What a highly articulate intelligent talented individual, Pete Thorn reminds me of listening to Neil Peart - I could listen to quality info like this all day long - thank you.
I've been wondering about this for a long time! Running an old bandmaster into load/ir I was shocked at how much perceived dirt coming through. Thanks for covering this topic.
I've noticed this effect with my 12" speaker in an isolation box and a 57 mic on the speaker. Using my 50w Marshal head it was loud and at 4or 5 not all that dirty or distorted especially when backing off my attack. Putting a load box between the speaker and the amp, the sound became darker and distorted. In fact, I could not get a clean sound out of this Marshal with the load box in place. I finally opted for an amp with a switchable power amp section (7w, 25w & 50w). This gave me a consitant tone at any of those three power settings with the same speaker in the same isolation box with the same mic on it. I don't know exactly what causes this, but your setup may not have the same thing going on with it. Thanks for the vid Pete! Keep them coming.
How about solid state amps for this "bedroom" process? Is the load box necessary/can you skip right to the line out to audio interface and I.R.? (For example, the Roland JC 40/120 which I believe has no dedicated speaker out port.)
You would kill the audio interface, it can not withstand the high level that comes out of the ´speaker out´ bushing. You would need a simple attenuator to tame the output. A lot of amp schematics show that. But check with an audio guy, because you will not need what they call compensated output, wich gives a kind of simple speaker ´sim´.
Long time subscriber to Pete's channel and huge fan, but this video has bugged me a bit since I first watched it two years ago. I just recently got into a discussion about this and it made me pull up your video again. I've gotta disagree with Pete somewhat here. I'm using IR's with my Suhr RL about 90% of the time when I play at home now (due to having young kids) and I very much believe that some of the distortion you hear in that raw (DI out) signal is coming through the reactive load and IR filtering no matter how you set the mic in the IR. I could hear added DI type distortion in your IR/Load tone at 4:30 vs the 1" close mic tone where it was absent. The clipping with the 1" close mic is typical (amp like?) sounding smoother OD clipping to my ears, but the IR tone has an added harsher crackle on top of that typical clipping. You can hear what I believe is the same harsh crackle in your DI tone example at 4:45 as well. I think this harsh crackle would be even more apparent if you had done the demonstration with the totally clean tone you used at the end of the video rather than with an edge of break up tone which hides that crackle a bit. Even when I play totally clean through a Suhr RL and an IR set up with the mic back in the room, I can hear a bit of a crackle. It seems to be something that the IR programmers or load box builders haven't perfect yet. In a mix it's somewhat negligible, but playing solo you can definitely hear it. I think your video still makes a legitimate point, but I definitely think there is some added DI signal distortion that sneaks through the reactive load and IR filtering.
Instead of turning down the gain on a big, brash class AB amp to get rid of the grit, why not switch to something that’s less “stiff”? Pushed cleans out of my cathode-biased 5E3 (tweed deluxe) are fat and warm. Not edgy or anemic at all!
This really bugs me. I usually love Pete's videos but his response here isn't even addressing the concerns, instead is basically saying "nah, there's no way you're hearing clipping". I gotta call BS. I have the exact same problem with my setup. Nice clean tones out of my amp, but I can't run it into my RL even in the low input with the volume basically all the way down. It's the IMPEDANCE, folks. The RL is only meant to handle 8 ohm loads at a max of 100 watts. If your amp only has 4 ohm outputs (like mine), you will get clipping. A very easy answer to what I'm assuming is a common problem, and commonly overlooked.
hey Pete, I have had to address this issue a lot with fellow guitarists. small stage combo flat and up against guitarists legs. his ear is too far off axis to speaker, he turns up treble and volume, front row of audience ears are smashed. I always play with a slanted quad box to get the axis to ear right, not for high volume. this means I can play at lower levels, audience hear a nice tone, if at all over foh, and my ear is at same axis I like the mic placement. it has solved a lot of issues for me. tilting a 2x12 with a head on top or a combo is ok, just find 4x12's used right are perfect.
Hey everybody, I have just bought the Suhr Reactive Load but I am puzzled about the fan and the noise that the device emits. This goes out to other Suhr Reactive Load owner that might to tell me if this crackling noise is normal. Since it is so difficult to explain the phenomenon, I have made a short video. ( ua-cam.com/video/duCw0601cU0/v-deo.html )This is just a guitar into the amp and into the Reactive Load. No sound is coming through any speakers. Just watch the video and turn it up loud and you will hear that rattle that I am talking of. Thanks!
What a highly articulate intelligent talented individual, Pete Thorn reminds me of listening to Neil Peart - I could listen to quality info like this all day long - thank you.
I've been wondering about this for a long time! Running an old bandmaster into load/ir I was shocked at how much perceived dirt coming through. Thanks for covering this topic.
This is fantastic, I learned a lot! Thanks!
I've noticed this effect with my 12" speaker in an isolation box and a 57 mic on the speaker. Using my 50w Marshal head it was loud and at 4or 5 not all that dirty or distorted especially when backing off my attack. Putting a load box between the speaker and the amp, the sound became darker and distorted. In fact, I could not get a clean sound out of this Marshal with the load box in place. I finally opted for an amp with a switchable power amp section (7w, 25w & 50w). This gave me a consitant tone at any of those three power settings with the same speaker in the same isolation box with the same mic on it. I don't know exactly what causes this, but your setup may not have the same thing going on with it. Thanks for the vid Pete! Keep them coming.
Thanks for this! so helpful
How about solid state amps for this "bedroom" process? Is the load box necessary/can you skip right to the line out to audio interface and I.R.? (For example, the Roland JC 40/120 which I believe has no dedicated speaker out port.)
You would kill the audio interface, it can not withstand the high level that comes out of the ´speaker out´ bushing. You would need a simple attenuator to tame the output.
A lot of amp schematics show that. But check with an audio guy, because you will not need what they call compensated output, wich gives a kind of simple speaker ´sim´.
Long time subscriber to Pete's channel and huge fan, but this video has bugged me a bit since I first watched it two years ago. I just recently got into a discussion about this and it made me pull up your video again. I've gotta disagree with Pete somewhat here. I'm using IR's with my Suhr RL about 90% of the time when I play at home now (due to having young kids) and I very much believe that some of the distortion you hear in that raw (DI out) signal is coming through the reactive load and IR filtering no matter how you set the mic in the IR.
I could hear added DI type distortion in your IR/Load tone at 4:30 vs the 1" close mic tone where it was absent. The clipping with the 1" close mic is typical (amp like?) sounding smoother OD clipping to my ears, but the IR tone has an added harsher crackle on top of that typical clipping. You can hear what I believe is the same harsh crackle in your DI tone example at 4:45 as well.
I think this harsh crackle would be even more apparent if you had done the demonstration with the totally clean tone you used at the end of the video rather than with an edge of break up tone which hides that crackle a bit. Even when I play totally clean through a Suhr RL and an IR set up with the mic back in the room, I can hear a bit of a crackle. It seems to be something that the IR programmers or load box builders haven't perfect yet. In a mix it's somewhat negligible, but playing solo you can definitely hear it.
I think your video still makes a legitimate point, but I definitely think there is some added DI signal distortion that sneaks through the reactive load and IR filtering.
Are you the XLR out of the reactive load in the apollo interface? If so the apollo input is set to mic ?
dagoat1 you probably have your answer by now. if not, check this out
ua-cam.com/video/yHfDi0bSlpY/v-deo.html
it may answer more questions.
Instead of turning down the gain on a big, brash class AB amp to get rid of the grit, why not switch to something that’s less “stiff”? Pushed cleans out of my cathode-biased 5E3 (tweed deluxe) are fat and warm. Not edgy or anemic at all!
This really bugs me. I usually love Pete's videos but his response here isn't even addressing the concerns, instead is basically saying "nah, there's no way you're hearing clipping". I gotta call BS. I have the exact same problem with my setup. Nice clean tones out of my amp, but I can't run it into my RL even in the low input with the volume basically all the way down. It's the IMPEDANCE, folks. The RL is only meant to handle 8 ohm loads at a max of 100 watts. If your amp only has 4 ohm outputs (like mine), you will get clipping. A very easy answer to what I'm assuming is a common problem, and commonly overlooked.
hey Pete, I have had to address this issue a lot with fellow guitarists. small stage combo flat and up against guitarists legs. his ear is too far off axis to speaker, he turns up treble and volume, front row of audience ears are smashed. I always play with a slanted quad box to get the axis to ear right, not for high volume. this means I can play at lower levels, audience hear a nice tone, if at all over foh, and my ear is at same axis I like the mic placement. it has solved a lot of issues for me. tilting a 2x12 with a head on top or a combo is ok, just find 4x12's used right are perfect.
Hey everybody, I have just bought the Suhr Reactive Load but I am puzzled about the fan and the noise that the device emits. This goes out to other Suhr Reactive Load owner that might to tell me if this crackling noise is normal. Since it is so difficult to explain the phenomenon, I have made a short video. ( ua-cam.com/video/duCw0601cU0/v-deo.html )This is just a guitar into the amp and into the Reactive Load. No sound is coming through any speakers. Just watch the video and turn it up loud and you will hear that rattle that I am talking of. Thanks!