That's a horrifying story, Steve! My story isn't nearly as bad in the end. Back on Christmas Day 1979, when I was 14 years old, my folks got me a Ronko Record Vacuum as a present. I was so excited, I foolishly grabbed my most christened album at the time to try it out - Fresh Aire III by Mannheim Steamroller. I remember preparing the record and putting it in this infernal machine. I flipped on the switch, at which point the record was launch across the room and slammed into the opposite wall of our living room. It was basically a skeet thrower! Fortunately, the record survived, and I have it till this day. The Ronko record cleaner, however, was returned the next day.
i just LOVE my pro-ject vinyl cleaner vc-s it was the best buy i ever did and never had any problems besides the constant rebuying of sleevs and destilld water :-)
Thanks Steve, I am waiting for the delivery of a vacuum record cleaning machine, and will now keep my eye on the ‘velvet’ record protection strips to check no grit is being stuck into it. Thanks again from another Steve.
I have a HiFi / Phono store around the corner which has a ClearAudio Double Matrix Professional Sonic and . I've cleaned every record there so far because the price is very reasonable and a new sleeve is also included. I like how it removes all the static and restores used records to unexpected brilliance - in some cases. So far not one record has gotten worse and most of them better.
My first record cleaning tool was the Spin-Clean. It works wonderfully on many levels and is seemingly very safe for your records. It's also kinda fun! Then I got a Record Doctor V to experience what a vacuum style cleaner could do. I think the Record Doctor V was worth the extra investment and I'm pretty happy with it, three years in. It seems just as gentle on the records as the Spin-Clean. I tend to stay on top of replacing the microfiber strips surrounding the intake slot to avoid the damage you described. Overall, I feel like my records are as clean as they can be when working within one of these two systems. Lastly, I use my trusty Discwasher (with or without their fluid) before playing. And I always keep the stylus clean. I simply can't afford an Ultrasonic machine, although there are a couple record stores in my area that offer it as a service (no doubt to offset what they've spent!). Cheers for the great videos.
My problem is after what clean I dig up so much Gunk off the record of clogged the needle up Welsh are the records clean I have to play each record one two three times before the gunk goes away I really don't want to chew up my needle
@@MidwestBoom The same with my cleaning. I just clean the stylus until no more. . And result is quite reliable for many next times of using such cleaned LP. .I copy my often played LPs to reel recorder and it is my way to guard pickup. If needed I can play original LP but due to provided by me system futures tape sounds much better. .
One thing about microfiber cloths. I was using them rather than setting up my vacuum unit and the sound seemed worse than before. Then I cleaned my glasses using the same microfiber rag and noticed the micro hairs shedding off an my glasses - that was why the LPs had more pops than before. This is an easy way to 'see' if you should be using those cloths on your records.
I too use the kitchen sink, TAP water and some dish detergent. BUT - what can happen AND DID was that the water and detergent gets on the label - the label gets WET which causes the glue that holds the label onto the vinyl to soften - become "glue" again. Then I placed this record on my acrylic turntable platter. Left it there for a day. When I went to remove the record it HAD GLUED ITSELF TO THE PLATTER. I mean glued itself hard. I ended up breaking the record trying to get it off the platter - fortunately the platter was not affected - but a Led Zep 2 - cherry version from the '80s - was destroyed. Record cleaning does greatly enhance the sound of a vinyl record - but is filled with pitfalls no matter the technique used.
I used LAST on my records when they were new. I don't have a big problem with dirt. I use an Oracle brush before playing. The Oracle brush is just a carbon fiber brush with a ground wire. The brush attracts dust and removes charge from the record. To clean the brush, turn away from the record and rotate the grounding blade across the bristles. Once the charge is removed from the record, not much dust is attracted.
Around 1995 I was a student, had a Rega Planar 2 (bought used and modified by me), and bought a Record Doctor cleaning machine (used, for $60). This is a version of the cheapest NittyGritty made for Audio Advisor, and it had felt on the lips of the sucking device. This machine was amazing. Fantastic. Loved it. Did an amazing job. I would recommend a cleaning machine to everyone with records. I don't have my vinyl gear anymore, but I do have all my records and one day I will get back into vinyl.
I'm very happy with the Knosti manual cleaner. Instead of the included fluid (which leaves a sticky residue behind), I use 0.5 L tap water, one or two drops of dish washing liquid and a cap or two of isopropyl alcohol. I've revived the cruddiest of old records this way.
Wao Steve, I have just repaired an Audio Desk and after hearing the improvement on a record I finally cleaned all my records, is incredible how well they sound after cleaning with Audio Desk
I use a distilled water alcohol solution in a spray bottle. I got a rotating wooden plato. I put the record on the wooden plato with a rubber mat. I cover the label with a plastic cub. I spray the surface of the record. I wipe with a soft microfiber cloth and finish with a lint brush. I got this method from a youtube channel.
I once bought a bill Evan's record and it ended up being one of my favorites. I found a used copy of an older pressing, so I bought it because I like the sound of older pressings more. It was really loud. the noise floor was like 60db! i went to clean it with water and soap. nothing. tried wood glue. nothing. gave it away. freedom.
Made my own vacuum style record cleaning machine about 35 years ago. Still going strong. Works very effectively and it's never damaged a record. Neither has my homebrew cleaning solution.
@@johnsweda2999 No secret, nothing magical. Four parts distilled water, one part 91% isopropyl alcohol, a few drops of either a neutral film-free detergent or Kodak photo flo. I've been using the same stuff for the whole time. I use the Mo-Fi brush for wet scrubbing, vac the solution, rinse with distilled water, vacuum again until dry. I never said it was easy!
Yes that was the original VPI Hw16, in its first year or so of production. The grit, silica, could become wedged in between the lip on the pickup tube and the record causing the circular scratch. I found that I could rotate the pickup tube slightly towards the direction of travel of the record which would lift the leading lip off the record surface, leaving only the rear lip contacting the surface. In that way the slot would pick up the grit before it became became wedged in place. This worked quite well with no problems until a year or two later when I replace the lips with velvet.
Tried a Spin Clean. Thoroughly unimpressed, I returned it in short order. After research, including trial and error, distilled water and microfiber cloth. If it's really bad, I'll do a 2nd treatment with Groovewasher fluid and a clean microfiber towel. Works great.
I owned and used the velvet covered Nitty Gritty 1.5 back in the day on over a thousand of my records and it was an absolute miracle in how it cleaned my store bought records. One of the best audio accessories I ever bought. However, my brother had the older version with the delren lips and had the same experience as Steve.
I was once very satisfied with a DIY cleaner based on the punctual succion system where a nylon thread is led through the succion tip. With such system, the grooves only get in contact with the soft nylon thread and no dirt is left on the succion tip...
I have two methods for cleaning records, depending on their value, condition, and if I'm keeping them or putting them up for sale in my store. The first, which I use most often, is utilizing two Spin Clean units. The first with a mixture of tap water, clear washing up liquid, and a bit of isopropyl alcohol. The second is distilled water only, then I gently wipe the excess water off and allow to dry in a rack that only touches the edge and label. The works quite well, if you remember to rinse VERY dirty records in the sink first and change the solutions when needed. My second method is a homemade RCM, comprised of a milk crate, ice cream maker motor, an old turntable platter and spindle, clamp, paint pads, cleaner, distilled rinse, microfibre towels, and the drying rack. This works great, as well as any RCM with the exception of maybe an ultrasonic, but take much longer, so I usually reserve this for my personal collection or more valuable records.
I purchased a record label protector on ebay, and like you, I wash them in the sink. With the label protector the record can be washed as much as you like without the label getting wet. I agree with you that water wont kill a label but it does make me feel better to know its protected. The label protector has handles on each side which makes it easy to spin the record under the water. Pretty much a foolproof process. I never was a fan of vacuuming the record. I never felt like it was foolproof. So sorry to hear about your damaged records, keep on spinning!
@@45rockinwax All good. I actually use a 4inch paint brush to run along the grooves as well, and luckily my faucet has a sprayer which helps as well. I do a final rinse with distilled water. Happy spinning!
I use “VinylBug”. I got it from seller ApplesAndString on Etsy. Very happy with it. You use your own shopvac which keeps costs down. It supports the record from the center so when you flip the record over, the just cleaned side doesn’t sit on a dirty surface. $119 plus $15 for an extra vacuum arm. I use one to wash and one to rinse. The solution I use to wash is distilled water with a drop of hair conditioner. It cleans but doesn’t suds up. I follow that with a distilled water rinse. I use a carbon finer brush to spread the solution which I put on with a small mister bottle. Made a big difference for me.
I was traumatized by the COST of a record cleaning machine! Do they REALLY have to cost MORE than the TT, amp and speakers used to play the damned records?
Sorry to hear that Steve, I use a Pro Ject cleaning machine which I have had for 2 years now and I can recommend it's use. I also clean any new record I buy, before playing it. It does make a sonic difference.
During the 1960's my uncle told me he had read that washing records was the way to go, so I used tap water and non-perfumed (Sunlight - Australian brand) pure hand washing soap. Worked a treat. WOW... that was 50 years ago !!!
This very same thing has just happened to me. I won’t mention what machine I purchased but the velvet slowly came off of the vacuum arm whilst I was cleaning. After cleaning this particular record I was excited to listen and man it sounded terrible. I held it up to the light and to my horror I noticed deep grooves and scratches had been etched into the record. I went to the machine and pulled off the vacuum arm to inspect and saw that the velvet had rucked up whilst the record was spinning. Fortunately it only happened to one of my records and not a whole batch of them. I feel your pain.
For grungy records purchased second hand from various sources I use two spin clean units (first one for detergent mix and the second for rinse with deionized water) and then a KAB EV-1 vacuum cleaner attachment to dry them off (thankfully it uses the felt gasket). If the records have mildew on them, I will add a mildew disinfectant to the first mix. For records that come from a home with tobacco use, a little trisodium phosphate added in removes that pretty well.
I really enjoy Steve (is he really Steve or is he Woody Allen???) and his audio words of wisdom. His story regarding the use of a record cleaner with a hard surface (delrin) tube in direct contact with record surfaces, especially spinning record surfaces, does give one pause however. I've had a VPI 16.5 record cleaner for close to 20 years and have replaced the tube several times. Every tube had/has soft fabric strips along each side of the slit in the tube through which the liquid is vacuumed. Only the fabric comes in contact with the record surface, and only after it's been wetted with cleaning solution. My experience with keeping records playable, which by my standards include pop, skip, & click free with low surface noise, is to restrict anything coming in contact with the grooves other than the stylus, cleaning solution, and air. Experience has also taught me that a clean record indeed does sound better than a dirty one. Besides, who in their right mind would use the stylus on an expensive cartridge as a dredge to clean record grooves?
I’ve tried various procedures: washing in the sink with dishwashing soap, using a wash towel/nail brush/paint brush/Discwasher brush, Spin-Clean, carbon fiber brush, DIY vacuuming wand similar to the Vinyl Vac 33. All of these still leave dirt/lint in the grooves that I have to clear off of my stylus 2-3 times per side when I play it the first time. Granted I only go through a deep cleaning once, but obviously I’m not getting everything out of the grooves when I do.
Yeah that's my problem with fluids and gunk - there is no way you can get right down into the very deepest groove with a rag to wipe that off. That's just not possible. Meanwhile, ultrasonic cleaning will actually be able to do that. Ultrasonics are used to clean intricate tiny bits of jewelry and the like and it seems absolutely perfect for records. I'm not really a vinyl guy, but if I were I'd be picking up something like a Cleanervinyl system in a heartbeat. Sure, a hundred bucks or so for the system and another hundred perhaps for the ultrasonic cleaner itself but seems like a nobrainer to me.
Wow! That´s really sad! I feel very sorry for you! I for one can´t afford a cleaning machine, so I clean it by hand with my own method and it works very well.
I bought a Keith Monks record cleaner awhile back used for a little over $100 and it does a wonderful job of safely cleaning records. However it is totally a Rube Goldberg invention that no self respecting design engineer would let out of prototype. It takes an advanced degree from MIT to keep it running. It has a very large vacuum pump in it but uses very small tubing to take the vacuum to the record surface. 90% of the vacuum suction is wasted and the narrow aquarium tubing involved gets easily clogged with dust, requiring disassembly to open up. Noting all of that, it really saves recordings and my ears from the ticks and pops!
Great story Steve . Thanks for sharing the way you clean your record. I used water and mix soap just a bit of alcohol and it works great my records are fine.
The idea of placing a hard, solid surface on a spinning LP is crazy. What was the manufacturer thinking? I use the “$200” velvet lipped, manually rotated device. Super bang for the buck.
My heart goes out...I would have had a complete breakdown if that happened to me! Im glad someone is talking sense about cleaning...its become a beast of its own in the vc
My wife got me a Nitty Gritty for my birthday many years ago. It cost as much as our Electrolux vacuum cleaner, quality not nearly as good. The pump handle couldn't stand up to a two year old, and the rubber puck on the spindle eventually falls apart, but is almost impossible to replace. And the motor makes so much vibration that I had to buy sorbothene pucks to place underneath the machine. When we moved, it never made it out of the box.
If you don't replace the pads on the tube regularly and ensure everything is flush and properly calibrated, modern RCMs will actually damage your records. Something I've noticed is that the 1st record you clean when the brush is still dry, will actually leave blueish/grey marks specially visible under bright light in the deadwax from the friction (best to wet the pads first). Cleaning brushes also accumulate debris from dirt and other particles that will essentially grind into the surface but since it's in the direction of the grooves most people don't notice it.
Back in the 80's I worked for a Linn Naim dealer in Florida and we had a Keith Monks record cleaning machine there in the store. We offered record cleaning as a service and I took many of my own albums to work to clean. Thankfully I never encountered anything like your situation. I've recently decided to try one of the ultrasonic machines available now. Nothing comes in direct contact with the grooves and as long as the temperature is maintained, there is no harm to the vinyl. For a surfactant, I have chosen Tergikleen and along with distilled water it should work fine. By the way, I still kick myself for letting my Linn LP 12 go.
I bought a SpinClean about a year or so ago. I've used it on very dirty records and some almost new records, and have had no problems whatsoever. A little time-consuming since I also fan dry them for about an hour (five at a time) before playing them, but worth it. They've all played great.
I have used an okki nokki machine with the Mofi Super Record wash for years now. I haven't damaged any records so far. I originally used a Spin Clean which worked pretty well but I find using a vaccum system much better. I am interested in using an ultrasonic cleaner but I cant justify the space of two RCM's right now. I hope that you get over your phobia because for me it makes cleaning my records easy and I find it a lot of fun too!
I used the Groovmaster acrylic caps set to protect the labels and a solution of distilled water a squirt of alcohol and dish detergent placed in small tray and a painting pad soaked in the solution then evenly rotated around the record pretending you're painting it with the solution, both sides then rinse with more distilled water, to dry the record is placed flat on a clean free of dust microfiber cloth and covered with another microfiber cloth like a sandwich and gently pressed with my hands then removed and placed in a dish rack for air drying, this method reallly works for me and is done in the kitchen sink and counter, the Groovmaster you find it on Ebay.
I've just bought by first vacuum record cleaning machine. Thanks to seeing this video beforehand I check the velvet pads on the vacuum arm before every side.
My current method? Spinclean pre-clean for dirty records. Pro-Ject VC-S Mk II with the stock fluid, followed by a VERY wet rinse using distilled or RO water. Even this method occasionally adds noise rather than removing it. Best method, though way too tedious? Steam. And you still need to get the fluid off completely, but man does steaming work. My next purchase will be a 10 liter ultrasonic tank for those stubbornly noisy disks.
Started with the spin clean. Works great. I got tired of spinning it by hand so i bought a chinese ultrasonic cleaner. Works great in my opinion. I modified it to hold 6 records with a half inch in between each recoed. Super happy
I just use a micro-fiber rags, 3 parts distilled water to 1 part alcohol solution and a big heavy glass ashtray (clean) to cover the label. Similar to the way I did it as a kid. Then I go over it again on an old turntable using a micro-fiber brush spayed with my homemade solution. I thought about a Spin Clean, but I couldn’t justify paying $80 for something like looks like it took $10 to manufacture. I’m curious about the labels to be honest. I use the ashtray to protect the label during cleaning. I’ve never been worried that they would come off. They are basically infused with the vinyl during pressing. However, what I don’t want is water marks or moisture ring damage on the label. I would be traumatized if a label was aesthetically ruined by getting wet. I always thought of it as a given; a label will show signs of water getting on the label. Am I just wrong for thinking this happens? I base it on how easy it is to leave finger prints on a label if I don’t wash my hands properly on a hot day and handling one of my records.
Excellent of you Steve to mention such a flaw that many would not admit to. My concern which is also of great interest would be a poll to ask those who have cleaned records for at least 15 - 20 yrs. using different types of chemicals (household cleaners), isopropyl alcohol with regular tap water. After all this time do their records sound just as good???? Any signs of wear, groove damage???? I really wonder what the results would be? Then everyone can figure out whether it's worth in spending $$$$$ or to just keep using soaps and plain tap water. The record label concern would be in spots left on, colour dyes running along with blurred printing.
At least on all the records I have examined, the label is not glued on, it is pressed on with heat, so the vinyl melts and fuses to the paper. Soaking in water will never remove the label, though obviously the paper itself will be damaged if soaked in water too long.
I use the Spin Clean cleaner first off, then I put the record on what is basically a lazy susan with felt pads and a wooden spindle in the middle, and then use a 33rpm wand on a Green Machine to suck it all up. After all’s said and done you might as well get a Spin Doctor or just do it like Steve. It does help get rid of a lot of the pops and skipping; I always thought that once they were there on your record they were there forever, but not necessarily.
I use two 8oz Nalgene bottles and mix a brew of 'pure' (not distilled) water with one drop of Triton X100 (a very concentrated surfactant and mild detergent) in one bottle for a light wash, and 5 drops in a second for stronger jobs. I then add 1/2 ounce of reagent 99.9% isopropyl alcohol to each bottle. A third bottle has just pure water. I got a plastic 9.5" diameter lazy susan for a 'turntable', drilled a hole dead center and mounted a 1/4" plastic tube to act as the record spindle, and about twenty 1/2" soft plastic pads on the table for the record to sit on. This setup is used for the 'wash'. I use a kitchen sink, and a small artist live sponge, applying the wash brew and moving it around making sure it cover the record. I cover the label with an inverted glass dish. I let it sit a few minutes, then another few passes with the sponge, followed by a 'pressure' rinse, using the squirt thingy on the sink while rotating the record on the turntable. Then I remove the turntable and record from the sink and use a Vinyl Vac wand, which has felt strips on it to protect the record surface. It attaches to a small shop vacuum I use only for this purpose, and I hold the wand on the record while turning the 'turntable'. Basically, you want to remove anything that does not belong in the grooves or on the surface, not introduce anything that will be left behind afterwards, and not damage the record. The surfactant breaks the surface tension and gets into the grooves instead of the fluid sitting on top of them. The alcohol is there in this case to help the X100 mix with the water - I don't need alcohol as a drier, since I'm removing by vacuum (hopefully) all of the cleaning solution (water) along whatever particulate is in suspension from the cleaning. Vacuuming isn't done just to dry the record - you want to remove the fluid and whatever is in the fluid. Perfect? No, but it works really well for me. As to what gets removed from the groves, it depends on what it is and whether or not it's just sitting, physically jammed , or somehow sticking with the assistance of potato chip grease or pizza. Some situations can require a second or third wash.
My old technique was to place the record flat on a clean soft surface (usually bubble wrap) and then pour some warm water over it and then scrub it with a microfiber cloth. Then flip it over and do the other side. It worked pretty well but was a messy job, so a couple of years ago I got the Spin Clean and I'm really happy with that. I recently got a couple of old Beatles records that looked like they had the beginnings of mildew or mould on them so I gave them a couple of runs through the Spin Clean and now they're nice and shiny and sound pretty good. I wish I knew someone with one of those ultrasonic cleaners I could use from time to time though.
Was using a spin clean but soon found out with 3000 records I wasn't getting anywhere soon. I've been using a a Vevor Ultrasonic cleaning machine and have nothing but great results. The performance results are evident and mounds of evidence left behind in the tank is always awkwardly refreshing...
Bought a record cleaning machine (Audio Advisor Nitty Gritty type) back in 2000. First one I ever owned. Was very satisfied with the results and purchased another one (Nitty Gritty 1.0) in 2013. Perfected my cleaning routine over the years .. don't scrub .. I just apply a terigitol based fluid w/ last record brush and vacuum. I've never batch cleaned. I clean one record at a time .. right before I spin on TT.
I've done the same over the sink with mild dish soap and running tap water (on filthy used records only) and great success. New records shouldn't need more than a light carbon fibre brushing.
I have Spin Clean and it works great at an affordable price. I spent a little extra and picked up the clear version. After cleaning about 20-25 records, I can see the water is dirty and there’s dirt collecting on the bottom of the tank. Ultrasonic cleaners may be the best out there, but they’re too pricey for me. A basic Spin Clean setup can be had for under $100 and cleaning with it is both relaxing and fun to do. Once you dry off your records with the included towels, set them in a purchased bamboo folding dish rack to air dry for a bit then sleeve them in a MoFi inner sleeve.
I like the LAST "all purpose" record cleaner but more importantly their "Record Preservative". Also the "stylast" for your stylus. The preservative is supposed to reduce wear to the record for up to 200 plays. I/you can hear the difference between a clean and preserved record with the teflon goo or whatever it is reducing friction.
@@EclecticApotheosis maybe because it's expensive, the innovator is not disclosing what's in there, his marketing is from the 1970s? or before, not too many pushing it, but yeah it is amazing stuff. "Highly recommended" and don't forget stylast.
I use a Spin Clean manual washer. They use these velvety soft pair of brushes and I've cleaned several hundred records and never had a problem. However I've wondered what keeps grit from accumulating on the brushes and causing the same catastrophe you experienced.
I am on my second one. Had one of the notable vacuum types for over 15 years. Worked really well, however sometimes when cleaning an particularly grungy record that needed to be run through a number of times. I found it turned my records into ultra-clean electrostatic dust magnets, compounded by the sticky residue of the cleaning fluid that remains even after rinsing. So I have abandoned it for one the more affordable ultrasonic ones. A lot more work to use, since it has no drying cycle, but it gets them cleaner without me having to go crazy with the Milty gun afterwards.
I used a Spin Clean in the 80s, then graduated to Nitty Gritty and Record Dr - with enzyme cleaning fluid. I have lusted for an Audiodesk since they first came out but the price! Will probably go Kirmuss in the near future. Ive never had a problem like yours and Steve, surely you can get past your 'trauma' considering you've had friends clean your records with their machines, curious...
okki nokki works very good. what i have found when i first started using the okki nokki is i would use too much cleaning fluid and what works best is as little as possible as long as the entire surface is barely wet.
I have owned one of these "unnamed" brand of cleaning machine and I noticed exactly this issue but it is easily dealt with with a unused toothbrush to clean the tube with. It is obvious that all the crap that came off the previous record is picked up by both brushes - the applicator as well as the pick up tube and BOTH need cleaning with the toothbrush constantly. If this is done you have zero problems as I have using this VPI for the last 28 years - IT STILL WORKS AND CLEANS FINE!!! BUT - one more note: be sure to clean out both the cleaning fluid tank and the dirty fluid tank at least once a year to avoid build-up within those tanks. Use ONLY distilled water for all needs!!!!
Bath of home brew of 0.1% reach of Triton-X and isopropanol in distilled water. Goat hair brush. Separate bath of distilled water to rinse. Microfiber towels after each cycle. Dry on a rack. Cleaned vinyl from the 50's through the 80's. After about 10 lps through the cleaning solution, it was a little pinkish from one from the labels, but none of the labels showed any signs of damage. That's including the early 50's stuff.
I use a VPI 16.5 RCM and it’s one of the best investments I’ve made in my system , it has reduced the noise floor in my records by a wide margin, highly recommended.
I use soap and water and I've been doing it since '81. I have never had any issues, so much so, I have clients coming to me to have their records cleaned. Excellent results every time.
accidently discovered 'home remedy'; 50/50 water & vinegar (white, not malt), spray until well saturated, run your finger gently around the grooves and feel grit collect into tiny clusters, wipe with a microfibre rag, repeat. unfortunate side effect is even after good deep clean and a light tone arm, the needle may collect some build-up, but the record is clean and fresh for the next play. if anyone knows of possible long-term degradation this may cause over time please let me know
Scary stuff ruining records... Currently using the fully manual single direction Hanss RC-20. Cleaning fluid is filtered water via fridge carbon block filter and a few drops of dish cleaning liquid. I clean and then rinse. with another bottle. Fairly decent results. One thing I always do is clean the felt pads before each cleaning to ensure no dirt / grit on the felt pads.
I was most interested to listen to your account of being traumatized by a record cleaning machine. Over the years I have collected literally thousands of classical as well as assorted other records, many having been obtained in charity shops here in the UK. Often these records have been very dirty so I tried all manner of things but eventually settled on the old tried and tested soap and water in the sink approach. Even the worst records are greatly enhanced and after washing sound perfectly acceptable. I use warm water straight from the tap. My record is placed on a flat wooden board with a spindle in the middle which holds the record exactly as it is held on the record player - unable to move. I rinse the water over both sides which goes over the lable as well. Only once did I find a bit of colour leakage on a red RCA record. I use an ordinary soft sponge with a decent amount of washing up liquid so that the suds cover the record entirely. I have learnt not to be too delicate with my sponge rubbing and even go round in circular motions as well as following the now soapy grooves. Purists who don't try this approach are missing out - is what I would say - as over the years I have never had a poor result either in the hugely improved sound quality of the record or in terms of lasting damage to my records. After washing off the soapy water under the warm tap, having taken it off the holding board, I shake the record and let it drain for a minute or so whilst leaning against a wall. I then get 2 pieces of ordinary soft paper kitchen roll and fold these twice to make the 2 pieces a quarter of the size thus being easier to use. Each small piece usually dries one side of the record without leaving any smearing. Finally I then take a small hairdryer to remove any lasting dampness. All this takes about 5 mins or so but my goodness - what an improvement! I have a Linn system and can say with complete confidence that sink washing makes my Hi Fi listening so much better. As an afterthought I was once tempted to buy what was then a £400+ Moth record cleaning machine. Fortunately I was rather put off when the man trying to sell it wasn't all than enthusiastic about its high cost or its effectiveness. I saved myself quite a bit of money.
I just use a Spin Clean. I clean off the record, and let it sit supported by the top of the brushes for a few minutes. This allows capillary action to pull excess water and debris from the grooves. I then wipe the remaining water from the LP with a cloth. In all honesty I can't hear any difference in sound between using a Spin Clean or any of the vacuum machines. Before playing the LP I always use an anti static brush. I've been doing this for quite a while now, and I always get good results.
i use a lowly VCS mk2 , wipe the pads off with a micro fibre cloth after every record and replace the pads after 500-ish records , for fluid i use the project stuff and can only reprt great results , i buy lots of charity shop records and the vcs has paid for itself many times over.
Bought a cheapo Disco-Antistat and the bottom of line Sonicare toothbrush. As I spin the LPs in the washer, I hold the metal spike (that usually holds the toothbrush head) of the Sonicare on the LP edge. Ultrasonic cleaning for about $100. Cleaning solution: one drop of Dawn, 1 part 99.9% rubbing alcohol, 5 parts distilled H20 and a splash of photo-flow. Overall I'd rate it a 7/10. If I could figure out a cheap vacuum solution to add on it would be a 9/10
This just reminds me of the fancy hand held wood/velvet types from the 70/80s. The ones that were kinda fat and hollow, and held the solution bottle inside. This magic elixir in the bottle was just alcohol best we could tell.
I have this same paranoia, also with contact cleaners. I am convinced they all leave more residue and bad after effects than the original problem they set out to achieve. I know I’m probably wrong, but I still don’t want to risk it.
I'm so glad I came across this video - I've been cleaning my records in the same way (water plus a little washing-up liquid), but I always felt guilty that I was committing some vinyl crime. Now I feel okay. But one question... why distilled water, as opposed to normal tap water? Thanks from Wivenhoe, England.
"We haven't heard about that problem before" (from other callers/customers)- often heard when you call a company about a problem with a product- is the most popular customer service response since "your call is important to us"- which is also the first half of a book title from some years ago on the subject- the second half of it being "The Truth About Bullshit."
Hmm, I've had that record cleaning machine for years and use it all the time. I guess the updated lips fixed that? I also keep the lips clean by wiping them off between cleanings. Wild story though!
My kick is buying used LPs, finding first pressings in good shape, maybe even buying a few of the same and seeing which one is best. This sub-hobby requires a cleaning protocol. I’ve gone from Spin Clean, to the VPI 16.5, to the Klaudio ultrasonic (Andy Singer turned me on to ultrasonic with his ravings). If anyone’s paying attention: the Klaudio is bonkers good. Just bonkers. Expensive, but the way to do it is to share the cost with friends or your audio society and let it circulate from owner to owner. Unlike the 16.5, which take forever if you do the Walker Audio 4-step enzyme process, it’s a few minutes per LP. You do other stuff, leave the room, whatever, and it’s done. Bonkers good.
Steve I purchased a vacuum based record cleaner years ago and it sits in storage. It was a pain to use and I find using a Groovewasher system before playing a record works for me since I take care of my vinyl, there is not much schmutz on my records to begin with
You didn't have an album cleaner, you had an album LATHE! The Delrin (Acetal) surface became the cutting tool! Damn! I would have been pissed! I haven't tried it yet, but apparently a spray bottle with 2/3 distilled water, 1/3 Veggie wash a a few drops of rubbing alcohol works well. Clean and dry them with a nice soft cloth.
i remember once as a young student living in a house, seeing the landlady's DJ son washing a bunch of his vinyl in the kitchen sink as if they were plates. Never tried it myself.
I use the sink with dove soap a fingernail brush and rinse in running water in the sink then dry abd spray 90percent alcohol mixed with distilled water it does a great job
I wash mine like you do. I have label protectors, but I've noticed that labels (as long as you don't soak them for any amount of time) don't pucker up or come off when you rinse them in water. Therefore, I have concluded that label protectors are good (and if you have a substantial collection, you might consider buying them if you don't already have them), but I find that simple clear (not cloudy like pink Palmolive) dish soap does the trick just fine. Of course, you have to make sure you've thoroughly rinsed the record before playing. For those who crow about Spin Clean: I'm sure it's a good product, but not everybody can afford one. If someone wants to donate a Spin Clean to me, I'd be happy to take it!!!
I use the nitty gritty entry level machine, and have been for 20 years. I also scrub the shit out of my records with the vpi brush covering the side in tiny bubbles. The vacuum dries the records and they are clean--plus no static. My records sound good.
I used to use a machine, I won't name it, but it rhymes with Heath Dunks. ;) And it also left visible rings on some of the records I cleaned. But generally it did not leave audible gunk or scratches on the grooves. So, apparently the abrasion was merely surface, and I don't know why it happened, but perhaps it was a similar phenomenon -- grit sticking to the little bit that sucked up the fluid and then scraping the record.
That's a horrifying story, Steve! My story isn't nearly as bad in the end. Back on Christmas Day 1979, when I was 14 years old, my folks got me a Ronko Record Vacuum as a present. I was so excited, I foolishly grabbed my most christened album at the time to try it out - Fresh Aire III by Mannheim Steamroller. I remember preparing the record and putting it in this infernal machine. I flipped on the switch, at which point the record was launch across the room and slammed into the opposite wall of our living room. It was basically a skeet thrower! Fortunately, the record survived, and I have it till this day. The Ronko record cleaner, however, was returned the next day.
Spin Clean fits my budget and works well enough for me. Very impressed and easier than the sink method I was using.
I made a DIY “rotisserie” ultrasonic and never looked back. Super cost effective with the best results I’ve ever heard.
i just LOVE my pro-ject vinyl cleaner vc-s it was the best buy i ever did and never had any problems besides the constant rebuying of sleevs and destilld water :-)
Thanks Steve, I am waiting for the delivery of a vacuum record cleaning machine, and will now keep my eye on the ‘velvet’ record protection strips to check no grit is being stuck into it. Thanks again from another Steve.
I have a HiFi / Phono store around the corner which has a ClearAudio Double Matrix Professional Sonic and . I've cleaned every record there so far because the price is very reasonable and a new sleeve is also included. I like how it removes all the static and restores used records to unexpected brilliance - in some cases. So far not one record has gotten worse and most of them better.
My first record cleaning tool was the Spin-Clean. It works wonderfully on many levels and is seemingly very safe for your records. It's also kinda fun! Then I got a Record Doctor V to experience what a vacuum style cleaner could do. I think the Record Doctor V was worth the extra investment and I'm pretty happy with it, three years in. It seems just as gentle on the records as the Spin-Clean. I tend to stay on top of replacing the microfiber strips surrounding the intake slot to avoid the damage you described. Overall, I feel like my records are as clean as they can be when working within one of these two systems. Lastly, I use my trusty Discwasher (with or without their fluid) before playing. And I always keep the stylus clean. I simply can't afford an Ultrasonic machine, although there are a couple record stores in my area that offer it as a service (no doubt to offset what they've spent!). Cheers for the great videos.
Well I'm glad VPI fix that issue before I bought mine about 15 years ago. Sorry for your loss.
Dawn and two microfiber rags washing and drying. Then I use a brush with distilled water before actual playing.
Ultrasonics are so much better now that we have that option. Zero contact with the vinyl, and zero chemicals too.
My problem is after what clean I dig up so much Gunk off the record of clogged the needle up Welsh are the records clean I have to play each record one two three times before the gunk goes away I really don't want to chew up my needle
@@MidwestBoom The same with my cleaning. I just clean the stylus until no more. . And result is quite reliable for many next times of using such cleaned LP. .I copy my often played LPs to reel recorder and it is my way to guard pickup. If needed I can play original LP but due to provided by me system futures tape sounds much better. .
One thing about microfiber cloths. I was using them rather than setting up my vacuum unit and the sound seemed worse than before. Then I cleaned my glasses using the same microfiber rag and noticed the micro hairs shedding off an my glasses - that was why the LPs had more pops than before. This is an easy way to 'see' if you should be using those cloths on your records.
Lol. Not when you have over 1k of vinyl.
I too use the kitchen sink, TAP water and some dish detergent. BUT - what can happen AND DID was that the water and detergent gets on the label - the label gets WET which causes the glue that holds the label onto the vinyl to soften - become "glue" again. Then I placed this record on my acrylic turntable platter. Left it there for a day. When I went to remove the record it HAD GLUED ITSELF TO THE PLATTER. I mean glued itself hard. I ended up breaking the record trying to get it off the platter - fortunately the platter was not affected - but a Led Zep 2 - cherry version from the '80s - was destroyed. Record cleaning does greatly enhance the sound of a vinyl record - but is filled with pitfalls no matter the technique used.
I used LAST on my records when they were new. I don't have a big problem with dirt. I use an Oracle brush before playing. The Oracle brush is just a carbon fiber brush with a ground wire. The brush attracts dust and removes charge from the record. To clean the brush, turn away from the record and rotate the grounding blade across the bristles. Once the charge is removed from the record, not much dust is attracted.
Around 1995 I was a student, had a Rega Planar 2 (bought used and modified by me), and bought a Record Doctor cleaning machine (used, for $60). This is a version of the cheapest NittyGritty made for Audio Advisor, and it had felt on the lips of the sucking device. This machine was amazing. Fantastic. Loved it. Did an amazing job. I would recommend a cleaning machine to everyone with records. I don't have my vinyl gear anymore, but I do have all my records and one day I will get back into vinyl.
I'm very happy with the Knosti manual cleaner. Instead of the included fluid (which leaves a sticky residue behind), I use 0.5 L tap water, one or two drops of dish washing liquid and a cap or two of isopropyl alcohol. I've revived the cruddiest of old records this way.
Wao Steve, I have just repaired an Audio Desk and after hearing the improvement on a record I finally cleaned all my records, is incredible how well they sound after cleaning with Audio Desk
I use a distilled water alcohol solution in a spray bottle. I got a rotating wooden plato. I put the record on the wooden plato with a rubber mat. I cover the label with a plastic cub. I spray the surface of the record. I wipe with a soft microfiber cloth and finish with a lint brush.
I got this method from a youtube channel.
I once bought a bill Evan's record and it ended up being one of my favorites. I found a used copy of an older pressing, so I bought it because I like the sound of older pressings more. It was really loud. the noise floor was like 60db! i went to clean it with water and soap. nothing. tried wood glue. nothing. gave it away. freedom.
Made my own vacuum style record cleaning machine about 35 years ago. Still going strong. Works very effectively and it's never damaged a record. Neither has my homebrew cleaning solution.
Ok what's in your home brew cleaning solution
@@johnsweda2999 No secret, nothing magical. Four parts distilled water, one part 91% isopropyl alcohol, a few drops of either a neutral film-free detergent or Kodak photo flo. I've been using the same stuff for the whole time. I use the Mo-Fi brush for wet scrubbing, vac the solution, rinse with distilled water, vacuum again until dry. I never said it was easy!
Yes that was the original VPI Hw16, in its first year or so of production. The grit, silica, could become wedged in between the lip on the pickup tube and the record causing the circular scratch. I found that I could rotate the pickup tube slightly towards the direction of travel of the record which would lift the leading lip off the record surface, leaving only the rear lip contacting the surface. In that way the slot would pick up the grit before it became became wedged in place. This worked quite well with no problems until a year or two later when I replace the lips with velvet.
Tried a Spin Clean. Thoroughly unimpressed, I returned it in short order. After research, including trial and error, distilled water and microfiber cloth. If it's really bad, I'll do a 2nd treatment with Groovewasher fluid and a clean microfiber towel. Works great.
I use Kirmuss Audio ultrasonic machine and often get amazed how it can transform used records from unlistenable condition to nearly dead quiet.
I owned and used the velvet covered Nitty Gritty 1.5 back in the day on over a thousand of my records and it was an absolute miracle in how it cleaned my store bought records. One of the best audio accessories I ever bought. However, my brother had the older version with the delren lips and had the same experience as Steve.
I was once very satisfied with a DIY cleaner based on the punctual succion system where a nylon thread is led through the succion tip. With such system, the grooves only get in contact with the soft nylon thread and no dirt is left on the succion tip...
I have two methods for cleaning records, depending on their value, condition, and if I'm keeping them or putting them up for sale in my store.
The first, which I use most often, is utilizing two Spin Clean units. The first with a mixture of tap water, clear washing up liquid, and a bit of isopropyl alcohol. The second is distilled water only, then I gently wipe the excess water off and allow to dry in a rack that only touches the edge and label. The works quite well, if you remember to rinse VERY dirty records in the sink first and change the solutions when needed.
My second method is a homemade RCM, comprised of a milk crate, ice cream maker motor, an old turntable platter and spindle, clamp, paint pads, cleaner, distilled rinse, microfibre towels, and the drying rack. This works great, as well as any RCM with the exception of maybe an ultrasonic, but take much longer, so I usually reserve this for my personal collection or more valuable records.
I purchased a record label protector on ebay, and like you, I wash them in the sink. With the label protector the record can be washed as much as you like without the label getting wet. I agree with you that water wont kill a label but it does make me feel better to know its protected.
The label protector has handles on each side which makes it easy to spin the record under the water. Pretty much a foolproof process.
I never was a fan of vacuuming the record. I never felt like it was foolproof. So sorry to hear about your damaged records, keep on spinning!
@@45rockinwax As I said in my 1st sentence, "I purchased a label protector" i think you missed that...
@@45rockinwax All good. I actually use a 4inch paint brush to run along the grooves as well, and luckily my faucet has a sprayer which helps as well. I do a final rinse with distilled water. Happy spinning!
I use “VinylBug”. I got it from seller ApplesAndString on Etsy. Very happy with it. You use your own shopvac which keeps costs down. It supports the record from the center so when you flip the record over, the just cleaned side doesn’t sit on a dirty surface. $119 plus $15 for an extra vacuum arm. I use one to wash and one to rinse. The solution I use to wash is distilled water with a drop of hair conditioner. It cleans but doesn’t suds up. I follow that with a distilled water rinse. I use a carbon finer brush to spread the solution which I put on with a small mister bottle.
Made a big difference for me.
I was traumatized by the COST of a record cleaning machine! Do they REALLY have to cost MORE than the TT, amp and speakers used to play the damned records?
I was traumatized by the cost of these machines as well.
I've always wondered about that
Sounds like a job for a 3d printer, a little hardware, a vacuum motor from a yard sale and a few cheap hand tools.
Record Doctor V (vacuum system) works great, $200. You just have to manually rotate it.
It works better if it costs more, because you get what you pay for. Always.
Regardless of the markup.
Sorry to hear that Steve, I use a Pro Ject cleaning machine which I have had for 2 years now and I can recommend it's use. I also clean any new record I buy, before playing it. It does make a sonic difference.
During the 1960's my uncle told me he had read that washing records was the way to go, so I used tap water and non-perfumed (Sunlight - Australian brand) pure hand washing soap. Worked a treat.
WOW... that was 50 years ago !!!
This very same thing has just happened to me.
I won’t mention what machine I purchased but the velvet slowly came off of the vacuum arm whilst I was cleaning.
After cleaning this particular record I was excited to listen and man it sounded terrible. I held it up to the light and to my horror I noticed deep grooves and scratches had been etched into the record. I went to the machine and pulled off the vacuum arm to inspect and saw that the velvet had rucked up whilst the record was spinning. Fortunately it only happened to one of my records and not a whole batch of them. I feel your pain.
For grungy records purchased second hand from various sources I use two spin clean units (first one for detergent mix and the second for rinse with deionized water) and then a KAB EV-1 vacuum cleaner attachment to dry them off (thankfully it uses the felt gasket). If the records have mildew on them, I will add a mildew disinfectant to the first mix. For records that come from a home with tobacco use, a little trisodium phosphate added in removes that pretty well.
I really enjoy Steve (is he really Steve or is he Woody Allen???) and his audio words of wisdom. His story regarding the use of a record cleaner with a hard surface (delrin) tube in direct contact with record surfaces, especially spinning record surfaces, does give one pause however. I've had a VPI 16.5 record cleaner for close to 20 years and have replaced the tube several times. Every tube had/has soft fabric strips along each side of the slit in the tube through which the liquid is vacuumed. Only the fabric comes in contact with the record surface, and only after it's been wetted with cleaning solution. My experience with keeping records playable, which by my standards include pop, skip, & click free with low surface noise, is to restrict anything coming in contact with the grooves other than the stylus, cleaning solution, and air. Experience has also taught me that a clean record indeed does sound better than a dirty one. Besides, who in their right mind would use the stylus on an expensive cartridge as a dredge to clean record grooves?
I’ve tried various procedures: washing in the sink with dishwashing soap, using a wash towel/nail brush/paint brush/Discwasher brush, Spin-Clean, carbon fiber brush, DIY vacuuming wand similar to the Vinyl Vac 33. All of these still leave dirt/lint in the grooves that I have to clear off of my stylus 2-3 times per side when I play it the first time. Granted I only go through a deep cleaning once, but obviously I’m not getting everything out of the grooves when I do.
Yeah that's my problem with fluids and gunk - there is no way you can get right down into the very deepest groove with a rag to wipe that off. That's just not possible. Meanwhile, ultrasonic cleaning will actually be able to do that. Ultrasonics are used to clean intricate tiny bits of jewelry and the like and it seems absolutely perfect for records. I'm not really a vinyl guy, but if I were I'd be picking up something like a Cleanervinyl system in a heartbeat. Sure, a hundred bucks or so for the system and another hundred perhaps for the ultrasonic cleaner itself but seems like a nobrainer to me.
Wow! That´s really sad! I feel very sorry for you!
I for one can´t afford a cleaning machine, so I clean it by hand with my own method and it works very well.
would you like to share and what Formula do you use make up
I bought a Keith Monks record cleaner awhile back used for a little over $100 and it does a wonderful job of safely cleaning records. However it is totally a Rube Goldberg invention that no self respecting design engineer would let out of prototype. It takes an advanced degree from MIT to keep it running. It has a very large vacuum pump in it but uses very small tubing to take the vacuum to the record surface. 90% of the vacuum suction is wasted and the narrow aquarium tubing involved gets easily clogged with dust, requiring disassembly to open up. Noting all of that, it really saves recordings and my ears from the ticks and pops!
Great story Steve . Thanks for sharing the way you clean your record. I used water and mix soap just a bit of alcohol and it works great my records are fine.
The idea of placing a hard, solid surface on a spinning LP is crazy. What was the manufacturer thinking? I use the “$200” velvet lipped, manually rotated device. Super bang for the buck.
My heart goes out...I would have had a complete breakdown if that happened to me! Im glad someone is talking sense about cleaning...its become a beast of its own in the vc
My wife got me a Nitty Gritty for my birthday many years ago. It cost as much as our Electrolux vacuum cleaner, quality not nearly as good. The pump handle couldn't stand up to a two year old, and the rubber puck on the spindle eventually falls apart, but is almost impossible to replace. And the motor makes so much vibration that I had to buy sorbothene pucks to place underneath the machine. When we moved, it never made it out of the box.
I agree, the Okki Nokki is much better built, easier to use, and reasonably priced.
Louis Perlman , you would have probably been better using the vacuum cleaner with a record attachment!
If you don't replace the pads on the tube regularly and ensure everything is flush and properly calibrated, modern RCMs will actually damage your records. Something I've noticed is that the 1st record you clean when the brush is still dry, will actually leave blueish/grey marks specially visible under bright light in the deadwax from the friction (best to wet the pads first). Cleaning brushes also accumulate debris from dirt and other particles that will essentially grind into the surface but since it's in the direction of the grooves most people don't notice it.
Back in the 80's I worked for a Linn Naim dealer in Florida and we had a Keith Monks record cleaning machine there in the store.
We offered record cleaning as a service and I took many of my own albums to work to clean.
Thankfully I never encountered anything like your situation.
I've recently decided to try one of the ultrasonic machines available now.
Nothing comes in direct contact with the grooves and as long as the temperature is maintained, there is no harm to the vinyl.
For a surfactant, I have chosen Tergikleen and along with distilled water it should work fine.
By the way, I still kick myself for letting my Linn LP 12 go.
I bought a SpinClean about a year or so ago. I've used it on very dirty records and some almost new records, and have had no problems whatsoever. A little time-consuming since I
also fan dry them for about an hour (five at a time) before playing them, but worth it. They've all played great.
I have used an okki nokki machine with the Mofi Super Record wash for years now. I haven't damaged any records so far. I originally used a Spin Clean which worked pretty well but I find using a vaccum system much better. I am interested in using an ultrasonic cleaner but I cant justify the space of two RCM's right now. I hope that you get over your phobia because for me it makes cleaning my records easy and I find it a lot of fun too!
thanks for letting us know abot this story... maybe it's a warning / message to brush the felts on the suction arm every so often ?
I used the Groovmaster acrylic caps set to protect the labels and a solution of distilled water a squirt of alcohol and dish detergent placed in small tray and a painting pad soaked in the solution then evenly rotated around the record pretending you're painting it with the solution, both sides then rinse with more distilled water, to dry the record is placed flat on a clean free of dust microfiber cloth and covered with another microfiber cloth like a sandwich and gently pressed with my hands then removed and placed in a dish rack for air drying, this method reallly works for me and is done in the kitchen sink and counter, the Groovmaster you find it on Ebay.
I've just bought by first vacuum record cleaning machine. Thanks to seeing this video beforehand I check the velvet pads on the vacuum arm before every side.
My current method? Spinclean pre-clean for dirty records. Pro-Ject VC-S Mk II with the stock fluid, followed by a VERY wet rinse using distilled or RO water. Even this method occasionally adds noise rather than removing it. Best method, though way too tedious? Steam. And you still need to get the fluid off completely, but man does steaming work. My next purchase will be a 10 liter ultrasonic tank for those stubbornly noisy disks.
Started with the spin clean. Works great. I got tired of spinning it by hand so i bought a chinese ultrasonic cleaner. Works great in my opinion. I modified it to hold 6 records with a half inch in between each recoed. Super happy
Steve, I use a Keith Monks machine. Built like a tank, fast, low maintenance, utterly reliable, thousands of records cleaned without incident.
I just use a micro-fiber rags, 3 parts distilled water to 1 part alcohol solution and a big heavy glass ashtray (clean) to cover the label. Similar to the way I did it as a kid. Then I go over it again on an old turntable using a micro-fiber brush spayed with my homemade solution. I thought about a Spin Clean, but I couldn’t justify paying $80 for something like looks like it took $10 to manufacture.
I’m curious about the labels to be honest. I use the ashtray to protect the label during cleaning. I’ve never been worried that they would come off. They are basically infused with the vinyl during pressing. However, what I don’t want is water marks or moisture ring damage on the label. I would be traumatized if a label was aesthetically ruined by getting wet. I always thought of it as a given; a label will show signs of water getting on the label. Am I just wrong for thinking this happens? I base it on how easy it is to leave finger prints on a label if I don’t wash my hands properly on a hot day and handling one of my records.
I just bought a Spin Clean and used it for the first time and was not disappointed with the result.
Excellent of you Steve to mention such a flaw that many would not admit to. My concern which is also of great interest would be a poll to ask those who have cleaned records for at least 15 - 20 yrs. using different types of chemicals (household cleaners), isopropyl alcohol with regular tap water. After all this time do their records sound just as good???? Any signs of wear, groove damage???? I really wonder what the results would be? Then everyone can figure out whether it's worth in spending $$$$$ or to just keep using soaps and plain tap water. The record label concern would be in spots left on, colour dyes running along with blurred printing.
At least on all the records I have examined, the label is not glued on, it is pressed on with heat, so the vinyl melts and fuses to the paper. Soaking in water will never remove the label, though obviously the paper itself will be damaged if soaked in water too long.
I use the Spin Clean cleaner first off, then I put the record on what is basically a lazy susan with felt pads and a wooden spindle in the middle, and then use a 33rpm wand on a Green Machine to suck it all up. After all’s said and done you might as well get a Spin Doctor or just do it like Steve. It does help get rid of a lot of the pops and skipping; I always thought that once they were there on your record they were there forever, but not necessarily.
I use two 8oz Nalgene bottles and mix a brew of 'pure' (not distilled) water with one drop of Triton X100 (a very concentrated surfactant and mild detergent) in one bottle for a light wash, and 5 drops in a second for stronger jobs. I then add 1/2 ounce of reagent 99.9% isopropyl alcohol to each bottle. A third bottle has just pure water. I got a plastic 9.5" diameter lazy susan for a 'turntable', drilled a hole dead center and mounted a 1/4" plastic tube to act as the record spindle, and about twenty 1/2" soft plastic pads on the table for the record to sit on. This setup is used for the 'wash'. I use a kitchen sink, and a small artist live sponge, applying the wash brew and moving it around making sure it cover the record. I cover the label with an inverted glass dish. I let it sit a few minutes, then another few passes with the sponge, followed by a 'pressure' rinse, using the squirt thingy on the sink while rotating the record on the turntable. Then I remove the turntable and record from the sink and use a Vinyl Vac wand, which has felt strips on it to protect the record surface. It attaches to a small shop vacuum I use only for this purpose, and I hold the wand on the record while turning the 'turntable'. Basically, you want to remove anything that does not belong in the grooves or on the surface, not introduce anything that will be left behind afterwards, and not damage the record. The surfactant breaks the surface tension and gets into the grooves instead of the fluid sitting on top of them. The alcohol is there in this case to help the X100 mix with the water - I don't need alcohol as a drier, since I'm removing by vacuum (hopefully) all of the cleaning solution (water) along whatever particulate is in suspension from the cleaning. Vacuuming isn't done just to dry the record - you want to remove the fluid and whatever is in the fluid. Perfect? No, but it works really well for me. As to what gets removed from the groves, it depends on what it is and whether or not it's just sitting, physically jammed , or somehow sticking with the assistance of potato chip grease or pizza. Some situations can require a second or third wash.
My old technique was to place the record flat on a clean soft surface (usually bubble wrap) and then pour some warm water over it and then scrub it with a microfiber cloth. Then flip it over and do the other side.
It worked pretty well but was a messy job, so a couple of years ago I got the Spin Clean and I'm really happy with that.
I recently got a couple of old Beatles records that looked like they had the beginnings of mildew or mould on them so I gave them a couple of runs through the Spin Clean and now they're nice and shiny and sound pretty good.
I wish I knew someone with one of those ultrasonic cleaners I could use from time to time though.
Was using a spin clean but soon found out with 3000 records I wasn't getting anywhere soon. I've been using a a Vevor Ultrasonic cleaning machine and have nothing but great results. The performance results are evident and mounds of evidence left behind in the tank is always awkwardly refreshing...
Bought a record cleaning machine (Audio Advisor Nitty Gritty type) back in 2000. First one I ever owned. Was very satisfied with the results and purchased another one (Nitty Gritty 1.0) in 2013. Perfected my cleaning routine over the years .. don't scrub .. I just apply a terigitol based fluid w/ last record brush and vacuum. I've never batch cleaned. I clean one record at a time .. right before I spin on TT.
I've done the same over the sink with mild dish soap and running tap water (on filthy used records only) and great success. New records shouldn't need more than a light carbon fibre brushing.
Been using the exact same method like forever, only replacing the soap for blue windex. Excellent results.
I have Spin Clean and it works great at an affordable price. I spent a little extra and picked up the clear version. After cleaning about 20-25 records, I can see the water is dirty and there’s dirt collecting on the bottom of the tank. Ultrasonic cleaners may be the best out there, but they’re too pricey for me. A basic Spin Clean setup can be had for under $100 and cleaning with it is both relaxing and fun to do. Once you dry off your records with the included towels, set them in a purchased bamboo folding dish rack to air dry for a bit then sleeve them in a MoFi inner sleeve.
I like the LAST "all purpose" record cleaner but more importantly their "Record Preservative". Also the "stylast" for your stylus. The preservative is supposed to reduce wear to the record for up to 200 plays. I/you can hear the difference between a clean and preserved record with the teflon goo or whatever it is reducing friction.
@@EclecticApotheosis maybe because it's expensive, the innovator is not disclosing what's in there, his marketing is from the 1970s? or before, not too many pushing it, but yeah it is amazing stuff. "Highly recommended" and don't forget stylast.
I use a Spin Clean manual washer. They use these velvety soft pair of brushes and I've cleaned several hundred records and never had a problem. However I've wondered what keeps grit from accumulating on the brushes and causing the same catastrophe you experienced.
I am on my second one. Had one of the notable vacuum types for over 15 years. Worked really well, however sometimes when cleaning an particularly grungy record that needed to be run through a number of times. I found it turned my records into ultra-clean electrostatic dust magnets, compounded by the sticky residue of the cleaning fluid that remains even after rinsing. So I have abandoned it for one the more affordable ultrasonic ones. A lot more work to use, since it has no drying cycle, but it gets them cleaner without me having to go crazy with the Milty gun afterwards.
I used a Spin Clean in the 80s, then graduated to Nitty Gritty and Record Dr - with enzyme cleaning fluid. I have lusted for an Audiodesk since they first came out but the price! Will probably go Kirmuss in the near future. Ive never had a problem like yours and Steve, surely you can get past your 'trauma' considering you've had friends clean your records with their machines, curious...
I bought a SpinClean a few months ago and it works really well. Not perfect but makes a huge difference.
okki nokki works very good. what i have found when i first started using the okki nokki is i would use too much cleaning fluid and what works best is as little as possible as long as the entire surface is barely wet.
I have owned one of these "unnamed" brand of cleaning machine and I noticed exactly this issue but it is easily dealt with with a unused toothbrush to clean the tube with. It is obvious that all the crap that came off the previous record is picked up by both brushes - the applicator as well as the pick up tube and BOTH need cleaning with the toothbrush constantly. If this is done you have zero problems as I have using this VPI for the last 28 years - IT STILL WORKS AND CLEANS FINE!!! BUT - one more note: be sure to clean out both the cleaning fluid tank and the dirty fluid tank at least once a year to avoid build-up within those tanks. Use ONLY distilled water for all needs!!!!
Wood glue for dust and dirt. Home built vacuum and solution for oils/grime. On one occasion scrubbing bubbles ressurected an LP from the trash.
Bath of home brew of 0.1% reach of Triton-X and isopropanol in distilled water. Goat hair brush. Separate bath of distilled water to rinse. Microfiber towels after each cycle. Dry on a rack. Cleaned vinyl from the 50's through the 80's. After about 10 lps through the cleaning solution, it was a little pinkish from one from the labels, but none of the labels showed any signs of damage. That's including the early 50's stuff.
The Estonian "Degritter" is the best one!
I'll stick to a drop of Dawn dish soap in a dixie cup and microfiber cloth and use a cotton cloth to dry in a circular motion that follows the grooves
I use a VPI 16.5 RCM and it’s one of the best investments I’ve made in my system , it has reduced the noise floor in my records by a wide margin, highly recommended.
I use soap and water and I've been doing it since '81. I have never had any issues, so much so, I have clients coming to me to have their records cleaned. Excellent results every time.
accidently discovered 'home remedy'; 50/50 water & vinegar (white, not malt), spray until well saturated, run your finger gently around the grooves and feel grit collect into tiny clusters, wipe with a microfibre rag, repeat. unfortunate side effect is even after good deep clean and a light tone arm, the needle may collect some build-up, but the record is clean and fresh for the next play. if anyone knows of possible long-term degradation this may cause over time please let me know
I have a okki Nokki record machine. Works great.
I have a Okki Nokki too. Works really well!
Scary stuff ruining records... Currently using the fully manual single direction Hanss RC-20. Cleaning fluid is filtered water via fridge carbon block filter and a few drops of dish cleaning liquid. I clean and then rinse. with another bottle. Fairly decent results. One thing I always do is clean the felt pads before each cleaning to ensure no dirt / grit on the felt pads.
I was most interested to listen to your account of being traumatized by a record cleaning machine. Over the years I have collected literally thousands of classical as well as assorted other records, many having been obtained in charity shops here in the UK. Often these records have been very dirty so I tried all manner of things but eventually settled on the old tried and tested soap and water in the sink approach. Even the worst records are greatly enhanced and after washing sound perfectly acceptable. I use warm water straight from the tap. My record is placed on a flat wooden board with a spindle in the middle which holds the record exactly as it is held on the record player - unable to move. I rinse the water over both sides which goes over the lable as well. Only once did I find a bit of colour leakage on a red RCA record. I use an ordinary soft sponge with a decent amount of washing up liquid so that the suds cover the record entirely. I have learnt not to be too delicate with my sponge rubbing and even go round in circular motions as well as following the now soapy grooves. Purists who don't try this approach are missing out - is what I would say - as over the years I have never had a poor result either in the hugely improved sound quality of the record or in terms of lasting damage to my records. After washing off the soapy water under the warm tap, having taken it off the holding board, I shake the record and let it drain for a minute or so whilst leaning against a wall. I then get 2 pieces of ordinary soft paper kitchen roll and fold these twice to make the 2 pieces a quarter of the size thus being easier to use. Each small piece usually dries one side of the record without leaving any smearing. Finally I then take a small hairdryer to remove any lasting dampness. All this takes about 5 mins or so but my goodness - what an improvement! I have a Linn system and can say with complete confidence that sink washing makes my Hi Fi listening so much better. As an afterthought I was once tempted to buy what was then a £400+ Moth record cleaning machine. Fortunately I was rather put off when the man trying to sell it wasn't all than enthusiastic about its high cost or its effectiveness. I saved myself quite a bit of money.
I use the Spin Clean too. Cheap and effective.
I just use a Spin Clean. I clean off the record, and let it sit supported by the top of the brushes for a few minutes. This allows capillary action to pull excess water and debris from the grooves. I then wipe the remaining water from the LP with a cloth. In all honesty I can't hear any difference in sound between using a Spin Clean or any of the vacuum machines.
Before playing the LP I always use an anti static brush. I've been doing this for quite a while now, and I always get good results.
i use a lowly VCS mk2 , wipe the pads off with a micro fibre cloth after every record and replace the pads after 500-ish records , for fluid i use the project stuff and can only reprt great results , i buy lots of charity shop records and the vcs has paid for itself many times over.
Bought a cheapo Disco-Antistat and the bottom of line Sonicare toothbrush. As I spin the LPs in the washer, I hold the metal spike (that usually holds the toothbrush head) of the Sonicare on the LP edge. Ultrasonic cleaning for about $100. Cleaning solution: one drop of Dawn, 1 part 99.9% rubbing alcohol, 5 parts distilled H20 and a splash of photo-flow. Overall I'd rate it a 7/10. If I could figure out a cheap vacuum solution to add on it would be a 9/10
Tough luck! I've had only great experiences washing my LP's on my VPI "16.5 WASHING machine". Just great results! Clean, pristine LP's.
This just reminds me of the fancy hand held wood/velvet types from the 70/80s. The ones that were kinda fat and hollow, and held the solution bottle inside. This magic elixir in the bottle was just alcohol best we could tell.
In the 1980's there was Disco Film, something like the wood glue method, I used not enough, wasn't dry, so I ruined records this way.
I love my AudioDesk RCM!
I don't.
I have this same paranoia, also with contact cleaners. I am convinced they all leave more residue and bad after effects than the original problem they set out to achieve. I know I’m probably wrong, but I still don’t want to risk it.
I'm so glad I came across this video - I've been cleaning my records in the same way (water plus a little washing-up liquid), but I always felt guilty that I was committing some vinyl crime. Now I feel okay. But one question... why distilled water, as opposed to normal tap water? Thanks from Wivenhoe, England.
"We haven't heard about that problem before" (from other callers/customers)- often heard when you call a company about a problem with a product- is the most popular customer service response since "your call is important to us"- which is also the first half of a book title from some years ago on the subject- the second half of it being "The Truth About Bullshit."
Hmm, I've had that record cleaning machine for years and use it all the time. I guess the updated lips fixed that? I also keep the lips clean by wiping them off between cleanings. Wild story though!
My kick is buying used LPs, finding first pressings in good shape, maybe even buying a few of the same and seeing which one is best. This sub-hobby requires a cleaning protocol. I’ve gone from Spin Clean, to the VPI 16.5, to the Klaudio ultrasonic (Andy Singer turned me on to ultrasonic with his ravings). If anyone’s paying attention: the Klaudio is bonkers good. Just bonkers. Expensive, but the way to do it is to share the cost with friends or your audio society and let it circulate from owner to owner. Unlike the 16.5, which take forever if you do the Walker Audio 4-step enzyme process, it’s a few minutes per LP. You do other stuff, leave the room, whatever, and it’s done. Bonkers good.
Bonkers! 😆🤦♀️😎
Steve I purchased a vacuum based record cleaner years ago and it sits in storage. It was a pain to use and I find using a Groovewasher system before playing a record works for me since I take care of my vinyl, there is not much schmutz on my records to begin with
You didn't have an album cleaner, you had an album LATHE! The Delrin (Acetal) surface became the cutting tool! Damn! I would have been pissed! I haven't tried it yet, but apparently a spray bottle with 2/3 distilled water, 1/3 Veggie wash a a few drops of rubbing alcohol works well. Clean and dry them with a nice soft cloth.
i remember once as a young student living in a house, seeing the landlady's DJ son washing a bunch of his vinyl in the kitchen sink as if they were plates. Never tried it myself.
VPI Cyclone. I clean before each use. I personally don’t feel the need to clean them all at once.
Since 1973 I have cleaned them in the sink and lean up to air dry for a hour or so and never had a label issue.
I use the sink with dove soap a fingernail brush and rinse in running water in the sink then dry abd spray 90percent alcohol mixed with distilled water it does a great job
Wash mine in the sink, have a two piece saucer deal that protects the label. Always try any new method on "disposable " records first.
I wash mine like you do. I have label protectors, but I've noticed that labels (as long as you don't soak them for any amount of time) don't pucker up or come off when you rinse them in water. Therefore, I have concluded that label protectors are good (and if you have a substantial collection, you might consider buying them if you don't already have them), but I find that simple clear (not cloudy like pink Palmolive) dish soap does the trick just fine. Of course, you have to make sure you've thoroughly rinsed the record before playing.
For those who crow about Spin Clean: I'm sure it's a good product, but not everybody can afford one. If someone wants to donate a Spin Clean to me, I'd be happy to take it!!!
I use the nitty gritty entry level machine, and have been for 20 years. I also scrub the shit out of my records with the vpi brush covering the side in tiny bubbles. The vacuum dries the records and they are clean--plus no static. My records sound good.
I bought the Audio Desk based on Ken's recommendation. Love it!
I used to use a machine, I won't name it, but it rhymes with Heath Dunks. ;) And it also left visible rings on some of the records I cleaned. But generally it did not leave audible gunk or scratches on the grooves. So, apparently the abrasion was merely surface, and I don't know why it happened, but perhaps it was a similar phenomenon -- grit sticking to the little bit that sucked up the fluid and then scraping the record.