads me to think that the vessel is being controlled more by the void than anything with its wish to destroy that angry god
Some of this is probably incorrect but it's just what I remember from watching mossbags videos
Remember when you get void heart. That’s when you become the radiances enemy you become the patron of the void the radiances ancient enemy. Radiance = reflections of light and heat. Void=pure black and emptiness. Pure black can’t result in a radiance as it absorbs the light.
the crossroads can get infected even without opening the seal actually. on my 2nd playthrough i haven't killed any dreamers and the crossroads are already infected.
#1: Like any disease, the Infection gets worse the longer the victim has it. Also, throughout the game you're weakening the seal on the Black Egg Temple, which is likely releasing more Infection as you go on.
#2: Remember that the Vessels are actually biological creatures. They were sired by the Pale King, and their eggs were laid by the White Lady. They only became vessels because their eggs were incubated in the Abyss. As for why some are more grown up than others, it's implied that Void has time-slowing or even halting properties, so the Vessels trapped in the Abyss after the Pale King sealed it off didn't grow up because they were in a place where time doesn't flow. The Hollow Knight/Pure Vessel grew up because they were able to develop outside of the Abyss. The Vessel we play as likely only escape the Abyss very recently, which is why they're still a baby when we play as them.
#3: This is more in the realm of headcanon, but I think that Nosk is, to at least some degree, psychic. As an apex predator, it likely evolved psychic powers to read the minds of prey, and use the information gained to disguise itself using illusions.
#4: This is the big flaw in the Pale King's plans; he meant for the Vessels to not have wills, yet they obviously do. The Knight goes out of their way to help others even when it takes them away from their main goal and the Broken Vessel reaches out to you when they die and even leave behind a lingering ghost. Even the Hollow Knight/Pure Vessel probably had a will, as while they are deleted so how canon they are is debatable, there were lines in the code in earlier versions that showed their thoughts about who they are that suggest that they were worried about their possible failure, as well as them thinking about the Pale King.
vessels do not grown because they are undead. there is natural size variety in them though. THK was artificially grown by PK.
vessels were intended to have a will. PK did not intend for vessels to lack a will.
For no.4, I've always had the personal headcannon that the vessels can and will do anything to achieve their end goal. (such as marking a map, or buying a charm)
So they don't have a mind, just super highly advanced instincts.
Hornet even mentions this - you can see vessel corpses all over hallownest - her job is to defeat the unworthy vessels trying to contain the infection, so the vessels gravitate towards the black egg to try and replace the hollow knight.
Once the player defeats hornet twice, she realises that they may be the vessel that can change hallownest's stasis and actually defeat the radiance.
The knight's goal is to defeat the radiance - by containing it, killing it, or killing it in godhome, it's just that its instincts are so advanced that it almost functions as a mind.
Yet the knight is able to make choices irrelevant to stopping the infection, like giving people delicate flowers.
Steel Soul Jinn who knows about the void says the knight has a will of it's own if it refuses to trade (which in of itself requires a will).
Hornet herself at the abyss says The Knight has a choice.
The description of the void heart says it unifies the void under the bearer's WILL.
He's made to contain it but they were imperfect creation that's why the story exist
@@guigui2099 That was my point.
@@stuffstuff3455 no need to like your own comment no one will see this
@@stuffstuff3455 + mb I didn't rode the whole comment
my theory about the will of vessels is that pure vessel had no will, hollow knight (like most of them) had a just enough to get infected and the player is a vessel with so strong will, that it overcomed the infection
The Vessel one is my favourite question out of these, since there's so many little contradictions that make it confusing. You could just say "The infection makes them grow" and the evidence is that Broken Vessel is larger than other vessels, along with THK. But that's easily disproved as BV is only infected after the Knight enters the room. Before it's just a dead Vessel. And as for THK, Pure Vessel proves it grew that large without infection. So then, what if it's natural growth? Birthplace destroys this theory, since the Knight and THK are the same size, yet the Knight hasn't grown at all since then. So why do they grow? My personal belief is thst it might be to do with training. But as usual, there's a contradiction! Broken Vessel has no proof and being trained, and no reason either. And if it's to do with power, the Knight easily disproves that from its feats. So yeah, it's just one of those mysteries we'll probably never know, similar to the death of the King.
The hollow knight was likely trained to that size afterall baby’s start out tiny and can get huge and it would make sense for it to be trained incase the seal breaks it would need to fend off the infection and the reason the hollow knight loses to us is because it’s impure and gets infected essentially weakening it because it now has emotion and is being leached on by the infection.
The best guess I can come up with after reading more comments is that vessels can grow through the actions of or maybe just being around the White Lady or Pale King, or maybe exposure to void. It could even be some of all of them. Broken Vessel is found not too far away from both the Abyss and the old location of the White Palace, which could explain its size just by being close to either. And THK being the largest known vessel could be modified by the Pale King in a process similar to the creation of kingsmolds, or something given in some way by the White Lady. The vessel found dead in Greenpath is on the other side of Hallownest and looks about the same size as other vessel
My guess is vessels do grow on their own like any other creature but we don't get to see that in-game, like how the grimmchild is implied to grow into another full-sized Troupe master but it's still a youngling in the game
It could be that its growth was induced by an external force. As if he wasn’t supposed to grow as fast he did but the king sped it up.
I think the knight has a will, since its controlled by the llayer. It makes the sealed ending even more tragic than it already is, since your efforts will be undone eventually anyways
My guess for question #4 is that the vessel creatures are naturally programmed to do whatever they can to defeat the radiance, or at least keep the infection sealed away.
or they're just the void?
Actually for #4 the entire point of the game is that they do have a mind that’s why the hollow knight wasn’t able to properly contain the infection
@@CornyFries yeah that’s not really a mystery, the vessels having wills when they weren’t supposed to is kinda the whole point of the story
@@CornyFries yea like every question here except *maybe* Nosk, because I don’t remember, is easily answered
Honestly I Always thought that the PC was actually without will and thats why it is the only one able to actually contain the infection. In the finaly cutscene of the standart ending and the sealed siblings ending you can see the infection in the eyes of the knight be destroyed or absorbed by its void
1. Yeah, more. 2. They do grow. 3. Nosk is weird. 4. Game mechanics, also, you can’t say no
2. I think that the vessels hatched from the eggs in the abyss and the one to climb up was the hollow knight so because it didn't fall it didn't break it's skull, there by it was still alive and was able to grow
The god-seeker expansion talks about void being given focus, a pin-hole dedication towards which to aim it's will, the pale king tried to make a *being with no will,* probably unaware that such a thing is an oxymoron, you can't possibly have a mind to funnel the radiance into without there being a way for the radiance to interact with it because the radiance would only ever interact with things she could infect, you can't beat her at her own game, the hollow knight, I believe, is the result of this attempt at creating a mindless mind, meanwhile, us in the dream-no-more and god-seeker endings rather achieve a "focus" through which to orchestrate the power of the void, I say that our vessel is very much capable of creating attachments and having thoughts, at least through us, but it's their/our ability to focus which makes them capable of resisting and even defeating the radiance.
1, Infection is at like stage 3/5 at that point.
2, Vessels can grow, but most died. Given how Vessels are "born of Wyrm and Root", they likely grow similar to how the White Lady, a sentient plant, grows. They require light, which can't happen in the Abyss. Sidenote: Broken Vessel did grow, as it was noticeably larger than the Knight. The Knight doesn't grow for an unknown reason. Maybe because he left the Pale King's beacon?
3, Nosk can "read minds" but it's actually probably just that Nosk can pickup on the thoughts and memories of other creatures. The Knight has no thoughts though, so it just imitates the Knight.
4. Though no Vessel has the ability to think, they do have a purpose that was ingrained in them at birth. A core instinct, which is to seal the Radiance. In other words, the Knight isn't thinking, it is just taking the actions it "feels" are correct. Like how when you get hungry, you go looking for food. You aren't actually thinking about it, but you are doing it.
gaminkill said it's because Vessels have "No will to break" and said this means their will just has to be unbreakable. This is blatantly contradictory and wrong. They also said this happens because they get the Voidheart, but the Voidheart is an optional item, therefor, not important.
I will correct them by saying: Vessels do not have the ability to think, that would be a weakness the Radiance can and does exploit. The Vessels do not require the Voidheart, otherwise the Hollow Knight would be sealing the Radiance already. Heck, the whole reason the story happens is because the Knight gets called back to Hallownest by the Radiance's cry. And the cry escapes the Hollow Knight because it has just 1 single thought in it.
Yet the knight is able to make choices irrelevant to stopping the infection, like giving people delicate flowers.
Steel Soul Jinn who knows about the void says the knight has a will of it's own if it refuses to trade (which in of itself requires a will).
Hornet herself at the abyss says The Knight has a choice.
The description of the void heart says it unifies the void under the bearer's WILL.
Also lost kin bows to the knight when you beat it.
@@stuffstuff3455 On the contrary, isn't the Knight simply doing what others tell it to? Grey Mourner tells it to take the flower. Where it ends up is the player's choice, but in-world, it would simply be making mistakes, because it's not thinking about where the flower is intended to go.
Jinn says it has a will of its own if it refuses to trade because Jinn is pretty much telling you to trade, as does Jiji. Give us eggs and we'll give you treasure, basically.
Hornet says the Knight has a choice, but again, it's acting on instinct. Would its job be better done if it seals the Radiance, or attacks it in the Dream Realm? It follows its only instinct to decide which path it takes. Which leads to 2 different endings, making both choices canon.
Voidheart does unify the Void under the bearer's will, but does the Knight have will in the first place? Nope. So the Void will follow the knight, but the Knight's head is still empty.
Lost Kin doesn't bow to the Knight, nor does Broken Vessel.
They both lift their head and reach out to the Knight when they die. Furthermore, it was infected, so it clearly had a will, which is why it died.
@@MorganSaph The Knight wasn't doing what it was told. Jinn's dialogue is only triggered by doing THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF WHAT IT WAS TOLD TO DO.
The knight wasn't told to give flowers to OTHER NPCS.
Both I made clear in my initial comment.
"player choice" can't change what characters already know. Jinn KNOWS about the void and said the knight has a will of it's own.
Also delicate flower ending. Team cherry said all endings are canon, so giving flowers what the knight's choice, as no one told it to give a flower to godseeker.
How can the void unify under a will that doesn't exist? why put that in the description in the first place if a will is not needed?
The lost kin does bow you dirty liar.
Once you wake up after beating it, it's spirit appears and you use the "accept" prompt it bows.
ua-cam.com/video/nGK8SVghqF0/v-deo.html
look at 2:54 of this video.
Your blatant lie about lost kin and you ignoring how the knight did the opposite of what it was told to do, completely misrepresenting my argument, it's clear your just a dirty liar.
"though no vessel has the ability to think" then why are they all thrown to the abyss? the point of vessels in the game is that they all have a mind and emotion unlike the pale king wanted, which is why a lot of them are thrown to the abyss. the hollow knight is special because he's the one with the least emotion so the pale king took him out of the abyss to contain radiance, but when he trained the hollow knight, the hollow knight formed some kind of bond with him and made him fail to contain the radiance which led to hallownest going into shit.
This is the plot's big point. The hollow knight has will. This is why the vessel was possessed. The hollow knights were supposed to have no will but they have, just a little but this is enough. The king didn't notice it. And this is why the game exists at all. The king wanted to stop the infection and he couldn't. He needed someone without will and he thought he created one but he actually didn't. And you are supposed to prolong the time of the infection being captured(2 endings), or to destroy the infection(the only good ending).
There is a broken egg in the white palace, my theory is that, similar to the eggs in their birthplace, it was sort of a specialized incubator for the HK to reach its final form
Where?
Im not sure if that exists, but if it's in the White Palace instead of the Abyss, it's probably Hornet's egg as they wouldn't be certain before they hatch.
If youre talking about the pale kings room then thats his beacon not the egg
1. yes it's just the hopeless stage of infection ( even if the Radians is dead they won't be cured but they will die)
2. the hollow knight has feeling and mind ( because of the bale king) so he grew up
3. nosk is some kind of a parasite that can access mind of its bray, but the knight doesn't have a mind, so it accessed some memories, that's why the knight defeated nosk but other vessels couldn't.
4. yes the knight is actually controlled by a higher being, and it's the shade lord( the huge shade monster in the god home ending) and the player is actually the shade lord that controls the knight, so that it can be awaken, which is why the god home ending is the best because the shade lord (the player) achieved his real goal, and is awake now to rule what was left of hallonest.
I love that team cherry calls the players “higher beings”
Not really
I'm thinking Nosk is just a corpse creeper on steroids
For number one they just get more infected 😂
Or you just go deeper
Ok, self proclaimed somewhat expert on HK lore here
1. Yeah, you kinda get it right. Like, Myla is a bit infected at the start, loosing sanity, but still speaking and not atacking, and then just becoming mindless husk attacking everyone in sight.
2. I kinda.. don't know for sure myself. My theory is that he was either trained to grow, or that either King or Queen has influenced his growth with their power. But there is The Broken Vessel for example, that is partially grown. Maybe, it's under infections influence, maybe, vessels just grow naturally, outside of the abyss, who knows.
3. He has always been like that, i think. These are his methods to hunt, achieved evolutionary , no different from claws or tooth. Its just that deep nest is messed up with how dangerous predators there are.
4. They aren't supposed to have a will of their own, that's right, but the Pale King haven't achieved that, so they have a will, and can make decisions.
vessels are explicitly supposed to have a will
The knight/ghost/vessel that you play as makes conscious, logical decisions. Like a robot. He has no free will, but does as he needs to in order to complete his task.
he has free will, he can do whatever he wants. its just that he is MEANT to not want anything for himself
He has a free will like the hollow knight that's what happen at the end of the game
@@guigui2099 The Hollow Knight was tainted, a broken vessel
@@monokuma6041 yes but we had two example of vessels in the game and both was tainted it looks like vessels are a failed creation
1. Yes, they get more infected.
2. The vessels do grow but it was likely that THE Hollow Knight has lived for a long time and has been raised by the Pale King in a specific way.
3. Nosk is likely another failed Vessel which wasn't successfully discarded or escaped to Deepnest which explains its great power. Its sinister behaviour may be learned.
4. A vessel's lack of will is the problem with the whole game, but it's narratively brilliant. The Hollow Knight is failing to contain the infection despite being the 'perfect vessel', so we take over. But who's to say we don't fail as well? Unless we defeat Radiance, we fail as far as I see. This begs the question: Can life exist without free will? Also, we probably just point at things we want to buy.
1 yes they are just more infected now, 2 the vessels grow and he was trained to prime form, 3 nosk is a bug similar to the other corpse things down there that is using vessel bodies, he is just a really good mimicking spider, and 4 the knight may or may not be 100% hollow, void heart suggests it has a will and void itself can be given form mind focus etc, so it is likely in some way alive/sentient enough to do those things
1. Yes, but it's in a significantly more advanced stage.
2. Vessels are children. Most die or get killed, so they don't have the chance to grow. As for why our vessel (who is the same age as THK) doesn't grow, it's probably due to being away from the Void and/or the Pale King's influence.
3. Nobody knows anything about Nosk, other than he's creepy as hell. My best guess is he's a fragment of void substance that somehow got infected.
4. We have a will. The plan of using Vessels was flawed from the start because they all had minds and wills, that's why we have to either become the new Vessel and restart the cycle or confront the Radiance and end the infection for good.
Yes he is connected to a higher being... Us literally us. Like its said it multiple times. My question is are we connected to every vessel
Once you take the monarch wings the winds stop. This somehow allowed the infection to spread harder overcharging the enemies
All vessels had wills except the hollow knight he was perfectly hollow but the kings affection gave the hollow knight will,emotions and personality
Since the player character learns amazing nail skills and good magic skills but stays the same the hollow knight prolly got empowered in some way possibly drinking more void to enhanche its size like eating a fuck ton of protein so your muscles grow faster
Nosk judging from his behaviors was some transforming predatory bug and the infection just juiced him
1.they were already infected, but as you release the dreamers the seal on the black egg temple door weakens which causes it to spill out more. Crossroads is that area in the map which is why the infection is greatest there.
4.the hollow knight and the vessel both have will, they just have no desires. The radiance infects bugs through their desires promising them what they want. The hollow knight had no desires and was willing to be sealed, but right before he was he wanted to earn his father's respect/love(pale king). The radiance fed on that weakening the seal right as it was made. The hollow knight does make choices, but never seems to want anything or to make connections with others. So when you replace the hollow knight, the radiance is consumed within you and your hollow soul.
Since I’m on my first playthrough I’m not the best person to try to take a gander at the lore, but from all I know and a little interpretation, at least for the very first one, once you beat broken vessel or your first dreamer, the infection plaguing all bugs in the crossroads, which is where the black egg is located, goes from mild to massively increased by the radiance as most likely something of a defense mechanism, especially if it happens after beating your first dreamer, it knows that that’s one seal out of three broken, and it’s only a matter of time before either you come to take THK’s place, starting the cycle over and either trapping it for another long period of time or possibly for good, or ending the radiance yourself rather then becoming yet another “succeeded” vessel. In short, I think the infected crossroads is a defense mechanism because it knows “oh shit, one dreamer down, two more and I’m stuck here for even longer/over with for good”.
Edit: as for the knight, I wasn’t aware that, although it should’ve been obvious, it was thrown into the abyss with the others for a reason, that being it does have some sort of will, therefore there can’t be holding the radiance for good, only restarting the cycle for longer.
Not necessarily, the pale king and white lady didn't discriminate their children, they cast them into the abyss in order to fill them with void. Then they waited for the first one to climb up, that being the hollow knight, as shown in the birthplace cutscene.
No vessels can grow. One example is the broken vessel who is much larger and much grown than the knight
To answer the question of how the hollow knight grew so much, the vessels are all spans of the pale king and white lady combined with void making them mostly higher beings so most likely the combination of void with a higher being leaf to the growth that happened to the knoghty
The vessel is controlled by a higher being, the player. If you set the controller down, he doesn’t do anything, therefore, no will.
the player is not a canon entity
I think in this game, the Player are a piece of the Void that look back after being observe for so long.
1. More infected. If you have a cold and are not trying to heal yourself or can't, you get more sick
2. The vessels do grow, some of the vessels in nosk's arena are taller than you'd expect, also the broken vessel/lost kin are as tal as us, but they are hunched forward, if they were straight they'd be taller than us
3. Maybe nosk made a copy of our knight from the discarded vessels and he was just walking in the ground, similar to how he jumps to the top
4. We (the knight) have (has) a will. The "hollow" knight was corrupted by an idea instilled (most likely the scene at the end of path of pain. Also the "idea" might be love or compassion to his father). The infection also can only take hold of you if you dream, not if you have a will. (The knight doesn't dream, he goes into other people's dream). This is why the white lady says the hollow knight had an idea instilled, not a will to break
I’m pretty sure that the vessels cannot grow on their own, and they must be trained to do so. Which explains why the hollow knight is the only one who is big, because somewhere in the game (I don’t remember where) it says that the hollow knight was trained while the others werent
1. The infected bugs are now fully bloated and overrun even though they were infected.
2.there is nothing really stating that vessels can’t grow. You could be confused because the player doesn’t but that has no real answer and is most likely something that the king did
3.nose is predator that reads the mind of bugs and disguises itself as the loved ones to lure and kill prey.
4.the knight is not fully hollow until obtaining the void heart and then they operate purely like a machine rather than a creature
1) you kill a dreamer ->black egg opens a bit -> gives radiance more room for influence -> more plague. That is also the reason why it’s only the crossroads, it’s the closest to black egg
2) both the knight and hollow knight are basically the same age but the difference is that one vessel spent his time in abyss and outside the kingdom while other was trained in the palace. I think the one that grew in palace was not only trained but also upgraded in a way that led to his growth. We have charms that extend the length of a nail, why can’t there be some magical artefact that vastly increases growth
3) nosk doesn’t transform, he compresses himself into a disguise. But I raise a question why does he has the same mask as the knight since each vessel is unique
4) I don’t think it’s a part of the lore but the knight doesn’t have will, it’s just we as a player guide him. We are the higher being that controls him while he still is hollow and perfect for sealing the plague
Yet the knight is able to make choices irrelevant to stopping the infection, like giving people delicate flowers.
Steel Soul Jinn who knows about the void says the knight has a will of it's own if it refuses to trade (which in of itself requires a will).
Hornet herself at the abyss says The Knight has a choice.
The description of the void heart says it unifies the void under the bearer's WILL.
@@stuffstuff3455
the choices are made by the player. The knight is as hollow as he can be, if we don’t interfere, he would not move or do anything at all. Rejecting trade or giving flower is a will of a player. The choices made by the player
Besides the opening cutscene, there isn’t a point in the game where the knight does something without our input
the last one is probably the only problem with my theory, I can’t really disprove it
The npcs directly respond to the player's choices, so it was intended to be the knight's choices.
The double down, the delicate flower ending. The devs definitely intended on the knight giving flowers to be a choice on the knight's part, otherwise they wouldn't make a whole new ending.
Also you ignored my point about Hornet directly telling the knight it has a choice in the abyss.
@@thatlittlemonstrositythe "player" is not a canon entity, the knight DOES decisions nobody tells it to, implying it has a will.
You said "if we didn't interfere at all it wouldn't even move" that's just wrong, all the other vessel could and definetly moved without any exterior interference.
@@thatlittlemonstrosity higher beings doesn't refer to the player, it's referring to things like Grimm, Pale King, Radiance, etc. we the player isn't canon, it's our knight's journey, not ours.
I feel as if the Void has a play in how the Hollow Knight thinks.
"Call of the void" indeed. Void seems to become a hivemind like the Godseekers once you obtain Voidheart and "Unite the void under the bearers will". Which is funny cause Radiance also has a hivemind thing going on...
Yeah, a higher being, called me
I believe vessles do grow, the knight being a child, the hollow knight being an adult.
And hornet being a teenager. (I will die on this hill)
From my perspective.
The reason the Ghost can make decisions is because he's not perfect. Deciding shows that he has a will, something he shouldn't and the clue that indicates that the infection will return because Radiance will control him like his brother.
about number one
as u progress through the game the infection gets so bad it becomes physic, that can be seen in the enemies and in those stupid blocked passages
at last that’s what i think
you do have a will, it would've not be a problem that the king sacrificed thousands of your kind if it wasn't the case but the game clearly wants to make it clear that the action of the king where ruthless seeing how much of a gloomy and sad place is the abyss. and remember that you are void and it is said that the void had/has a will of his own in the void tendrils journal entry, sorry for my bad english
It says you have no will to break which means you have no will or an unbreakable will but your character knows its purpose and most likely acts on that like an AI told to do a task. So it would make sense for the character to not have a will but act the way it does because a higher being which is you, told it to do what it does.
that line from PK's speech is not literal. TK is explicitly said to have a will many times, and you can see this through its actions as well.
it seems like youre suggesting the player is a canon entity and that is not true either. purely baseless and unprecedented
My theory about the vessels having a will when they aren't supposed to is that it's a paradox. So they do have a will and mind, but at the same time they don't. Or at least they don't have a will and mind in a way that the radiance can infect it
Nosk was a smart hunter before he get infected
There are a lot of theories about Nosk. The one I think is the most reasonable is the one that says that is an infected-warped Corpse Creeper. I don't remember all the points, but there are a lot.
The 4th one legitimately puzzles me too, apparently he doesn't have "no will to break"
That's why sealing off the infection is not the solution, It only buys time
@@kitpaovm8537pretty heavily implied that the only reason the hollow knight wasn't truly hollow was because it had a connection to the pale king, a connection that the knight lacks. This is further proven by the white lady telling the knight that it is unblemished while the hollow knight isn't. Perhaps it is purpose that drives the vessels, because the knight returned to the kingdom to seal the infection
@@epicmenace1303 but the king and queen were wrong one time, they could be wrong again. Also, through the game you do some decisions (and achievements) that imply a conection with the others (saving zote, killing/not killing Mila, staying with quirrel for a while after his master's death, not killing the nail blacksmith, fighting oniric zote for no reason, wanting to do the path of pain for no reason, completing the hunters diary, fighting oniric Warriors, etc) the game enables paths that demonstrate the knight feels something, (when you die, your Shadow Is referred to as a regret, a feeling) so It also enables endings where "not feeling" is not the only solution, and not the optimal one. Wouldn't you rather attack the source if you can? You are given the dream nail for a reason, and the solution from a long time ago is not always the best solution to today's problem
@@kitpaovm8537 obviously dream no more is the best ending but i think that it's very up to interpretation if the cycle would repeat
Nosk is based on something I believe is called an ant spider which is a spider that pretends to be an ant and go in ant nests
If you answer every question to a story, things will get over complicated, and fans will get bored when their curiosity is abruptly satisfied. Lore is lore, but fun game mechanics don’t always have to follow the rules.
The reason the hollow knight is bigger is because he was fed royal jelly or something like that. thats how bees become queens or get different jobs they get fed beebread or honey
for 4
i’m pretty sure a perfect vessel was never created
The whole conflict of the game is caused by the fact that vessels have will
I always assumed that WE would posses the vessel and that WE are the higher beings who are literally spoken directly to in the tutorial.
no. the player is not a canon entity
The knight have will he's just stronger than anybody else.
4 - He just do what is going to be better for him
The vessel has a will, voidheart says your will needs to be unbreakable so in my mind that explains purchases too because the knights will to contain the radiance is pure and buying things is a step on that path
about number 2, this has to have samething to do with the time it spend with the king, since that’s what’s different between him and the other vessels, besides it been hollow, wich i don’t think had anything to do with it
1. Yes. The infection gets stronger as more of it is seeping out of the Black Egg
2. Unanswered, but I assume its because only the Hollow Knight had proper nurturing and training from birth. The other vessels were deprived and their growth stunted.
3. Nosk is just Nosk (yeah no answer).
4. The obvious answer is that The Knight isn't hollow. No vessels were. They were just exceptionally strong willed due to the void within them.
To elaborate on that, The Radiance and Void clearly have a storied history of conflict we arent fully aware of - for example, she refers to The Void as an "ancient enemy".
The Godseekers "tune" gods. This power isnt elaborated on too much, but it is seemingly able to commune with strong creatures at their peak strength, regardless of time. Pure Vessel, White Defender, Grimm, etc.
They must have inadvertently tuned the original Shade Lord too (the giant void entity that kills The Radiance in Embrace the Void). The Godseekers accidentally unified the void again themselves, causing it to run rampant in Hallownest.
The Void is weak to (and hates) light (see the lighthouse in The Abyss). Maybe a shared instinct among even the disordered void is to quell any and all light.
This is backed up by the fact The Void very likely also killed the Pale King, a being that radiated his own pale light.
So when any light bringing god arrives, the void unifies to see it be snuffed out. It isnt always successful however, especially if the being is outwith its reach (the radiance's shrine is atop the crystal peaks)
TL;DR: Void hates light, light beats Void. The Pale King inadvertently made void beings that are not only independent of the void hive mind while in their bodies, but are also of higher, godly birth. They can reach and defeat The Radiance with their godlike strength and support of the void hivemind, or contain it within themselves for a time due to their iron wills.
The vessels were meant to have no will, but the vessel plan failed, as if the hollow knight had no will then they would have contained the infection forever without issue, the reason its cracking and the infection has returned to hallownest is because the hollow knight had a will but it concealed it to make its father proud, and that love for its father is what the radiance used to break it.
vessels could have a will. PK's speech was not literal.
THK is not failing because of that. theyre failing because they were never pure to begin with.
My headcanon is that the knight actually has feelings and a will cuz we've seen the hollow knight who was tought to be the perfect vessel starting to have emotions so I think that every vessels can feel things
They can feel thing but once they start they aren't pure anymore
I thought that the knight (ghost) didn't have will at first but developed it throughout the journey
The reason we have a will is because there ISN’T a “perfect” vessel
They said the same thing about the hollow knight and look what happened to them
The only thing they could do before the knight came along is prolong the infection by throwing vessels at the problem and buy time
for #4, the character definitely has a will. The radiance infects a person's soul, so the Pale King made hundreds or maybe thousands of children out of the void in hopes that at least one of them would have absolutely no soul. No will to break, no mind to think, no voice to cry suffering. The King chose the Hollow Knight as the vessel because he thought it truly had no soul. Obviously though, he was wrong. The radiance infects the soul of the Hollow Knight and through it starts to leak back out into hallownest. If the Hollow Knight had a soul, and therefore a will, and the player character is supposedly less hollow that the hollow knight, then it makes sense that the Knight has a will too.
The hollow knight has a will of his own, but no dreams, desires, as that is where the radiance manages to infect others.
Not sure about 1 and 3 but my take on 2 and 4 are that for 4 the knight is a defective vessel and obtained a will after being cast aside. For 2 It is stated that after being taken he grew a substantial amount and I think it might be because he did not remain in the void as long making his vessel a more pure form of the knights. Kind of like how big hornets crown is a lot bigger because she did not spend time in the void
The vessels do have wills and minds, the Pale King just made an incorrect assumption. A popular idea is that the Knight has an indomitable will compared to HK
That makes sense. A lot of people have been telling me that recently. Thanks.
1. They become *completely overrun* by their infection, due to their proximity to the black egg
2. The Hollow Knight vessel is different, as he had an idea instilled and grew to his goals
3. Nosk is a fucking weirdo
4. The hollow Knight has no will or emotions, so its best to think of him as going through the motions for his goal of defeating the infection
THK was artifically grown.
nosk is not a weirdo. theyre just a shape shifter.
THK does have a will and emotions
My main theory for #4 is that the player themselves are the void controlling the vessel (the hollow knight)
Plot twist: you are the higher being controlling the knight
not accurate
1. Yes. They were infected before and now become even more infected as more infection is spread.
2. The Vessels do grow but not simply by aging as the Hollow Knight isn’t any older than the other Vessels. It is unknown what is the trigger for them to grow.
3. Nosk is a mystery. It is not even clear if he really has been infected but we have seen some bugs retain higher amount of intelligence once infected like the Moss Prophet.
4. The Knight (like all Vessels) does have a will. That is the Pale King’s biggest mistake and what allowed the Radiance to take over the Hollow Knight. The Knight went out of its way to defy its original purpose in the Dream No More ending.
That last part actually makes a lot of sense. The fact that you have the decision to conquer the Radiance boss, which technically wasn't the job of the vessels. It was just to withhold the infection to allow Hallownest to last eternal.
@@WyvrnOnYT That’s exactly that
1. The bugs are attempting to resist the infection, thus they become more infected.
2. The training that the vessel goes through makes him grow.
3. Nosk is most likely one of the escaped vessels, infected, seeing as there is void which probably allows him to shape shift.
4. The knight most likely does have a will, as making something "hollow" isn't possible. This is backed up by the void hearts charm description as it says it unites the void under the wearers will.
I liked the Nosk theory. I've also heard many people say the pure vessel grew because of training. It's not 100% proven though, which is why it's in this video.
@@WyvrnOnYT Personally, the pure vessel theory makes the most sense to me because it explains why the knight/other vessels didn't grow. Another piece of proof for it is the soul scholars. They "mastered" soul usage and they became swollen, thus they grew. And we know that the Pure Vessel at least knows how to use soul because of his fight in the Hall of Gods, in which the files calls one of his attacks a "focus" attack. Seeing as focus is often used when talking about soul, (see the soul sanctum lore tablets and the kings pass lore tablets) it's safe to say the Pure Vessel's Training including mastering soul in a safe way, causing them to grow.
@@noahclendenon It definitely makes the most sense compared to any other theory. Although I'm not sure that the real bugs in the soul sanctum area would grow using soul the same way that the Hollow Knight would.
@@WyvrnOnYT You're most likely correct, seeing as the bugs in the soul sanctum swell, while the Pure Vessel, with more high quality knowledge of soul, grew. They also would most likely have better resistance to the adverse effects of soul, being a higher being (see the knight).Though, this is all just a theory, so who knows?
@@WyvrnOnYT you should read hunter's journal of Pure Vessel
The knight doesn't need a will to do stuff, or even to make decision. How do I know this?
*Computers*
1: The infection has different stages, for examplel, in the first stage the infected have no symptoms. In the second stage they start having violet thoughts and visions of the radiance. In the third stage they start loosing their intelligence and identity, and also start to see the infection as a "blessing'. In the fourth stage their eyes become orange and they basically become the enemies you early-game. And lastly, in the final stage (at least of the stages we've seen), the infection takes a physical toll on the host, like we see in the infected crossroads(also, this is not the official explanation, just me trying to make one that fits what we know about the lore and tone of the game).
2: The hollow knight got trained to reach a vessel's true potential.
3: Nosk is probably the bug version of a skinwalker.
4: We are actually not playing as a vessel, but instead, as Asriel Dreemour from undertale, just like Kris!
I love watching your channel grow
my biggest question is who created the ascended maps for bosses and where that person lives.
Lost kin is infected (caused by the radiance) and is bigger the knight so if the hollow knight absorbed the radiance then it grew so it’s probably something to do with the infection and the radiance
lost kin is not traditionally infected, no. theyre bigger than TK because vessel size naturally varies a bit
Translate it:
1.Los insectos de cruces olvidados ya estaban infectados lo que pasa es que como avanzas en el juego , al mismo tiempo avanza la infección.
2. El Hollow knight si crecio ya que fue "entrenado" por el rey pálido y no fue desechado como las demás vessels y el caballero no sé tal vez el nació después del Hollow knight al igual que Hornet .
3.Nosk es de una raza unica porque en el salon de los dioses dice que es el "Dios" de las criatura cambia-caras.
4. El caballero si tiene voluntad(emociones) y por eso fué desechado como las demás vessels.
I always assumed it meant he had no EMOTIONAL will
I just wanted to mention that in kings pass the tutorial plaques that say “higher beings these words are for you alone” show the game controls so you could infer that we are a higher being that makes all of the decisions for the night
I don't think Nosk is a "bug", it's a creature of the void.